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How to avoid turning bitter when in the presence of women more attractive than you?

March 29, 2020

I'm a rather plain girl (22, slim, but trust me when I say I have a very below average face) and when I meet very attractive women, especially in social situations where many men are present like work dinners, I immediately turn bitter inside me and I become closed off, which ruins the feminine energy I'm trying to cultivate and sours my mood for the whole evening. I'm sure my negtaive energy in these cases does come across unfortunately. I guess it's because our value as women is 80% our looks, so I feel immediately threatened. Also the 80/20 is male projection on women and most men want the most attractive woman out of a group of women (look up "Nash equilibrium scene" from the movie "A beautiful mind"). So how can I stop the sight of an attractive woman from souring my feminine energy?

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Post Information
Title How to avoid turning bitter when in the presence of women more attractive than you?
Author applepies4kittens
Upvotes 96
Comments 60
Date March 29, 2020 2:36 PM UTC (3 years ago)
Subreddit /r/RedPillWomen
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Original Link

[–]MajIssuesCaptObvious32 points33 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

The bitterness isn't the real emotion you have to confront, it's the underlying emotion that's causing it. Most often anger is how we express something else like insecurity, feeling rejected, sadness, fear, etc . If you treat one of your underlying emotions, say your insecurity and rejection which your ego assumes will happen, then you will be one step closer to avoiding feeling bitter/angry and more importantly, one step closer to feeling confident.

I have a couple of books that have been recommended to me regarding the subject, although I've not read them yet so don't take my word for it: The Power of Now, and He's Scared, She's Scared.

[–]metajenn91 points92 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

How you carry yourself influences how others perceive your attractiveness, don't discount this.

This is why I don't online date. I would've never ever swiped yes on my ex, he wasn't a conventionally attractive guy but his energy, his humor, his confidence when he spoke, he caught me. And I was googoo gaga over him. After falling for him, I thought he was totally hot!

Energy matters. You have to get your focus off what you can't control, like your bone structure, and double down on your strengths. You can more than make up for what you think you lack aesthetically (which is totally subjective anyhow).

Letting yourself feel threatened is going to ooze out insecurity and won't help your cause. You gotta replace that thinking and that trigger with confidence in displaying what you DO have. Grace, wit, depth, what have you.

[–]sabsz1664 points65 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Honestly, I struggle with this as well and the best advice that has worked for me is to pay them compliments and become friends with them or make an effort to get to know them. They may seem intimidating at first, but we all have insecurities and that includes them. It’s such a beautiful thing to uplift other women and have them uplift you, too :)

[–]mydogwillbeinmyheart-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

This a lot. Just because you think a woman is more attractive, or even if she is objectively more attracttive, there's no justification to be mean and unkind to her.

Not saying you have done that OP, but I've seen (and received) my fair share of woman on woman hurtfullness and this post just brought back some sad memories.

Try to work on your self esteem. I've seen plenty of women who are not top model tier (who is anyway) with amazing partners. Take care of your physical appearance, sure, but work also on things that will last, such as kindness, sense of humor, intellect, honesty, useful hobbies, etc.

[–][deleted] 12 points13 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

I totally feel you. I hate the whole rating scale all together. I think it's a bunch of BS. I feel like I'm easily an 8 to my husband because he hates conventional beauty and in a sea of Stacy's he'd pick me anyday becuase he genuinely thinks I'm very cute, although conventionally men wouldn't choose me first in the looks department. It's so much BS because you would never tell your daughter she's ugly or a 4 or 5, you would see her as the best and I feel like you should not do that do yourself either. I generally avoid situations with girls who 'know' they're pretty. Like there's a difference between a humble girl and someone who flaunts this stuff. Most of the world flaunts their beauty because that's all they have.

Also, get off the social!! Starting a new Instagram was a good thing I did. I only follow a handful of people who I really want to be influenced by. After years of being on insta, it's easy to accumulate people who are probably doing you more harm than good. When I worked at Wholefoods , I always thought I would see 10/10 girls. Well, the 10's on insta looked like walking ducks with acne, etc. It goes to show that looks can be altered and the women who are "10's" are really the 1% of society, but they're 90% of what makes up social media. That's created a new found insecurity in women.

It sounds like your coworkers may be really shallow. There are attractive women at my job, but I don't feel threatened by them because they don't act like their looks are eveyrthing. Instead it's easy to have happy hour with them and talk about thought provoking topics instead of who they last hooked up with, dated, got drunk with, etc. What industry do you work in, if you don't mind me asking?

Hone in on your skills, things that interest you, find confidence in social situations, read books like, "Not Nice." And cling to genuinely kind people that fill you up, including family if they are that for you!!! Those are the things that really matter.

[–]pennynotrcutt3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I agree with this about the social media so much. I would scroll through Instagram and think, when did everyone become so gorgeous? They’re not-the effort, poses, filters etc that are put into some stuff is INSANE. Don’t compare yourself to what is, in essence, a complete fabrication.

[–]oliviaj2011 points12 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

When i was in my early 20s I had a big problem with jealousy of "pretty girls", even though I am considered an attractive woman.

I say this for 2 reasons. 1. Once i addressed the root of my problems (went all the way back to childhood, dad issues/mom issues, rejection, abandonment) I was able to learn how to treat myself, and others, (with grace) and build my confidence and self esteem. 2. looks do not dictate mental capacity---everyone has their own struggle. As I mentioned, I am an attractive woman, but I have dealt with depression, anxiety, jealousy, too-much-partying, job struggles, etc. You can't read a book by its cover, and it may help you to remember that someone you consider to be "prettier than you" might actually feel "ugly" on the inside sometimes.

Also, something that really helped me was yoga, but you could fill in the blank with any type of exercise routine. Yoga allowed me to build a lot of strength, mentally and physically!

[–]FleetingWishEndorsed Contributor9 points10 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

When I see a woman that I view as "better than me", the first question I ask myself is "how can I be more like her?" This allows me to keep in perspective a couple things:

  • That being better often requires hard work.

Even people who have been blessed with great genes have to worry about diet, hair care, skin care, exercise, clothing choices, etc. Otherwise their genes will be hidden under bad self-care.

When I view what they have as an accomplishment, it makes me view them as admirable. This is a feeling that comes in direct conflict with feelings of bitterness. Think about it, do you feel bitter when someone lands a triple backhand spring, or creates a beautiful piece of art?

  • That if I want to be better, all I have to do is put in the effort.

Thinking you are doomed to be exactly how you were yesterday is self defeating, and wrong. There are always ways to improve yourself. It's just a matter of picking in what ways you want to be better and working towards those things. After years of this philosophy I have become the person other people envy. And because of that, there are very few people I encounter anymore that make me wish I could be more like them. But even still, I work on improving myself in some capacity every single day.


Because I know I'm imperfect, and I will always the parts of me that could be better.

[–]Timely-Sun23 points24 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Do you think it stems from insecurity? Because to you, those women look beautiful; but in their minds you may look just as beautiful and they're trying to fight off the same feelings. If you are trying to cultivate feminine energy, let it be because you support and cherish every woman in the room. Give them compliments and watch their faces light up. Looks are unfortunately pretty valuable in a woman, but people are definitely more likely to remember the one who was kind, smart, etc. And their attractiveness does not equate to the absence of your own, remember. Especially if it's at a work dinner you really shouldn't be focused on it so much that the negative energy coming from you overwhelms all else. Fuck what the males project onto women, that doesn't sound like your problem to me.

[–]Own_Outsideasd-3 points-2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Fuck what the males project onto women, that doesn't sound like your problem to me.

Don't turn this into an incel forum... and, it is her problem, if it's true and she wants to attract men. But it seems unlikely to be true; see: simps. What I suspect is more likely is the men she's attracted to are picky. I thought that way too. But that suspicion doesn't contribute to this discussion or support OP, so let's forget about that.

[–]tofurainbowgarden20 points21 points  (8 children) | Copy Link

I'm black. I am overlooked by men of every race. When a man is looking at my group of friends, they are never looking at me. I would feel bad about it except black men worship the ground I walk upon. To black men, I am a mystical goddess. To everyone else, I'm completely undesirable. I say all of this to say, there are people who consider you to be a mystical goddess. It may not be as many people as some women have, but they exist. In that situation you may not be the prettiest woman in the room but there will be situations in which you shine. It was just someone else's turn then 😊

[–]pgokok9 points10 points  (5 children) | Copy Link

Are you sure? Im black and I don’t encounter this. Usually I get the most attention in a group. At least since 2016 when the culture started changing. Just asking because i think maybe some black women discredit themselves based on assumptions.

[–][deleted] 7 points8 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

this. i’ve noticed that a lot of women of color assume that other races will automatically find them unattractive because they’re not white. if you’re pretty, men will approach you no matter what race you are

[–]Lukkazx1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link


[–]mxmoon2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Yeah. I’m Puerto Rican. In real life I noticed a lot of attention from other Puerto Ricans or white men. I’m trying online dating and the diversity in the response I’m getting has been pretty cool!

[–]tofurainbowgarden2 points3 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

You may just be more attractive than me, or I may not notice or it's not as obvious with other types of men. I'm not sure. I hope it's changing because it really hurt me when I was younger.

[–]pgokok3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Oh yea, i find that other races aren’t as overt for sure. Me too dude! I used to feel so bad about my skin/hair but I’m glad times are changing.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Black women are pretty too

[–]mxmoon5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

For what it’s worth I think most black women are stunning.

[–]CochinoChingon10 points11 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Not all guys look at just physical beauty in a mate, some take the time to get a read on their personality before deciding on whether or not to date.

[–]RedPillMissionary4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Just know that the good men will be far more interested in what you have.

[–]Jasmineof-Agrabah3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I’ve had the same issue due to low self estime. Many people have told me I am good looking but I just don’t believe it deep inside, even now. So when I was around attractive or popular women I would shut down. What has helped me greatly is to keep a kind of internal smile- it’s very hard to describe it. But it’s kind of always keeping a smile inside of your head, which in turns makes me look more approachable and joyful. I’ve had women I was threatened by compliment ME after doing this, and that made me also feel more relaxed around everyone. It’s really a great tip that has helped me even in my saddest days! I just can’t keep sad for long when I do this, recommend you try it, even if it’s sounds a little strange :)

[–]taroenthusiast3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Such a needed thread

[–]BonnieBelle2553 points4 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

I struggled with jealousy of my best friend in college. All the guys wanted her, and I was never once asked out. I believed it was because we were always together, thus, always compared. But when I realized my jealousy was hurting our friendship, I had to really work on defeating the jealousy monster. I prayed a lot, and made a conscious effort to not take it personally. I wanted to save our friendship. Somehow I no longer became jealous even though her suitors piled up. Our friendship was more important to me and I loved her like a sister.

Perhaps praying and focusing on loving the other women like a friend will help you as well! They will feel your loving energy, which is a beautiful thing.

[–][deleted]  (1 child) | Copy Link


[–]BonnieBelle2551 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Thanks for sharing your experience, since it does at first sound similar. However my case was definitely different than yours, as my friend was not sexually actively. She was objectively more physically attractive and outgoing than I was. I’m sorry your friend was doing that behind your back though, that’s really not cool and I’m glad you realized it later and have moved on

[–]mxmoon4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Honest response: it’s subjective. All of my 4 best friends were strangers once. And I considered ALL OF THEM to be ridiculously pretty and more beautiful than me. After becoming friends it became clear that at first they also thought I was really pretty.

So I learned not to be so hard on myself and to see the beauty in myself that others were noticing but I was too insecure to notice.

In addition to this. Looks are not everything. They make a first impression but personality, values, sense of humor, goals, etc make a lasting impression. Focus on not letting other people’s beauty make you forget your own.

[–]young_x3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I guess it's because our value as women is 80% our looks, so I feel immediately threatened. Also the 80/20 is male projection on women

This is your projection on men. Your assumptions are putting blinkers on you and shaping your attitudes. Keep reading the wiki resources and keep growing.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I have struggled with this for a long time!! I'm also 22, average looks, and when a beautiful woman comes along I can become very insecure and this bitterness that looks matter so much and I'm aging everyday can take over me.

This used to happen everytime, but now not so much- it largely depends on the mood I am in.

Things that have really helped me:

-complimenting genuinely the women that intimidate you (in your head, to your friends, or to the woman herself)

-looking for positive things about everybody. I believe that how harshly we judge ourselves mirrors how harshly we judge others, so changing one can affect the other.

-Dressing in a way that makes me feel confident and like I'm staying true to my tastes and personality

-Remembering that all women will become old women, all women have insecurities, and all women want their man to be only attracted to them- no matter how beautiful they are, they will face these problems. So we should help them celebrate their beauty while they have it.

-Last and seriously important!!: How much your soul and heart shines through can seriously override your looks. At the end of the day, looks are external and fleeting. What (good) men really want is a loving wife. Yes beauty is nice to look at, but a kind and loving companion is the ultimate desire and trumps a woman with just a nice physical appearance anyday.

[–]Sobinia7 points8 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

when I meet very attractive women, especially in social situations where many men are present like work dinners, I immediately turn bitter inside me and I become closed off, which ruins the feminine energy I'm trying to cultivate and sours my mood for the whole evening.

If you can, try to imagine that the most attractive women resemble mountain trolls. That they are all obese, have severely deformed faces, no sense of fashion or grace. In the meantime, do your best to improve your appearance. If you have crooked teeth, wear braces. If the shape of your face is unusual, experiment with different hair styles and makeup. Ask some trusted friends or a hairdresser about the best hair style for you. Keep yourself groomed. Maintain a healthy weight and skin care routine. Plastic surgery is also an option, if you have the money. Also, remember: this may sound like some bluepill sweet-talk, but acting bitter makes you seem even more unattractive. It makes wrinkles become more visible. It changes your posture and behavior, which can be an even bigger women.

I guess it's because our value as women is 80% our looks

This is true, but mostly in the dating market. I'm not going to say things such as "lOoKs d0n't mAtTER u,u". If that was the case, women would all wear sweatpants and makeup and plastic surgeries wouldn't exist. Unless you work in the modeling, acting or sex industry, you're a waitress, dancer or hostess, your looks don't play a major role in your career. Can they make it easier for you to get promoted? Of course. But no decent boss will promote a woman simply because she is pretty.

Also the 80/20 is male projection on women

As for the 80/20 rule, I highly doubt if it's male projection on women. If that was the case, humanity would have been extinct by now because, instead of mating with available females and attempting to spread their seed, most men would fixate themselves on getting the best mate, leaving most women without child. Men, if they mate with a woman incapable of giving birth to a child, only loose a bit of semen that they recover in a matter of days. Women, on the other hand have to go through pregnancy, child birth, post partum and raising the child without their partner, which often meant death thousands of years ago. This is why we are way more selective when it comes to being attracted to someone, getting in a relationship and intimacy. We wouldn't have survived if we mated with every man that found us attractive.

most men want the most attractive woman out of a group of women

It's natural! The more attractive a woman is, the higher the chances of her successfully giving birth to a healthy child are. However, that does NOT mean that men absolutely despise of the rest of the women. I'm almost certain that if a guy had to pick between having a 6/10 girlfriend entirely for himself, or have "access" to an 8/10 that he'd have to share with 10 other men, he would most likely pick the former, since, on a subconscious level, he knows that a woman can only be pregnant with one man's child at a time, and if he'd have to share her, the odds of the woman birthing his offspring are lower, even if she is very fertile.

(look up "Nash equilibrium scene" from the movie "A beautiful mind")

Literature, movies and TV shows aren't always the best source of information regarding how the world functions. It is much better to simply observe real life situations.

[–]Shots2TheCrotch3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

You’re 22 and you’re slim. Smile and be friendly and almost all men will be attracted to you. Obviously do what you can with makeup and hair. There are subreddits where others can help you with that.

[–]toreliza3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

You will probably grow out of this. I used to be this way but it really won’t matter as you age. Keep the best appearance you can but also try to keep a graceful character. The character of a person is always more important and it’s what people remember. Also, sometimes people’s appearances change. Someone may look great at 22, but by 31, their looks have transformed. I’ve seen it happen.

Also, you can be blind in a way. These women may not be any more attractive than you are. You just might be your harshest critic. I used to think this woman I worked with was so beautiful but recently looking back on pictures from 10 years ago, I really don’t see it anymore.

[–]sotodiefor1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

babe go see a hair stylist, make up artist, esthetician, brow lady, nail lady, ask for recommendations & be consistent. i guarantee you are not ugly! its all in the grooming, even if it means permanent make up. there's padded bras, there's spanx there's sexy shoes. it's in you just bring it out.

and if ever i feel that way about another woman i just try to be happy for them. i'd way rather them be beautiful & content, then doubt or loathe themselves & have crippling low self esteem. not a good place to be and i wish it on no one

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Everyone has insecurities, but it's important to try and address the root of them. Maybe a trauma (just using this word because I can't think of a better one) from your childhood or teen years is causing it. I also bet you that a lot of these attractive women feel exactly the same way as you do on the inside over one insecurity or another. Perhaps they think that men don't take them seriously or are constantly paranoid about whether a man has good intentions or not.

For years, even though I was "the hot friend", I was never approached by good Christian guys and spent my college years weeding through manipulative players and shallow chads with hidden intentions while my "plain" friends had wonderful healthy LTR with the sweet, intelligent guys I would have loved to date and get to know. However, these good guys never approached me and I only crushed on them from afar and lived with horrible bitter jealousy because of it.

Try not to be discouraged or too judgemental of these women you perceive to be hotter than you. I'm positive you have wonderful qualities, plus a standout feminine outfit, well applied make-up and being well-spoken go a really long way in social situations.

[–]pennynotrcutt1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Be friendly with them, you’d be surprised—they are just people who may have gotten a better shell, but on the inside you may be more alike than you think. And I will say that grooming and how you dress, do your makeup/hair, your teeth and how you carry yourself can be a huge part of your “attractiveness”. Being slim is a great start!

[–]Suppercommievillain1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Honestly op knows men are looking for beauty because that’s how heterosexuality works and in exchange a man takes care of her, etc. so traditionally just shoot for one that can I’m sorta do that, but not completely. Lol

[–]isidorakimou2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I would suggest to stop thinking this way, because everyone is attractive and beauty is in the eye of the beholder.

Sure there are women who might be perceived as more attractive, because there is this universal stereotype of what is attractive, for which most people are programmed to lust after. It's just TV and movie (edit: porn as well) programming seriously, and yes, most people are THAT stupid that allow their taste to be programmed a certain way. They don't have a sense of their own taste, so when Hollywood tells them, lust after the blonde, blue-eyed, etc, they do just that.

Don't hate the player, hate the game kind of thing... There's nothing you can do other than accept that the way you look is the most beautiful and most attractive to someone out there and that is more than enough. What's the point in being liked by many anyway? :)

[–]chibinuts3 points4 points  (4 children) | Copy Link

Look better. Lose weight, get better at makeup, improve your hair, dress better.

Listen to positive affirmations.

Write down gratitudes everyday.

Also maybe try befriending her. That’ll help prevent a negative demeanor if you know her personally.

[–]0005000f4 points5 points  (3 children) | Copy Link

Doesn't sound like you read the post!

[–]chibinuts1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

I did. If she knows she looks her best she will feel less threatened. If she works on inner peace the presence of another beautiful woman will bother her less. And she can transform her negative thoughts into positivity by trying to connect with the other woman: a smile, a compliment, and engaging her in a conversation if possible.

[–]0005000f1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Did you? You're telling her to lose weight when she clearly states she is slim.

[–]StepfordInTexas1 point2 points  (5 children) | Copy Link

Makeup makes a big difference.

[–]applepies4kittens4 points5 points  (4 children) | Copy Link

I already wear makeup but makeup only takes you from a 5 to a 6 maybe

[–]Sobinia3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Makeup on its own can take you from a 5 to a 6. But makeup combined with:

- a decent skincare routine

- fitness and good posture

- flattering clothes

- manicure

- healthy teeth and hair

- plastic surgery (in extreme cases)

Can bring you from a 5 to a 7-8.

[–]LemurianStarseed11-1 points0 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

There’s a YouTube makeup tutorial I saw, how to catfish in real life, literally took this girl from a 5 to a 9. Maybe check it out and brush up your skills!

[–]applepies4kittens5 points6 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

I'm pretty good at doing natural makeup looks but I feel like that sort of theatre-stage, "beauty-guru", heavy-contour makeup looks better on camera than in real life..?

[–]LemurianStarseed110 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

I read somewhere that guys are into contouring actually. Idk, it was such a dramatic transformation you might be able to learn something to give you an extra boost of confidence. This kind of makeup is good for night time, dinner dates and parties, etc.

[–]danyixa0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

I struggle with similar. What helps me is to remember that we all have our own beauty and you can appreciate the beauty of others without having to put down yourself. I always think that your beauty is unique to you and no one else 💕

[–]Pola_Lita0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Try to keep in mind that not all beautiful women buy into the rating/value system either, and the thought of other people believing 80% of their value is only their looks also makes them wince. They're as likely to think that the 80/20 projection is as shallow and limiting as any other woman does and it's rare that they see themselves as goddesses.

They're just women, like you. Say "hello". :)

[–]TheBunk_TB0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

You choose how you feel. Choose to feel good and happy. Know what is good about you.

[–]cornycatlady0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Maybe work on your attractiveness (wardrobe, plastic surgery, hair, etc) so you can get confidence? When you’re fun, we’ll put together and confident men will be attracted to you.

[–][deleted]  (1 child) | Copy Link


[–]Sobinia-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

There's a "no doxing" rule

[–]CeruleanRabbit-4 points-3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

If it was me, I’d have been to a shrink for this like yesterday. This is a deep seated hang up, it’s not normal and it’s causing you real problems in your life. Definitely need to get to the bottom of it and for that you need a pro. I’d start looking up psychotherapists.

[–][deleted]  (1 child) | Copy Link


[–]pearlsandstilettosModerator | Pearl[M] 3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I don't see the relevance of a femcels complaints to the OP. Please elaborate.

[–]leetlepingouin-1 points0 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

People don't remember what you look like. They remember how you made them feel.

[–]chibinuts-1 points0 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

But how a guy feels about you is tied to his visual consumption of you.

[–][deleted]  (1 child) | Copy Link


[–]LuckyLittleStarModerator | Lil'Star[M] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

No examples from fiction.

You can kill a man, but you can't kill an idea.

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