If women don’t prefer abusive men, why are they more lenient with them than shy/introverted men?

sdwdqw65 · 2021-09-22T17:27:31+00:00

The only woman I’ve ever truly loved dumped me to get back with her ex who raped her and would hit her (before dating me). She was also willing to do a lot more sexual stuff with him than with me even though he was a drug dealing high school dropout and I actually treated her decently.

I’ve had a lot of bad experiences in life (who hasn’t by a certain age) but that fucked up my self esteem and mental health more than anything ever has. Since that happened I’ve been incapable of feeling close to women or developing romantic feelings for them because I feel like I’m unattractive/unsexy when I treat women right and feel sexy/attractive when I treat them like shit like her ex did to her.

It’s been a long time since this happened but there’s a small part of me that wants to message her and tell her how much that fucked me up and has damaged my entire life since then. Idk why I feel that way but I just do.

I agree OP, it is infuriating how much this is denied by people even though a shit ton of us men have experienced this. It feels like being gaslighted.

This topic cuts deep, very very deep. But of course it’ll be dismissed by many as just “delusional incel raging” by people. Fucking assholes, people are such toxic pieces of shit sometimes.

andreea_carla_b · 2021-09-22T19:58:37+00:00

I think it boils down to psychology, and it's valid for either men, women, or anything in between.

I read that people who tend to go for abusive relationships typically come from abusive families. It's an unconscious familiarity. And not in a comforting sense, but more like "I know this behaviour and I know how to deal with the sotuation". This by no means is healty or sustainable.

But people don't like change and unfamiliar things, so the brain kind of freaks out when the person finally sees themself in a healthy relationship.

thecureforaheart · 2021-09-22T17:22:00+00:00

I can’t speak for shy/introverted men but Abusive men are playing a game and know exactly what to do and say to get their partners to be attached to them.

They pretend to be the perfect partner and once the love develops, they slowly change. By this time, the woman is in love and will begin to do what everyone in love does, make allowances for their partner.

That perfect partner view remains in the woman’s mind as their partner’s true self so they hang onto that view of their partner and always think that perfect partner will return (he does sometimes which is what keeps her hooked)

Also people who experience trauma in romantic relationships are more likely to continue to attract those type of people or even seek out those types of people because it is what they are use to and possibly all they know!

Also like many said- shy/Introverted doesn’t automatically equal a good man.

It’s possible now that the woman has been able to escape an abusive relationship, she evaluates her tolerance in relationships and makes sure she sticks to her boundaries to avoid a situation similar to what she’s experienced in the past!

Hope this helps

NarniaFox · 2021-09-22T16:35:09+00:00

People with untreated traumas often choose partners/situations that will retraumatize them. The ones who have experienced only shitty treatment might seek it again just because they don't know anything else and/or because they believe they deserve it.

From the other side, there's a fair share of men and women who have got out of abusive relationships and now they don't tolerate anyone's shit and some of them might be even too reactive/cautious around their new partners, because it's their way of protecting themselves.

Abusers are also very good at trapping their victims. They don't just start beating you up, they undermine your self-esteem, destroy your connections with others, gently and slowly take control over your whole life, so at some point leaving them looks like leaving Earth. Also being timid or "less exciting" doesn't mean that one can't be an abuser.

Kentucky_Supreme · 2021-09-22T16:52:28+00:00

I've also wondered why they'll say safety is their biggest concern when meeting new guys but at the same time it seems the only places where it's socially acceptable for guys to approach women are places where alcohol is being sold in the vicinity. (i.e. bars and clubs)

Mrs_Drgree · 2021-09-22T16:34:12+00:00

The behavior is only painted as abusive after they break up. Probably it's just normal people doing normal things. If they never break up, those behaviors are never described as abusive.

Ruben_the_Fish · 2021-09-22T16:31:01+00:00

Bold of you to assume that shy introverts are never abusive.

SaBahRub · 2021-09-22T16:35:37+00:00

You admit it’s not the abuse that attracts them but you can’t complete your logic?

Abuse is just a tactic, and an effective one on the right people

Orange_Paisley · 2021-09-22T16:51:35+00:00

Introverted men can be abusive too. As to why women do not choose introverted men over extroverted men, it’s probably because introverted men do not put themselves out there the way extroverted men do. You make a decision based on the choices made available to you. You’re not going to choose a man you weren’t aware was an option.

LittyKitsune · 2021-09-22T23:19:37+00:00

Remember that abusers can often get up to shady/illegal shit in order to keep their victims in line. No it is not always just some kind of sheer magical alpha charisma sexual attraction that keeps people going back. You don't necessarily know what's happening behind the scenes.

I've had friends/loved ones whose ex threatened to leak their nudes, dirty messages, etc., threatened any new SO they would try to go out with, threatened to hurt friends/family, threatened to call their job and get them fired, etc. Even when those aren't active threats, splitting on bad terms with somebody who has your nudes, could otherwise damage/humiliate you, and has given you zero reason to believe they wouldn't do it carries that underlying fear. Yes I know both women and men who have returned to their abusers (sometimes more than once) for similar reasons. Going back to them seemed better than the choices of being alone or becoming invested in a new relationship that ex could nuke with a push of a button.

WestsideMoonWalker · 2021-09-22T16:33:47+00:00

In what world is.... introverted or shy somehow the opposite of abusive? The logic you need to twist to get to that point is ridiculous.

Regardless, this is not something that is common in my social circles at all.

-Paradigm- · 2021-09-22T16:47:57+00:00

No one gets with someone and its abusive right off the bat. Abuse trickles into relationships slowly over time.

gimpgirl555 · 2021-09-22T17:07:44+00:00

Obviously they don’t actually like abusive behavior. But there is no denying every man has met a woman who picks abusive men and makes excuses for their behavior. When these same women give a chance to the less exciting option, they’re usually ready to leave at the first inconvenience or make a bigger deal about his beta/timid qualities than the abusive qualities she was willing to put up with. Why do you think this is so common, yet denied so heavily by most women?

Tingles.

KirthWGersen · 2021-09-22T16:45:05+00:00

Women love men who make them feel strong emotions.

There is often a lot of positive, delightfully conflicted emotion mixed in with the negative.

No woman wants to be bored by a man.

flamingoinghome · 2021-09-22T17:52:09+00:00

So, you're asking why "the same woman" who has a history of abuse has a hard time maintaining a functional relationship with a normal guy?

This is what's known as a "cycle of abuse." People who have a history of being abused become used to it. Even though they don't enjoy it, it feels familiar, and they end up recreating the same situation. When these people are in a situation that's not abusive it feels really weird, and very foreign. And, whether consciously or not, they often torpedo these much better situations, because they've sort of forgotten (or worse, never learned) how not to be in an abusive relationship.

Beltadowa · 2021-09-22T18:52:30+00:00

I work for social services and the many women who I see this behaviour in, they grew up in abusive households and to them it is normal. Even though they know it is wrong they will lose their children to go back to their abusers. They choose them over their babies. It's unbelievable but happens all the time.

I think its a combination of it being the way they grew up, low self esteem, like in the dirt self esteem, my impression is they feel they are nothing and have no life and just can't fathom not going back to these guys.

supergirl3730 · 2021-09-22T19:08:52+00:00

As a woman who suffered 33 years of trauma from a bipolar/narcissistic father; no matter how hard I tried to break my pattern, I would always drift to relationships that were similar to my childhood experience.

It was familiar even though it was a very bad situation. Only 3% of women are able to break the pattern of staying in abusive relationships, whether it’s staying with the same guy or continuing to pick similar men.

I have been committed to therapy to break my pattern. Learning about my complex PTSD that shows up as depression and anxiety. Learning how to create healthy boundaries. It’s a struggle to spot the people pleasing to get any kind of attention.

cloudnymphe · 2021-09-22T21:34:55+00:00

Aside from the cycle of abuse and the psychology that goes behind why someone would take back an abuser, there are people who will choose someone who comes with drama, manipulation, or emotional unavailability over someone who’s a more stable option for a partner because (usually subconsciously) they don’t want to be bored or are trying to district themselves from something else in their life. It seems very illogical but hey that’s human nature for you.

I have a friend who one time said that dating his abusive ex was obviously a horrible experience but that part of him wonders if he chose to be with her because all the shit in that relationship was a distraction from other stuff going on in his head and in his life at the time. And I’ve seen other men and women who admitted part of them was attracted/addicted to the drama in past relationships. There are people who, whether they realize it or not, seek out relationships like this.

In addition, there’s the human tendency to seek familiarity and do what we’re used to over switching up our environment even when it means ending up in a shittier situation and being unhappy. Therapy would definitely benefit those who have such patterns of behavior.

lilac-hiraeth · 2021-09-22T22:37:11+00:00

Abuse is a trickle down effect. It’s not like these men go from nothing to punching women in the face. They appear functional and nice and loving as anyone else in a new relationship. It starts slowly and under the guise on miscommunication, or being overly protective or some other manipulative tactic and escalates from there.

It’s why so many women you know have been in abusive situations but men don’t know any men who abuse women. They hide it, they isolate their victims and they perpetuate how they’re on the receiving end to level out what they’re doing behind closed doors.

Source: recently got out of a financially and physically abusive 17 year relationship. No one knew went on at home. He was expert at hiding it and by the time I stopped gaslighting myself that I was in fact enduring abuse I was 3 kids in and married.

PurpleManufacturer94 · 2021-09-23T00:52:59+00:00

How the Dad was to the daughter is who she'll be attracted to.

Tinyfoxxo_17 · 2021-09-23T03:37:01+00:00

Have you ever been abused? Like- genuine question.

It is SO hard to leave your abuser behind, especially when they're AMAZING moments that happen that make them seem like they changed, when they haven't. Abusers will constantly flip the script, they will shower you with gifts, praise, compliments, just to keep you attached and coming back for more. Its the same with Toxic relationships.

A lot of abused women have kids with their abuser, and some abusers treat their kids wonderfully. There's also a big stereotype of "women only wanting child support" "oh shes keeping him from his kids" or "shes using them against him" because abusers perpetuate this with other people.

Some abusers threaten their victims, so they feel the only choice they have is to go back. Especially if they have children they will put the safety of their kids first.

Its also hard financially, especially during these times, to live independently, work, get child care, take kids to school, pick them up, provide them with their basic care, and give them attention that they need.

My mother stayed with my sisters father for a lot of these reasons. No where to go, no job, little to no help, scared of CPS, scared for our lives. Its not as simple.

And some women simply are just so conditioned to abuse that they think its normal. They've grown use to it. Kinda like with mental health, you start to feel good and you feel uncomfortable with it. You fall back into depressive/anxious/toxic ways because irs comfortable its what you know, and change is scary.

With all that being said, you aren't invalid for feeling the way you do about this stance, especially if you ever had someone leave you for their abuser. To people who are on the outside, it can be frustrating and irritating to see that person continously falling back in with their abuser. It can seem like it doesn't make any sense, and lets be honest to people who have never faced, experienced, or grew up with abuse it is. And just know that it wasn't anything YOU did, she unfortunately just couldn't get away.

Neptune-Jr · 2021-09-22T16:55:57+00:00

Women aren't psychic , they generally don't know a mans abusive til it's too late. It's not like abusive men walk up to women and bars and go "If you date me I'll knock your lights out then gaslight you about it."

chalkandapples · 2021-09-22T16:46:22+00:00

I don't think in my experience women put up with abusive behavior more than introversion. Introversion isn't really a bad thing, and a lot of women like it. The thing with introversion is though, that it usually causes the guy to not actively force their way into the woman's life, while abusive people can. Abusive people are not successful, abusive AND manipulative people could be successful if they successfully manipulate someone. Good manipulators are often socially talented and therefore not quiet. And you often only can acknowledge what had made their presence known to you. The large problem with being introverted is that you're not visible, not that you're unlikable.

januaryphilosopher · 2021-09-22T17:03:25+00:00

Because being abusive often means you're good at manipulating people and making them do what you want, including dating you. Abusers aren't going to make their abusive qualities obvious early on, and are often hard to tell apart from non-abusers, including being shy and introverted.

goneaway2thewind · 2021-09-22T16:58:06+00:00

It’s not necessarily the abuse that turns them on, it’s that the masculine traits that overlap with abuse is what activates their submission.

They don’t admit to it because it’s not in their interest for most guys to walk around being dominant over them, they still need to keep the NPC Men in check. They don’t want it to be Saudi Arabia do they? They only need 1 guy that assumes control through frame and that type of man will do that automatically despite their words. So they don’t need to tell the truth or even understand their superficiality in that regard.

happyface712 · 2021-09-22T16:58:48+00:00

What makes you think it’s the same woman?

The-Wizard-of-Oz- · 2021-09-22T18:38:34+00:00

False dichotomy

Individual-March8163 · 2021-09-22T17:29:53+00:00

Reminds me this gem of a post:

https://www.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/cux0dm/discussion_research_finds_that_women_do_not/?utm_source=amp&utm_medium=&utm_content=post_body

Bascially traditionally masculine men are more attractive to women, even if they are abusive, they share masculine traits and dark triad over introverted men who don't.

DplusLplusKplusM · 2021-09-22T22:58:00+00:00

Every woman has known another woman like this and we READILY admit that they're brainwashed. We move heaven and earth to get our friends, sisters, aunts and mothers out of these abusive relationships. It's a little specious on your part to try to tie this to your apparent lack of dating success.

Sultmaker_9000 · 2021-09-22T17:11:42+00:00

Easy, you have to look at it from her point of view. Instinctually its still better for her and her offspring to be guarded by a mean mother fucker than a choir boy.

Female preference hierarchy as always: Good guys> Bad guys> Nice guys.

WilliamWyattD · 2021-09-22T17:20:57+00:00

Why do some men let beautiful women abuse them in non-physical ways? We are all weak and sometimes desperate for that high that comes with attraction. Men find many women attractive, but they also know that their chances of getting one to sleep with them are low. So once you have a 'hottie' who has been sleeping with you it is hard to let them go.

Add the fact that fixing a bad guy and turning him into a tough but good guy is a primordial female fantasy and you have a potent motivation for a woman to keep a guy in her life at all costs.

Why do women not admit this? That's complex. A lot of guys won't admit when they are being abused by their woman either. There's shame. There's the fact that you can't admit it to yourself as it destroys the fantasy. If you can't admit it to yourself, you can't admit it to others.

Are women less likely than men in general to openly admit shitty things about themselves? Maybe. Probably. Men and women both have strengths and weaknesses. Women are more prone to being sensitive to negative emotion. They are taught that they are morally superior to men, and thus expect themselves to be morally superior on some level. So straight up admitting your flaws and just living with them or not caring is hard for women. It creates a lot of negative emotion. Denial is easier. Women also face more external pressure along these lines from men, and especially from other women via the female social matrix.

wtknight · 2021-09-22T18:02:24+00:00

Women usually have some good times with the abusive guy. Abusers aren’t usually abusive 24/7, so some women try to forget the bad times and optimistically remember the good times.

On the other hand, boring guys are usually boring all the time.

Novadina · 2021-09-22T21:29:38+00:00

I’ve known shy introverted abusers, as well as exciting non-abusive people, so I’m not really understanding your categorization here. But the reason so many people (this is not just women - men frequently date and stay with abusive women as well!) stay with abusers is because of how psychology works, it’s like Stockholm syndrome. Abusers that people stay with don’t start abusive, they sneak it in slowly, and make you think you are at fault or deserve it. Also many people who were abused as kids think that is just how relationships and love works and repeat their parents behavior as adults.

There has been a lot of research and books written on this, if you really want to know the answer to your question you can find tons of info on it and learn all about it.

YellowSweetPotato · 2021-09-22T21:39:57+00:00

I see it kind of like why do people continue to eat junk food that makes them feel bad afterwards than only eating a healthy diet of whole foods?

I think many of the commenters hit it right on the head. It doesn’t make you feel bad at first but eventually you’re addicted to it, craving it. Or in your example, they’re in love with these men and thinks things can change.

Lotus_82 · 2021-09-22T22:07:44+00:00

It’s not about the “bad boys” it’s about the fact that they usually have more fun personalities and interesting lives compared to the Nice Guy who never disagrees with anything she says and who just feels kinda bland and boring compared to guys with spicier lifestyles and stronger personalities.

Chemical-Ad3703 · 2021-09-23T04:04:00+00:00

Truama probably..

heshetwink · 2021-09-23T05:48:38+00:00

…..Psych 101. Stockholm Syndrome and/or trying to protect oneself is not preferring abusive men. This is how abusive relationships work, regardless of gender dynamic.

hopesy123 · 2021-09-23T06:42:43+00:00

I think many of these cases (probably not all) is due to past trauma, neglect or being conditioned in a certain way to feel most comfortable or maybe even more safe by seeking their past abuse or a new abuse in order to gain control of the situation.

The idea that a woman can “fix” a broken or abusive man has being portrayed in so many kinds of media’s that it probably have effected many women and maybe still are, this is also very dangerous thinking and many times not possible to do in the first place. But I hope it will change, and as soon as possible.

Aldabruzzo · 2021-09-23T12:27:32+00:00

But there is no denying every man has met a woman who picks abusive men and makes excuses for their behavior.

This can be a trauma response. If you had an abusive father, your understanding of love will be strongly tied to being abused, and you won't grow up with a healthy concept of love, leading you open to being treated the same way again.

Why do you think this is so common

Shit parents are common.

Endor-Fins · 2021-09-24T01:58:24+00:00

Abusers do not start out being abusive. They win them over and then slowly break them down over time. Women don’t get into a relationship with someone knowing they are an abuser. Unless they are so traumatized they seek it out.

CloudBerryPunch · 2021-09-22T16:59:48+00:00

You're confusing confidence/outgoing with being abusive and so are they when they get suckered into those relationships.

TomorrowsWar · 2021-09-22T17:09:37+00:00

People who make excuses for abuse will also make excuses for “shy” and “introverted” men. They would make excuses for anyone they attach to because they can’t be alone.

But abusive guys are persistent and annoying, shy guys get so anxious they kind of just don’t put themselves out there at all. Out of sight, out of mind.

Sxdhaley · 2021-09-22T23:50:07+00:00

We don’t pick abusive men I’m so tired of this narrative. They PRETEND to be kind in the beginning

LillthOfBabylon · 2021-09-22T22:15:31+00:00

Oh great, another Nice Guy post asking why women be asking for it. Abuse is a serious topic and I'm getting so fucking sick and tired of it being a Nice Guy topic.

ragman75 · 2021-09-22T17:40:19+00:00

Its not that they prefer abusive men its that women often have really specific types, they will find the highest quality guy who meets x y and z criteria that will commit to them. So aslong as he still meets those criteria, a lot of women will put up with abuse from him because they don't think they can find a upgrade who meets x y and z that will commit that isn't abusive.

Its kind of like those guys who are really into ass where they will date and fuck girls who have meh faces not because they like ugly faces but because 70% of their attraction to the woman is in the quality of her ass so to them if you get 10/10 on that one quality you are super attractive to them.

TheBookOfSeil · 2021-09-22T17:42:41+00:00

The abusive men tend to be more attractive to those women because they have higher testosterone so women will be more accommodating to them than the lower T guys they see as less or unattractive.

rbx077 · 2021-09-22T17:50:05+00:00

Women prefer men with power, whether that comes from good looks, wealth, or social status. People with power can be more easily corrupted when they realize they can take advantage of it

Sewud · 2021-09-22T19:44:07+00:00

It really grinds my gears when people say women "prefer" abusive men.

First of all, you don't know how many single guys would be abusive if they had a girlfriend. You're not defaulted to being a nice guy just because you've never had a girlfriend. What if women are actually good at spotting abusive men and that's why the single guys are single? Give women more credit. The fact that SOME abusive men find girlfriends while SOME good guys are single isn't proof that abusive men are more popular. You'd have to check the percentage of good guys who are single versus the percentage of abusive guys who are single. But going back to my first point, it's probably impossible to measure if someone is abusive or not, and unclear what you even mean by that. I think what you really mean is "how come some abusive men have girlfriends when there are non-abusive men available". You seem to wonder why a girl is with an abusive man when there is at least one non-abusive man available in her city. Well I can think of several reasons:

1) The non-abusive men who are single are not interested in her, only the abusive men are. Abusive men might be willing to date girls with mental health issues that non-abusive men aren't willing to date.

2) The abusive men might use lying or hiding facts about themselves. If a guy is lying about his bad sides, wouldn't you agree that it will take a while for the woman to reject him for his bad sides?

3) The abusive men might be pushy, manipulative, and won't stop when she says she's not interested. This won't work on healthy women, but tying back to point number 1, it might work on a woman who mentally ill, non-committal, indecisive, weak, easily manipulated and struggling to put in place boundaries. Non-abusive men who hit on this woman will feel like she's not interested and will move on. They might witness how she lets shitty dudes walk over her and be completely turned off by her. So basically shitty dudes will find her, their pressure techniques will work on her, she will be seen as unattractive by good dudes, and her options will continue to be limited to abusive men.

In short, you might not even WANT to date the girls who date the abusive men. A good man is a man who is not abusive, a good woman is a woman who doesn't let abusive men near her.

By the way, abusive and introverted are not opposites. Why would only confident extroverts be abusive? Lots of introverted dudes are unstable and maladjusted, will make her feel bad for having friends, will secretly hate women, will threaten to kill themselves if she doesn't date them, etc.

AtomicMGTOW · 2021-09-22T19:57:16+00:00

At a certain level I think that part of it is that the introverted men are actually quite calm and not very assertive. And I think to most women the introverted man seems quite sad.

The man with the dark Triad traits, the one that's a little bit more aggressive and a little bit dismissive towards women triggers their nurturing response.

Women don't want to help make a sad man happy. But in some twisted way they all think they can take an angry man and calm The Savage Beast so to speak.

Both men and women like to feel useful. Men will run around chopping down trees and digging ditches to try and make a woman more comfortable.

Women don't have that skill so the way they want to help is to use their natural womanly nurturing skills to essentially soothe the angry frustrated child

Just imagine it like this (and this is one of the reasons why the term boys don't cry comes up)... Imagine the child who for example falls off their bike or gets bit by a bee or another kid pushes them and they fall down. They cry in an anger and a frustration due to the pain. This sends the mother's brain on alert and she goes running to the child to comfort it and calm it down which is usually only requires very short period of time.

The alarm goes off in her, head she runs to the rescue she comforts and consoles the child and within 5 minutes everything's all calm and her reward center goes off in her brain telling her that she did this wonderful job.

An introverted man might seem sulky. He's obviously not going to be very exciting he's not going to provide much adventure and I have a feeling that she's looking at that as almost like she would be his long-term nurse and therapist. There are very few women, very few, that would be willing to do that.

My brother was an alcoholic and ended up in a shelter even though he was a plumber. He had been damaged by sexual abuse from my grandmother. But he would drink and party and ride motorcycles and snowboard. He was very extreme in those type of things. His baby mama had a master's degree in psychology. She was fully aware that he was borderline personality disorder and also fully aware that there's no cure for that. But she bailed them out time and time again when he would get himself into trouble. He'd get drunk he'd scream and yell at her he push her down he leave he'd go to a hotel he'd go party and doing drugs and plowing hookers for a week and he can call up his baby mama and cry guilt and shame her and she would end up running to him and bringing him Subway sandwiches and even more booze. Of course the whole thing ended badly and now he's dead.

My other brother went through pretty much the same thing. He was sexually assaulted by my grandmother at a very young age and it ruined him but he got very quiet and very introverted and very shy. He was homeless for two decades. No one came to bail him out.

One seems to have potential even though he would ruin everything that he achieved very shortly after achieving it. The other one turned into a church mouse. That does not get a woman excited.

Women need and thrive on chaos and conflict and drama as long as they feel like they can put out the fire using essentially their body. They'll hold and console the baby for a little while. And they'll feel like they were very useful in helping him feel better again.

But the shy introverted guy looks damaged and like a long-term nursing assignment and they aren't going to do that for a man. They need to at least believe that there is hope that they can soothe him enough in short order to get him standing back up and back to work.

Although women claim to be more emotionally intelligent than men it seems to me they focus on the three primary emotions, almost like the primary colors. Happy sad angry. You rarely hear women describe their own emotional state any differently. And they rarely describe other people's emotional state any differently. They'll say I was unhappy in my marriage. They'll say "you have anger issues!" And a sad guy to them just looks like a incel living in his mother's basement.

You would rarely hear them describe themselves or anyone else (besides their children) as puzzled, enchanted, content, scared, frustrated... The quickly reduce all of those down to the main primary emotions. Puzzled scared and frustrated are quickly translated to anger. Enchanted or content translates to Happy.

Women will focus so much of their emotional intelligence onto their children that they will pick up things and give the children Grace for being frustrated or puzzled or mesmerized. But when it comes to men, even the ones they claim to love, they simply won't put in the effort or patience to determine his actual emotional state never mind put in any real effort to solve the problem. They will quickly determine is he happy or sad or mad and if there's anything to do about that and if she's willing to do anything about that. It's very reductionist and she assumes that she's right she's always got it right. And most of the time the response - even if internally only - is "suck it up".

Modern day women have simply no interest in nursing they're grown male adult partner. Just think of the example of the man flu. That translates as sad, and boy do women resent that s***. They aren't making you chicken soup. They aren't getting a cold damp cloth to put on your forehead. They will do that for their children and their children only.

Whether he be introverted, sad or sick, I believe it all translates the same in a woman's mind and then she gets a disgust response to that.

If a man is angry she may very well quickly submit and perhaps try and get close to him and use her body to soothe him.

And if a man is too happy for too long she is going to cause a situation that will get him angry because a happy man is boring as f*** to her. It's almost as repulsive as the sad man but their brain can't Square the circle.... In other words they can't get mad at the happy man. As a matter of fact the happy man renders the woman useless when it comes to her natural nurturing abilities. This is when they will set about creating and provoking a problem.

In my estimation a happy man is about as equivalent as a guy who's just got a little too much free time for her liking. He's not working enough and not stressing enough. I think she sees this as him taking it too easy. It might spawn some jealousy in her which she will never admit but she will seek to ruin your good time. It drives women crazy that men can go into their own little headspace and stare at a f****** video game for 8 hours. My father-in-law could come home and read a book for a few hours. But sure enough mother-in-law is going to go in the den sit down and say I want to talk, let's talk. They've been married almost 50 years what the f*** is there to talk about. And I'm sure she doesn't want to talk about him and his interests and what he's reading. She wants attention and she's going to whine and guilt and shame father-in-law to get what she wants.

honey-bundy-88 · 2021-09-22T21:12:45+00:00

I feel like love bombing is also a factor here. Abusive relationships have a cycle and the beginning of a new relationship is always the best times. Think about being intensely showered with affection, gifts, and promises for the future, you’ve been made to believe that all this is a sign of "love at first sight". Since such signs of affection and affirmation may meet felt needs and not look harmful at the surface, the excitement of such a new relationship often does not appear as cause for alarm”. It’s only after things take a turn for the worse and the abusers true tendencies begin to show that you realize the image of your perfect relationship was a lie. When people talk about getting back together, THIS is the part of the relationship that they’re imagining returning to. They may believe that this time their partner will stay as amazing as they were in the beginning.

Introversion has little to do with relationship styles and more to do with your approach fo social situations. But in any case, a person with a healthy set of boundaries won’t feel the need to possess their partner by tricking them into a long term commitment so soon. Their approach may be more subtle and not as passionate and exciting as the one they just left.

No one likes to admit when they’ve been fooled. And in abusive relationships, the blame usually falls solely on the shoulders of the victim instead of the abuser for their treatment (kind of like what’s happening here). It’s embarrassing to admit that you were so enticed by the idea of the perfect partner that you turned down other prospects that were objectively better for you. But that’s not to say that being shy or introverted is innately the better option.

ColorMePoorly · 2021-09-22T22:14:47+00:00

I don't have a lot of time to expand on this, but I just listened to part of a podcast episode of Dr. K (healthyGamerGG), where he talks a bit about different attachment styles. He says that one reason people may stay into abusive or toxic relationships is because they don't think they deserve better. Essentially, they feel insecure about themselves, which is painful, and since the brain prefers a known pain from an unknown pain, the person will more easily stay in a relationship where their partner will treat them how they already view themselves.

It's not the only explanation, but your post made me think of it.

Maybe sometimes, they will more easily forgive their piece-of-shit partner than someone that treats them better, because they already have those insecurities. Whereas shy/introverted partners might want to treat them good, and they can't accept it because they don't think they deserve this level of consideration.

It's just anecdotal, but I loved my ex-boyfriend very much, but our relationship was painful to him because he never truly believed he was worth my love and attention. He was constantly battling this inside because he didn't think he was worth it.

ChairNegative2514 · 2021-09-22T22:02:57+00:00

You shy/introverted men just need to get a grip and realize that hating women won’t solve your own insecurities sweetie. Has it ever crossed your toxic little minds that maybe you’re single because of your horrible personalities? Checkmate, incels. Women do not like horrible sexist men who treat them like dirt. Understand this before you expect a girl to date you. -Mic drop-

SwaySh0t · 2021-09-22T16:40:02+00:00

Because ape brain want. Extroverted, psychopathic and narcissistic behaviors is attractive to a womens lizard brain in the short term because evolutionary biology dictated that those were stronger and more dominant men as opposed to the more passive introverted type. Only when they get settled in a LTR or have children the long term provisioning light switch turns them off to this behavior because it’s more destructive to their offsprings survival.

ffandyy · 2021-09-22T20:54:05+00:00

r/niceguys

applesaucekungfu · 2021-09-22T17:27:22+00:00

Your Over complicating things women are attracted to power not weakness so they will put up with more abuse from the alpha abusers

G35guy1994 · 2021-09-22T17:48:16+00:00

That's something I've been trying to understand for years. You'd have to ask God since he engineered them.

malin_w13 · 2021-09-22T17:48:58+00:00

Abuse can be addictive; there’s a chemical/hormonal reaction to it.

Not sure what shyness/introversion has to do with it? Generally they aren’t as appealing traits as being outgoing and extroverted. Either can be abusive though.

wateroclock · 2021-09-22T18:03:20+00:00

Extroverted men who will become abusive, but aren’t at the moment > shy men

CommanderBobcat · 2021-09-22T18:09:40+00:00

Because abusive = powerful, and women like powerful men, far more than weak, acquiescent men.

michael1962-01 · 2021-09-22T18:15:44+00:00

Women like leaders and winners....

Introverts are rare on that category.

kyle_fall · 2021-09-22T18:24:01+00:00

Because at least they are masculine so it creates a sexual polarity.

A shy/awkward guy doesn't have his masculinity developed so although he's more pleasant to hang out with, he makes the relationship almost platonic for the women he's involved with romantically and sexually so it's super hard to make that work.

rathyAro · 2021-09-22T18:37:29+00:00

My friend once said it's just because the sex is better.

ThenIJizzedInMyPants · 2021-09-22T18:41:42+00:00

Don't abusive men tend to shack up with emotionally damaged women? The types of women that are desperate for male attention and validation.

Mrs_Drgree · 2021-09-22T18:53:30+00:00

[permanently deleted]

Unga_Bunga_Kill_Kill · 2021-09-22T18:58:06+00:00

Legit your woman needs you to make decisions and reasons to follow you. You need to lay out what your plans are demonstrate you are in control and are a competent human being. Note there is a difference from being oppressive. If you are worthy of following, she will follow you. I have a girl and been together more than 7 years. For a lack of better words you need to know when to put her in her place and not take shit from her. Also it helps to just get a woman who isnt a feminist and wants to challenge you cause patriarchy. Women can be strong and voice their opinions without being combative. At the end of the day you need to be the one who leads and be the stability in the relationship.

IOportA · 2021-09-22T19:01:24+00:00

It's genetics, developed over millions of years of natural selection for violent males.

As humans went from a nomadic, violent life to more peaceful agrarian life style, women's desire for violent men was controlled via arranged marriage.

Now that arranged marriage has been discarded, society is seeing why it was created in the first place.

grand_tiremaster · 2021-09-22T19:10:59+00:00

I put up with shy/timid men for a long time, kind of "teaching" them to be more assertive. Then shit happens which ultimately causes the break up.

Like this fella I dated in 2017, he was an aspie too, there were many times where I was like "wtf is he doing". We broke up because I wouldn't convert to be a Southern Baptist, and apparently that was a must to move forward with the relationship. I'm Catholic. He said that my dad would be in hell for being Catholic, and he didn't want to see me go to hell. Rude! Lol! At the time I thought it was so rude that I broke up with him.

I've only had 2 relationships with abusive/narcissistic men, and in those relationships we would fight/argue A LOT, but with the introverted men I dated we didn't fight like that. Very minor squabbles compared to what happened with the narc guys. Narc men have explosive anger, they'll scream at the top of their lungs, throw shit, punch walls, slam doors, etc. I am not lenient with any of that crap. If you come at me yelling, I will yell at you right back to leave me tf alone. I will tell your parents that you're crazy, too.

nathaniel_new · 2021-09-22T19:34:14+00:00

Even though women don’t like abusive guys they are emotional creatures and the “abusive men” provide some good emotions as well. That’s why push and pull is such an effective strategy on women; the introverted guy isn’t giving them the tingles they want. The aforementioned characteristics of the “abusive guys” can make sex seem really good because that’s the most intimacy they will ever get from guy like that plus the mix of positive and negative emotions does it for them. Form a guy’s perspective it seems stupid as fuck, but remember that we are wired differently.

NUKE_DEMOCRACY · 2021-09-22T19:48:57+00:00

They prefer masculine men, who are often more abusive

The age old contradiction, that's just how it is

JacobMoogberg69 · 2021-09-22T19:49:57+00:00

You guys don't get it. These jerks and assholes have something that none of you nice guys have. They have immunity to drama and disrespect and low tolerance for bullshit. While a nice guy will let a woman get away with murder, an asshole does not and that actually makes her feel safer with the asshole. Because if she can step all over a guy and control him through drama and BS, then anyone else can too therefore she doesn't feel safe with a weak nice guy.

And you know deep down you are weak. You tolerate female bullshit, you tolerate bad and disrespectful Behavior, you have zero boundaries with women, you never stand up to them and you are too afraid to lose them. This is what's making you unattractive to them. And yea, a man who might beat them every once in a while but doesn't tolerate disrespect is more desirable than a nice guy wjth no backbone. That's nature.

The hot stripper who uses you for money and champagne and doesn't care for you is more sexually attractive than the shy, frumpy and overweight nerdy girl who will actually be nicer to you and will treat you right. But you all want the hot chicks but you can't bring the hot badboy stuff to the table. So you are screwed.

Gullible_Salt_5684 · 2021-09-22T19:52:13+00:00

Suit Up.

Zofious · 2021-09-22T21:03:25+00:00

Because woman will take excitement over boredom no matter what the form.

KamuiObito · 2021-09-22T21:21:29+00:00

Idk but it be funny cuz it’s always gonna be like this

rothkochapel · 2021-09-23T00:47:45+00:00

Women will tolerate ANYTHING except boredom

Mrs_Drgree · 2021-09-22T19:04:25+00:00

[permanently deleted]

superlurkage · 2021-09-22T19:09:07+00:00

Because they’re more attracted to the abusive men for reasons other than “he beats, insults or yells at me”?

Is this really that hard to grasp? Pick a reason, any reason — looks, money, status, fame, sex, attention, etc etc — they’re all legit

Meanwhile, where do men get this idea that shyness/introversion is a desired trait, because it’s not. For any gender.

Physiologist21 · 2021-09-22T19:52:28+00:00

Combine the following:

Women hate boring

Women run instinctively on emotion not logic

Women call everything abusive, ie. setting boundaries, not putting up with their shit, having standards, etc.

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BabyOutrageous468 · 2021-09-22T18:05:20+00:00

Some do some don't 🤨 And yeah I'm wondering the same thing

AutistNerd · 2021-09-22T18:56:59+00:00

People tend to attract to opposite of what they are.

Title	If women don’t prefer abusive men, why are they more lenient with them than shy/introverted men?
Author	aquamanouttawater
Upvotes	195
Comments	493
Date	September 22, 2021 4:29 PM UTC (2 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PurplePillDebate
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/ptb88c/if_women_dont_prefer_abusive_men_why_are_they/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PurplePillDebate/if-women-dont-prefer-abusive-men-why-are-they-more.1074947 https://theredarchive.com/post/1074947