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“Don’t build with a man”

August 12, 2020
17 upvotes

Hi ladies,

I saw “don’t build with a man” on another subreddit and would love to get your thoughts. Basically, it was saying that if you commit to a man while he’s poor, he’ll associate you with what he can get when he’s poor. If he becomes rich, he’ll dump you. Whereas if you commit to a man while he’s already rich, he’ll associate you with what he can get at the height of success.

Obviously some subs like this and I think TRP considers building with a man to be A+ behavior, which is why I thought this would be an interesting discussion.

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Post Information
Title “Don’t build with a man”
Author LeilaintheDark
Upvotes 17
Comments 32
Date August 12, 2020 6:46 PM UTC (2 years ago)
Subreddit /r/RedPillWomen
Archive Link https://theredarchive.com/r/RedPillWomen/dont-build-with-a-man.54785
https://theredarchive.com/post/54785
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/RedPillWomen/comments/i8jj2e/dont_build_with_a_man/
Red Pill terms in post
Comments

[–]katsnackshackysacks64 points65 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Some men are ambitious with humble beginnings. I’d build with that man. Any man, whether rich or poor in the beginning, can take you for granted one way or another. Character is what matters.

[–]LeilaintheDark2 Stars[S] 12 points13 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Yes, I agree that character matters a lot here. Actually I feel like the self-esteem of the man is of primary importance. If he’s unsuccessful and has low self-esteem, he might indeed place lower value on his partner, since he might subconsciously think that she couldn’t get anyone better than him.

[–]daffodil-13-25 points26 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

I think this is half true? It’s absolutely true for some men. My bff’s parents were like this: her mom worked her butt off to keep a roof over their heads while her dad finished med school and he did leave her for a younger, fitter woman once his career took off. But she also married him because he was going to be a doctor, and he’s a sort of narcissistic man who cares way more about status than about anything else. What I took away from that is to avoid men who are status focused, not to avoid putting effort in building with a man.

The other thing is-is what you and your man are building towards good for both of you? It makes sense to put effort into building something that will still be there even if the marriage falls apart.

[–]aussiedollface23 points4 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

I agree with this. I’m sorry this happened to your mum. I’m a physician and I saw this A LOT with my male students/colleagues. xo

[–]CuppyBees19 points20 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I have first hand experience that this is not true lol. Nothing is absolute, it's not about where he is in life it's about who he is as a person.

[–]LocalReligionMajor12 points13 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I feel like this very much depends on your age. I'm 21, so there are very few men my age who are independently wealthy. To implement this strategy, I would have to date men who are much older than myself or rich kids.

I would hope that after I marry a man, he wouldn't be constantly evaluating whether or not I was "what he can get." That's what commitment means. Also, I think you keep a man happy by being pleasant, feminine, and maintaining your appearance. I don't think it depends on some subconscious association with his economic status at the beginning of the relationship.

[–]-SouthwesT-8 points9 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I'd say that it depends on his character. But, at the same time, what does committing to each type of man tells about you? Would you rather "build" your SO into a successful man (according to your or society's standards) or get to know and get married to an already successful man (by which standards?). What would make you feel more valuable to yourself?

You see, you can find a financially stable man or even a rich guy. But what if he loses everything (difficult to happen, but it does), what will he mean to you without money?

My father married twice. My mom and his previous wife married him because he was well established in his career - he had more money than any woman he met/had relationships with. His first wife divorced him and took half his assets plus child support for some 18 years. My father lost his job in 2010 and never found another, only sporadic works here and there. My mother is a housewife and relied on him, not because he asked or wanted but because she could, after all he had a good job right?

The thing is that there is no love between the two, what kept their marriage healthy, so to say, was a high and steady inflow of money on his account. As soon as he lost that job by unfortunate events my mother started treating him like he was some loser, she despised him for being unemployed instead of helping him. He started to drink a lot and bevause of that he had a stroke that left him paralyzed in 2014, while I had to grow up to see how damaging a relationship based on financial reasons can be to the spouses and the kids. If my mother truly loved him for who he was I believe things could have been better for everyone. He would not have started drinking if he had her emotional support, I believe. Why would she marry him for money? As soon as he lost it she began to resent him, overnight. Why couldn't she help him after 20 years of marriage?

I'm so sorry, I had to take this out of my chest. Not sure you can understand, but my point is: don't marry for money or because a man is "stable". Don't rely only on his job or money, do something for yourself and future kids and build and take care of each other, together. Dear, I hope you find happiness and self-reliance before entering relationships and don't make the same mistake of my mother.

[–]JoyfullMommy0069 points10 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I'm mixed in my opinion on this but of course there aren't any absolutes when talking about trying to predict how a man is going to turn out.

On one hand, I've heard (maybe in this sub?) that if you find a determined, motivated man when he's still young and ambitious and helping that man, as his wife, rise to the top, he will cherish you as his most valued help in getting to where he ended up.

Whereas, if you find the man once he's already rich, won't he just look at women as somewhat easy to gain because of his money?

But we've certainly heard plenty of stories of men marrying the woman, making it rich and then dumping the wife. It probably boils down to the kind of man he always was and how the wife treated him during the years he was working on his success.

[–]cast-away-ramadi066 points7 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Low morality men will act as you describe. High mortality men will be the opposite. Don't let yourself get roped in by men of low morals.

[–]LouiseConnor8 points9 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I’ve built with my husband. We met at 16, married at 18 and he did his higher education for over a decade for a good paying job.

The humble beginnings test the woman’s loyalty and commitment, the better ending tests the man’s. Women need and seek the security so it’s harder for them at the beginning like that. And men, once they’re more successful, feel like they can get anything/anyone they want and get approached by more women.

In my experience, it was fun and carefree to be broke kids together just getting married. We struggled through a lot of school years when we had our first few kids.

Now, he seems on another level. He has friends now that are at a similar place but they skipped the humble beginning part. I notice I feel really inferior when I’m around them sometimes, although they never make it so, it’s just my own issues inside myself.

I also notice people respecting and going to or looking up to my husband more whereas before people kind of treated him as the young kid just getting life started that he was.

I’ve had to find ways to continue to upgrade myself during this whole process because I’ve stayed home with my kids the whole time. I did not finish college, which is sometimes unspokenly looked down upon. I’ve focused on learning new things, becoming an expert at our style of homeschooling, and continuing to take care of my appearance so I don’t look as homely as people think I sound before they meet me.

I have to work to not feel left back in the dust (within myself, my husband never acts like that). And I’m confident that I’m keeping up in my own ways.

[–]TheBunk_TB6 points7 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Men appreciate a "Ride or Die b*tch". This isn't my term.

That other subreddit idea is looking like "fair weather" attitudes. Encouraging stereotypes like monkey branching, etc.

[–]blueeyedbeauty1234 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

This is a tricky one is really depends on the individual man and the relationship you have. Some men will want the women who stood by them since the beginning. Who he built a life with. People really seem to have a special attachment to anyone they date during the high school or college years. But on the other hand your spending your youth with someone who could still be a failure. Most men want to build but not all actually will. And high quality women don’t associate with losers. Where some men will see you as the prize they won for their success. They look at you and say wow I really made it. This is so situational

[–]chrissy6767 points8 points  (3 children) | Copy Link

Yes, this is solid advice. Another aspect is that men date who they can afford. It's not so much as just an association of what he can get while poor, she is what he can get while poor. When he becomes wealthy, another group of "higher quality" women become a dating option for him. In addition, he will like a woman who will look at him as the success he is and doesn't know he had to rely on a woman to get where he's at. Men respect what they pay for and invest in.

[–]LeilaintheDark2 Stars[S] 0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy Link

Thanks for your input! That’s interesting and makes sense, though I wonder, what if the man, while poor, got a quite high quality woman that he normally wouldn’t be able to get because she happened to have fallen in love with his other qualities?

Also, I guess I didn’t mean “build” as anything beyond just staying by his side while poor. He would still have to reach success through only his own efforts, but with the company of a gf/wife. Would that feeling of relying on a woman still hold?

[–]chrissy6760 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

Yes, it would and in that case, in the long run it wouldn't work out. Either she resents him for not being the breadwinner or some other financial problem as its the number one reason for divorce or he will still cheat because he feels inadequate and wants a woman to look at him like he's God.

[–]LeilaintheDark2 Stars[S] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Yikes that’s a bleak outlook. It’s my current situation haha but I don’t resent him and I’m holding out hope that our relationship will work out.

Also, stats might say one is more likely to do such and such because of x, but it doesn’t mean one is doomed to do it, just maybe a bit more likely. Anyway, that’s what I currently think about it but I appreciate your perspective!

[–]DunboyCastleInTheSky2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I think if he’s a good man and you stick with him, you’ll have nothing to worry about.

[–]fosho_away2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Well if he only appreciates you as some rich guy checklist trophy, you don’t want him as a husband anyway tbh

[–]Lagstravaganza2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

For any premise built on "men are...*", expect it to be wrong on as often as it is right when analyzing an individual as opposed to a large population. The advice is as reliable as flipping a coin.

*or "women are..."

[–]Noodlesoupe27 points8 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I don’t listen to TRP since what men say and what they actually do are two different things (like women). Many women have helped build a man up just to get dumped for a trophy wife. Lesson is: don’t do wife things until you’re a wife and always have a plan b.

[–]fairydust911 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I do think it depends on the character of a person like the others are saying. I met my fiance while he was unemployed (but far from broke) and I was studying for the bar exam. He made it clear he was serious about me, so I gave him 6 months to get a job. He got one and has stuck with it for over 4 years. He's an extremely hard worker, and I would do it all over again.

Last year he bought me a car that I could have never paid for by myself. He is also meant to inherit some money & land in the next year - altogether it's quite a bit of money. He spent all this week designing our house that he plans to build for us to settle down and start our family. You should see his face when he talks about it. 😍

Do I think he'll leave me when he does come into his inheritance? No, I don't. He works his ass off for our future and I take care of him (in many ways). The thing is - even if he does, I know that I treated him very well and took care of him like a King. If he decides to throw it all away for someone younger & fitter that's on him, I did nothing wrong. My conscience will be clean and sadly I can only control myself.

[–]bchsweetheart1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

This absolutely depends on the character of the man. I built a life together with my now husband. We've been together 6 years and met while we were both poor students and he lived with his parents. Now we have careers and own a home. No regrets

[–]Lagstravaganza1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

Are you talking about r/Diabla? That advice is so dumb. If one's premise is that men are the enemy, it will be a guaranteed self-fulfilling prophecy. It's also the opposite of progressive: regressive (the only way for a woman to make money is to take it from a man.)

[–]LeilaintheDark2 Stars[S] 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

Yup that’s the one! I’m not familiar with the “ideology” of that sub if you will, this bit just caught my eye bc I think some RPW do subscribe to that thought while some do not (I’m talking about individuals here, not the general spirit of this subreddit)

[–]RhettButler73 points4 points  (4 children) | Copy Link

If you are with someone from high school or college, the problem is that you don't know whether or not they will succeed. You could devote the prime years of your life to someone who ends up in a dead end job out of college. Or worse, has a struggling business that hemorrhages money. Then your choice is to either raise a family in poverty or try your hand at the marriage/dating market where your value is 10x lower than it used to be.

Might sound mercenary of me, but I would always suggest going for men who have already built a solid foundation in their careers, say in the 30-35 yo range.

This is especially true if you are TradCon and want to be a SAHM.

[–]slappysq5 points6 points  (3 children) | Copy Link

Dude here. 100% this. You have to maximize your potential in the moment, not make bets on people's potential.

Just like women shouldn't choose to commit based on a man's potential options and instead should go for men that have built a solid career foundation, men shouldn't commit to fat girls that could be fit.

[–]LeilaintheDark2 Stars[S] 1 point2 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

Oh man, that kind of scares me. I have pretty high smv and rmv and I committed to someone poor (not as in lots of debt but as in makes very little money) but not because of his “potential.” I just fell in love with his personality, character and how he treats me. I guess if he becomes rich one day, I’ll be older so way less smv so he could probably get someone with higher smv but I guess I’ll just have to hope that I was accurate in judging his character.

[–][deleted]  (1 child) | Copy Link

[removed]

[–]pearlsandstilettosModerator | Pearl[M] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Argue with ideas not insults

[–]aussiedollface21 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Hmm interesting concept. I’ve heard this too. But I’ve also heard that men always love and respect the loyalty of a woman who helped them “build”. I think there’s probably an element of truth in both xo

[–]kclanton80-2 points-1 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

And some point someone who is polite and pleasing to be around. They want someone who's feminine and allows themselves to be lead.

a man doesn't need your help in building anything nor does he need you after he has built something.

At any stage of a man's life you should make yourself indispensable to him. If you do so he will not leave you.

Women are always so concerned about what a man can do for them. They never think about what they bring to the table for a man.

Men don't walk away from women just because they got more money.... They walk away from women because their relationship turns bad. once a woman lands in man she stops doing all the thing she did to get him in the first place. If they have kids then their lives become completely about the kids that SHE wanted to have.

These are the reasons why men get tired of marriage and look to recapture the feeling they had when first dating someone new. if you work to be the best possible partner for that man he is not going to look to replace you because he knows that very few women will try to do that.

This is a woman issue....not a man issue. Your question should be "how can I be the type of woman that a man would not want to leave.."

[–]shopdropnroll-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I rather be with a poor man who works hard, has potential and has a kind heart over a rich, self entitled asshole any day. At the end of the day, I just need enough money to be comfortable but being stuck with someone who doesn’t check all the boxes in terms of character and values is terrible. No amount of money can buy mental sanity and a good partner.

You can kill a man, but you can't kill an idea.

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