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Body Counts and Quality Men: The 2022 Complete Review

May 22, 2022

Hey ladies, I know this is a sub for ladies but as a man who is surrounded literally up and down by men making 6 and 7 figures that actually have their shit together physically, emotionally, financially, and family wise , I feel like giving you my insight based on conversations with many of these dudes for dating would be valuable.

The first thing to outline is that seeing a man with money as a "HVM" (I hate the term, but let's go with it) will lead to loads of pain. I know a few footballers and crypto dudes that with all due respect are lames dating wise. They had talent/luck in one department and money came as a byproduct of it. That is not who you probably want as they aren't as strong mentally and give in to temptations with ease. The type of guys I am talking about are 25-40, business oriented, high standards, and do not date based on potential. They assess what they have in front of them right there and then. More importantly, my actual friends are traditional to a T and do not cheat.

So, the topic of body counts is often discussed here, and I have seen a few ladies saying that it doesn't matter. It does x1000. Once you are in a certain socioeconomic space, appearances and reputation is what rule you, no man who is worth his dent would ever put himself in the position of dating somebody who has been "out there".

The sooner one comes to terms with the quote:

"women want men with a future; men want women with no past",

the more fulfilling our lives will be relationship wise.

I understand that the likelihood of dating someone with a promiscuous past, going to a restaurant with her, and seeing two men that she slept with coming to say hi to her is low, but that is how we think about it, and it is a MASSIVE FEAR we have.

Yes, some dudes do not care about your body count but I know that you'd like to date the best man possible. So, in order to get the best man, you should come to terms with the fact that the best man has his own standards and thankfully for you, they aren't even that difficult to meet, it is just that unfortunately you ladies receive lots of mixed information all around.

1- Protect your body count at all costs. This one is not even a debate. I am not gonna tell you not to be promiscuous but to accept the fact that YOUR PAST MATTERS AND IT ALWAYS WILL for men with options. ALWAYS.

There was a thread on Twitter about it. Some 18 year old was talking about her body count being 1 and feeling like she's missing out, and another woman told her to go have fun and sex with many men. Men adviced her to not listen to her. Another woman chipped in and said that she slept with over 100 men and that her partner does not care. Somebody shared the thread with the partner and he broke up with her, right there and then. She made a post saying that he broke up with her.

We are giving you the answers to the test. Don't take bad advice.

2- Work on yourself. Be well read, physically fit and have hobbies.

These dudes do not want a woman to make him the center of her life. This is not to mistake with not giving him attention but to have things you like. A personality, a passion. Drawing,writing... these are things that are lost nowadays but most dudes agree that it makes you super appealing.

I met my ex when she was writing in a very sunny day under a tree alone in a park wearing a very simple dress, a summer hat and no shoes. She radiated femininity and I was mesmerised. (We broke up because she was a little older than me and wanted to get married soon. I did not feel ready but I kind of regret it. She is all I want in a woman.

3- Limit the advice you take from your single friends. It will lead you to make bad choices that will be expensive for you from a romantic standpoint. Trust me!

4- Take accountability. We all make mistakes, dudes that have done the work will own their mistakes and won't entertain somebody who is never wrong.

5- Come to terms with the fact that double standards do exist in society both for men and women. Most men that are wealthy will unlikely be judged by most women if they are competent in every department but have been promiscuous. Women do get judged. Many women get for free or cheaper in clubs, we pay. Double standards have been there since day one.

The reason why other men look up to men with many options is because they know that consistently dating super attractive women is faaaaar from easy as they themselves have tried and failed miserably. that is why it is not frowned upon for men (generally speaking). Furthermore, the prettier the ladies I personally dated, the more pretty ladies took initiative and approached me in other occasions, despite having seen me with other women. That is just how it has been.

As a lady, you can be literally dirt broke or even homeless, that if you are decent looking, you can get laid with 5 dudes a day just saying "let's have sex". Since it is so easy for you, most dudes believe that you should make yourself exclusive. With great power comes great responsibility. The choice is yours nevertheless.

I know for a fact that if I hadn't done what I did for a living, made good money, drive what I drive... I would not get 1/10 of the options I do. I had to become. When I am in the VIP of clubs, the men there tend to have money, the ladies there, do not. Literally 90% don't, yet we are in the same place. I had to delete my IG for years, work like a donkey, learn, reinvest on my company, suffer, and finally see the light. they just had to be hot, and I am totally fine with it. That is just how society has always been. I understand that those women do not represent the general but you get the analogy, it still applies in different levels and situations.

Protect what God gave you. Your cards are there in a way with men, protect them and improve them. You'll find yourself with a good man sooner rather than later. Be a forward thinker. Ignore fuckboys and learn about yourself. If you have a history of beinng attracted to bad men, address it and correct it, you will thank yourself in the future.

PS: I am not saying I agree or disagree with the double standards but they are a fact. I am personally not promiscuous but I dated a bit, and no woman I have dated has ever cared about my body count despite them having a below 4 body count (they said that. I believed them as they were pretty religious like me).

80% of of this post is me repeating literally what most of them said and the other 20% my experiences.

So yeah, good luck!

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Post Information
Title Body Counts and Quality Men: The 2022 Complete Review
Author SEO403
Upvotes 118
Comments 133
Date May 22, 2022 3:56 PM UTC (1 year ago)
Subreddit /r/RedPillWomen
Archive Link
Original Link
Red Pill terms in post

[–]KombuchaEnema4 Stars 64 points65 points  (3 children) | Copy Link

The only deviation I have from your advice is that it’s okay to date for potential if you’re young (and smart).

When I was 19 I started dating my husband. At that time he obviously wasn’t very far in his career (in fact, he hadn’t even gotten started yet). But I saw in him a good work ethic and traditional values. He came from a dirt-poor abusive household and had to drop out of high school to pay his family’s bills. I dated him for potential and now he makes very good money for our age group and good job security.

I was there when he went to get his GED. I was there when he went to trade school. I drove him to and from all his classes. I helped him study. And I was there when he got started in his career.

He also dated me for potential. I wasn’t great at cooking or cleaning when we started dating. But when I got out of my mom’s house and we got our own place, it lit the biggest passion in my heart for homemaking. My mom was a drug addict so I stayed in my room as much as possible and wouldn’t dare wander into any shared living spaces (including the kitchen).

A lot of people here (like me) come from poor or dysfunctional households. The dating game becomes 10x harder when you’re young and have to learn how to recognize potential in others and in yourself.

For young women I think the best way to build a bond with a man is to be there for him while he’s in the building phase. My husband tells me he will never cheat simply because I was there for him when he was broke, working a minimum wage job and had no car or GED. Women who throw themselves at him once he makes good money are worthless to him.

Obviously that’s the old-school way to do it. Boy meets girl in high school and they stick together from that point onward.

But modern redpill dating seems to be more focused around young women dating men in their 30s who are already established. I think those relationships miss out on the fundamental intimacy that develops when a woman is there for her man during his building stage.

But I also understand the immense risk for a woman in pursuing a man based on potential. It’s a high-risk, high-reward arrangement.

[–]oliveshoot 22 points23 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

“I think those relationships miss out on the fundamental intimacy that develops when a woman is there for her man during his building stage.”

I agree. There is a risk with this, but the significant benefits are there too. These personality and character traits can be found in younger men and women. It’s just a bit more rare to find a man who is conscientious and a woman who can host a six-person dinner at age 20. If you’re looking beyond income and appearance when looking for a mate, you can find them. The traits will produce the fruit later. Most people at this age are not looking for these things, though. Some, but not the majority.

[–]oooKenshiooo 24 points25 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Dude here.

You put the finger on a thing that has been in the back of my mind for quite some time now: "If you come from a difficult background, you have enormous difficulties spotting a good partner and even more so potential."

Damn, that hit hard.

Also, kudos to you being there for your men. Women have enormous transformative power. Mine transformed me from music-hobo to successful businessman. :D

[–]Columba-livia77 73 points74 points  (8 children) | Copy Link

I guess remember that most women also have to work like donkeys, learn and do things for themselves. It's a minority of women who are very thin, attractive, naturally confident and sociable, and choose to date someone with money who is generous towards them. I'm saying this because it came off a bit like the rhetoric that women don't have to work for anything. Plus lots of women who are very attractive still choose to go to university and work.

It's also a bit odd if you're Christian and say premarital sex is okay for men but not women, this makes sense secularly but not in the Christian view. Paul was clear in his chapters that premarital sex isn't good for either gender.

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[–]Columba-livia77 5 points6 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

It sounds like we're on the same page actually, I agree with most/all of this. I was just worried that you might be like some incels I've seen that are under the delusion that life is really easy for women.

You got pretty fired up over this, there was no need to take it as an attack really.

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[–]Columba-livia77 2 points3 points  (3 children) | Copy Link

lol I edited once to add the last two sentences

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[–]Columba-livia77 3 points4 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

I edited once, and I can see most of your comments here have been edited, I think you take this way too seriously.

[–]CCloudds 24 points25 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

A high value man is a reliable man who is focused on his career , family and community. Not a rich man who is hedonistic and participates in debauchery. Maybe where you live promiscuous men don't get judged but in my community they do get judged and we have the lowest divorce rates. My dad never had the time to date around or hve affairs because he is a hard working man who worked hard all his life and gave so much to the community. My dad's home town didn't have a road my dad built it using his own money. Any man who's life revolves around beautiful women and treat women as eye candy is not a high value man. I know many hvm in my life who's first priority in a woman are not her looks.

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[–]cohost3 32 points33 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

This is good advice. Body count is huge, I feel so sad for women who get persuaded into thinking it doesn’t matter.

I like how you brought up the idea of money achieved through luck as not being high value. I remember back when I I went on a few dates with a man who was in finance. He was already making about 80k and was only 25. But I could tell he didn’t have any true ambition or work ethic. He was just naturally good with numbers and got lucky with the job market. He was also incredibly stingy, and would never want to go anywhere nice for dates. I instead ended up exploring things with my now fiancé. He had a lower paying job at the time, but had a strong work ethic and a strong desire to provide. He had goals and worked hard to achieve them. He would work for 16 hours and then still pick me up to go on a night time drive.

I realized back then that ambition, work ethic and desire to provide are worth much more than money. If finance guy lost his job, he would rather put his family in the poor house then work a job with less status. My fiancé would get a job licking door handles if it would help our family. These values are what makes the man a HVM. Not the actual dollars in his bank account.

[–]sunglasses903 Stars 46 points47 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

As a woman you’re not wrong.

Does it suck to hear? Yeah, because it’s not fair because it doesn’t go both ways, but the world isn’t fair. People make mistakes when they’re young. I hate to tell them it may haunt them forever, but the truth is it might…

My other advice to women is to not lie about it, but if it’s not relevant information don’t voluntarily give negative information about yourself to your partner or publicly online. If that lady would’ve not put that info out there for the world to see and put the burden on her partner to deal with it publicly probably it would’ve been fine. Don’t ask don’t tell does work sometimes. Don’t cause problems for yourself by not knowing when to keep things to yourself.

[–]notknownfromhere 14 points15 points [recovered] (9 children) | Copy Link

What advice would you give for young women that have already messed up in past and have been promiscuous? Im 20 years old and am just now becoming aware of the consequences my promiscuity will have in my romantic relationships. If I work on self improvement is there hope that I can attract and have a relationship with a high quality man or should I lower my standards?

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[–]drpaugrosso 3 points4 points  (6 children) | Copy Link

Hers is at 9

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[–]drpaugrosso 3 points4 points  (4 children) | Copy Link

I read her previous post

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[–]notknownfromhere 14 points15 points [recovered] (2 children) | Copy Link

Yeah it’s 9. Going forward I am definitely going to be more selective with who I choose to have sex with for many reasons. My previous experiences have shown me it’s really unfulfilling when it’s with someone I don’t share a connection with.

[–]One-Introduction-566 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I’m in the same place! I feel you. Also going to be more selective in the future and I know it’s not worth it at all for me

[–]huckleberryhomemaker 5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

As a married woman who also messed up early in my life, it's not a deal breaker for a good man. Abstain from sex until you are married. Period. It will save you heartbreak and mental issues down the road. Then you can begin looking for a man in the right places.

I met my husband on tinder because I didn't know where else to look. we shared values, he wooed me by being a gentleman, paying for dinner, surprising me with vintage stools for my apartment, and bonding over old architecture. I wooed him by being a hard worker, cooking for him and displaying what kind of wife I would be.

My husband isn't a multi millionaire and frankly, that shouldn't be what women consider a HVM. You want a man that is a hard worker, who would bust his rear to make sure you have what you need. You don't need lots of money you just need to know he would do whatever it takes to care for his family.

We've been together 5 years and married for 3 this month. We just had our first child and although we're two imperfect people, we have a wonderful marriage.

[–]RengarTwoTrick 4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

The number isn’t bad, it’s the mentality behind it. 20 is still young and if you meet a guy you really like and that guy cares about body count, just be up front with literally what you said in your post. 9 isn’t bad at all even though it’s relatively high.

[–]GreatBelow 20 points21 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

This post is a truth that many find inconvenient. The red pill sub also said it repeatedly before it was killed off due to many broken men latching onto the sub and bastardizing it.

Double standard or not people as a society measure future investment based on past data.

A key that can open many locks (options) is a master key. A lock that opens for any key serves no purpose.

[–]amhran_oiche 11 points12 points  (13 children) | Copy Link

not bad advice but this stuck out to me

The first thing to outline is that seeing a man with money as a "HVM" (I hate the term, but let's go with it) will lead to loads of pain.

which is why this is a women's sub lol. pretty bold to come in here with "being rich is not HVM.....but for men, a low body count is!"

income is a strong indicator of a lot of masculine qualities. this isn't just women looking to get a new designer bag every 6 months. furthermore this sub is pretty heavy (but not exclusive!) on tradcon lifestyles, so you're looking at a lot of potential SAHMs. it's hard not to consider income when looking at a partner. point blank it just tells you what you're going to be in for, whether that's keeping your job, or quitting and raising your kids.

yes higher income is preferable, as it is for men to prefer lower body counts and feminine looks. we know we're probably not marrying multimillionaires and you hopefully know you're not marrying virgins.

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[–]pearlsandstilettosModerator | Pearl[M] 2 points3 points  (11 children) | Copy Link

If you don't intend to be rude then don't be.

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[–]amhran_oiche 3 points4 points  (6 children) | Copy Link

it makes sense, you just don't like it. you literally disparaged men (footballers and crypto dudes) who got rich quick but said they aren't mentally strong and give into temptation. that is an absolutely bizarre correlation to make, and more bizarre still to come in here and tell us "what we probably want." you're welcome to whatever pov you have regarding what you and other men want. what we want is a man who has a good means of living that he has shown discernment in choosing and is excelling at, by way of receiving promotions (or other pay increases) and isn't job hopping. a strongly desired masculine trait is being able to provide. footballers and crypto dudes count too if they are responsibly managing their money.

I think you misunderstand what a HVM is. his income is only one aspect so yes, wealth does not necessarily equal a potential husband, but boy is it attractive! women want men with a future, remember? his future probably doesn't rest on Warhammer stats.

I'm curious what conclusion it is you think I came to that wasn't plain as day in your post? men like lower body counts, even if it's a result of poor social skills--the mindset doesn't really matter. if you have a decent-looking girl who has anxiety, but without that anxiety doesn't have a problem morally with sleeping with even long-term partners, men will still pick her over the bubbly, friendly girl who has slept with 6 guys even if she realizes that was detrimental to her and has now changed, right? it's hard to quantify morality and mindset, but really easy to count the number of partners, yes? hard pill to swallow for us ladies!

but I'll tell you, similarly, your get-rich quick compatriots look pretty darn good to us when we think about raising multiple children and being able to afford a good vacation every year, good vehicle or two, a house in a good neighborhood, and have an emergency savings! where's the so-called pain in that? you really think women are turning down rich crypto dudes because they got their income through "luck?" it's totally possible that they're lame dating-wise, as you say, but like, so are a lot of broke men? it's not exclusive to income.

you came in here with unsolicited advice, so be it. all in all you got some decent engagement but it has to go both ways. higher income IS a higher value trait. again, we know we're not all marrying multimillionaires or oil shieks (but those men need wives too!) again, it's weird to come in here with your unsolicited advice about what men find valuable and reject what women find valuable in the same breath.

if I misconstrued something you said, let me know without getting it deleted please.

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[–]amhran_oiche 5 points6 points  (4 children) | Copy Link

I am 100% confident that you know ZERO professional ballers and crypto dudes on a level. I am confident. I have been in the dating pool long enough to know what the vast majority of serious women want.

you are vastly, VASTLY, over-estimating your knowledge. everyone thinks they know everything dude. "Vast majority of dating women" is in itself concerning. if you've dated enough women to feel confident in saying this then I really doubt how successful you've been, which then casts doubts on your judgement. however, the most concerning aspect here is that you, a man, would under any circumstances insist to know what women in any group really want. come on. confidence IS sexy but this? nah. this is what all the incel subs sound like.

But you'd rather I give shit advice than facts that will help you.

I mean, no one asked for any advice so....

I find it wild how you have someone in front of you who has been on the scene telling you what happens there and you don't wanna take it.

you are some random person on reddit with absolutely zero verification and you're shocked pikachu face that your opinion isn't taken as law lmao come on my guy

My take is not a hypothesis, it is based on what I have experienced. It might be limited, but my limited is more qualified than your ZERO. literally 10s of ballers and crypto dudes, I know what they say and how they think.

it is definitely a hypothesis. definitely. the SELF-PROCLAIMED tens of ballers and crypto dudes *you* know are such a small, teeny, tiny, minute portion of men. you literally said your experience is LIMITED. sir what do you want me to do? believe you based on your *limited* experience with ballers in the *tens.* I was born at night but not last night.

If I say I know women with low body counts in the tens and that they would prefer baller-types over overly-confident men who need to feel like the smartest man in the room, you would never believe me. my limited knowledge? of women in the *tens?* now that's just silly.

Please cite where I rejected where women want. Not once have I done that.

Ah, it was here: "The first thing to outline is that seeing a man with money as a "HVM" (I hate the term, but let's go with it) will lead to loads of pain."

it's like you're intentionally misunderstanding the sub. this is not an equal counterpart to u/redpill.

You are the same woman who made a whole paragraph based on reading the post the wrong way and you keep doing it every time and it is exhausting, please read, please. It is very difficult to engage with you. Seriously.

the only other original reply I made in this thread is here. I think you are confusing me with someone else.

your condescending attitude is what makes it hard to engage. I don't HAVE to ask for clarification because I'm not "unsure" about what you've said, I am disagreeing with you, and you're taking my disagreement as not understanding, because obviously what you said is so correct that that can be the only reason someone wouldn't immediately agree with you and award all your posts.

You have no capability to correct me because all this is is putting forth opinions. if you disagree that's fine, but that doesn't make either of us "right." your experience is your own dude, I get that but it IS limited. if the baller types *you* know act in x manner, so be it, but this is a very subjective experience and literally anyone here can has a different but equally valid experience. being a man who knows x number people and dated x number of women doesn't make you some dating expert.

[–]Ruffleafewfeathers 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

This is such a brilliant and eloquent reply. Well done.

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[–][deleted] 18 points19 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Good advice

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[–]amhran_oiche 13 points14 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

as a woman I definitely care about body count. idk where men get this idea that women can't possibly feel insecure by the number of partners a man has gone through. the more women you've slept with before me, the likelier you are to make comparisons or ask me to do something one of the past women did.

we do value men more when other women want them! (trusting other women's opinions) that doesn't directly correlate to sex though, because that's your decision to sleep with x number of women.

[–]mysterygurl_ 12 points13 points  (11 children) | Copy Link

I don’t speak for all women, this is just my personal preference but I do care about a mans body count. It would be very unattractive to learn that a man has slept with even 3, 4 + women honestly. I think both men and women need to be mindful of who they are sleeping with. 🤷🏼‍♀️

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[–]amhran_oiche 8 points9 points  (7 children) | Copy Link

there's no man out here emotionally healthy who has slept with 25 women lmao

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[–]amhran_oiche 3 points4 points  (5 children) | Copy Link

ah yes, by setting up a situation which has no possibility of existing, you're proving what?

what you're trying to set up is the idea that a woman with the perfect body, feminine appearance, submissive attitude, will give you a blowjob every day, wants to quit her job and raise your kids, comes from a great family, and never nags but has slept with 25 men is undesirable. by sleeping with multiple men she loses something. men would be wise to take on the same mindset. it's bizarre (but not really) that men so strongly perpetrate the idea that sleeping with more women makes them more desirable. it really doesn't.

I think as a christian I struggle with what you're presenting because although I see the truth in it (meaning, that other mostly non-christian men generally agree) it doesn't align with christian teaching, which is that we are all redeemable through Christ. there's a bunch of comments here asking "well what if I already slept with a lot of men but that life is behind me?" and it's bizarre to tell women that so much of their value lies in something they can't take back. we can all get richer, fitter, healthier, hell even better looking, but body counts are irreversible.

I'm not going to argue with you on why I think it's a poor value judgement, I know the arguments and doing so goes against the idea here that men and women view things differently. not to say that it is totally meaningless of course, but to each their own. may you find the expectationless virgin of your dreams I guess.

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[–]amhran_oiche 2 points3 points  (3 children) | Copy Link

no, I'm talking about men in general. just like in your example there's a lot of nuance, some women would take the guy in a heartbeat and some wouldn't. arguing about individual preferences is just chasing our tails.

It will sound pretentious but I had no hoe phase, no STIs, I stay fit, healthy, bring in 6 figures after tax, donate every month to charity, help my family, no baggage from previous relationships, I will take care of my wife and will never tell her what to wear or do.

not pretentious at all, this is all awesome. I'm in the same boat but make less money. what we know though is that personality and chemistry account for a huge portion of attraction.

I will take care of my wife and will never tell her what to wear or do

I generally think highly of men but this, [the controlling behavior] honestly goes hand in hand with "must have a low body count" imo. this is something a lot of men say until their partners do or wear something that crosses the line, and everyone has a line. just so I'm clear, you're going to work hard to find a woman with no hoe phase and suddenly be ok if she goes out on the weekends without you dressed like her closet had a hoe phase?

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[–]amhran_oiche 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

The women I like do not like going out partying. Yes, they exist. They dress classy. They exist. I have dated a few of them.

we know hon

But who argued preferences?

sorry, what I meant was when you put forth an example about the perfect man but with a high body count, you were implying that women would still go for him, and that therefore women do not care as much about high body count as men.

I put forth a similar example and you said "well I'd be happy with a 1/3 of these qualities." well yes but we're not talking about you, or me, we're talking about men and women in general, because you started by making generalized statements. no neither example holds up if we start interviewing people and seeing what they would do. the answers would be across the board!

My girl doesn't even like revealing clothes. Never told her what to wear. Not una vez. What attracts me to her among many other things is how private she is about everything including her body.Women like that exist.

there it is! "I wouldn't tell her what to do or how to dress as long as she is doing what I want anyway!" you, like a billion other people, really like your partner who does all the things you like without having to be told, therefore "I would never tell her what to do or how to dress" is technically true! sneaky sneaky. you didn't answer my question though. You clearly said, "I will take care of my wife and will never tell her what to wear or do" so I ask you again, you're going to work hard to find a woman with no hoe phase and suddenly be ok if she goes out on the weekends without you dressed like her closet had a hoe phase?

because if not then your statement has a big qualifier on it and isn't actually truthful.


women like that exist

again babe, we know. we're here. you have such a weird incel mentality. we can chalk this up, however, to your limited experience.

[–]huckleberryhomemaker 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

It depends entirely on where he is now. Is he a Christian now? Does he feel guilty and regretful for the way he lived his life? If no then I would leave him.

But honestly, my husband and I never talk about past relationships. He's the first man I've ever been super jealous with, hearing about any ex (not even in a sexual context) makes my stomach turn and the same with him. I don't ask questions I don't want the answer to and neither does he. But he is saved now, as am I so we are new creations.

We stopped having sex 6 months into dating and got married a year later. That, plus repenting of our sins, we consider our wedding night our first time ever.

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[–]PonderonDonuts 6 points7 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Rt. Good post.

[–]heythereitsemily 10 points11 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

There’s a lot of good advice here but what I don’t agree at all with is the notion that a HVM is just a guy that makes money. There’s wayyy more to it than that. Just like how there’s more to a HVW than just appearances.

[–]babybyeonz 5 points6 points  (29 children) | Copy Link

Good point. Important to realize that Op is Muslim and the rules do not apply at all to western dating world. Most high value men in America I find are quite liberal, the majority of those with stable white collar jobs requiring college or higher were more politically liberal. These men do not care about body count, they don’t care if you make more or less. Many of them just want a respectful partner who is patient, feminine and supportive. Context is everything. Cultures are different, In my experience Muslim cultures do really care about body count. I have met many Muslim men and they all think just like OP. They have many different cultural views and it’s why I choose not to date any Muslims. American cultures not so much. I am a doctor, every one of my young men coworkers are making 400k plus here, most are easily 6 foot tall and American cultured. They do not care at all about your body count. They want someone intellectually stimulating and a partner to move through life. Lesson here is culture is context, and context is everything. Nothing wrong with Muslims way of looking at body count, just not one I have seen western men to care about.

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[–]OmarNBradley 3 points4 points  (27 children) | Copy Link

In the United States, fraternity Chads with high body counts marry hot sorority Staceys with high body counts every damned weekend and they don't care one bit. High sociosexuality American men don't want shy virgins, they want high sociosexuality American women.

[–]eventually_throwing 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

That's not the problem that most men speak of.. fuckboy and hoe together = fine, thats their circle. they usaully, like most promiscuous people, they get bored of each other after a decade..if that, an start to see other people... but for someone whos trying to build long term it makes no sense at all trying to settle down with someone who's spent their earlier years being a mattress.

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[–]OmarNBradley 3 points4 points  (24 children) | Copy Link

My husband of 21 years is not a fraternity Chad; he is from the US upper class - his great grandparents were invited to and attended the Coronation - and trust me, his boarding school classmates are also married to high sociosexuality women. He married me thinking that my N was a LOT higher than it actually is, simply because he saw no reason why a young pretty woman on her own for the first time in THE BIG CITY would not take advantage of it. This bothered him not at all.

You appear to be very unfamiliar with US cultural mores on this topic and the women here by and large are not seeking to date in your social circles.

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[–]OmarNBradley 4 points5 points  (5 children) | Copy Link

It might be the case in certain circles

Yes, the exact same circles that you claim you are trying to advise women about.

This is not something that men have any degree of visibility into, any more than women have any degree of visibility into what other women value and prioritize when dating, which is exactly why TRP doesn't allow women to post OPs about what men should do to attract women. Men love to tell women that they should be shy chaste virgins and then they go and fall in love with and marry hot high N women.

You are a fish, and you are trying to advise the fishermen.

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[–]OmarNBradley 1 point2 points  (3 children) | Copy Link

I am telling you the things top tier fishermen said they want from fish.

Yes. The things they say they want. Just like women say they want nice sweet men who are willing to hold their bags while they try on infinity dresses.

Women should not listen to what men say (except, maybe, their fathers). Women should watch what men do.

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[–]babybyeonz 0 points1 point  (14 children) | Copy Link

Once again in my experience majority of US men don’t care. Could you provide a peer reviewed source for your claim? Your whole argument hinges on this “majority of men” believe x,y,z. Without a proven source your anecdotal evidence is worth as much as a pile of shit.

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[–]babybyeonz 1 point2 points  (3 children) | Copy Link

I asked for peer review… you link Reddit. You claim men argue with logic and you link a Reddit link……… that’s your evidence? Could you provide actual evidence? Could you provide a real source? Published in a journal by researchers please.

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[–]babybyeonz 0 points1 point  (7 children) | Copy Link

I spoke with thousands of men. My anecdotal evidence outweighs yours. Also I don’t have evidence because I’m claiming it’s bullshit. The fact no evidence exists proves my point. Too much logic for you there?

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[–]babybyeonz 1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Thank you! I thought I was going crazy. Most guys I know in the West have no interest in girls with no dating history. Experience usually equates to comfort and confidence which leads to a better time. I find Muslim culture have this concept of owning a woman’s sexuality, example would be the hoods their woman have to wear to “protect their beauty from others”. This man needs to understand the west is not like Muslim culture at all. It’s very very different. They are having a enormously difficult time in Sweden with the cultural clashes.

[–]OmarNBradley 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

He comes from a socioeconomic niche that has absolutely nothing to do with just about any woman here. If he really honestly truly knows women who are flown to Dubai in order to be paid for hideous degenerate acts, then his world is so far removed from anybody here that he might as well be on Mars, and no advice that he gives will be remotely useful to a girl going to college in the Midwest.

[–]Puzzleheaded_Back255 4 points5 points  (15 children) | Copy Link

What do you suggest for women who gave into that peer pressure in their youth and have promiscuous pasts? Should they lower their expectations as to earning potential, looks, sexual prowess, perhaps accept a religious but non-legal marriage? Some combination of all of the above? I know it's important for a man to feel that he is prized above all other men that a woman has known if they are to become life partners, so I think that settling or lowering expectations too much can do damage to both parties. Should she accept that no good man will want her? I can't help feeling that they should still try, work on themselves, and give it all they have despite the odds, but I'm curious what the male perspective is.

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[–]rosesonthefloor4 Stars 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

That’s a very extreme example. How many women have the opportunity to yacht in Dubai though lol? On here, I’d guess not many.

There’s a huge difference between sugaring/sex work and having a handful of boyfriends or hookups. They’re not even close to being in the same league.

[–]Mirchii2 points [recovered] (2 children) | Copy Link

How old are you? Are you married / in a long-term committed relationship now?

Those other guys you spoke to, are they married / in a long-term committed relationship?

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[–]IndependentAd7065 1 point2 points  (18 children) | Copy Link

The problem with this is a lot if not most women fabricate their body count and there’s never really any way you can verify if it’s true. For example I have a friend whose body count is 30+ she’s been with her boyfriend for 4 years now & they’re planning on getting married. To this day he believes her body count is 4 & it’s never been brought up or negatively impacted the relationship. & trust me there’s many more women like this. So my question is how can you truly know? Let’s say you’ve married and now have children with your partner and you someway somehow find out that she was lying about her body count, is that an instant dealbreaker to you despite everything else that’s been built? Genuine question.

[–]beseechpeach 4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Untill the day he finds out the count is higher... 50 years of marriage is a long time. It's a really bad thing to kie about. It's a big risk to take. Your whole life might come crashing down after 30 years if you lie about something like this. Especially if the count goes from 4 to 30...

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[–]IndependentAd7065 2 points3 points  (15 children) | Copy Link

Fair enough. Hope your lie detector radar is stronger than the gods my friend.

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[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (8 children) | Copy Link

First we talked about alpha and beta traits and every man who came through was the alpha-y-ist of all and no man in the whole world wanted to get married, he knew, trust him.

So it changed to HVM. Now all men are making 6+ figures because that is what they assume that is what qualifies as high vlaue (they are also all 6 ft tall).

My baseline qualifications were: a white collar job, an ability to fix stuff and diy, white, a non-practicing Christian, in shape and good looking.

My 6ft tall ex, the lawyer didn't work out because he couldn't find the right end of a screwdriver. A man outside of my own race or "faith" would have been a non starter no matter how much he made. Sure this works for some but value is so very subjective.

Most women here are average westerners and will look to date the best man they can find in their average western circle as they should. I wish we could get away from all these terms that ultimately mean "the best guy I have access to and can pull". All it does is allow men to do a bunch of mental gymnastics to tell us why they represent all the good men that we all obviously want.

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[–]Sxwrd 0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy Link

I think the body count thing is desperate bs by guys who want to be sold a dream in reality of it all (but nobody will argue women have more value with having “no past”). If a woman/man wants to sell themselves, they’ll just learn to lie. I will guarantee the women you think are “safe” did some wild stuff and just don’t talk about it.

When a car salesman is trying to sell a car, he won’t tell you about the broken AC and it leaking oil because he knows you won’t want to buy it…. It’s no different in this context of “body count”. The only man to truly falls for this is a naive child running to a dream. Again, it’s a good dream, but you have no way of proving she is as “pure” as the dream she now knows to sell you.

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[–]Sxwrd 4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I’m glad you have your own philosophy. I just think if men are openly setting standards which can be as easily manipulated as “how many sex partners a woman had” don’t be surprised when women will simply learn to lie about the numbers. Especially if you’re a catch for her…..

For example, if banks just gave out loans to people who said they paid people back, EVERYONE would just say “I pay people back” and take out billions. So what do banks do? Ask for PROOF. When it comes to “body count”, please tell me- how can you ever prove this? Because you had a hunch? Dude, they’re just going to learn to lie. I’m begging you and any other man who’s living dating life based on this, as a man, don’t be so naive. Now, on the other end, don’t just go and date anyone and throw the whole logic out the window. Learn balance in it.

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[–]Ok-Supermarket-6747 0 points1 point  (4 children) | Copy Link

This last part sounds like dating based on potential if you meet him at his low

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[–]Ok-Supermarket-6747 0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy Link

I have dated for potential up to this point, always. However I realize I just got done basically raising a manchild for 3 years and he seems to have turned out to be a cheater. I saw his potential and was willing to give up that time if I also grew. I grew a bit because I learned my own boundaries but it wasn’t enough to forgive cheating and ignoring texts. I tried my best so pardon if I no longer have interest in dating based on potential and wasting my time playing games. This post actually helps me a lot to save time and better vet candidates which are already mature

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[–]Ok-Supermarket-6747 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

that’s the idea. both partners should be their best match. Sorry if you assumed I would have a problem with that but nope, I’m a hard worker. And there will always be quirks and flaws in both people so the goal is to find the best match, commit to because you are ready, and work hard together to fix any future problems because you believe in your commitment

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[–]warm20 -1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

this is true while life is unfair it's hard to know what really will workout for you in the end with your choices

feels like even saving virginity may have its pros and cons with progressing relationships, but in my opinion just as a man or women they would love to have it all, but they can't really have it all, very few people have it all or none do you could say

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[–]FlounderFriendly6582-1 points [recovered] (6 children) | Copy Link

Lol. Why would you care if you’re confident you’re the best she’s ever had?

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[–]grahamcookiefart 2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

OP your comments are spot on, thank you for all the insight and putting up with the trolls!

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[–]We_Are_All_One 1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

A woman's ability to pair-bond and be faithful decreases with each added body count.

[–]pearlsandstilettosModerator | Pearl[M] 6 points7 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

You seem to have stumbled into the wrong sub. Removed.

[–]CrazyHorseInvincibleModerator[M] 8 points9 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I'm going to step in and put a stop to your participation here for a while, so you can better absorb the culture.

What you are dispensing here as advice is the equivalent of sugar candy... it tastes sweet in the mouth, but it makes women fat and sick and unattractive and unhappy about their lives.

It does not matter whether or not men who don't like to marry the town bicycle have standards, or whether they are simply "insecure". The fact is, they want what they want, and a scolding lecture about "insecurity" isn't going to change their minds.

You have no power over them.

You are giving women advice that will cut them off from a whole host of options, and if they suffer from that, you will not be there to pick up the pieces for them.

So I'm going to shut you up now before you give any more stupid advice whose only apparent purpose is to soothe or polish your own ego.

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[–]LuckyLittleStarModerator | Lil'Star[M] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

The post was removed.

[–]saddensgirl1 Star 0 points1 point  (6 children) | Copy Link

Are you married or in a long term relationship? If the answer is no, why are you posting here?

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[–]saddensgirl1 Star 0 points1 point  (4 children) | Copy Link

I'm pointing out rule 9 for your unwarranted advice:

"The men who can provide the most valuable advice are: older, married and long time participants in the RP community. Everyone else should focus his time on TRP.

Familiarize yourself with these guidelines and realize that personal preference is not advice."

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[–]saddensgirl1 Star 0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy Link

You should've posted that in your initial message since it was extremely unclear.

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[–]saddensgirl1 Star 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

I never said anything about how you replied to me. You're making a lot of assumptions based on some simple questions. And so what if I pointed out the rules? They are there for a reason.

You can kill a man, but you can't kill an idea.

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