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The Difference between TRP and RPW

TempestTcup
August 29, 2013
195 upvotes
/r/RedPillWomen

The way /r/RedPillWomen differs from /r/TheRedPill is that women are the gatekeepers of sex and men are the gatekeepers of commitment, so RPW works toward keeping women from squandering sex while working towards obtaining commitment, and TRP works toward keeping men from squandering commitment while working towards obtaining sex.

TheRedArchive is an archive of Red Pill content, including various subreddits and blogs. This post has been archived from the subreddit /r/RedPillWomen.

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Post Information
Title The Difference between TRP and RPW
Author TempestTcup
Upvotes 195
Comments 102
Date August 29, 2013 2:14 PM UTC (10 years ago)
Subreddit /r/RedPillWomen
Archive Link https://theredarchive.com/r/RedPillWomen/the-difference-between-trp-and-rpw.83967
https://theredarchive.com/post/83967
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/RedPillWomen/comments/1lbxo6/the_difference_between_trp_and_rpw/
Red Pill terms in post
the red pill
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Comments

[–][deleted]  (3 children) | Copy Link

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[–]TehGinjaNinja 46 points47 points  (61 children) | Copy Link

That, and there is an ongoing debate with in TRP if serious commitment (e.g. marriage and fatherhood) is worth while, feasible, or even safe for men in modern society.

As far as I know RPW doesn't seem to be having a corresponding debate about sex, at least not with in the context of relationships.

[–]WhisperTRP Founder 31 points32 points  (5 children) | Copy Link

This is because, while the government can legislate relationships into a bad deal for men, it cannot legislate sex into a bad deal for women.

Laws can abolish any rights a man may have in marriage, but they cannot abolish love, affection, pleasure, connection, or the female orgasm.

[–][deleted] 16 points17 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

American laws at least.

[–]FatherDawn 4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

So true

[–]MasterGolbez 20 points21 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I would say anti abortion and anti contraception laws (if there are any) would be legislating sex into a bad deal for women. If that one quick fuck could mean becoming pregnant and even having to bear the child then shit gets serious pretty quickly. This was the basis for pretty much all gender roles in human history before the late 20th century

[–]-Fender- 4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I was randomly browsing the subreddits of Reddit, and fell on this one. I expected to find a poor parody of what the Red Pill actually stood for, with feminists trying to reappropriate the term to redefine it in their favor. Seeing TehGinjaNinja's post and your own, as well as the description of the subreddit on the side, actually came as a vast relief to me. Thank you for giving me a bit more hope in society and lessening my cynicism. I will probably not become a member of this subreddit, but I am glad that it exists and that there are people like this community around.

[–]TempestTcup 31 points32 points  (26 children) | Copy Link

That's because sex is an incredibly important part of a relationship. When the sex goes away, the relationship is more or less doomed. Also sex is FUN!

[–]geko123 4 points5 points  (21 children) | Copy Link

When you say sex, do you mean intercourse or just generally being sexual?

[–]life036 14 points15 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

As a man, I just want you to know I have no understanding at all of that sentence.

[–]TempestTcup 9 points10 points  (19 children) | Copy Link

Intercourse.

[–]geko123 14 points15 points  (18 children) | Copy Link

My girlfriend experiences intense pain during sex (after two years of having sex). Is my relationship doomed?

[–]TempestTcup 15 points16 points  (13 children) | Copy Link

I don't know. I guess if I were in your position, I would start researching what is causing her pain. If she has a tipped uterus you can try different positions. I would find out what is causing the pain and figure out what can be done about it.

When I was saying that a sexless relationship is doomed, I didn't mean by medical issues, I meant that if one or the other partner is "too tired", uses sex as a weapon, or if sex just fades away, then the relationship is doomed. Medical issues are outliers, not the norm.

[–]geko123 5 points6 points  (12 children) | Copy Link

Thanks for clearing that up, I understand now.

Yeah, we're working on various things, but we haven't found the root of the problem just yet. We keep our sex life (except sex) fun, fresh and exciting and really enjoy what we do. But yeah, it would be nice to be having sex.

[–]brotherwayne 4 points5 points  (4 children) | Copy Link

Uhhh, has she been to a Dr? This isn't a rare condition, I'm sure you can find a Dr who's seen it.

[–]geko123 4 points5 points  (3 children) | Copy Link

We're working on seeing gynecologists and sexual therapists. Also, you said Doctor Who, so yeah.

[–]brotherwayne 11 points12 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

Well yeah, if you could get that Dr to look at it it'd be solved right away.

[–]BillyBillButt 10 points11 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Just because your penis isn't in her pussy doesn't mean that it isn't fun, enjoyable, satisfying or whatever.

[–]cottoncubes 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Check out vaginismus.com. If she has vaginismus, then you guys are in luck because there's a 99% success rate in treating it.

[–][deleted]  (2 children) | Copy Link

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[–][deleted]  (1 child) | Copy Link

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[–][deleted]  (1 child) | Copy Link

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[–]geko123 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

What do you mean?

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy Link

fix it

[–]geko123 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

How do you suggest I do that?

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

see a Dr. if he cant help see others. research on the internet... find a solution.

make a post on reddit or other websites and see if their are people who had the same issue and how the fixed it or what they did.

[–]TehGinjaNinja 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

You're going to get no argument from me on that account :)

[–]taraga185 12 points13 points  (3 children) | Copy Link

Yeah, my husband doesn't really like TRP for that reason, our family and marriage was definitely a top priority/desire in his life. He says it's not really anything he can relate to for that reason.

[–]TehGinjaNinja 7 points8 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

Like I said, it's a debate with in the community. There are those who swear adopting some Red Pill habits will improve, or even save, a marriage.

[–]taraga185 16 points17 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

As far as the debate I'm not on TRP sub often, but the majority of the population does get married at some point so it only makes sense that if you desire marriage and family that this information is beneficial.

I'm new to the red pill lifestyle, but as soon as I found this sub I immediately saw a lot of my relationship with my husband. We tended towards a more traditional marriage gender roles, etc. I especially liked the MMSL post about relationship momentum. We have been married 4 years, together 7, and I'm still totally nuts about him. I just wondered how women go from happy to hating their husbands, miserable and divorced. So I see this as a way to improve myself and be a better wife.

[–]TehGinjaNinja 5 points6 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

That's nice to hear.

[–]Offensive_Brute 16 points17 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

also, because in modern society sex has been divorced from its natural consequences, while commitment has had a ton of artificial consequences heaped on it.

If I get married and want out, I cant pay a doctor $400 to hack you into pieces and toss you out with the medical waste. I have to pay a divorce lawyer, and then probably keep paying alimony indefinitely. Theres no pill to protect me from becoming homeless if you decide we should no longer cohabitate. I can't demand you wrap yourself in a greasy balloon to protect myself from the potential consequences of significant commitment.

[–]naanplussed 1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Theres no pill to protect me from becoming homeless if you decide we should no longer cohabitate.

Could you explain this one? I know if there's a divorce the man will often rent an apartment and the woman pays the mortgage with alimony?

Or is this like she changes the locks on the residence and lives with her new boyfriend and tenant laws protect them?

[–]Offensive_Brute 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

when there are kids involved the woman almost always retains the primary residence, and a man paying alimony and child support, on the average american males income will be hard pressed to cobble together a half decent lifestyle. You're talking about a man moving back into the same apartment he lived in when he first moved out of his parents house, 60% of the time, because his wife felt the marriage isnt working.

[–]Boss_Monkey 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

The debate over commitment could not have occurred up until the point where sex was readily available without commitment (squandering sex).

[–]IllimitableMan 11 points12 points  (8 children) | Copy Link

The consensus in TRP is get a vasectomy so she doesn't try to get pregnant to trap u by lying about taking birth control "OOPS!" is bullshit, cohabit, but don't marry.

Women are far too incentivised by the divorce system to basically ditch you and leave you with nothing. She'll defend that position while she loves you, but love is oft temporary with the feminine ruled by their emotion, if a better guy comes along you're fucked, win-win for her, lose-lose for you. She gets an upgrade (branch swings) and you have to pay out the ass for her. Whilst your life goes into serial downgrade and the money you've given her now makes it harder for you to get another woman and move on. It's clean for her, dirty for you.

I want a family, I'm not going to have a formalised legal contract that allows me to be divorce raped though. Might have a ceremony, but you won't catch me signing marriage papers. That's strategically stupid for a man, the feminists made it so.

[–]TehGinjaNinja 18 points19 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

That's not a "consensus" on TRP. It's a caricature of modern gender relations held by one faction in the debate.

Also, given "common law marriage" laws in some states; cohabitation and raising a family together present the same risks as "a formalized legal contract".

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

There wording of these laws (some of them) provide strict conditions to be present before common law marriage is recognized. Because of this it is possible to circumvent/avoid/loophole the common law marriage (depends on how the law is written and legal precedents of course).

[–]BillyBillButt 16 points17 points  (5 children) | Copy Link

Why are you on RPW when you obviously don't like women?

[–]IllimitableMan 8 points9 points  (4 children) | Copy Link

Are you serious? I love women. Go home.

LOL. http://www.reddit.com/r/TheRedPill/comments/1mnrok/we_as_men_need_to_put_our_foot_down_and_stand_up/ccb36h7

[–]BillyBillButt 12 points13 points  (3 children) | Copy Link

I'm sorry, why would you agree to cohabit with someone who you think will "divorcerape" you at any instant?

EDIT: not even mentioning the fact you imply many women will lie to you about taking birth control, that they care only about money and that they are ruled by emotion.

[–]IllimitableMan 18 points19 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I wouldn't cohabit with a chick I thought would divorce rape me, that's silly. I'm in the legal profession, about as red pill as it gets when it comes to contracts, and this is not a contract any logical or objective person would sign, it's probably the most biased legal contract in existence because it's so easy to terminate the contract. Divorce rape is exactly what it says. Your economic progress gets wiped out. It's absurd.

[–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I'm sorry, why would you agree to cohabit with someone who you think will "divorcerape" you at any instant?

do you think those who did get divorceraped knew it would happen? they loved their wifes and believed their marriage would be a success. and i im sure most women didnt plan to divorcerape their husband, but many did.

imply many women will lie to you about taking birth control

many do and dont even think thats unethical or wrong in any way.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (6 children) | Copy Link

Hmmm, are these views that are held by genders (let's generalize that these unique gender preferences are prevelant) products of the nature of each gender, or things that are taught by societies?

What portion of this is a product of environment/culture and what portion is caused by genetics/the nature of each gender/ seems to be where people disagree.

I think that environment and culture play larger roles in causing behavior among genders. In my experience the differing views of people are shaped by their differing experiences (experiences that; teach them how to interact with the world). These styles of thinking propagate and evolve as society does.

I've met too many unique men and women to assume that all behave according to certain roles or that they should; however, I do recognize that in a broad sample many do.

[–]TehGinjaNinja 2 points3 points  (5 children) | Copy Link

I think that environment and culture play larger roles in causing behavior among genders. In my experience the differing views of people are shaped by their differing experiences (experiences that; teach them how to interact with the world).

I wish that were true. Unfortunately, people's experiences of the world are filtered through their biases, and many of those biases seem to be a product of biology.

Environment and culture certainly play a role, but the strong influence of biology should not be underestimated for the sake of political correctness. Biologically based cognitive and behavioral biases are the only reasonable explanation for the norms of gendered conduct common to most cultures.

I've met too many unique men and women to assume that all behave according to certain roles or that they should; however, I do recognize that in a broad sample many do.

No doubt you have met many different sorts of people, but that's because biology expresses broad variations (along with statistical norms). Consider the transgendered; they will commonly assert that their gender identity is rooted somewhere deep within themselves and not something which can be changed (like an opinion or belief structure). As a result they go to the extreme resolution of surgery, rather than seeking some form of psycho-social realignment.

That the lived experience of individuals who have transitioned from one gender to another refutes the idea of gender as a purely social construct is very significant. It also explains why there is tension between feminists (and other PC proponents of gender equivalence) and the trans community.

Above you imply that "all" people "should" not conform to "certain roles" but that "many do". What you seem to be missing is that "many do "conform to "certain roles", because that is their nature and it brings them happiness.

Ideally, the many should be free to conform to those roles and the few should be free to express their own non-conformist nature. Unfortunately, at the insistence of the politically correct, we have demonized the way the many express their nature in the name of "liberating" the few.

This hostility to normative gendered conduct has produce increasing unhappiness among women and a growing social disengagement among men. Personally, I doubt that the current, politically-mandated hostility to gender norms is sustainable in the long run.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (3 children) | Copy Link

I've met too many unique men and women to assume that all behave according to certain roles or that they should; however, I do recognize that in a broad sample many do.

The variation I was referring to was in behavior/tendencies associated with masculinity or femininity. I should have been more specific.

Above you imply that "all" people "should" not conform to "certain roles" but that "many do". What you seem to be missing is that "many do "conform to "certain roles", because that is their nature and it brings them happiness.

That is also not quite what I was trying to say. I had meant to imply was that I do not believe anyone ought to behave more or less like either gender. They don't have to, but they do. Again, I would be more apt to conclude that it's because of the life experiences they've had. Then again, I hold these beliefs because of what I have experienced in life.

[–]TehGinjaNinja 0 points1 point  (2 children) | Copy Link

The variation I was referring to was in behavior/tendencies associated with masculinity or femininity. I should have been more specific.

No, I understood that was your meaning, but there is no reason to assume those behaviors/tendencies are not biologically rooted, and a great deal of evidence suggesting they are.

I had meant to imply was that I do not believe anyone ought to behave more or less like either gender. They don't have to, but they do.

Then your beliefs are in conflict with the facts. They are compelled to behave that way by their natures. To suggest otherwise is as harmful and unreasonable as the idea that you can "pray away the gay".

I hold these beliefs because of what I have experienced in life.

No, you hold those beliefs because they serve to rationalize your innate biases. Your "experience" of the reality reflecting those false beliefs is largely a product of perceptual filters created by your biases.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

I don't assume that people are completely influenced by experience. I do think it plays a larger role than genetics.

As for facts, I would have to look at more research.

The apparent effect cultures have on people's behaviors or desires gives a lot of credibility to Social Learning Theory.

[–]TehGinjaNinja 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I do think it plays a larger role than genetics. As for facts, I would have to look at more research.

I would recommend looking into adoption and twin studies on heritable behavioral traits. The results might surprise you, or you might dismiss them or rationalize them away to maintain your biases.

The apparent effect cultures have on people's behaviors or desires gives a lot of credibility to Social Learning Theory.

Social Learning Theory amounts to little more than "monkey see, monkey do". It asserts that people can learn behavior from each other, it does not prove anything about the ultimate origin of said behaviors. Humans are biological entities, and our cultures are ultimately rooted in our biology.

[–]TRP_ 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

There's plenty of red pillers who are in long term relationships or even married. Red pill just advises against it because divorce dzvirs females and a woman can use divorce as leverage.

[–]TehGinjaNinja 4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

I wouldn't even go so far as to say that The Red Pill out right "advises against it" as a whole. Like I said, there is a debate about whether it's worth while. What The Red Pill does make clear is that it's dangerous to men and they should not enter into it our of naive romanticism.

[–]The-Self-Post-Guy 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Im over at TRP pretty often and I think the general consensus is that marriage is not worth the risk. I think you hit the nail on the head here. In this day and age of having your cake and eating too, most women are too flakey and as soon as they get a wild hair up their ass they divorce you, take the kids, get child support, alimony and leave you with nothing. With women intiating divorce a vast majority of the time its a really big risk. So like you said its about safety.

But if things weren't so bad, I might reconsider marriage again. But right now its not an option for me.

[–][deleted] 37 points38 points  (10 children) | Copy Link

trp and rpw use the same set of knowledge about the sexes to negotiate different and sometimes even somewhat mutually incompatible goals. the negotiation process usually leads to each party compromising on the other sexes prime directive to obtain a satisfactory portion of their own, i.e. a woman giving in on sex to obtain a portion of commitment thats satisfactory to her or a man giving up liberty or resources to obtain a satisfactory portion of sex or other attributes of a relationship he desires from a specific woman because he finds letting that specific one go more unappealing than looking for sex in another, even if he has options.

[–]TempestTcup 17 points18 points  (7 children) | Copy Link

LOL, you make it sound so romantic :)

[–][deleted] 20 points21 points  (6 children) | Copy Link

...is it my warm and lilting prose, dripping with human emotion?

[–]TempestTcup 9 points10 points  (5 children) | Copy Link

Yes it is, I can tell you are going all squishy on us!

Oh, and I should mention something about how women fall in lust (therefore men can't drop their frame), but men fall in love eternal (oneitis). Just my little idea I'm working on.

[–][deleted] 9 points10 points  (4 children) | Copy Link

heres something i wrote about male vs female "commitment" i dont know if i already posted it or not...seems along the lines of what youre saying

http://minarchyblog.wordpress.com/2010/09/08/why-wont-men-commit-oh-yeah-because-women-are-ballbusting-shrews-that-steal-your-dreams/

[–]BowlOfCandy 4 points5 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Awesome post, it really resonated with me. I'm a 26M, starting to get an idea of the realities of long-term human companionship. I'm new to TRP, was curious about RPW and I came across this post.

Both of these communities have great value.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (1 child) | Copy Link

Interesting read. Replying for later reference. There's no doubt that women require more out of a relationship from their husbands. If a husband fails to meet his wife's emotional needs, there is risk of flight from the marriage, just as a wife must meet a husband's needs for sex (or he may begin to look elsewhere).

Please read this and tell me what you think about it as a woman:

http://www.marriagebuilders.com/graphic/mbi8111_leave.html

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

i try not to think of things "as a woman" as much as is humanly possibly

that marriagebuilders thing was not even close:

http://www.counter-currents.com/2011/06/rotating-polyandry-and-its-enforcers-part-1/

http://dontmarry.files.wordpress.com/2009/03/sexualutopia.pdf

[–]throwaway000123456 6 points7 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

There is an interesting dynamic going on here before and after commitment:

TL;DR Summary: Before commitment happens, both the guy and the gal have a decent amount of power in the relationship, though whoever wants commitment is at a slight disadvantage.

After commitment, the guy is at a large disadvantage because he has no exit and is at the mercy of the gal for sex

Disclaimer: The ramblings that follow are based on my (limited) understanding of power dynamics in relationships. If both parties have a deep respect and love for each other, are very generous to each other, are willing to sacrifice for the relationship, etc., then much of this analysis may be irrelevant. The reason is that generous cooperation really messes with power dynamics and makes them less important (imo).

Also, the below are my opinions of course. I am not trying to present facts—just opinion. I may be very wrong in my judgments. Honestly speaking, I am very biased.

Before commitment, the romantic male-female dynamic has to do with sex and determining fitness for commitment. (Actually, the healthiest goal is to just have fun while together and do one's own thing while apart.)

As a guy, if you're in decent shape and know what's up, you can get sex a few times per month (or more) from different women. As a woman, you can get more sex than that. In other words, both men and women can find some modicum of sexual satiety without too much difficulty if they know how.

The penalty for a failed sexual relationship is fairly small. To be clear, by sexual relationship, I mean a relationship where there is not much commitment—the same two people have sex maybe only once ever, or even once every week or every few weeks, in which case it's casual, relaxed friendship.

If things don't work out, you shrug, feel sad for a bit, then keep looking (or perhaps you have multiple partners). At worst, you've lost sex for a bit, as well as the possibility of commitment from that individual.

Then there's commitment. Commitment refers to an exclusive relationship as well as marriage. Both situations are not terribly easy to leave—the former because of emotional attachment and comfort—the latter for all the same reasons as the former, plus financial reasons, and, most importantly, children.

After commitment happens, there is the potential for sex to be used as a weapon, usually by women. IMO, there are several reasons why I believe this:

  • For men, sex is generally a stronger compulsion—probably because we haven't been as sexually repressed as women by society. Generally speaking, I think women can live without sex better than men. Furthermore, women get more sexual validation throughout the day. When you have people checking you out or hitting on you several times a day, it makes a difference in your life. You may not think so, but compare this to men who are generally not appreciated sexually. Any validation men receive from foreigners usually comes after the guy puts effort into flirting and doesn't get rejected—which is not an option for a guy in a relationship. Thus, his only validation as a sexual being generally only comes from his girlfriend or wife. That's it.
  • Women have an easier time cheating because 1) they can find partners more easily, and 2) because society is slightly more forgiving of women cheating. I know that's controversial. I'll explain this viewpoint after I discuss some of the reasons why men and women cheat.

To be clear, I'm not saying society views cheating by women as a-OK—hardly anybody supports cheating. Rather, I'm saying that women are viewed by society as have more understandable reasons for cheating, and thus can be forgiven more easily by their peers. This is usually by laying blame on the guy, which is generally half-true. In reality, the blame lies with both parties, unless the cheater is a raging nymphomaniac with no self-control.

The reasons for cheating that a woman has include:

  • The guy is a total deadbeat.
  • He spends too much time doing his own thing (friends, video games, etc.)
  • He comes home and is emotionally distant because he's tired from work or whatever.
  • He's generally neglectful in small but significant ways. It's generally not intentional or malicious, but it's still neglect.
  • He is sexually not performing or is unexciting to you.

These are valid issues by the way, and they occur in many relationships that work and don't work.

Anyhow, the above reasons for cheating are implicitly known throughout society (imo), which means that when a woman cheats, it's easier for us to forgive her. Again, I'll explain this more in-depth in a little bit.

Guys have the same set of reasons for cheating, however society does not view them as valid excuses because society still views these reasons as being mostly the guy's fault. Again, this is only half-true. In reality, both parties ought to work together to solve any problems.

  • Girl is a deadbeat: You should engage more. Talk to her about things she likes, go dancing with her, cook with her, hike with her, encourage her to push herself, etc.
  • She spends too much time doing her own thing: Girls need time by themselves. And besides, consider yourself lucky that she gives you some space, right? Plan "Guy Time", or make an effort to involve yourself in what she enjoys.
  • She comes home and remains distant due to being tired from work or whatever: Give her massages, cook for her, do extra-nice things for her, pamper her, draw her a bath, just be with her and don't put on any pressure because, hey, she's tired.
  • She's generally neglectful: What are you doing to piss her off? Maybe you said something wrong. Buy her roses, take her out on nice dates like you used to, etc. Try to communicates your feeling more. Maybe she feels you're neglecting her.
  • She is not performing sexually: Welcome to married life. But seriously, try to communicate your feelings. Maybe counseling. You should also hit the gym to stay attractive. And might try viagra...

Many of the issues are viewed as the guy's fault. "You're in the doghouse now," is what happens when the man misbehaves and so has to sleep on the couch. It is uncommon for a guy to put his gal "in the doghouse."

In short, if a guy cheats on his SO, he's a total and utter douche-bag. If there are kids involved, then fuck that guy even more because she bore his children.

If a girl cheats, well what a freaking bitch, but was her SO treating her okay? I mean, you know how so many guys just don't pay any attention to their wives/girlfriends and are a total bore after awhile. And so many guys just eat and eat and watch TV and let themselves go! And he probably didn't help with the cooking, the kids, the cleaning, and who knows what else. Living with that man must've really been suffocating if she had to go out and cheat to feel some freedom and excitement. But, you know, it's good that she decided to divorce that man in the end. The cheating really was the first sign that she needed to get out of that relationship...

(To be clear, I am assuming the reasons a person has for cheating are 100% true—the SO might be negligent, unhelpful, uncommunicative, etc.. I am not saying that either party is fabricating any complaints. However, we can all agree that cheating is off the table—at least until significant effort has been made to rectify things at home.)

It is the above sentiments that make me feel cheating is easier for women—in part, because it's easier to find people to sleep with, in part because women can live without sex more easily, and in part because I believe society's standards make it easier for women to rationalize cheating to themselves and others and thus be forgiven.

As another example, think of the woman who finds her husband cheating. It is more acceptable that she retaliates by destroying his property than if the roles were reversed. She still goes to jail and she's still crazy, but there is a strong "He deserves it" mentality in society.

As a supporting anecdote: I saw a clip of a talk show where the women hosts were talking about a woman who cut off her guy's penis and put it in the blender. As I recall, the hosts' reactions included: "He probably cheated on her", laughter, and "You go girl".

Now, reverse the roles—the man finds his gal cheating, cuts off her clit and labia and puts them in a blender. If a guy so much as smirks, his career would be over, and rightly so. And anyway, no one would smirk because genital mutilation is just not funny.

Anyway, if cheating is easier for women, you now have a situation where the guy feels that he has to behave properly in the committed relationship if he wants sex. (His feelings may be paranoia, but feelings are still real.) If the guy misbehaves, he loses sex and may face divorce (and, depending on the situation, may lose a portion of his finances and family). If he cheats on his wife, he also faces divorce.

In other words, if it the commitment situation doesn't work, the guy often times gets screwed and is no shrug and walk away. Thus, the guy is at a great power disadvantage after committing.

Contrast the above with the pre-commitment situation, where both parties have more control over the situation. Whoever wants commitment is at a slight power disadvantage because ze has to get the other person to agree to commitment. Generally, it's the girl who is in this slightly disadvantaged position, though guys certainly experience this as well.

[–]tigolbittiez 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Agreed on most of what you said, but I don't necessarily agree that women could get on better without sex than men. I think they are about equal, but the right generation/melting pot of men could last without sex entirely. Because they've never had it before. With the pressure on men to make the move and escalate it to sex, there are simply more men than women not having sex.

And at a certain point they don't necessarily understand what's so great about it and rationalize their inability to get some as sex isn't worth getting anyway. Just an observation I've had of some of the more bitter men out there, that I've actually seen on Reddit as well. I suppose there are certain women out there who are the same way. I have no evidence that this is fact or that this is a real thing. Like I said, just an observation!

[–]FleetingWishEndorsed Contributor 17 points18 points  (3 children) | Copy Link

I really like how my SO put it to me the other day. It was something to the gist of, "If the foundation of TRP is that men and women are fundamentally different, you can't expect TRP and RPW to be the same. Men and women have different wants, different needs, and different expectations; the differences in TRP and RPW reflect that."

[–]TempestTcup 8 points9 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

I think the people who think that women and men are equal and interchangeable are the ones asking why TRP focuses on sex while we focus on relationships. I also think that those people are the ones cheering on the fat, short haired, foul mouthed feminists and the skinny jean wearing, effeminate, hipster boys.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

If men and women were exactly the same the world would be a very boring place indeed. Thankfully this is not the case.

[–]crankypants15 6 points7 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

Just an small clarification. Some men are scared of marriage for emotional reasons, some don't want marriage due to horrendous divorce laws. I wouldn't just say "men squander commitment." There's a reason they don't want commitment, whether they understand what's going on in their minds, and tell you, or not.

Divorce laws these days simply make it too expensive to get married.

[–]TempestTcup 17 points18 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Committment doesn't have to be marriage, but that is the ultimate commitment.

Think about it like this: if a man says "I love you" to every girl he meets, it cheapens the sentiment, and if a girl has sex with every guy she meets, it cheapens the act.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

"Cheapens" is a great word choice. Its associations beautifully explain the situation.

[–]RaxL 2 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

Umm... what is "squandering commitment"?

[–][deleted] 13 points14 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

umm....for a man with options--wasting time, money and effort on "committing" to one woman in some tabglible way without getting the expected return (sex, wifely behavior, fidelity in return, etc)

[–]TempestTcup 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

If a guy says he loves every girl he meets. The clingy guy.

[–][deleted] 7 points8 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Can we say that the RedPill is essentially accepting and committing to living in a world with uncomfortable truths?

[–]mcdehuevo 3 points4 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

"women are the gatekeepers of sex and men are the gatekeepers of commitment"

That is about as perfect a nutshell summation of the evolutionary difference between men and women as I've ever seen. Kudos!

[–]TempestTcup 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

LOL, that statement is so old, I have no idea where I even stole it from! But yes, whoever coined it was genius.

[–]cloudydaez 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

To anyone who has a hard a time with reading the red pill websites, I recommend this RPW-centered blog. It is VERY old fashioned, but if you keep reading, you might see its virtue.

(http://wwnh.wordpress.com)

[–]SoftHarem[M] 3 points4 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Succinct and on point, as usual. Stuck.

[–]TempestTcup 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

Awww, thanks!

[–]charbo187 1 point2 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

wow. elegantly put.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (2 children) | Copy Link

excellent!

[–]TempestTcup 4 points5 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

It came to me in the shower - I do all of my best thinking there!

Of course, the first part about gatekeepers is very well known, and the second part has been said hundreds of times in a bunch of different ways; I just thought of a way to tie it up in a nice little bow.

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

lol thats so funny, i developed an entire theory f feminism as marxist class amelioration for women in the shower the other day, i always do my best thinking there

[–]LoxStocksAndBagels 3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

So very true. I recently broke up with my girlfriend. She never wanted to have sex anymore. I'm not a red piller persay but I sure as hell am not stupid. I know her well, and damn well knew her sex drive didnt just vanish. Nope it was just being fulfilled somewhere else. It's funny because I know for a fact that ultimately while she made some questionable choices...I was the nexus of our relationships failure.

A combination of baggage from a previous girl as well as my own infidelity sort of rotted the damn foundation way to early. I'm certain however if I would have just fucking manned up and stopped my pathetic descent into a whiney useless shadow of who I was when she met me things could have turned out differently.

I'm so conflicted right now. I'm a bit sad but know its for the best. How could I expect a woman to respect me when I wasn't respecting myself? Ah well, every fuck up is simply a lesson for the future if you don't get bogged down in the bullcrap.

[–][deleted]  (19 children) | Copy Link

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[–][deleted] 6 points7 points  (18 children) | Copy Link

yes its a generalization. from now on no statement can be made about any category of things. things can only be discussed in the particular. no general statements describing the generic traits of "men" "women" "diamonds" "atoms" or "giraffes" can be made. no inferences can be drawn regarding groups ever. every individual human is a unique snowflake about whom their gender, race, ethnicity, country of origin, religions , hairstyles or weight can tell us ABSOLUTELY NOTHING. there are no biological differences between the sexes other than the most superficial physical traits.

[–][deleted]  (17 children) | Copy Link

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[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (16 children) | Copy Link

No, we are not including anything we exist for the purpose of openly rejecting.

Yes we're unabashedly sexist

Maybe you should, like, read the welcome message before posting the same hackneyed feminist garbage the whole rest of Reddit and the culture is full of before posting the exact same thing 1000 others have posted before you verbatim, you snowflake who can't be stereotyped, you:

http://www.reddit.com/r/RedPillWomen/comments/1giney/welcome_to_red_pill_women/

[–]real-dreamer 0 points1 point  (15 children) | Copy Link

Why are you sexist?

[–][deleted] 5 points6 points  (12 children) | Copy Link

did you read the welcome message?

"sexism" is a content-free, cultural marxist neologism used for the sole purpose of denying non social constructivist, aka natural, concepts of sex differences. it has no meaning to anyone but leftists, feminists and other social constructivists. i reject the concept out of hand. but to those who consider it a legitimate concept, i am considered a sexist.

we are "sexist" to the type of person who thinks the term describes an aspect of reality because we believe inn inherent biological sex differences that describe the bulk of the human population, with of course trends toward outlier on either side. we base our opinions on thebulk of the population of each sex, not on its weird outliers. outliers and people outside the norm offer no useful information on how the bulk of humans can interact successfully, other than as the exceptions that prove rules. if you dont believe this then thats fine, but your fundamental 1st premises regarding human sexuality are simply not accepted by what this sub stands for and have been repeatedly analyzed and rejected by all of us to the point that seeing them repeated again and again and again and again in the exact same words becomes like a far side cartoon in its absurdity

[–][deleted]  (11 children) | Copy Link

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[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (10 children) | Copy Link

I haven't "forgotten" history, I don't subject it to feminist interpretation or hold feminist values. If that's your example of sexism then all I can do is LOL . I want the world to be like patrician Rome, victorian England or late 19th to early 20th century US. None of your concepts of sexism or feminist history have any meaning to me

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (9 children) | Copy Link

So, you'd be ok with being stopped from doing something you're capable of? Genuinely trying to learn here.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points  (8 children) | Copy Link

My husband want let me take out the trash. It's very oppressive

[–]MrsStrom 4 points5 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Because there are REAL, MEASURABLE differences between men and women. I like to play to my strengths, and have my husband play to his. That way, we're complementary.

[–]portll 3 points4 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

That's not sexism, sexism is:

prejudice, stereotyping, or discrimination, typically against women, on the basis of sex:

That's just admitting reality includes gender differences (and sex differences).

[–][deleted]  (1 child) | Copy Link

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[–][deleted] 2 points3 points  (0 children) | Copy Link

"Wear proudly the scorn of Fools"

[–][deleted]  (2 children) | Copy Link

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[–]TempestTcup 1 point2 points  (1 child) | Copy Link

Don't be the town bicycle while obtaining commitment; don't squander your partner number. Be picky about what dicks get to enter your orifices. That is all.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Very well said

[–]Spidertech500-1 points [recovered] (1 child) | Copy Link

RP'r here, great analogy, +1, if I may ask, just linked here, Why is it that sex is over protected, I would assume such a habit would carry into marriage. I can explain the trp side if asked for the opposite perspective

[–]TempestTcup 0 points1 point  (0 children) | Copy Link

Why is it that sex is over protected

I'm assuming you are talking about "keeping women from squandering sex". It means that she shouldn't have sex with every guy she meets; she shouldn't be a slut.

You can kill a man, but you can't kill an idea.

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