The measure of sexual success is desire

Cyralea · 2014-06-03T20:22:24+00:00

While a 20+-year incel who can’t get two words out in the presence of a woman without being threatened with rape charges can easily identify his shortcomings and leap to The Red Pill with great enthusiasm, a beta gets just lucky enough, just often enough that he thinks to himself, “I’m doing fine without that stupid Red Pill shit. I just need to stay the course, and eventually I’ll find the right girl.”

As an attractive guy this couldn't hit any closer to home. I stayed blue throughout most of my 20's because of my occasional easy lay here and there. It wasn't until a string of successive relationship failures that I eventually put two and two together to figure out that I wasn't generating any desire in them, just physical attraction.

You want to experience the greatest headrush as a man? Try being with a woman that wants to get with you no matter how much you tell her no. A woman that calls you up to come over even when she knows you're fucking someone else.

Blue Pill me was so excited at the prospect at eventually becoming someone's beta bux. I'm glad I failed so hard that I became a winner.

myschadenfreude · 2014-06-03T16:58:21+00:00

In retrospect my ex-wife never desired me our entire marriage. We'd have "sex" every two weeks to every two months. Quotes? Because it felt so transactional, no kissing, a minute or two lackluster bj, 3 to 5 minutes missionary and/or doggie. In bed, except for occasional shower sex "clean up is quicker". I waited to cum, except rare occasion, until after she came.

She would leave the room immediately after, rarely longer than 10 minutes beginning to end.

There was zero affection otherwise. Less than 5 times a year I'd get a random 3 second hug. Affection was so rare it was shocking when it did happen.

I thought this was my fault and tried to love her more.

Surprisingly, she left me for a coworker who dropped her like a hot potato once he heard we were divorcing (I saw incriminating texts and confronted her).

Funny thing is she was thankful to him because he showed her she "...didn't have to live like this." Lol I'm handsome, educated, funny, have a good job, well spoken and have a good head of hair. He had neither!

Last I heard she was living hand to mouth in a shitty run down part of town (her exact state when I met her 8+ years ago). I couldn't be happier for her. (My details on her are slim as she wants nothing at all to do with me.)

Me? Better work out schedule, newer better job with even more pay, and happy as hell with all facets of life.

I'm also desired now :-)

EDIT: My Beta ways died with that relationship. I thought she was my "soulmate(tm)" and she clearly wasn't. I'm a changed man. Hurt for a year then focused inward on bettering myself. Saw this sub and saw a lot of my innate behaviors.

Mistakes you learn from become lessons. Mistakes you don't learn from are failures.

Invalidity · 2014-06-03T16:57:45+00:00

To fuck you because she wants to, and no other reason. The Red Pill isn't strictly about achieving sex with women.

The point to hit home. Having sex with a woman is whimsical at best. You can beg for sex, pay for sex, use pickup skills to get sex... the point is, you want to build yourself up to become a legend, a man who defies all odds and can put in minimal effort to bed a girl.

It's the equivalent of an iceberg. The tip of the iceberg is small compared to what's underneath. All the hardwork and dedication you put in to yourself is the iceberg underneath. What you want to show people and what you want people to see is the tip of the iceberg, so that everything you do looks natural.

Schrodingersdawg · 2014-06-03T16:23:57+00:00

You will never have to question if a woman is into you if she is truly into you. Mixed messages are used to lead men on so they can become orbiters, if they want to fuck you then they'll basically do all the work for you.

Aiming to learn chatting up women is secondary to aiming to increase your value to where they approach you. Don't be neckbeard bob spitting game. Be muscular Tony who has fun without paying attention to women, without needing women.

IllimitableMan · 2014-06-04T01:28:26+00:00

He receives just enough of a trickle of sex to think that he’s on the right track, and that if he keeps it up, eventually he’ll hit the jackpot and everything will be good.

Trickle down economics is bullshit, if there's anything crony capitalism and the 2008 housing bubble has taught us it's that the rich get rich and the poor get poorer. Alpha fucks harems are getting bigger, beta bucks bank accounts are getting raped more, it's a tough economy you see, economically, sexually, and everywhere where that overlap occurs. Pussy isn't gonna trickle down to the "lesser men" pussy, like money, is monopolised/horded by those at the top, and those at the bottom are starved or get the occasional scrap. Doing the same provenly unsuccessful crap over and over again isn't going to magically start working for you all of a sudden. It's not like you're in a basement of celibacy and there's a trap door above you and if you keep poking it with your cock it'll finally give way to a battalion of naked victoria's secret models that will rain down on your sex deprived body like a UN food drop in a famine-ridden african village. What do you do in this bullshit economy if there are no jobs for your skillsets? Find a niche and start your own business/service in that niche, make a name for yourself in it and start earning REAL BANK.

If you want to say fuck the system, find out how to legally avoid paying tax in your country if that's not possible find out how to at least mitigate your liability, if your govt has relationships with foreign banks forcing them to divulge your accounts and hiding money isn't possible, wait until your business is doing well enough to pay you your cut no matter where you live in the world and earn US DOLLARS whilst living in a low cost of living country, say somewhere like south america, get that first world money paid in whilst living in a second/third world country, you're getting the income you'd get back home but your liability has now moved to your new cheaper jurisdiction and thus the american taxman can't get at your money. Learn a new language in the process and live it up as a king rather than slave away in the american, english or whatever developed world ratrace it is you come from.

Anyhow I've digressed in my attempt to be analogous, back to the whole pussy side of "resources dont trickle down" topic, you're not going to get the kind of sex life you desire for yourself by continuing to meet questionably attractive women off okcupid and sustaining all your current habits, no, what you need to do is reinvent yourself into a better, more fuckable person or like /u/Archwinger says, a desirable one. Someone you like more that is stronger and sexier than who you currently are, to the point where you like yourself so much and have so much to back that up that your frame/confidence radiates out and bitches think "shit, this guy is hot." Just like a financial overhaul your social value and sex appeal needs one too. They are two sides of the same coin.

Essentially: Riches don't trickle down so you have to go and make your own wealth. Pussy doesn't trickle down for to the average men so you have to go and make yourself fuckable, likeable and desirable. It is really that simple. It's not easy, the words do it no justice, but that's what you have to do, with all the blood, sweat, tears and pain that such an endeavour is inclusive of. Not willing to do it? Well accept the mediocre life you have and resign yourself to averageness. You're not going to be a lothario or a millionaire or anything if you can't be fucked with yourself. Giving up on yourself is tantamount to spiritual suicide.

How do you do those things? Xbox? No. Partying? No. Socialising? Minimally and on the cheap. You're going to be giving up your shitty behaviours and the rut you're caught up in being the same old unsuccessful self-disappointing person that you are and instead become obsessed with being better than you are because that's the only way you escape the purgatory of poverty and pussylessness you exist in. How do you do that? Well, I've already written about that, I'm not one to repeat 2,700~ words I've previously communicated, so instead you can save me from repeating myself and give me some pageviews for the trouble and actually make a change and improve who you are with "monk mode"

Addendum: if your life is too comfortable you'll agree with shit like this/things we say in TRP, and then go back to watching game of thrones, make a sandwich, play some xbox, jerk off, read some internet, contemplate the things you read earlier feel too lethargic, go "naaaah" watch some more TV and then fall asleep. If your life is too comfortable you need to make yourself more uncomfortable or you will betray yourself and not give yourself the self-improvement that you need to overcome your more long time problems, eg: the fact that pussy is like a solar eclipse or a lunar landing for you rather than part of a healthy and varied psychosocial diet. Then there is the fact you have a crushingly low self-esteem/lack of confidence (typical in men nowadays) because you're not getting what you want out of life. If that sounds like you, welcome to the red pill, read a lot but don't stop at reading, it's the beginning but it's not enough, most of all you must fucking do something with yourself AND STOP BEING COMFORTABLE - IF YOU'RE COMFORTABLE YOU WON'T IMPROVE YOURSELF YOU'LL GET LAZY.

magical_artist · 2014-06-03T22:14:32+00:00

Brutal stuff. I am realizing my GF has showed a lot less desire for me over our time together, and that makes me wonder about long term viability.

I don't want to be in a monogamous relationship, if my only sexual partner hardly is interested, inclined, or passionate about sex.

Redpill is like an onion. Many layers to peel and unravel.

RojoEscarlata · 2014-06-03T18:51:43+00:00

On attraction, one thing that opened my eyes was how women don't ask me anymore if I have a condom.

Back in my beta pua/sedditor time I used to pull a lot, but never really got to that point of real attraction, where women are so fucking horny, turned on and infatuated by you that they are willing (they want) to getting raw doged.

Or maybe I'm just a romantic.

vox_veritas · 2014-06-03T21:39:46+00:00

Great post, dude. I see so many people getting hung up on their partner count or the frequency of lays. First of all, sex shouldn't be the measuring stick. But more importantly, you have to consider why you're getting sex. Women provide sex for a reason -- it isn't random. Is she providing it because you give her tingles and she's interested in the sex itself? Or is she providing it because she is looking for you to provide for her or keep you in line to keep you as an orbiter? I would encourage people to evaluate their recent sexual encounters and really be self-critical in evaluating the events that led to the encounter with respect to why the sex happened.

laere · 2014-06-03T17:55:11+00:00

Daily reminder that the number one person in the world that matters is YOU.

YOU and ONLY YOU are the prize that women want. Work on yourself as a human being, and pussy will follow.

Stay vigilant.

defallama · 2014-06-03T19:24:28+00:00

NEW lurker but gdammit after reading the post and some of the comments I am definitely going to read up on all this red pill shit

hashtagpound2point2 · 2014-06-03T17:33:55+00:00

If you have to entice a woman with gifts or affection to have sex with you, she's just throwing you a bone when she does eventually have sex with you. If she can't have sex with you just for the sake of having sex, she's not having a great time doing it (with you).

JGH8763 · 2014-06-04T00:09:04+00:00

Your post reminds me of a few of Julien Blanc's (RSD) videos. He talks about how he'll do anything to get laid, even beg. He'll use any tactic that works, no matter how beta it may seem. If it works, it works. He's one of the most sexually successful people I know of. As long as the sex is good quality, the women will keep coming back. If you convince her to give you pity sex, then fuck her better than James Deen would, she'll keep coming back, and she'll tell her friends, and they'll all want to fuck you. I see your point, but ultimately, being good at sex is what's going to make a woman "desire" you in the way you're referring. A guy with a high degree of LMS, a guy who conforms to all of the suggested behavior patterns TRP advises, is not going to be nearly as desired as a man who fucks her like a porn star, a man who gives her the highest quality sex of her life, regardless of how he initially got her to fuck him.

Homestaff17 · 2014-06-04T09:15:10+00:00

Being too busy, too successful, and too awesome to waste a single second trying to impress a woman is, ironically, impressive to women.

The Red Pill epitomised.

ljubebanjeglav · 2014-06-05T01:59:50+00:00

"And you can’t negotiate desire. There’s no amount of time, gifts, compliments, attention, validation, or favors you can trade to receive desire. In fact, the very attempt to make such a transaction kills desire. Trying to win a woman’s attraction is failing before you begin."

Exactly.

Or how the great French philosophical duo Deleuze and Guattari put:

"Desire knows nothing of exchange, it only knows theft and gift".

Just to share a thought with you guys, I've been thinking about this sentence a lot lately and the thing, I think it's Rollo's, that you can't negotiate desire. Namely I was thinking that there is a way to think "sexual economy" and desire not in terms of reciprocal equivalent exchange, but more in terms of theft and gift. And this conceptual duo theft/ gift can be sexuated so that the sexual difference passes through it, namely that theft is on the male side, and gift on the female. Remember the often repeated lamentation of women, described in many variations in songs about "the thief" who "stole her hearth". Or the expression that the woman "gives herself to a man". I know that there is a book by another French philosopher Jacques Derrida "Spurs, Nietzsche's Styles" about Nietzsche's conception of women and the feminine, and his understanding of sexual difference that is precisely formulated in these terms theft/ gift that I just shortly described. So, the thought in the end isn't even mine, I stole it!

I remember also the work of an anthropologist Marcel Mauss "The Gift", that precisely claims that the economy (under this falls the "exchange of women") in primitive, savage societies functions more in terms of gift and theft, then in terms of an equivalent market exchange (and then market exchange isn't natural, it didn't exist always as Adam Smith thought and it isn't the natural way of exchange for man, if there is one). And also I was thinking if we go on to formulate the sexual economy in this way, what are it's ramifications for Redpill theory, who mainly uses market exchange as it's primary model (the sexual market and so fort).

I still don't know what to think of it, I'm still struck by a thought whose consequences I have yet to discern.

[deleted] · 2014-06-03T20:27:47+00:00

knows she’s not getting a long term relationship and marriage out of the deal. She just wants sex, with an awesome man. She desires him. That’s sexual success.

I'd say the vast majority of women secretly wish to snag this desireable man down in a long term relationship, hoping their vagina will be the vagina to make him stay with her.

frankiejholden · 2014-06-03T22:24:20+00:00

I realised about 6 months ago, that my wifes friends wanting to fuck me was a sign of my success as a man.

SovietRaptor · 2014-06-03T22:27:45+00:00

This makes it sound like good sex and a good relationship are completely mutually exclusive. What do you think about that OP?

FinnianWhitefir · 2014-06-03T22:42:41+00:00

Yes. To sum up, many betas believe sex is bad, women don't want it, you have to do something for them to get them to have sex with you, and that corrupts your self-esteem and makes women the prize.

Instead it is realistic and treats women as actual people to take on a "Sex is good, women want to have sex, become the kind of man that women will want to have sex with".

donit · 2014-06-03T21:38:21+00:00

The measure of an eloquent, vivid post worth archiving.

OrpheusV · 2014-06-04T05:01:50+00:00

An interesting paradox, isn't it? Not focusing on sex being key to getting a ton of it.

If nothing else, this post only confirmed that I should just focus on myself and improve above everyone else. I have a girlfriend, just need to come up with something awesome to do this week. Ideas?

bradyo2 · 2014-06-04T08:27:23+00:00

/u/archwinger You're fast becoming my favourite poster on this sub.

I'm seeing this post as a kick up the arse. I was starting to settle back into a less RP version of myself, and not surprisingly, starting to fail. I'm going to turn up the heat now though.

[deleted] · 2014-06-04T13:23:30+00:00

And you can’t negotiate desire. There’s no amount of time, gifts, compliments, attention, validation, or favors you can trade to receive desire. In fact, the very attempt to make such a transaction kills desire. Trying to win a woman’s attraction is failing before you begin.

I'm in a relationship, even married by now and THIS is true! This is the TRUEST Sentence in all of RedPill. Whoever reads this and is not sure about TRP - Archwinger is a 100 % correct on this point.

You can not "win" a Womans affection, it must flow to you freely, either by you being handsome, fit or doing cool stuff, but you can't "buy" a Woman. There, I said it. Feminists are very right on that point. You can not buy a Woman!

Buy her roses > WON'T win her affection. Handle yourself well in a situation > WILL WIN her affection (For example)

CarlsPudding · 2014-06-04T15:20:51+00:00

Thank you. This is exactly what I'm always trying to explain. This is what I come to TRP for. Not all this bio evolutionary theory crap or bitter posts about feminists (though they are amusing). This.

You are exactly fucking correct. I got laid plenty without TRP. I'm not a spineless neckbeard loser in a fedora, and never have been. I was always happy with all the female attention I got, because I didn't recognize the fact that I was their plan B. The marrying kind. And I would fall right into it, and then have to be the one to break their poor little hearts.

That was the hardest pill to swallow, and that's what I've been choking on over the past year. I would rather not get laid than continue being a fucking chump for these women. Thank you.

dancingwithcats · 2014-06-03T23:18:55+00:00

Sorry, but wrong. The ultimate goal isn't just sex, and it's not just having sex with a woman who doesn't expect anything but sex. The goal is to find a mate. Some of us are lucky enough to find a girl who understands the differences between men and women but who can be a good partner in life. I feel rather sorry for men who think the goal is just to find women to fuck without expectation. I'll get downvoted for this, but I really do find it to be a bit pathetic. Sure, the fucking of multiple women is fun. It's part of the growing up process that some men go through. To stall there and not consider that one of those women might be a potential partner in life is pathetic though. Go ahead. Drain my karma :)

EDIT: To elaborate, if that's really all you're after then fine, but you're missing out. Finding a true partner of the opposite sex is a wonderful thing, and it doesn't detract from your 'alphaness'. It enhances it. There is a reason why the majority of men who are successful in life have significant others. We enhance each other when it's right.

JayStyles15 · 2014-06-04T00:24:45+00:00

so in todays youth society (15-19) desire is also what will drive women to want you or is there some special type of thing that I need to try

[deleted] · 2014-06-04T10:45:48+00:00

i need to print this So that i will read it evry Day. this gives evryone à life direction

tony_douglas · 2014-06-04T17:45:03+00:00

dude this is so on point ... if we didnt care if girls were attracted to us, most men would just go live on the beach somewhere in costa rica or brazil and fuck hot escorts all the time

the validation is surreptitious... we know its beta to want it, but validation is what makes the alpha the alpha

I recently had some slight cosmetic work done, and its completely changing the way I am perceived. It really is a mindfuck when girls start feeling up your muscles and stuff unprovoked, not because of your body, but because of your chin and jaw line.

ie my body didnt change... but its perceived to have gotten stronger because of my chin

Zanford · 2014-06-06T20:11:11+00:00

Bam. For me, the biggest gain of RP has been the quaLity of sex (crazy shrieking orgasms from her, no resistance to swallowing or anal, lots of BDSM, sexts and nude pics, whatver I want). QuaNtity gain has been less dramatic since I usually had LTRs anyway with sex basically on tap (but less freaky shit, and I wouldn't f*** her as hard.)

Since RP the number and intensity of orgasms I've given girls has gonne waaay up (even tho I never do fingering or cunnilingus). Honestly my plates have seen as much benefit from RP as I have.

PlusGoody · 2014-06-04T00:25:12+00:00

Could not disagree more.

Caring about being desired is just a special case of popularity seeking, as beta as can be. Men of substance obtain women through the attraction of status and don't give a moment's thought to whether she'd prefer someone taller or more athletic or cooler. They don't allow dead bedrooms because they are gone the second a woman tries to pull that. They fully respect her choice and then next her without hesitation.

RPL23 · 2014-06-03T23:31:02+00:00

and saved.

this is gold.

jkonine · 2014-06-03T18:35:02+00:00

Sounds like a kind of miserable existence though..

[deleted] · 2014-06-03T21:02:03+00:00

Upvoted for the last sentence

Title	The measure of sexual success is desire
Author	Archwinger
Upvotes	355
Comments	112
Date	June 3, 2014 3:38 PM UTC (8 years ago)
Subreddit	/r/TheRedPill
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/TheRedPill/the-measure-of-sexual-success-is-desire.16220 https://theredarchive.com/post/16220
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/TheRedPill/comments/277iun/the_measure_of_sexual_success_is_desire/