TheRedArchive

~ archived since 2018 ~

Bernouttheday Archive

View 1 post and 270 comments by Bernouttheday on TheRedPill subreddit and various other subreddits related to The Red Pill community.
Search in:
In subreddits:
More
Filter by year/month:
Upvotes Comment on Subreddit Date (UTC)
–

Early courtship and established relationship are different vibes/experiences. You don’t jump through hoops in the same way in a relationship and you deal with less ambiguity. Moreover a lot of what drives that early courtship stage is a certain kind of novelty, and if you aren’t motivated by novelty, doing that over and over again can become a chore. The comparisons to a job interview hold because there are nebulous expectations and the hope of a positive outcome (sex isn’t the only positive out…
/r/PurplePillDebate04/08/26 03:07 PM
1

Mindful, principled, funny, kind and considerate.
/r/PurplePillDebate04/08/26 03:48 AM
1

Are you making the argument that women don't bully men? Appearance isn't the only vector for someone to give you shit. Obviously it's awful that that woman received those comments, also this is the internet. Are you really going to sit there are pretend that a legion of Swifties aren't waiting to launch a hate campaign and tell her exes to kill themselves?
/r/PurplePillDebate02/08/26 08:03 AM
2

What example of an ugly lady? Was that an argument you were having with someone else? We disagree about whether the woman was strung along which I contend that she was not because she did not communicate her expectations/desires. If she had or he had promised something I would agree that he strung her along. Without that, she projecting and expecting him to read minds. Saying you disagree with me on this point will not make me agree with you. I call her entitled because she took an unspoken outc…
/r/PurplePillDebate02/08/26 07:39 AM
1

Okay, I’ll acknowledge that OP is off the mark and using a lot of thought terminating cliches while soft pawing for permission to be irritated. Can you elaborate on your specific measures?
/r/PurplePillDebate02/08/26 07:07 AM
1

What measures? You say we regurgitate memes but you can't give a direct answer to a question. Again, I'm not saying men don't degrade women, but you've waylaid this conversation into "men lead women on" and "Men are worse." You aren't addressing Simps like OP did. You haven't really answered any of my questions beyond "men bad, men worse." I ask you by what measure and you say "I have measures." You degree of confidence seems indirectly proportional to your demonstrated ability to self reflect s…
/r/PurplePillDebate02/08/26 06:17 AM
1

By what measure?
/r/PurplePillDebate02/08/26 04:16 AM
2

How does establishing terms of engagement derail the discussion?
/r/PurplePillDebate02/08/26 03:47 AM
2

I didn’t say that men don’t radicalize women. I said women radicalize men too. Again, a fundamentally different argument. There are men out there who are absolute animals, and there’s no shortage of guys who are just idiots. There are women out there who are garbage human beings, and there are plenty of women out there who are just actively messy. Both of the preceding statements are true. One being true does not preclude the other, if anything each dovetails into the other. If we can’t acknowle…
/r/PurplePillDebate02/08/26 03:26 AM
2

It would be cruel if he did. Are these ppd posts your frame of reference and basis for comparison? Is that what you’re trying to communicate?
/r/PurplePillDebate02/08/26 03:14 AM
1

He didn’t string her along. How many guys do you think you’ve radicalized into misogyny?
/r/PurplePillDebate02/08/26 03:12 AM
3

Why are you gaslighting me about that debate? I wasn’t defending a guy’s right to string someone along. I was saying he didn’t string her along. Those are two fundamentally different arguments
/r/PurplePillDebate02/08/26 03:03 AM
1

We still fundamentally disagree about this discussion but thanks for introducing another example of you frontloading a conclusion and expecting others to backfill for you. Everyone isn’t going to have the same emotional experience or perspective as you do. If you want to create a bridge then you have to be able to meet them where they are. I didn’t write anything in that post that I don’t still think today, nothing I’d feel inclined to apologize for. I imagine you’d say the same for your part, e…
/r/PurplePillDebate02/08/26 03:01 AM
-1

It’s a simple bias. Men are more capable of inflicting physical harm, this is repeatedly observable. Once we start moving into the psychological and emotional that delta isn’t as deep as you seem to think.
/r/PurplePillDebate02/08/26 02:56 AM
1

Follow up questions: how much if that is your algorithm? How often do you explore other perspectives or modalities? Are you uncomfortable with challenging and reexamining this thing you take for granted?
/r/PurplePillDebate02/08/26 02:54 AM
-2

Evidence that men are cruel to women is not evidence that women aren’t cruel to men. If you are pushing the view point that men do this and women don’t you’re going to have to try a bit harder.
/r/PurplePillDebate02/08/26 02:48 AM
2

That’s half an answer. How do you know and what’s your basis for comparison?
/r/PurplePillDebate02/08/26 02:46 AM
4

How do you know it’s the vast majority of men? What’s your source and what’s your basis for comparison? You seem to be awful comfortable with broad sweeping generalizations.
/r/PurplePillDebate02/08/26 02:23 AM
0

Which women don’t speak this way about men? A non insignificant number of women are actively disparaging (just look at a lot of posts during men’s mental health month.) Again, I’m not excusing anyone’s behavior. I’m just suggesting that we try to examine things a bit more holistically instead of just pointing the finger.
/r/PurplePillDebate02/08/26 02:13 AM
2

Do women radicalize men into misogyny? Do misogynistic men perhaps radicalize women into misandry?
/r/PurplePillDebate02/08/26 02:05 AM
3

One hand washes the other when it comes to parties radicalizing each other. I’m not making excuses for anyone or saying we can’t do better but in the interest of improving our context it might be best to stop passing the buck, or at the very least it would help if we could separate fault from responsibility.
/r/PurplePillDebate02/08/26 01:54 AM
12

I mean, being a decent human doesn’t necessarily help them find a partner. It won’t necessarily hurt them either but “just be a decent person” is a hop, skip and jump from “but I was nice”
/r/PurplePillDebate28/07/26 11:22 PM
–

I won’t say never but if I’m with someone I probably find her attractive as is and I don’t like the look of lip fillers or botox. Honestly, smile lines are a beautiful thing.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/07/26 10:12 PM
5

Why not just be honest and discerning?
/r/PurplePillDebate25/07/26 07:01 PM
1

Sure, I agree, as long as everyone holds themselves accountable. I think for this to work though, a lot of people are going to need to take a long look at the things they take for granted.
/r/PurplePillDebate25/07/26 11:02 AM
–

I agree that informed consent should be our hard default. How is it informed if we don't talk about our expectations and desires?
/r/PurplePillDebate25/07/26 10:39 AM
–

"we're not in court. Human's relationship doesn't work like that and everyone knows it." This is true, but consensus reality requires us to be able to triangulate otherwise we're just talking past each other. The inclination to say "Obviously X should have known Y" is a slippery one, if understandable. In the context of a friendship (given that platonic relationships don't make us as acutely vulnerable as intimate relationships do) typically lines are drawn once a transgression, or more general …
/r/PurplePillDebate25/07/26 10:36 AM
–

I think he had performance issues and they mutually decided not to continue. Continuing to have sex in that case might have reflected more a feeling of obligation than manipulation on his part given that she was already ready to go. I understand that someone pretending to want something when you don't is an issue. The burden of proof is another matter entirely, how would you know that a guy was pretending as opposed to having changed his mind? Also, given how nebulous and vibes-based courtship g…
/r/PurplePillDebate25/07/26 10:27 AM
–

I'm glad we agree that a guy can revoke consent. I think the issue that pops up is that there's a default assumption of manipulation. If a woman immediately concludes that she's been used because a guy didn't want to stick around after they slept together it fundamentally rules out the possibility that he changed his mind, which is why the revocation of consent factors into these discussions. It's very hard to determine whether someone pretended to want something or they thought they did and the…
/r/PurplePillDebate25/07/26 09:28 AM
–

If he directly promised something, you have a case. If she assumed he would, it's a bit more murky. Consent to a relationship can still be revoked (let's say you see another, less appealing, side of her personality after) but there are absolutely guys out there that will say whatever the woman wants to hear to get where they are trying to go. The false premises thing is a bit weird though just because in early dating stages most people are sending out their representative rather than their full …
/r/PurplePillDebate25/07/26 09:13 AM
–

So, outside of a context where a guy promises to be with her/get married, what false facts have been presented? Also, if consent can be revoked for any reason, why can't the guy revoke consent? He might not even be out to be deceptive. Sometimes post-nut clarity hits you like a brick. e/ typo
/r/PurplePillDebate25/07/26 08:55 AM
–

There's plenty of room between being a doormat and being abrasive. You don't have to stay friends with her. You don't have to pretend to be thrilled. It's probably best not to vilify or guilt her though. If your costs are sunk then you also have to own up to the fact that you fell for the fallacy. e/ typo
/r/PurplePillDebate25/07/26 08:51 AM
1

There are best practices when it comes to forming pre nups, not least of which is that each partner should have their own legal representation present.
/r/PurplePillDebate25/07/26 08:46 AM
2

People are still accountable for the choices they make in both cases. If you don’t like the “default prenup,” I don’t know why you think a union would be more effective than one drafted by a couple of trained attorneys.
/r/PurplePillDebate25/07/26 12:21 AM
3

If the law itself was a pre nups there wouldn’t be a need for pre nups. Making things explicit rather than defaulting to litigation and acrimony seems pretty prudent. If someone chooses to be a SAHM, it must seem like a good deal to them when they make that choice. They don’t have to get married. They don’t have to stop working.
/r/PurplePillDebate24/07/26 11:42 PM
1

How would both parents be SAHMs? Would the union bylaws cover their arrangements? The assumption that they can just out and get jobs is a bold one but it’s possible. If a bunch of women flood the job market at the same time, they probably won’t all be able to find employment in a timely fashion, especially while striking. Ostensibly Dad could take care of the kids but depending on the explicit division of labor (given that the union would make things more explicit) more than likely you’d be puni…
/r/PurplePillDebate24/07/26 11:14 PM
5

Pre nups aren’t mandated by law and all pre nups aren’t created equal (ask Paul McCartney.) Also, with so much being concerning why not just avoid being a SAHM?
/r/PurplePillDebate24/07/26 11:08 PM
2

Wouldn’t that be covered by a pre nup?
/r/PurplePillDebate24/07/26 10:56 PM
3

Non-men, are lesbian SAHM excluded? Also is capacity going to be an issue in this case? For the friends and family that would be housing these women, is there an assumption of recompense? Will the children be expected to go as well? Is there an obligation in place for the non-sahm friends to house them?
/r/PurplePillDebate24/07/26 10:49 PM
6

Other women in the union? If all of them are striking and leaving their homes, where will they stay?
/r/PurplePillDebate24/07/26 10:41 PM
3

Where would they stay in the event of a general strike?
/r/PurplePillDebate24/07/26 10:37 PM
8

How would SAHMs pay union dues?
/r/PurplePillDebate24/07/26 10:34 PM
17

What do women bring to the table: On an emergent level (speaking very broadly) in a heterosexual context: we’ve been socialized differently and for better or worse those differences in socialization can complement each other in a significant way. The benefits of a healthy, loving, mutually supportive, mutually respectful relationship are exponential. This quality of life isn’t something I can build on my own. With that being said, the inverse is also true. The wrong woman will fuck my shit up mu…
/r/PurplePillDebate23/07/26 04:23 PM
3

Those women are showing skin. It doesn’t mean fake lips and botox are preferred. It doesn’t even mean fake tits preferred. It means we see boobs and flat/tones stomachs. We would still prefer that without silicone and facial paralysis.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/07/26 10:29 PM
3

The trash that she took for granted. New question: why do you need him to be trash? Is this scenario mirroring a personal anxiety? Are you worried that someone will get close to you and decide not to commit? What if you like their mom, would that be devastating?
/r/PurplePillDebate22/07/26 01:39 PM
3

She got whatever attracted her to him in the first place, whether it was good times, the attention of a charming man, he probably took her on dates etc. It was a yes or no question, can you answer?
/r/PurplePillDebate22/07/26 01:33 PM
3

Each of them took the other for granted. You still haven’t answered the question.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/07/26 01:29 PM
2

It is infantilizing women to say that she shouldn’t have to communicate and he should just know.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/07/26 01:00 PM
4

You didn’t answer the question. Can you accept that different people take different things for granted?
/r/PurplePillDebate22/07/26 12:59 PM
4

This conclusion still presumes a mono culture. Can you accept that different people take different things for granted?
/r/PurplePillDebate22/07/26 03:20 AM
2

You're still painting with a broad swath. Stop trying to infantilize women. If you want something, speak up.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/07/26 03:19 AM
5

If they're more conservative they're more likely to slut shame than call the woman a victim. This still doesn't address the fact that people who grew up under different circumstances are likely to take different things for granted.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/07/26 02:39 AM
1

So if his mom happens to stop by while you're there, he's serious? What makes this the threshold?
/r/PurplePillDebate22/07/26 02:37 AM
1

Define reasonable.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/07/26 12:18 AM
6

He doesn’t need an excuse if he’s unaware. People come from different cultural backgrounds and take different things for granted. You’re applying a one way standard without much of leg to stand on.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/07/26 12:18 AM
1

We were talking about the general dating market, these are all things that hypothetical “she” should be mindful of. If she hasn’t communicated and he hasn’t verbally promised anything (no “it’s implied”) he isn’t stringing her along. e/spacing
/r/PurplePillDebate22/07/26 12:05 AM
7

He isn’t stringing her along if he isn’t aware. She’s projecting. “He should know” is not an excuse to project.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/07/26 12:04 AM
6

I’m not giving a false impression, she’s projecting. If she can’t be bothered to communicate directly, she doesn’t have a case. It doesn’t matter how hurt she is. “Hey can we talk,” would do crazy work to support your argument. If that’s too much for her to bear, he isn’t the problem.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/07/26 12:00 AM
2

Well, for one thing, if you can’t communicate effectively you’re liable to struggle in the dating marketplace anyway. If you’re a prize to be won, I don’t know why you think someone looking at you as a prize is going to care much about what you think. Prizes wait at the end of challenges, if I’ve won you already what kind of consideration are you expecting? No one is saying you have to sleep with anyone. As a matter of fact: if you don’t want to have sex, don’t have sex. Pregnancy is absolutely …
/r/PurplePillDebate21/07/26 11:50 PM
3

It’s not disingenuous and here’s why: If I’m dating someone for a month or a year, we’re going to fall into certain rhythms. We will have micro concerns and we will have macro concerns as determined by our individual idiosyncrasies and life in general. Part of feeling comfortable with someone involves a certain degree of taking things for granted BUT if a specific change or progression is expected and not discussed then the person doing the expecting is moving from a place of presumed indulgence…
/r/PurplePillDebate21/07/26 11:45 PM
2

A woman’s orgasm is just collateral then. And if she lies there like a dead fish he should thank his lucky stars because she’s not an active participant but a receptacle… I begin to understand why a man might not want to marry into this framework.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/07/26 10:38 PM
5

Wait, if I just go through my normal day to day I’m stringing someone along? What is my presumed obligation? How reasonable is it to expect someone to read your mind?
/r/PurplePillDebate21/07/26 10:36 PM
1

Including sexual acts from men to women? Let’s assume the guy is good in bed for this hypothetical, is he giving a gift as well?
/r/PurplePillDebate21/07/26 10:34 PM
3

He didn’t string her along, he just went about his day as normal.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/07/26 10:33 PM
3

It’s not an excuse. You’re just wrong about this. He didn’t do anything, there’s nothing to make an excuse for.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/07/26 10:09 PM
0

That is a risk to calculate but has no bearing on whether or not she should communicate her hopes and expectations.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/07/26 09:56 PM
3

Or, they grew up under different punches in different households, maybe even under different social strata and it’s a bad idea to treat your significant other as a concept rather than an individual. He has to take the same things for granted for your argument to hold, but you don’t seem all that interested in his mental state. It just has to be a certain way.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/07/26 09:54 PM
1

This is a starfish’s perspective. Sex can be a lot of fun and mutually gratifying. It can genuinely deepen a bond between people. It also does a lot to destress. If you’re lying back and treating it like something you suffer through for the other party, something definitely needs to be adjusted. Also, unless you’re playing the part of a dominatrix, telling someone they should be grateful to have sex with you is a wild take.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/07/26 09:52 PM
6

I think that assessment is dehumanizing. Stringing someone along can be a passive thing, but it does require some measure of awareness and/or intent. It’s entirely possible that he was going through his day to day unaware of what was going through her mind. This becomes way more likely if she can’t be bothered to communicate.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/07/26 09:48 PM
1

So following this logic, if a woman is a prize, she’s a thing to be objectified and earned, right?
/r/PurplePillDebate21/07/26 09:41 PM
6

I’m not arguing that he’s justified in stringing her along. I’m arguing that he never was. If she’s painting a picture in her head and expecting him to fall into line without communicating/inquiring, not only is she setting herself up for frustration, she’s also kind of dehumanizing him.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/07/26 09:35 PM
1

Sex is a gift… Does this imply that women are prizes to be won? Should he put niceness points in? I mean I didn’t realize that every sexually active woman was performing charity. How magnanimous.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/07/26 09:30 PM
6

When did they have a conversation about expectations? Why is he expected to lead it? Why can’t she ask?
/r/PurplePillDebate21/07/26 09:29 PM
1

Or it was out of sight and out of mind. Also, can we stop treating sex in this situation like something that’s happening to her rather than something she’s an active participant in?
/r/PurplePillDebate21/07/26 09:13 PM
7

Diabolical implies intent or at the very least callous disregard. Callous disregard presupposes awareness. If she hasn’t communicated her intentions/expectations clearly and directly and he hasn’t promised anything, he hasn’t done anything wrong. If she’s hurt it’s because expectations collided with reality and she wasn’t intentional in her pursuit.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/07/26 09:12 PM
1

I was asking for clarification and I agree with you on the young love point, granted when I brought that up before I was referring to the beginning of his post. Thank you for clarifying.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/07/26 07:44 PM
3

How was he intentional?
/r/PurplePillDebate21/07/26 06:51 PM
1

Is that wrong of him?
/r/PurplePillDebate21/07/26 06:50 PM
8

You said that he was diabolical. You’re treating him like some sort of nefarious manipulator when there was more than likely just a mismatch in expectation.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/07/26 06:50 PM
5

Lying by omission still requires a degree of intentionality. You have to willingly mislead the other party. She didn’t make her intentions and expectations known. It could be argued that he never really had the opportunity to lie by omission given that she just expected things to happen.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/07/26 06:32 PM
8

Is one of us more responsible than the other in this particular hypothetical? Is it possible that she led herself on?
/r/PurplePillDebate21/07/26 06:30 PM
1

Sometimes multiple people can be stupid, sure.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/07/26 06:30 PM
1

Mostly hers, but sure.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/07/26 06:25 PM
1

Unless he promised something or she asked and he said he wanted to, I don’t think he led her on.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/07/26 06:24 PM
2

Entitlement literally means you take something for granted, that you feel owed. If she didn’t say anything and he didn’t promise anything and she blows her top, she is the red flag.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/07/26 06:23 PM
9

I could find myself in a relationship with a woman going day by day. Days can turn to weeks, weeks can turn to months, months can turn to years. Given that we have lives outside of each other, the passage of time might surprise us. If she doesn’t directly communicate desire or intention for marriage I won’t think I’ve been stringing her along or misleading.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/07/26 06:21 PM
2

The woman moving with that sense of entitlement without clear communication is a red flag. Are women that string men along abusers?
/r/PurplePillDebate21/07/26 06:18 PM
1

It is entirely possible to care about someone and occasionally wish they would shut up, ask anyone with younger siblings. Men will blame women for ignoring red flags, which is admittedly a prickly conversation because a lot of guys ignore red flags too (“I can fix her”.) Not wanting to marry someone isn’t abuse. If you are going to categorize misleading someone as abuse there is a burden of proof and intentionality, otherwise you are actively asking us to infantilize the woman in this scenario.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/07/26 06:09 PM
1

Even a lie by omission requires a degree of intentionality. He can care about her and still show up while still being neutral about long term plans. The burden of proof requires that you show that he intentionally misled her, whether by omission or direct misrepresentation of his intentions. Being there is not a signal of intention for marriage.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/07/26 05:40 PM
1

I think deception requires intentionality though I suppose it’s also good for men to read responses like yours so they can better identify red flags.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/07/26 05:29 PM
2

I’m not villainizing her, I’m challenging your villainization of him. For all I know, she’s just ignorant. If you don’t need to outright lie to someone to deceive them, was she being dishonest by expecting something more than casual? I mean if he was just going with the flow, why wouldn’t she make her intentions known? Is that fair to him?
/r/PurplePillDebate21/07/26 04:54 PM
2

Introducing family isn’t always a formal thing and doesn’t necessarily mean you intend to get serious. Sometimes your parents live nearby and pop in. I don’t think he strung her along. She just had unvoiced expectations. “Most men aren’t good” is a fascinating take, and while it’s tempting to hold up a mirror to show women’s behavior (broad generalization, I know women aren’t a monolith) it seems more productive to point out that, beyond a certain point, bitterness is a choice. Hell, OP worked t…
/r/PurplePillDebate21/07/26 04:49 PM
1

Someone meeting your family doesn’t guarantee marriage and months slip into years all the time. He didn’t promise anything.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/07/26 04:29 PM
1

Did he say he wanted to marry this ex? Why would she assume?
/r/PurplePillDebate21/07/26 04:27 PM
0

That’s a fair distinction and I may have been reading into something that wasn’t there. It could be argued that the high school experience (“young love”) does have an expiration but I would still say that the woman’s biological clock has a harder deadline.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/07/26 04:26 PM
2

Did he tell her he wanted to marry her? Why would she assume that as a default if they hadn’t talked about it? So much of courtship and many relationships is indirect and vibes based, why is he the only one expected to perform the emotional labor of direct communication? Why are we infantilizing her?
/r/PurplePillDebate21/07/26 04:24 PM
0

What if he wants marriage but he’s (initially at least) unsure if he wants it with her? There’s no such thing as perfect and every relationship brings with it a certain amount of compromise. Also people change over time. The marriage minded partner might hit a pocket of circumstances that make them more libertine. The party animal might come to crave stability.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/07/26 04:18 PM
0

Why does that place the onus of communicating expectations on him?
/r/PurplePillDebate21/07/26 04:15 PM
3

Mutual respect and effective communication are pretty crucial.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/07/26 04:13 PM
4

100% agree. A lot of people think this is too forward in early stages but midterm slips into longterm without anyone noticing.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/07/26 03:16 PM
1

Why is he accountable in this case? If he’s taking it day by day he’s probably not willfully misleading her and consent can be withdrawn at any time. There are probably tons of guys who do want to marry their ltr before a certain puzzle piece clicks into place.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/07/26 03:14 PM
–

I’m not sure that I’d say I’m part of the manosphere. There’s a not insignificant number of cases where a guy is in what he thinks is a loving relationship only to find out that it’s a relationship of convenience. These are dynamics directly experienced and also observed and they can embitter someone. Every woman with a past isn’t necessarily in a relationship of convenience with the boring guy. A lot of them genuinely love their guy, people can grow. The issue with a lot of buzz words and pop p…
/r/PurplePillDebate19/07/26 04:29 PM
–

If you love him and both of you are happy in your marriage, the choice you made is the correct choice.
/r/PurplePillDebate19/07/26 04:16 PM
–

Those are observations. For example: I’m not a cat person. Don’t want cats in my home. I will hear everything from “you must have an issue with boundaries/be controlling” to “you’re not yet a cat person” but I know that if I’m getting to know someone and potentially interested in her, her being a cat mom will at least give me pause. People shaming me over not wanting cats in my house is not going to make me want cats in my house. I am perfectly fine with someone who would try to browbeat me into…
/r/PurplePillDebate19/07/26 02:16 AM
–

You can have any preference you want. Just remember that you exist in an observable state and people are going to make observations. If you’re a hypocrite, you’re likely to get called out for it. Just like any feeling is valid by virtue of the fact that you feel it, you’re allowed a large variety of preferences. We just exist in a world where a lot of people might have something to say.
/r/PurplePillDebate19/07/26 02:07 AM
–

If they’re lamenting the friendzone it’s probably a big deal to them. They likely have some growing up to do but that doesn’t mean they aren’t genuinely in a state of distress. The person putting them in that zone doesn’t owe them reciprocation but denying that they feel/ get to feel that way is one of many roads that lead to bitterness and inceldom.
/r/PurplePillDebate18/07/26 11:25 PM
–

“Nice Guys” exist and people tend to conflate failure to launch with the Friend Zone but the disinclination to humanize the other person tends to be pretty disconcerting.
/r/PurplePillDebate18/07/26 10:50 PM
–

You’re not obligated to return their affection, but you do understand that someone being attracted to you doesn’t automatically mean they don’t value you as an individual, right? It’s not a binary thing. Plenty of people “marry their best friend,” and a guy doesn’t have to devalue a woman as a person to find her sexually appealing. e/ spacing
/r/PurplePillDebate18/07/26 10:25 PM
–

Romantic and platonic relationships satisfy different needs. Outside of ace and aro contexts one doesn’t really substitute for the other.
/r/PurplePillDebate16/07/26 04:17 PM
1

The term describes one way attraction between friends and consequent frustration/distress. It’s not gender specific.
/r/PurplePillDebate16/07/26 02:35 PM
1

If they are romantically interested in me, sure. In that case I wouldn’t be the one in the friend zone. For the record, if a woman who is a friend of mine develops romantic feelings that I don’t reciprocate, she would also be in the friend zone. The dynamic persists across these contexts.
/r/PurplePillDebate16/07/26 02:01 PM
1

I’m not interested in guys, so no.
/r/PurplePillDebate16/07/26 01:01 PM
1

Friendzone can exist alongside a rejected friend
/r/PurplePillDebate15/07/26 11:05 PM
1

The Friendzone is a social construct that describes a lived experience of developing unrequited feelings for a friend. It does not mean that you aren’t/weren’t friends. It does not mean that the object of your affections is obligated to return your affections. Saying “it doesn’t exist” doesn’t stop it from existing. “end of” all you want.
/r/PurplePillDebate15/07/26 10:54 PM
1

You are awfully comfortable invalidating someone else’s lived experience. You can be a friend and be in the friendzone. You can be a rejected suitor and be in the friendzone. Plenty of people reject suitors that then become friends. Why do you need these things to be mutually exclusive?
/r/PurplePillDebate15/07/26 10:45 PM
1

Nothing you just said negates the existence of the friendzone
/r/PurplePillDebate15/07/26 10:29 PM
1

The difference between general friendship and “the friend zone” is the presence of one-way intimate/amorous desire. Without the presence of unrequited desire it’s just friendship.
/r/PurplePillDebate15/07/26 10:00 PM
1

If you are a real friend who develops feelings for someone who doesn’t reciprocate, you are in the friendzone. You don’t have to stay there, and I would advise that you don’t. The epiphany that the person you’re attracted to doesn’t want you back in the same way puts you in the friendzone, even if only for a moment.
/r/PurplePillDebate15/07/26 09:00 PM
1

I agree. That doesn’t mean the friendzone doesn’t exist.
/r/PurplePillDebate15/07/26 07:25 PM
1

There is if he sticks around with lingering feelings. This is exacerbated if he holds onto to hope but even with acceptance he ends up there. He can get over it eventually or he can distance himself. The acknowledgment of the existence of the friendzone doesn’t bring with it any sort of obligation but I would still argue that it does exist. If you find yourself there it’s on you to remove yourself or accept the platonic state. If you remove yourself, you’re doing so for you. It’s not about the o…
/r/PurplePillDebate15/07/26 05:38 PM
6

Good morning genocide. Does the “everyone” it will make happier include all of the dead men?
/r/PurplePillDebate15/07/26 02:36 PM
2

There’s overlap but that venn diagram isn’t a circle.
/r/PurplePillDebate15/07/26 12:24 AM
2

A friendship, like any relationship, can end for myriad reasons. If I call someone my friend, I’m likely to mean it but there are absolutely people I used to call friend that I don’t anymore and the inverse is true. Is it difficult to accept that a friendship might cultivate amorous feelings and those amorous feelings can cause distress?
/r/PurplePillDebate15/07/26 12:13 AM
1

Maybe in gay friendships? Women absolutely get friendzoned too, it just manifests in different ways.
/r/PurplePillDebate14/07/26 11:04 PM
1

I don’t think we agree on what the term means. Getting close to someone with the specific intent of starting a relationship or sleeping with them and getting swerved reads as “failure to launch” to me. You can’t be in the friendzone if you were never interested in being someone’s friend.
/r/PurplePillDebate14/07/26 11:02 PM
1

It’s a social construct in that the term “friendzone” has worked its way into common parlance. You say the term and people will have some degree of a preconceived notion as to what you mean. A social construct isn’t limited to an individual case, it’s a cultural meme.
/r/PurplePillDebate14/07/26 11:00 PM
1

I’ll agree that if you decide to stay in the “friendzone”, you’re making choices and need to take responsibility for those choices. How is it not a social construct though? Acknowledgement of the existence of the friendzone doesn’t presume obligation on part of the person placing an individual in it. Consent isn’t compulsory. I tend to advocate a clean break for both parties if possible. There are absolutely cases where someone might put someone in the friendzone and have an interest in keeping …
/r/PurplePillDebate14/07/26 10:53 PM
8

Some people legitimately become friends and catch feelings. They still aren’t owed anything but it seems weird to presume mal intent.
/r/PurplePillDebate14/07/26 10:44 PM
6

Does this comment presume that there are no heterosexual relationships in which the women are happy/satisfied?
/r/PurplePillDebate14/07/26 10:34 PM
2

All words are made up. Who are you to tell someone that their perception of their lived experience “doesn’t really happen”? The friendzone is a social construct, by virtue of being discussed it’s “real” though the meaning of the term is muddied as is the case with most buzz words.
/r/PurplePillDebate14/07/26 10:32 PM
–

Some guys are actively into it, some guys are repulsed by the idea. Plenty won’t care as long as it isn’t super noticeable. I think the thing you have to ask yourself is: are you okay to keep rolling the dice on procedures? It’s not typically a one and done thing and every time you come out you’re going to look a little different, plus there’s the expense and the chance that your body will reject the procedure. A tattoo even has a finish point and those tend to be polarizing as well. Another thi…
/r/PurplePillDebate13/07/26 12:59 AM
2

It could be better phrased as telling the guy to get out of his head and of course it’s important to respect consent but I push back against the idea that people should “just know.” This is doubly true if they don’t live in a formal or homogeneous context. What’s true for one person isn’t necessarily true for another and guidance is generally lacking, unless you count the grifters. For the guy who is very in his head about every bad faith take he’s read/heard online and all of the worst case sce…
/r/PurplePillDebate11/07/26 09:47 PM
4

Where are young men supposed to learn social cues from?
/r/PurplePillDebate11/07/26 01:37 PM
1

“at no point is sex compulsory” can you answer 1-3 of the questions I asked?
/r/PurplePillDebate10/07/26 11:26 PM
1

What classifies emotional intimacy as a need?
/r/PurplePillDebate10/07/26 03:04 AM
3

So, setting aside the broad sweeping generalizations for a moment, (though I do agree that pressure can kill desire) being in an intimate relationship calls for a degree of compromise from each party involved. At no point is sex compulsory, but I’m always suspicious of discussions about things like gender dynamics or emotional labor that don’t acknowledge the speaker’s role in those dynamics. I’ll freely admit that I’m not always the easiest person to deal with. I can be incredibly stubborn. Wit…
/r/PurplePillDebate09/07/26 10:00 PM
1

I wasn’t the first person to accuse someone of being obtuse. You can literally go back through the chain. Why does this have you so tilted?
/r/PurplePillDebate09/07/26 09:33 PM
1

Reported you, though for the record I don’t assume you’re friendless. I just feel sorry for your friends.
/r/PurplePillDebate09/07/26 09:32 PM
1

I think there’s a lot of truth to what you’re saying but I view the numbers game as a sort of brute force approach and I’ve seen plenty of people win that game only to find long standing misery on the other side. If I’m going to run those odds, I might as well shoot the moon.
/r/PurplePillDebate09/07/26 02:14 PM
1

Finding things to do outside of the home that you actually enjoy. You’re more likely to be at ease which can increase feelings of openness and even if nothing comes of it, you haven’t wasted a day/evening. Plus if you do meet someone in that space you’re more likely to have things in common.
/r/PurplePillDebate09/07/26 01:54 PM
1

I’ve got plenty of friends, it’s a wonder that you have any. Pop quiz: what was the comment that immediately preceded you initially calling me “obtuse”? Was it phrased as a question? Were the preceding two sentences phrased as questions? How many of my responses in this chain have featured questions?
/r/PurplePillDebate09/07/26 12:49 PM
1

You continue to prove my point for me. Keep going.
/r/PurplePillDebate09/07/26 12:47 PM
1

You’re employing the tactics of a middle schooler. Grow up a bit before you talk to me about socialization.
/r/PurplePillDebate09/07/26 04:52 AM
1

You’re the one making accusations and refusing to answer questions. Why bother responding?
/r/PurplePillDebate09/07/26 04:51 AM
1

I am aware that this is a possible and perhaps common scenario. I push back against the suggestion that it is the only or most effective approach.
/r/PurplePillDebate09/07/26 03:39 AM
1

I see the crowds as an impediment but I understand that we disagree on a fundamental level here. A crowded room doesn't signify connection to me, if anything I don't think anyone will really be able to hear what anyone else is saying.
/r/PurplePillDebate09/07/26 03:32 AM
1

Did I hit a nerve? Why are you being obtuse?
/r/PurplePillDebate09/07/26 03:30 AM
1

Nice to see you there next to me.
/r/PurplePillDebate09/07/26 02:20 AM
1

The first rule of tautology club is the first rule of tautology club. Also, all interactions with people aren’t the same. A fist fight is an interaction, as is extortion or a visit to the dentist. Can we be intellectually consistent? Do you understand how someone might not enjoy crowded spaces but still enjoy meeting up with people in small groups or one on one? Do small groups not count as interaction?
/r/PurplePillDebate08/07/26 09:05 PM
1

So enjoyment of crowds and crowded places is a prerequisite to a good time then?
/r/PurplePillDebate08/07/26 08:57 PM
1

Is there a common thread that makes a club a club? If so, is it possible that someone is averse to that(those) common thread(s)?
/r/PurplePillDebate08/07/26 08:49 PM
1

How am I being obtuse?
/r/PurplePillDebate08/07/26 08:48 PM
–

I’m answering for me specifically: your hypothetical lacks detail. So with all else being equal there’s an implication that the ltr isn’t healthy and, being mindful of the sunk cost fallacy, it makes sense to me personally to choose the fwb, girlfriend.
/r/PurplePillDebate08/07/26 06:40 PM
1

The Venn Diagram between sex and intimacy isn’t a circle but there’s significant overlap. Your hypothetical didn’t tell us much else about the quality of the relationship or the ostensible fwb relationship. More frequent sex with a girlfriend with the foreknowledge that marrying that girl will directly lead to a reduction in frequency and quality of sex could also just deter me from getting married. Moreover, if we’re extrapolating, the marriage/ltr might not be fulfilling or healthy for reasons…
/r/PurplePillDebate08/07/26 06:23 PM
1

How often is sex a factor in the non marriage case?
/r/PurplePillDebate08/07/26 05:58 PM
1

Because bars and clubs are the only way to socialize and form relationships?
/r/PurplePillDebate08/07/26 01:56 PM
1

I didn’t say all. I’m saying enough of them are that “beautiful, intelligent “ isn’t a goal in itself. I’ve also known plenty of beautiful intelligent women who are a joy to be around. Don’t put words in my mouth. Part of humanizing anyone is acknowledging the capacity for human error.
/r/PurplePillDebate07/07/26 09:45 PM
2

I think we agree that time spent to improve one’s circumstances is generally better spent than time sitting on the couch. Clubs and bars just might not be the best or only way to go about it. It seems incredibly short sighted to present this as something so straight forward. I’ve known plenty of smart beautiful women that are a drain to spend time around and not in the fun way. If this scene is a prerequisite then success may well become a chore.
/r/PurplePillDebate07/07/26 08:40 PM
2

Thanks for holding the space, spending time with you sounds lonely.
/r/PurplePillDebate07/07/26 08:27 PM
1

Let’s say social anxiety goes away and conversational skills improve and they still don’t enjoy being in bars and clubs. Can you hold space for this possibility?
/r/PurplePillDebate07/07/26 08:20 PM
2

You make interesting assumptions
/r/PurplePillDebate07/07/26 08:09 PM
2

Conversational skills are definitely important, that doesn’t mean you’ll enjoy time spent in dive bars. Can you hold space for the possibility that there are people who genuinely don’t enjoy being in clubs and bars, not due to lack of experience but just to due to the fact that the experience of being there is draining and not rewarding?
/r/PurplePillDebate07/07/26 08:09 PM
2

I’ve been out. I used to perform in bars and spent much of my early adulthood looking after drunk people as an RA and later an overnight hostel attendant. This is not a keyboard warrior’s perspective. I don’t tend to enjoy these experiences.
/r/PurplePillDebate07/07/26 07:24 PM
3

Is comparing this to filing taxes really the best argument?
/r/PurplePillDebate07/07/26 07:08 PM
2

These don’t sound all that different nor do they mitigate the dynamics that make this unappealing. Meeting people in the abstract can be good or bad. Meeting people in a place where some measure of intoxication is the expected default doesn’t necessarily increase appeal and treating it as the only or most effective way does seem short sighted.
/r/PurplePillDebate07/07/26 06:59 PM
3

These don’t sound all that different, nor do they mitigate the dynamics that make clubbing unappealing
/r/PurplePillDebate07/07/26 06:54 PM
6

There are games you lose for winning, if I don’t enjoy the thing and successfully get together with someone who enjoys the thing and then suddenly don’t want to keep doing the thing, would I be in the wrong?
/r/PurplePillDebate07/07/26 06:05 PM
4

How many types of “the club” are there? What varieties am I missing?
/r/PurplePillDebate07/07/26 06:04 PM
12

If you don’t drink and don’t enjoy being in those spaces why would you conduct yourself in a way that sets the expectation that will enjoy being in those spaces?
/r/PurplePillDebate07/07/26 05:36 PM
2

Personal experience says we pick our battles but I’ve had to walk on eggshells in multiple relationships so take that with a grain of salt.
/r/PurplePillDebate06/07/26 09:15 PM
3

This sort of thing comes with vibes and guess culture. Sometimes people do change their minds. There is something to be said for the dynamic that takes advantage of paths of least resistance though. Maybe he knows that he isn’t into her and she’s more into to him but both of them want to fuck so why not. Maybe she isn’t into him and she knows he’s into her and he wants to spoil her and she does like being spoiled, so why not? Frustration with these dynamics is a big part of the push for direct c…
/r/PurplePillDebate06/07/26 05:13 PM
3

There are levels to this. On one hand each should partner should be supportive of the other, especially when it comes to things like aspirations (with certain caveats) and times of strain or emotional distress. I do think part of being in a healthy relationship requires each party to be able to call the other on their shit in constructive ways though. If the relationship doesn’t have capacity for that then people tend to end up walking on eggshells and that’s not sustainable.
/r/PurplePillDebate04/07/26 03:06 PM
–

You don’t need to be comfortable with the idea of getting cheated on, you need to be willing to leave.
/r/PurplePillDebate02/07/26 04:38 PM
1

This is a debate though?
/r/PurplePillDebate29/06/26 07:57 PM
–

Well your name definitely fits. I will say that I used to work overnights at a hostel in a part of the city that was big on night life and the number of times that I saw a group of women leave their black out drunk friend on the stoop or the couch in the lobby (and they weren’t even staying there) was mind boggling. In some cases it was the same friend being left. Nevermind the risk of sexual assault, these women were at risk for choking on their own vomit but apparently that wasn’t cause for th…
/r/PurplePillDebate29/06/26 06:52 PM
0

It’s not catastrophic, it’s just a soundbite. People mostly draw issue with her because she’s running on Jada Pinkett energy
/r/PurplePillDebate25/06/26 11:12 PM
7

No
/r/PurplePillDebate25/06/26 07:46 PM
2

If you say so, mind that bias.
/r/PurplePillDebate25/06/26 04:52 PM
3

Throwing an edit on my previous response, I was referring to the top level post, not pending decision. He and I seem to agree. Re your last response: well that it the trap we fall into when we make wide sweeping generalizations. You can trace trends but it helps to mind your own biases.
/r/PurplePillDebate25/06/26 04:47 PM
3

OPs original post lacks dimension, but your response seems willfully obtuse.
/r/PurplePillDebate25/06/26 04:42 PM
2

That doesn’t necessarily mean that they are seeking out women with accomplishments. This isn’t the only or primary vector for attraction. Accolades aren’t short hand for a personality, they don’t tell you what it’s like to spend time with the person. If I marry someone I’m not doing so to impress other people or present a certain level of status. I’m doing so because I love that woman. Odds are that I’m not spending time with her at work so her job doesn’t matter to me so much (re the doctors) a…
/r/PurplePillDebate25/06/26 04:34 PM
3

How many doctors that marry other doctors met in med school or through work? How many rich couples meet through country clubs or at luxury resorts? How much of this is predicated on social situations that these people find themselves in?
/r/PurplePillDebate25/06/26 04:27 PM
8

There are ways to work the problem. If he isn’t open to working alternate solutions then you guys probably weren’t going to work out anyway. If you’re not all that invested or interested then you aren’t. It does seem cruel to tell a guy that you don’t want to be with him because he’s too small though.
/r/PurplePillDebate25/06/26 04:25 PM
2

How much of this is due to exposure though?
/r/PurplePillDebate25/06/26 04:22 PM
5

People getting frustrated with this dynamic has always confused me. Is the assumption that you aren’t supposed to find a stranger attractive? Are you expected to know all there is to know about someone at a glance?
/r/PurplePillDebate25/06/26 04:19 PM
1

Avoids any hot button or potentially controversial topics early on Enunciates the hell out of every word they say. Ambivalence. A quality man must yearn. Isn’t a contrarian, he should not agree with you in a general sense. We are meant to be complementary. Our worldviews should not overlap. Conservative, even if he’s just a little right of center. This should be self explanatory. Sober at all. Booze, barbiturates or horse are fine. No weed though.
/r/PurplePillDebate24/06/26 05:56 PM
8

A woman's disinterest in this space isn't generally expressed directly, especially if we're talking high school or college aged women. "Nice Guy" has been a buzzword for a while now and if a guy has any sense he won't describe himself as such but there are a couple other things we need to address before we lob certain accusations. For one thing: you have the burdens of initiation and performance. People in general (and a lot of guys in particular) are conditioned to earn positive outcomes. This …
/r/PurplePillDebate24/06/26 03:08 PM
2

Part of entering into an intimate relationship with someone is understanding that you aren't just living for yourself, sometimes you'll have to do things you don't want to do or forgo things you do want to do. Unhealthy relationship dynamics abound but mutual consideration and mutual respect are cornerstones of healthy relationship dynamics. You and your partner should absolutely be mindful of your (and each other's) boundaries. If I'm with a woman who has some weird acute trauma around guys who…
/r/PurplePillDebate24/06/26 02:08 AM
1

This is not remotely true. You'll see variance on a case by case basis but do you really think men never compromise in relationships? They never have to hold their tongue or manage their partner's emotional state?
/r/PurplePillDebate24/06/26 02:04 AM
6

Correct me if I'm wrong but I think you're asking for rites of passage (not necessarily the same thing, but there's significant overlap between the two concepts) which do exist in certain cultures and also emerge in some people's family traditions. That being said, something more generalized might be good for young men depending on how it's implemented. If it's done poorly it would probably be a real shit show.
/r/PurplePillDebate17/06/26 02:13 PM
1

What point do you think you're making?
/r/PurplePillDebate17/06/26 01:32 AM
1

If we have no way of knowing then we can't rule it out. Eroticism doesn't just pop up post Enlightenment. Both Gilgamesh and the Tale of Genji were horny as fuck.
/r/PurplePillDebate16/06/26 02:52 PM
3

It sounds like you have trouble examining things from other people's perspectives. If erotic imagery predates written language, why would expect sophistication in early expression? To be fair, maybe it was a self portrait. We can't conclusively say it was or it wasn't. Guys have absolutely beat off to women's self portraits before. One thing being true doesn't preclude the other.
/r/PurplePillDebate16/06/26 02:42 PM
2

What part of my argument had to do with money?
/r/PurplePillDebate16/06/26 02:41 PM
1

Refusal to answer is an answer in itself. Enjoy your Puritan perspective.
/r/PurplePillDebate16/06/26 02:35 PM
2

My worldview would change significantly. From a biological perspective our bodies would have probably evolved along different lines, our infrastructure, if it existed would be massively different. So regarding the worldview we asked about earlier: your turn.
/r/PurplePillDebate16/06/26 02:33 PM
3

Was I the primary intended audience? Do you struggle with object permanence? Does a tiktok brained 30 second clip watching porn afficionado still get turned on by old Playboys or porn from the silent era? Can you examine perspectives outside of your own? I'm not turned on by gay porn, there are plenty of guys that are. Does the fact that it doesn't turn me on make it not porn?
/r/PurplePillDebate16/06/26 02:31 PM
2

You're dodging the question. If you can hold space for the possibility of another perspective for a moment, how much does it threaten your world view?
/r/PurplePillDebate16/06/26 02:29 PM
2

Did it turn on the cave men? Do you know that it didn't?
/r/PurplePillDebate16/06/26 02:24 PM
2

There are no consenting adults under objectification. /s Totally agree with you though.
/r/PurplePillDebate16/06/26 02:22 PM
0

How much do you need this to be true? Phrased differently: how much of your world view is pulled into uncomfortable scrutiny if this isn't true?
/r/PurplePillDebate16/06/26 02:21 PM
1

"Taxes are stealing money from men to give to or spend on women. Men pay around 80% of taxes and women absorb a similar % of welfare and public services. Men's value being a public utility but women's value being a protected utility is blatant misandry." - Do you have sources to support this? Primary sources in fact? Where are you getting these percentages? Women work in the public sector as well, even if they aren't in blue collar spaces. Clerical work is still important. "Lol. They don't at al…
/r/PurplePillDebate09/06/26 03:05 AM
1

>Who owes you healthcare, a house to live in, infrastructure, schools, hospitals, public services, protection, clean running water, electricity, food etc etc etc? Same answer to the same question. I don't live in a country with socialized healthcare, though I wish I did. Your taxes go toward public services. As funny as an insult it might be toward a certain individual, a woman's pussy isn't a public service. Paved roads and clean drinking water operate on a different level of the hierarchy of n…
/r/PurplePillDebate07/06/26 03:43 PM
1

The contempt in that statement really sells it. Since you edited yours I'll refresh my response. "Byzantine parenting" sounds an awful lot like control and manipulation, which is the kind of thing that builds resentment. The presumed context here is that you're in an intimate relationship, please correct me if I'm wrong. If you've tried to communicate and ostensibly tried counseling, and they still ignore your requests it makes sense to leave. If you don't want to be there in the first place, it…
/r/PurplePillDebate06/06/26 03:53 PM
1

There's the added consideration of understanding the difference between talking to ("hey, this is bothering me...") and talking at ("you need to do...") someone, though I won't pretend that there aren't guys out there who don't like being told things period. "I" statements can go a long way though.
/r/PurplePillDebate06/06/26 03:37 PM
4

I didn't say we were incapable, I asked why we should bother. How much is he vetting versus confirming a bias? How much reflection has he done if he can't be bothered to write his own post?
/r/PurplePillDebate06/06/26 10:42 AM
1

Alright, let's take this point by point. "I didn't say someone owes you sex. I said people are owed sex. That isn't the same thing." - You're going to have to explain the difference here a bit more clearly, and while you're at it: if you are owed sex, who owes it to you? "But yes, in relationships, and certainly in marriage, a specific person owes you sex." - You are free to leave due to sexual disharmony along with a bunch of other reasons. That is not the same thing as being "owed" sex. Unless…
/r/PurplePillDebate06/06/26 10:37 AM
3

He's still outsourcing his ability to think. Hell, he'd be better served by posting cryptic song lyrics than relying on a chatbot.
/r/PurplePillDebate06/06/26 10:03 AM
2

Nah dude, saying someone owes you sex is high key rapey. This isn't a white knight thing. Why are you trying to obligate someone who doesn't want you.
/r/PurplePillDebate06/06/26 06:12 AM
1

Fascinating.
/r/PurplePillDebate06/06/26 01:52 AM
9

Question is valid but if you can't be arsed to write out your actual thoughts, why should people bother engaging with it?
/r/PurplePillDebate06/06/26 01:52 AM
2

Real talk, I don't think a lot of women realize just how much the typical guy appreciates clear instruction and straightforward, objective based communication.
/r/PurplePillDebate06/06/26 01:48 AM
3

On one hand I can understand where you're coming from. On the other this is all highly relativistic language. Also, much like people don't wait until it's convenient for everyone else to drop dead, an emotional or nervous breakdown doesn't generally come wrapped in a bow. What does it mean to be an adult in those cases? Do you advocate stoicism when the nervous tics start? Is it more adult to maintain a neutral tone of voice when the tears start to fall? If those are the expectations, is it stil…
/r/PurplePillDebate06/06/26 01:45 AM
2

Was she also KGB? This context is very specific.
/r/PurplePillDebate06/06/26 01:41 AM
9

No one owes you sex chief. I'd classify it as a need but it's not something you're entitled to. My need for sex does not and will not ever override a woman's autonomy. This isn't a good look.
/r/PurplePillDebate05/06/26 02:03 PM
2

Nah, there are third options. Perceived paradox is generally resolved by expanding context. It's okay to want to be with a woman. It's okay to want to be in a reciprocal, nourishing relationship. It's okay to feel frustrated if those circumstances are lacking in your life. These considerations are not all you are. They aren't all you have to live for. You don't have to run behind women, and finding other things to fill your day doesn't mean giving up on women entirely. Most of this shit isn't bi…
/r/PurplePillDebate13/03/26 09:46 PM
2

It's unhealthy because it's a lotus eater machine. Infinite scrolling and social media are already demonstrably bad for us, but the appeal of chatbots in general and ai romance in particular is confirmation bias on a stick. You don't grow in that space. You get sucked into a loop with something that can't say no, but also can't really touch or hold you and brings none of its own life experience to bear. As you indulge it you'll find short term hits but no long term edification and the cost to be…
/r/PurplePillDebate13/03/26 07:39 PM
1

Communication is a harder thing to solve for than sex, but barring low libido/ asexuality, if you can both communicate then the other issues become solvable. I'm not expecting someone to magically know everything but a willingness to try/figure things out is a pretty big green flag. I've been in relationships with seasons of both but things change.
/r/PurplePillDebate08/03/26 03:18 AM
1

Can you expand on that?
/r/PurplePillDebate07/03/26 06:18 PM
3

You could argue that there's a bell curve in effect but I don't think the traits are necessarily mutually exclusive. Prefacing this by saying hope and acknowledgement of possibility aren't the same thing as entitlement. It's not a binary thing either, but loyalty and integrity don't require you to be a prude. Being easy doesn't necessarily make you good in bed.
/r/PurplePillDebate07/03/26 06:09 PM
1

When it comes to commitment, most guys want the good girl. If you're building a life with someone you want something stable and you want to be with someone that's willing to pour back into your cup, especially if you recognize that all relationships require some measure of compromise. "Bad girls" bring on the same kind of confirmation bias as fake tits. "He's ogling that woman, obviously he likes women who've had work done." - Nah, women with work done are just more likely to show skin. "He reac…
/r/PurplePillDebate07/03/26 05:21 PM
1

Real talk. As a guy I'm also not going to date someone I'm not attracted to. I've got enough other shit to worry without trapping myself in that particular tango.
/r/PurplePillDebate04/03/26 04:37 AM
1

I understand and I hope this isn't coming across as defensive. I think we just break things down differently. Relativistic terms can cause us to talk past each other. To drill down into the response though, there is a subtle but important different between "the" standard and "her" standard. Understanding your needs and communicating them directly tends to be a good thing. If someone isn't down for that they're free to self select out. What I've described is standard and basic for me. I don't rea…
/r/PurplePillDebate01/03/26 05:44 PM
1

What is the standard? Who defines this standard?
/r/PurplePillDebate01/03/26 05:36 PM
3

Option 3. Any relationship is a sharing of time and mind. Intimate relationships also involves each of you opening yourselves up to the other's chaos. Struggling together with someone that I'm attracted to physically and personality-wise is far preferable to the first two.
/r/PurplePillDebate01/03/26 05:35 PM
1

"Basic" is a relative term. I'm not sure that a ubiquitous concept of basic really exists unless you're moving in very formal circles. I don't necessarily mind inconvenience. If someone needs my help: if I get that 2:00 am freak out call, if they need a place to crash, if someone's moving or they need help with a task, or they need advice and I'm able to show up or help, I will. I hope for the same in return and you could argue that this qualifies as mutual consideration. I tend to equate a lot …
/r/PurplePillDebate01/03/26 05:30 PM
3

My platonic relationships are generally low maintenance and not performative. One of my best friends lives down the street from me and sometimes we can go months without talking to or seeing each other. There's no friction. We're just busy doing our own thing. I'm also pretty introverted and not always going to want to be out doing things. I still maintain relationships formed in every phase of my life. People can trust that if they reach out and I can't respond right away, I'll hit them back. T…
/r/PurplePillDebate01/03/26 05:09 PM
2

"I think the core problem here is that you’re treating “being used for your body” as an individual level vetting failure, when it’s actually a structural pattern rooted in asymmetric incentives and risk." - "Being used for your body" in a context where consent is given, is an individual failure. Sex is something you are participating in in this hypothetical, not something that's being forced on you. "When women say they were used for their bodies, they are not saying “I failed at pattern recogni…
/r/PurplePillDebate27/02/26 06:31 PM
2

So we fundamentally disagree here but maybe we can tease this out a bit more. OP mentioned "being seen, being connected with, being personally considered." Consensus reality requires us to be able to triangulate. "Being used for your body," raises questions about your priorities and your vetting process. There's a fundamental difference between fault and responsibility but assuming that you've been "used" in a circumstance that you consented to: pattern recognition is a survival trait. "No," is …
/r/PurplePillDebate27/02/26 07:20 AM
1

It's a moving target for sure, but you're right. This is part of the human condition.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/02/26 07:13 AM
3

Alright so to recap: OP makes a post about not feeling valued in a dating context, not only due to the difficulty of getting on date in the first place, but also the burdens of performance and negative or lukewarm response on the other side of that performance. Also obligatory "yes men want sex, not that is not all they want." You respond by saying women don't want to be valued "primarily for their body," and further "you may be feeling undervalued but that's not nearly as bad as being sexualize…
/r/PurplePillDebate26/02/26 04:09 PM
2

"It is a reframing that strips women's complaint of its sexual and bodily reality so it can be mirrored back onto men."
/r/PurplePillDebate26/02/26 03:34 PM
3

Agreed. 7 times out of 10 the follow up question should be: "what does that mean to you?" A lot of people demand effort without reflecting on how they recognize and receive effort.
/r/PurplePillDebate26/02/26 03:24 PM
-2

So to clarify: objectifying someone or compartmentalizing their humanity is only an issue in a sexual context. Emotional damage means less than being viewed primarily as a sexual object. Is that correct?
/r/PurplePillDebate26/02/26 03:23 PM
1

When does reading between the lines become projection?
/r/PurplePillDebate26/02/26 03:18 PM
1

That Venn diagram isn't a circle but there's some overlap there
/r/PurplePillDebate26/02/26 03:18 PM
–

I don't necessarily disagree with you, but can you expand on why?
/r/PurplePillDebate11/02/26 04:31 AM
3

While there might be ways to increase our odds, we can't earn a given woman's attraction. The idea that you can brings on certain types of entitlement that we as a society probably wouldn't want to encourage. Add to that the understanding that every performance ends. If the goal is just sex, it is a lot easier. You can min max certain things and run the numbers until you get off. Odds are that you'll get laid eventually, and as you try more you learn more. Efficacy in this space requires us to d…
/r/PurplePillDebate08/02/26 08:03 PM
–

Which women? Also how do you recognize (literally meaning "recognize", not as a stand in for reward) effort?
/r/PurplePillDebate01/02/26 03:34 PM
2

There's a difference between communicating to be understood and communicating to be indulged. Also "the nagging paradox," in many cases can be resolved by understanding the difference between talking to someone and talking at them.
/r/PurplePillDebate30/01/26 07:02 PM
1

None of this answers my question. Also I didn't say that women should automatically want to sleep with me without knowing me. How do you recognize effort and how do you reciprocate?
/r/PurplePillDebate19/01/26 06:57 PM
–

There are absolutely cases where it's a quality of life improvement but the way it's commercialized and the effect that it (plus social media filters) has on young women seems like a net negative. To your point there are professionals who can perform efficiently and safely, but there's also no shortage of horror stories surrounding people who wanted to get it cheap or became addicted to getting work done.
/r/PurplePillDebate19/01/26 06:08 PM
1

"I'm gonna be blunt, I'm getting sick and tired of guys here coming up with wild conclusions without backing up their claims. Unless you can map out your thorough on how what I said and what you said are related, I'm just going to move on to another portion of this argument." - Your response to a request to defend your claim was to flame out and deflect, but I'll get back to this below or in the post you made this morning. "That's the problem with the "Sex Is A Need" mindset, it encourages a sen…
/r/PurplePillDebate19/01/26 05:22 PM
–

What marks it as improvement? A nose job tanked Jennifer Grey's acting career.
/r/PurplePillDebate19/01/26 05:05 PM
–

Generally speaking I agree with you, but people absolutely give food service staff money while looking down on them. The cognitive dissonance isn't as high as you'd think.
/r/PurplePillDebate19/01/26 05:04 PM
–

Speak for yourself?
/r/PurplePillDebate19/01/26 05:03 PM
–

If you want to do it for you, go ahead. Just remember it's more likely a subscription than a one time deal and repeat procedures increase a margin of error. Also make sure you're examining the want behind the want.
/r/PurplePillDebate19/01/26 05:02 PM
10

Try not to let those voices get you down. Success in romantic pursuits means you're going to spend a lot of time and mind with someone. Ideally the two of you grow old together, which means gained weight, expanded cartilage and saggy skin. This is less a response to how to attract someone than how to cultivate something that's ideally healthy. There are games that you lose for winning. "Boring/uninteresting" and "Uneducated" are relativistic descriptors and generally not useful in these discussi…
/r/PurplePillDebate19/01/26 06:31 AM
3

"So what does that have to do with “Wanting or prioritizing sex doesn't mean that sex is the only thing someone wants”?" The statement is reductive. If you can elaborate on some greater nuance without short hand or passing the buck, by all means enlighten me. "That doesnt work if you constantly describe an entitled person." In the context where we pick apart things taken for granted it absolutely makes sense to discuss entitled people, because taking things for granted is what entitlement entail…
/r/PurplePillDebate19/01/26 02:54 AM
5

"I didnt claim otherwise. Now please stop woth the bad faith responses." - A quote from the initial post: "This comes off as seeing relationships as work and sex is the payment." "Do you not realized you’re implying sex is an entitlement?" Specifically said multiple times that no one is entitled to anything. Recognizing something as a priority or a need does not make people entitled. "No, its because alot of guys are creepy, dehumanizing, and dont give a shit that theyre gross." - You're literal…
/r/PurplePillDebate19/01/26 02:26 AM
4

You've presented a bad faith take, but the following is intended to increase understanding rather than going for a gotcha. Wanting or prioritizing sex doesn't mean that sex is the only thing someone wants. A guy feeling sexual frustration in relation to the woman who is the object of your affections doesn't mean that sexual gratification is all that she's good or valued for. I would call sex a need (needing something does not mean you are entitled to it.) Everyone is trying to get their needs me…
/r/PurplePillDebate19/01/26 02:07 AM
1

Everyone compromises (unless you are in a particularly controlling and abusive relationship) I think there's just a difference in what people compromise on. Cultural conditioning and holdover gender dynamics have caused men to provide most of what women say they want for themselves, or to be fine without it. Think of how many guys on average would much rather be home than out socializing but still go out because that's expected if they want results (that they aren't entitled to, but still put in…
/r/PurplePillDebate30/12/25 03:56 PM
3

On one hand, you shouldn't be in a relationship just to say you're in a relationship and it's probably best to find someone who has values that align with yours. On the other, if you're looking at the person you're with as an individual and not a concept, you kind of have to meet them where they are. Relationships aren't obtained, they're cultivated. If your list of desired traits is 30 items long and my list is 5, that doesn't mean I value you less. It means our Venn diagram isn't a circle, whi…
/r/PurplePillDebate30/12/25 03:47 PM
5

NGL, if this post is indicative of your personality and what it's like to spend time with you I probably wouldn't want to commit either. Why do you feel the need to be so controlling? Yes, everyone should be faithful. Yes, everyone should be an active and present parent. No, you can't ethically force people to do anything. There are plenty of people out there in supportive, committed and reciprocal relationships. If you want to see a change in patterns and circumstances think about what you actu…
/r/PurplePillDebate23/12/25 05:07 PM
1

Neither party is obligated or owed access to the other. If you walk away, understand that it isn't about her. You're doing what you think you need to do for your mental health. Don't villify her or try to paint her a certain way, just make the break and acknowledge that it was what you thought would be best for you to do.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/12/25 09:54 PM
1

Oh, we might disagree on the expression a bit but I think we agree on the principle.
/r/PurplePillDebate20/12/25 07:48 PM
1

There's a longer response in here somewhere but before I type it out, what does ITA mean?
/r/PurplePillDebate20/12/25 08:02 AM
1

You might have a point about people just liking shiny things. I still draw issue with performative status but sometimes things are simpler than they appear. The presumed intimidation factor is still something that doesn't quite pass muster, at least as it would be applied to a large swath of men. It's entirely possible to decide you don't want to be bothered with someone without being intimidated by them, in fact I'd say that's a pretty common interpersonal dynamic. You've probably experienced t…
/r/PurplePillDebate20/12/25 08:00 AM
1

Thanks again for your reply, and for the circumspection to distinguish between someone not being for you as opposed to being subpar in the general sense (though that is somewhat undermined by your last point.) The first point in your last response regarding status is an interesting one and it makes me think about the ways in which we take things for granted. Many people live beyond their means to signal status because they derive feelings of security from that. Sometimes that networks them into …
/r/PurplePillDebate19/12/25 04:03 PM
2

"Esteem" in this case means that you are living a fulfilling life in accordance with your values. If I care about you, I want to see you happy and doing well, regardless of what your career is. Plenty of people work jobs that they hate, which aren't necessarily reflections of their character. I have a buddy who makes 2-3x what I do and he drinks most of the difference in our income because he hates his job. If you're passionate about pre-literate mesoamerican culture, cool. If your jam is watchi…
/r/PurplePillDebate19/12/25 03:42 PM
1

Thank you for the thoughtful response. I think we fundamentally disagree on the established premise. -For one thing, I associate a fixation on status with materialism as a baseline. Yes it makes sense to worry about things like financial security if you're building a life with someone, but most guys aren't looking for someone to fund their lifestyle. In many cases we're okay getting by with simple things. -Everyone has vices, even you. Not all vices are weighted equally. -Maybe I could have used…
/r/PurplePillDebate19/12/25 03:22 PM
0

Is it possible to care about your esteem without your vocation being a selective criteria?
/r/PurplePillDebate19/12/25 03:10 PM
2

The framing of this is off. It's kind of weird to respond to "we don't really care about external signifiers of status" with "well clearly you're insecure." There's also a difference between "your job is stupid" and "you being a top sales executive doesn't tell me much about what it's like to spend time or build a life with you." Put another way, I might have invested in an extensive sneaker collection. What does that mean to you if you aren't going to wear my shoes?
/r/PurplePillDebate19/12/25 03:03 PM
2

This stance and the defensiveness around it is a major red flag for poor communication skills. Nevermind the signal to noise problem between a look of interest and a look for literally any other reason. Nevermind the fact that your signal is not the same as other signals and we'd be asked to disregard your potential discomfort for approaching due to eye contact. This signals that you expect people (strangers in particular) to read your mind. In western countries, we do not live in a homogeneous …
/r/PurplePillDebate07/12/25 02:45 AM
–

Thanks for committing to the bit
/r/PurplePillDebate29/11/25 08:46 AM
–

A gold digger but not objectifying, got it.
/r/PurplePillDebate29/11/25 08:16 AM
–

So it's only objectifying if it's sexual? If I hook up with Oprah and just love her accomplishments and the life that affords but don't have any sexual interest in her, I'm not objectifying her?
/r/PurplePillDebate29/11/25 06:17 AM
1

How is valuing you for your accolades not objectifying?
/r/PurplePillDebate28/11/25 07:59 AM
3

You are greater than the sum of your parts. I get that the need for esteem is important and I'm not saying guys should just shut you down and talk over you if you're delving into something you're passionate about but accolades don't mean much by themselves. If a guy comes in leading with the fact that he's dined at every Michelin star restaurant, climbed Everest and he belongs to a bunch of exclusive country clubs, that might tell you a bit about his character, but it doesn't tell you anything a…
/r/PurplePillDebate27/11/25 09:44 PM
1

Thoreau talked about men leading lives of quiet desperation. This isn't new but it's exacerbated by atomization, shifting social and gender roles, and technological advancement.
/r/PurplePillDebate12/11/25 06:38 AM
You can kill a man, but you can't kill an idea.

© TheRedArchive 2026. All rights reserved.
created by /u/dream-hunter