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Mammoth_Salt_4509 Archive

View 1 posts and 51 comments by Mammoth_Salt_4509 on TheRedPill subreddit and various other subreddits related to The Red Pill community.
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discussionMammoth_Salt_4509/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates26/04/22 05:24 PM
Upvotes Comment on Subreddit Date (UTC)
4

This is an excellent and often overlooked point. Women support each other and can organize to advance towards common goals because they can see themselves as a worldwide group. Being a woman is seen as being part of a globally shared set of experiences. Men seem much less inclined to group themselves on the basis of their "manliness". A part of it, I imagine, is because one of the prescriptions of manliness is exactly to not lean on each other and instead be self-reliant. But ultimately I agree,…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates17/05/22 09:12 AM
1

I totally agree, I am against air conditioning too. Unfortunately I cannot imagine shorts to be considered appropriate for client-facing corporate environments anytime soon.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates10/05/22 01:52 PM
4

I'll play the devil's advocate here, but I think the notion that those insults are also demeaning towards women is definitely true. Those who use those insults aim at evidencing some perceived negative behaviour commonly associated with femininity in the targeted man. Might be weakness, cowardness, whining. By associating these attributes to femininity they are clearly implying that women usually display those traits. It's implied that you, as a man, shouldn't cry, whine or be scared. Women, on …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates10/05/22 10:35 AM
22

I used to argue all the time with my female colleagues during summer. If I showed up in shorts, short-sleeves and sandals I would be fired. You can either help me change this policy and the expectations of clients and higher-ups, or you can stop complaining about the air conditioning and dress up. There's really no fair third alternative. Never changed anyone's mind. The general narrative was that thermostats are set on male temperatures because women are not expected to be in the workplace.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates10/05/22 02:21 AM
5

I get the general impression that anime and manga tend to strongly promote traditional gender roles. Female characters are objectified and male ones are commodified (pushed to be heroes, sacrifice for others...). In a product mostly aimed at children and teens this can be really damaging. Maybe this is ill-informed, since I don't have much experience with it.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates10/05/22 02:04 AM
9

This is a sort of trope. Right now I cannot think of a specific scene, but you've likely seen it somewhere. A man and a woman are having an argument, which escalates in intensity. Then the guy says something which "goes too far", and the argument stops abruptly with her slapping him. I've seen it over and over, mostly in shitty dramas, and every time I cringe. It is a really toxic trope perpetrating the notion that hitting their partner is a viable tool for women to signal their displease and "c…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates10/05/22 01:48 AM
4

I know a single experience doesn't make a statistic. But I'll give my datapoint. A man really close to me works with dangerous acids, has witnessed several hazardous situations and has already been lightly injured himself. He is not a risk inclined guy at all. On the contrary, he's a prudent and responsible man. But he is middle-age, has no qualifications, no study titles and a family to provide for. Therefore he has to take whatever job is available. My guess is the situation must be similar fo…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates08/05/22 12:13 AM
3

None of these policies are going to soon, or ever, occur. The current "general political structure" (whatever this means) is much more multi-faceted and complex. There's a lot of work to do in the context of men's issue recognition, but this sort of caricatural self-victimization is the opposite of what is needed, and makes us look as a bunch of unhinged drama queens.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/05/22 01:42 PM
13

The issue with bringing data to the table is that, while the hypotesis itself is falsifiable, their proponents are not good Bayesians: they give it a 100% probability and are not willing to ever review it. Many men are pro-choice? They have been educated out of their natural tendency to domination. Many women are pro-life? They are prisoners of the patriarchy. Whichever data you might bring, they ask themselves how it fits the narrative, not what it says about the narrative itself. This kind of …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates06/05/22 06:00 AM
5

As far as I understand (and I may be completely wrong) the biggest factor in the gap seems to be career allocation. Simply put, women work in lower wage jobs (or for less hours) than men. That seems to me clearly driven by the persistance of traditional gender roles in society, which, more or less explicitely, set the expectation for men to be the main provider of their family and for women to fill a supportive role. I see a potentially good outcome in fighting the pay gap by spreading the idea …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates03/05/22 05:07 PM
25

I feel there is an under-explored gap between men and women in success expectations. My impression (which might be wrong) is that women are celebrated when they succeed, for example in business, but don't get much social stigma for failing or not looking for success altogether (even in today's families it is rare to see the wife as the main provider). Men, even those who lack a natural tendency for competition, are much more likely to feel pressured into stressing jobs they hate because of socia…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates01/05/22 02:10 AM
2

The thing is that, as a society, we seem to value much more the "exceptional" people than the modest ones. We don't name squares and streets after happy-but-unremarkable men and women. We name them after "the heroes". In such an environment it is natural to see "historical importance" as the measure of a person's value. And this means that, even if you want to live a quiet life, you will still feel pressured by this unhealty social expectations to try to have some impact on the world anyway. I w…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates01/05/22 12:17 AM
11

I would advocate for a "positive" MR movement too. But it's not so simple. There's a reason why Menslib never actually deep dives in men's issues: it's because as soon as you do that, outside of the MR communities, you will usually get dismissive or antagonistic responses. And, as much as I hate to say it, these responses are driven by feminism. The mere suggestion of systemic men's issues is at odds with much of the feminist narrative (male privilege, the patriarchy as an oppression system...).…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates30/04/22 05:31 AM
7

Thank you so much for this. I already intuitively knew it must be a violation of some human rights, but didn't know how specifically. The thing that bothers me the most are the responses I got from people so far about the matter. Unfortunately I don't think they are going to be very different by citing some articles. Some of the excuses (these are not straw-men, I heard them quasi-literally from real people): "In a time of emergency they cannot afford to be sophisticated" (As if human rights wer…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/04/22 06:42 AM
1

I am torn apart on this matter. On one hand, military conscription goes against my deepest beliefs about human rights. I can never justify it morally. (That's why I voted the last option). On the other hand, from a military point of view, it's a common tool for quickly building up an army. Strategically, it wouldn't make any sense for a country (e.g. Ukraine) not to adopt it, considering its widespread support worldwide.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates27/04/22 03:15 PM
2

Fair enough. I should have been more careful with words, but I wanted to cut it short because the post was already long enough. By saying "men have been the primary agents" I unfairly attributed agency to the whole group (men). Obviously most men didn't have any agency at all. Also, when I say that I agree with it, I only mean on a first, superficial level of approximation. If you think that the history of the world is the one we are mostly taught about in school (the history of conquests, explo…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates27/04/22 10:35 AM
3

Thanks for this take, I absolutely agree! I used the word "script" to simplify things, since the post was already long enough. But I think it's really impossible to talk about gender roles (or any other human behaviour for that matter) in any meaningful way without taking into account evolutionary biology.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates27/04/22 10:07 AM
-2

I appreciate the positivity you express towards feminism accomplishments. Too many people tend to only look at the exaggerated versions propagated by media. I think the ideal situation would be one where MRM and Feminism could collaborate with one another. That said, MRM are currently in their very early stage, and as such are a confused mess. What they should be doing better is build a shared narrative around what are the roots of men's issues and organize in order to solve them. Right now, we …
/r/MensRights23/04/22 05:55 PM
8

Besides, using myself as an example here, I believe that these kind of expectations are the reason I can't cry. No matter how distressed I am, how sad, I'm simply unable to, like I'm blocked somehow, because I've been told since I was a kid that's not what men do. Imagine if laughter was considered unmanly and boys were discouraged from it. How damaging it would be for their well being and mental stability. The way I see it, repressing crying is as damaging as that. It's part of our natural beha…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates22/04/22 10:57 AM
31

Maybe it's out of place, but reading your post made me think of the character of Lady Macbeth. Her ability to exercise power by proxy, influencing her husband's desires and ambition, really resonates with the way you describe soft power.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates21/04/22 03:36 PM
7

It's mind-numbing to see people, which are otherwise surely smart, being surprised because the rules made to create equality have the unintended effect of creating equality, just not the way they expected.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates19/04/22 02:23 PM
3

Perhaps I am missing your point here, so please correct me if that's the case. The notion that women were completely powerless and basically enslaved to men is only suited for simple-minded people. Of course the world is much more complex than that. To historians (and common-sensed people in general), the fact that high class women, throughout history, held some (or even a lot of) power over society, is non controversial. That said, in my opinion, we shouldn't fall in the opposite pit. That is, …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates19/04/22 01:21 PM
18

Honestly, there's nothing to do that you are not already doing. Close-minded people cannot be engaged with. We should focus on the open-minded people. Discuss with them frankly but with empathy. Use only moderate tones. Show them that we are not a bunch of angry incels. Reasonable people exist on both sides (but really, there should be NO sides in these discussions).
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates17/04/22 06:02 PM
12

It' quite clear that the value of a man is still commonly viewed as directly correlated to his "usefulness": if you want to gain some simpaty for a guy, saying he has a family to provide for is the obvious and most effective choice. That is traditionally true for women too: they are pressured into being child and husband carers. But thanks to feminist struggles, a lot of those expectations are finally receding. It's now a widely accepted idea that women's value shouldn't depend on their contribu…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates17/04/22 05:50 PM
2

I don't see it as a battle of the sexes neither, but it often feels that way in debates and in media. I think you are right, I may just need to look at better content. Thank you very much for the suggestions!
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates15/04/22 05:12 PM
10

I don't dislike this term itself. It helped me recognize a bad behavioural pattern I was starting to adopt unconsciously (avoiding chores, using as an excuse that I wasn't going to do it the way my gf wanted them anyway). I found it useful in this sense to avoid this sort of lazyness. What I really dislike is how it's used in a sexist way, implying it to be an intrinsecally male behaviour. In my anecdotal experience (this is all very anecdotal anyway...) I am constantly nagged by friends and fam…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates15/04/22 02:14 PM
3

In the last few weeks I've done a mini deep dive in the Men's Issues world. My "wake up call" was the war in Ukraine, which blew up my bubble and made me realize there are a lot of things in the world which very much negatively affect men, but are never talked about under this lense. I got into this by promising myself I would've kept a positive and moderate attitude, in order to avoid ending up as the stereotipical "anti-feminist". Unfortunately I'm starting to see that keeping out the negative…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates14/04/22 01:36 PM
24

Unfortunately, people in media who use the women and children card, usually do so for a perceived good cause (to attract attention towards an injustice going on). They take advantage of the "empathy gap" towards women (which is, I think, a bug of our brains) to maximise audience response. Due to the "nobility" of their purposes, it's hard to point out the damaging effect of this strategy without appearing insensitive.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates13/04/22 05:59 PM
5

You are right, I didn't want to come out so negative about the sub. I really appreciate some of their initiatives (their weekly mental health check for example) and their generally positive and moderate tones, which often lack here. I just wanted to point out that these topics would also require some deeper discussions (on the same vein in which women's issues are discussed in feminist subs). But my general impression is that even the valuable users in there seem more willing to focus on tangent…
/r/MensRights13/04/22 02:49 PM
34

Under the actual discussion about men's conscription, I remember that the majority of comments were very inoffensive statements like: "that's so sad, war is shit". Nobody there seems willing to deep dive into the actual systemic issues affecting men. That's I think a major flaw of that sub: in order not to look like actual MRAs they avoid any sort of controversy. The sad truth is that these issues ARE polarizing right now. And, while women and LGBT issues are something everyone can agree on, dis…
/r/MensRights13/04/22 10:37 AM
41

What kind of monster do you have to be, from the confort of your home, to shame someone escaping from a war? Unbelievable.
/r/MensRights12/04/22 03:10 PM
10

Just on a side note: let's not make draft discussions anti-Ukraine. Russia applies drafts too (and Western countries likely would as well). ​ miners have a risky job, and so receive higher pay There's something about this whole matter we really cannot ignore: miners are not conscripted to do their job. I get there may be a lot of forces pushing them to it, but they can leave and are not stripped of any fundamental human right. Drafted guys are deprived of their right of self-determination. They …
/r/MensRights12/04/22 02:42 PM
3

People tell me that, since right now people are dying, it's not appropriate to talk about these topics. It's almost as if concerns about gender equality were a "peacetime preoccupation". Not serious enough to be raised during a war. As soon as a war breaks out, we should apparently consider normal a complete regression to traditional gender roles. And, despite everyone telling me that "in war there's no privilege", civilian men are very clearly getting the worst deal in all of this. Unfortunatel…
/r/MensRights12/04/22 02:14 PM
5

The idea of a horror movie about men being monsters, likely made to cater to a feminist audience, and simply called MEN is simply hilarious. It sounds straight out of South Park. A part of me too hopes that this will be a self-conscious movie playing with its own absurdity, but I doubt it. At least I hope it will be hilariously bad.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates11/04/22 08:53 PM
7

Thanks for the conciliatory tone of your post. I think it's vital for both male advocacy and feminist movements to approach each other in a non-antagonistic way. That doesn't mean not being able to criticize each other; but it's important to be open-minded and willing to approach these issues less emotionally. I think that the MRA movement, broadly speaking, could use a lot more attention towards women's issues when discussing gender imbalances. Sometimes the general tone seems dismissive, if no…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates11/04/22 02:29 PM
44

I cannot wrap my mind around this behaviour. First of all, to shame someone because they want to escape a mortally dangerous situation is inhuman. But, even if you are pro-draft, what's the reason for shaming the men only? Abled women with no children can help defending as much as men (and many of them chosed to do it). I don't often use the term misandry, but I really cannot define this in any other way.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates11/04/22 12:56 PM
3

To break a spear for Garland, in Annihilation the lack of male protagonists was nicely understated. It's just a group of scientists doing their thing, nothing out of the ordinary for them to be women. The only line where it's aknowledged was like: "Hey...weird, we are all women" and that's it. I think that's a movie example of gender equality done right. Unfortunately the movie itself was boring af.
/r/MensRights07/04/22 04:18 PM
10

I like their generally positive attitude and moderate tones that often are missing here. That said: 1) Discussion on that sub are often filled with a strange sense of reciprocal mistrust. They want to discuss men's rights, but they are always careful with the words they use, because they don't want to end up looking like actual MRAs and indispose the side of the sub which sees the topic only from the feminist pov. So they end up saying things in a very roundabout way in order to avoid "incrimina…
/r/MensRights07/04/22 06:29 AM
28

While 99% of gender-based violence is committed by men, it is important that this does not mask the domestic abuse that is committed by women. OP's question advocated for helping male victims, without any mention of the perpetrator's gender. The response managed to immediately turn it into a fight between the sexes. Aside from that, decent reply.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates06/04/22 03:15 PM
5

We are light years away from men's rights becoming a "trendy" topic. When that will happen, finally politics may take notice. Still it's a small step in the right direction.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates06/04/22 05:26 AM
12

I will do Satan's lawyer here. Patriarchy is actually an accurate term, if you use it do describe the historical arrangement of gender roles in human society, and leave out the "oppression" lenses. All the key areas of society (politics, science, the arts...), throughout history, have been predominatly convered by men. This was not only a matter of habit, but was often enforced by the law or even by religious norms. In this sense, "Patriarchy" seems a perfectly reasonable term to describe this a…
/r/MensRights05/04/22 02:43 PM
2

To be clear, I agree with you that on average each gender has some innate preferences. But the line between what is freely chosen and what is expected by society is very blurry. Despite being a man, working in construction has no appeal to me whatsoever. But, if I needed a job and the only available options were to work in construction or to be a house cleaner, I can easily see myself choose the first one due to social pressure.
/r/MensRights05/04/22 09:52 AM
9

Are men really more "interested" in working in construction sites? Honestly the people I know did it because it was the job available at the time. I'm also against forcing exact 50-50 equality in every occupation, but I think it's good to encourage women to enter traditionally male jobs. And the same for men in traditionally female jobs. Also, for a change, I appreciate that we are talking about women in construction jobs, instead of prestige positions like big company CEOs.
/r/MensRights05/04/22 07:56 AM
1

Evil men still exist that exert totalitarian control and no checks or balances to keep them in check...If Russia came to my state to ‘liberate’ it, I would fully support a draft. I see a contradiction here, but maybe it's just a matter of definitions. To me a totalitarian State is exactly one which has the power override the will of its citizens in matters regarding their own lives and deaths. When this happens, people are no longer citizens, they are subjects. It's not simply a "tactic", it's a…
/r/MensRights05/04/22 07:41 AM
21

Honestly I think patriarchy is not a terrible term if it's used properly. You can use it to describe the way society historically arranged itself in order to have key areas (in politics, science, arts...) mainly covered by men. It's an arrangement with very deep, pre-historical roots, which helped us survive for most of our early history. But today we don't find it useful anymore and we want to get rid of it. And I happen to agree with this assesment. On the other hand, many people talk about pa…
/r/MensRights04/04/22 09:56 PM
17

The injustice of conscription is just too much. War is shit, but at least fight each other using regular armies and volunteers. Do not force unwilling civilians to kill each other. Some of my male friends told me they would happily respond to conscription, in order to defend their homes and freedom. They are still full of the idiotic image of war as a matter of honor and bravery. If you are a conscript, war is just a matter of dying after giving an infinitesimally low contribution to your side. …
/r/MensRights04/04/22 09:45 PM
1

You are right, gender is not the only factor in the equation. But I would say that, even if you were the youngest son, you still were expected to serve in the army or go into an honorable profession, and therefore hold high the reputation of the family. And daughters were expected to do the same by producing a lot of babies and taking care of them. Being of masculine or feminine character had nothing to do with it. It was 100% mandated by gender. BTW I don't know why I talk about the past. It st…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates04/04/22 07:13 PM
8

Like many in other comments, I would object to the term "privileges" (even in quotation marks). The preponderance of the male gender in key areas (politics, arts, science...) is a real phenomenon, but I wouldn't call it a "privilege men often have": to the vast majority of men who ever lived, sharing the same gender as the ruling class was absolutely of no use. That aside, I think that the "status as a male" has been without doubt the predominant factor in the historical preponderance of men. If…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates04/04/22 03:45 PM
3

Thank you for coming here to discuss! I think communication between open minded feminists and MRAs is desperately needed. A lot of what moves this sub is the need for a place to safely call out injustices which are elsewhere tolerated only because they label themselves as feminist. This is an important function of this community, because for many people it's their only way to express their frustration. But it has the side effect of making MRAs look like a bunch of angry dudes. Also you are spot-…
/r/MensRights03/04/22 09:06 PM
-3

I don't find it a very useful term tbh. I think men issues are very deeply rooted in our societal structures and even in some "bugs" of human cognition. The term misandry simply means "not liking men"...which I guess can be useful to call out specific bad behaviours. But seems superficial when used as an explaination. I think the same for "misoginy".
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates03/04/22 03:20 PM
21

The empathy gap against men, in the context of warfare, is overwhelmingly obvious. It would be simply insane to deny it, so people just ignore it. Some days ago I made the mistake of bringing this topic up irl, during a discussion about Ukraine. I was flooded with ready-made comments (like women are suffering and fighting too, it's Putin's fault for starting it..). All these are true, but do not address the specific issue that men, simply on the basis of their gender, are being used like tools b…
/r/MensRights03/04/22 02:26 PM
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