Opinions on rape/misogyny

vanBeethovenLudwig · 2016-11-16T19:21:11+00:00

Legitimate cases notwithstanding, I think every woman has the responsibility to conduct herself in a manner that keeps her safe. Drinking to excess, going off with men you barely know, being provocative, all these things put her in a situation to be taken advantage of. Of course cases like Brock Turner, I blame the guy, but waking up the next day with buyer's remorse, that's your own fault. I also think women who make false allegations should be put in jail.

loneliness-inc · 2016-11-16T21:16:59+00:00

I think it's very sad that feminism and SJWs have made necessary the term "real rape."

With all of the false allegations and unclear situations that could have been avoided, and especially when they claim catcalling and whistling as rape, it diminishes and belittles the situations of actual rape victims. Speaking for myself, if I were a rape victim, I would wish that I was only whistled at.

Also, it is so hypocritical that feminsts want to be empowered with control over their own bodies but as soon as it comes to taking reasonable measures for protecting their own bodies, it's suddenly the men's responsibility to just not rape. They want all of the fun and privileges with none of the responsibility or consequences

VigilantRedRooster · 2016-11-16T19:10:22+00:00

It's a legitimate question, but I don't think an example from Dubai where the woman is automatically presumed guilty is the best starting point for discussion about Western views on the topic.

[deleted] · 2016-11-16T20:08:17+00:00

With any crime, such as murder/robbery, the fact that a crime was committed is not in question, but rather who-did-it. With sexual relations, on the other hand, the parties involved are known, but the question is was a crime committed. From the information presented there is no way to determine if a crime was committed or not. However, the opening sentence does presume a crime, "... claiming rape because she was gangraped by two men..." by using circular logic.

You either seduce (i.e. consent given) or pay for a persons companionship. If there is no consent, then it's a crime. It's incumbent on the person claiming a crime to prove that consent was not given, because of a presumption of innocence on the other party involved.

electrokiwi · 2016-11-16T20:29:01+00:00

So I'm seeing people posting as if rape of a drunk person is not "real rape" and I think it's pretty misguided. Rape is still a crime and the person that robs you while you're walking home alone at night is still a criminal, even if you could have gone a different way. The guilt that rape survivors feel in situations where they're judged as having been responsible for their rape can be really traumatizing, and I think more blame should be placed on the rapist. Oftentimes these guys will ply girls with drinks, pressure them, and keep sober themselves, in a way that's clearly predatory. A girl may not have been taught about these methods being used, as is the case with many young girls going to college for the first time, which is when they are statistically most vulnerable. We should teach women to be wary of situations where they are taken advantage of, but the only not "real" rape is that where the person had the mental ability to say yes and then lied about it after.

Lizziloo87 · 2016-11-17T12:55:47+00:00

I don't like rape claims that are based of being drunk. I've been drunk during my younger party years and slept around (happily married now and obviously don't do that anymore) I would have never thought that regret=rape. It just doesn't. However, if I said no to something (let's say we were doing vaginal stuff) and the guy wants butt stuff, then even if I said no and he goes in anyway...that is rape. Rape is forced sex. Not regretful sex.

loneliness-inc · 2016-11-16T23:17:31+00:00

One of the most frustrating things about all this nonsense is the notion that one person is entirely responsible for everything that happens.

This is sheer lunacy.

Every person is 100% responsible for whatever they chose to do. This applies to the rapee as much as it applies to the rapist.

A man who forces himself onto a woman is responsible for his actions. The woman who makes herself vulnerable to being taken advantage of, leads a guy on only to pull away or other such "brilliant" moves is responsible for putting herself in harms way. Just because he's responsible for what I he did, doesn't mean she isn't responsible sible for her role.

Personal responsibility of is an old fashioned value which needs to become popular again.

Spazzy19 · 2016-11-17T19:29:14+00:00

I'm rather torn on the issue because I do feel women should be able to wear what they want or go where they please without being assaulted. Note, I do not consider cat calling "rape" and would roll my eyes at a woman complaining about it after getting dolled up. It's to be expected at that point.

However, like some others have said, a woman has a responsibility to ensure her own safety. My friend was raped by guys she knew in the military and thought she trusted. She is definitely not one to be all girly and worked the mechanic shop in the Army. She has a 14 yr old daughter from that experience.

But, going out alone to places seeking that attention is risky. There's a YouTube cartoon video that came out after a fairly recent CA rape that made headlines where a girl passed out outside and this kid went to town on her. Even if she may have said yes before (and who knows if she actually did) no one should have sex with an unconscious person. The YouTube video compares consent about sex with asking for a cup of tea. It's sadly humorous, but very accurate IMO. You can just search "consent tea" and it'll come up.

Willow-girl · 2016-11-17T02:35:24+00:00

I think it's a real shame that many parents don't warn their daughters of the danger of drinking or drugging around men who might take advantage of them. I guess parents assume that "My daughter would never do that!", and remain in denial, not discussing the possible ramifications, which puts their girls in danger. A shame.

Capn_Underpants · 2016-11-17T05:07:05+00:00

If a woman drinks and drives a car, she's a 'horrible person' ...if a woman drinks and has 'regretful sex', she gets to call it 'rape' if she wishes.

However, is this what happened here ?

Mentathiel · 2016-11-18T20:48:19+00:00

I think in most situations both are to blame. Women are to blame for not taking care of their own safety and men are to blame for violating it.

For violent back alley kind of crime, it's completely the man's fault.

For when judgment-impairing substances are involved, it depends. If a woman has consented, regardless of how impaired her judgment was, she has consented. I mean, of course that doesn't apply for when she didn't consume these substances willingly, although she should also make sure not to allow people to drug her discretely. However, if she's passed out or unable to take action otherwise, then both are to blame again, her for putting herself in that situation and him for violating her.

As for minors, I'm not sure what to say. In my country, it's legal to gave sex from 14 years on, regardless of the age of the other person. I don't see that as completely healthy in some circumstances, but I also see no reason why an 18yo sleeping with a consenting 15yo should be seen as a predator. It's a difficult question, because it has to juggle cultural morality and benefits and problems young people get from this. On one hand, sexual exploration is important, it's a bonding experience that maintains relationships, but on the other hand young people often lack self-control, self-respect, responsibility and maturity that should go into such a choice. Age gaps are also questionable.

Due process and all always applying. You should, of course, offer support to your friends who claim to have gone through such a thing regardless of proof (well, if they're trustworthy, but they should be if they're your friends), but that doesn't mean that anything of that sort is acceptable on legislative level.

Similar applies to male victims as well.

[deleted] · 2016-11-19T15:15:44+00:00

For me, drunk sex/consent is analgous to drunk driving. It's about as ridiculous to place blame on the sexual partner as it is to blame the bartender. Where I lived previously, a drunk driver actually sued her bartender after getting into an accident. The only thing that saved the bartender was a video clip that clearly showed "a reasonable person" could not tell the woman was drunk.

LadyLumen · 2016-11-18T18:37:08+00:00

Uh...that's a real fuzzy line.

dottywine · 2016-11-18T19:19:14+00:00

I take it seriously. When you're drunk, it is incredibly easy to make stupid decisions that will put you in a vulnerable position. Just like I would blame anyone for taking advantage of a vulnerable person. You don't tell a kid who's been molested "You shouldn't have let that person take you to the restroom". Sure, you'll teach the kid about it so that it never happens again but largely, you're blaming the offender. It doesn't matter what stupid decision was made, someone took advantage of the situation and caused harm. That's wrong period.

And I think its important to note in here--

There's a difference between having buyer's remorse and "being provocative, hanging out with guys you barely know and putting yourself in a situation to be taken advantage of". I don't get... I don't understand how some of y'all are acting like they're the exact same thing...

Title	Opinions on rape/misogyny
Author	vanBeethovenLudwig
Upvotes	3
Comments	53
Date	November 16, 2016 6:55 PM UTC (7 years ago)
Subreddit	/r/RedPillWomen
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/RedPillWomen/opinions-on-rapemisogyny.86637 https://theredarchive.com/post/86637
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/RedPillWomen/comments/5dayqk/opinions_on_rapemisogyny/