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Meayow Archive

View 0 posts and 87 comments by Meayow on TheRedPill subreddit and various other subreddits related to The Red Pill community.
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Upvotes Comment on Subreddit Date (UTC)
2

Says some asshole in an echo chamber. :eyerolls:
/r/PussyPassDenied29/05/17 06:56 PM
1

Citation needed.
/r/PussyPassDenied29/05/17 06:54 PM
1

I would like to point out that this subreddit called "men going their own way" primarily is about shitting on women. It's full of bitter men who can't seem to understand or interact with women effectively. Now, adopting this mindset may help you in life, especially if you're gay and aren't seeking positive mutual relationships with women. However, if you are looking for a balanced life with positivity and the ability to interact with both sexes, then I woulf suggest holding off on making decisio…
/r/MGTOW26/11/16 06:17 PM
0

But drunk sex shouldn't be disallowed. This analogy means you shouldn't have sex when drunk, just like you shouldn't drive when drunk. Why the fuck can't I fuck my boyfriend drunk? It's... The analogy is weak. Go back to school.
/r/MGTOW20/05/16 04:47 PM
1

Haha. Sure. I see what you mean. Driving is not a decent analogy to sex.
/r/MGTOW12/05/16 07:07 AM
-1

Simple sad analogy = goddamned genius? Wow. You've high standards.
/r/MGTOW10/05/16 10:20 PM
-8

The analogy breaks down because it lacks stability. It also makes the point that it's illegal to drive drunk. It seems to also basically be accidentally making a case against drinking and sex, which we all know would screw us all over. So it's a pretty tedious analogy. Don't give a shit about his point, but his lazy logic is disgusting.
/r/MGTOW10/05/16 07:03 PM
1

I love George. Women ARE fucking crazy!
/r/MGTOW10/05/16 06:34 PM
-6

Aren't you not supposed to drive a car when you're drunk? This is a terrible analogy. If you're caught driving drunk you go to jail/pay a fine/or lose your license. The fuck is he talking about.
/r/MGTOW10/05/16 06:13 PM
1

Meayou is cute, but it's actually Meayow. Rape is very rarely prosecuted.
/r/MensRights20/01/13 08:28 AM
-13

Excuse me, but a case being dropped doesn't mean that rape did not occur. Is there any evidence that she wasn't raped besides the case being dropped?
/r/MensRights09/01/13 09:24 PM
-1

Why does it matter that she's wearing an ugly sweater? Why is that relevant? Answer: It isn't.
/r/MensRights09/01/13 08:40 PM
2

There are two things that I found really interesting in this article. First, the article seems to equate parental support with financial support (or emotional support), but not with actual parenting. Real parenting consists in being there at 2 in the morning and helping through the actual activity of parenting. Of course, he was away, so she would take on most of that activity. But equating his role (even though physically removed) with providing financial support seems off, however, that doesn'…
/r/MensRights09/01/13 07:01 PM
2

Great filmmaker. He also has some shorts on youtube that are worth a watch.
/r/MensRights25/12/12 08:44 AM
-16

In a post about how one ought to generally disregard female accusations, this comment seems incredibly hypocritical.
/r/MensRights13/12/12 03:17 AM
2

Considering the husband and wife were legally the same person, the wife had absolutely zero right to provide for herself, and the wife was equally screwed if the husband couldn't provide for himself, I'm failing to see how this is a pedestal at all. As I point out later, this isn't so different from the rights given to slaves at the time, or dogs today. and And for the record, it was still a total cop out to focus purely on the period of history that gave birth to women's suffrage and finally ac…
/r/MensRights10/12/12 04:43 PM
1

This is a thesis statement, not a fact. Meaning, it's an argument that people can entertain, argue for, or argue against. You haven't said anything about why absolute rights is higher than obligation, you also haven't proved that women had absolute rights. For example, you said: Under coverture, men were punished for the crimes of their wives (up to treason and murder), they were financially obligated for the upkeep of their wives (and could be sent to debtors prison if they failed in that oblig…
/r/MensRights10/12/12 04:25 PM
1

Feminism came about not because of male advocacy but because of male negligence. We weren't as vigilant as our fore fathers were in keeping human nature in check. Nope. Stopped reading. I can't debate logically with a fox news adherent and I certainly can't talk about gender and culture with someone who is as ignorant as you. When people who say things like this don't get down voted in this forum, it makes your movement look utterly ridiculous. That is the truth, down voting me for saying it won…
/r/MensRights10/12/12 04:14 PM
0

Reporting is also often a surefire way to insure that the victim goes free. Considering how often every male assumes that she's lying (and many women too), and what it means to have a rap kit done, and what it means to have it on public record with your name attached accusing someone of violating you in a way that stigmatizes you socially, I personally choose to let each victim deal with THEIR OWN FUCKING TRAUMA in whatever way is best for them. These stats are useful because they are telling us…
/r/MensRights10/12/12 04:02 PM
-11

I don't need stats to know that a hell of a lot of people are raped. I know a hell of a lot of people who have been raped. I only know of one rapist who has been to jail. He went to jail for molestation and a few years later he was out again. So, when you tell me that feminists are lying and conflating the issue, then I'm like huh? The majority of people who are raped are raped by someone they know. But the majority of people who are stabbed for their wallet probably aren't. I still think there …
/r/MensRights09/12/12 02:43 PM
0

I agree. When I say accused. I mean a victim says "someone raped me" It seems that you read that as saying "that person raped me" which is a very different accusation. Your problem with my word choice is fair. I am rather unedited on reddit. It's just how I procrastinate doing my real work.
/r/MensRights09/12/12 02:34 PM
0

Again, the stat isn't about the number of alleged rapists who may be guilty or may be innocent. That is conflating conviction of a crime with the crime actually occurring. (IF that were the case, then 100% of rapists would be in jail!)Now whether or not they've done a good job assessing how frequently rape isn't reported (i.e. is 54% the correct number) is a question about the methodology of the social scientists who devised a system to gather that data. I'm open to you finding a problem with th…
/r/MensRights09/12/12 02:30 PM
-4

I still think 54% of the data is irrelevant/poorly present. Because you don't understand how that data was gathered, which is very different from the data being irrelevant or poorly presented. (I assume you meant poorly presented because the sentence doesn't make sense otherwise).
/r/MensRights09/12/12 01:37 PM
-2

Your argument against my use of this stat doesn't make sense. This stat supports my argument. It's not as detailed or qualified as you would like it to be. Rather than teasing out different aspects of rape culture and explaining them individually, I took the number that comes to mind off the top of my head (and I knew where the source was without having to google it) and put it there. Not because other sources or other ways of using that source don't also make sense, but because that is the numb…
/r/MensRights09/12/12 01:32 PM
-2

Given that sex is generally a private activity there are going to be a lot of cases where it's his versus her word on if it was consensual. But mostly whether or not her word is accepted (in this gendered scenario that you presented) is based on whether she is white enough and appears to exhibit traditional heteronormative sexual values. I.e., it's clear that when white heterosexual conformist women are raped by non-white men there is a much higher conviction rate (and subsequently longer impris…
/r/MensRights09/12/12 01:18 PM
2

That someone is accused of rape is different than filing a police report. So when I say, 97% of the accused will not spend a day in jail, I am not citing official police complaints. For a multitude of reasons, many of which involve shame, people are unlikely to report. This, the unlikelihood of it being reported, is an aspect of rape culture. Which is why I used this stat for that point. My counter argument used too many curse words and general insults to be considered polite. But I am way hoppe…
/r/MensRights09/12/12 01:04 PM
0

Neither do I. I think some views in this forum are sexist and based on ignorance. But I actually think there is a lot to be gained from MRA. I wrote a kind of thoughtful long thing about my perspective, as a feminist, on the value of MRA, but I couldn't post it b/c I'm new.
/r/MensRights09/12/12 12:58 PM
1

Names? I don't even know of a single radfeminist who even counts as an academic. Edit: teaching at a community college doesn't count. Edit: "madam" lol.
/r/MensRights09/12/12 12:54 PM
-1

I am not kidding at all. When I go to r/science I don't assume I'm talking to leading physicists. (though one might be). I certainly don't think the leading voices in feminism hang out on Reddit. I think people who are smart and know some things about feminism are drawn to SRS because holyshitballs terrible sexist ideas are being spouted all over reddit. I don't think SRS would exist if people here were, in general, less tolerant of terrible views about women.
/r/MensRights09/12/12 12:54 PM
-6

I have seen some vitriol on SRS. (However, I can't imagine them being worse than "the typical redditor". Honestly, I don't think SRS is about the typical redditor. It's about the atypical misogynist who gets upvoted because their horrible women hating rhetoric is admired or viewed as funny instead of contributing to a cultural devaluation of women. So, in many respects SRS is more about how the community as a whole doesn't shame people who have terrible views. But I think many people on reddit a…
/r/MensRights09/12/12 12:50 PM
-2

While most of what you said doesn't bother me much about the role of feminists (i.e. sitting on advisory boards and endorsing laws that they feel are good for women), I certainly hope they aren't endorsing faulty stats. If you have examples of actual feminists who are doing this (and publishing), then I'd be really interested to read them. Do you read any feminists? If so, who's your favorites? (least favorites?) I am basically saying, do you know any of their names and are you familiar with any…
/r/MensRights09/12/12 12:45 PM
-5

Other crimes that are significantly different from rape? or just all other crimes? Because drug use seems to be a crime that is very difficult to prosecute unless you catch someone in the act. In order for rape to happen, there has to be a victim (see witness) present. I think it's pretty detrimental to this argument that there's some blanket statement that the lack of punishment for rapists in our country is admissable because other less serious crimes that likely don't have witnesses involved …
/r/MensRights09/12/12 12:33 PM
-9

If you care about how sociological data is gathered take a fucking course in it. Wikipedia the damn shit. Don't tell me that peer reviewed respected sources are shit because you don't understand how social science is done. Edit: Me: Assert something with a well respected source. MRA: Your source sucks. (translation: You must justify the methodologies of every social science study you cite.) Me: dafuq?
/r/MensRights09/12/12 12:27 PM
-12

97% of the accused will never spend a day in jail. That's why feminists call this a rape culture. Clearly, the fact that our culture endorses rape by refusing to act more drastically to reduce the frequent rape of men, women, boys and girls, is a mark against us. Edit: It always amazes me when MRA can't tell when something I say is an argument FOR their position. (The above stat is not about women, it's about people.)
/r/MensRights09/12/12 09:04 AM
5

If you were married to a woman who was the financial provider for your family (say you lost your job and unemployment ran out), and she would not allow you access to money for necessities without asking her permission, wouldn't you call her behavior unacceptable? I would.
/r/MensRights09/12/12 09:02 AM
-3

Obviously SRS isn't the leading voice in feminism! Leading feminists are academics and authors who publish thoughtful feminist works that contribute to feminist thought. They aren't a bunch of people who point out the prevalent misogynistic views of a typical redditor.
/r/MensRights09/12/12 08:57 AM
5

I'm pretty sure that society doesn't treat a girl who is raped like a hero. They treat her like a victim. Clearly, it's a huge cultural tragedy that boys who are raped aren't also acknowledged as victims. Edit: word choice
/r/MensRights09/12/12 08:48 AM
3

I think any adult who spends a minute around a 15-18 year old boy should quickly realize that an adult woman being attracted to them is clearly perverted. They are children. They are very underdeveloped and incredibly immature. I think when people applaud this situation they just remember being horny teenagers, they have no concept of how young that age really is.
/r/MensRights09/12/12 08:46 AM
1

Its hard to call yourself a feminist cause the movement hasn't matured enough to actually hold goals to what they want, theres several flavours of feminism that deal with different things and its confusing. Ways that feminism has been a movement: Women can vote Women aren't considered property anymore Women can be educated Sexual assault is a thing Intersectionality is a thing Men and women are (on paper) legally equal Gender discrimination laws are a thing Women can own property and have an occ…
/r/MensRights09/12/12 08:39 AM
2

I am conflicted because I agree with: Firstly, use paragraphs. But disagree with everything else.
/r/MensRights09/12/12 08:26 AM
2

The trigger warning is for the potentially undeleted comments that have hate speech and misogynistic content. It takes time to delete all the terrible things that people who use hate speech say.
/r/MensRights09/12/12 08:22 AM
0

This isn't true. First, what women focus on and what feminist focus on are different things. While many women may focus on the superficial benefits of wealth and judge others accordingly, I think that most feminists tend to see that line of judgement as crock. Second, feminists focus on general practices that are near universal, not particular instances that don't exemplify a systemic problem. In other words, feminists look at the over all practices of the culture, not at 1% of the people.
/r/MensRights09/12/12 08:19 AM
2

Freedom to say something, doesn't imply that it's a good idea to say it. Free speech sure, but whether or not you have some dignity in the way you disseminate your ideas is up to you.
/r/MensRights09/12/12 08:14 AM
1

You are saying that men cared about women so much that they willingly granted them superiority? That feminism itself is a product of male advocacy on behalf of women? It seems strange to think that feminism was a battle by and large fought by men. Obviously, you don't disagree that men at one time had more power than women, or else they wouldn't be able to benevolently grant power to women in general. It seems really weird to say that mean created a separate class of citizens. Obviously, women w…
/r/MensRights09/12/12 08:13 AM
3

But what if the study found the opposite of this? That men look at bodies and women at faces? Then your response would have to be something like: It probably has to do with how we evaluate potential mates. A woman's body show's how fertile she is (boob size, hips) and how able she is to spend her time running after kids. While a man's face shows his age which will show that he's old enough to be a good provider, but young enough to be around for a bit. This is the problem with attributing these …
/r/MensRights08/12/12 02:02 AM
2

I think he needs feminism to change how people respond to what he likes. In this picture he is directly referencing the consequence of him being perceived as gay or a pedophile as a result of his liking MLP
/r/MensRights08/12/12 01:32 AM
2

But seriously, can someone tell me from a MRA perspective: What is feminism?
/r/MensRights08/12/12 01:27 AM
6

I can't respond to what you say you experienced from feminist circles, but I would say if I encountered someone who called themselves a feminist and then shamed someone for having a polka dot umbrella I'd correct them on that because it's rude and it reinforces gender norms.
/r/MensRights08/12/12 01:22 AM
1

I (a feminist) would say you are a feminist.
/r/MensRights08/12/12 01:17 AM
2

Maybe a better response to this would be to explain that what I have seen in this thread is a conflation of what women say as what feminists think. Just because some ignorant foxnews anchor goes on a rant against men who don't conform to gender ideals doesn't mean that's what feminists think about gender ideals. Likewise, radical feminist thinkers usually try to differentiate themselves from other feminists by naming themselves rad-fems and making sure that people know that their views are diffe…
/r/MensRights08/12/12 01:10 AM
2

What do you mean by "what they've done." Do you mean an effect that they've had on cultural norms? Or do you mean what has been published in academic journals? A current feminist that I find really stimulating is Lila Abu-Lughod. She has written several recent pieces that complexify the relationship of white western feminists to feminists in other areas of the world. Miranda Fricker writes on Epistemic injustice which is very interesting. I would also recommend reading up on the concept of inter…
/r/MensRights08/12/12 01:04 AM
2

There must be some adrenalin rush associated with my response to the complete misunderstanding of feminism regarding Bronies. Bronies happen to be one of the best examples of subverting gender norms (i.e., not conforming to the cultural definitions of men and women as "manly" and "girly"). Bronies are like what they like and they don't apologize for it. This. This is what feminism is about. It's about leaving behind the culturally constructed set of RULES that define what counts as masculine and…
/r/MensRights08/12/12 12:57 AM
3

After reading the comments here all I can think: WILL SOMEONE TELL ME WTF MR's THINKS FEMINISM IS?! Because from what I have read NO ONE here has any idea about feminism beyond what they hear from foxnews and violent radical feminists who are obviously crazy. It appears to me that MRs thinks feminism is about: a. keeping gender norms b. endorsing ideas about manly men being real men c. trying to get special treatment.
/r/MensRights07/12/12 11:22 PM
4

Which feminists have shamed any male for liking a girly show?! I think it would be much more likely that feminsts would shame WOMEN who like girly things for being all conformy to the patriarchy. But MEN who like MLP are acting outside of gender norms and therefore subverting gender norms, which is precisely the aim of feminism.
/r/MensRights07/12/12 11:19 PM
1

I doubt it. I think he just sees himself as a feminist and a person who benefits from feminist thought.
/r/MensRights07/12/12 11:17 PM
3

Feminism according to ShackeSoul: A man is not manly enough so he must be the dreaded gay, or maybe he just lacks a penis, o wait no, hes doing it to get close to our kids the dirty perv! feminism is not about gender conformity and "manly men", Feminism is the exact opposite of this. However, there are many mainstream women who hold these type of patriarchal thoughts. In a fandom formed largely out of men, originally just looking for a bit of support and camaraderie, for others that enjoy a show…
/r/MensRights07/12/12 11:16 PM
4

I would love to know which feminists are saying this. I mean, sure women may say this, but I doubt that they are feminists.
/r/MensRights07/12/12 11:10 PM
4

I hope you don't mind that I upvoted this while intentionally ignoring the sarcasm.
/r/MensRights07/12/12 11:09 PM
1

It is. It is what patriarchy means to us.
/r/MensRights07/12/12 11:07 PM
2

I think he's the perfect example of someone who does know something about feminism. Next time you question what you know about feminism consider what feminist thinkers you are referring to when you construct your idea of "feminism". I personally, would hate to get all of my information from message boards and the internet.
/r/MensRights07/12/12 11:07 PM
4

Actually, it will. Feminism, according to some thinkers, is about problematizing the way that gender is created as a tool for oppressing women and men. In this case, the culture at large associates only women with things that are pink little ponies. But this man doesn't want to live within a compulsory gender normative framework. A false dichotomy where one has to practice continual gender signification. Judith Butler, a prominent feminist, claims that gender is performed rather than constitutiv…
/r/MensRights07/12/12 11:05 PM
1

Adorbs!!
/r/MensRights07/12/12 10:57 PM
0

I had hoped this would be about the massive amount prison rape in general. It's important to put trans people and intersex people in the appropriate setting. Obviously a mtf trans woman with breasts is going to be misplaced in a prison population. Likewise, anyone who has a vagina but is officially male will be definitely victimized. But what about the MILIIONS of people who are regularly raped in prisons now?! I met a person who volunteered as a teacher and pastor at a prison. He admitted that …
/r/MensRights07/12/12 10:51 PM
1

Word. Katy Perry is definitely NOT a feminist.
/r/MensRights07/12/12 10:45 PM
1

I'm very curious about which writers you are using to define feminism as anti-egalitarian? I'm an avid reader of feminist writers and have yet to find a single feminist argue for anything but egalitarianism. Note: Downvote away, but realize, this is a serious question. If you are going to represent a view and argue against it, it only is a disservice to your own view to build a strawman.
/r/MensRights07/12/12 10:44 PM
-1

I didn't realize that mensrights was opposed to feminism. I thought mensrights was about reasonable advocacy for men and against unequal treatment of men culturally and legally. Why is mensrights specifically opposed to feminism? Note: I'm asking about mainstream feminism. The rad-fems are a different thing, which I wouldn't even know to explain.
/r/MensRights07/12/12 10:39 PM
-4

You make a really good point. I wonder to what extent there are female-to-male violence verses male-to-female violence. One would assume that the former is 2-3x more frequent, but that doesn't mean it's the only type of thing that occurs. I think the way that these commemorative events get started though is by people who have been affected getting together and planning it. Going on the web and complaining that there isn't a day that advocates for men who are victims of violence, or assuming that…
/r/MensRights07/12/12 10:31 PM
2

Meanwhile, most questions from the audience, rather than referring to the film, opposed Long's request: "Some men were here to learn, and it's not a simple binary, not all of us are men or women," said one audience member. "You have to know your allies," said another, "changing the dynamic of what is a public screening was not fair. Your invitation was not in my name." Seems like most of the people in the audience didn't agree with Long.
/r/MensRights07/12/12 10:21 PM
1

In all seriousness, I wonder what her reasoning was for asking them to leave.
/r/MensRights07/12/12 10:15 PM
-8

Your language is not helpful.
/r/MensRights07/12/12 10:14 PM
9

Absolutely, they should sue. Gender discrimination isn't okay.
/r/MensRights07/12/12 10:13 PM
-6

Most feminists wouldn't agree with this behavior. Male feminist allies are wonderful, and my own conversion to ardent feminism was from knowing strong male feminists.
/r/MensRights07/12/12 10:12 PM
1

I tried to post this to r/mensrights but I couldn't. So, if someone is interested in starting this discussion please feel free to respond. Title: Reflection on MRs I decided to check out the MRs stratosphere. I keep hearing about this movement and see positive and negative references to this subreddit so I thought I would take a look. I am a feminist. I am all about gender equality and the interrogation of gender dynamics that are oppressive. This doesn't mean that I want women to dominate men. …
/r/MensRights01/12/12 10:57 PM
2

Why is this getting downvoted? It makes no sense. If you are from SRS then this is good news for women and you shouldn't down vote it. If you are from MRA's then the fact that someone has experience of women in power doesn't seem to go against MRs in general. Unless you dislike the idea of women being lab managers, then there is no reason to downvote this comment.
/r/MensRights01/12/12 10:15 PM
1

"It kind of does, actually. Women get financial assistance that men do not, thus allowing them greater security and time for schooling. " AHHHHHHHHHHH! (sorry, I need to get off of MRs. I came here to see if there was anything to this movement. I was glad that there are a couple of points that MR have to make that are valuable, but THIS is just too much) Men make more than women in the work place. When the recession hit, the focus was on recovering men's jobs. When there have been improvements s…
/r/MensRights01/12/12 10:11 PM
6

I'm also in a male dominated field and have noticed a completely disproportionate response from the higher ups to male verses female students. In fact, at times I have had to have all of my statements restated by a male, word-for-word and immediately following my comment, in order to be heard or valued. Every time I spoke to this professor he dismissed my comment without a reason, but when it was restated he adamantly agreed with it. So, I really don't think being a woman in a male dominated fie…
/r/MensRights01/12/12 10:04 PM
1

Wha? How is this showing sexism against men? If men are favored how is that "against" them?
/r/MensRights01/12/12 10:01 PM
3

Why isn't it inherently 'anti-female'? It hurts female scientists if you assume that they can't do "hard, lonely, dirty work"
/r/MensRights01/12/12 10:00 PM
2

Point 2 and 3: if the goal of the article is to show hiring/mentoring bias, then why would likability play a large role. Would you hire someone for an important job that you thought wasn't qualified just because you liked them? Of course you wouldn't. Saying, "She's just not qualified, a great girl, but not qualified" isn't going to make a woman's career opportunities any more broad. Second, another interesting study on the impact of gender when deciding who is better qualified. http://ideas.rep…
/r/MensRights01/12/12 09:58 PM
3

It's true that women who are extremely beautiful are so favored by society that they operate under the false information that everything they say is pure gold and that they can do no wrong. But if this didn't happen to you, it doesn't mean you are ugly. It means that you don't look like the 10% of girls who are just stunning. Personally, I think this is just as harmful to them as it is to the women who don't look like this. The favoritism sets them up with false expectations about the value of t…
/r/MensRights01/12/12 09:51 PM
-9

haha. Women do 2/3rds of the hours worked world wide. That doesn't mean that some women aren't entitled and lazy, but it means that most women work more hours than men for less compensation.
/r/MensRights01/12/12 09:47 PM
6

This would be a problem if they were trying to call it something other than rape. But this is merely a description of a rape. It's not an attempt to diminish the seriousness of the assault.
/r/MensRights01/12/12 09:40 PM
3

Don't you think that woman #2's actions were equally offensive to the woman who wanted to do her job without help? Don't you think that feminists would probably see this as exactly the kind of sexism that is a problem in the workplace. Sexism doesn't have to come from men to be sexism.
/r/MensRights01/12/12 09:38 PM
3

So one woman is a feminist and the other isn't. I say you have to decide which form of masculinity you endorse. It sounds like it isn't the one where "men are responsible for everything" and you see women as completely capable of doing traditionally masculine things. So, tell the woman who's bullying you to back off. Tell her woman are perfectly capable, but you don't mind helping if ANYONE needs help.
/r/MensRights01/12/12 09:35 PM
-25

Just curious about your opinion: If we have the practice of only hiring those who are the most qualified by experience and only certain people get promoted or mentored for the higher positions, then won't the result of your suggestion be that men who are over 6 ft tall, fit, white, and from a middle or upperclass background be the only people who get promoted?
/r/MensRights01/12/12 09:27 PM
3

Interestingly, if you are arguing that this is a mensrights issue because it assumes that mothers are nurturers and fathers aren't, then it's also a feminist issue because it assumes that mothers are nurturers and fathers aren't.
/r/MensRights01/12/12 09:25 PM
2

Clearly that wasn't the only evidence. Clearly someone also said "this dude, this one right here, he raped me."
/r/MensRights30/03/12 10:56 PM
You can kill a man, but you can't kill an idea.

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