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Melodave86
[–]somethrows 54 points55 points56 points 8 years ago (48 children) | Copy Link
I was one of these babies. Nothing ever happened to my mom and I ended up being adopted.
I don't really wish any harm on her, in reality though some rehab would have been the right thing, and to my knowledge that never happened.
[–]Apemazzle 53 points54 points55 points 8 years ago (47 children) | Copy Link
This guy gets it: addicts need medical help, not criminal charges.
[–]fancyhatman18 33 points34 points35 points 8 years ago (20 children) | Copy Link
The problem is they were doing this to a baby, not just to themselves. If you hit a woman and she miscarries, you are charged with murder/manslaughter. If she smokes crack every day and her baby ends up severely deformed, should she not be held responsible?
[–]Felpsy 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
In the UK, a fetus is not considered "a reasonable person in being" and therefore it's not considered murder. Not sure about other countries though.
I'm fairly certain they just get charged for assault/GBH.
[–]fancyhatman18 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
In the US it is murder.
[+]Apemazzle -19 points-18 points-17 points 8 years ago (17 children) | Copy Link
If she smokes crack every day and her baby ends up severely deformed, should she not be held responsible?
Sometimes, definitely yes, but other times, it achieves nothing. If she has a disease, called addiction, that's making her behave that way, what she needs is medical help, not criminal charges.
If you hit a woman and she miscarries, you are charged with murder/manslaughter.
Not if you have a mental illness that precipitated the violence; in that case, you are sent to a medical institution for rehabilitation, because jail time wouldn't help you. Addiction is a disease.
[–]fancyhatman18 12 points13 points14 points 8 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link
So if I have a disease called alcoholism and I get in a car wreck and kill someone is it not my fault?
False on the second one. if the disease you have is drug addiction then you will definitely be charged more harshly.
[–]Apemazzle -5 points-4 points-3 points 8 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link
It is your fault because you made a conscious decision to get in the car while drunk. You could've easily chosen not to drive.
By contrast, a pregnant crack addict cannot easily choose not to smoke crack; their disease, called "substance use disorder", impairs their ability to make that choice.
I'm no psychiatrist; I'm not saying addicts who smoke crack while pregnant should never be held accountable for it; I am saying that they deserve sympathy with charges and sentencing, because many of them are good people who have a bad disease (as opposed to bad people). What they need is treatment for their disease, and for many of them, that's all they need.
[–]fancyhatman18 8 points9 points10 points 8 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link
I'm saying you are responsible for your actions in our current legal system, even when you are addicted to drugs. Just because she "really needs crack" doesn't mean they shouldn't face a punishment for what this does to their children.
[+]Apemazzle -6 points-5 points-4 points 8 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
Just because she "really needs crack"
It's not just "really needing crack" it is a recognised medical condition. A lot of these people would never normally dream of doing harm to their baby - or to anyone; it is only their disease that makes them act this way. If you sling these people in jail, you ignore the underlying problem and only cause further harm. Unlike other crimes, punishment neither rehabilitates nor deters. What's the point of punishment then?
[–]fancyhatman18 5 points6 points7 points 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
Now you're just getting into the philosophy of punishment.
The thing is the woman chose to do crack. That harmed the baby. She knew it would harm the baby.
Would a crack addiction also mean gunning down someone for their wallet is ok? Where do we draw the line on who you can hurt in the course of fueling your addiction? The current law in America says even doing crack the first time was a felony. She started off with a felony, and that felony led to her harming her child.
[+]Apemazzle -8 points-7 points-6 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Ah yes, how irrelevant /s
I agree that it should be illegal, I just don't think it should be enforced all that often because enforcing it often achieves nothing.
[–]Gnometard -1 points0 points1 point 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Soooo.... if I'm addicted to rape, I can rape all I want and not need to worry about legal issues?!?!?
[–]Diarrhea_Van_Frank 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link
Addiction isn't a disease, it's a choice. I'm a smoker, but I don't pretend that my dependence on nicotine is anything other than the direct result of my own actions.
[–]willmaster123 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
I'm sorry but I was addicted to heroin for 5 years and it is completely a disease. It is possible to cure your self of the disease, but it requires an EXTREME amount of hard work and willpower, more than most people will ever have.
It's not a disease in the same way a cold is, but more it's both a disease of the mind (constantly wanting it) and of the body (feeling like death without it).
I was addicted to cigarettes too, and while it affects a lot of people, it's not even close to the horrible addiction that heroin is.
[–]Apemazzle -2 points-1 points0 points 8 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link
I'm using the word addiction to refer to substance use disorder:
Substance Use Disorder refers to the overuse of, or dependence on, a drug leading to effects that are detrimental to the individual's physical and mental health, or the welfare of others.
[–]Diarrhea_Van_Frank 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
Right. Which they would not have developed without making a conscious choice to use.
[–]Apemazzle -5 points-4 points-3 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
You honestly see no difference between a pregnant woman who's not addicted to crack smoking crack and a pregnant woman who is addicted to crack smoking crack? You think they're equally immoral and equally culpable? Even though one of them literally has a disease that accounts for her behaviour and the other one does not?
[–]asaasa1983-2 points 8 years ago [recovered] (1 child) | Copy Link
Substance use disorder is a disease.
Addiction to crack isn't.
See the difference? Being easily addicted to something is a disease, but you can't say that the thing you're addicted to is the disease or the cause of your disease. What if I was addicted at eating red Jell-O and nothing but red and brand name Jell-O? I would be totally functionnal (maybe a bad case of diabetes, who knows!) but I would still suffer from substance use disorder wouldn't I ?
So yes addiction to a drug is a crime and not a disease. There might be an underlying cause which makes you more likely to be addicted to it but you can't be addicted to something you never tried, can you? See how your argument makes no sense when put this way? Ths is why people don't agree with you.
A woman who decides to become pregnant and doesn't seek medical treatment for her addiction to crack is basically endangering the life of her child. If, the moment he's born, he shows an addiction, a deformation, a disease or anything other adverse condition related to the CRIMINAL use of a drug, the mother should at the very very least (and that's being insanely leniant here) lose the custody of her child.
[–]Bortasz 22 points23 points24 points 8 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link
Soooo why all that men who were arrested over marijuana? Don't get me wrong but this is PussyPass. If over milion children were found with met addiction with single fathers... we will see 1milion convicted men.
[–]Levy_Wilson -2 points-1 points0 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
If over milion children were found with met addiction with single fathers... we will see 1milion convicted men.
Well... duuuuh, if those children got addicted to meth that means the fathers actually gave the children drugs. That's child abuse, among other things. As far a I know, there are no laws about abusing an embryo.
[+]BogWraith -45 points-44 points-43 points 8 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link
What about the men who got these women pregnant? Are they somehow immune from judgement? They were just as much a part of this as the women only the women were stuck carrying the baby so ended up taking the blame. I bet those guys were such great guys and would have made excellent fathers had they stuck aro-oh, wait! :P
You guys are fucking obsessed, get a grip and step outside for some fresh air. This is about addiction and that is something that can happen to anyone, if men got pregnant instead you wouldn't even give a single shit about them because you can't warp their problems into your hate-material.
[–]StarHarvest 16 points17 points18 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
If you "get pregnant" in 2015 and you didn't want to, it's entirely your fault. Try Plan B or an abortion if you were too careless to take your pill or have the guy wear a condom.
[–]diesel_stinks_ 10 points11 points12 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Women have complete control over whether they have a baby or not, men do not.
[–]Bortasz 19 points20 points21 points 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
You mean does men who under influence have one night stand? Or guys who fuck a junky for 10 dollars and move along? Yes pleas Tell me how they are responcible that women start taking drugs, than get pregnant and give birth to addicted baby. Pleas explain to me how men are responsible for this?
Do we are obsessed that we want women to be ACCOUNTABLE FOR THERE ACTION? YES WE ARE.
[–]kylestephens54 7 points8 points9 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
I agree with you, but gosh darn, your English is rough.
[–]Bortasz 9 points10 points11 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
You just to have to read it... I have to write it :P ;)
[–]freedumb12311 points 8 years ago* [recovered] (13 children) | Copy Link
If you're harming yourself, that shouldn't be criminal. If you're harming a baby, that should absolutely be criminal. These women would face charges in any just society.
[+]Apemazzle -11 points-10 points-9 points 8 years ago (12 children) | Copy Link
See my comment below: what do you expect a pregnant crack addict to do?
And how do criminal charges help the situation? (Hint: they achieve nothing).
[–]freedumb1238 points 8 years ago* [recovered] (10 children) | Copy Link
Not get pregnant in the first place... Pregnancy is a choice with all the options available women to prevent and end pregnancy.
[+]Apemazzle -12 points-11 points-10 points 8 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link
Pregnancy is a choice
Often it's not.
[–]freedumb1237 points 8 years ago* [recovered] (8 children) | Copy Link
Unless the woman was raped, it is 100% a choice in a society that affords women over 20 viable methods of birth control. Also, choosing not to have sex while you're addicted to crack is another method of birth control, and it is 100% effective in preventing pregnancy.
[+]Apemazzle -10 points-9 points-8 points 8 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link
So you want to criminalise female drug addicts having unprotected sex now? Maybe criminalise the men as well, who knowingly have unprotected sex with a female drug addict? Good luck with that.
[–]freedumb1238 points 8 years ago* [recovered] (5 children) | Copy Link
Why would you criminalize the man? It's not a man's choice to have a baby. A woman has full control over her reproduction. The only choice a man made was to have sex. The woman chose pregnancy consciously or through negligence, and the man didn't. The women is responsible for becoming pregnant, because it is her body, not the man's.
[+]Apemazzle -8 points-7 points-6 points 8 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
Oi, don't get sidetracked: you can't criminalise female drug addicts having unprotected sex.
Since you asked, this is my off-the-cuff rationale which I may decide to relinquish. If we grant the following parameters:
1) The woman has a disease (drug addiction) which will inevitably lead to harm towards the child if she falls pregnant
2) The woman is too poor to abort the child
3) The man is fully aware of points 1) and 2)
Then IMO, the man is partly culpable for the harm to that child. Wouldn't you feel bad if you had unprotected sex with a woman that you knew was an alcoholic (and you knew had no money), and then she gave birth to a child with severe FAS?
I mean, I wouldn't, because I live in England, where she would've had easy access to the morning after pill or an abortion clinic completely free-of-charge. But in America? I think I would feel very bad. I would feel that as a responsible adult, I should not be having unprotected sex with impoverished drug addicts, because - aside from anything else - they might not have the capacity to avoid harming their child.
[–]Deathfrompopcorn 3 points4 points5 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Not going to disagree with you, you're absolutely right.
However, Males with crack addictions are tried and thrown in prison. Is that helpful? fuck no. However; it isn't fair and is still clearly a pussy pass.
[–][deleted] 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
False. They need both.
[–]Pinworm45 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
I understand this mentality but she commited a crime. I don't care what the law saws, bringing a person into this world with that that addiction is a fucking crime. It is a crime, period. If you're on meth, use a fucking condom. It's not fucking hard. Get on the pill. You have a million options. Places give free condoms. I know some dipshit is going to say "well durp condoms cost money, bus costs money". AND THAT IS OUTWEIGHED BY BRINGING A DRUG ADDICTED BABY INTO THIS WORLD? FUCK YOU. Being an addict does not absolve you of all responsibility. The birth of a drug addicted child can not be brushed asside as a "minor error" as if all the mother did was steal a twenty from her sister. No. Unacceptable.
Doing such an unimaginable thing deserves consequence. With one million, clearly some form of disincentive is required. Clearly the current method isn't working. While I'm almost always in favour of less criminal punishment, not here, not in this case. It almost seems as if it's about protecting women. UH HELLO THEY JUST RUINED THE LIFE OF SOMEONE THEY CREATED, or at least made it a lot more difficult than it ought to be. Having a birth defect (unrelated to meth or drugs) I know how much it blows to be born with something unfortunate. When it's by choice, that should be a crime. It's deliberately causing harm because it is so easy to prevent. It is no different than sneaking into someone elses house every night and giving them a shot of drugs. It is forcing it upon someone else. If doing that was a crime, there is no reason this shouldn't be considered equally as serious
[–]shitinmyunderwear 17 points18 points19 points 8 years ago* (14 children) | Copy Link
Source on this?
Edit: source is ops ass confirmed
[–]Melodave86[S] 4 points5 points6 points 8 years ago (13 children) | Copy Link
The Myth of Male Power, Warren Farrell, p.254
[–]Sparkleworks 17 points18 points19 points 8 years ago (11 children) | Copy Link
A web page promoting a book is a credible source? Come on, now!
[–]JJWattGotSnubbed 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (10 children) | Copy Link
To add insult to injury. Most if not all Drug Addiction experts believe that this thing called rehab is better than having drug addicts face criminal charges.
[–]OmwToGallifrey 14 points15 points16 points 8 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link
To be fair, there's a huge difference between punishing someone for putting something into their own body and punishing someone for indirectly putting something into the body of a child with no choice on the matter.
[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
That's implying that A. The mother knew she was pregnant and B. That it can be proved she did.
[–]JJWattGotSnubbed 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link
To be fair, thats not at all how drug addicts see it. The only thing they chemically care about at that point is drugs, not the baby. There are real chemical reactions to this sort of stuff, its not all about willpower.
[–]OmwToGallifrey 5 points6 points7 points 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
I agree but that shouldn't absolve them of accountability.
[–]StarHarvest 6 points7 points8 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
As a former addict, can confirm. There were countless people telling me that it "wasn't my fault" and that I was a "slave to my addition" and it just made me less motivated to stop. It was the Randy Marsh's Alcoholism effect.
[–]Psandysdad 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Like the people (mainly christians) who think smoking tobacco is some sort of moral failure, having no idea of the power a physically addictive substance has over the body.
[–]TBFProgrammer 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Our world may well be inherently deterministic. It may be that all of our actions are the patterned interactions of billions of random chances. Or, it may be that we actually have control and free choice despite all the evidence to the contrary.
Whilst the answer to that philosophical question is very interesting and useful, it doesn't overturn society's dependency on holding people accountable for their actions. You are still responsible, even if you couldn't have done otherwise. Our understanding of the problem allows us to better prevent it, or to prevent recurrence. It allows us to institute rehabilitation as a form of criminal sanction.
Ideally all crimes would be addressed with rehabilitation of some form. They would still be crimes and the freedom of the convict would still be restricted until the rehabilitation was complete.
[–]Terminal-Psychosis 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
One of the first issues anyone fighting for equality needs to work on.
[–]Squiggledog 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Seems to be a dead link
[–]snell_kille9 points 8 years ago* [recovered] (3 children) | Copy Link
Holy shit, that's 16,666 children for every crack addicted woman! They should lay off the drugs
[–]Melodave86[S] 5 points6 points7 points 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
Did you infer that the 1,000,000 were born to only the 60 that were charged?
[–]inthyface 4 points5 points6 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
That's crack math for ya.
[–]labiaflutteringby 8 points9 points10 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
well duh, the patriarchal CIA kickstarted the crack trade, everybody knows that
[–]aakksshhaayy 3 points4 points5 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
They were probably raped post-coitously... patriarchy confirmed.
[–]PeterPorky 3 points4 points5 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Oh my God. We don't even have shitty sources anymore. We literally have memes in this subreddit and people are taking it as fact. My head is going to explode.
[–]Apemazzle 3 points4 points5 points 8 years ago (17 children) | Copy Link
Yes, why didn't these crack-addicted women just stop smoking crack, a notoriously easy thing to do?
Better still, why didn't they just get an abortion when they found out they were pregnant? Abortions are so cheap and easy to get done in the US after all.
Some of them are definitely culpable for having unprotected sex when they knew they were in no position to have a child, but others may have been raped, or may have done sex work etc.
Callous behaviour, yes, but you know one thing that makes a person callous? Being a drug addict. Addicts need help, not jail time.
A more relevant statistic would be how many of those mothers had their children taken away by social services. I suspect it's a much higher proportion.
[–]fulanomengano 4 points5 points6 points 8 years ago (11 children) | Copy Link
Rights come with responsibility. They have their F@#!ing reproductive rights, is fair to ask for reproductive responsibility.
[–]spirit_spine 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago [recovered] (6 children) | Copy Link
That's not really how Constitutional rights work. Not at all.
[–]fancyhatman18 5 points6 points7 points 8 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
You have the right to free speach, you are responsible for the things you say.
You have the right to free press, you are responsible for what you publish in the press.
You have the right to freedom of religion, you are responsible for what you do in the name of that religion.
You have the right to own a gun, you are responsible for what you do with that gun.
So how exactly is that not how rights work?
[–]spirit_spine -3 points-2 points-1 points 8 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
You are conflating responsibilities with obligations.
[–]fancyhatman18 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Oh wow, your pedantic argument is appreciated by everyone. Everyone on reddit, gather round and applaud this person for basing their argument purely on the semantics of a word chosen. They really are doing god's work.
[–]brutinator 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
What's the difference between an obligation and a responsibility? If I'm responsible for something, am I not obligated to follow through on that responsibility?
[–]Apemazzle -1 points0 points1 point 8 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
They have their F@#!ing reproductive rights
Rights are irrelevant when you can't actually afford to exercise them.
is fair to ask for reproductive responsibility.
It is fair, which is precisely why bad mothers up and down the country have their children taken away from them by social services. If you can't be a responsible parent, you are not allowed to raise a child. That is the status quo.
[–]the_mighty_skeetadon 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
It isn't fair at all if men would be arrested and gave criminal charges under similar circumstances - (e.g., they show up at a hospital with a medical condition but are crack addicted and face charges).
[–]Apemazzle -3 points-2 points-1 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
You got any evidence that there's a gender disparity in convictions for crack possession? I was under the impression it was more of a race thing.
[–]the_mighty_skeetadon 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
http://time.dufe.edu.cn/jingjiwencong/waiwenziliao1/004109.web.pdf
See page 305. Disparities in sentencing for Blacks in Drug Trafficking offenses are +10.51 months, weighted. Disparities in sentencing for Females are -11.00 months, weighted.
So it's actually more of a positive effect to be a woman than it is a negative effect to be black in this case. Enjoy!
[–]lolwatman -4 points-3 points-2 points 8 years ago* (4 children) | Copy Link
Abortions are incredibly cheap and easy in comparison to the finances and effort required to properly raise a child for a few decades, especially when you can't even take care of yourself.
[–]spirit_spine 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago* (1 child) | Copy Link
That's like saying buying an airplane is incredibly cheap and easy in comparison to buying an island, and therefore everyone should have their own airplane.
You're not thinking about the fact that crack-addicted mothers are unlikely to have the initial funds to afford an abortion (due to lower socio-economic standing), much less the access to get an abortion (due to increasing anti-abortion legislation), the education to know where to get an abortion and, to begin with, the education to understand how to have protected sex.
EDIT: spelling : /
[–]lolwatman 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link
To become a crack-addicted mother implies bad decision after bad decision, after bad decision.
I agree education is very important but I can guarantee you that most of these mothers are well aware of the effects that hard drugs have on children, and child birth. It's more-so the fact that they are so addicted, they just don't care. My mother treats these people every single day and that's the morbid reality of hard drugs, they really have no regards for their actions.
Addiction is a definitely a disease, but at a certain point people need to be held liable for their actions. It's also important to note that a good portion of drug addicts are educated people, so it's far more complex than simply educating people about the effects.
Of course in a perfect world everyone would be educated about drugs and pregnancy. I think being pragmatic is important though, the situation here is not necessarily the drugs or the pregnancy, but both holistically because a parent is having their bad decisions directly affect the rest of a child's life.
[–]Apemazzle -1 points0 points1 point 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
You haven't thought this through at all.
1) An abortion may be cheaper than raising a child, but it's still prohibitively - yes prohibitively - expensive for a lot of people. As in, it costs so much money that you literally couldn't get one even if you wanted to.
2) You've overlooked the fact that parents can get financial support from claiming benefits (not to mention other help from charities in the form of clothing, food etc.), whereas no such help is available for a pregnant woman who wants to get an abortion.
3) You've overlooked the fact that children can be put up for adoption (i.e. given away).
[–]TheFleshBicycle -3 points-2 points-1 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Well...there are always coat hangers.
[+]bunker_man -9 points-8 points-7 points 8 years ago (11 children) | Copy Link
What does that have to do with anything? This is a problem caused by both parents. In at very least a good slice of cases.
[–]sockmess 14 points15 points16 points 8 years ago (10 children) | Copy Link
Crack is transferred in beast milk and with nutrition passed on to the womb. Unless the father poisoned the mother with crack he was no say on a baby being born addicted to crack.
[–]jackal858 3 points4 points5 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
No no. When it comes to abortion rights, it's solely a woman's choice about their body, but when it's a crack baby, clearly the patriarchy forced crack into them.
[–]johnny420black 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
Cocaine can also be carried by a man's semen, causing birth defects. Not that a crackwhore's "baby daddy" would be likely to stick around and continue to ejaculate inside of her for the duration of the pregnancy, but in some cases the man could be held partially responsible, I suppose. A "good slice" of them, though? Not so much.
[–]sockmess 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
Most sperm from a crack addict is deformed but there is a slight chance. Sucks since 60% of my sperm that is alive has 2 heads or 2 tails and i didn't even party.
[–]johnny420black 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
Oh shit. I'm sorry to hear that, man. Do you know what caused it? Is there any way it can be corrected?
[–]sockmess 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Just have to pay for IVF. Thanks.
[–]johnny420black 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
That makes sense. I'm glad you at least have a way around it. I would imagine that reproductive issues could be quite troubling.
[+]bunker_man -10 points-9 points-8 points 8 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
Okay? But in most of these cases he was probably willfully having unprotected sex with people knowing what the result was going to be, and not caring. I really don't get what math you're doing that implies that they all were having sex with virtuous guys who had no idea at all what the result was going to be.
[–]CornFedConscience 4 points5 points6 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Having sex with a crack addict, while risky and gross, isn't even close to being as messed up as doing crack for 9 months while pregnant. You're right, though. Let's cut crack mommy some slack
[–]sockmess -1 points0 points1 point 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
You only need to have sex once to conceive. Let's say it took three dates before having sex. How much do you really know the other person. The addicted might be able to pass it off. Or she wasn't addicted to crack yet and became so while pregnant.
[–]notacrackheadofficer 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
''she's too pretty to be on drugs'' says society about every pretty girl on drugs.
[–]whitey_sorkin -2 points-1 points0 points 8 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
Are you actually implying they should be prosecuted for a crime? What crime would that be?
[–]MarxIzalias3 points 8 years ago* [recovered] (3 children) | Copy Link
Doing Crack is legal in your world?
[–]whitey_sorkin -3 points-2 points-1 points 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
In "my world", yes, all consensual acts are legal. But here in the real world, you think crack mom's enjoyed privileged status because they weren't prosecuted? For what? Possession? Showing signs of past use?
Having signs of past use, implies they committed a crime.
It's like having a stolen watch on your wrist.
[–]blazedupree-4 points 8 years ago* [recovered] (2 children) | Copy Link
You're an idiot.
[–]Melodave86[S] 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
No one forced you to click the link, but you're so self righteous that you had to come into the thread and contribute nothing. Go away
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[–]Diarrhea_Van_Frank 1 point2 points3 points (2 children) | Copy Link
[–]Apemazzle -5 points-4 points-3 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]asaasa1983-2 points [recovered] (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]Bortasz 22 points23 points24 points (7 children) | Copy Link
[–]Levy_Wilson -2 points-1 points0 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[+]BogWraith -45 points-44 points-43 points (5 children) | Copy Link
[–]StarHarvest 16 points17 points18 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]diesel_stinks_ 10 points11 points12 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]Bortasz 19 points20 points21 points (2 children) | Copy Link
[–]kylestephens54 7 points8 points9 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]Bortasz 9 points10 points11 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]freedumb12311 points [recovered] (13 children) | Copy Link
[+]Apemazzle -11 points-10 points-9 points (12 children) | Copy Link
[–]freedumb1238 points [recovered] (10 children) | Copy Link
[+]Apemazzle -12 points-11 points-10 points (9 children) | Copy Link
[–]freedumb1237 points [recovered] (8 children) | Copy Link
[+]Apemazzle -10 points-9 points-8 points (7 children) | Copy Link
[–]freedumb1238 points [recovered] (5 children) | Copy Link
[+]Apemazzle -8 points-7 points-6 points (4 children) | Copy Link
[–]Deathfrompopcorn 3 points4 points5 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–][deleted] 1 point2 points3 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]Pinworm45 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]shitinmyunderwear 17 points18 points19 points (14 children) | Copy Link
[–]Melodave86[S] 4 points5 points6 points (13 children) | Copy Link
[–]Sparkleworks 17 points18 points19 points (11 children) | Copy Link
[–]JJWattGotSnubbed 1 point2 points3 points (10 children) | Copy Link
[–]OmwToGallifrey 14 points15 points16 points (9 children) | Copy Link
[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]JJWattGotSnubbed 0 points1 point2 points (6 children) | Copy Link
[–]OmwToGallifrey 5 points6 points7 points (2 children) | Copy Link
[–]StarHarvest 6 points7 points8 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]Psandysdad 1 point2 points3 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]TBFProgrammer 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]Terminal-Psychosis 2 points3 points4 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]Squiggledog 2 points3 points4 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]snell_kille9 points [recovered] (3 children) | Copy Link
[–]Melodave86[S] 5 points6 points7 points (2 children) | Copy Link
[–]inthyface 4 points5 points6 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]labiaflutteringby 8 points9 points10 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]aakksshhaayy 3 points4 points5 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]PeterPorky 3 points4 points5 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]Apemazzle 3 points4 points5 points (17 children) | Copy Link
[–]fulanomengano 4 points5 points6 points (11 children) | Copy Link
[–]spirit_spine 0 points1 point2 points [recovered] (6 children) | Copy Link
[–]fancyhatman18 5 points6 points7 points (4 children) | Copy Link
[–]spirit_spine -3 points-2 points-1 points (3 children) | Copy Link
[–]fancyhatman18 2 points3 points4 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]brutinator 1 point2 points3 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]Apemazzle -1 points0 points1 point (3 children) | Copy Link
[–]the_mighty_skeetadon 1 point2 points3 points (2 children) | Copy Link
[–]Apemazzle -3 points-2 points-1 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]the_mighty_skeetadon 2 points3 points4 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]lolwatman -4 points-3 points-2 points (4 children) | Copy Link
[–]spirit_spine 0 points1 point2 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]lolwatman 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]Apemazzle -1 points0 points1 point (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]TheFleshBicycle -3 points-2 points-1 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[+]bunker_man -9 points-8 points-7 points (11 children) | Copy Link
[–]sockmess 14 points15 points16 points (10 children) | Copy Link
[–]jackal858 3 points4 points5 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]johnny420black 1 point2 points3 points (4 children) | Copy Link
[–]sockmess 2 points3 points4 points (3 children) | Copy Link
[–]johnny420black 1 point2 points3 points (2 children) | Copy Link
[–]sockmess 1 point2 points3 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]johnny420black 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[+]bunker_man -10 points-9 points-8 points (3 children) | Copy Link
[–]CornFedConscience 4 points5 points6 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]sockmess -1 points0 points1 point (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]notacrackheadofficer 2 points3 points4 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]whitey_sorkin -2 points-1 points0 points (4 children) | Copy Link
[–]MarxIzalias3 points [recovered] (3 children) | Copy Link
[–]whitey_sorkin -3 points-2 points-1 points (2 children) | Copy Link
[–][deleted] 1 point2 points3 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]blazedupree-4 points [recovered] (2 children) | Copy Link
[–]Melodave86[S] 0 points1 point2 points (1 child) | Copy Link