One_Job9692 Archive

Upvotes	Title	Category	Author	Subreddit	Date (UTC)
322	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy	Debate	One_Job9692	/r/PurplePillDebate	03/04/25 12:12 PM
201	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it	Debate	One_Job9692	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 10:53 AM
150	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think	Debate	One_Job9692	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 01:43 PM
125	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear	Debate	One_Job9692	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 01:41 PM
125	The Provider Man Model No Longer Works in Modern Western Relationships. It's a scam.	Debate	One_Job9692	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/01/25 05:30 PM
119	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable	Debate	One_Job9692	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 01:52 PM
104	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it	Debate	One_Job9692	/r/PurplePillDebate	08/04/25 03:55 PM
59	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world	Debate	One_Job9692	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 11:25 AM
22	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger	Debate	One_Job9692	/r/PurplePillDebate	17/01/25 06:02 PM
4	As we become more online, how much weight should we give to how men and women interact in digital spaces?	Discussion	One_Job9692	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 10:35 AM

Showing the 1,000 most recent of 1,265 comments.

Upvotes	Comment on	Subreddit	Date (UTC)
-1	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world I think this sounds like negging to you because you're most likely a woman and looking at things through that lens. Objectively, this is a much harsher post for men, and calling for men to raise their standards or x y z will occur, making things more difficult for them.	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 03:12 PM
2	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world I’m not saying that every woman walks around with an inflated ego, but constant uncritical attention can lead to some women feeling like they're in high demand, whether they consciously realise it or not. It’s about how consistent attention, even if undesired, affects self-perception. I agree that women may conclude all men are "lemons" based on their bad experiences. But that’s still a distortion of the reality of the dating market. The real issue is how unfiltered attention, without boundaries…	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 03:08 PM
2	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world "It's not tho". Like this YOUR debate post 😆. If I say the conversation is about x it's x. You don't decide that. Bye. You can get the last word in.	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 03:04 PM
1	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world I’m not saying every guy gets treated that way, but the point is that the dating culture is shaped by patterns of behaviour, including how attention is given and received. The fact that you don't experience this doesn't invalidate anything. I’m not part of the pattern you’re referring to, but I’m still seeing how it distorts things for everyone. Yes that is possible.	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 02:59 PM
-3	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world “Sexual market value” may be a theory, but it's based on observable dynamics in dating. High demand can increase perceived value, but that doesn’t mean it’s genuine value in a deeper, emotional or relational sense. People often move on when they’re not meeting someone’s standards, but that doesn't mean they’re necessarily improving themselves in a meaningful way. The issue is that when surface-level attention becomes equated with self-worth, it leads to distorted expectations and relationships b…	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 02:58 PM
1	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world I’m not claiming every woman experiences this, but that some women, especially those who receive constant attention, can internalise it as validation. That’s a real effect that some women experience, whether or not it applies universally. I’m not idealising anyone, I’m pointing out the patterns and how they affect the dating culture. Only one of us is generalising here...	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 02:56 PM
0	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world Yes, you're right much of that attention is driven by sexual desire. But that’s the point: when women are constantly sought after, even if it’s just for sex, it reinforces the idea that they’re desired. And whether or not they want to acknowledge it, that can still inflate their sense of self-worth and dating value.	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 02:54 PM
9	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world Well yright—men should be more selective. When men don’t hold boundaries, it harms everyone. That’s the conversation here. Men should be dating for genuine connection, not just for a quick hookup. Not doing so has an undesired effect..	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 02:53 PM
-1	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world This comment made me realise how ignorant some women are to male behaviours. You've inspired another post idea for me thank you!	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 02:51 PM
1	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world If you say so.	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 02:50 PM
1	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world Agreed.	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 02:49 PM
1	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world This is not a quantifiable issue.	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 02:49 PM
1	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world My words don't work in your favour. I can't debate someone who has this glamorised infallible view of women. Cheers. You're assuming every woman experiences this "negative" effect, and that is objectively untrue.	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 02:46 PM
3	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world The conversation here is about understanding those dynamics, not waiting for proof that changing them would work. If you're not open to that, then, yeah, we’re done here.	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 02:43 PM
-1	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world If a woman has a dozen men vying for her attention, sure, that reflects some level of desirability. But desirability doesn’t equal worth in a relationship sense. It’s a surface-level measure that often doesn’t account for compatibility, emotional maturity, or genuine connection, all factors that shape long-term value in relationships. As for defining a woman’s worth i dont think its about one set definition, but about recognising that people’s value isn’t determined by how many men are intereste…	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 02:41 PM
2	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world Maybe the reason you're not treated that way is because you're not contributing to the pattern I am criticising. Congrats. Though I'm not sure your intentions with that last comment...	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 02:38 PM
1	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world The issue isn’t just about you as an individual though. This is about the broader dating culture. Even if you filter out men who engage in influencer culture, the lack of standards still shapes the overall dating ecosystem. It’s not just about unwanted attention but about how the bar keeps lowering, making it harder for men to set healthy expectations.	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 02:35 PM
0	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world You’re right that unwanted sexual attention is uncomfortable, demeaning, or even traumatic for many women and no one is denying that. But that doesn’t change the fact that SOME women do internalise constant, uncritical male attention as a form of validation, whether it’s wanted or not. This isn’t about minimising harmful attention, it’s about recognising the broader dynamic where attention—even unearned—can distort self-perception. It’s not about assuming every woman feels the same way but about…	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 02:32 PM
-1	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world This is more so about the subtle effect of constant validation. When they’re flooded with low-effort attention, it reinforces the idea that they’re in demand, even if they’re not interested in those men. It’s about perception, not conscious belief. The issue isn’t whether women settle but how the constant stream of attention skews the overall dating dynamic.	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 02:30 PM
1	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world The effect on the recipient is what matters whether the attention is sleazy or not, it still shapes their self-perception. Trying to excuse the behaviour as manipulation doesn’t change its impact on how people view themselves. You're struggling to accept that maybe just maybe some of your peers don't think like you assume they do. You guys aren't infallible and are just as prone to bad ways of thinking like men are.	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 02:28 PM
1	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world If you don't see a problem with the current dating system then we don't have a debate here. Cheers.	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 02:26 PM
3	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world You're conflating different types of content. Posting in niche, women-focused communities like r/MakeupAddiction isn’t what I’m talking about. That’s not the kind of attention economy driving distorted dating dynamics. The point is about platforms and behaviours where male validation is actively sought out and rewarded whether that’s through thirst-traps, suggestive content, or low-effort posts that still rack up likes. That space exists, it’s massive, and it shapes how some women perceive their…	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 02:24 PM
2	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world It’s not unreasonable to feel like the dating pool is full of lemons—it’s unreasonable to treat every man like one by default. That’s the distortion. You can recognise a pattern without letting it define your entire outlook. The issue is when perception becomes prejudice and too many people, men and women, fall into that.	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 02:19 PM
0	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world You keep shifting the goalposts. First, you say “show me where women think this way,” then when the claim is about perception being shaped over time by attention patterns, you demand hard numbers as if subconscious social dynamics can always be quantified cleanly. You’re asking for lab data on a cultural trend good luck. No one’s saying most women walk around thinking, “I’m relationship material because random men want to have sex with me.” The point is that when attention is constant, even if u…	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 02:07 PM
2	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world Enough men are simping to make it visible and visibility is what drives perception. The dating pool might feel full of “lemons,” but the problem is when women treat all men as if they’re part of that subset. That’s where the distortion comes in. Generalising based on the loudest or thirstiest examples isn’t accurate, but it happens constantly and that’s exactly the issue being called out.	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 02:02 PM
1	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world There’s no emotion here—just observation. You’re fixated on dissecting the metaphor instead of addressing the actual argument: that repeated, unearned attention can warp someone’s self-perception. If you disagree with that point, argue that. Trying to reframe it as emotional bias is just a dodge.	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 02:00 PM
3	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world It’s not about “cock blocking” yourself for other men—it’s about not feeding a system that actively works against your own interests. No one’s saying men should live like monks. The point is, if men constantly reward low-effort behaviour with attention, they're helping create the very dating culture you complain about. You don’t have to care about other guys. But maybe care about not making your own situation worse.	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 01:59 PM
-5	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world Nobody said every woman who rejects a guy thinks she’s above him. The point is that some women especially those constantly pursued regardless of effort or compatibility start to internalise that attention as proof of higher value. That can lead to inflated egos despite body image issues or insecurity. Confidence and insecurity aren’t mutually exclusive. You can dislike your body but still believe you’re too good for most men romantically especially if you’re constantly reminded that men will cha…	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 01:58 PM
2	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world No. Some women are wrong because they generalise all men based on the behaviour of that desperate subset. Simping is often a sign of emotional immaturity or lack of standards, but it’s not representative of all men. The issue is when women take attention from that subset and use it to validate a belief that most men are beneath them. That’s the distortion I’m pointing out.	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 01:53 PM
2	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world You’re stuck on the metaphor instead of the meaning. Whether you see the woman as the car or the customer, the point holds: when something is constantly approached, pitched to, or pursued, it affects perception especially when that pursuit is relentless and uncritical. That’s the dynamic being addressed. The metaphor’s just a tool you’re obsessing over the label instead of the logic.	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 01:52 PM
3	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world Sure but pretending dating dynamics aren’t affected by male behaviour is like denying the dragon while ignoring the burn marks. You don’t need a skull when the fire’s already reshaping the landscape. The evidence is the distorted dating culture we’re all navigating you’re just refusing to connect the cause and effect.	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 01:51 PM
3	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world No it’s wrong because that belief gets reinforced by men who’ll tolerate anything just to be near them. When enough guys chase without standards, it stops being about who is worth their time and starts being about why they think they’re above everyone. That’s the distortion I’m talking about. FYI, condescension will not be able to compensate for your lack of insight.	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 01:50 PM
2	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world The difference is, the car doesn’t have a self-image—people do. When someone is constantly pursued, even by low-effort or unwanted attention, it can still affect how they perceive their own value. That’s the whole point. The pandering doesn’t change objective value, but it can absolutely warp perceived value in the mind of the person receiving it.	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 01:49 PM
2	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world If you think everyone who disagrees with you is just inexperienced or unqualified, then you’re not debating—you’re just insulating your worldview. That’s not a discussion.	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 01:47 PM
0	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world You're emotionally venting, not actually debunking anything. Saying “some women believe they’re unworthy” doesn’t refute the claim that others especially those flooded with male attention might internalise the opposite. Both things can be true at once. That’s not a contradiction; it’s reality. Also, high demand doesn’t always equal high value in dating. Being desired sexually doesn’t guarantee you’re a good partner ask anyone who’s been in a toxic relationship with someone “hot.” You’re throwing…	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 01:43 PM
2	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world Regardless it still proves the point. When sleazy salesmen flood the market and never stop pitching, it inflates the perceived value of anything they’re pitching to. Even if the attention is unwanted, the sheer volume of it creates a distorted sense of desirability. The quality of the attention doesn’t matter as much as the consistency of it.	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 01:42 PM
3	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world Cool. Cheers the for the "debate"	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 01:40 PM
1	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world And yet the junker still gets sold, over and over again. That’s the point. When enough people are willing to chase and praise something, even if it’s low-quality, it creates the illusion that it’s high value. Doesn’t matter if the intention is manipulative the effect is still validation.	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 01:34 PM
2	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world Right, but calling something “bullshit” doesn’t make it so. If you actually disagreed with the argument, you’d engage with the substance not just write it off as dangerous or dumb. That kind of hand-waving isn’t analysis, it’s deflection. If you think the take is flawed, prove it. Otherwise, you’re just noise.	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 01:32 PM
2	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world First comment from a woman saying this. Cheers.	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 01:31 PM
0	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world No but if every car salesman treated me like a luxury vehicle no matter what condition I was in, I might start to believe it. That’s the difference. When praise is constant and uncalled for, it starts to shape self-perception.	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 01:30 PM
1	Non-westerners and non-assimilated foreigners are ruining western dating discourse and western dating. Based on Reddit being mostly white yeah. I am also mixed.	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 01:29 PM
1	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world Because those women still exist in the same dating market. Men don’t suddenly raise their standards just because a woman isn’t online they’ve already been conditioned by constant exposure to the loudest, most attention-seeking types. That sets the tone for dating expectations across the board, whether someone participates in the culture or not.	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 01:28 PM
2	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world I think comments like this miss the point entirely. This subreddit exists to analyse gender dynamics and cultural contradictions—so dismissing any critical post as “whining” just shows you’re not engaging in good faith. If that’s not your thing, feel free to move on. Also, I love the classic: “stop whining [debating] about gender dynamics… in a subreddit about debating gender dynamics.” comments. Cheers for your "contribution."	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 01:27 PM
-1	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world I’m not worried about them. I’m pointing out how their behaviour reflects a larger pattern that affects the dating pool as a whole. You don’t have to date them for their influence to be felt. That’s the point.	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 01:03 PM
2	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world The volume may be small, but the impact isn’t.	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 12:52 PM
1	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world Good. You can move on from this debate then.	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 12:51 PM
-2	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world That’s true in economics not necessarily in dating. Being in high demand might reflect surface-level appeal, but it doesn’t automatically mean someone is emotionally healthy, relationship-ready, or a good long-term partner. A woman getting endless attention doesn’t mean she’s “high-value” in a romantic context—it just means a lot of men want to sleep with her. And that’s the core issue: conflating sexual demand with deeper value leads to mismatched expectations and inflated self-perception.	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 12:49 PM
1	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world You're right that the attention isn't evenly distributed more conventionally attractive women get the bulk of it. But even average women get more attention than their male counterparts, especially online. And when attention comes easy, even if it's from men they don’t want, it still subtly reinforces the idea that they’re in demand. It’s not about guys obsessing over every woman it’s about the volume and consistency of low-effort, unfiltered attention. That’s what skews perceptions and inflates …	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 12:48 PM
1	Non-westerners and non-assimilated foreigners are ruining western dating discourse and western dating. Personally, I would have assumed this mostly white people. I felt that was pretty obvious, hence my question.	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 12:46 PM
7	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world You’re not wrong that a lot of people chase clicks for money but let’s not pretend the validation and the profit aren’t linked. The reason influencer culture works is because attention feels like value, especially when it’s constant. That feedback loop affects how people especially younger women see themselves, even if they’re not consciously thinking “I want male validation.” And yeah, men do it too. But when men chase validation, they’re often mocked or ignored. When women chase it, it’s reinf…	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 12:44 PM
2	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world Influencer culture, dating app behaviour, and social media are built on the currency of male attention. Not all women chase it, but plenty benefit from it and yes, some internalise it as validation, even subconsciously. It’s not that men are “incapable” of rejecting what they don’t want it’s that too many don’t, and that refusal to walk away from low-effort interactions is what keeps the whole cycle alive.	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 12:43 PM
2	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world All good.	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 12:15 PM
4	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world You’re reading more into it than what’s actually there. I never said women get big egos just for not sleeping with me I said some women develop inflated perceptions of their value because of relentless attention from men who offer it uncritically. That includes DMs, matches, stares, comments most of which come from guys they don’t even like, but it still reinforces the idea that they’re always in demand. And I agree not all men are quiet or desperate. But enough are to shape dating dynamics. Thi…	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 12:06 PM
1	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world You’re right that attraction isn’t purely logical and yes, plenty of men get turned off by interest from someone they’re not into. But here’s the difference: that kind of attention doesn’t follow most men everywhere they go. For women, it’s constant, and when that attention is coming from all directions whether it’s desired or not it still reinforces a sense of desirability, even if it’s just in the background. I’m not saying every woman is walking around feeling superior, but some absolutely co…	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 12:04 PM
1	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world You’re describing how some women think and that’s fair. But pretending that most women completely separate sexual attention from perceived value just isn’t honest. If that were true, we wouldn’t see people tying self-worth to likes, messages, compliments, or who’s “in their DMs.” That dynamic fuels a whole chunk of online culture. Also, it’s not about men projecting but bout what’s observable. Some women do equate constant attention with desirability, even if it's subconscious. You’re right that…	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 11:56 AM
-2	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world Agreed, there are men with standards but that’s kind of the point. They're less visible because they’re not constantly online or chasing women who don’t meet their criteria. What most women see day to day on apps, in DMs, in public is the noisy, desperate subset. And that subset shapes perception. You're also right that insecurity drives a lot of this. But acknowledging that doesn’t mean we excuse it. My post isn’t just saying “stop being insecure” it’s pointing out how unchecked male behaviour …	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 11:54 AM
3	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world If it were mostly annoying, it wouldn’t be monetised, flaunted, or used as leverage in dating. Let's be real—women filter out the unwanted attention but still benefit from the volume of it. And no, I’m not saying all women are delusional. I’m saying constant male thirst enables delusion in some especially when they mistake being desired for being deeply valued.	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 11:53 AM
-1	Male desperation is what reinforces and in many cases, creates female delusion in the dating world Fair point but i don't think it contradicts mine. If men’s low standards lower the bar for women’s effort, it’s not a stretch to say that same dynamic also fuels their inflated sense of value. Women aren’t delusional in a vacuum—they’re reacting to nonstop male validation, even when they’ve done nothing to earn it.	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 11:52 AM
4	Men aren't approaching women due to a lack of social skills, merely because they are taught not to. Yep	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 11:22 AM
1	Non-westerners and non-assimilated foreigners are ruining western dating discourse and western dating. Surprisingly?	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 10:00 AM
18	Men aren't approaching women due to a lack of social skills, merely because they are taught not to. Better that than someone who can’t handle a real answer and hides behind emojis when the truth hits too close. Keep laughing it's easier than thinking.	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 09:58 AM
34	Men aren't approaching women due to a lack of social skills, merely because they are taught not to. Love when women ask this like they’d actually take the answer seriously like they wouldn't mock, dismiss, or downplay it the second it doesn’t fit their narrative. The moment a man talks about the emotional damage caused by women, it’s either a joke, an eye-roll, or “we have it worse.” But we should care about your traumas/bad experiences? What a joke.	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 09:54 AM
9	Men aren't approaching women due to a lack of social skills, merely because they are taught not to. You're right shoplifting has tangible benefits to it 😆	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 09:52 AM
7	Men aren't approaching women due to a lack of social skills, merely because they are taught not to. I made a post addressing female on male violence, and it's not so surprisingly full of angry women dismissing and downplaying it. They absolutely loathe any conversation that even slightly admits their shit stinks too.	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 09:48 AM
12	Men aren't approaching women due to a lack of social skills, merely because they are taught not to. Absolutely agree here This is the result of consistent messaging from authority figures, institutions, and media over formative years. If you repeatedly tell young men not to approach women, that doing so is intrusive or even threatening, then yeah, it’s not a mystery that many grow up internalising that. It’s social conditioning, plain and simple. This shouldn't be about blaming women or invalidating anyone’s experiences but about recognising how the cultural response, however well-intentioned,…	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 09:47 AM
1	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy Ironically "taking it on the chin" will eventually fall back on women. Bottling things up has never led to good results for us men...	/r/PurplePillDebate	11/04/25 06:21 AM
1	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it Thank you brother	/r/PurplePillDebate	10/04/25 06:53 PM
1	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it Stop reading after the first statement. There's nothing else to debate. Bye.	/r/PurplePillDebate	10/04/25 01:57 PM
1	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it You’re missing the point. Yes, statistically speaking, female abusers may be less common but calling them “atypical” isn’t being objective in this context, it’s being dismissive. It’s used as a rhetorical shield to avoid reckoning with their behaviour. We don’t call male abusers “atypical” because they’re the statistical majority but more importantly, we still hold them individually accountable regardless of that. That’s what’s missing when women are violent: people rush to soften, explain away,…	/r/PurplePillDebate	10/04/25 11:03 AM
2	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it Calling these women “atypical” is a way to distance them from accountability. But when men act out violently, we don’t default to “oh, he’s not a typical guy” we hold him responsible and examine the cultural conditions around it. That’s the same standard I’m calling for here. Statistical majority doesn’t mean moral immunity. Just because something’s less common doesn’t mean it should be dismissed, laughed at, or downplayed especially when the victims are consistently ignored or ridiculed for spe…	/r/PurplePillDebate	10/04/25 07:16 AM
1	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it We don't have anything to discuss here if you're so delusional that you genuinely think female on male abuse is some made-up thing. Cheers.	/r/PurplePillDebate	10/04/25 07:15 AM
1	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it You’re comparing consensual, context-specific gestures between teammates to one-sided, performative aggression framed as “content.” That’s not camaraderie—it’s a cop-out. The difference is consent, intent, and power dynamic. Nobody’s calling a fist bump or chest bump abuse. We're talking about public humiliation or striking a partner in a way that would never be defended if the roles were reversed. Your attempt to paint this as me disrespecting “real” survivors is rich, considering you're the on…	/r/PurplePillDebate	09/04/25 11:17 PM
1	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it You say “holy projection,” but your entire response dodges what I actually said. I didn’t accuse you personally of abusing men. I pointed out a cultural pattern where female-perpetrated harm is often minimised or laughed off. Your discomfort with that point doesn’t make it go away. Your racism analogy collapses under its own weight. If someone said, “Racism’s not real because I don’t see it,” you’d (rightfully) call that denial. That’s exactly what you did with female-on-male abuse: dismissed it…	/r/PurplePillDebate	09/04/25 11:15 PM
1	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it Right and that framing made sense in the context of gender-based violence where women have historically been the primary victims. But the issue now is that this framing has become default, even when the roles are reversed. Saying “these aren’t typical women” is exactly the kind of distancing that lets abusive behaviour get excused or ignored. If a man lashes out, i dont think saying “he’s not a typical guy” is gonna go down well and for good reason. The point isn’t that women aren’t victims. It’…	/r/PurplePillDebate	09/04/25 09:38 PM
2	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it I'm not sure what you're attempting to say, to be honest.	/r/PurplePillDebate	09/04/25 09:30 PM
1	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it This is so odd. Your over reliance on "algorithms" to dismiss the acceptance and existence of female on male abuse is truly bizarre. Worst part is that your logic doesn't hold up. Everything you're saying I could say the same about racism and never seeing racist videos, but I wouldn’t pretend that means racism isn’t an issue. What's your stance here/goal? Do you think what I'm saying doesn't exist? What I'm getting here is a woman who is uncomfortable with a conversation that inherently threaten…	/r/PurplePillDebate	09/04/25 09:28 PM
1	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it Well said	/r/PurplePillDebate	09/04/25 09:17 PM
2	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it Completely agree. The stigma around advocating for male victims is one of the biggest barriers. The second someone brings it up, they’re either accused of derailing, being contrarian, or having some hidden agenda. And that shuts down so many people who actually do care and want to help, especially within progressive spaces that should be leading the charge on empathy and equality. And you're right. It’s not about forcing every feminist to take on every issue but we should at least create room fo…	/r/PurplePillDebate	09/04/25 02:04 PM
3	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it You’re so sensitive that the first explanation you reach for is “TikTok brainrot” instead of actually engaging with the point. The idea that leniency toward female-on-male abuse is just an algorithmic illusion is wild and honestly says more about your denial than it does about me. The self-reporting in this thread is doing half the work for me. It's hilarious how averse some of you women are to acknowledging how your shit stinks too and how you benefit from patriarchy.	/r/PurplePillDebate	09/04/25 02:01 PM
2	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it And it means nothing. Try again.	/r/PurplePillDebate	09/04/25 01:57 PM
2	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it Ah, there it is—the classic minimising: “It’s just a prank,” “It’s for views,” “He can handle it,” “No bad intent.” That’s exactly the cultural blind spot I’m talking about. When a man does something similar, it’s not waved off as “dramatic” or “harmless content.” It’s instantly scrutinised, criticised, and often condemned regardless of context. But when a woman hits, slaps, or humiliates a man in a skit, vlog, or prank video, people rush to downplay it. “It’s just a bit,” “She didn’t mean it,” …	/r/PurplePillDebate	09/04/25 01:57 PM
3	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it Here's one I quickly find. Not abusive at all!: https://vm.tiktok.com/ZNdNDMJFS/ And another: https://vm.tiktok.com/ZNdNDr3v8/ I can link more if you like 😁	/r/PurplePillDebate	09/04/25 12:31 PM
3	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it I’d probably say the same thing if I had nothing intelligent or constructive to offer, too. If you’re that bothered by someone pointing out a real double standard, maybe it’s not them who’s too online its you who’s too uncomfortable to deal with reality.	/r/PurplePillDebate	09/04/25 12:28 PM
3	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it If it don't apply let it fly 😁	/r/PurplePillDebate	09/04/25 12:25 PM
3	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it Pointing out a cultural blind spot is doing something. Talking about it is doing something. You don’t get to dismiss that just because it doesn’t look like activism you approve of. It's only people who are bothered by the topic of conversation that spout bs like this. And spare me the guilt trip about “taking it out on women.” Criticising how society reacts to female-perpetrated harm isn’t an attack it’s accountability. If you can’t tell the difference, maybe you’re part of the problem I’m descr…	/r/PurplePillDebate	09/04/25 12:24 PM
3	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it You mock the effort, then claim we’re not making one. That’s the entire issue. When men raise valid concerns, they’re ridiculed, tone-policed, or told they’re not doing it “the right way.” Meanwhile, the people doing the mocking offer nothing but sarcasm and dismissal. If you're genuinely about solutions, start by listening instead of sneering. Change doesn't start with perfection.it starts with calling things out, even when people like you laugh instead of engage.	/r/PurplePillDebate	09/04/25 12:08 PM
3	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it The point is that when women behave abusively especially in casual, public ways it’s often brushed off, laughed at, or framed as harmless. That reaction is what’s telling. You say “we shouldn’t judge people based on the worst of us,” but male behaviour is constantly judged that way by media, by institutions, by online discourse. So if you're fine throwing that lens on men, don’t flinch when the same scrutiny is turned around. If you claim to stand for equality, that standard goes both ways. http…	/r/PurplePillDebate	09/04/25 12:06 PM
2	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it The point is that the path to that change isn’t as simple as “just do what women did.” If you ignore the social costs men face when they speak up mockery, dismissal, even shame from other men and women alike you’re not offering a solution. You’re offering a shrug wrapped in a command. “Doesn’t change what has to happen” is easy to say when you're not the one carrying the weight of the stigma. Real progress requires more than telling the unheard to shout louder it requires the rest of society to …	/r/PurplePillDebate	09/04/25 10:05 AM
3	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it Nobody’s asking women to speak for men. What I’m saying is stop acting like male silence is just passivity, when it’s shaped by a culture that mocks them the moment they do speak. Yes, women faced resistance but they also gained solidarity, funding, and platforms. Men, especially when abused by women, still get met with disbelief or laughter. And let’s not pretend the ground was level. Society was already primed to care about female harm. It resisted, yes—but it didn’t ridicule in the same way. …	/r/PurplePillDebate	09/04/25 09:12 AM
3	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it We will word this however we like it and if women such as yourself are offended by it, that's just you telling us how hateful and toxic you are. We always appreciate the self report though.	/r/PurplePillDebate	09/04/25 09:11 AM
3	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it You’re proving my point. When men speak up, they’re told how to speak, what to focus on, and how not to make anyone uncomfortable. That’s not support that’s tone policing. And yes, people are building safe spaces and resources for men, but cultural change requires conversation too. Calling out double standards isn’t "blablabla" it’s part of breaking the silence that makes those safe spaces necessary in the first place. If we can't even name the problem, we’re not solving anything.	/r/PurplePillDebate	09/04/25 09:10 AM
1	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it The title’s worded that way because of the imbalance its not about ignoring female pain, it’s about how it’s often centered to the point where other forms of harm, especially male suffering, get sidelined or dismissed. My post isn’t saying female pain shouldn’t matter it’s saying it shouldn’t be the only pain we treat as urgent or culturally valid. So yeah, the wording is deliberate. It’s meant to highlight the blind spot, not shift the blame.	/r/PurplePillDebate	09/04/25 09:09 AM
4	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it Good to see a woman saying this.	/r/PurplePillDebate	09/04/25 09:08 AM
4	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it Another lazy point. Try again.	/r/PurplePillDebate	09/04/25 09:07 AM
3	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it I’m not upset about pushback I’m calling out bad faith responses that twist the argument into something it never was. Criticism is fair game; misrepresenting what I said to avoid engaging with it isn’t. This post is about public accountability for public behaviour not silencing anyone, and definitely not shielding myself from critique. But if the best counter is to pretend this is just “criticising women online for no reason,” then you’re not debating you’re dodging.	/r/PurplePillDebate	09/04/25 09:06 AM
3	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it This isn’t about asking feminists to “cater” to men it’s about applying the same values consistently. If a movement claims to care about equality, then male victims shouldn’t be treated like an afterthought just because they don’t fit the usual narrative. Pointing out that imbalance isn’t hostility it’s accountability. And if someone needs a reward to care about basic fairness, that kind of proves the point.	/r/PurplePillDebate	09/04/25 09:05 AM
2	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it By that logic, I could say racism isn’t a real issue because I don’t see racist content on my feed. Would that suddenly make it invalid? Of course not. Just because you don’t see something doesn’t mean it’s not widespread or influential. Social media shapes public perception whether you want to admit it or not. Dismissing everything as “just TikTok” is lazy. You don’t get to pick and choose when it matters. I get this topic makes you guys uncomfortable but wow is this pathetic.	/r/PurplePillDebate	09/04/25 09:04 AM
1	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it There we go.	/r/PurplePillDebate	09/04/25 09:02 AM
3	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it Blaming algorithm is a weak argument. Let it go. There are smarter ways to dismiss what I'm saying because it makes you uncomfortable.	/r/PurplePillDebate	09/04/25 09:02 AM
2	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it Yep its not new. What has changed is how society frames it. The focus on female pain has been essential and overdue, but when that becomes the dominant lens, it can overshadow harm that doesn’t fit that narrative. The issue isn’t that the spotlight exists it’s that there hasn’t been much effort to widen it. Acknowledging male victims more openly doesn’t take anything away from female ones. It just makes the picture more honest.	/r/PurplePillDebate	09/04/25 09:00 AM
6	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it Well said.	/r/PurplePillDebate	09/04/25 08:57 AM
3	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it Typical to be honest.	/r/PurplePillDebate	09/04/25 08:57 AM
5	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it I get where you’re coming from and you’re right that the roots of this issue go deeper than modern activism. But when I said “as a result,” I wasn’t blaming the push for female victims’ rights. I was pointing out an unintended consequence of how certain narratives have been amplified while others were neglected. The cultural blind spot around male victims didn’t start with feminism but some extreme voices, left unchecked, have made it harder to talk about harm when it doesn’t fit the usual scrip…	/r/PurplePillDebate	09/04/25 08:56 AM
3	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it Really sorry to hear that. This is why this topic needs to be talked about so much.	/r/PurplePillDebate	09/04/25 08:55 AM
1	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it You can check out my response to this copy and pasted comment on a different comment.	/r/PurplePillDebate	08/04/25 06:04 PM
8	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it Appreciate the passion, but your entire reply is built on a strawman of a post you admittedly didn’t read properly. First off, nowhere did I say patriarchy was “better for women.” That’s either bad faith or you projecting. The post literally says patriarchy hurts everyone, including male victims. That’s not blame-shifting it’s recognising a shared systemic issue that affects both genders differently. Second, I never excused male responsibility. I called out a cultural blind spot where female-per…	/r/PurplePillDebate	08/04/25 06:03 PM
7	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it This is exactly the kind of selective framing that keeps the cycle going. You say men don’t take harm against themselves seriously but maybe ask why that is. It’s not because men don’t care. It’s because when they do speak up, they’re mocked, doubted, or treated like they’re weak. And that reaction often comes from both men and women. You’re giving all the credit to women for taking abuse seriously, but ignore that they had cultural backing, sympathy, and systems that evolved to support them eve…	/r/PurplePillDebate	08/04/25 06:00 PM
10	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it “Doesn’t show up on my feed” isn’t a counter-argument it’s anecdotal and irrelevant. The fact you personally haven’t seen it doesn’t erase how common this content is or how popular it clearly is to others. Algorithms reflect what performs well across a platform, not just what you’ve clicked on. If anything, your lack of exposure proves the point: people only seem to take it seriously when it’s everywhere for them but when male harm is normalised or brushed off, it’s easy to miss because nobody l…	/r/PurplePillDebate	08/04/25 05:58 PM
5	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it Sure individuals support who they want to. But culture isn’t just a sum of personal intentions, it’s shaped by patterns, media narratives, institutions, and public attitudes over time. When male suffering is routinely ignored or mocked especially in relational or domestic contexts that is culture at work, even if no one voted for it. I’m not denying that some people support men or that there aren’t great examples like your outreach work. That’s important. But this post is talking about the broad…	/r/PurplePillDebate	08/04/25 05:54 PM
14	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it Sure individuals support who they want to. But culture isn’t just a sum of personal intentions, it’s shaped by patterns, media narratives, institutions, and public attitudes over time. When male suffering is routinely ignored or mocked especially in relational or domestic contexts that is culture at work, even if no one voted for it. I’m not denying that some people support men or that there aren’t great examples like your outreach work. That’s important. But this post is talking about the broad…	/r/PurplePillDebate	08/04/25 05:54 PM
10	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it Appreciate that you acknowledge women can perpetuate patriarchy but you can’t have it both ways. You admit the system still treats women as default victims and men as emotionless tanks, yet somehow claim centering female pain isn’t part of the problem? You’re right that patriarchy is the root—but when mainstream narratives only uplift female victims while ignoring or mocking male ones, that selective framing becomes part of the machinery too. “Didn’t read the full post” says a lot, because if yo…	/r/PurplePillDebate	08/04/25 05:51 PM
7	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it But that’s the thing these videos aren’t framed as abuse. They’re usually casual vlogs, pranks, or “couple content” where a woman hits, screams at, or humiliates her partner and it’s all treated like harmless entertainment. That’s exactly the problem. It’s not just what’s happening it’s how normalized and unserious it’s made to look. So no, this isn’t just an “algorithm” issue. If these videos perform well enough to keep showing up, that reflects audience engagement. People watch, like, and shar…	/r/PurplePillDebate	08/04/25 05:48 PM
8	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it I'm a bit confused. I’m not sure how this ties into white supremacy or institutional racism	/r/PurplePillDebate	08/04/25 05:44 PM
8	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it Yes, some women face disbelief when speaking out but the default narrative still supports them. We have hashtags, public campaigns, mainstream support structures, and institutional language that centres their pain (Duluth model). Male victims don’t have that. The mockery and apathy they face isn’t occasional it’s standard. And no saying “it has to start with men” just punts the responsibility elsewhere. Imagine if people told women during the #MeToo movement, “Well, until you stop romanticising …	/r/PurplePillDebate	08/04/25 05:14 PM
8	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it What you’re describing isn’t accountability it’s misogyny, double standards, and societal policing of women’s choices, which feminism rightly fights against. That’s not the same as being held accountable for how you treat other people especially men. My post isn’t about calling women ugly or telling them to stay in the kitchen. It’s about how society often refuses to hold women accountable when they cause harm. Not personal choices, not how they dress actual harm to others. The fact that you're …	/r/PurplePillDebate	08/04/25 05:10 PM
15	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it Saying “women get called out too” doesn’t disprove anything it actually highlights the imbalance. When women face criticism, it’s often met with outrage, defence, or reframed as misogyny. When men speak about their abuse, it’s met with disbelief, mockery, or apathy. That’s the difference. And sure, you can say you condemn female violence but if your takeaway is “nothing’s going to change anyway,” that’s just passive resignation. It’s not enough to personally disagree with a broken attitude while…	/r/PurplePillDebate	08/04/25 04:48 PM
9	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it Right, because if you see a pattern of bad behaviour, the issue isn’t the behaviour it’s your algorithm. That’s a convenient way to dodge the conversation entirely. It’s not “falling for rage bait” to notice something that happens often enough to feel normalised, especially when the response to it is laughter or silence. If anything, the fact these videos perform well says something about the audience too it’s not just the algorithm, it’s the culture that finds this stuff entertaining or harmles…	/r/PurplePillDebate	08/04/25 04:46 PM
9	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it Hilarious bait. Predictably unintelligent.	/r/PurplePillDebate	08/04/25 04:45 PM
5	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it Sure, people are dangerous. That’s not in dispute. But saying “everyone can be violent” is a convenient way to dodge the specific issue: society doesn’t treat male and female violence the same. When a man hits a woman, it’s (rightfully) condemned. When a woman hits a man especially in public or on camera it’s joked about, excused, or ignored. That’s the double standard. The “women are also people” line is only ever pulled out when it’s time to diffuse accountability, not when it’s time to apply …	/r/PurplePillDebate	08/04/25 04:45 PM
20	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it You realise how messed up that is, right? You’re just openly saying it doesn’t matter unless it fits your idea of serious. That’s exactly the problem. Abuse isn’t only valid when it’s sexual or parental. Emotional abuse, psychological control, public humiliation, and yes even physical violence from women can leave real, lasting damage. Downplaying it just because it doesn’t fit a certain mould is how victims fall through the cracks. This kind of selective empathy is why male victims stay silent.…	/r/PurplePillDebate	08/04/25 04:41 PM
12	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it That’s a dishonest read, and if you actually cared about the conversation, you’d know it. The post never said women shouldn’t talk about their problems or that women should “stay silent.” It said everyone men and women should be open to criticism when valid and fair. The point was that men are constantly broken down, critiqued, and psychoanalysed in media and culture and they’re expected to take it. But when women face even light scrutiny, suddenly it’s sexism or “misogyny.” The “pushback” comme…	/r/PurplePillDebate	08/04/25 04:40 PM
17	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it No, “centering female pain” doesn’t mean simply talking about hardships women face. It means building a cultural narrative where female suffering is consistently prioritised, believed, and validated while male suffering is downplayed, joked about, or ignored. That’s the imbalance being highlighted. And nobody here is barging into a conversation about a woman’s trauma and shouting, “But what about men?” This post wasn’t a reply to someone else’s pain it’s its own conversation, about a blind spot …	/r/PurplePillDebate	08/04/25 04:38 PM
11	A culture that centres female pain struggles to acknowledge when women cause it “If it’s a relationship just leave” is such a lazy take. People say the same thing to women in abusive relationships, and rightly get called out for lacking empathy or understanding of how abuse works. But when it’s a man, suddenly that logic’s acceptable? Abuse isn’t just about bruises it’s about control, manipulation, and fear. And men, just like women, can be psychologically worn down, isolated, and gaslit into staying. On top of that, men are less likely to be believed if they speak up, and …	/r/PurplePillDebate	08/04/25 04:35 PM
2	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable Well said.	/r/PurplePillDebate	08/04/25 05:38 AM
1	There is no point in telling women theyre not entitled to safety. It's usually cringe red pillers. Can't stand them.	/r/PurplePillDebate	08/04/25 05:37 AM
3	There's a narrative out there that someone who has never been in a relationship is undateable because they "don't know how to be in a relationship". What are some examples of this? Can the reason just be you didn't feel like it/didn't want to/had other priorities?	/r/PurplePillDebate	07/04/25 08:14 PM
2	There is no point in telling women theyre not entitled to safety. Grass is green	/r/PurplePillDebate	07/04/25 01:27 PM
3	There is no point in telling women theyre not entitled to safety. At most you'll get a police call. I'm not risking getting stabbed for you.	/r/PurplePillDebate	07/04/25 01:24 PM
2	There is no point in telling women theyre not entitled to safety. Incorrect	/r/PurplePillDebate	07/04/25 01:22 PM
1	There is no point in telling women theyre not entitled to safety. Valid	/r/PurplePillDebate	07/04/25 01:21 PM
1	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable Sure	/r/PurplePillDebate	07/04/25 06:59 AM
2	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy Well said.	/r/PurplePillDebate	07/04/25 01:09 AM
1	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable I'm not a woman, and those power structures are harmful.	/r/PurplePillDebate	07/04/25 01:07 AM
1	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable Exactly and that’s part of the problem. When men feel entitled to express attraction with zero filter or purpose, it stops being confidence and starts being noise. Whether it’s about approval or control, the outcome’s the same: cheap attention no one respects and that can often turn into harassment. A line must be drawn.	/r/PurplePillDebate	07/04/25 12:34 AM
0	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable If it were really about self-expression, men wouldn’t crumble when that attention gets ignored. Let’s be real—most of it isn’t about expressing something for yourself, it’s about hoping for a response. That’s not self-expression, it’s approval-seeking dressed up as honesty. This is my post. You don't get it.	/r/PurplePillDebate	07/04/25 12:30 AM
2	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable Incorrect.	/r/PurplePillDebate	07/04/25 12:03 AM
2	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable No one said all compliments mean you lack self-respect. The point is when it’s compulsive, unfiltered, and purely driven by attraction, it stops being thoughtful and starts being performative. That’s not confidence—it’s validation-seeking Why you as a woman are trying to argue this is baffling. I get the urge to blindly argue as is the Reddit way but actually think about what I'm saying. Advocating for men to be sexually disciplined and not smother women with validation is a GOOD thing.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 11:19 PM
1	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable There we go we agree.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 11:18 PM
2	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable Exposed by how clearly the message applies to them. If someone genuinely didn’t relate, they’d scroll past. But when someone gets defensive over a general observation, it usually means it hit a nerve.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 11:16 PM
1	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable Let it go. Seriously, we've done enough.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 11:15 PM
1	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable Nah, I just don’t think basic physical attraction deserves a standing ovation. If your bar for giving out praise is ‘she exists and I’m attracted,’ that’s not generosity—it’s low standards. And it’s exactly why male attention is an inconvenience to a lot of women and not wanted. Too much of it.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 10:12 PM
2	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable You’re confusing discipline with bitterness. This isn’t about ‘withholding affection’ out of spite it’s about not giving it away reflexively out of neediness. And framing a call for self-respect as ‘unnatural weirdness’ says more about how normalised desperation has become than anything I’ve said	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 10:10 PM
1	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable Exactly and people are free to ignore it. But the ones who get defensive usually aren’t ignoring it. They’re exposed by it.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 10:07 PM
1	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable I did	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 10:05 PM
1	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable Advice doesn’t need to be requested to be relevant. Next.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 09:40 PM
1	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable It's run it's course. Move on	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 09:38 PM
1	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable That’s a wild projection. Telling men to stop tripping over themselves for every attractive woman isn’t about control—it’s about self-respect. If you think discipline and standards are a tactic to manipulate women, maybe ask why male restraint feels threatening to you	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 08:35 PM
1	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable No, it means don’t hand out praise just because someone’s attractive. ‘Earning it’ means showing basic qualities like kindness, effort, personality that go beyond looks. If you’re giving compliments just because someone exists, that’s not connection—it’s desperation	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 08:30 PM
2	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable If you see basic discipline as intrasexual competition, you’ve already told on yourself.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 08:29 PM
1	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable Telling men to develop standards and stop giving out low-effort attention is part of becoming the kind of person worth taking seriously. If you think self-respect is a distraction from self-improvement, you’re missing the point entirely.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 08:19 PM
1	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable It’s not about having authority—it’s about having eyes. If you can’t recognise obvious patterns of behaviour in how men interact with women online and in real life, that’s on you. No one needs a PhD or a YouTube channel to point out self-sabotaging behaviour when it’s everywhere.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 07:40 PM
1	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable More than the women they pedestalise. More than the strangers they chase for validation. If your attention is handed out to anyone just because you’re attracted to them, it doesn’t look like self-worth it looks like neediness. That’s how you lower your value, not by speaking, but by showing you’ll give your energy to anyone with a face.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 07:21 PM
1	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable We've sent multiple paragraph long we'll thought out responses to each other. At some point you hit a stalemate and have to leave it at the fact we disagree. Let it go.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 06:30 PM
1	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable Again I disagree.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 06:05 PM
1	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable I disagree. Cheers for the debate.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 06:03 PM
1	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable It’s about men valuing themselves more.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 06:02 PM
1	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable You though it was silly...so why are you here ? Bye!	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 06:01 PM
2	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable It went over your head. It happens!	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 05:58 PM
2	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable "Worked up". Come on its a basic reddit post (far from my best work). Be honest. You had nothing constructive or intelligent to say and it shows. Sorry if my post bothered you in any way!	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 05:54 PM
1	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable It’s not judging all female behaviour it’s pointing out how men’s behaviour collectively shapes how women respond. If you can’t tell the difference between describing a pattern and blaming a gender, you’re not reading in good faith.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 05:53 PM
1	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable Yes. I am bothered by the countless men whose thirst for women borders on obsession and turns to harassment. What I'm discouraging and calling out benefits women too. You have no basis here to argue with me unless you're just bored.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 05:52 PM
1	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable What I'm discouraging indirectly discourages that behaviour as well. There's no argument to be hard here we agree...	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 05:49 PM
1	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable Okay? This is a debate subreddit, not a life coaching session. I’m not expecting insecure men to turn their lives around because of a Reddit post but pointing out thesw problems still matters. Especially when half the replies act like it’s not even real or an issue. If one guy reads it and actually reflects, that’s already a win I'm not bothered.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 05:48 PM
1	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable Right that and a lack of sexual discipline, over valuing women, pedastilsing women are part of the explanation.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 05:44 PM
3	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable It's ok you're a woman and don't get it.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 05:42 PM
1	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable It will because it's the first step as they don't see what their doing as wrong. That needs to be established first.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 05:10 PM
1	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable Ever sadder.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 05:07 PM
3	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable Cool. I do actually give a fuck so i am going to call out bullshit male behaviour because I actually want us to get better for our own sakes.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 05:06 PM
1	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable Well at some point they'll have to change if they want their outcomes to change so it doesn't matter.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 05:03 PM
1	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable Well said.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 04:53 PM
2	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable Oh they're definitely listening. They're all over this comment section in their feelings.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 04:50 PM
2	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable Yep. It's ridiculous but not surprising.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 04:48 PM
1	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable The problem isn’t women receiving it, it’s men giving it out willy nilly.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 04:48 PM
7	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable I'd argue they have just not in ways that benefit us.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 04:45 PM
2	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable Simple: have standards. Don’t give out attention just because someone’s attractive. Compliment when it’s genuine, not when it’s driven by thirst. Learn to pause and ask, ‘What has this person actually done to earn my time, energy, or interest?’ As for motivation it has to come from self-respect. Men need to stop seeing women’s approval as the measure of their worth. Once you stop chasing validation and start acting like your attention has value, your behaviour changes naturally. You don’t need g…	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 04:29 PM
2	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable That’s exactly why I wrote the post. I’m not defending the 99% of male attention you’re describing I’m calling it out. When men lack discipline and hand out sexualised attention to anyone they find attractive, it becomes intrusive and meaningless. That’s not validation, it’s desperation, and it harms both men and women. If more men actually developed self-respect, standards, and could interact platonically instead of constantly performing thirst, women wouldn’t be so exhausted by male attention …	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 04:28 PM
7	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable It leads to men chasing anything that moves, offering attention with no standards, and treating women like sex dispensers. That doesn’t help men, and it doesn’t help women. You think women benefit from a dating culture full of low-effort, approval-starved men? It cheapens male attention, erodes healthy dynamics, and trains women to expect praise just for existing. Drawing a line is necessary for both sides. Sexual discipline protects men from emotional dependency and desperation, and it protects…	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 04:26 PM
8	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable Im not concerned how women respond but that too many men overvalue women and undervalue themselves. They hand out attention with zero standards, not because they’re being honest, but because they’re desperate for approval. That’s not confidence—it’s a lack of sexual discipline	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 04:14 PM
2	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable Not sure what you're claiming I said is "false" And sure, men have always been the more proactive sex but being proactive isn’t the same as being desperate. There’s a difference between intentional courting and throwing validation at anyone who looks good. That lack of sexual discipline is exactly what I’m calling out. And yeah, social isolation plays a role, but that doesn’t mean the answer is doubling down on low-effort attention	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 04:06 PM
5	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable Only way way forward at this point. Messages like this just get certain users emotional because I've indirectly targeted them.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 04:04 PM
4	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable Here's an actul genuine question that isnt a gotcha. Do you just not think there’s a problem with how undisciplined a lot of guys are when it comes to women? Like the constant pedestalising, the need to hand out attention to anyone they find attractive. Because if that’s not something you see as real or a problem, then we’re probably not even talking about the same thing here and there's nothing to debate. Not trying to waste my time with someone who lives in a different reality	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 04:03 PM
2	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable Fair enough. If you don’t think us men have a big problem pedestalising women then we’re clearly working from different realities. No point debating something you don’t see as a problem. Cheers	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 03:55 PM
8	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable Exactly which is why it matters how you present yourself. If you treat your own attention like it’s worthless, don’t be surprised when others do too	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 03:46 PM
3	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable Sure, sex is a factor but the need for validation runs deeper. A lot of men aren’t just chasing sex, they’re chasing approval. That’s where it stops being just biology and starts becoming insecurity	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 03:44 PM
6	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable You’re confusing observation with control. I’m not assigning motives. I’m encouraging reflection. If someone’s actions get the same results over and over, it’s reasonable to ask if the approach is working. That’s not judgment it’s basic pattern recognition	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 03:42 PM
6	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable You’re describing thoughtful compliments—those aren’t the issue. My post is about men flooding women with generic attention out of habit, not sincerity. If you compliment someone because you genuinely notice something, great. But if it’s reflexive and constant, it stops being meaningful. That’s the difference.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 03:40 PM
5	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable That’s exactly the point men shouldn’t flood strangers with constant praise. It’s not meaningful, it’s not respected, and it often comes off as intrusive. I’m not defending that behaviour I’m calling it out. You’re arguing against the very thing I said needs to stop.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 03:39 PM
2	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable Exactly	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 03:38 PM
5	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable Fair. Social compliments have their place, especially when they come from a genuine, intentional place like you described. The issue I’m calling out is when validation becomes reflexive in a way that devalues both the person giving it and the one receiving it. Intent matters.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 03:37 PM
3	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable The goal isn’t to be rewarded for compliments it’s to stop giving them out mindlessly. If validation is constant and unearned, it stops meaning anything. That’s not strategy, it’s common sense	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 03:35 PM
7	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable Being replaceable isn’t the same as acting like you don’t have value. Evolution isn’t an excuse to abandon self-respect.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 03:34 PM
7	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable You’re twisting a personal standard into a commandment. No one’s claiming authority over anyone. But if a guy constantly gives attention that gets ignored or disrespected, then yeah it’s worth asking why he keeps doing it. That’s not control, it’s self-awareness.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 03:34 PM
7	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable That’s fair and actually supports what I’m saying. When compliments are thoughtful and specific, they stand out. When they’re generic and constant, they feel lazy or shallow. That’s the difference between sincerity and autopilot validation.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 03:33 PM
5	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable Their tone isn't reflective of someone who wants a constructive debate so I'm not sure what's wrong with my comment.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 03:32 PM
11	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable Calling out patterns of behaviour isn’t the same as demanding to be wanted. If you can’t tell the difference, you’re not arguing in good faith.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 02:43 PM
0	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable Improving the quality of men and being more selective with attention aren’t mutually exclusive they go hand in hand. If men level up but still hand out attention like candy, the signal still gets lost in the noise. Value isn’t just about who you are, it’s also about how you present yourself.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 02:43 PM
3	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable No one’s deciding for anyone. The whole point is that you should set your own standards. If you want to hand out attention freely, fine but don’t complain when it’s taken for granted. That’s the trade-off Something tells me you felt targeted by my post. You're way to defensive.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 02:41 PM
6	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable No one said finding someone attractive gives you the right to access anything. The point is that unsolicited praise especially when constant loses all meaning. It’s not about expecting women to appreciate it. It’s about men recognising when they’re giving it away at their own expense.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 02:40 PM
1	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable Agreed. Simping isn’t exclusive to men, but the form it takes matters. When male attention is overgiven and undervalued, it reshapes dating dynamics in ways that hit men hardest. Recognising the pedestal effect is the first step to undoing it for everyone	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 02:39 PM
2	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable Fair point. Material conditions definitely shape dating behaviours. But that doesn’t cancel out the need for individual accountability. If men’s default response to worsening conditions is to lower their standards further, that’s not adaptive—it’s self-sabotage. Culture may be downstream, but behaviour still matters.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 02:37 PM
3	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable It’s not about suppressing how you feel but about asking why you feel the need to express it to someone who hasn’t earned it. If your praise is on autopilot, that’s not sincerity, it’s insecurity.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 02:35 PM
2	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable Yeah, all of this tracks. Biology and social pressure both push men toward over-validating women but that’s why reframing male attention as something selective and intentional is so important. Just because it’s hard doesn’t mean it’s not worth doing. There is no way we can keep going on like this. It's not sustainable, in my opinion.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 02:34 PM
–	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable It’s not about a strike. It’s about self-respect. If that sounds impossible to you, that says more about your standards than it does about the point.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 02:13 PM
1	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable Exactly. Capability earns attention willingness alone just makes you background noise	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 02:12 PM
4	The Overabundance of Male Validation Has Made Us Disposable Agreed. Nobody owes anyone anything. That’s exactly why men need to stop handing out attention like it’s free samples. If it’s not appreciated (which it often isn't and for good reason), stop giving it.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 02:10 PM
8	No one cares about “men checking out” other than anti-feminists. These guys have no real purpose beyond simping for women. When you've put them on a pedestal this high, life feels empty without one. It’s pathetic, and no matter how much you call it out, it never seems to sink in. The mental dependence on women is weirdly comfortable for them and honestly, it’s disturbing.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 07:52 AM
0	No one cares about “men checking out” other than anti-feminists. The entire existence of r/MensLib is pretty much that.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/04/25 07:39 AM
1	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy Good try at a debate!	/r/PurplePillDebate	04/04/25 08:33 PM
1	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy Because no one wants to feel like they’re on trial just for existing. Having to constantly signal that you’re not one of the bad ones especially when that standard isn’t equally applied gets exhausting. If that doesn’t register as pressure to you, fair enough. But for many men, it does. I’ve said what I needed to say.	/r/PurplePillDebate	04/04/25 08:33 PM
1	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy You’re proving my point if a man used the exact same logic to justify misogyny, it wouldn’t be tolerated. And saying “most men don’t face misandry” doesn’t negate the fact that generalised contempt toward men is still socially excused in ways the reverse isn’t. If we’re going to have honest conversations about gender, the standard has to apply both ways otherwise it’s not justice, it’s selective outrage. That’s all I’ll say on it.	/r/PurplePillDebate	04/04/25 08:32 PM
2	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy If you think asking for men not to be treated with default suspicion is the same as demanding attention or friendship, then you’ve already chosen to argue in bad faith. I’ve been clear throughout: this isn’t about control, entitlement, or pity it’s about pushing back against collective blame and trying to build mutual understanding. If even that gets twisted into some “Nice Guy” narrative, then there’s no point continuing. You’re not responding to what I said just what you assumed I must have me…	/r/PurplePillDebate	04/04/25 08:30 PM
1	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy Fair point — I agree that acknowledging the context and differences is necessary. I’m not saying the problems are identical or that they need to be measured the same way to be valid. I’m saying that when one kind of hostility is repeatedly framed as “not as bad,” people stop taking it seriously altogether. That’s not about denying scale it’s about preventing indifference. We fix both sides of the problem by holding the same standard of empathy and accountability, even if the outcomes look differ…	/r/PurplePillDebate	04/04/25 08:28 PM
1	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy Caring about women and wanting fairness in how men are spoken about aren’t mutually exclusive. It’s not either/or. I’m not downplaying violence against women — I already said it deserves constant attention. But that doesn’t mean men should just quietly absorb casual hostility as the price of caring. When someone reduces misandry to “hurt feelings,” it shows exactly why some men disengage not because they don’t care, but because they’re told their experiences don’t matter unless they’re violent o…	/r/PurplePillDebate	04/04/25 08:26 PM
1	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy What you're describing is a personal trauma response and that’s completely valid. No one’s asking someone who’s been hurt to ignore their instincts or erase their pain. But that’s different from a broader cultural pattern where men, regardless of who they are or what they’ve done, are made to carry guilt or suspicion by default. That’s where it shifts from personal caution to collective control — when guilt becomes an expectation placed on people who had no part in the harm. I’m not here to inva…	/r/PurplePillDebate	04/04/25 08:24 PM
1	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy This has definitely been more constructive than most threads like this get. And you're right that context always matters. But the point I’m making isn’t about isolated communities or extreme echo chambers it’s about what society at large chooses to tolerate, excuse, or call out. Misogyny, even when subtle, is generally met with public disapproval. People are expected to challenge it, and failure to do so often carries social consequences. Misandry, on the other hand, is often reframed as justifi…	/r/PurplePillDebate	04/04/25 08:23 PM
2	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy True. Cultural bias, even when not institutionalised on paper, can have systemic consequences through social dynamics, hiring, relationships, and mental health. In that sense, misandry’s impact definitely reaches further than just “online talk.” Well put i never thought of that.	/r/PurplePillDebate	04/04/25 08:19 PM
1	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy Well said	/r/PurplePillDebate	04/04/25 08:13 PM
1	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy Basic goodwill means being seen as an individual, not assumed guilty by default. It’s not about strangers being outright rude — it’s about the way media, online discourse, and even everyday conversations often frame men as inherently suspect, emotionally stunted, or dangerous. It’s subtle, but constant and that has a cumulative effect. If you don’t recognise that atmosphere, that’s fine. But dismissing it because no one’s been directly cruel isn’t the gotcha you think it is. I’ve made my case cl…	/r/PurplePillDebate	04/04/25 08:12 PM
1	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy Good luck	/r/PurplePillDebate	04/04/25 08:10 PM
1	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy Very true.	/r/PurplePillDebate	04/04/25 08:10 PM
1	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy I get that and I think most women don’t intend for their criticism to come off as hatred. But when that criticism becomes constant, broad, and emotionally charged, it stops landing as guidance and starts feeling like contempt. Intent matters, but so does delivery and if the message isn’t being received well, it’s worth rethinking how it’s being communicated. I think that’s where the real progress starts	/r/PurplePillDebate	04/04/25 08:09 PM
2	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy Well said. Thank you.	/r/PurplePillDebate	04/04/25 08:07 PM
2	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy Well said.	/r/PurplePillDebate	04/04/25 08:04 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it I did.	/r/PurplePillDebate	04/04/25 08:04 PM
1	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy If your view of fairness depends on historical guilt and assumes every male concern is rooted in misogyny, then you’ve already decided men have no right to speak unless it’s in agreement. That’s not progress — that’s ideological gatekeeping. I’ve never defended men who degrade women, and this post clearly doesn’t either. But if that’s all you’re willing to hear when men speak up, then you're not engaging — you're projecting. I’ve said my piece.	/r/PurplePillDebate	04/04/25 08:03 PM
1	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy Totally fair that you haven’t seen it offline but online spaces are shaping how a lot of people, especially younger men and women, think and interact. What starts as “just internet talk” often bleeds into dating norms, social expectations, and even policy conversations. So while it might seem niche, the ripple effects are very real. That’s why the divide is worth addressing now before it gets worse.	/r/PurplePillDebate	04/04/25 08:02 PM
1	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy Exactly and that contradiction is at the heart of the issue. You can’t demand men keep fulfilling traditional roles while stripping away the social value or empathy that used to come with them. That’s not equality, it’s selective convenience. I think we’re in agreement here.	/r/PurplePillDebate	04/04/25 08:01 PM
1	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy Appreciate the kind words, and I actually agree with your revision. You’re right a lot of the harm historically came from a small, powerful subset, not the average man. I exaggerated that line intentionally, hoping it might encourage some of the more emotionally reactive female commenters to drop the defensiveness and engage logically for once.	/r/PurplePillDebate	04/04/25 08:00 PM
1	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy We good	/r/PurplePillDebate	04/04/25 07:57 PM
1	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy Appreciate it.	/r/PurplePillDebate	04/04/25 07:56 PM
2	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy Acknowledging historical and ongoing problems isn’t something I’m opposed to and nothing I said denies that they exist. But recognising those realities shouldn't require silently absorbing broad, negative narratives about men or constantly proving you're "one of the good ones" just to be treated fairly. It’s not that hard to comprehend that individual men do feel affected when they’re lumped into collective blame especially when that blame is repeated in public discourse, media, and everyday con…	/r/PurplePillDebate	04/04/25 07:56 PM
1	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy I’m not arguing that misandry and misogyny are identical in history or impact — they’re not. But harm doesn’t have to reach the level of physical violence to be real or socially corrosive. When contempt, mockery, and emotional invalidation become normalised especially toward an entire group it creates a culture of dehumanisation. That may not leave bruises, but it still does damage. If that distinction isn’t worth acknowledging, then we’re not having a fair conversation to begin with.	/r/PurplePillDebate	04/04/25 07:55 PM
2	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy I don’t deny that many of the problems we’re facing today disproportionately stem from male behaviour and those should absolutely be addressed head-on. But acknowledging that doesn’t justify treating men as a group like they’re inherently suspect or collectively guilty. That’s the line I’m drawing. And I agree more men should speak up about issues like being punished for trying to protect loved ones. But that only happens when men feel like they can actually enter the conversation without being …	/r/PurplePillDebate	04/04/25 07:54 PM
2	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy No — it means not every man feels the need to wear collective guilt to prove he has empathy. You don’t have to relate to abusers to understand that what they do is horrific, and you don’t have to accept being grouped in with them to care about victims. If that distinction isn’t clear, there’s really nothing more to discuss.	/r/PurplePillDebate	04/04/25 07:52 PM
6	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy I agree, supporting each other is exactly what we need more of. That said, what you described kind of proves my point: I have to perform my sensitivity or empathy for people to even know I’m not one of the “bad guys.” That’s a lot of pressure to carry to constantly prove you’re different from the worst examples of your gender just to be treated with basic goodwill. It’s great that people like you do recognise nuance. But culturally, the default lens on men is still tinted by suspicion and that’s…	/r/PurplePillDebate	03/04/25 03:05 PM
7	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy I’m not demanding anything unreasonable certainly not asking women to ignore risk or stop protecting themselves. Caution is necessary. Awareness is necessary. But there’s a line between being cautious and treating all men like a threat by default. You say the cost to men is a bruised ego but it’s not about ego. It’s about constantly being treated with suspicion or disdain, regardless of behaviour. That doesn’t create safety — it creates division and distrust. You can be alert without being hosti…	/r/PurplePillDebate	03/04/25 03:03 PM
2	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy I’m not denying any of what you said. Those examples are real, horrifying, and they absolutely deserve outrage, accountability, and action. I’m not here to defend abusers, harassers, or rapists and I never was. What I am pushing back on is the jump from condemning those specific actions to generalising about men as a group assuming that maleness itself is something to fear or despise. That's not justice it's displacement. Caution is valid. Generalised contempt is not. We don’t build a better cul…	/r/PurplePillDebate	03/04/25 02:56 PM
12	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy You’re right that the kind of misandry I’m referring to isn’t institutional in the way misogyny historically has been. I’m not arguing that men face policy-level discrimination or exclusion from power structures I’m arguing that social narratives, especially online and in modern discourse, have made it increasingly acceptable to generalise or belittle men in ways that would be called out instantly if directed at women. And while the impact may not be systemic, that doesn’t mean it’s insignifican…	/r/PurplePillDebate	03/04/25 02:54 PM
6	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy Sure, no one’s entitled to be heard without mockery but if your first instinct is to mock rather than engage, you're not having a conversation. You’re shutting one down. As for moral high ground you’re claiming it the moment you laugh at people for speaking up, while pretending that only one side deserves to be taken seriously. That’s not debate. That’s deflection.	/r/PurplePillDebate	03/04/25 02:50 PM
2	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy I get the analogy, but the problem is that when you frame it like that — bricks vs. sand — you’re still justifying one form of hostility because it seems lesser by comparison. That’s the exact dynamic I’m talking about: if it’s not severe or systemic, we brush it off as harmless or deserved. But hostility is hostility and when it becomes socially acceptable in any form, it doesn’t just stay “sand.” It builds resentment, erodes empathy, and shuts down honest dialogue. If we’re serious about break…	/r/PurplePillDebate	03/04/25 02:49 PM
2	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy Right	/r/PurplePillDebate	03/04/25 02:47 PM
28	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy "Men control the world" is a broad statement that doesn’t reflect most men’s lived reality. Most men don’t have power politically, socially, or economically. And dismissing their pain by pointing to elites at the top doesn’t help build the empathy you’re asking for. If women want men to be emotionally open, but only when that emotion aligns with what they want to hear, that’s not emotional acceptance that’s selective validation. Real equality involves listening, not just being listened to.	/r/PurplePillDebate	03/04/25 02:47 PM
10	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy Being allowed to speak isn’t the same as being heard without mockery or bad-faith dismissal which you’re kind of proving right now. If the idea is that only one side gets to advocate for themselves without ridicule, that’s not progress it’s gatekeeping. You don’t get to claim moral high ground while laughing at people for trying to address issues that affect them.	/r/PurplePillDebate	03/04/25 02:30 PM
13	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy Because when broad, negative narratives about men are normalised even if they’re “not about me personally” they still shape how people see me, talk to me, and treat me. No one wants to live in a culture where they’re constantly assumed guilty until proven otherwise, or where their identity is tied to the worst examples of their gender. Being a “good guy” doesn’t shield you from the impact of that. It just makes you more aware of how unfair and counterproductive it is.	/r/PurplePillDebate	03/04/25 02:29 PM
7	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy Right and that’s what I’m getting at as well. Misandry is often invisible because it’s filtered through comparison. If it doesn’t look like historical misogyny if it’s not systemic or violent people think it doesn’t count. But harm doesn’t need to mirror someone else’s to be real and when we become desensitised to certain kinds of gendered hostility especially when it’s aimed at men we start normalising it instead of addressing it. That’s the cycle that needs to break.	/r/PurplePillDebate	03/04/25 02:27 PM
2	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy I’ve seen plenty of that behaviour and I agree, it’s gross, immature, and deserves to be called out. But pointing to the worst corners of male spaces and using them to judge all men is exactly what I’m pushing back on. Most men don’t talk like that. Most men aren’t on PUA subs, rating women like property, or making those kinds of vile claims. The ones who do? Criticise them. Expose them. Reject them. I’m all for that. But when that criticism turns into collective guilt — assuming that maleness i…	/r/PurplePillDebate	03/04/25 02:25 PM
8	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy Not sure what point you’re actually trying to make here but reducing male concerns to “dry dicks” kind of proves mine. This is exactly the attitude that makes men feel like they can’t talk about anything real without being mocked or dismissed.	/r/PurplePillDebate	03/04/25 02:12 PM
6	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy Yeah, the revanchism angle nails it a lot of men today are being treated like stand-ins for the sins of others, and that kind of collective blame breeds nothing but resentment. And you’re right, there’s a weird cultural double standard forming. One form of power is celebrated, the other is demonised even when both are tied to survival or societal roles. If we keep pushing men into duty while shaming the traits that come with it, something’s going to give. This kind of imbalance isn’t sustainable…	/r/PurplePillDebate	03/04/25 02:11 PM
7	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy You see it every time gender-related issues come up. The hostility, defensiveness, and inability to have honest conversations without someone getting shut down or dismissed? That is the divide. So in that context, it’s very real.	/r/PurplePillDebate	03/04/25 02:08 PM
5	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy Well said.	/r/PurplePillDebate	03/04/25 02:06 PM
2	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy Some have, sure. But not all. That’s the point. Holding individual men accountable for their actions is one thing holding all men collectively responsible just for existing in a system they didn’t create is something else entirely. You can acknowledge problems in male behaviour without assuming guilt by association. That distinction matters if the goal is real change and not just scapegoating.	/r/PurplePillDebate	03/04/25 02:04 PM
9	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy If the goal is to inspire men to change, framing that as misandry — even unintentionally — is a terrible delivery method. People don’t respond well to contempt, no matter how valid the underlying point might be. You can’t insult someone into self-improvement. If the message is “you’re all trash until proven otherwise,” most men won’t stick around to hear the rest. They’ll either tune out or push back. That’s not growth that’s division. Calling it “instruction” doesn’t change how it lands when it…	/r/PurplePillDebate	03/04/25 02:03 PM
4	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy I agree that misogyny has been historically systemic in ways misandry hasn’t. No question there. But the problem with constantly comparing scales of suffering is that it ends up being used to justify or ignore certain kinds of harm especially when they’re directed at men. You're right that misandry and misogyny don’t look the same. But that’s why misandry slips under the radar. It’s not about laws or ownership anymore it’s about social narratives, media portrayals, emotional invalidation, and gu…	/r/PurplePillDebate	03/04/25 02:02 PM
4	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy Totally agree with having standards that’s solid advice for anyone. But this post isn’t about whether I choose to date or befriend misandrists. It’s about how misandry is socially tolerated sometimes even encouraged in a way that misogyny isn’t. If a man says something hateful about women, people speak up or are at least EXPECTED to. If a woman says something hateful about men, it’s often dismissed as justified frustration. That’s the gap I’m talking about not who we should date, but the double …	/r/PurplePillDebate	03/04/25 01:59 PM
9	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy By that logic: “I don’t think men who are misogynist are misogynist because of history. It’s largely because of current misandry. And I also don’t think all critique of female behaviour is misogyny.” If a man said that, it’d be seen as deflection at best, hate at worst. And rightly so. So why is the same logic accepted or even praised when the roles are reversed?	/r/PurplePillDebate	03/04/25 01:57 PM
2	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy Totally agree that both misandry and misogyny are toxic and I’m not trying to argue they’re equal in impact or history. Violence against women is absolutely real, serious, and deserves constant attention. But here's the thing: misandry doesn't need to match misogyny in violence to still do damage. Dismissing men’s experiences, mocking male pain, or generalising all men as threats that creates emotional distance and resentment. It doesn’t make women safer, it just makes men feel unheard. We can a…	/r/PurplePillDebate	03/04/25 01:55 PM
19	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy I’ll break it down as clearly as I can: By misandry, I’m not talking about policy-level oppression I’m talking about socially accepted hostility toward men as a group. Things like mocking male vulnerability, generalising all men as dangerous, or treating male discomfort as irrelevant or deserved. It’s not the same as criticism of harmful behaviour I’m fully on board with calling that out. But when that criticism turns into collective blame, it stops being productive. The distinction between misa…	/r/PurplePillDebate	03/04/25 01:54 PM
3	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy Yep. Once victimhood becomes a tool for power, there’s no real end to it because the goalpost keeps shifting. And honestly, a lot of men don’t buy into the guilt narrative, but they’re just not vocal about it. Doesn’t mean they’re okay with it just means they’re opting out of a conversation that feels rigged.	/r/PurplePillDebate	03/04/25 01:52 PM
30	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy Well said. When one side claims all the victimhood and none of the power they've held even passively it skews the whole conversation. Men aren't reacting out of nowhere. If our pain keeps being ignored or blamed back on us, resentment is inevitable. You can’t build empathy by pretending only one side has struggled.	/r/PurplePillDebate	03/04/25 01:50 PM
25	Part of the growing divide between men and women comes from the idea that men should silently accept misandry as justified payback for patriarchy Exactly. When guilt becomes a tool for control, it stops being about growth and starts being about power. And yeah, a lot of men do feel taken advantage of but know they’ll be labelled the problem if they speak up so they don’t. That silence isn’t agreement, it’s quiet disengagement.	/r/PurplePillDebate	03/04/25 01:48 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it It's a debate sub so incorrect.	/r/PurplePillDebate	03/04/25 09:49 AM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Cool. Thanks for the attempt at a debate. Bye.	/r/PurplePillDebate	03/04/25 07:32 AM
1	Reasons for men to decenter relationships You're making my point for me. The fact that red pill has no structure, no standard, and no clear principles is exactly why it morphs into whatever the loudest voices in the room push usually fear, distrust, and reactionary takes on women. You say it's important because it counters mainstream narratives. Fine but replacing one caricature with another isn’t balance, it's just flipping the polarity. Assuming betrayal and manipulation as the default female behaviour isn’t awareness, it’s projection…	/r/PurplePillDebate	30/03/25 10:20 AM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Fair enough sounds like you've drawn your own conclusions from your experiences, and that's completely your call. We just interpret the patterns differently. Appreciate the discussion, though.	/r/PurplePillDebate	30/03/25 08:29 AM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it That’s fair your experience is valid, and I’m not denying that initiating doesn’t always lead to better outcomes. But the core point still stands: relying purely on inbound interest limits who you connect with and how much control you really have in the process. Anyway, I think we’re just coming at this from different angles. Appreciate the back and forth.	/r/PurplePillDebate	30/03/25 08:28 AM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Right, but the difference is men are still expected to initiate even with that baseline filter in place. That’s the whole point it’s not about attraction, it’s about who’s expected to act on it. Anyway, I’ve made my point. Appreciate the reply cheers.	/r/PurplePillDebate	30/03/25 08:26 AM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it I think at this point we’re just coming at the definition of “initiative” from two different angles. I’ve never denied that women take steps or show interest only pointed out that those steps often come after some level of safety or existing momentum is in place, which makes it structurally different from being the one to define intent from the start. That doesn’t mean it’s wrong it just means the dynamic isn’t as evenly distributed as it’s sometimes portrayed. In any case, I think we’ve both ma…	/r/PurplePillDebate	30/03/25 08:25 AM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it That’s fair. If you feel your approach is working for you based on your understanding of how things are, then there’s really not much more to say. My point was just that risk-avoidant strategies often come with trade-offs, and it’s okay to acknowledge that without framing them as ideal. Take care.	/r/PurplePillDebate	30/03/25 08:23 AM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it You can say “women approach the men they’re interested in” all you want, but the studies still show they do so far less frequently than men. That’s the point. If interest alone were the trigger, and there were no broader social or psychological filters at play, we’d see more parity in who initiates. But we don’t. So either women are interested far less often than they claim or they’re interested but conditioned to wait. Pick one. This isn’t about pretending women never approach it’s about acknow…	/r/PurplePillDebate	30/03/25 08:21 AM
2	Reasons for men to decenter relationships That’s exactly the problem when an ideology can mean everything, it ends up standing for nothing. You say red pill isn’t a worldview, just a dating strategy, yet it routinely gets treated like a lens through which to view gender dynamics, self-worth, and personal development. That’s not just a strategy that’s a philosophy a poor one at that. And let’s not pretend the lines are clean. Red pill spaces overwhelmingly prioritise content on women, dating dynamics, sexual access, and ‘frameworks’ buil…	/r/PurplePillDebate	30/03/25 08:19 AM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Yeah it's wild.	/r/PurplePillDebate	30/03/25 08:15 AM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Well said. Good for them I guess.	/r/PurplePillDebate	30/03/25 08:14 AM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it He	/r/PurplePillDebate	30/03/25 08:12 AM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Interesting. i have my doubts but I'll take your word for it...	/r/PurplePillDebate	30/03/25 08:12 AM
3	Reasons for men to decenter relationships Then great no one said women can’t be part of that life. The point is that they’re not the foundation of it. Wanting meaningful relationships isn’t the issue it’s building your entire identity around chasing them that leads to dysfunction. When you're grounded in your own purpose first, any connection you build—romantic or otherwise—is healthier, more intentional, and far less desperate. That’s the whole point.	/r/PurplePillDebate	30/03/25 08:11 AM
4	Women hide under the ideals of masculinity to avoid approaching men socially They try and convince each other of the same shared delusion. It's sad.	/r/PurplePillDebate	29/03/25 06:19 PM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it You’re still responding to a point I didn’t make. I never said only asking someone out counts as initiative. I said that in most dating dynamics, the first clear emotional or romantic risk the step that defines intent and moves things from ambiguous to intentional still overwhelmingly falls on men. That doesn’t mean other forms of escalation don’t exist. It means they typically follow a pattern that begins with male-led initiation. The fact that you think women “escalate actively when they find …	/r/PurplePillDebate	29/03/25 06:12 PM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it You just answered your own question. When I said “women know this,” I was referring to exactly that an awareness that passivity has downsides, but many stick with it anyway because it’s safer or less emotionally taxing. You literally said you don’t voice complaints because you assume men don’t care. You do know the strategy isn’t ideal. You’ve just decided it’s not worth the energy to change it. That’s the very dynamic I was describing. And to be clear there’s nothing wrong with acting in self-i…	/r/PurplePillDebate	29/03/25 06:10 PM
–	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Not a counterpoint just a personal anecdote dressed up as a universal rule. You pursued the wrong person and it didn’t work out. Fair enough. That doesn’t mean initiative itself is flawed it means your choice was. Bad outcomes don’t invalidate the concept, they just highlight the need for better boundaries, standards, and follow-through. Plenty of people get burned being passive too. That doesn’t mean passivity is a bad strategy for everyone, just that no approach is immune to poor judgment. So …	/r/PurplePillDebate	29/03/25 06:08 PM
–	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it You just reinforced what I’m saying: if effort is the first filter, why only test for it after someone else initiates? That’s still outsourcing the entire start of the interaction to men. If someone has to make the first move to even be tested, you're not filtering you’re reacting. That’s the difference. Being proactive doesn’t mean chasing low-effort people. It means expanding your options beyond whoever happens to show up. If the current method keeps leading to the same complaints, maybe it’s …	/r/PurplePillDebate	29/03/25 06:07 PM
–	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it You’re preaching “mutuality” like it’s some big mic drop, but that’s exactly what I’ve been advocating the entire time shared effort, shared risk, shared initiation. What I’m critiquing is the pattern where initiative is only expected from men, while women wait, filter, and still expect premium outcomes. And yeah, some men are indiscriminate. That’s not news. But somehow, those same men still end up getting attention because passive strategies don’t weed them out they invite them. That’s the iro…	/r/PurplePillDebate	29/03/25 06:05 PM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it No, I didn’t shift blame I pointed out that both sides have agency. Saying outcomes depend partly on selection isn’t absolving men of accountability, it’s recognising that dating isn’t one-sided. You made a sweeping claim that initiative leads to exploitation. I pushed back by saying that outcome isn’t universal and when it does happen, it’s often more about who someone engages with than the act of initiating itself. That’s not denying men’s behaviour matters. It’s acknowledging that personal pa…	/r/PurplePillDebate	29/03/25 06:04 PM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it You can call it passive-aggressive if you want, but at some point, intent matters less than impact. I challenged the logic not your character. If the phrasing annoyed you, fine. But don’t pretend that makes the critique invalid. You’re focusing on tone because it’s easier than dealing with what was actually said: that basing long-term strategy on one bad experience isn’t the flex it’s being framed as. That’s not personal it’s a pattern. And if the only way to deflect that point is to keep rehash…	/r/PurplePillDebate	29/03/25 05:55 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it And yet again, you’re fixating on phrasing because you don’t want to address the argument itself. You made a choice based on one negative experience. That’s fine. But when you present that choice like it’s some universal wisdom, it’s fair game for critique. The phrase wasn’t meant to insult it was a shorthand for using an isolated disappointment to justify long-term disengagement. If that doesn't apply, great. Then say that. But don’t twist it into an emotional attack just so you can dodge the p…	/r/PurplePillDebate	29/03/25 05:53 PM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it No, I’m not saying women should pursue men they’re not attracted to. I’m saying if your only metric for participation is immediate physical attraction, you’re limiting your options from the jump and then complaining about the results. Attraction can be instant, sure. But long-term compatibility usually isn’t. It takes interaction, not just instinct. So if you’re only willing to engage when all the boxes are already ticked, that’s not high standards it’s passive strategy disguised as discernment.	/r/PurplePillDebate	29/03/25 05:49 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it 😂	/r/PurplePillDebate	29/03/25 05:46 PM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it If that were true, we’d see a much more even distribution of who initiates. But every available study shows men overwhelmingly take the lead. That’s not a “construction in my brain.” That’s observable, measurable reality. Saying it “doesn’t only show up then” without offering anything to support that isn’t a rebuttal it’s just denial. If the behaviour were balanced, we wouldn’t even be having this conversation.	/r/PurplePillDebate	29/03/25 05:46 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it You’re personalising a critique that was never about denying your specific effort but about recognising which direction the norm leans in most dating dynamics. I’m not saying you didn’t do anything. I’m saying your experience is the exception, not the standard. You took initiative, sure but it’s telling that this example is being treated like a mic drop moment. If it were truly common for women to take the first emotional or romantic step, there wouldn’t be this much need to defend it. And again…	/r/PurplePillDebate	29/03/25 05:44 PM
–	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it True, there are issues in modern dating and yes, both men and women are checking out. That’s part of the bigger conversation. But my point was just that one woman being single at 30 doesn’t automatically signal a crisis. Some are opting out, sure but that’s not always the same as being left behind.	/r/PurplePillDebate	29/03/25 05:42 PM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Fair enough if you’re genuinely content with the results your approach brings, then there’s really no debate to be had. My critique was never about forcing anyone to change, just pointing out the disconnect when frustration and passivity exist side by side. But if you’re happy with your strategy and not blaming anyone for the outcomes, then we’re not really disagreeing just talking past each other.	/r/PurplePillDebate	29/03/25 05:41 PM
3	Reasons for men to decenter relationships You can make that divide in theory, but in practice, the pipeline is undeniable. You say red pill ends the cycle of desperation for many men but for just as many, it reshapes that desperation into resentment, competition, and status obsession. That’s not healing its just redirecting insecurity into a new container. And claiming red pill ‘doesn’t tell men to do anything’ is a convenient dodge. Ideologies don’t need to issue commands to influence behaviour. If the core framing revolves around hype…	/r/PurplePillDebate	29/03/25 05:39 PM
2	Reasons for men to decenter relationships Because the tone of your reply didn’t read like genuine support it read like a backhanded warning wrapped in politeness. The whole 'good luck, just don’t turn into MGTOW' bit is a familiar pattern. It’s not neutral encouragement it’s a subtle jab dressed up as concern. And that’s exactly the kind of passive-aggressive response I was calling out. If it wasn’t meant that way, fair enough but maybe ask yourself why it came across like that to more than just me.	/r/PurplePillDebate	29/03/25 05:37 PM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it No what I’m saying is that effort ≠ volume. Just because someone approaches doesn’t automatically make them “high effort.” Plenty of men shoot their shot with zero intention, zero follow-through, and zero compatibility. That’s not effort it’s opportunism. Meanwhile, there are men who are intentional and emotionally available, but they’re selective with who they approach because they’re tired of one-sided dynamics or playing the numbers game. That’s not “low effort.” That’s boundaries. The whole …	/r/PurplePillDebate	29/03/25 05:36 PM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it If “most women” reciprocated clearly, this conversation wouldn’t be so common. The fact that so many men report having to guess, over-interpret, or carry every interaction forward kind of undercuts your point. I’m not talking about fringe cases or influencer types I’m talking about a broader dating norm where interest is often passive and indirect, especially early on. That’s not a personal dig, it’s a pattern. And brushing it off as “horseshit” doesn’t change that it just avoids engaging with i…	/r/PurplePillDebate	29/03/25 05:34 PM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it No one’s arguing for a one-size-fits-all strategy that is black-and-white thinking. What I’m pointing out is that when similar advice is given to men (“step up, improve, be intentional”), it’s called growth. But when women are encouraged to take more agency, it suddenly gets framed as unrealistic, unnatural, or unnecessary. Yes, gender dynamics are skewed but that doesn’t mean criticism of passivity is invalid. Skewed norms can and should be questioned when they start producing consistently poor…	/r/PurplePillDebate	29/03/25 05:33 PM
–	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Well said.	/r/PurplePillDebate	29/03/25 05:31 PM
–	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Very rare.	/r/PurplePillDebate	29/03/25 05:31 PM
–	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it It’s not about “caring so much” or feeling entitled as it is an observation about a pattern that affects the broader dating discourse, especially when that pattern fuels constant public complaints. If someone repeatedly broadcasts dissatisfaction with results, it’s fair to point out the role their own strategy might be playing. That’s not entitlement it’s accountability. Also, “women are constantly approaching men” is just not supported by the data. Approaching rarely happens unless the guy is a…	/r/PurplePillDebate	29/03/25 05:30 PM
3	Reasons for men to decenter relationships Agreed	/r/PurplePillDebate	29/03/25 05:28 PM
–	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Which proves the point more than it refutes it. If effort only kicks in after a guy has already shown interest, already created momentum, and already passed her internal checklist, then it’s not really initiative it’s conditional participation. That’s not the same as what’s expected of men, who often have to act before any signs of reciprocation, and often without knowing whether that “spark” will even exist. Saying women do more once they’re already sold on a guy doesn’t counter the argument it…	/r/PurplePillDebate	29/03/25 05:28 PM
2	Reasons for men to decenter relationships Red pill CLAIMS to promote self-focus, but in practice, it’s constantly framed around reacting to women what they want, how to attract them, how to ‘navigate female nature.’ That’s not self-development, that’s obsession with external validation. If the core message really was about focusing on yourself, posts like this wouldn’t get the usual backlash from red pill types. You can’t preach abundance while centring your entire worldview around sexual strategy and control.	/r/PurplePillDebate	29/03/25 05:26 PM
–	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Clearly you've had enough. Just to clarify, though, my point wasn’t that women must approach it was about the patterns behind the frustration. If the common complaint is about quality, then passivity limits your options by design. That’s not a dig, just an observation. Take care.	/r/PurplePillDebate	29/03/25 05:25 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it No, the point is that when men are selective or emotionally grounded, they get penalised for it. They're labelled passive, unmasculine, or "not trying hard enough." Meanwhile, women get to call the exact same behaviour "self-respect" or "having standards." So yeah—if both genders value selectiveness and emotional grounding, then stop treating it like a flaw in men while celebrating it in women. You can't push outdated expectations on one side and then act smug when they stop playing along. That’…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 04:54 PM
8	Reasons for men to decenter relationships That’s a wild leap from what I actually said. I never called anyone a ‘sarcastic bitch’—I pointed out a tone that’s become very common whenever men talk about genuinely walking away from validation-seeking behaviour. If your reaction to that is this level of emotional projection, it kind of proves the point. The post encourages men to live for themselves, and somehow even that triggers defensiveness. Maybe ask why that is before putting words in my mouth.	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 04:50 PM
2	Reasons for men to decenter relationships You’re drawing arbitrary lines to avoid acknowledging what’s plainly observable. If the 'truths' red pill promotes consistently push vulnerable men toward despair, anxiety, and resentment, then it’s not just a 'personal problem'—it’s a design flaw. You can’t sell men a worldview based on cold sexual hierarchies, constant competition, and fear of obsolescence, then act surprised when it breaks people who internalise it. Calling it 'black pill retardation' doesn’t change the fact that this is a pi…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 04:49 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it And yet again, you’re proving the point. You are demanding results just passively. You're setting a system where effort is filtered out on your end entirely, but outcomes are still expected to align with your preferences. That’s the contradiction. You claim you’re not forcing men to do anything, but you’re also not taking any ownership over how your own strategy limits options. That’s the whole issue: if you're not participating in the process, you're not just filtering opportunists you're filte…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 04:47 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it You’re still missing the distinction I’ve made from the beginning, and it’s not because I haven’t explained it clearly—it’s because you keep redefining the terms to preserve your position. I never said physical escalation carries zero risk. I said it’s not the same kind of risk. Making out at a party especially after mutual vibes are already in play—is qualitatively different from being the one to clarify intent and move a situation from ambiguity to romantic direction. What you did may have inv…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 04:45 PM
6	Reasons for men to decenter relationships But that is what the red pill encourages—by design or by consequence. You can’t separate a belief system from the consistent psychological outcomes it produces in its followers. If large numbers of men engage with red pill content and end up more insecure, resentful, and obsessed with competition, then something in the messaging is driving that. You say you only care about what red pill 'actually encourages' but in practice, if the result is widespread anxiety and fixation on status, then the id…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 04:43 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it I'm not American so the "free country" claim means nothing to me, and this isn’t about rights or legality. No one’s saying people can’t complain. The question is whether those complaints hold weight when someone has actively opted out of any active participation Also, telling me I’m “free to stop listening” is redundant. I'm just responding to a pattern, not chasing individuals around demanding they stop. Pointing out contradictions in widely shared mindsets or behaviours is a valid observation …	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 04:42 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it A lower sex drive might explain selectivity, but it doesn’t explain why initiative only shows up when rejection is near impossible. That’s not just preference—it’s strategic passivity. The core issue isn’t who’s attractive, it’s who’s expected to take risk and create momentum in the first place. Saying “women do approach, just rarely and only under perfect conditions” isn’t proof of balance—it’s confirmation of the asymmetry	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 04:36 PM
1	Reasons for men to decenter relationships No one’s denying that relationships can be meaningful what I’m challenging is the idea that they have to be the centre of a man’s identity. Saying men should stop chasing connection from a place of lack isn’t the same as saying 'cut off your social life.' It’s about building a life that isn’t defined by whether or not you’re chosen. And while I get the point about most people wanting family, you're assuming that fulfillment only looks one way. That belief is exactly what keeps some men trapped i…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 04:33 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it First of all, even if I had been more critical—or, as you put it, made a post purely ‘shitting on women’—you’re clearly underestimating what this sub actually allows. This sub doesn’t shy away from uncomfortable takes. Posts are judged on effort, clarity, and reasoning not on whether they criticise men or women. Second, the fact that I’m still here should make it obvious I’m not doing what you’re accusing me of. Instead of engaging with the argument, you’ve shifted the focus to tone and motive. …	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 04:31 PM
3	Reasons for men to decenter relationships You're conflating goal-oriented self-improvement with the anxiety-driven behaviours that red pill spaces routinely promote. This isn’t just speculation—it’s been analysed in academic research. A 2023 study titled 'Swallowing and spitting out the red pill: young men, vulnerability...' found that red pill spaces often draw in vulnerable young men and funnel their insecurities into resentment toward women and sexually successful men. The result? A scarcity mindset rooted in fear, not abundance. Eve…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 04:25 PM
4	Reasons for men to decenter relationships Red pill claims to preach abundance, but its entire ecosystem thrives on amplifying male insecurity. If you truly believed in abundance, you wouldn’t need endless content obsessing over 'female nature,' hypergamy, and how to maximise your chances with women like it’s a strategy game. The tone is clear: women are a prize, and men are in constant competition to win. I don’t need a quote from r/TheRedPill (didn't even know it still exists) you just need to scroll through the daily posts on reddit d…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 03:45 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it And that’s exactly the double standard being called out you want to define the rules based on past grievances, but reject any accountability for how those rules now affect others. You claim to want something different, but your strategy hasn’t evolved—it just leans on selective history to justify inaction. Saying “men want easy sex” isn’t just a lazy generalisation, it’s projection. If your assumption is that any male interest is inherently low-effort or predatory, no wonder you think showing in…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 03:42 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it You're not filtering—you’re just outsourcing the entire screening process to men and calling it strategy. Putting up a filter after someone approaches isn’t the same as being intentional about who you engage with in the first place. You’re still relying on men to make the first move, which means the pool you’re filtering from is based on who chose you, not who you chose. That’s not agency—it’s passive curation. And no, desirable men aren’t attracted to one-sided expectations masked as "reality."…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 03:40 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it And this is exactly the kind of goalpost-shifting that makes genuine discussion so difficult. You didn’t create the dynamic—you advanced it once it was already co-established. That’s the distinction you keep dodging. Physical escalation after mutual attraction is already brewing is not the same as taking the first emotional risk that defines intent. You didn’t start the interaction, you built on a vibe that was already there. That’s participation, not structural initiation. The problem isn’t tha…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 03:39 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it I never said men who don’t approach are automatically “nicer.” I said they might be more selective or emotionally grounded, not that avoiding approach makes someone morally superior. The issue is that you’re twisting that into “being scared of approaching makes a man bad,” which is exactly the shallow, performative mindset I’m critiquing. Not every man opts out of approaching because he’s scared—some do it because they’re tired of initiating in an unbalanced system where effort is expected but r…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 03:37 PM
9	Reasons for men to decenter relationships I will always find it funny how a post encouraging men to live more intentionally always triggers this kind of gritted-teeth passive aggressive support from some women. No need to sarcastically warn us not to become MGTOW caricatures.	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 03:33 PM
6	Reasons for men to decenter relationships That’s not virtue signaling—it’s a mindset shift. No one’s saying ‘don’t date ever.’ The point is to stop treating relationships as the centrepiece of your life or self-worth. Like you said focus on your career, build something fulfilling, live with purpose. That is what decentring looks like. It's not about rejecting connection. but about not chasing it from a place of lack.	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 03:28 PM
19	Reasons for men to decenter relationships That’s exactly why it matters because too many men build their identity around chasing something they feel excluded from. Decentring relationships isn’t about pretending you had options, it’s about refusing to let the lack of them define your worth. You don’t need to be ‘allowed in’ to stop orbiting around it. That’s the whole point—reclaiming your energy instead of wasting it hoping to be picked.	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 03:26 PM
3	Reasons for men to decenter relationships But that is the red pill mindset—treating women as rare opportunities and relationships as high-stakes transactions. You’re describing behaviour that’s shaped by desperation and scarcity, which red pill content constantly reinforces. It’s not just 'what happens'—it’s what keeps happening because men are taught to obsess over every chance like it’s life or death. That’s not biology, that’s conditioning. The entire reason posts like this exist is to help men unlearn that mindset so they stop actin…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 03:25 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it That’s a wild leap, and it proves you didn’t actually engage with what I said. No one claimed approaching is always disrespectful only that not all men want to constantly do it, especially when effort is often one-sided or poorly received. You’ve taken “some men don’t cold approach because they’re selective or tired of the dynamic” and twisted it into “those men don’t understand boundaries.” That’s not logic—it’s projection. Also, weird how the second a man doesn’t play the expected game, he’s d…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 03:23 PM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it And there it is—when challenged, just default to historical victimhood and collective blame. I’m talking about individual accountability in modern dating, not rewriting human history. You’re not “doing what gives you better results”—you’re repeating a strategy that filters out initiative, then blaming men when it doesn’t work. Also, no one’s asking for begging or nagging just equal participation. If your response to fairness is “we’ve been your slaves,” then you’re not looking for progress. You’…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 03:22 PM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it If you “don’t know which ones they are,” all the more reason to take initiative because you get to choose, instead of waiting to be chosen by whoever shows up. That’s the entire point. And no, desirable men don’t deny male behaviour—they just reject the idea that low standards among some men should justify passive strategies among women. If you don’t want to rely on indiscriminate guys, stop building your entire dating approach around waiting for one to prove he isn’t.	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 03:20 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it If I just wanted to “shit on women,” I wouldn’t have asked for a debate I’d have made blanket statements and dipped. Instead, I’ve been clear, specific, and consistent in what I am addressing. You’re the one dodging, twisting what I say, and falling back on emotional accusations instead of counterpoints. You haven’t “already addressed” the argument—you’ve just avoided it, then acted outraged when that avoidance gets called out. If you have a real response, make it. If not, admit you’re more inte…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 03:19 PM
3	Reasons for men to decenter relationships Maybe I’m wrong, but red pill types usually hate posts like this. Every time someone talks about men decentring women or focusing on themselves, there’s a swarm of red pillers jumping in to disagree. It’s like they need men to stay desperate so their talking points stay relevant. The scarcity mindset they push isn’t about understanding reality—it’s about keeping men stuck in fear	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 03:17 PM
7	Reasons for men to decenter relationships Yes finally! I've been preaching this for ages. Men decentring relationships isn't about 'giving up'—it's about reclaiming control over their own identity. Too many guys measure their worth based on whether women like them, which leads to insecurity, desperation, and performative self-improvement. But when you focus on building a life you actually enjoy, everything shifts. Friendships get stronger, your goals become clearer, and if you do end up in a relationship, it comes from a place of confid…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 03:15 PM
8	Reasons for men to decenter relationships This comment is exactly why red pill ideology keeps men stuck. You’ve reduced male self-worth to 'one shot at pussy' like that’s all a man’s life is worth. That kind of thinking is the problem. If men are conditioned to think every interaction with a woman is a high-stakes game they have to 'win' or they’ll be doomed forever, of course they’ll end up desperate, obsessive, and unbalanced. You’re not describing biology—you’re describing how red pill thinking trains men to devalue themselves unless…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 03:13 PM
7	Reasons for men to decenter relationships Exactly.	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 03:11 PM
1	Reasons for men to decenter relationships Yes finally! I've been preaching this for ages. Men decentring relationships isn't about 'giving up'—it's about reclaiming control over their own identity. Too many guys measure their worth based on whether women like them, which leads to insecurity, desperation, and performative self-improvement. But when you focus on building a life you actually enjoy, everything shifts. Friendships get stronger, your goals become clearer, and if you do end up in a relationship, it comes from a place of confid…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 03:11 PM
0	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it That wasn’t a “first step”—that was a green light after the engine had already been started. You approached, sure but in response to existing vibes, not out of the blue. And even then, you made a physical move in a context where physical escalation is normal (a party), not in a context that required emotional vulnerability or clarity of intent. That’s not the same as risking rejection with a direct ask for time, attention, or romantic interest. You responded to mutual chemistry. He defined it. Y…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 02:18 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Then show it. Because so far, all I’ve seen is deflection, misrepresentation, and refusal to actually engage with the core argument. If you’re still in the debate, stop dodging and start addressing what’s being said—directly and honestly.	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 02:17 PM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it What I am saying is if you only ever lift a finger when someone is already your ideal, then you’re not participating in the process—you’re just shopping from a wishlist and waiting for perfection to show up. Attraction isn’t always instant. It can build through chemistry, conversation, and effort—if you give it the space to. But if your strategy is “sit back until the stars align,” don’t act superior while doing the bare minimum and still expecting top-tier results.	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 02:16 PM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it So let’s be clear you're saying that any romantic attention not explicitly invited in advance is automatically disrespectful? That’s not consent culture, that’s absurdity. By that logic, no one should ever speak unless they already know their words are welcome—which defeats the entire point of social interaction and dating. Consent is about how someone responds to boundaries, not whether they read minds beforehand. If a man respectfully says hello or shows interest and backs off when it’s not re…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 02:15 PM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Then stop entertaining indiscriminate men. That’s literally the point. Taking initiative doesn’t mean pursuing anyone and everyone—it means you set the standard from the jump instead of reacting after the fact. Blaming male indiscriminacy while still relying on them to initiate is just handing the steering wheel to the very dynamic you’re complaining about. If you know the bar is low, why not be the one raising it instead of waiting for exceptions?	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 02:13 PM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it “Be better, men” is not a rebuttal, it’s a lazy cop-out. You’re dodging the point: if you aren’t bringing effort, risk, or initiative to the table, then demanding better from others is just entitlement in disguise. This isn’t about men being perfect. It’s about fairness. If your only strategy is “wait and judge,” don’t be shocked when the results are disappointing. You want better? Meet better halfway.	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 02:12 PM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Which is exactly what men have been saying for years—just flipped. “Be more appealing and you'll get better results.” Funny how when that advice is aimed at men, it's seen as self-improvement. But when it's aimed at women, it’s suddenly unfair or missing the point. If you think the solution is better options, then logically, taking more initiative increases your chances of finding them. Sitting back and hoping the “competent, appealing” ones magically land in your lap while doing nothing? Wishfu…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 02:11 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it I guess you're waving the white flag. Appreciate the attempt at a debate.	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 02:09 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Again. I'm good. Thanks though.	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 02:07 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it No one’s denying the phrase can have connotations but context matters. You used one failed relationship to justify never taking initiative again. Referring to that as chasing a “fairytale ending” wasn’t dismissal, it was shorthand for the kind of idealistic expectations that get projected onto rare effort. If that stung, fine. But don’t pretend the entire argument hinges on one phrase just so you can avoid engaging with the actual point.	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 02:07 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Exactly. That’s the double bind—men are blamed whether they try and fail or don’t try at all, while women are rarely expected to self-reflect on their own dating approach. Sit back and wait? Men aren’t good enough. Men approach? They're desperate or creepy. The strategy is passive, the expectations are sky high, and somehow the blame still lands on men either way. At some point, you’ve got to ask—if you're not putting consistent effort in, why do you expect consistent results?	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 02:05 PM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it “Unwanted” isn’t the same as “disrespectful.” Respect is about how you approach someone, not whether the outcome is what you hoped for. If you’re calling every failed attempt “disrespect,” you’re just redefining normal interaction as a problem to justify the imbalance. And no, saying effort flows one way isn’t about any one man being entitled to attention—it’s about a systemic norm where one gender carries the bulk of risk and initiation. If women only engage when interest is guaranteed, while m…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 02:04 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Yeah, because that is the part you actually control. If a woman takes initiative and consistently ends up with men who use her, that doesn’t mean initiative itself is the issue—it means her selection criteria or boundaries might need work. That’s not shifting blame, that’s pointing to agency. Saying “initiative = guaranteed exploitation” is a sweeping, fatalistic claim. I challenged it by highlighting that outcomes depend heavily on who you choose not just that you chose. If you can’t separate c…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 02:03 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it And I’ve said multiple times that’s fine. You don’t have to believe it benefits you. No one’s forcing your hand. But when you turn that personal feeling into a broader argument against taking initiative altogether, it’s fair game to challenge it. And again, you’re dodging the point. You’re fixated on how I said something instead of what I said, because the core message—about effort, risk, and double standards—hits too close. You can keep insisting I misinterpreted your story, but if your takeawa…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 02:01 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Right and that still proves the point. When men disengage or give up, they’re often mocked, blamed, or told they just didn’t try hard enough. But when women disengage, it’s framed as healthy boundaries, wisdom, or “choosing peace.” The social framing is not the same, even if the behaviour looks similar. The broader double standard isn't just about what people do, it’s about how it’s perceived and rationalised. Men are expected to keep striving and improving to be seen as worthy. Women can withdr…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 02:00 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it We already have a debate going on two other comments. Lets give it a rest.	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 01:58 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it She shouldn’t. If she’s genuinely content with her options and her dating results, then there’s no reason to change her approach. But if she’s not satisfied—if she feels like nothing’s working, men aren’t serious, or she keeps getting poor outcomes—then something has to change. And that’s where the strategy gets called into question. The point isn’t “you must approach men you don’t want.” It’s: if you're dissatisfied with your current dating pool and only willing to engage when a man meets an ex…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 01:57 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Right, because when men express frustration at a clear social imbalance, the answer is just “then stop.” Helpful. Almost like the point is that stopping isn’t really an option without being written off as undesirable or lazy unlike women, who get to opt out without judgment. And no, saying women often default to filtering isn’t the same as claiming they have no agency. That’s you oversimplifying because it’s easier than addressing the actual argument—that participation and risk are often unevenl…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 01:55 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Says the person who’s been replying just as much, but with zero actual substance. If you had a real counterpoint, you'd have led with it instead of hiding behind mockery and deflection. It’s not “not letting it go” when I’m calmly dismantling a bad argument—you’re just not used to someone pushing back with logic instead of blind agreement. Keep calling it “word salad” if it helps you cope, but that doesn’t make your side any less empty.	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 01:54 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Then explain the pattern. If women truly approached based only on interest, you'd see more balanced initiative across the board but you don’t. You see hesitation, delayed action, and passive signalling unless there’s already clear reciprocation. That’s not pure interest—that’s calculated risk management. And let’s not pretend like that’s neutral. When men approach based on interest, they’re expected to deal with rejection. When women do, they often wait until rejection is nearly impossible. That…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 01:52 PM
0	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it You just gave a laundry list of creepy, disrespectful behaviours that literally no one is defending. That’s not “approaching”—that’s harassment. If you think those things are what I meant by men being expected to make the first move, then you either didn’t read properly or you’re intentionally twisting the argument to avoid addressing the actual point. I’m talking about normal, respectful effort—initiating conversation, showing genuine interest, and risking rejection. The kind of stuff women say…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 01:51 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it No, I didn’t shift blame—I challenged the idea that initiative inherently leads to being used. That’s your narrative, not mine. You claimed it’s what happens when women take the lead, so you back it up. Don’t flip the burden of proof just because you can’t. And again, disagreeing with a strategy isn’t “dictating.” It’s criticism. If someone posts a public claim that passivity is the smart move, that’s fair game for pushback regardless of gender. You’re not exempt from critique just because you’r…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 01:49 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it You keep pretending my language is the problem so you don’t have to deal with the substance of what I’m saying. Calling out a double standard isn’t manipulation. It’s not bias. It’s not “emotive language.” It’s just criticism you don’t like. And the phrase “fairytale ending” wasn’t an attack—it was a reference to your own framing, where one disappointing relationship became the excuse to stop trying. If that struck a chord, maybe reflect on why instead of fixating on tone like it changes the arg…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 01:48 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it And yet again, you dodge the point. The issue isn’t that men “show up”—it’s that they’re expected to. Constantly. Even when it’s unwelcome or unrewarding. You’re complaining about the wrong men trying while ignoring that women still rely on men to make the first move at all. You want initiative when it’s convenient, but not when it’s messy or mismatched. That’s the contradiction. If women don’t like who's showing up, nothing’s stopping them from leading more often and filtering for what they wan…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 01:46 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it You’re proving my point while thinking you’re disproving it. You escalated after he set the foundation. That’s not leading the momentum—it’s responding once the momentum already exists. He defined the context by asking for a date. Everything you describe still hinges on him initiating the transition from casual to intentional. Without that, none of what you did afterward happens. This isn’t about who contributes—it’s about who starts the engine. And in most dynamics, especially early on, that bu…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 01:45 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it So we’ve moved from fear-based hypotheticals to just waving off any disagreement as “bullshit.” Classic dodge. You can’t seriously claim that women are strong and independent, then also argue they’re powerless the moment they show interest. That’s a contradiction. Either women are capable of setting boundaries and filtering out bad options like adults, or they’re not. But don’t pretend helplessness is wisdom just because it’s more comfortable. And if you think challenging flawed logic is manipul…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 01:42 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it No, they approach rarely and in men they're already confident will say yes. That’s not taking initiative—it’s playing it safe. If you're only willing to make a move when rejection is basically off the table, you're not challenging the dynamic, you're reinforcing it. That’s not balance—it’s convenience dressed up as effort.	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 01:41 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it You're twisting my point. I never said attraction is manufactured through forced behaviour like pickup lines I said it develops through interaction, which requires initiative. That’s not ego, that’s just how social dynamics work. Someone has to start the conversation, take the risk, and drive momentum. The issue is that men are overwhelmingly expected to do that while women often get to wait and filter. That imbalance is real whether you want to admit it or not. And you keep repeating “that’s no…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 01:39 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it You keep demanding “graphic detail” as if that somehow proves your point, but that’s not how logic works. You made the claim that women being used is the automatic outcome of taking initiative. The burden is on you to back that up not me to explain everyone else's experience just because it doesn’t align with your fear-based narrative. And again with the “you’re a man so you can’t speak” routine—newsflash: if your argument only works when it’s shielded from critique by gender, then it’s not stro…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 01:37 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it The classic fallback when you can’t refute the point, just call it “word salad” and throw in a troll insult. Pathetic. You still haven’t brought a single piece of actual data to counter what I said. You’re just mad the one legitimate source you yourself linked backed me up. So now it’s projection, mockery, and zero logic. If that’s all you’ve got, then yeah I’ll stay at my “bridge,” and you can keep flailing under it.	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 01:35 PM
0	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it You keep screaming “dictating” like I’m handing out orders, when all I’ve done is disagree. That’s not control—that’s conversation. If someone critiques your logic, it doesn’t mean they’re trying to live your life for you. It just means your argument isn’t bulletproof, and you don’t like that being exposed. You keep fixating on the phrase “fairytale ending” like it was some calculated dagger. It was a shorthand for romantic idealism which you brought up by framing one failed relationship as proo…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 01:34 PM
0	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it If you genuinely think the mere act of showing interest leads to being used for sex, then the problem isn’t initiative—it’s who you’re choosing. You keep acting like taking initiative = automatic exploitation, but that’s not reality. That’s a projection built on fear, not fact. Plenty of women lead with clarity and still find meaningful relationships because they know how to filter, how to set boundaries, and how to walk away when respect isn’t given. What you’re pushing isn’t protection it’s pa…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 01:25 PM
0	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it You keep calling it “dictating,” but all I’ve done is critique a contradiction. If someone shares a story to prove a broader point, they’re inviting scrutiny—not blind agreement. That’s not control, that’s discourse. If you can’t handle your logic being tested, maybe don’t frame personal choices as universal truths. And yes if the core fear is “being settled for,” that is ego. You can spin it however you like, but insecurity rooted in needing to be someone’s ideal is still about pride. Men don’t…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 01:23 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it No, what’s illogical is pretending that initiative = exploitation. That’s a ridiculous leap. You’re not defending women—you’re infantilising them. The idea that if women take initiative, they’ll automatically get used like “fleshlights” is so wildly defeatist it borders on parody. By that logic, women should never date at all because any move they make risks being taken advantage of. That’s not empowerment, that’s learned helplessness. And no, my “central complaint” isn’t about mimicking male be…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 01:21 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it If it’s “proven over and over,” then cite something that actually proves it. Not opinions. Not personal blogs. Not cherry-picked quotes. Real data. The only legitimate study you linked—the IFS one—explicitly shows men ask for the first date far more often. That is rare. You just don’t like what the numbers say, so now you’re pretending a handful of feel-good anecdotes somehow outweigh hard evidence. You’ve misunderstood my point, misrepresented it, and now you’re doubling down with zero new subs…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 01:19 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it If your “security” hinges on never feeling like someone might settle, then yeah—that is ego. Because no one gets guarantees in dating. Men risk being used, rejected, or overlooked constantly, and they're still expected to show up. But when women face the possibility of not being someone’s first choice, suddenly it’s unacceptable? And no I don’t need to have your exact experience to spot flawed reasoning. That’s not how arguments work. If men can’t speak on women’s dating behaviour, then by your …	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 01:17 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Sure equal doesn’t mean identical. But “going with the grain” only makes sense when the grain isn’t creating lopsided effort, risk, and emotional labour for one side. If men are expected to initiate, absorb rejection, drive the interaction, and still get blamed when it fails while women mostly “filter” that’s not just nature, that’s a loaded system. Saying we can tweak the burden slightly without actually shifting participation doesn’t solve the imbalance, it just makes it more palatable. Fairne…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 01:15 PM
-1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Yeah, no shit—they’re not interested in every man. No one is. That’s not the point. The point is that men are still expected to approach women they’re interested in, even knowing most won’t be interested back. Meanwhile, many women won’t even consider approaching unless rejection is basically off the table. That’s the double standard. If women only ever make moves when the outcome is basically guaranteed, that’s not evidence of balance—it’s proof of how little risk they’re willing to take reinfo…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 01:13 PM
5	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Cheap hyperbole. When logic fails, just accuse someone of promoting sexual exploitation. Classic. Nothing I said implies women should be “perma fleshlights” or accept mistreatment. If your takeaway from “take initiative to increase your agency in dating” is “submit to random men,” that says more about your mindset than mine. You’re not arguing against my point you’re attacking a strawman because it’s easier than addressing what was actually said. So either engage with the argument as presented, …	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 01:11 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it You say it’s about security, not ego but then you openly admit the fear is being “settled for.” That’s ego. You’re dressing pride up as practicality and hoping no one notices the difference. And no, saying “you’re a man so you don’t get to speak on what works for women” isn’t some clever technicality. It’s still deflection. Either the argument holds up or it doesn’t—who says it doesn’t matter nearly as much as what’s being said. You called my point condescending, but you’re the one spiraling int…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 01:10 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it You keep accusing me of not accepting evidence, but all you’ve brought are anecdotes plus one study that literally proves my point. You’re just mad that I didn’t roll over and pretend cherry-picked stories override actual data. I never said it never happens. I said it’s rare. And that’s exactly what your sources confirmed. So instead of admitting that, you’re now scrambling to rewrite my stance into something easier to argue against. If you need to strawman someone just to have a response, it me…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 11:58 AM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Good on you!	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 11:22 AM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it And yet men are expected to play that role every single time—initiating, leading, sustaining interest, and making the whole thing “fun” without getting to claim burnout or compare women to children. You did it once, got discouraged, and now equate effort with babysitting. That’s exactly the imbalance I’m talking about. If putting in energy makes you view someone as lesser, maybe the problem isn’t who’s passive—it’s the fact that effort itself feels beneath you. Because when men get burned out fr…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 10:21 AM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Sure, biological tendencies might influence things but they don’t justify imbalance. That’s the difference. Saying “well it’s just hardwired” is a convenient way to excuse passivity while pretending it’s inevitable. But we’ve challenged biological instincts across history monogamy, contraception, even basic hygiene all defy “natural” behaviour. Social norms do evolve, especially when they’re exposed as lopsided. So no one’s saying we need to erase all asymmetry overnight. But if we’re going to k…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 10:19 AM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it I read them. And it’s hilarious how desperate you are to argue against something I never even claimed. I never said women never make the first move—I said it’s rare, and the social norm overwhelmingly places the burden on men. Which, funnily enough, is exactly what your own sources confirm. The only link you posted with actual data (the IFS one) backs me up: men ask for the first date far more often. The others? Just cherry-picked anecdotes—exactly what I called out from the beginning. You’re no…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 10:17 AM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it If your argument crumbles the moment someone asks for data, it was never strong to begin with. Saying “you’re just denying it” isn’t proof—it’s deflection. I’m not ignoring evidence. I’m asking for actual evidence like I have, not cherry-picked anecdotes that don’t reflect the norm. If you can’t bring that, don’t act shocked when your take gets challenged.	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 09:36 AM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it That’s fine in theory. But what you’re describing isn’t the problem. The getting to know you phase isn’t the issue. The issue is when one side—usually men—is expected to do all the work to even start that phase. Mutual attraction and rapport don’t magically appear. They’re built through initiative, action, and risk things that men are socially conditioned to provide and women are often socially excused from. And if vague signals and passive filtering are the only contributions being made, that’s…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 09:33 AM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it And yet… despite all that "desperation" and "wild flailing," men are still the ones doing the heavy lifting—approaching, planning, risking rejection, and absorbing the emotional fallout when it doesn’t work out. If women are so "fine alone," why is the internet flooded with dating complaints, emotional burnout posts, and endless TikToks dissecting “why men aren’t good enough”? Let’s not pretend stoicism is the same as satisfaction. What you’re describing isn’t peace—it’s learned complacency dres…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 09:30 AM
3	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Thanks for the unintended confirmation—again. You’re reinforcing exactly why passivity gets justified: because the moment women are asked to be assertive, intentional, or experienced, suddenly the goalposts shift to “but men can’t handle that.” So the strategy becomes: stay passive, vet hard, and then blame the system when results are mid. Also, let’s not act like “discrimination and vetting” is synonymous with good judgement. If the results are frustration, endless complaints, and low-quality o…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 09:29 AM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it This isn’t about whether it happened to me directly—it’s about how often it happens overall. That’s the distinction you keep missing. If we’re talking trends and societal norms, then individual stories don’t move the needle unless they reflect the majority. You can’t challenge a data-backed point with “well, I experienced different.” That’s not trolling—it’s just standard critical thinking. And if your position is strong, you shouldn’t need to rely on personal frustration to defend it. You’d bri…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 09:27 AM
4	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it I think “transitional period” sums it up well. The frustration comes from that exact mismatch: traditional expectations haven’t disappeared, they’ve just become one-sided. Men are still largely expected to pursue, pay, plan, initiate all the “provider” traits while the cultural message to women is: you do you, and if it doesn’t work out, well, independence is enough. Which again, is fine—if you're owning the trade-off. But what we see instead is this bizarre mix of empowerment and entitlement, w…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 09:25 AM
7	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Exactly—that’s the contradiction no one wants to own. You can’t spend years pushing messages that say “don’t be pushy,” “don’t assume attraction,” “don’t make women uncomfortable,” and “wait for clear signals”… then turn around and expect men to suddenly flip the switch and become bold, charming initiators the second they enter the dating market. That’s not how human psychology works. It’s like slamming the brakes and the gas at the same time and wondering why the engine’s burning out. If women …	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 09:23 AM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it No one’s trying to “guilt” you into anything. You’re absolutely free to avoid risk, protect your time, and steer clear of being used. That’s not the issue. The issue is when that personal boundary gets universalised into a dating strategy, and then the complaints start rolling in about how the dating pool is trash, men aren’t serious, and nothing ever works out. If the goal is to avoid being used—totally fair. But then don’t pretend passivity is some foolproof shield. Women get used all the time…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 09:21 AM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Your entire comment just proved my point in real time. You opened by saying it’s not about ego—then immediately framed taking initiative as something that would make you feel “settled for.” That’s ego. That’s literally placing pride above strategy, then pretending it’s about practicality. And telling me I can’t speak on dating dynamics because I’m a man? That’s not a counterpoint—that’s deflection. If the data, logic, and observed patterns are sound, it doesn’t suddenly become invalid because of…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 09:20 AM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it That’d be a fair point if I were saying all generalisations are valid. But I’m not. The difference is how they’re applied and whether they’re based on observed, widespread patterns or just lazy stereotyping. When people say “men are trash,” they’re rarely talking about actual data or consistent behavioural trends—they’re venting, often based on personal bias. What I’m pointing to is a well-documented, recurring pattern in modern dating: women being more passive in the early stages while expectin…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 09:18 AM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it You're not wrong. A lot of men are unfortunately conditioned to value the "chase" and may lose interest if they feel it's too easy or one-sided in the other direction. That dynamic does exist, and I get why you've adjusted your approach accordingly. You’ve responded to the system the way many men are also forced to: by adapting, even if it means suppressing parts of yourself. But that is the problem. The dating script punishes women for being too forward and punishes men for not being forward en…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 09:16 AM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Well said. The hypocrisy is hilarious to me.	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 09:14 AM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it That’s fair IF we’re talking about genuinely uninterested women. But that’s not the point I’m making. The issue is when women are interested but still default to passivity waiting for men to carry the entire interaction forward, dropping vague signals, and then getting frustrated when it doesn’t go anywhere. That’s the contradiction. If you’re interested, show it clearly. If you’re not, sure, be passive but don’t complain about the dating landscape while contributing to the imbalance. And yeah, …	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 09:13 AM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Sure those things can be signals of interest. But let’s not pretend a DM or casual small talk is the same level of risk or effort as actually making a clear move. Most of what you're describing still keeps the ball firmly in the guy’s court. It’s a nudge, not initiative. That’s the whole point: when women are interested, they often hint, while men are expected to act. There’s a gap between creating an opportunity and taking responsibility for moving things forward. One is passive encouragement, …	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 09:10 AM
3	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it That’s the problem though—subtle signals aren’t equal engagement. Liking a post, making eye contact, or standing nearby isn’t the same as starting a conversation, making a plan, or facing rejection. If you’re relying on “subtlety,” then you're not actually meeting anyone halfway you're tossing breadcrumbs and hoping he builds the whole loaf. And this idea that “you won’t need to put in effort if she likes you”? That’s exactly the imbalance being pointed out. One side gets to be passive and choos…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 09:08 AM
3	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Well said.	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 09:07 AM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Well said. People can dress it up as "strategy" or "discernment" all they want, but when you know you’re into someone and still won’t make a move—out of fear, pride, or habit—that’s not empowerment, that’s avoidance. It’s wild how often “I’m just not comfortable doing that” is used as a shield while still expecting men to be confident, direct, and emotionally available on cue. Like… what’s the logic there? You want someone who leads with bold energy but you won’t even signal with clarity? And ye…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 09:06 AM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Makes sense	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 09:05 AM
3	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it No—what I’m saying is that if women only participate when a guy is already doing all the work and is already their ideal, then they’re not actually participating. They’re outsourcing effort while still demanding outcomes. It’s not about chasing men you’re not attracted to. It’s about understanding that attraction can grow, that connection takes effort from both sides, and that sitting back until someone perfect shows up is a strategy built more on fantasy than reality. So no, the takeaway isn’t …	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 09:04 AM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Your idea of “participation” is limited to reacting—swiping left, rejecting, filtering. That’s not active participation, that’s gatekeeping. There’s a difference between screening interest and initiating it. You’re right—women are selective. But being selective while remaining passive is exactly what leads to the recurring complaints: “emotionally unavailable men,” “nothing ever progresses,” “dating is exhausting.” Those aren’t random complaints—they stem from a strategy built around hoping the …	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 09:03 AM
3	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it And everyone can complain sure. But if your standards filter out effort, risk, or initiative on your end, then the complaints lose weight. That’s the core point. Also, “men will fuck anything” isn’t a valid counter—it’s often repeated as hyperbole, and used to diminish male effort while excusing female passivity. If women want better quality, the answer isn’t “lower your standards” or “wait for the unicorn,” it’s engage with more intention. You can’t dismiss all male interest as meaningless and …	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 09:01 AM
3	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it I do but here’s the disconnect: you're saying men and women aren’t the same, then using that as a blanket justification to disengage from the process while still expecting elite results. That’s the imbalance I’m calling out. No one’s saying you have to act like a man to get a man. But if you want a specific type of 'high quality' man (dominant, bold, intentional etc) you can’t always rely on traditional dynamics and luck. It’s not about becoming aggressive or loud. It’s about showing clear, inte…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 08:58 AM
3	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Interesting story, but it’s not really relevant to the point I made. One woman’s personal dating outlook doesn’t prove some wider cultural downfall. Not every woman who’s single at 30 is a “spinster”—some just aren’t panicking, and that’s okay.	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 08:55 AM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it That sounds logical until you realise it relies on a flawed assumption: that the only men worth dating are the ones who already approached you. That’s not quality control—that’s convenience masquerading as selectivity. You’re mistaking who initiates for who is best suited, and in doing so, you’re narrowing your dating pool to only the most forward men, not the most compatible ones. If you want a confident, intentional partner but only ever sit back and wait, you’re relying on hope, not standards…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 08:51 AM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Because that’s not how reciprocity works. If you're waiting for men to always lead, you're not looking for a partner you’re looking for a performer. Saying “if we’re confident, men don’t have to be” sounds clever until you realise it just reinforces the same double standard you’re trying to defend: men must prove themselves while women simply choose. Healthy dynamics require mutual effort. Confidence isn’t a limited resource where if one has it, the other is off the hook. In reality, both people…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 08:49 AM
-1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Then don’t do their work do yours. The point isn’t about making things easier for men; it’s about improving your own outcomes. If a man is lazy and low-effort, that’s all the more reason to take initiative and screen for who actually shows up with genuine energy. Being proactive doesn’t mean carrying the relationship or courting men who do nothing. It means filtering better, faster. This “I won’t do it because that’s what they want” logic sounds empowering but it’s actually reactive. It’s not ab…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 08:47 AM
3	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it But that’s also part of the issue. Most women aren't approaching dating with that level of directness or consistency unless the guy is already ticking every single box. That’s not the norm—that’s the exception. The “jump at it” response usually only happens when the stars align: looks, status, timing, vibes… all of it. And that kind of passivity waiting for perfect alignment is exactly what leads to so much dissatisfaction. If you're only active when it feels safe and ideal, you're not really pa…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 08:45 AM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it No one’s saying women should be forced to initiate. The point is about honesty and consistency. If someone chooses a passive approach, that's their prerogative. But then they should also accept the natural consequences of that choice limited options, lower agency, and possibly more frustration. What’s unfair is opting out of the effort while still expecting top-tier results and sympathy when things don’t go as hoped. This isn’t about dictating how people must date—it’s about pointing out the con…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 08:42 AM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Then let’s be honest what you’ve brought isn’t evidence, it’s anecdotes. Individual examples, even a handful, don’t disprove a widespread trend. If someone says “men are expected to initiate the vast majority of the time,” and your rebuttal is “well, I’ve approached someone before,” that’s not a counter-argument—it’s personal experience. Useful for context, sure, but not for overturning data. If you think I’m wrong, then show me studies or statistics that demonstrate women initiating at anywhere…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 08:40 AM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Which just proves the point. That’s not active dating—that’s hyper-selective engagement under perfect conditions. If women only “approach” when a guy is already in the top 5% of attraction, pre-vetted, and showing signs of interest, that’s not taking initiative—that’s taking a shortcut. Meanwhile, men are expected to shoot their shot across the board, face rejection constantly, and still carry the emotional and logistical burden of getting things off the ground. So no, cherry-picking the occasio…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 08:39 AM
0	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it That’s the kind of mental gymnastics I’m talking about. You’re framing reaction as initiation to maintain the illusion of shared effort. But let's not kid ourselves responding to interest isn’t the same as creating it. Making out at a party isn’t some masterclass in agency if everything still depended on the guy taking the next step afterward. You escalated in the moment, sure but he still had to interpret the signal, define the intent, and initiate the actual relationship. That’s not initiative…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 08:37 AM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Simple: because the loudest guy in the room isn’t always the best one in it. Men who are constantly approaching tend to be the most confident, extroverted, or assertive not necessarily the most emotionally intelligent, compatible, or relationship-ready. Plenty of thoughtful, high-quality men don’t cold approach strangers or spam messages on dating apps. Why? Because they’re selective, respectful of boundaries, or tired of the lopsided effort with low return. So when women only wait to be approac…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 08:35 AM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it What’s actually hilarious is pretending that the work is equal when the dynamics clearly aren’t. Men aren’t just “putting in more work” they’re expected to do so as a baseline. They initiate the conversations, plan the dates, risk rejection, carry the emotional labor of pursuit, and often still get dismissed as “not good enough” by people who haven’t made a single proactive move in the process. Meanwhile, many women are taught that just showing up is enough. Make yourself look good, exist on the…	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 08:34 AM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Well said	/r/PurplePillDebate	28/03/25 08:31 AM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it I have and that’s exactly why this conversation keeps circling back to effort and strategy. Most women’s complaints about dating revolve around the quality of men, lack of commitment, “nothing ever going anywhere,” or emotional unavailability. Sound familiar? Because it should. Those outcomes aren’t random they’re directly tied to a strategy that revolves around waiting for attention, filtering it reactively, and refusing to take ownership over how they engage with dating in the first place. So …	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 06:54 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Because that’s exactly what men are expected to do every single day and no one’s handing them a gold star or a rejection-proof environment for it. The issue isn’t that women want to gauge interest—everyone does. The issue is that when men do it, they’re expected to act on that interest. When women do it, they often stop at vague signals and still expect the guy to take the risk, lead the interaction, and make things happen. You're framing it as "why waste her time?" but that's what initiative in…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 06:52 PM
3	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Perfect because you’ve unintentionally proven my point better than I could. You're right: if men stopped chasing, simping, and pursuing tomorrow, the dating market would grind to a halt. And that’s not because women “don’t want it”—it’s because they’re used to not having to work for it. That’s the imbalance I’ve been pointing out all along. It’s not about who wants relationships more. It’s about who’s expected to earn them. Men have been conditioned to put in effort, face rejection, initiate con…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 06:49 PM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it “Fewer options” is the trade-off of passivity and that’s fine if you accept the outcomes that come with it. But the issue is, many don’t. They choose passivity, end up with limited, low-quality results, and then blame men, the apps, or the entire dating system. You’re acting like women are just calmly choosing selectivity but that doesn’t line up with the volume of complaints we constantly hear about how “there are no good men,” “nothing ever works,” or “dating is exhausting.” If passive filteri…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 06:47 PM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it You're misunderstanding what “works” actually means here. If the goal is attention, then sure—passivity might work fine. But if the complaints are about poor relationship outcomes, low-quality matches, or dating exhaustion, then clearly it’s not working in the way people claim to want. And no—saying “men will sleep with anything” isn’t a justification for disengaging from effort altogether. That just means low-effort options are abundant. It doesn’t mean those options are good, committed, or com…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 06:44 PM
0	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it And that’s exactly the double standard I’m pointing out. You’re allowed to prefer assertive, dominant men but then don’t turn around and complain about the lack of them if your strategy is to sit back and wait for one to find you. You want rare, high-value traits in a partner? Then maybe show up with some intentionality yourself. You don’t get to hate passivity in men while practicing it yourself and expecting gold to fall in your lap. You figured out what you’re attracted to. Great. Now ask you…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 06:42 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it If women only engage when a man is already attractive, already made the first move, already did the heavy lifting, and already meets every precondition… then that’s not engaging. That’s filtering. That’s sitting back in the VIP section and claiming you’re “involved” because you waved at the waiter. You can’t say women are “engaging” when the entire strategy is waiting for ideal conditions to come to them. That’s not initiative, it’s selective participation based on minimal effort and maximum rew…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 06:40 PM
9	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it That’s a valid concern but it’s also not a reason to default to passivity. Yes, some men will accept attention or sex without long-term interest. But guess what? That happens regardless of who initiates. Men don’t suddenly gain more integrity just because they made the first move. If anything, when women are assertive, they gain more control over the interaction—they set the pace, they clarify intent, and they can better filter who’s genuinely interested versus who’s just opportunistic. Avoiding…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 04:50 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Agreed	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 04:48 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Fair enough. You're absolutely allowed to complain. Just don’t act surprised when people stop listening or outright shut you down because your complaints don’t match your choices. Choosing to disengage can be a form of agency—sure. But the contradiction arises when someone disengages, then turns around and blames everyone else for the results. If you're opting out, that’s fine. Own it. But you don’t get to disengage from the process while still demanding ideal outcomes from it or sympathy for ho…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 04:48 PM
4	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it And yet again, hiding behind biology to justify passivity while ignoring agency in a modern context. Yes, women want men who are interested and proactive cool. But if your entire dating strategy hinges on waiting around for that energy to show up without putting any out yourself, then you’re not “selecting,” you’re just hoping. Nature might explain instinct, but you’re not an animal in a mating ritual—you're a person with choices and tools and dating apps. You're capable of doing more than waiti…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 04:46 PM
0	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it That’s not the profound insight you think it is. “Women show interest differently” is often just a euphemism for doing the bare minimum—a glance, a smile, a like on a photo and expecting men to not only notice it but act on it. That’s not “different communication,” that’s strategically vague signalling that shifts all the pressure onto men to guess, initiate, and risk rejection. And the “there’s not a lot of benefit to chasing men who haven’t shown interest first” line? That cuts both ways. Men …	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 04:43 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Appreciate the honesty in your response especially the bit about the meritocracy myth being nonsense. But let’s be real: saying “being passive won’t hinder their outcomes that much” only holds up if the goal is attention, not meaningful connection or long-term compatibility. Sure, being passive might land you dates, matches, or short-term interest but that’s not success in the broader sense, especially not the kind women often claim to be looking for. If women are exhausted, disillusioned, or st…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 04:41 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it No one is denying that it happens—I’m saying it’s not common enough to shift the overall dynamic. Anecdotes ≠ data. Pointing to a handful of women who take initiative doesn’t disprove the overwhelming trend that men are still expected to initiate, pursue, and carry the emotional risk. Just because something occasionally occurs doesn’t mean it’s the norm. That’s like saying, “I saw a man cry once, so emotional repression in men must not exist.” It’s a weak counter. If you want to challenge the ar…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 04:38 PM
4	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Everyone wants someone they’re attracted to. The difference is, men still have to put themselves out there, risk rejection, and do the heavy lifting regardless of outcome. If women only make a move when the stars align, they’re not participating equally, they’re curating from a safe distance. And if that strategy keeps delivering poor results? Then maybe it’s time to change the approach, not just the standards.	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 04:37 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it That sounds nice in theory, but in practice, broad generalisations about men happen constantly and go largely unchallenged especially when they’re negative. “Men are trash,” “men need to step up,” “men are emotionally unavailable”—these are blanket critiques often made with zero nuance, and rarely do people rush in to clarify, “Well, not all men.” So let’s not pretend this double standard doesn’t exist. What I’m doing is holding up a mirror to that. If broad-stroke advice is acceptable when dire…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 04:35 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it I am doubtful. "Active" for women is not very active https://theblog.okcupid.com/a-womans-advantage-82d5074dde2d	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 04:33 PM
7	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it You’re conflating two completely different dynamics. When men operate from “abundance,” they’re usually already putting in work—building status, improving themselves, and actively pursuing options until they reach that point. It’s a result of effort, not a strategy of sitting back and hoping. What I’m critiquing is a strategy where women start from passivity expecting high-quality outcomes while doing none of the initiating and labour. And when that strategy doesn't deliver, it’s followed by lou…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 04:32 PM
7	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it I’m well aware of what evolutionary psychology says but citing it like it’s the final word ignores the fact that human beings aren’t slaves to biology. We don’t base every modern decision on Stone Age instincts. If we did, we wouldn’t have birth control, improve gender relations, or monogamy. We’d be clubbing each other and calling it courtship. Yes, evo psych might explain why some women are passive but it doesn’t justify the continued use of a strategy that leads to repeated frustration. Under…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 04:30 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Yes, women ultimately choose who to date but only from the pool that presents itself. And that pool is determined by who’s doing the approaching. If women are only choosing from the men who pursue them, then they’re operating with limited options, often skewed by who’s most confident or persistent—not who’s actually most compatible. Initiating flips that dynamic. Instead of passively sorting through whoever shows up, women can actively seek out the men they’re genuinely interested in. That gives…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 04:27 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it You say you’re not the passive one, but the moment you took initiative, the guy you invited turned out to be passive. Right. And what did you do? You dropped the energy and walked away. So let’s apply that logic evenly: if men constantly take initiative and are met with passivity, should they also just stop and say “no second date”? You’d call that giving up too easily, right? This is the exact double standard I’m calling out. You tried once or twice, didn’t get your ideal outcome, and backed of…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 04:24 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it You’re not “explaining the obvious” you’re just reframing the imbalance as natural so it doesn’t have to be addressed. And in doing so, you're proving my point: comfort over accountability. You say you’re fine waiting for the right guy to appear in your social sphere—that’s fine. But then don’t turn around and complain about the quality of men you meet if you're unwilling to actively engage beyond your default environment. That’s not dating, that’s hoping. And if hope is your strategy, then own …	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 04:22 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it You're talking about complementarity in established relationships—I'm talking about initiation and effort in the dating phase, where imbalance is the norm and one side (men) carries the bulk of the work. Those are two completely different stages. Your example works after mutual interest is established. But that’s not the point being made. The issue is that many women want the results of a high-effort relationship while contributing passive energy at the start. If you only engage when the “perfec…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 04:20 PM
3	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it So now we’re pretending that the problem isn’t passivity or imbalance—it’s “too much genderlessness”? That’s a neat way of avoiding the core issue, which is this: women benefit from a system where they aren’t expected to initiate, take risk, or lead—yet still complain about the outcomes. You’re trying to intellectualise the problem away by invoking abstract terms like “regulation” and “intermediation,” but all that does is dodge individual accountability. No one’s asking for gender erasure. What…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 04:18 PM
3	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it No, the problem is the blatant imbalance in expectations. You keep falling back on “men are thirstier” and “do as they please,” as if that magically makes the disparity irrelevant. It doesn’t. If anything, it proves my point: men initiate because they’re expected to, and women benefit from staying passive while still demanding high standards and emotional labour from the other side. The fact that women don’t have to take the same risks and still complain when the results don’t match their expect…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 04:15 PM
3	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it No I’m not flailing at women for “approaching dating differently.” I’m pointing out the double standard where women want men to be bold, direct, and intentional, but feel entitled to remain vague, passive, and unaccountable then act confused when the results are disappointing. And let’s be real: you’re not defending logic here, you’re defending comfort. Calling minimal effort “logical” because it results in less rejection doesn’t make it a strong dating strategy—it just makes it risk-averse. Tha…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 04:11 PM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it If women want better dating results, the solution isn’t to double down on comfort and blame male standards. It’s to actually engage in the process. The entire point is about taking ownership not just sitting back, enjoying the perks, and blaming the system when it doesn’t deliver the fantasy.	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 04:09 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Respectfully, I don’t give a shit what’s “biologically determined.” That’s a lazy framework people fall back on to justify convenience and avoid growth. Biology might explain impulses, but it doesn’t excuse behaviour especially when it’s contradictory to the image someone is trying to project. If women want to brand themselves as strong, independent, and modern, then clinging to traditional, one-sided courtship dynamics because “biology says so” is just intellectual laziness. You don’t get to wa…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 04:07 PM
–	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it “It’s not sabotage if it works” is a cope. Works how, exactly? If it “works,” then why the constant complaining about low-quality men, unfulfilling dates, and disappointing outcomes? You can’t call it a successful strategy when the results clearly don’t match the expectations. That’s like burning your dinner every night and insisting the oven’s fine because the fire alarm still works. As for that link just because an experience is common doesn’t make it optimal. Men being more sexually indiscrim…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 04:04 PM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it I disagree.	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 04:02 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it No contradiction here—just your inability to grasp nuance. Women flirting is not the same as initiating. Liking a guy’s photo or making eye contact isn’t taking the lead—it’s a soft signal, not an actionable step. The burden of actually making the move, planning the date, and risking rejection still falls on men. That’s not me demanding it be “done my way”—that’s pointing out the actual difference in investment and risk. You’re pretending crumbs equal a full meal. In other your words womens idea…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 04:01 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Sure. Point stands.	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 03:58 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Yes I am 😂	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 03:57 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it You're turning basic, commonly understood concepts like "initiative" and "effort" into abstract riddles to avoid acknowledging the imbalance. We don’t need a roundtable to define “first move”—we all know what it means in the context of dating: who opens the conversation, who plans the date, who makes the intentions clear. And overwhelmingly, that burden falls on men. Claiming that women don’t message first because they’re too overwhelmed by matches isn’t a rebuttal—it’s exactly the issue. If wom…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 03:55 PM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Good for them?	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 03:53 PM
0	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it First off, every morning I begin with the Mirror Confidence Enhancement Ritual, standing in front of my reflection for 17 minutes, deep in my own eyes, repeating affirmations like “I am a dating god” and “My sarcasm is the key to unlocking any heart.” This primes me for battle, ensuring my inner confidence is nothing short of invincible. Then, I embarked on the 12-Step Alpha Energy Program. This is a highly classified course I designed to exude maximum dominance with minimal effort. Step one: we…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 02:52 PM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Sure. I don't get red pill so I'll take your word for it.	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 02:45 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Dating rewards active participation, and if you're only putting effort into situations that already feel comfortable or are ideal, you're still relying on passivity. That’s self-sabotage in the long run. It's really simple. You can’t keep waiting for the "perfect" scenario and then complain when the results don’t match your expectations.	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 02:45 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it You can’t be serious. So? A couple of anecdotal examples that don’t represent the norm at all aren’t relevant here. Try again with some data maybe?	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 02:42 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Then why bring up how this would change the quality of men? Women initiating gives them more control over the quality of their dating pool. It’s better quality control, plain and simple. In life, no one is taught to just “let things happen”—we’re taught to take initiative. So why, when it comes to dating, is this the exception that gets pushed back? Well, I know why...	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 02:39 PM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it This is all bout effort and accountability. The issue is that women expect men to do all the initiating, while sitting back and complaining when things don’t go their way. You can’t keep waiting for the “perfect” match to come to you and then complain about lack of quality. Approaching isn’t about fairness, it’s about engagement. If you want better outcomes, you have to engage with the process and take responsibility for your own results. That’s what I’m saying, but if you want to ignore that an…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 02:36 PM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it I'm just not gonna pretend the current dating system is fine when one side does all the work. If women want better results, they need to start contributing equally.	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 02:33 PM
3	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Men and women have different goals—fine, but that doesn’t justify the imbalance. Men are expected to put in the effort while women get to opt out of that work, then complain about the results. If women want to attract quality men, they need to put in the same effort, instead of sitting back and waiting to be approached. Cold approaches and swiping right are minimal effort—men are still the ones doing the labour of initiating. Women are handed attention daily, but they don’t engage with the proce…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 02:32 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Dating may be voluntary, but expectations are not. Men are expected to initiate because that’s the dynamic that’s been set. If things were truly as equal as you’re suggesting, we wouldn’t see men doing nearly all the work—sending 80-90% of first messages, facing rejection, and still putting themselves out there while women remain passive. The issue is that women benefit from this system—they don’t have to take the same risks, yet still complain about the results. Lack of initiative is the core p…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 02:29 PM
0	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it You're missing the point. It’s not about just "approaching better men"—it’s about taking responsibility for the process. Women can complain all they want about the men they encounter, but if they’re not actively engaging in the dating world and initiating at all, they’re just waiting for the perfect man to fall into their lap. That’s the issue. If women want better outcomes, they need to stop relying entirely on men to pursue and show some initiative themselves. Complaining about men being "bad"…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 02:26 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it I have no clue. It's really strange.	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 02:24 PM
0	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Fair enough, but we’re clearly not going to see eye-to-eye on this judging by your flair. If you think gender roles are fine as they are and that the system works, that’s your choice. But the issue remains that the lack of equal engagement is the core problem. Men are expected to initiate, and women often don’t take equal responsibility, while still complaining about the results. If you’re content with that, fine, but don’t act like the imbalance isn’t there. I’ll stick with the idea that mutual…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 02:23 PM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Try not to move the goal post: https://theblog.okcupid.com/a-womans-advantage-82d5074dde2d	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 02:19 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Agreed.	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 02:19 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it You have to prove to me there is a "quality of men" issue to begin with. This is a different conversation but I am curious.	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 02:18 PM
16	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it My point is if you want an equal dating dynamic, you need to actively engage, not just wait for the "right" guy to meet your standards.	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 02:17 PM
4	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Agreed. They massively exaggerate how much initiative they take and what that actually looks like.	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 02:16 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it I’m not talking about individual cases; I’m talking about a pattern. Yes, some women do take initiative, but the issue is that too many don’t, and then complain about the outcomes. Your experience of initiating plans is great, but let’s not pretend it's the norm when so many women still expect men to pursue them and take all the lead, then act surprised when things don't go well. As for the "boring" guys you’ve met, that’s exactly my point. Passive men are often a result of the environment they'…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 02:14 PM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Cop-out. The point isn’t that approaching more will fix everything, it’s that participating actively in the dating process is what’s needed. If you want better outcomes, you have to put in more than just passive observation. If you’re only waiting for the "perfect" guy to come to you, you're not even giving yourself a chance to find the right match. Yes, quality matters. But if you're sitting back and complaining about the lack of quality men, while expecting them to put in all the effort, then …	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 02:12 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Nobody’s saying men are just roaming the streets waiting for women to approach them—that would be an absurd expectation. What I’m talking about is the larger, more common pattern where men are still expected to do the majority of the initiating in dating, whether on apps or in person. Yes, apps are designed for dating, and sure, relationships often begin through mutual interactions. But the dynamic still falls largely on men to make the first move. The fact that most apps report men initiating c…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 02:10 PM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it The problem isn't that women don’t get approached—it’s that they overly rely on being approached. The issue is that men are expected to do all the initiating, while women often sit back and complain about the lack of quality options. You don't get it both ways. Approaching in mass would change the dynamic because it would shift the expectation for women to also put in effort, instead of waiting to be pursued and then they get better quality control which is something they often complain about...	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 02:08 PM
-1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Appreciate the well thought out comment but respectfully this reminds me how much i vehemently disagree and despise red pill ideology so i'm gonna pass on the back and fourth debate here. Again thanks for the comment.	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 02:05 PM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it I’ll stick with the data, thanks. Women’s opinions on their own group can be insightful, but they often don’t align with the broader trends or reflect the full picture. It’d be convenient if we could rely solely on personal opinions to shape the narrative, but the numbers tell a different story, and they’re more grounded in observable behaviour. So, yeah, I’m going with what’s actually backed up by facts. Hilarious suggestion.	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 02:02 PM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it When I make a broad point about women’s passive dating strategies or complaints, I’m doing the same thing that’s done to men when we’re told to “just be more assertive” or “do better” without acknowledging that not all men are the same. If you want to challenge my generalisations, that's fair, but the same standard should apply to the generalisations about men too and blatantly isn't so I'm done caring to be honest.	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 01:59 PM
3	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it No, it’s not about being “dedicated to the chase”—it’s about the contradiction of wanting certain outcomes while refusing to participate in the process that leads to those outcomes. Men are expected to put in all the effort, take on the emotional labor, and deal with rejection. Meanwhile, women can lean back, selectively engage, and still complain when it doesn’t work out how they want. It’s not about dedication to the chase but about accountability for the role you play in the outcome. If you'r…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 01:52 PM
3	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it You're still missing the core issue. It’s not about complaining for the sake of it—it’s about the contradiction between women actively choosing a passive dating strategy, getting poor outcomes, and then blaming the dating system or men. If they want to be passive, fine. But don’t act surprised when the results are underwhelming. The issue is the lack of accountability. I’m not concerned about their failure—I'm concerned about them refusing to adjust and still placing the blame externally. It’s n…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 01:50 PM
3	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Exactly!	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 01:48 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it I did. You should read the stats within the article. Burying your head in the sand isn't going to work here unfortunately.	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 01:47 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it You’re missing the point. This isn’t about who suggests plans with friends—it’s about dating dynamics, where women are often passive, waiting for men to pursue, while still complaining about men and dating because it isn't going their way. If you want an active, engaged partner and more dating success you need to start being active in the early stages of dating—not just sitting back and expecting men to carry all the weight.	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 01:46 PM
6	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it You’re missing the point entirely. Men supposedly acting passive on dating apps or cold approaching doesn’t absolve women of the responsibility of equal participation in the process. You’re confusing effort with expectations—men are still expected to initiate, lead, and navigate the dating landscape, while women get to sit back and wait for the “right” moment, all while complaining about lack of results. Swiping right mindlessly and cold approaching are still forms of putting yourself out there—…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 01:43 PM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Great, it worked for you. That’s anecdotal, though, and doesn’t change the fact that it’s not the norm for most women. If women were consistently taking initiative, we wouldn’t still be seeing the same trends on dating apps and in real life—where men still do the vast majority of initiating. Not sure what you're trying to prove with that last point. Give my post another read.	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 01:40 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it When we're talking about women's version of 'flirting' which is often an minimal-effort act most men miss because it's so ridiculously low effort, no. If that’s "approaching" in your book, then sure but let’s not pretend it’s equal to taking the initiative to make a move, plan a date, or follow through. And yes, some women do approach. The issue is that it’s the exception (which you guys hilariously exaggerate) not the rule. The vast majority of dating dynamics still put men in the position to t…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 01:37 PM
3	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Eye contact, vague compliments, or liking a photo are still passive actions, and they do nothing to actually move things forward unless a man takes the next step. What you're describing is the bare minimum—a low-risk way to test the waters without putting in real effort. Flirting is an invitation, not an action plan. If women want men to step up, they need to show more than just a casual "hint." And yes, men should learn how to flirt too, but that doesn’t let women off the hook for their lack of…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 01:31 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Yes	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 01:29 PM
0	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Yes—men swipe more, are more sexually assertive, and face more rejection. That is the context and it's precisely why the burden of initiative overwhelmingly falls on men. But f things “aren’t equal,” and women know they’re benefiting from this imbalance, then turning around and complaining about poor dating results while doing none of the work is pure hypocrisy. You don’t get to opt out of effort and act like a victim of the system. That’s the double standard I’m pointing out. It's not about pre…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 01:26 PM
42	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it It makes sense why women do this but it also explains why so many of them are frustrated. If your dating strategy is “sit back and wait for a unicorn while putting in zero consistent effort,” then disappointment is baked into the process. And when that’s your approach? You’ve forfeited the right to blame the system or the men in it.	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 01:22 PM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it The point isn’t why men send more first messages—it’s that women overwhelmingly don’t. You're proving my argument without realising it: men are expected to carry the burden of initiation, effort, and rejection, while women stay passive and selective and still complain when dating doesn’t go their way. Saying men are “thirsty” or “indiscriminate” doesn’t change the imbalance—it just reinforces it. If women genuinely wanted a more equal dynamic, they’d match that energy with action. But most don’t…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 01:21 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Sure, it can work short-term. But if it was working long-term, we wouldn’t see so many women saying they’re exhausted by dating, struggling to find quality men, or frustrated that things “never go anywhere.” Passive attraction might get attention, but it rarely leads to connection especially if you're relying on the other person to carry the entire interaction forward. You can say “there’ll always be enough male attention,” but this just proves that women are still leaning on traditional dynamic…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 01:18 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it I was talking about the moderation culture and what kinds of conversations are actually allowed to happen here compared to other subs on Reddit. This is one of the few places where you can critique dating dynamics especially around gender without instantly getting dogpiled or banned. I'm also not about ignoring anyone’s complaints?. Maybe I misunderstood what you said. If you're reading that as me "ignoring" one side, maybe it's because a lot of platforms do ignore or shut down any perspective t…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 01:15 PM
5	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Yes, I’ve looked at dating app demographics and your point doesn’t hold up. Online dating is now the most common way couples meet, surpassing every other method—including through friends, work, or social events. So dismissing patterns from dating apps as if they’re irrelevant or niche is just wrong. The behaviours we see there—like men sending 80–90% of first messages—reflect the same dynamic that plays out offline: men are expected to initiate, women are expected to choose. Also, let’s not pret…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 01:12 PM
6	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it I’m not “complaining that women don’t behave how I want.” I’m pointing out that a large number of women stick to passive dating strategies while simultaneously complaining that dating sucks, men are trash, and nothing ever works out for them. That contradiction isn’t a matter of preference—it’s a cultural pattern that deserves scrutiny, especially when it shapes mainstream narratives around dating. As for “going out and increasing social contacts,” again—you’re proving my point. Men are expected…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 01:09 PM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it This even proves as I said being more active actually helps women: https://theblog.okcupid.com/a-womans-advantage-82d5074dde2d By the way you're misrepresenting what I said. I never claimed women never approach men—I said it's not the norm , and when it does happen (which is MASSIVELY overexaggerated by women for some reason), it’s usually under very selective, low-risk conditions. That’s a huge difference. So no, I don’t need to prove women never approach men. I need to prove that it’s not comm…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 01:06 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it You’re oversimplifying my point. It’s not “women complain = bad.” It’s women complain about outcomes they’re actively contributing to while refusing to adjust anything. That’s the issue. If someone tries a different strategy—like being more active in dating—and still complains, then the question becomes: are they reflecting on how they’re approaching it, or are they blaming others again? Because growth requires more than just switching tactics once. It takes consistency, patience, and self-aware…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 12:50 PM
4	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it “Women already approach the men they like” is a feel-good line women love to repeat, but let’s be honest—it’s mostly bullshit. It’s a narrative a lot of women tell themselves to feel like they’re putting in effort, when in reality, what they’re calling “approaching” is usually limited to safe, low-risk signals like eye contact, vague compliments, or liking a guy’s photo. Deep down, a lot of women know the current gender dynamic benefits them. You don’t have to risk rejection, put yourself out th…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 12:47 PM
0	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it You just gave me a long-winded non-answer laced with condescension. You're not disproving anything I said. You're just shifting the conversation to sex drive, popularity dynamics, and vaguely nostalgic stories about organic flirting as if that cancels out the documented, widespread trend of men being the primary initiators in dating. And that’s not just opinion—it’s supported by real-world stats from nearly every dating app and social study on courtship behaviour. You ask when women would have t…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 12:44 PM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Exactly and that’s the part that rarely gets said out loud. You can date passively, sure but that means relinquishing control and accepting whatever results come your way without complaint. You don’t get to stay passive and hyper-selective, and expect the guy to be perfect at reading your mind, hitting every note, and still take the lead without flaw. That’s just unrealistic. What you're describing is the split between wanting traditional courtship when it benefits you, and modern equality when …	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 12:38 PM
2	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it That’s more a reflection of the nature of this space, to be fair. This sub is a lot more lenient than most places online especially on Reddit.	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 12:32 PM
-1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it If “women approach when they’re interested” were truly the norm, we wouldn’t still be having this conversation or seeing men send 80-90% of first messages on dating apps, or watching women still overwhelmingly expect men to initiate in real life. That line is mostly a feel-good narrative women tell themselves to maintain the illusion of effort while still enjoying the comfort of traditional gender roles a lot of you are supposedly against. And before you claim it’s because 'most men aren’t up to…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 12:30 PM
3	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Simple: if you’re not attracted to passive men, then don’t be passive yourself. Lead with the same energy you want to receive. No one’s saying you should date men who just sit around and wait but if you sit around and wait, how are you any different? This is exactly the issue: women want confident, intentional men… while refusing to be confident or intentional themselves. You can’t demand boldness while offering ambiguity. If you want someone who leads, attracts, and pursues with clarity—then sh…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 12:22 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it This is exactly the mess I’m talking about. Women want to be approached, but only by the right guy, at the right moment, when they’re in the right mood. If any of those variables are off? Suddenly it’s “creepy” or “inappropriate.” But if men stop approaching altogether, that’s a problem too. We're "cowards" or "not real men." You literally can’t win. And yeah there’s zero accountability. Women won’t initiate, won’t give clear signals, but will still complain when dating doesn't go their way. The…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 12:21 PM
1	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Nobody said being single is a “total loss.” The point is, if someone consistently complains about their dating experience while sticking to passive, outdated strategies, then yeah—that’s self-sabotage. Choosing to stay single and owning that choice is one thing. Complaining about poor outcomes while doing nothing to change your approach is another. Also, “women do approach when they’re interested” is only true in the most selective, low-risk scenarios—if the guy is highly attractive, if the cond…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 12:17 PM
11	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it No, the solution isn’t “pursue the men you already think aren’t good enough.” That’s a misread. The point is: if you’re constantly disappointed with who’s showing up, maybe it’s time to stop waiting for the right people to come to you and start being intentional about who you pursue, connect with, or give a shot. Taking an active role means taking control of your outcomes, not just complaining about the options that happen to fall into your lap. You can’t keep relying on passive strategies waiti…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 12:14 PM
6	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it “Women approach men they like. Facts.” Cool statement. Now back it up with actual data or anything beyond “trust me, bro.” Saying “it’s the norm” without evidence is just opinion dressed up as truth. Meanwhile, the actual observable norm—both online and in real life—is still men overwhelmingly being the ones expected to initiate, pursue, and lead. That’s why nearly every dating app still reports men sending the vast majority of first messages, and why women themselves openly talk about how they …	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 12:10 PM
11	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Sure—people complain. The sun rises. Water’s wet. That’s not the point. The difference is, when people consistently make choices that lead to poor outcomes, and loudly blame external factors while refusing to adjust their own behaviour, it becomes fair game for critique. Especially when that dynamic shapes broader cultural narratives around dating. Saying “just ignore it” is like saying we shouldn’t discuss any flawed behaviour just because it’s common. That logic could apply to literally anythi…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 12:08 PM
4	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it But that’s the issue—you’re calling it logic just because it feels justified based on limited experience. “It didn’t work for me, therefore it’s flawed” isn’t logic, it’s rationalisation. If anything, that proves the comfort-over-agency point: trying something briefly, not getting ideal results, then writing it off completely. That’s not how growth or success works in any area of life. Men experience rejection constantly, and yet they’re expected to keep pushing, improve their approach, and not …	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 11:41 AM
3	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it I agree that being active doesn’t have to only mean direct cold approaches—there’s a definitely a spectrum. Socialising, putting yourself in the right spaces, and keeping conversations alive are forms of engagement. But I think we both know that many women still stop far short of anything that actually requires them to take initiative when it’s not already a sure thing. You say women have “done this and realised it’s not a good strategy.” But here’s the thing: when men try and fail, they’re expe…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 11:40 AM
25	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it "Let them fail" would be fine if they actually owned the failure. But they don’t. They complain. Loudly. Constantly. About how dating sucks, men aren’t good enough, nobody meets their standards, etc. This isn’t about men not being chosen. It’s about outcomes and women playing the same passive role over and over, getting the same unsatisfying results, and then acting like they’re just unlucky or that men are the problem. If you refuse to change your dating strategy, then yeah—stop moaning when it…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 11:37 AM
–	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it Yep. There’s a massive disconnect between the “strong, independent woman” branding and how a lot of those same women actually operate in dating. Independence tends to vanish the moment initiative is required. They still expect men to lead, initiate, plan, and pursue just like always. If you’re falling back on traditional dynamics, that’s your choice but then you lose the high ground when it comes to complaining. You can’t cling to passive dating habits, rely on men to carry the interaction, and …	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 11:32 AM
3	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it That’s exactly the pattern I’m calling out: choosing comfort over agency, then acting like the dating system and men are the problem when things don’t just fall into your lap. Now, maybe that doesn’t apply to you personally but it’s a common trend. Too many women dip their toes into effort, have a slither of the male dating experience, don’t get the results they want, and retreat back to passivity, then complain that nothing’s working. The real logic is simple: if you want different results, try…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 11:30 AM
7	Women’s reliance on passive dating is self-sabotage and they know it If women were truly doing this en masse, we wouldn’t be having the same rinse-and-repeat complaints about modern dating dynamics every time the topic comes up on Reddit, on TikTok, in articles, everywhere. The reality is, while some women do take initiative with men they're highly attracted to, it's the exception, not the norm. And often, it's done in extremely low-risk ways like dropping a hint or liking a dating profile—not the kind of clear, direct approach men are expected to make daily. Say…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/03/25 11:20 AM
1	Fix for dating and loneliness lies in valuing happy singledom (mostly for men) So, it’s a pick-your-poison situation—play the game or don’t play at all. Even if you’re convinced no man can truly choose the latter, it’s still the only other option. Personally, I have no issue not playing at all. I don’t pedestalise women like most men do, so I know their validation isn’t a necessity for me and I can do without. Can you say the same and if not what will you do?	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 10:07 PM
1	Fix for dating and loneliness lies in valuing happy singledom (mostly for men) Interesting...	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 10:00 PM
1	Fix for dating and loneliness lies in valuing happy singledom (mostly for men) What is the answer then? You've scrutinised plenty of my talking points but given none of your own...	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 09:21 PM
1	Fix for dating and loneliness lies in valuing happy singledom (mostly for men) Share them.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 09:19 PM
1	Fix for dating and loneliness lies in valuing happy singledom (mostly for men) I think it needs to be said that women will NEVER change in any way that benefits men. It will never happen. So you see how we don't much choice here right? So because of that men need to just pick their poison. If you're not willing to leave the system, then complaining about it is pointless—the option to step away is right there. And if you truly believe the system is broken, the only way it ever changes is by more men opting out and refusing to play the game on unfair terms. But the truth is,…	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 09:05 PM
1	Fix for dating and loneliness lies in valuing happy singledom (mostly for men) Up to you.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 08:24 PM
3	Fix for dating and loneliness lies in valuing happy singledom (mostly for men) I did. The first part is a fact.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 05:41 PM
1	Fix for dating and loneliness lies in valuing happy singledom (mostly for men) Confidence comes from competence—the more a guy builds skills, improves his body, and gains experience in different areas of life, the more confidence naturally develops. It’s not some magic trait you’re born with; it’s a byproduct of doing hard things and succeeding at them. And yeah using finances as a flex in dating is weak, but being financially stable isn’t about impressing women—it’s about independence and having options. If you’re broke and struggling, you’re at a disadvantage in every ar…	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 05:15 PM
5	Stating that sex and intimacy for men is a need, isn’t a proposal for sexual slavery. This is a common strawman that women propose because it would be ethically uncomfortable to acknowledge this being true. OP can’t have it both ways. You can’t introduce the idea that sex is a need, compare it to blood transfusions, and then say we’re ‘off-topic’ for discussing the implications of that framing. If you want to argue that sex as a need doesn’t lead to entitlement, then you have to engage with why people push back against that idea—not just dismiss them as dishonest or ‘inconvenienced.’ The moment OP made claims about why people reject this framing, they opened the door to this discussion. You can’t j…	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 05:06 PM
1	Fix for dating and loneliness lies in valuing happy singledom (mostly for men) I'm saying that for the many guys who are trying—and there are a lot—if they stopped participating, the whole thing would collapse. Whether we were ever fully included or not, it's our engagement that keeps it running. If enough opt out, the dynamic shifts entirely.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 04:59 PM
3	Stating that sex and intimacy for men is a need, isn’t a proposal for sexual slavery. This is a common strawman that women propose because it would be ethically uncomfortable to acknowledge this being true. Wow this is a really good point I didn't consider. Well said.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 04:54 PM
2	Fix for dating and loneliness lies in valuing happy singledom (mostly for men) By focusing on what he can control—his physique, career, finances, social skills, and overall lifestyle. Instead of obsessing over dating, he should be improving in areas that make him more valuable as a person, not just as a potential partner. When a guy has a strong foundation—confidence, purpose, independence—he’s not desperate for a relationship to fill a void. Ironically, that makes him more attractive and puts him in a better position to actually succeed in dating. It’s not about becoming …	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 03:26 PM
1	Fix for dating and loneliness lies in valuing happy singledom (mostly for men) If a guy has no leverage in dating, his only real option is to build himself up so he’s not playing from a position of desperation. That’s not delusion, that’s strategy.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 03:15 PM
8	Stating that sex and intimacy for men is a need, isn’t a proposal for sexual slavery. This is a common strawman that women propose because it would be ethically uncomfortable to acknowledge this being true. You keep saying OP is 'explicitly' separating need from entitlement, but that doesn’t change how people hear and interpret it. Language doesn’t exist in a vacuum—certain framings come with baggage, whether OP intends it or not. That’s why people react this way. And no, it’s not just because of ‘socialists’ or ‘female posters’ assuming entitlements—plenty of people, across all ideologies, push back against this framing because it has historically been used to justify entitlement. That’s the conce…	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 03:13 PM
2	Fix for dating and loneliness lies in valuing happy singledom (mostly for men) You're pretty bleak for a purple pill.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 03:01 PM
1	Fix for dating and loneliness lies in valuing happy singledom (mostly for men) It's crazy because if us guys just 'opted out' this whole thing crumbles but it's a big task.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 03:00 PM
1	Fix for dating and loneliness lies in valuing happy singledom (mostly for men) I wish us both luck with that then.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 02:50 PM
2	Fix for dating and loneliness lies in valuing happy singledom (mostly for men) That's a good mindset! /s	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 02:46 PM
3	Fix for dating and loneliness lies in valuing happy singledom (mostly for men) I mean I agree assuming you suggest we as men encourage each other to 'opt out'. In fact I've made posts here before encouraging such a thing but other dudes particularly red pill ones always have some reason why we shouldn't and often claim a man would be "cowardly" or a "failure" for doing so.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 02:46 PM
1	Fix for dating and loneliness lies in valuing happy singledom (mostly for men) Fair enough, everyone’s experience is different. But if building a fulfilling life hasn’t made loneliness more manageable for you, what’s the alternative? Just sitting in it and hoping a relationship fixes everything? Because that mindset tends to make things worse, not better. I’m not saying having hobbies, friendships, and goals erases loneliness entirely—but it gives you something else to lean on so it’s not all-consuming. If that hasn’t worked for you, then what do you think actually does? B…	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 02:37 PM
12	Stating that sex and intimacy for men is a need, isn’t a proposal for sexual slavery. This is a common strawman that women propose because it would be ethically uncomfortable to acknowledge this being true. It’s not ‘projection’—it’s a recognition of how language shapes expectations. If calling sex a ‘need’ didn’t often carry an implication of entitlement, then why do so many people push back against it? Why does this conversation happen over and over again? If the argument is simply ‘sex is important for well-being,’ there’d be no controversy. The reason people are cautious is because we’ve seen where this framing leads—whether it’s frustration, resentment, or outright entitlement when that ‘need’…	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 02:35 PM
5	Stating that sex and intimacy for men is a need, isn’t a proposal for sexual slavery. This is a common strawman that women propose because it would be ethically uncomfortable to acknowledge this being true. I get that OP’s focus was on the straw man, but that doesn’t exist in a vacuum. The reason some people react so strongly isn’t because they’re incapable of nuance—it’s because we’ve seen how framing sex as a need has historically been used to justify entitlement. Sure, not everyone who makes that claim is arguing for something extreme. But the pushback isn’t just an emotional overreaction; it’s rooted in the fact that this rhetoric has been used to frame sex as something that men are unfairly 'd…	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 02:34 PM
1	Fix for dating and loneliness lies in valuing happy singledom (mostly for men) At the end of the day, I think the real takeaway is fix your life first, then approach dating from a position of strength rather than need. OP might not have spelt that out perfectly, but that’s what I quite easily I took from it.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 02:31 PM
2	Fix for dating and loneliness lies in valuing happy singledom (mostly for men) Yeah, long-term loneliness can lead to desperation, but the difference is whether you’re actively making your life better in the meantime. If a guy is lonely and doing nothing about it except waiting for a relationship to fix it, that’s when desperation really takes hold. If you’re building a solid life (hobbies, friendships, goals) you might still feel lonely sometimes, but you won’t be as crippled by it. That’s the key difference. The guys who put their entire sense of fulfillment on getting a…	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 02:27 PM
3	Fix for dating and loneliness lies in valuing happy singledom (mostly for men) Fair enough. Forced singledom is brutal, and I’m not saying every guy can just "bootstrap" their way out of it like it’s that simple. Luck plays a role, and sometimes the situation really is just stacked against you. That being said, sitting in that mindset of "I'm screwed and can't do anything about it" doesn’t help either. Yeah, not everyone is built to be a monk, and yeah, women being single isn’t the same because they usually have options. But the hard truth is, we don’t have the same luxury…	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 02:24 PM
3	Stating that sex and intimacy for men is a need, isn’t a proposal for sexual slavery. This is a common strawman that women propose because it would be ethically uncomfortable to acknowledge this being true. The difference is that a kidney, blood donation, or even housing can all be provided in a neutral, impersonal way by third parties or institutions. Sex isn’t like that it’s an interpersonal act that requires mutual desire, which is why people are wary of how it’s framed. Even if OP isn’t saying people are owed sex, this framing still shapes expectations in a way that can lead to entitlement, frustration, and resentment. That’s why people push back—not because they think OP is demanding anything,…	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 02:22 PM
12	Fix for dating and loneliness lies in valuing happy singledom (mostly for men) I agree that men would be better off if they saw relationships as enhancing their peace rather than trying to fix loneliness or desperation. I've been preaching this for a while and that’s exactly why I said I’d rather self-improve for myself rather than for the sake of being more appealing to women. If a guy is thriving on his own, he won’t settle for a relationship that doesn’t add to his life—he won’t need to.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 02:19 PM
14	Fix for dating and loneliness lies in valuing happy singledom (mostly for men) I completely agree—women have a huge advantage in dating, and modern culture only amplifies it. No matter how they act, there’s always demand for them, while men have to constantly self-improve just to be considered. And even then, there’s no guarantee. The real issue is that we, as men, don’t have much leverage to push back against behaviour we don’t like in dating. Women don’t need us the way we need them, so they set the terms, and we either play along or get left behind. That’s why you're no…	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 02:15 PM
3	Stating that sex and intimacy for men is a need, isn’t a proposal for sexual slavery. This is a common strawman that women propose because it would be ethically uncomfortable to acknowledge this being true. You literally asked if I knew someone in this situation. I gave you an answer. Now you’re nitpicking because it didn’t fit the imaginary standard you made up after the fact. Whether by choice or circumstance, plenty of people live fulfilling lives without sex. You just don’t want to accept it because it undermines your worldview. But that’s a you problem.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 02:08 PM
5	Fix for dating and loneliness lies in valuing happy singledom (mostly for men) Pretty bleak take. Good luck.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 02:07 PM
7	Fix for dating and loneliness lies in valuing happy singledom (mostly for men) If you think being single automatically means you’re a failure, you’re already setting yourself up to lose. Desperation isn’t attractive, and treating relationships as the only proof of your worth is why so many guys struggle in the first place. Plenty of people are single for reasons beyond just being "undesirable"—bad luck, high standards, or just not wanting to settle for garbage. If you think forcing a relationship is better than being single, enjoy whatever mess that leads to.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 01:30 PM
3	Fix for dating and loneliness lies in valuing happy singledom (mostly for men) I get that—it’s definitely easier said than done. Loneliness is a real and difficult feeling, and I’m not saying it’s something you can just ignore. But the alternative—treating a relationship as the only solution—puts you in a position where your happiness depends on external factors you can’t fully control. That’s what leads to desperation, and desperation rarely gets good results in dating. The goal isn’t to pretend loneliness doesn’t exist, but to build a life where it’s not overwhelming. St…	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 01:28 PM
5	Stating that sex and intimacy for men is a need, isn’t a proposal for sexual slavery. This is a common strawman that women propose because it would be ethically uncomfortable to acknowledge this being true. I agree that bad-faith accusations don’t help productive discussion, but that doesn’t mean concerns about this framing aren’t valid. If the OP’s only goal was to say 'sex is important for emotional well-being,' then cool—no argument there. But they specifically push back against people being wary of that framing, which ignores why people are cautious about it in the first place. That’s what we’re actually discussing. So are you interested in engaging with that, or just dunking on people who went…	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 01:27 PM
2	Stating that sex and intimacy for men is a need, isn’t a proposal for sexual slavery. This is a common strawman that women propose because it would be ethically uncomfortable to acknowledge this being true. Funny how we’ve gone from "Do you actually know someone in this predicament?" to "Well, but he chose that life, so it doesn’t count." You asked if I knew someone who lives a healthy and fulfilling life without sex—I gave you an example. Now you’re scrambling to redefine the parameters because the answer didn’t go the way you wanted. The point remains: sex isn’t a requirement for happiness, no matter how much you want it to be.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 01:24 PM
5	Stating that sex and intimacy for men is a need, isn’t a proposal for sexual slavery. This is a common strawman that women propose because it would be ethically uncomfortable to acknowledge this being true. I’m not arguing that sex and intimacy aren’t important for well-being, just like friendships, love, and family are. But words shape expectations. The reason people push back isn’t because they think lonely men secretly want sexual slavery it’s because history shows that framing sex as a ‘need’ has fueled entitlement and resentment when that need isn’t met. When people say ‘I need sex for emotional well-being,’ it can shift from self-reflection (‘I should work on attracting a partner’) to blame (…	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 01:20 PM
2	Fix for dating and loneliness lies in valuing happy singledom (mostly for men) You can build a life that’s genuinely fulfilling without a relationship being the only thing that makes it feel complete. The problem is when men see singledom as a failure rather than just another way of living. That mindset shift alone gives them more control and confidence, which ironically makes dating easier when they do choose to engage with it.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 01:17 PM
1	Fix for dating and loneliness lies in valuing happy singledom (mostly for men) The way I see it is OP is encouraging a mindset shift so men aren’t approaching dating from a place of desperation. Yeah some women complain that men don’t approach anymore, but that’s a direct result of the current dating landscape—guys are realising that constant rejection, low success rates, and the risk of being seen as creepy make traditional approaches less appealing. If both men and women are struggling now, that just shows the system itself is off-balance. The real fix isn’t “just stop d…	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 01:14 PM
1	Fix for dating and loneliness lies in valuing happy singledom (mostly for men) Effort alone isn’t enough if it were, every guy aggressively pursuing dating would succeed. What actually matters is effective effort, which comes from improving yourself, understanding social dynamics, and having leverage. Just throwing yourself at the problem without strategy leads to frustration, not confidence. Men absolutely struggle with self-worth being tied to dating—if they didn’t, so many wouldn’t spiral when they have no options. Some guys disengage due to fulfilling hobbies, but most…	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 01:09 PM
6	Stating that sex and intimacy for men is a need, isn’t a proposal for sexual slavery. This is a common strawman that women propose because it would be ethically uncomfortable to acknowledge this being true. The issue is that calling sex a 'need' shifts the way people think about it, often in ways that create entitlement, even unintentionally. Your example about friendships and loving parents actually proves my point. Yes, those things are incredibly important for well-being but when people frame them as needs in the same way as food or shelter, it can lead to resentment, entitlement, and toxic behaviour when those needs aren’t met. We see this all the time in people who struggle socially and blame …	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 01:03 PM
2	Fix for dating and loneliness lies in valuing happy singledom (mostly for men) I don’t think OP is saying men should just resign themselves to being single forever. The point is more about shifting the mindset from desperation to choice. Yeah, humans are social creatures, and dating is a natural part of life, but when guys see being single as a problem to solve rather than just one way to live, they approach dating from a place of lack—and that’s not attractive. Self-improvement is great, but if it’s done only for the sake of getting a partner, it’s just another form of ex…	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 12:56 PM
3	Fix for dating and loneliness lies in valuing happy singledom (mostly for men) Eh I think the idea that men are just “starving” while women are “fasting” frames it as purely an access issue, when in reality, mindset plays a huge role. If men collectively stopped treating singledom as some unbearable curse and actually built fulfilling lives outside of dating, they’d naturally have more leverage. A guy who’s thriving on his own isn’t “starving”—he’s just not willing to eat scraps. And ironically, that makes him more desirable in the long run. Desperation is the real killer …	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 12:51 PM
3	Fix for dating and loneliness lies in valuing happy singledom (mostly for men) OP’s point didn’t necessarily come across as "be more like women" to me, but more about adopting a healthier mindset towards singledom rather than seeing it as some kind of failure. And yeah, women have had their struggles too, just in different ways. The high standards and independence we see now didn’t appear out of nowhere—they were shaped by their own experiences and history. It’s not that men haven’t been doing this at all, but that there’s still a lingering cultural expectation that being …	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 12:46 PM
4	Fix for dating and loneliness lies in valuing happy singledom (mostly for men) The problem isn't whether singlehood is 'chosen' or 'imposed'—it's that men have been conditioned to fear it. Even if a woman could get into a relationship anytime, that doesn’t mean she has to, because she doesn’t see being single as some kind of existential failure. Meanwhile, men internalise the idea that being single = being inadequate, which leads to the exact kind of desperation and bitterness that makes dating even harder for them. The real issue isn’t access to relationships but that men…	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 12:44 PM
2	Stating that sex and intimacy for men is a need, isn’t a proposal for sexual slavery. This is a common strawman that women propose because it would be ethically uncomfortable to acknowledge this being true. Ah, so now the only "valid" example is someone who was physically incapable of ever having sex? That’s a laughably extreme standard. You’re desperately clinging to this idea that happiness is impossible without sex, but reality doesn’t work that way. There are countless people who, for one reason or another—whether through choice, circumstance, or personal preference—live fulfilling lives without it. You just refuse to accept it because it dismantles your argument.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 12:40 PM
6	Stating that sex and intimacy for men is a need, isn’t a proposal for sexual slavery. This is a common strawman that women propose because it would be ethically uncomfortable to acknowledge this being true. You’re right that acknowledging something as a need doesn’t automatically mean forcing people to provide it. But it does influence the way society frames expectations and obligations around it. The reason people push back isn’t because they think OP is outright advocating coercion—it’s because this framing has historically been used to justify entitlement to sex. Blood, housing, and medical care are systemic issues society can address collectively. But sex is an interpersonal act requiring mutua…	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 12:38 PM
5	Fix for dating and loneliness lies in valuing happy singledom (mostly for men) Throwing yourself at the problem without any leverage isn’t a winning strategy. Desperation just makes things worse by lowering standards and making men seem less desirable. And acting like sex and companionship are the only things making men unhappy is way too simplistic. Plenty of guys get into relationships and are still miserable because they never built a fulfilling life outside of dating. If relationships were a guaranteed fix, we wouldn’t see so many unhappy couples. So it's not about giv…	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 12:34 PM
0	Fix for dating and loneliness lies in valuing happy singledom (mostly for men) I think you're slightly missing the mark on what OP is actually saying. It’s not about forcing yourself to be happy without dating or ignoring biological instincts but about shifting the mindset so that being single isn’t seen as a failure or something to desperately escape from and be deeply afraid of because fear of such a thing can be very influential to a man but to a detriment. Yeah, men have always leaned into work, travel, and hobbies when they don’t have a partner, but there’s often an u…	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 12:27 PM
8	Stating that sex and intimacy for men is a need, isn’t a proposal for sexual slavery. This is a common strawman that women propose because it would be ethically uncomfortable to acknowledge this being true. The concern isn’t about extreme hypotheticals; it’s about how framing sex as a ‘need’ can imply entitlement, which is what people are pushing back against.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 12:17 PM
36	Fix for dating and loneliness lies in valuing happy singledom (mostly for men) When it comes down to it, I guess us guys aren't really in a position of power and are meant to work in a way that betters a woman’s peace, and if we don’t, we’re not worth dating. We’re competing with women’s singledom, and this is often what women say—and I tend to believe it. Personally, I have no patience for it and don't look around me feeling like these current women are worth any amount of work/effort. If I'm gonna self-improve, it's gonna be completely selfish—not for female validation o…	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 12:15 PM
4	Fix for dating and loneliness lies in valuing happy singledom (mostly for men) Yeah, this is a solid take. I've been saying for ages that a big part of the dating imbalance comes from how men and women perceive singledom. When women are fine with being single and men treat it like a personal failure, the dynamic shifts men lower their standards and overvalue relationships, while women can afford to be pickier. A lot of this comes from traditional gender roles that still linger. Men were historically expected to have a partner and a family to be seen as "successful," wherea…	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 12:10 PM
4	Stating that sex and intimacy for men is a need, isn’t a proposal for sexual slavery. This is a common strawman that women propose because it would be ethically uncomfortable to acknowledge this being true. As predicted, the goalpost has moved. You trapped yourself in a corner with that dumb question, but now you're too stubborn to let it go. You asked for an example, I gave you one—there’s nothing else for you to say. The point stands—sex isn’t a requirement for happiness, and plenty of people, whether voluntarily or involuntarily, live fulfilling lives without it. You just don’t want to accept it because it contradicts your worldview.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 12:07 PM
2	Stating that sex and intimacy for men is a need, isn’t a proposal for sexual slavery. This is a common strawman that women propose because it would be ethically uncomfortable to acknowledge this being true. My uncle. Lost interest in dating years ago after a rough divorce, focused on his hobbies, career, and friendships instead. Travels often, stays in great shape, and is one of the most content people I know. Not everyone’s fulfillment revolves around sex, no matter how much you want that to be the case.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 12:01 PM
10	Stating that sex and intimacy for men is a need, isn’t a proposal for sexual slavery. This is a common strawman that women propose because it would be ethically uncomfortable to acknowledge this being true. Don't ask the question if you're just going to get pissy about a response that doesn't reinforce your narrative.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 11:27 AM
11	Stating that sex and intimacy for men is a need, isn’t a proposal for sexual slavery. This is a common strawman that women propose because it would be ethically uncomfortable to acknowledge this being true. You’re trying to redefine how analogies work to avoid engaging with the actual argument. Analogies aren’t just about stating things in a similar format they rely on meaningful comparisons between concepts. If the comparison doesn’t hold up under scrutiny, the analogy fails. Your entire argument hinges on equating “stated needs” rather than actual needs, but that’s not how reasoning works. People push back because sex, unlike food or medical treatment, is not a necessity for survival. That’s a fu…	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 10:13 AM
10	Stating that sex and intimacy for men is a need, isn’t a proposal for sexual slavery. This is a common strawman that women propose because it would be ethically uncomfortable to acknowledge this being true. That I know people in this "predicament" who actual live a healthy and fulfilled life. What else could that be a response to...	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 10:10 AM
15	Stating that sex and intimacy for men is a need, isn’t a proposal for sexual slavery. This is a common strawman that women propose because it would be ethically uncomfortable to acknowledge this being true. You’re trying to play semantic games to avoid addressing the core issue. Saying your premise is “neither proven nor unproven” doesn’t change the fact that your analogies depend on people accepting it as if it’s true. That’s why people are challenging it. Analogies don’t just “exist” in a vacuum they work if and only if the things being compared are meaningfully similar. The problem is that sex and life-sustaining needs like food or medical treatment are not comparable in the way you claim. So no…	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 09:16 AM
21	Stating that sex and intimacy for men is a need, isn’t a proposal for sexual slavery. This is a common strawman that women propose because it would be ethically uncomfortable to acknowledge this being true. Your argument falls apart because the distinction isn’t just about whether something is a need it’s about how that label is used in discussions. When people call something a need, it often implies some level of societal obligation or moral expectation, even if it’s not legally enforced. Your example of a blood donation proves my point. Blood is considered a medical necessity, and while donating isn’t mandatory, there are constant campaigns, incentives, and appeals to morality encouraging people …	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 09:13 AM
6	Stating that sex and intimacy for men is a need, isn’t a proposal for sexual slavery. This is a common strawman that women propose because it would be ethically uncomfortable to acknowledge this being true. The reason people push back on calling sex a need is that it often carries the implication that others are obligated to provide it. If something isn’t necessary for survival, it’s more accurately called a want or desire, even if it’s deeply important to someone’s quality of life.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 09:09 AM
2	Stating that sex and intimacy for men is a need, isn’t a proposal for sexual slavery. This is a common strawman that women propose because it would be ethically uncomfortable to acknowledge this being true. Not really. That's for deeper reasons. Don't fear monger by spreading shit like that.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 09:06 AM
15	Stating that sex and intimacy for men is a need, isn’t a proposal for sexual slavery. This is a common strawman that women propose because it would be ethically uncomfortable to acknowledge this being true. Yes.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 09:04 AM
36	Stating that sex and intimacy for men is a need, isn’t a proposal for sexual slavery. This is a common strawman that women propose because it would be ethically uncomfortable to acknowledge this being true. Whenever you red pill men frame sex as a need, it historically has been used to justify coercion. That’s why people are wary of this argument. If you’re genuinely just trying to “state facts,” then acknowledge that sex isn’t a life-or-death necessity and that no one is obligated to fulfill someone else’s desires. Otherwise, you’re just upset that people aren’t accepting your framing uncritically.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 09:04 AM
13	Stating that sex and intimacy for men is a need, isn’t a proposal for sexual slavery. This is a common strawman that women propose because it would be ethically uncomfortable to acknowledge this being true. The foundation of your point doesn't work.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 08:58 AM
18	Stating that sex and intimacy for men is a need, isn’t a proposal for sexual slavery. This is a common strawman that women propose because it would be ethically uncomfortable to acknowledge this being true. You keep saying you’re not arguing whether sex is or isn’t a need, yet your entire post relies on people accepting that it is. If you refuse to explain why calling it a “need” is important, then why should anyone accept the premise of your analogy? You also keep pushing this idea that people reject your claim out of “convenience,” but that’s just a lazy way to dismiss valid counterarguments. The disagreement isn’t about personal implications but whether your comparison holds up logically. If you…	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 08:56 AM
1	Stating that sex and intimacy for men is a need, isn’t a proposal for sexual slavery. This is a common strawman that women propose because it would be ethically uncomfortable to acknowledge this being true. That's propaganda to keep men desperate for female validation and intimacy.	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 08:54 AM
16	Stating that sex and intimacy for men is a need, isn’t a proposal for sexual slavery. This is a common strawman that women propose because it would be ethically uncomfortable to acknowledge this being true. You can’t “debunk a straw man” when your entire premise relies on an unproven assumption. Your analogy only works if sex is a fundamental need, like food or medical care. That’s the very point people are challenging. Saying “I’m not arguing whether sex is or is not a need” while using an analogy that depends on sex being a need is self-contradictory. If the foundation of your argument doesn’t hold up, the comparison falls apart. People pushing back on that aren’t “derailing” or “spamming.” They’…	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 08:52 AM
7	Stating that sex and intimacy for men is a need, isn’t a proposal for sexual slavery. This is a common strawman that women propose because it would be ethically uncomfortable to acknowledge this being true. I think this misinterprets Maslow’s Hierarchy of Needs and falsely equates “sex” with an essential physiological requirement like food, water, or oxygen. Maslow included sex in the physiological needs category, but he wasn’t referring to personal sexual gratification he was talking about reproduction. That’s why “sex” is listed alongside things like air and sleep, which are necessary for sustaining life at a species level, not on an individual basis. Even if you accept a broader definition where…	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 08:49 AM
32	Stating that sex and intimacy for men is a need, isn’t a proposal for sexual slavery. This is a common strawman that women propose because it would be ethically uncomfortable to acknowledge this being true. Calling sex a "need" in this context often comes with the implication that society or others are obligated to provide it. That’s why people push back against it. No one is saying that acknowledging the importance of intimacy is the same as endorsing coercion—the problem is pretending it belongs in the same category as life-sustaining medical treatments	/r/PurplePillDebate	06/02/25 08:43 AM
1	How are young men being disenfranchised? Women having free will isn’t the issue no one is saying women shouldn’t have choices. The issue is that society recognizes systemic problems when they disadvantage women but calls it "natural selection" when men are struggling. That’s the hypocrisy. Telling men to "stop simping" and "stop marrying slutty women" is a non-solution. The idea that men could collectively shift the dating market through discipline is a fantasy just like telling women to stop chasing the top 10% of men wouldn’t work. T…	/r/PurplePillDebate	27/01/25 12:04 AM
3	Dont expect women to fix men’s issues when they dont like women’s solutions. I think there are still major inconsistencies in your argument. You argue that when men face disadvantages today, it’s just the ‘loss of an unfair advantage.’ But that framing assumes that all disparities in men’s favour were illegitimate, while all disparities in women’s favour today are just natural shifts. That’s selective reasoning. A disadvantage is a disadvantage, regardless of history. The fact that men used to have more power doesn’t make their current struggles any less real or worthy o…	/r/PurplePillDebate	26/01/25 10:34 PM
5	How are young men being disenfranchised? The imbalance isn’t just about “men being hornier.” That’s a reductive way to frame it. The dating market has changed because cultural shifts and technology have given women more options while maintaining traditional expectations for men. Women are making choices that contribute to the imbalance—choosing higher standards, prioritising careers over relationships, and gravitating toward the top percentage of men. That’s their right, but it does create a system where a large portion of men are stru…	/r/PurplePillDebate	26/01/25 10:26 PM
10	Dont expect women to fix men’s issues when they dont like women’s solutions. That’s a convenient way to avoid addressing the problem. Men do need to take responsibility for their issues but how exactly are they supposed to do that when every attempt to even talk about those issues is shut down, dismissed, or framed as misogyny? You’re proving my point. Instead of engaging with the reality that men’s issues are consistently sidelined, you’re just shifting the blame back onto men, as if the roadblocks to discussing these issues don’t exist. When women face systemic challen…	/r/PurplePillDebate	26/01/25 09:50 PM
8	Dont expect women to fix men’s issues when they dont like women’s solutions. So you’re admitting that feminists only started addressing men’s issues after conservatives and anti-woke groups did? That just proves my point feminism didn’t advocate for men out of genuine concern, it only did so as a reaction to maintain ideological control. If feminism actually cared about male issues, why did it wait until others brought them up? When feminists did engage, it wasn’t about actually solving men’s problems. It was about framing them in a way that still blamed men. That’s why …	/r/PurplePillDebate	26/01/25 09:48 PM
3	How are young men being disenfranchised? That’s true, but it doesn’t negate the issue. Boys get diagnosed more often because their symptoms tend to be more external (hyperactivity, impulsiveness, disruptive behaviour), while girls often present with more internalized symptoms (inattention, daydreaming, social withdrawal), which leads to underdiagnosis in girls. The problem isn’t that boys are diagnosed more—it’s that their natural behaviours are increasingly treated as problems that need medical intervention, rather than schools adapti…	/r/PurplePillDebate	26/01/25 09:40 PM
6	How are young men being disenfranchised? The fact that girls go undiagnosed for ADHD doesn’t change the fact that boys are disproportionately punished for acting like they have it. Boys' natural behaviours—higher energy, impulsivity, and physicality—lead to more suspensions, disciplinary actions, and misdiagnoses, which negatively affects their education and self-perception. Meanwhile, the way ADHD presents in girls is often quieter, so it flies under the radar. Both issues exist, but only one gets sympathy. As for school structure, or…	/r/PurplePillDebate	26/01/25 09:38 PM
5	Dont expect women to fix men’s issues when they dont like women’s solutions. Your logic is flawed. Yes, historically, men created societal structures—including marriage, dating norms, and workplace hierarchies. But that history doesn’t justify dismissing modern disadvantages that men now face. A disadvantage is a disadvantage, no matter how it develops. You’re basically arguing that because women were once oppressed in these systems, any shift that now disadvantages men is just ‘balance being restored’ rather than a new inequality that deserves attention. But we don’t ap…	/r/PurplePillDebate	26/01/25 09:35 PM
4	Dont expect women to fix men’s issues when they dont like women’s solutions. I see where you’re coming from, but I think your framing is inconsistent. You justify women blaming men for systemic issues like the wage gap by saying they’re 'blaming a system put in place by men,' yet when men critique modern dating dynamics—a system shaped by both historical structures and modern female choices—it’s suddenly an unfair demand on women’s 'personal power' and 'autonomy.' That’s a double standard. Women aren’t just blaming ‘a system’ when they talk about the wage gap; they frequ…	/r/PurplePillDebate	26/01/25 08:17 PM
10	Dont expect women to fix men’s issues when they dont like women’s solutions. I get the concern about 'women-blaming' groups, I think you’re overlooking something thought: the vast majority of mainstream feminist spaces do blame men for women's struggles. Every discussion on gendered issues in society—from the wage gap to harassment to gender roles—centres men as the cause of women's problems. Yet, when men talk about how modern dating expectations, shifting social dynamics, or societal attitudes toward masculinity contribute to their struggles, suddenly it’s 'blame isn’t…	/r/PurplePillDebate	26/01/25 07:36 PM
5	How are young men being disenfranchised? "Acting like a boy" generally means being more energetic, rough, competitive, or physical—traits that are natural for many boys but are now seen as behavioural problems in schools. Boys are more likely to be diagnosed with ADHD, punished for disruptive behaviour, and told to “calm down” in environments that cater more to quiet, orderly learning styles that favour girls. As for your point about women being seen as "the means to production," that just reinforces the idea that men are disposable. Y…	/r/PurplePillDebate	26/01/25 06:56 PM
9	How are young men being disenfranchised? Because holding someone socially responsible and holding them legally responsible are two different things. No one is saying all men should be arrested for what a minority of men do, but men as a group are often blamed for issues caused by a small percentage. If a CEO underpays women, it’s framed as “the wage gap is caused by men.” If a handful of powerful men are creeps, the message becomes “men need to do better.” If a woman has a bad dating experience, it turns into “men are trash.” Meanwhile…	/r/PurplePillDebate	26/01/25 06:54 PM
7	How are young men being disenfranchised? Because feminism and progressivism changed how relationships work, and not in a way that benefits the average man. Women now have higher standards, more options, and less pressure to settle down, while men still have the same expectations to provide, lead, and initiate. Online dating skews everything even more, with most women competing for the top percentage of men, leaving the rest struggling. When men bring this up, they get dismissed as bitter or misogynistic instead of anyone actually addre…	/r/PurplePillDebate	26/01/25 06:53 PM
23	How are young men being disenfranchised? This is a reach. You’re basically arguing that a poor 21-year-old man today somehow benefits from a system where men dominated higher education decades ago—as if that legacy magically grants him success now. Meanwhile, in reality, men are now the minority in universities, struggling more academically, and have fewer targeted support systems compared to women. Your argument also assumes that every man automatically gets encouragement from family, advisors, and society just for being male. That’s …	/r/PurplePillDebate	26/01/25 06:48 PM
14	How are young men being disenfranchised? Your argument boils down to "men have always had it easier, so any struggles they face now are just a skill issue and don’t warrant support." That’s a lazy take. Yes, historically, women faced systemic barriers that required correction. No one is denying that. But the playing field has shifted, and now men are struggling in ways that are measurable—education gaps, higher suicide rates, homelessness, and declining economic power. Ignoring these issues because “well, men had it easier in the past”…	/r/PurplePillDebate	26/01/25 06:46 PM
26	How are young men being disenfranchised? A lot of young men feel lost because traditional pathways to success—good job, stable income, homeownership, fulfilling relationships—are way harder to achieve now. Meanwhile, society constantly criticizes masculinity but doesn't offer a clear alternative, leaving guys feeling like they can't win. Education is pushing boys out, dating is more competitive than ever (especially with online dating skewing things), and many grow up without strong male role models. When guys feel like they’re struggl…	/r/PurplePillDebate	26/01/25 06:43 PM
9	Dont expect women to fix men’s issues when they dont like women’s solutions. It's a talking point used to make feminism more palatable to men and potentially gain more allies.	/r/PurplePillDebate	26/01/25 06:34 PM
12	Dont expect women to fix men’s issues when they dont like women’s solutions. The solution is for feminists to stop talking about male issues and quit pretending to care just to manipulate men into being allies. Equality is not the real goal.	/r/PurplePillDebate	26/01/25 02:20 PM
15	Dont expect women to fix men’s issues when they dont like women’s solutions. I think the hyperfocus on women’s rights and feminism has made it incredibly difficult for men to even start that conversation without backlash. How can men feel comfortable speaking up when every attempt at discussing male struggles is either ignored, reframed as a distraction from women’s issues, or labeled as misogyny? The few visible 'men’s rights' spaces online tend to get dismissed as woman-hating, so even genuine discussions about men’s struggles don’t get taken seriously. If you genuinel…	/r/PurplePillDebate	26/01/25 01:38 PM
3	On the a-sociality of many men today I get what you're saying, and I agree that being too closed off can become its own kind of prison. But I think the real issue is that a lot of guys don’t feel like they have a ‘safe’ middle ground. Being too open makes them vulnerable to being taken advantage of, but being too closed off isolates them. A lot of men struggle to find the balance between caution and connection, especially when modern social norms don’t always reward vulnerability in men the way they do for others. And yeah, walking…	/r/PurplePillDebate	26/01/25 11:15 AM
25	Why is it difficult for you to understand the validity of the idea of overcoming male (and not only) loneliness through romantic relationships? Yep. Been preaching this for a while. Red pillers especially hate hearing it though. Biological determinism is a hell of a drug.	/r/PurplePillDebate	26/01/25 11:13 AM
31	Dont expect women to fix men’s issues when they dont like women’s solutions. So I actually agree that men should take responsibility for their issues rather than expecting women or feminism to solve them. The problem is that this contradicts the mainstream feminist claim that "feminism helps men too." That’s the real hypocrisy here. On one hand, mainstream feminism and progressive spaces constantly say "feminism fights for men’s issues too!" But when men actually bring up their struggles, the response is something akin to your post. If feminism were truly about gender eq…	/r/PurplePillDebate	26/01/25 11:11 AM
49	Why is it difficult for you to understand the validity of the idea of overcoming male (and not only) loneliness through romantic relationships? Yep. Romance is great, but if you see it as a cure for loneliness rather than a part of a fulfilling life, you’re setting yourself up for disappointment.	/r/PurplePillDebate	26/01/25 11:02 AM
7	On the a-sociality of many men today You make a fair point—being constantly paranoid and treating every social interaction as a potential scam or loss isn’t a great way to live. If you assume bad intentions in everyone, you’re going to push people away and make it harder to form genuine connections. Yeah, the world has bad actors, but shutting yourself off from everyone out of fear just guarantees loneliness. That said this ignores why so many guys feel this way. Modern social dynamics whether in dating, friendships, or work have m…	/r/PurplePillDebate	26/01/25 10:59 AM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think By your logic that's the harder path no? Because you are fighting against your "natural drives" (cringe) that we must give in to or we will die miserably lmao	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 11:59 PM
1	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger In this conversation external validation = romantic validation which equals female validation.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 11:56 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Dam. 1hr later and still nothing constructive or intelligent to say? Come on man. Also no. That structure of typing is just how I used to do things academically and it stuck. It's robotic tonally but it works.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 11:52 PM
1	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger Helps to read my post. I'm not operating on your logic nor do you dictate the language of the debate: "Red Pill claims to be about male self-improvement, but at its core, it’s nothing more than biological determinism disguised as self-improvement. It tells men that everything in dating and relationships is dictated by evolutionary psychology—women are hypergamous, men must be providers, and everything is hardwired into our nature." This was always a gendered debate.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 11:46 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Okay, you disagree—that’s fine. I just think biological determinism is a weak excuse, especially when it’s used to rationalise oneitis. But hey, taking the path of least resistance is easier, so to each their own!	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 11:44 PM
2	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Thank you	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 11:32 PM
0	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Right. I don't think whatever that genetic thing is we're at its mercy, however. We're not cavemen anymore.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 11:31 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think These analogies aren't working. You’re comparing self-sufficiency to a disability, which makes no sense. Just accept some of us aren't ruled by our instincts and are better off for it. There are billions of us so this isn't a wild thing to have to admit. I can admit some of us ARE at their mercy which is fine as well I guess.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 11:30 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Boom. You get it!	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 11:24 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think I'm relieved you think so.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 11:24 PM
0	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Jesus only on Reddit... Good luck man.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 11:19 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think And no one is saying otherwise. Men also die happy never touching a woman. I know shocking. I can never get with this red pill thinking and judging by its reputation I'm clearly not alone. Good luck.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 11:19 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Empty rhetoric. If you disagree, make an argument.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 11:15 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Let me restate my position one last time: Wanting a relationship is normal. Finding meaning in one is fine. The issue is when a man needs a relationship to feel whole—when his self-worth is entirely tied to whether or not he has a partner. That’s dependency, not fulfillment. If you don’t see that as a problem, then we simply disagree. No point in going in circles. Agree to disagree. I will never understand you red pillers and I'm clearly not alone considering your ideologies reputation. Good luc…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 11:14 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Because what happens if she leaves? If the only thing keeping your self-worth intact is your relationship, then you don’t actually have self-worth—you have borrowed stability. That’s the issue. I’m not saying relationships can’t be fulfilling—I’m saying a man should still be whole without one. If losing it would break you, then it wasn’t a solution. It was just a temporary shield from the real problem.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 11:07 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Wanting a relationship, pursuing one, and using that motivation productively? Fine. Needing one to feel whole? That’s the issue. There’s nothing wrong with the urge itself—the problem is when men can’t function without fulfilling it. If a man only works hard, socialises, and improves himself because he’s chasing a relationship, what happens when that relationship fails? What happens if he never gets one? A man who builds his life for women instead of for himself is setting himself up for a crash…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 11:04 PM
2	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think I get what you’re saying, and I agree—this belief is deeply ingrained in society. But that’s exactly why it needs to be challenged. The idea that a man’s most profound experiences must come from the love of a woman isn’t some universal truth—it’s conditioning. And I’m not saying ‘just don’t depend on women’ with no alternative. The real alternative is intrinsic self-worth. That means building a life where your fulfillment isn’t contingent on a relationship. That can come from purpose, mastery, p…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 11:01 PM
2	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think You just proved my argument. You’re not saying you ‘grew’—you’re saying you became dependent on your wife to fill a need you never addressed yourself. That’s exactly the issue. You compared it to hunger, but that’s a flawed analogy. Hunger is a biological necessity—without food, you die. But relationships aren’t the same. If your entire sense of self collapses the moment your wife stops validating you, that’s not just a ‘need’ being filled—that’s dependency. I’m not saying relationships don’t ad…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 10:59 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Losing weight is fighting biological programming—just like overcoming validation dependency is. But notice what you said: "Understanding this helps you fight it, plan ahead, and use those urges productively." Exactly. That’s self-awareness, discipline, and adaptability. No one is saying biology doesn’t influence us. I’m saying it’s not an unstoppable force. You acknowledge that people can resist binge eating by recognising the impulse and choosing a different path. So why is it impossible for me…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 10:56 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think At this point, you’re just admitting you have no real counterargument. You’re not engaging with what I said—you’re fixated on whether this post represents some ‘personal position’ as if that changes the validity of the argument itself. If you actually had a real issue with my stance, you’d argue against it. Instead, you’re just finding excuses not to. That says everything. Have something constructive and relevant to say or move on. Your little gotcha attempt didn’t work lmao	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 10:53 PM
1	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger Because this is a Red Pill-themed conversation, and the entire ideology revolves around the gender dynamics between men and women. That’s literally why it exists. Of course, validation can apply to friendships and family, but that’s not what we’re discussing. The issue here is men who can’t maintain self-worth without romantic validation, which is exactly what Red Pill feeds on. Shifting the conversation to general social validation is just avoiding the point	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 10:50 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think But being single is lesser evil than relationship with a wrong person. Agreed and one's desperation for female validation could end up matching them up with said wrong person.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 10:46 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think You’re still dodging the argument by reframing it instead of engaging with it. My post explicitly says: "Men need women too much. Not for survival, not for companionship, but for validation." That doesn’t mean men never seek relationships for companionship or family—it means too many men base their self-worth on whether or not they have one. If you actually read what I wrote instead of twisting it, you’d see that. And no, I never said "some men can live happily single, therefore all men should."…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 10:44 PM
2	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Convincing yourself you have no control is easier I get it. I can't do that, unfortunately. I value self-responsibility and human adaptability too much.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 10:38 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think No, you take it as whatever lets you avoid addressing my argument. I don’t post because I need to personally stake my entire identity on every discussion—I post because I find topics interesting to debate. If you can’t engage with what’s being said without trying to make it about me, that’s on you. You’re still dodging. If my position is so unclear, you wouldn’t be this desperate to misframe it.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 10:36 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think I’m not dismissing your relationship or the impact your wife had on you. A great partner can absolutely provide love, and support, and even inspire personal growth. But ultimately, sustained change has to come from within. If your wife helped you grow, that’s amazing—but the reason it worked is because you were open to that change. The problem is when men believe a relationship alone will ‘fix’ them without any personal effort. That mindset leads to dependency, not growth. Your experience shows …	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 10:34 PM
1	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger Everyone ≠ Women. This is the problem. We're not talking about general social interactions here just women...	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 10:31 PM
1	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger Disagree. The system wants you to continue to crave female validation and intimacy above all else. Keeps you guys gullible and easy to control.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 10:28 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Those men are victims of the same conditioning. We don't have to be this way however.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 10:26 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think You underestimate us as a species, unfortunately. I guess this is the path of least resistance though so I can't blame you for thinking this way.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 10:24 PM
3	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Ask Turnitin. My writing isn't the most... expressive. Years of essay writing does that to you.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 10:22 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think At this point, we’re just going in circles. You can keep insisting men are powerless against social conditioning, but that’s not an argument—it’s just learned helplessness. If that’s the mindset you want to stay in, that’s your choice. But don’t expect everyone else to do the same. Shockingly some of us DON'T want men to regress and decay into nothing whilst women continue to improve.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 10:20 PM
2	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Well said. Thank you for the convo!	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 10:13 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think No clue.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 10:12 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Whether I personally believe it or not is irrelevant. It was a topic I found interesting on that day at that time—simple as that. If you actually had a counterargument to what I’m saying here, you wouldn’t need to dig up past posts to force a contradiction that doesn’t exist. Again bad faith.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 10:12 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think You keep pretending my argument is vague when it's been clear from the start. My post literally spells it out: "Men need women too much. Not for survival, not for companionship, but for validation." The issue isn't that men want relationships—it's that too many men need them to feel like they matter. If you actually engaged with the argument instead of nitpicking phrasing, you'd see that. You even admitted that "some men can be happy without relationships," which means it's possible. So when I s…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 10:04 PM
2	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Sorry you feel that way. Good luck.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 09:56 PM
2	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think That means a lot man thanks. I was losing faith a bit with all this disagreement.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 09:55 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Right, I’ll give that a read later. It’s probably best to wrap this debate up since we’re just going in circles. To maintain any faith in men and our future, I can’t put any value in what you’re saying, unfortunately. In the far future, when the pendulum has swung to the other side and a matriarchy is in full control, maybe then you’ll understand my stance—but by then, it’ll probably be too late. I just don’t want to see us regress and decay further while women continue to improve. There’s no re…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 09:54 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Well said.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 09:47 PM
1	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger Intent matters because it shapes the outcome. If someone isolates out of bitterness, they stay stuck in negativity. If someone detaches to build a fulfilling life on their own terms, they grow stronger. Both may lack romantic connections, but only one is actually thriving. Not all disconnection is the same—some of it is a conscious choice for personal well-being, and that distinction is what you’re ignoring.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 09:45 PM
1	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger I hate how easy to grift we are. Well said.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 09:43 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Quoting a different post with a different focus doesn’t prove my position changed—it just proves you’re desperate to force a contradiction. I post based on what I think will be interesting to debate and will get a lot of engagement. It's not personal. If you have to go post-hunting instead of engaging with what I’m actually saying here, you’re just looking for an easy way out instead of addressing the argument. This is bad faith.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 09:42 PM
0	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger You’re acting like I need to cite case studies to prove a basic concept—men who rely on external validation will struggle when that validation disappears. This isn’t a controversial point; it happens everywhere, from high-status men in the public eye to everyday guys who spiral after a bad breakup. If you need a specific example, look at Andrew Tate’s meltdown(s) over being ‘betrayed’ by a woman he trusted—his entire persona is built on frame and detachment, yet even he couldn’t emotionally hand…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 09:37 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think You keep pretending my argument is unclear so you don’t have to engage with it. "Men shouldn’t need relationships for self-worth" is only vague if you’re deliberately misreading it. You even admit that relationships aren’t a need, so all you’re left with is ‘but most men still value them.’ No one disagrees with that. The issue is when men can’t be stable or happy without one. If you think that’s not a real problem, then we actually do disagree. Otherwise, you’re just arguing for the sake of it. …	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 09:31 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think I don't really get this writing style man but it's not for me. Cheers for the debate even if it was one of the weirder ones here. Don't fancy talking in circles... Bye.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 09:28 PM
5	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Yeah sorry you have to hear all that. Kind of wish this sub had more women in it because you guys seem to get my point a lot more which is unsurprising I guess.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 09:26 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Ok so what now? By your logic, no claim about happiness is verifiable. If I can’t prove men who detach are truly happy, then you also can’t prove they’re secretly miserable or just coping. You’re dismissing one idea as speculation while making another equally speculative claim. The reality is, some men report being happier after detaching from romantic validation. Can I prove their happiness under a microscope? No. If your entire argument is ‘we can never really know,’ then you don’t actually ha…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 09:25 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think You’re still trying to frame this as me ‘backtracking’ instead of just admitting you misunderstood from the start. My position hasn’t changed—I’ve consistently said that needing a relationship for self-worth is a problem, not that men should avoid relationships entirely. If you think that’s a "harmless position no one disagrees with," then why are you even arguing? You’re just trying to shift the debate to save face instead of addressing the actual point. Also here's a challenge. Show me where m…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 09:10 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Sure. Never disagreed with that position. Dependency is never healthy though.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 09:06 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think You’re not addressing my actual argument—you’re just reframing it to make it easier to dismiss. My point has always been that dependency on relationships for self-worth is unhealthy, not that men should avoid relationships altogether. That was clear from the start. And ‘feeling whole’ is only vague if you’re intentionally pretending not to understand. There’s a difference between valuing a relationship and needing one to function. If you think men must have one to feel complete, you’re just prov…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 09:05 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think You’re not actually countering my argument—you’re just rewording it and acting like you’ve proven something. Yes, most men want relationships. That was never in question. The issue is dependency—the belief that you need one to function. And no, saying men shouldn’t be controlled by their instincts isn’t the same as saying men should never marry or have kids. Self-control doesn’t mean rejection—it means not letting your entire self-worth be dictated by whether or not you succeed at something. Tha…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 09:03 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Or it just means people are strawmanning instead of engaging in good faith. If multiple people misrepresent an argument the same way, it usually says more about their biases than the argument itself. A clear position doesn’t mean people won’t twist it—especially when it challenges their worldview	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 08:58 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think A relationship can add to your life, but it shouldn’t be the only thing that makes it feel worth living. Otherwise, you’re just using it as a coping mechanism for an underlying emptiness	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 08:57 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Now you’re just making things up. No one said men should ‘get addicted to drugs and video games’ or stop socialising. The point is that men should build fulfillment for themselves, not just as a way to ‘earn’ a relationship. If a man can only stay motivated by chasing women, that’s not strength—it’s dependency. Improving yourself is great, but if your entire drive comes from external validation, what happens when you don’t get it? That’s the weakness. A truly strong man is productive because he …	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 08:56 PM
2	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Uh huh 😂	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 08:52 PM
2	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think A bad actor agreeing with something doesn’t make the idea itself bad. If a 4B guy says exercise is good, does that mean fitness is now extremist? No. The difference is in intent—MGTOW and 4B reject relationships out of resentment, while I’m talking about rejecting dependency for stability. You keep dodging that distinction because it’s easier to strawman than engage.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 08:51 PM
2	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think You’re just repeating ‘sex is everything’ like it’s a universal truth when it’s just your personal experience. If men only cared about sex and not validation, they wouldn’t spiral emotionally after dry spells, they wouldn’t chase women who mistreat them, and they wouldn’t beg for relationships. You keep saying ‘men aren’t like that,’ but reality proves otherwise. Also, your obsession with calling me a woman because I challenge male dependency is hilarious. If the only way you can defend your arg…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 08:49 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think All I can say is good luck to us both.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 08:44 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Caring about success in dating isn’t the issue—needing success to feel like you matter is. There’s a difference between improving yourself to increase your chances and basing your entire sense of worth on whether women validate you. The first is self-improvement; the second is dependency. And no one’s saying men should never feel bad about being single. Feeling lonely is human. The problem is when that loneliness turns into desperation—when a man believes his happiness is only possible through a…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 08:43 PM
1	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger That depends on why they do it. If it’s coming from bitterness or resentment, then no, it’s not making them stronger—it’s just avoidance. But if someone genuinely finds more fulfillment outside of relationships and builds their life around something else, then cutting out a system that doesn’t serve them can be a form of strength. Strength isn’t about conforming to what society expects—it’s about making choices that align with your own values and well-being.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 08:41 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Sounds good to me 😂	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 08:38 PM
0	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think You’re arguing against a point I never made. I never said all relationships are about external validation—I said needing one to feel whole is a problem. Big difference. And no, your body doesn’t ‘crave’ relationships the same way it craves sleep. You won’t die or suffer biological damage without a relationship. If that were true, single men would be dropping like flies. Having a desire for connection is natural, but acting like it’s an unstoppable force is just an excuse to stay dependent on it.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 08:35 PM
2	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think I'm 21 but yeah we will hopefully start catching up. Looks like we're regressing if anything though... Also, could you help me out. I'm not advocating for men to be eternally single, and celibate and reject women and relationships. I’m saying they shouldn’t be dependent on them for self-worth. Am I miswording my point or are people just misunderstanding?	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 08:28 PM
0	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think It’s not about ‘replacing’ romance—it’s about not being dependent on it for self-worth. If a man can’t function without female validation, that’s a problem, regardless of what else he has in life. Hobbies, friendships, purpose—those things matter, but the core issue is mindset.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 08:26 PM
1	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger Yeah, the contradictions are annoying.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 08:24 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think You keep contradicting yourself while pretending your personal belief is an objective truth. If sex was the ultimate meaning of life, then sexually active men would never feel empty, and celibate people wouldn’t be fulfilled. Reality proves otherwise. If you want to believe otherwise, that’s on you. I’m not wasting more time on circular arguments. Have something intelligent to say or move on.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 08:22 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Ok. Like I said relationships should add to an already good life, not be the thing that makes life good. You people are either illiterate or just like to argue for the sake of it. Nowhere here am I saying relationships are useless or that men should swear off women.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 08:19 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Fair enough	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 08:17 PM
1	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger To an extent.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 08:16 PM
6	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think It’s funny how, instead of engaging with the argument, you’re trying to psychoanalyze me like that somehow discredits what I’m saying. Even if I were personally struggling with this issue, that wouldn’t make the argument any less valid. But if you actually read my posts, you’d see I’m not just talking about myself—I’m talking about a widespread mindset that affects a lot of men. If your takeaway is ‘Why do you care so much?’ instead of ‘Does this argument hold up?’ then you’re avoiding the conve…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 08:15 PM
2	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think You’re getting emotional instead of engaging with the argument. No one said men are ‘personally responsible for being brainwashed.’ What I said is that once you recognise the conditioning, you decide whether or not to let it control you. That’s not denial of external forces—that’s basic agency. And your whole argument hinges on the idea that ‘no men ever stop chasing validation, they just get their needs met.’ That’s just flat-out wrong. Plenty of men detach from the idea that their worth is tie…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 08:14 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Agreed.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 08:11 PM
1	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger I don’t need to name specific men to prove a general pattern. It isn’t necessary for a conceptual discussion like this. You can look at high-status men—celebrities, influencers, even Red Pill figures—who’ve had tons of success with women but still fall apart after a bad breakup or dry spell. If confidence were just about ‘stacking wins,’ these men wouldn’t spiral the moment the external validation stops. That alone proves my point. And no, a truly confident man isn’t a fantasy—it’s just not as c…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 08:11 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Men’s self worth is just their own perception. It’s just wanting a woman. It’s their decision to tie their self worth to it. They can get jobs, healthcare, and education without needing a woman. No one has to validate his experience for him to continue living life. There are no barriers to him being single. Just wanting to not be single. I have other people to debate and respond to, so I can’t keep entertaining your other talking points—especially when they stray from my main argument. But this …	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 08:07 PM
7	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think This is why I don’t like how reliant some guys are on the ‘It’S bIoLoGy’ argument—it comes dangerously close to implying that women owe men sex just because it’s supposedly essential for our survival and well-being.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 07:55 PM
1	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger Yes. Shocker that's also toxic but I like to avoid preaching to women about their own toxic behaviour. Their peers can do that or not do that. I don't care.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 07:52 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think But that’s not an argument—it’s just unfalsifiable speculation. Yes, some people struggle with introspection, but that applies across the board. Plenty of people in relationships also convince themselves they’re happy when they’re not. The difference is that at least some men demonstrably detach from the need for female validation, and their lives improve as a result. If it was impossible, we wouldn’t see it happen at all. The fact that it does happen proves that conditioning can be overcome. Yo…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 07:50 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Agree to disagree then. I have too many other comments to respond to, so I’m not going to go back and forth on this. Cheers.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 07:44 PM
0	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think It's sad as hell.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 07:42 PM
2	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Jesus. You’re arguing against a point I never made. I never said men should "walk away from dating entirely"—I literally clarified in my post that wanting a relationship is normal. My issue is with men who need one to feel whole. That’s not a meaningless distinction; it’s the entire foundation of the argument. You even acknowledged that if a man "cannot tolerate a second of being single and will rush into toxic relationships," you agree that’s a problem. That is the problem I’m addressing. So un…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 07:42 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Instincts don’t dictate how we live—they just influence our behavior. If we were purely ruled by instincts, we’d still be living in caves, fighting for resources, and mating without thought. But we don’t—because humans have self-awareness, discipline, and the ability to override instincts in favor of long-term fulfillment. Yes, men have a biological drive for relationships, sex, and reproduction—but so what? We also have a biological drive for sugar and fat, but that doesn’t mean we should let i…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 07:29 PM
0	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Thank you Turnitin.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 07:24 PM
3	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think If failing to reproduce makes you a “genetic failure,” then every man who doesn’t have kids is a failure by default. But funny enough, most men aren’t walking around feeling like their lives are meaningless just because they haven’t passed on their DNA. Why? Because human fulfillment isn’t solely defined by reproduction. You’re confusing evolutionary incentives with personal well-being. Yes, your DNA wants you to reproduce—but your DNA doesn’t care about your happiness, mental health, or the qua…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 07:24 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Appreciate it.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 07:18 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think You’re right that women also face social pressure, but the difference is in what they’re pressured to value. Women are conditioned to optimize their attractiveness. They’re told their worth is based on being desired, looking good, and securing a high-status partner. This is why beauty standards, makeup, and fashion industries exist. Men, on the other hand, are conditioned to optimize for approval. They’re told their worth is based on whether they’re wanted at all. A woman can still feel socially…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 07:17 PM
0	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think That’s a false equivalence. Friendship and socializing are not the same as romantic relationships and dating. Everyone needs some level of social interaction—that’s a basic human need. But romantic validation, sex, and relationships are not on the same level as basic human connection. If what you were saying was true, then every single person without a romantic partner would be in the same state of suffering as someone with zero friends, family, or social connections. But that’s obviously not th…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 07:15 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think You’re contradicting yourself again. You just said, “You can make anything have meaning or value”—which means sex and relationships aren’t inherently more meaningful than anything else. If meaning is subjective, then my argument stands: Men don’t need sex or relationships to live a fulfilling life. You’re also making a false comparison. Not having sex isn’t the same as starving yourself or disabling your body—because unlike food, sex isn’t a survival necessity. You won’t die without it. You won’…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 06:34 PM
6	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Your brain thinks you need women, but that doesn’t mean it’s right. If you were truly starving for food, your body would shut down. If you were starving for sex, you’d… be frustrated. That’s it. The fact that seeing an attractive woman makes you depressed proves my point—it’s not just about sex, it’s about what not having sex represents to you. If this was purely biological, you’d just feel arousal, not sadness. The suffering you’re describing isn’t from a lack of intimacy—it’s from the belief t…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 06:30 PM
2	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger I do see some contradictions in RP but for the most part I agree and well said.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 06:28 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think True. We can be our own worst enemy.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 06:23 PM
2	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think The fact that your first instinct is to claim I must be a woman just for challenging male dependency proves how fragile this entire mindset is. Instead of engaging with the argument, you default to “You must not really be a man if you don’t think exactly like me.” That’s not logic—that’s insecurity. You say men only want sex and not validation? Then explain why so many men stay in miserable relationships just to avoid being single. Explain why men chase women who clearly don’t respect them. Expl…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 06:21 PM
3	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think You’re acting like emotional independence is some slippery slope to extremism, but that’s just projection. Not needing romantic validation isn’t “step one” toward resentment—it’s step one toward actual stability. The fact that you lump MGTOW, 4B, and what I’m saying into the same category shows you don’t actually understand the distinction. MGTOW and 4B are based on resentment, blame, and reactionary detachment. What I’m saying is about rejecting dependency—not rejecting relationships. The two a…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 06:18 PM
1	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger Agreed the system is rigged. RP is not helping men though because it strengthens/supports said system.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 06:14 PM
2	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Water ≠ Women	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 06:13 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think You keep shifting between arguments—first, romance is a basic need, then it’s about reproduction, then it’s about loneliness, then it’s about validation. So which is it? Because those aren’t the same thing. Of course, humans crave connection. No one is arguing that isolation is good. But romantic dependence isn’t the same as basic social needs. That’s why plenty of men live happy, fulfilling lives without being in relationships. If romantic love was truly a biological requirement, single men wou…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 06:13 PM
2	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Water ≠ Women	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 06:04 PM
4	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think No one’s saying people shouldn’t want relationships. The issue is when people feel incomplete without one. Wanting companionship is normal. Feeling like your life is empty without it? That’s dependency. If relationships were a pure biological necessity, single people would be physically incapable of living happy, fulfilling lives. But we already know that’s not true—plenty of people, both men and women, find deep purpose outside of relationships. That proves this is more about conditioning than …	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 06:01 PM
2	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think You just proved my point. Men aren’t just struggling with singleness—they’re struggling because they’ve been conditioned to believe that being single makes them inferior. That’s why rejection, dry spells, or breakups hit so hard—because men are socially pressured to see their worth through the lens of female approval. If being single was just about personal preference, men wouldn’t feel “humiliated” over it. But they do, because society treats male desirability as something that has to be earned…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 05:58 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think I get what you’re saying—some activities require a partner, and relationships fall into that category for people who want sex or companionship. But the issue isn’t about whether having a partner is sometimes necessary—it’s about how much power that need has over you. You can enjoy tennis, but if you don’t have a partner to play with, your entire self-worth doesn’t collapse. You don’t feel like a failure or spiral into depression just because no one’s available for a match. But a lot of men do fe…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 05:55 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think I think this affects men... differently to say the least.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 05:47 PM
3	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Well said.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 05:46 PM
0	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger No one’s saying men shouldn’t learn from experience. The issue is that if your confidence is built entirely on “winning,” then you’re not actually confident—you’re just riding momentum. Real confidence isn’t something that only exists when things are going well. It’s what’s left when everything goes wrong. If confidence was purely about stacking wins, then why do so many men who have had success with women still spiral after a dry spell or a bad breakup? Because their confidence was never intern…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 05:44 PM
3	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think I get that you’re being sarcastic, but the comparison still doesn’t hold. Civil rights movements weren’t fought because people were lonely or horny—they were fought because people were being denied legal rights, bodily autonomy, and equal treatment. The fight for gay marriage, reproductive rights, and anti-sterilization laws wasn’t about ensuring people could have sex or relationships—it was about freedom, dignity, and protection under the law. Equating that to a man struggling to find a girlfri…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 05:41 PM
2	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger If TRP was just about “sexual strategy,” no one would take issue with it. But that’s not what it is. It’s not just teaching men how to navigate dating—it’s reinforcing the idea that a man’s value is defined by how well he performs in the sexual marketplace. That’s exactly what keeps men in the cycle of validation-seeking. Your football analogy doesn’t hold up. A player’s worth as a person isn’t based on goals scored—it’s just a measure of performance in a game. But Red Pill isn’t just measuring …	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 05:36 PM
-1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think I never said women don’t have their own struggles. No one is denying that society pressures women in different ways. But you’re dodging the actual argument—how male self-worth is uniquely tied to dating success in a way that female self-worth isn’t. Women are judged for how they look, sure. But men are judged for whether they can get a woman in the first place. Women might feel invisible in certain areas of life, but single men are invisible everywhere. They don’t just get dismissed—they get ign…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 05:33 PM
5	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Wanting a relationship is normal. Needing a relationship to feel whole is not. That’s the entire distinction I’ve been making, and you keep glossing over it. Yes, men naturally desire intimacy, just like they naturally desire food, security, and social connection. The issue is that men are conditioned to place their entire sense of self-worth on whether they succeed in dating. That’s why rejection feels like failure instead of just a missed opportunity. That’s why men chase toxic relationships r…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 05:28 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think You just admitted that people respond differently to rejection, so you’ve already disproven your own point. If this was purely about biology, all men would react the same way. But they don’t—some spiral, some don’t. That proves rejection isn’t just some unchangeable primal instinct—it’s also about conditioning, experience, and mindset. And yeah, modern society has evolved past cavemen instincts—that’s exactly why men can also evolve past the belief that their value is tied to reproduction. If we…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 05:21 PM
2	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think You’re repeating the same mistake—confusing a biological drive with a biological need. Yeah, men are wired to want sex, but that doesn’t mean they must have it to function. If sex was truly a fundamental need, every celibate man would be dead—and that’s obviously not the case. And saying men will “do whatever it takes” to get sex isn’t an argument—it’s just proof of how deeply ingrained this mindset is. If you believe sex is so important that you’re willing to endure rejection, disrespect, and m…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 05:18 PM
2	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think You’re throwing a lot of words at the wall, but your argument boils down to “sex and relationships are the ultimate human experience, so nothing else can compare.” But that’s just an opinion—not a universal truth. If sex was the only thing that made life fulfilling, celibate monks wouldn’t exist. Men who thrive without relationships wouldn’t exist. But they do—so clearly, sex isn’t the only source of meaning. You’re acting like men trying to build meaning outside of sex and relationships are jus…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 05:13 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think If this were true, every single man would eventually break down, and that’s just not reality. There are men who have been single for years—even decades—and they aren’t “worn down” or suffocated by it. That alone proves that this “psychic pain” isn’t an inevitability—it’s a belief. The only men who suffer endlessly without a relationship are the ones who were conditioned to believe they can’t be whole without one. That’s the entire issue. If you convince yourself that life is meaningless without …	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 05:11 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think You could transpose men and women, but the reality is that men suffer from this issue way more. If this were purely a "human issue," we wouldn’t see such a massive disparity in dating effort, rejection rates, and how men vs. women react to being single. The reason this is a gendered issue is because men are taught their worth is earned—through success, status, and whether they can attract women. Meanwhile, women are taught their worth is inherent—they receive attention just by existing. That’s w…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 05:08 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think You’re still acting like relationships are as fundamental as food, water, and air. They’re not. If they were, every single man without a partner would be permanently miserable—and that’s just not reality. There are millions of men who live fulfilling, productive lives without being dependent on a woman’s validation. That alone proves it’s possible. And let’s talk about your “1%” claim. That’s just something you made up. Plenty of men find meaning in mastery, legacy, discipline, creation, leaders…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 05:06 PM
8	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think You’re acting like external conditioning = zero personal responsibility. That’s not how it works. Yes, society conditions men to tie their worth to female validation, but conditioning can be unlearned. The fact that most men don’t escape it doesn’t mean it’s impossible—it just means most men never challenge it. And I never said “just get over it, bro.” I said men need to stop letting it control them. That’s not the same thing. Overcoming conditioning isn’t about ignoring it—it’s about recognizin…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 05:00 PM
2	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Sure, biology plays a role—no one’s denying that. But the question isn’t whether men have a drive to find a mate, it’s why that drive is so emotionally destructive for some men and not others. If it was purely biology, men would experience rejection and just move on to the next opportunity, like animals do in the wild. But that’s not what happens. Men internalize it as failure, humiliation, and personal inadequacy. That’s not instinct—that’s social programming. Biology gives men a sex drive, but…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 04:57 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think No one’s saying men should be lone wolves—just that their self-worth shouldn’t depend on whether women want them. There’s a huge difference between valuing connection and needing it to feel whole. The second you need it, you’re at the mercy of something you can’t control. And sure, connection matters—but why is it only romantic validation that so many men feel lost without? That’s the issue. If men valued all forms of connection the way they do romantic success, they wouldn’t struggle nearly as …	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 04:51 PM
10	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Interdependence isn’t the problem—dependence is. There’s a difference between two people choosing to rely on each other from a place of strength and one person feeling incomplete without the other. That’s the difference between a healthy relationship and a desperate one. And I agree—if someone fears that relationships will take away their independence, that can be a problem. But let’s be real—that’s not the issue most men are facing. The issue is that too many men think they need relationships t…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 04:49 PM
3	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think You’re making the same mistake again—confusing a biological drive with a biological need. Hunger and thirst are needs. You die without them. Romantic validation is not. That’s why plenty of men who struggle with women fall apart while others become stronger—it’s not about biology, it’s about mindset. Yeah, humans are wired to want relationships, but we’re also wired for self-control, resilience, and adaptation. If our instincts were absolute, we’d be cavemen who couldn’t resist any impulse. The …	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 04:46 PM
6	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think No one’s saying love isn’t meaningful. But the issue isn’t love—it’s dependency. If you think romantic love is the best part of life, that’s fine. The problem is when men believe they can’t be whole without it, which is exactly why so many struggle when they don’t get it. You say that being able to form strong relationships is a sign of being well-adjusted, and I agree. But the inverse isn’t automatically true—choosing to detach from dependency on romantic validation doesn’t mean someone is brok…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 04:41 PM
6	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think No one’s saying women can’t be fun or offer companionship. The issue is when men feel like they can’t be happy without it. Yeah, people want love—but there’s a difference between wanting love and needing it to feel whole. Too many guys think relationships are the only path to fulfillment, which is why they settle, tolerate bad behavior, and feel like failures when things don’t work out. Relationships should add to an already good life, not be the thing that makes life good. If a man is miserable…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 04:37 PM
1	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger So we’ve now arrived at the real conclusion—Red Pill was never about empowering men, just giving them a way to cope with a system they believe is rigged. You’re now outright admitting that Red Pill is just a short-term dating strategy, that there’s no such thing as ‘keeping’ women, and that men should either ‘enjoy the decline’ or reject dating entirely. But at that point, what’s the difference between Red Pill and Black Pill? If the end result is still ‘men don’t have power, modern relationship…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 04:36 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think I guess.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 04:24 PM
2	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think You’re mixing up romantic dependence with basic human connection. No one is saying men should live in isolation—having friendships, a strong community, and a social life is important. What I’m saying is that men shouldn’t tie their self-worth to romantic success or female validation. Yeah, validation matters—to a degree. But not all validation is equal. The problem is when men make romantic validation the center of their self-esteem and feel like failures without it. That’s exactly why so many g…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 04:07 PM
1	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger I’m aware that TRP existed long before Kevin Samuels, but his messaging is a good example of how even the ‘self-improvement’ side of Red Pill thinking was still built around optimizing for women’s approval, not genuine independence. Whether it was MRAs trying to ‘change the game,’ MGTOW opting out, or PUAs mastering it, the underlying assumption across all three was that men’s struggles were centred around women’s role in society—not the deeper issue of how men define themselves. And no, I’m not…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 04:03 PM
5	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think You hit on something important—you can’t control whether others are attracted to you, but you can control what you build for yourself. The issue is that a lot of men are told that a relationship and a family are the ultimate purpose of life, and when that doesn’t happen, they feel like they have nothing. But here’s the truth: Meaning isn’t found—it’s created. If you feel lost right now, it’s because the purpose you built your life around was something external—something that requires someone els…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 03:59 PM
5	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Thank you!	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 03:55 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Yeah, I can tell from these comments that's what's happening. Unfortunate. Glad to see you've experienced it though!	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 03:55 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think If this was purely biological, all men would react the same way—but they don’t. Some men spiral when they get rejected, others brush it off and move on. That difference proves it’s not just biology—it’s conditioning. Yes, rejection taps into an instinct, but instincts can be overridden, controlled, and redirected. If men were truly just cavemen running on autopilot, we’d still be clubbing women and dragging them to our caves. But we’re not (for the most part). You say the feeling comes from an i…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 03:53 PM
8	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think You’re literally proving my point while thinking you’re arguing against it. You admit that society conditions men to base their worth on female validation and that even male status is influenced by women’s approval. That’s exactly the problem—men are taught that who they are means nothing unless women want them. You’re acting like escaping this mindset is just luck. It’s not. It’s a conscious rejection of programming that keeps men weak. The fact that most guys are trapped in it doesn’t mean it’…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 03:50 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think It's a big world.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 03:46 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Sounds good to me!	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 03:46 PM
1	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger No one’s saying confidence can’t grow from experience. But the problem is when a man’s confidence only exists when he’s winning. Confidence built only on success with women isn’t confidence—it’s dependence on validation. Learning social skills, charisma, and game isn’t bad—but if your sense of self crumbles when women aren’t responding the way you want, then it was never real confidence to begin with. That’s exactly why so many Red Pillers fall apart after one bad relationship or a dry spell. Th…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 03:45 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think No one’s saying sex isn’t great. But if you’re justifying male desperation and validation-seeking with “but sex feels amazing,” then you’re proving my point. Sex is an experience, not a life purpose. It can be enjoyable, but the second a man puts up with endless rejection, disrespect, and emotional turmoil just for the chance to have it, he’s not chasing pleasure—he’s chasing validation. If you’re genuinely just enjoying life, good for you. But the moment you start putting sex on a pedestal and …	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 03:42 PM
5	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think You’re proving my point without realizing it. You say you have a good life—career, friends, health—but still feel like you need a relationship to feel whole. That’s exactly the issue I’m talking about. Some men can be happy alone, some men can’t—but why can’t they? Why do some men fall apart without a relationship while others thrive? It’s not because of some biological law—it’s because some men have been conditioned to believe their life is incomplete without one. And let’s address the “unmarri…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 03:40 PM
2	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think You’re acting like the only options are chasing women or becoming a depressed hermit. That’s a false choice. Plenty of men find meaning in their work, passions, friendships, and personal growth. The fact that you can’t imagine fulfillment without a woman doesn’t mean it’s impossible. The irony is that your mindset is exactly why so many men suffer—because they believe life is empty without female validation. That’s the problem. Sure, relationships and family can be fulfilling—but so can building…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 03:34 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Social conditioning exists—this isn’t even up for debate. Both men and women are affected by it, and that’s just basic psychology. If you’re actually looking for studies, here’s one: Romantic Competence and Self-Worth (Journal of Personality and Social Psychology) – Found that men’s self-esteem is more dependent on their dating success than women’s. In other words, men tie more of their self-worth to whether they’re romantically desired, while women don’t experience that same pressure. There’s a…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 03:31 PM
15	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Sure, some men want relationships for the sake of the relationship itself, and there’s nothing wrong with that. But let’s be real—how many men feel miserable, unfulfilled, or even worthless when they’re single? Wanting a family is fine. The problem is when men can’t be happy without one. Too many guys chase relationships not because they genuinely want a partner, but because they feel like they’re failing at life if they don’t have one. If a man wants a relationship because he enjoys companionsh…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 03:09 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Women definitely seek validation, but the key difference is what happens when they don’t get it. A woman who isn’t desired might feel insecure, but a man who isn’t chosen often feels invisible, unwanted, and like less of a man. That’s a much deeper level of dependency. And you’re right, women also stay in bad relationships, but the reasons are different. Women might stay because of emotional attachment or financial dependence. Men often stay because they believe they have no other options. That’…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 03:08 PM
1	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger If Red Pill is purely about ‘becoming attractive,’ then let’s call it what it really is—a dating strategy, not a philosophy of self-improvement. But the problem is, it sells itself as more than that. It markets itself as ‘truth’ and ‘awakening’ while still keeping men’s sense of worth tied to external validation. You say that Red Pill is a means to an end, but what end? A successful dating life? That’s fine as a short-term goal, but what happens when you get the partner you wanted? If everything…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 03:03 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Then why even bring up rejection making men feel useless? If it’s just a minor disappointment and doesn’t impact your self-worth, it shouldn’t be a big deal. But for most guys, it is. That’s the whole point—it’s not just about wanting sex, it’s about what not getting it represents to them. If you’re truly indifferent to it, you’ve already beaten the trap. But for a lot of men, that frustration runs deeper than just being “disappointed.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 02:57 PM
6	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Not eating kills you. Not having a woman doesn’t. Big difference. No one’s saying men should lock themselves inside and do nothing with their lives. The point is to stop seeing women as the thing that makes life worth living. If you genuinely enjoy pair bonding and family, great. But plenty of men find meaning in other things, and acting like nothing else compares is just projecting your own values onto everyone else. The problem isn’t men caring—the problem is men caring too much. The second yo…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 02:55 PM
8	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think The issue isn’t relationships or families—it’s thinking you need women to feel whole. There’s a difference between wanting a family and feeling like life is incomplete unless you have one. Plenty of men live fulfilling, productive lives without ever getting married or having kids.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 02:49 PM
0	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Thank you.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 02:45 PM
3	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think If men weren’t conditioned to depend on female validation, why do so many feel like failures without it? Why do they tolerate disrespect, chase women who don’t want them, and structure their entire sense of self-worth around whether they’re chosen? That’s not just natural instinct—it’s a belief system that’s been drilled into them. Men are told from birth that their worth is earned—through success, status, and, most importantly, whether women desire them. Meanwhile, women are told their worth is…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 02:43 PM
7	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think No one’s saying men don’t want women. The issue is when that want turns into need, and when men feel like they’re failing just because they aren’t getting laid. Even normies can get women, sure. But plenty of those same guys settle for garbage relationships, tolerate disrespect, and let women walk all over them just because they’re afraid of being alone. That’s exactly what I’m talking about—they need it too much, so they take whatever they can get. Wanting women is natural. But the second that …	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 02:40 PM
7	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Yeah, we’re wired to care—but that doesn’t mean we have to let it run our lives. You can train yourself to stop craving junk food, you can train yourself to handle pain, and you can train yourself to stop tying your worth to women. That’s the difference between a man who’s in control of his biology and a man who’s controlled by it. You’re also mixing up species survival with personal fulfilment. Humanity needs reproduction to continue—that doesn’t mean every individual man needs to structure his…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 02:39 PM
8	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think No one’s saying relationships can’t be good. But the issue is when men think they need them to feel whole. A healthy relationship should be an addition to an already good life, not the foundation of it. You say it’s “just my opinion” that men can be happy alone, but reality already proves otherwise. There are men out there who are content without relationships—so clearly, it’s possible. The fact that you can’t imagine being happy alone doesn’t mean no man can. It just means you’ve tied your happ…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 02:32 PM
2	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Yeah, the drive is biological, but the emotional reaction isn’t just about reproduction—it’s about how men are conditioned to attach their worth to sexual access. That’s why rejection stings more than it logically should. If this was purely about nature, guys wouldn’t be out here depressed over body counts or thinking sex defines them as men. That’s social programming, not biology. And if rejection was just about failing to reproduce, men wouldn’t feel like failures in life when it happens—they’…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 02:30 PM
8	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think You’re right—relying on others for validation is a psychological weakness, and it makes people suffer when they don’t get it. The issue is that men are socially conditioned to depend on female validation in a way that women aren’t with men. You say you’ve never depended on men for validation, and that makes sense. Women don’t need to—their value in the dating market is reinforced constantly. But men? If they don’t get attention from women, they’re made to feel invisible. That’s why so many guys …	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 02:27 PM
9	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think No one’s saying validation isn’t real. The issue is where men get it from and how much power they give it. If your entire sense of worth comes from female approval, you’re setting yourself up to be controlled by something external. There’s a difference between needing validation in general and being dependent on women’s validation to feel like a man. That’s the problem, and that’s why so many guys struggle when they don’t get it.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 02:25 PM
3	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Biology isn’t an excuse to be a slave to your impulses. Yeah, men have a biological drive to pursue women—but we also have the ability to control, direct, and prioritize that drive. Revealed preferences show that most people eat junk food too—does that mean we should all give in and let our diet be dictated by cravings? No, because not everything we’re wired to do is good for us. The point isn’t to “fight” biology—it’s to stop letting it control you. If you can’t function without female attentio…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 02:23 PM
1	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Sure	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 02:20 PM
4	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think If it were just about sex, men wouldn’t be this emotionally frustrated over it. It’s not just the difficulty—it’s the feeling of rejection, exclusion, and lack of access that gets to guys. That’s why men get angry when they see “less deserving” guys getting women, or why they chase hookups even when it’s not fulfilling. It’s not just about attraction—it’s about what getting sex represents to them. That’s the whole point. Men tie too much of their worth to whether they can sleep with women, and t…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 02:20 PM
5	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Well said and good to hear!	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 02:17 PM
13	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think You say it’s not about needing anything from them, but let’s be honest—if that were true, you wouldn’t feel like life is “worth it” because they exist. You don’t have to physically have them to still be centering your existence around them. That’s the same trap—just repackaged. There’s nothing wrong with desire, but when your worldview is "women exist, so life has meaning," you’re still tying your purpose to something external. You’re still relying on them to justify you. The point isn’t to supp…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 02:16 PM
10	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think No one’s saying rejection doesn’t suck, but let’s be real—how you feel about it is exactly the problem. If you were truly content alone, rejection wouldn’t hit this hard. But because you believe you need women to feel successful, every rejection feels like proof that you’re failing. That’s the whole point of the post—men think they need women more than women think they need men, and that belief is what keeps them stuck. You’re not struggling because you got rejected 70 times—you’re struggling be…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 02:14 PM
1	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger There’s nothing wrong with wanting a sexual partner. The issue is that Red Pill frames it as a competition where men must constantly ‘optimise’ themselves to succeed, rather than just living a fulfilling life where dating is a natural byproduct—not the main goal. You say you can separate self-worth from your goals, but that’s not how Red Pill teaches it. The ideology revolves around ‘status,’ ‘frame,’ and ‘value’—all of which are measured in terms of how women respond to men. If Red Pill were tr…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 02:11 PM
7	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think I don’t think this applies equally to both men and women. The difference isn’t just in who’s chasing—it’s in who thinks they need the other more. Men build their entire sense of worth around whether they’re “chosen” by women. They think they need relationships to be complete. Women don’t operate the same way. Sure, they enjoy relationships, but they don’t feel like life is incomplete without a man—at least, not to the same extent men feel without a woman. The modern dating landscape proves this.…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 02:06 PM
1	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger Yes, that is the big issue here.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 01:59 PM
13	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think If you genuinely believe women are the best thing in existence, that’s your choice. But making them your number one motivating factor? That’s exactly why so many men struggle. The moment your happiness, drive, or self-worth depends on women, you’re setting yourself up to be controlled by something you don’t even have. You don’t need validation to feel that way, but let’s be real—your entire purpose is still tied to getting something from them. That’s not strength, that’s a blind spot.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 01:58 PM
3	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think Sounds good. The point isn’t to treat women like a problem (though they often can be)—it’s to stop seeing them as a necessity. Too many guys act like their lives are on hold until they get one. The moment you realise that’s not true, the game stops feeling like a struggle.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 01:56 PM
21	Men Put Too Much Value on Women—You Don’t Need Them Like You Think That sounds rough, man, and I’m not going to pretend to know exactly how that feels. But I respect the fact that you’ve pushed through it and kept going. A lot of guys fear the idea of being alone, but you’ve already faced it head-on. Society makes us think that if we’re not getting female attention, we’re somehow failing. But you’ve lived without it and kept moving forward. That means you’ve already done the hardest part—surviving what most men are terrified of. But here’s the thing: being sing…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 01:53 PM
1	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger If Red Pill men were truly ‘defining their worth on their own terms,’ they wouldn’t be obsessing over women’s hypergamy, optimizing themselves for the dating market, or constantly talking about how to ‘win’ in relationships. The entire framework is built around men being desirable to women—it’s not self-improvement for the sake of personal fulfillment, it’s self-improvement with a transactional goal. And sure, humans are social creatures—but there’s a difference between wanting relationships and…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 01:47 PM
1	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger Being strong means being internally secure—defining your worth on your own terms instead of measuring it by external validation. A strong man doesn’t feel the need to prove himself to women, to ‘win’ in dating, or to constantly optimize himself for female approval. He improves because he wants to—not because he’s trying to outcompete other men in a rigged system. Red Pill sells men the idea that strength means ‘winning’ in the dating market. But real strength is when you no longer need the datin…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 01:22 PM
1	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger Fair enough	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 01:21 PM
1	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger You don’t need Red Pill to have self-respect. Avoiding people who use you and setting boundaries is just common sense, not some special insight from TRP. The problem with Red Pill is that it doesn’t just teach self-respect—it frames women as adversaries and convinces men that dating is a constant power struggle. Instead of simply saying ‘don’t let yourself be used,’ it pushes men to see all women as hypergamous opportunists, making them just as emotionally reactive as the guys they claim to be a…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 01:19 PM
0	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger he alternative is real self-improvement—one that isn’t dependent on women’s validation. Getting fit, healthy, and financially stable are all great things. The problem with Red Pill isn’t the self-improvement aspects—it’s that they are still entirely centered around gaining success with women. That means men are still playing by the same rules, just from a stronger position. They aren’t truly free from the system—they’ve just optimized themselves to function better within it. How does that make m…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 01:17 PM
1	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger Very true.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 01:15 PM
2	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger Well said.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 01:14 PM
0	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger I think you’re spot on about hierarchy and shifting economic dynamics. The modern world has changed what men bring to relationships—women don’t rely on men for survival the way they once did, so attraction is based far more on status, personality, and other intangibles rather than just provision. But this is exactly why Red Pill thinking is flawed—it doesn’t address these structural changes at all. Instead, it just tells men to ‘level up’ in a system where the old rules don’t even apply anymore.…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 01:14 PM
0	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger The problem isn’t that evopsych is ‘uncomfortable’—the problem is that it’s often speculative, unfalsifiable, and cherry-picked to justify pre-existing beliefs about gender dynamics. Red Pillers don’t use evopsych as a scientific tool—they use it as a rigid framework to ‘explain’ why men and women must behave in specific ways. But real science doesn’t work that way. Human behavior is shaped by far more than just instinct—culture, socialization, personal experience, and conscious choice all play …	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 01:12 PM
1	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger Agreed	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 01:10 PM
1	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger If you’re saying the kind of guys who are drawn to Red Pill were already struggling beforehand, I’d agree. But that’s exactly why it’s a problem—Red Pill doesn’t actually help them, it just reinforces their worst instincts and keeps them dependent on external validation. Are you saying Red Pill isn’t the issue, just the men who follow it? If so, wouldn’t that mean Red Pill isn’t really ‘fixing’ anything at all? "Disagree"	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 01:10 PM
1	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger You’re missing the point. I never said Red Pill and Black Pill are identical—I said both are rooted in biological determinism. Red Pill just packages it as 'self-improvement' rather than outright fatalism. Red Pill still tells men that their worth is fundamentally dictated by external factors—looks, money, status, game. The entire philosophy is still based on competing within a fixed system where female hypergamy is an unquestioned reality. The difference is that Red Pill tells men they can win …	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 01:09 PM
1	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger Yes, historical reproductive patterns show that fewer men reproduced compared to women—but that was in a world where survival was brutal, polygamy was common, and social structures were vastly different from today. If you think modern relationships are governed by the same selection pressures as pre-industrial societies, you are the one coping. Biology may influence behaviour, but it doesn’t dictate it. If we were all still living purely by evolutionary pressures, we wouldn’t have monogamous rel…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 01:06 PM
0	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger I don’t doubt that some men feel Red Pill helped them—but improving your life while still being dependent on external validation isn’t real strength. If TRP was truly about strength, it wouldn’t keep men locked into a system where their self-worth is measured by their desirability to women.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 01:03 PM
1	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger Taking initiative and self-actualization are great—but Red Pill isn’t about self-actualization, it’s about winning validation from women and calling it growth. Real self-improvement is about developing confidence and fulfillment independent of external validation. You’re right that confidence often builds through experience, but if that confidence is only tied to success with women, then it’s fragile by nature. That’s exactly why so many Red Pillers fall apart after a breakup or after struggling…	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 01:02 PM
1	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger Rejecting a system doesn’t mean you’re actually free from it. Red Pillers claim to reject modern dating and gender roles, yet they’re still obsessed with ‘winning’ in that same system. They still chase women, still measure success by status, and still believe their worth is tied to competition. That’s not real rejection—it’s just frustration. MGTOW, on the other hand, actually detaches from the system by removing women and relationships from the equation entirely (at least they did for a time). …	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 01:00 PM
0	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger Interesting.	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 12:57 PM
1	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger Sure	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 12:56 PM
0	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger Exactly my issue	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 12:55 PM
2	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger Agreed!	/r/PurplePillDebate	18/01/25 12:54 PM
3	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger There’s a massive difference between choosing to be alone on your own terms and feeling alone because you can’t succeed in the system. One is independence, the other is frustration. A Red Pill guy who resents women but still chases them isn’t free—he’s just trapped in another form of dependency. And sure, the manosphere is a minority, but that doesn’t mean its influence is insignificant. Most men might not openly call themselves Red Pill, but the talking points—hypergamy, women don’t love uncond…	/r/PurplePillDebate	17/01/25 06:22 PM
5	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger Agreed	/r/PurplePillDebate	17/01/25 06:21 PM
4	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger The issue isn’t recognizing patterns—it’s assuming those patterns are rigid and unchangeable. Yeah, we’re animals, and sexuality has instinctual roots, but humans aren’t just instinct-driven machines. We create systems, rewrite rules, and redefine social values all the time. If that weren’t the case, we’d still be living in caves, and women would still be trading berries for protection. Red Pillers don’t just ‘understand patterns’—they accept them as fixed laws. They believe men are biologically…	/r/PurplePillDebate	17/01/25 06:19 PM
–	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger Not really. Black Pill is just Red Pill without the cope. Both are rooted in the same biological determinism—the only difference is that Black Pillers believe the ‘game’ is unwinnable, while Red Pillers believe men can ‘win’ if they play their role correctly. But either way, both ideologies operate on the belief that men are at the mercy of their biology and women’s hypergamy. Red Pill just puts a self-improvement spin on it, but it’s still a script, still a hamster wheel, still a worldview that…	/r/PurplePillDebate	17/01/25 06:16 PM
18	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger Exactly. The moment you buy into any ‘pill’ ideology, you’re surrendering your ability to think independently. Red Pill, Black Pill, even Blue Pill—they all rely on pre-packaged worldviews instead of actually adapting to reality on your own terms. That’s why I argue Red Pill doesn’t make men stronger. It just gives them a different script to follow instead of helping them break free from needing a script in the first place	/r/PurplePillDebate	17/01/25 06:14 PM
6	The Red Pill is Making Men Weaker, Not Stronger I get what you’re saying—early Red Pill had elements of self-improvement, but even in its original form, it was still built on biological determinism. It was never just about men improving for the sake of personal growth; it was about improving within a framework where women’s preferences still dictated a man’s worth. Even Kevin Samuels, for all his straight-shooting advice, still operated on the idea that a man’s value was directly tied to his ability to compete in the dating market. That’s my …	/r/PurplePillDebate	17/01/25 06:13 PM
1	The Provider Man Model No Longer Works in Modern Western Relationships. It's a scam. Can't wait. The less we're around each other the better.	/r/PurplePillDebate	17/01/25 04:36 PM
6	CMV: Males avoiding women at work are sexist Simple as that	/r/PurplePillDebate	17/01/25 03:31 PM
2	The Provider Man Model No Longer Works in Modern Western Relationships. It's a scam. Ah, the classic deflection—when the argument isn’t going your way, resort to personal attacks. It’s telling that instead of addressing my actual points, you’re more focused on making assumptions about my personal life. That alone shows how weak your position is. And let’s be clear: I initiated this conversation about the provider model—you’re the one who shifted it into a discussion about how men supposedly "need" women. Now that I’ve challenged that belief, you’re resorting to insults instead o…	/r/PurplePillDebate	17/01/25 07:06 AM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear You keep repeating that you "don’t know of any cultures" where men are respected without a partner, but that just shows the limits of your perspective, not the limits of reality. History is filled with respected men who weren’t defined by their romantic success—philosophers, monks, warriors, and leaders who dedicated themselves to something greater. Even today, there are men who command respect through their achievements, status, and contributions, not just their ability to secure a partner. But…	/r/PurplePillDebate	17/01/25 07:04 AM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Since you keep asking, here’s the specific answer: The goal isn’t to have some government intervention in dating but to shift the cultural narrative that pressures men into tying their self-worth to romantic success. That starts with three things: Destigmatizing male singlehood – Right now, men who aren’t “winning” in dating are shamed, ridiculed, or told to just “try harder.” We need to move away from the idea that a man’s value is determined by his relationship status. Promoting alternatives t…	/r/PurplePillDebate	17/01/25 06:59 AM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear You’re basically saying, "this is just how it is, so accept it," which is the exact mindset I’m challenging. The fact that men historically sought validation through women doesn’t mean they have to continue doing so. Societal norms aren’t set in stone—cultures shift when enough people question them. You argue that men will never walk away because they crave validation, yet the very industries you listed—OnlyFans, dating apps, sugar dating—are proof that dating dynamics are changing, just not in …	/r/PurplePillDebate	17/01/25 06:56 AM
2	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Thanks for the conversation!	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 11:13 PM
1	The Provider Man Model No Longer Works in Modern Western Relationships. It's a scam. If women truly don’t need men, then let them opt out without shaming them for it. But the fact that this conversation is even happening suggests that the shifting dating landscape is making some uncomfortable. Men are waking up to the fact that the provider model no longer benefits them. If relationships are as one-sided as you claim, why should men stay invested? You say women don’t need men—great. Then let men walk away without trying to convince them otherwise.	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 11:12 PM
2	If every average man dropped out of the dating market it would not affect women one bit. Their dating problems are entirely based on the behaviour of top tier men Because attention and validation don’t necessarily equate to desirability in a real relationship sense. Just because a woman receives constant admiration from average men doesn’t mean she’s objectively above average—it just means those men are willing to give her attention regardless. The delusion comes from mistaking the abundance of options for the quality of options. If a woman gets non-stop DMs, likes, and compliments from men she wouldn’t actually date, but takes that as proof that she’s "a…	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 11:04 PM
2	Issues on which common agreement has been reached? The concept is perfect but the online execution leaves a lot to be desired. I essentially advocate for it in my recent post here but of course there's still pushback.	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 10:58 PM
2	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear I get what you’re saying, and I appreciate the clarification. I understand that feminism promotes individual freedom and bodily autonomy, and that some of its efforts incidentally benefit men. But this is exactly where the disconnect happens—when people say “feminism helps men too,” a lot of men hear that as feminism is actively working on men’s issues, which isn’t really the case. What you’re describing is more of a trickle-down effect rather than direct advocacy, and that distinction matters. …	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 10:55 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear You’re conflating two different things—being single and being sexless. Just because men across cultures desire relationships or sex doesn’t mean they all obsess over it to the same degree or tie their entire self-worth to it. There are plenty of men who lead fulfilling lives without being in a relationship, even if they still seek connection in other ways. Different societies place different values on masculinity. In some cultures, a man’s worth is tied to his role as a leader, his contributions…	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 10:48 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear You’re stuck in a circular argument. On one hand, you claim that most men are doing fine and will eventually find relationships. On the other, you acknowledge that dating apps and social media have created a system where a small percentage of men monopolize casual sex, leaving the rest scrambling. Which is it? If most men are thriving, why do so many discussions about male dissatisfaction in dating exist? Why are men increasingly checking out if nothing is wrong? You can’t simultaneously argue t…	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 10:43 PM
0	The Provider Man Model No Longer Works in Modern Western Relationships. It's a scam. You just reinforced my entire argument. If relationships are a net negative for women, as you claim, and men are expected to sacrifice just to "access the feminine," why should men keep participating in this dynamic? You’re essentially confirming that modern relationships are an unfair deal for both sides—so why keep pretending the provider model is worth maintaining? You also contradict yourself. First, you say men aren’t entitled to women (which I agree with), but then you frame relationships …	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 10:34 PM
1	If every average man dropped out of the dating market it would not affect women one bit. Their dating problems are entirely based on the behaviour of top tier men Your entire argument is built on the idea that men should just accept that dating has always been unfair, that it will always be unfair, and that the solution is to just keep competing no matter how much it drains them. That’s the exact mindset I’m pushing back against. You’re right that human mating was never "fair." But you’re wrong to assume that means men should just blindly accept their place in a system that actively works against them. In the past, men were at least given a clear role and…	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 10:27 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear To be honest you’re clearly overcomplicating this on purpose, likely because you recognise that my core argument challenges the status quo. You’re treating this like I’m drafting a government policy proposal when, in reality, it’s a social shift—a change in mindset that doesn’t require bureaucracy, funding proposals, or formalised institutions. Plenty of major societal shifts have happened without all the things you’re demanding I outline right now. Let’s break this down. You’re misrepresenting …	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 10:16 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Pain isn’t the same as inevitability. Yes, resisting biological urges can be uncomfortable—just like breaking any deeply ingrained habit or instinct. But discomfort doesn’t mean it’s impossible or not worth doing. If anything, the pain of chasing validation and failing is often far worse than the pain of detaching from it. Men who build their self-worth solely around romantic success suffer the most when things don’t go their way. That’s why the goal isn’t eliminating desire—it’s putting it in i…	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 10:04 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear You’re still missing the point. NASA didn’t just exist out of thin air—it was created with government backing, funding, and structured support. The space race wasn’t won by just telling individual astronauts to "figure it out"; it was a collective effort with resources allocated to ensure success. That’s what systemic support looks like. Now, apply that logic to modern dating and men’s struggles. Yes, there are dating apps, books, and self-help content, but none of that changes the broader cultu…	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 06:02 PM
2	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear I get what you’re saying, and I appreciate the openness. I agree that men should take the lead in addressing these things but where I'm a bit lost is the fact that feminism has been framed as the movement for equality which makes it frustrating when male issues don’t get taken as seriously under that same umbrella. If we’re supposed to "get started" and build our own advocacy movements, that’s fine—but it reinforces my original point that feminism isn’t a movement for BOTH women and men, it’s a …	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 05:58 PM
0	The Provider Man Model No Longer Works in Modern Western Relationships. It's a scam. You just made my point for me. If relationships are such a net negative for women, as you claim, and men are expected to make endless sacrifices just to "access the feminine," why should men be so desperate to participate in this dynamic? If relationships are inherently burdensome for both parties, maybe the solution isn't to keep playing along but to rethink the entire setup. Also, you’re contradicting yourself. First, you say men aren’t entitled to women, which I agree with, but then you frame…	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 05:45 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear You keep acting like everything is a personal choice while ignoring the larger forces shaping those choices. Sure, men can opt out of gaming, porn, and social media, but pretending those things aren’t symptoms of deeper societal issues is just shortsighted. Men aren’t checking out of the dating market because they’re lazy—they’re checking out because the effort-to-reward ratio is worse than ever. And your whole argument about "status" is just repackaged old thinking. Yes, men have always compete…	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 05:37 PM
1	If every average man dropped out of the dating market it would not affect women one bit. Their dating problems are entirely based on the behaviour of top tier men Winning? By what metric? If men were overwhelmingly "winning," we wouldn’t see rising male loneliness, declining relationship satisfaction among men, and increasing frustration with modern dating. You’re assuming that because some men do well, the system must be fine for all men, which is just not true. And yes, fulfilment outside of relationships is absolutely possible—there are countless men who find deep meaning in friendships, careers, passions, and personal growth. The issue is that men hav…	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 05:30 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear You completely missed the point. The difference is that when society wanted to put men on the moon, it didn’t just tell astronauts to “figure it out” and leave them to fend for themselves. It built institutions, provided funding, and created infrastructure to support that goal. What I’m saying is that if men are struggling with modern dating and self-worth, we should be looking at why—just like we do with any other societal issue—rather than gaslighting them into thinking the problem is all in t…	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 05:27 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear I get what you’re saying, but this is exactly why it’s frustrating when people claim feminism benefits men. If the expectation is that men have to organise separately for their own rights, then feminism isn't doing that work for us—it’s focused on women's issues, which is fine, but let’s stop pretending it’s some all-encompassing movement for gender equality. And look, I’ll acknowledge that some men do bring up male issues in ways that are dismissive or derail conversations about women’s struggl…	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 03:35 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Sounds good. Evolution is cool.	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 03:25 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Sounds good to me! You're doing more than me so I can't complain. Thank you!	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 03:24 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear You’re still dodging the core argument. You keep trying to shift this into a debate about who deserves what in dating instead of engaging with my original point: men need to detach their self-worth from dating entirely. I’m not here arguing that men deserve a certain type of woman, nor am I claiming dating should be easier. What I am saying is that the dating market has changed in ways that make it more difficult for many men, and rather than endlessly competing in a game that offers diminishing…	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 03:22 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear You’re missing the point. Telling men to just stop gaming, porn, and social media doesn’t address the root issue—it just shifts the blame entirely onto individuals while ignoring the broader system that shapes behaviour. Yes, cutting out distractions might help some men regain focus, but it doesn’t change the fact that modern dating dynamics are skewed in ways that leave many men burned out, frustrated, and exhausted from chasing. You frame it as a simple competition between men, but that compet…	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 03:09 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear That’s a nice motivational speech, but let’s be real—chaos doesn’t mean the absence of a system. It just means the system isn’t fair or predictable. The fact that anything is possible doesn’t mean everything is equally accessible. We put men on the moon and split the atom because people acknowledged challenges, adapted, and built structures to make the impossible happen. They didn’t just tell themselves "nothing is real, just figure it out, bro." Pretending systemic influences don’t exist doesn’…	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 03:06 PM
1	The Provider Man Model No Longer Works in Modern Western Relationships. It's a scam. Framing relationships as some kind of biological sacrifice that men are doomed to make is a self-defeating mindset. We’re not insects. We have the ability to critically think, challenge outdated narratives, and decide what actually brings us fulfillment instead of blindly accepting a system that doesn't serve us. If you’re fine with playing into that dynamic, that’s your choice. But acting like men must either submit to it or accept isolation is just reinforcing a false binary. The point of this…	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 03:02 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear No one is denying that men seek out sexual partners across cultures—that’s a biological drive. But what isn’t universal is the degree to which men tie their self-worth to their sexual success. That varies wildly depending on societal values, expectations, and the narratives men are raised with. For example, in some cultures, a man's value is measured more by his community status, wisdom, or contributions rather than just his ability to attract partners. In others—like modern Western societies—se…	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 03:00 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear That humans are not built to live alone? If you want to think that then by all means.	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 02:58 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear If you say so.	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 02:57 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Apologies if I come off as combative, but I often see feminists talk about male issues in a way that mischaracterises their own movement, making it seem like it equally advocates for men when, in reality, it’s always been focused on women’s rights. And that’s fine—there’s nothing wrong with a movement prioritising women. What bothers me is when feminism is framed as something men should rally behind because it supposedly benefits us just as much, when that’s clearly not the case. You say men nee…	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 02:56 PM
1	If every average man dropped out of the dating market it would not affect women one bit. Their dating problems are entirely based on the behaviour of top tier men Tue but the show must go on.	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 02:48 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear I'm good. Cheers	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 02:46 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear There’s a difference between supporting men from the sidelines and actively inserting yourselves into a conversation that men need to have among themselves. This is about men reclaiming their self-worth on their own terms, without external influence—even from those who claim to agree and are engaging in good faith. The issue isn’t whether what you’re saying is right or wrong, it’s that men need to come to these realisations themselves, without being guided or nudged in any direction by women. En…	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 02:46 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear So are we done now? Cool.	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 02:40 PM
1	If every average man dropped out of the dating market it would not affect women one bit. Their dating problems are entirely based on the behaviour of top tier men That’s just evolutionary determinism taken to an extreme. Yes, reproduction is a biological drive, but reducing men’s entire existence to “get women or fail” is a gross oversimplification. Humans evolved past acting solely on primal instincts—that’s why we build civilizations, create art, and define meaning beyond reproduction. And your argument about men never settling contradicts itself. If men are so driven by this need to “dominate and reproduce,” then why are so many not succeeding? Because…	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 02:39 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear How do I circle your entire username?	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 02:32 PM
1	If every average man dropped out of the dating market it would not affect women one bit. Their dating problems are entirely based on the behaviour of top tier men It helps the men who drop out because they’re no longer stuck in a system that drains them emotionally, mentally, and financially while offering little in return. The goal isn’t to “help” men who opt out by somehow rewarding them in the dating market—that’s missing the point entirely. It’s about giving them an actual alternative to chasing validation through relationships and allowing them to build fulfilling lives outside of dating. Meanwhile, for the men who do remain, the shift forces a neces…	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 02:31 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear No I mean't the fact that no one their age was talking to them. We're seeing a shift with Gen Z men that reflects what I am talking about.	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 02:28 PM
1	If every average man dropped out of the dating market it would not affect women one bit. Their dating problems are entirely based on the behaviour of top tier men You’re treating evolutionary instincts as if they’re absolute laws rather than tendencies that can be influenced by society and personal choice. Yes, men have a biological drive to seek mates, but that doesn’t mean desperation is an inherent or unchangeable trait—it’s reinforced by societal conditioning that tells men they are incomplete without a woman. If men were truly inherently wired to be desperate for women no matter what, we wouldn’t see cultures like Japan where men are increasingly opt…	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 02:26 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear You keep framing this as though men are simply making bad choices and need to “stay in their lane,” but that ignores the structural shifts in modern dating that have made things more difficult across the board. The issue isn’t just that average men are shooting too high—it’s that the entire dating market is skewed in a way that makes the idea of “leagues” itself unstable. Social media, dating apps, and changing social dynamics have created a situation where average women often receive disproport…	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 02:22 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear It's definitely, because you're a woman. Respectfully it's not your place.	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 02:12 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Easy way out. Meme! 🥴	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 02:11 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Interesting	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 02:05 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear If it were purely innate, it wouldn’t vary so drastically across cultures and time periods. Envy itself is a natural emotion, but what triggers it and how intensely it manifests are largely shaped by societal values. If men weren’t constantly bombarded with messages that their worth is tied to sexual success, this kind of envy wouldn’t be as pronounced. The issue isn’t the feeling itself—it’s the system that amplifies it and keeps men chasing an illusion of validation.	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 02:05 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Sounds nice in theory, but in reality, plenty of people live fulfilling, independent lives without being in relationships. Life isn’t a one-size-fits-all experience—some people thrive in partnerships, others don’t. The real issue is that society pushes the idea that being single is inherently a failure rather than just another way to live.	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 02:01 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Well said. I guess we can stop pretending that feminism benefits men too, then. If it were truly a mutually beneficial movement, we wouldn’t need to take the steps you just outlined.	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 02:00 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear And that’s exactly my point—you get to decide what’s important to you. You’ve chosen relationships as your highest priority, and that’s completely valid. But not every man should feel obligated to make that their defining goal in life. The issue isn’t about telling men what they should value, but about giving them the freedom to question whether chasing relationships is actually what they want, or if it’s just what they’ve been conditioned to believe they should want. If a man finds fulfilment i…	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 01:57 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear The costs of being single are only high because society has conditioned men to believe they are. Most of those ‘costs’—loneliness, lack of validation, social stigma—are artificially inflated by cultural narratives that tell men they need a relationship to be whole. The reality is, plenty of men are single and thriving, but you rarely hear their stories because they don’t fit the mainstream script. If we stopped treating singlehood as a problem to be solved and started treating it as a valid life…	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 01:55 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Too bad	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 01:53 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Nowhere did I say women are an obstacle. The issue is men tying their entire sense of self-worth to whether or not they have a relationship. You can have both, but too many men chase relationships at the expense of their own fulfillment, burning themselves out in the process. This isn’t about being 'scared of rejection'—it’s about rejecting the idea that a man’s value is defined by whether or not a woman chooses him. That’s a major difference.	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 01:52 PM
2	If every average man dropped out of the dating market it would not affect women one bit. Their dating problems are entirely based on the behaviour of top tier men And it's equally as fun watching you guys chase over the same dude!	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 01:50 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Not sure about that last point.	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 01:50 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear That’s fair—you’ve achieved everything else, but you still feel like something is missing. That’s understandable. The issue isn’t wanting a relationship, it’s basing all fulfillment on that one missing piece. The truth is, no amount of personal achievement guarantees a relationship because relationships aren’t earned like career success or fitness goals. They involve timing, compatibility, and factors outside of your control. That’s why it’s dangerous to view them as the final checkbox for happi…	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 01:38 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear If refusing to tie your entire sense of worth to dating and women is "hoisting the white flag," then maybe the real issue is how men are conditioned to view relationships as the ultimate prize. Choosing to focus on self-fulfilment, personal growth, and friendships isn’t surrender—it’s reclaiming control. If the only way to ‘win’ in your eyes is to keep chasing something that leaves many men frustrated and burnt out, then maybe it’s time to question the game itself.	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 01:31 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear I guess.	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 01:29 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear That’s exactly the problem—if a man has been conditioned to believe that ever being single is a failure, then of course he’ll see it that way. But that belief isn’t inherent; it’s shaped by societal expectations, peer pressure, and cultural narratives. The point isn’t about ‘resetting’ a man’s personal goals but giving him the space to question whether those goals are truly his own or just a reflection of external conditioning. If he genuinely wants a relationship, great. But if he only feels li…	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 01:28 PM
2	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear So by your logic, Beethoven—one of the greatest composers in history—was a failure because he didn’t have kids? Tesla, who revolutionized modern electricity, also failed? That’s an absurdly narrow way to define success and human contribution. Personal growth isn’t exclusive to parenthood. Sure, raising children can be fulfilling, but so can building something, mentoring others, or dedicating yourself to a craft or cause. The idea that people without kids remain "solipsistic" is just a convenient…	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 01:25 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear You’re not entirely wrong that change starts at the individual level, but dismissing the idea of broader societal shifts as pointless is shortsighted. Every major social change—whether it was civil rights, women’s rights, or labour rights—started with individuals recognising a systemic problem and then pushing back against it collectively. If every man only focused on himself and ignored the bigger picture, nothing would ever improve beyond his own personal situation. That’s fine if you’re only …	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 01:23 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear A ‘tiny bit’ of success only makes a difference if you’re conditioned to believe that any success in dating—no matter how minimal—is the key to self-worth. That’s exactly the problem I’m highlighting. If a man is miserable and unfulfilled but gets laid once a year, does that suddenly fix everything? Of course not. Men need to stop defining their happiness by whether they scrape together the bare minimum in dating success. A mindset shift away from that desperation would do far more for men’s men…	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 01:20 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Yep, I’ve heard of Passport Bros, and for the most part, I support it.	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 01:17 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Sure, and plenty of those same men end up in miserable, transactional relationships because of it. If a relationship is built primarily on financial convenience rather than genuine connection, it’s a shaky foundation at best. The point isn’t whether some men are okay with it—it’s that men shouldn’t feel like they have to be in relationships just to survive financially. That’s not a healthy dynamic for anyone involved.	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 01:15 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Denying the existence of systemic issues doesn’t make them disappear. If dating dynamics were as simple as "just do what it takes," we wouldn’t see so many men frustrated and burnt out. You’re pretending there’s no system while actively reinforcing the very narratives that keep men trapped in it. And no, it’s not about a "participation trophy"—it’s about men realising they don’t have to play a game that offers them nothing in return. If you’re fine playing, go ahead. But don’t pretend the board …	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 01:13 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear If you say so.	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 01:10 PM
1	If every average man dropped out of the dating market it would not affect women one bit. Their dating problems are entirely based on the behaviour of top tier men I never said it was a "master plan by feminists." The point is that men are conditioned to tie their self-worth to whether or not they can attract women, and that conditioning leads to desperation. It’s not just a lack of attention from women—it’s the belief that being single is a failure, which is reinforced by societal expectations. Women may not deliberately lower their standards to keep men on the hook, but they don’t have to. Men, out of fear of being alone, willingly settle for less than w…	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 01:10 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear a) How to get men to utilize these programs? The biggest barrier to men engaging with mental health resources is the stigma around them. That’s why this wouldn’t be framed as a ‘therapy’ program but as a self-improvement and personal development movement. Men are already drawn to things like fitness communities, career mentorship, and skill-based groups (trades, martial arts, coding, entrepreneurship, etc.). Integrating these concepts into spaces they already participate in would make engagement…	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 01:07 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear A healthier dating market benefits everyone—including men who already date successfully. When desperation and scarcity are removed from the equation, relationships become more organic and less transactional. Men who already have a good relationship with dating aren’t affected negatively by this—if anything, they benefit from a market where relationships are built on genuine compatibility rather than social pressure or lopsided dynamics. As for 'societal narratives,' they’re everywhere. From chil…	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 01:01 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Like most red-pillers, you'd rather maintain the status quo instead of advocating for real change. With guys like you sticking around, we’ll get nowhere and continue regressing.	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 12:57 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Good to see.	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 12:54 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Well, that's good at least.	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 12:53 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Again we can choose whether or not we slave away to our biology. We're not some primitive species anymore.	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 12:52 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Interesting	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 12:51 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear No, but I believe the fear of that possible outcome must be resolved. Women thanks to feminism are slowly freeing themselves of it so now we men need to do the same.	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 12:46 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Good read and well said. Thank you for your constructive comments!	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 12:45 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear I don’t know. I feel like you need to be passionate about something to be your best self and work hard at it. Most men have found that to be wife and kids My dream is for this to no longer be the case. We've regressed so much, and it’s only going to get worse	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 12:43 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Well said. I wish I could offer an equally well-written response. All I can say regarding your last point is that I believe a woman's pride often outweighs her desire to avoid being single, so I'm sceptical about whether that approach would be effective. Modern women are quite stubborn.	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 11:47 AM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear I guess	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 11:42 AM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear I've thought this as well.	/r/PurplePillDebate	16/01/25 11:41 AM
3	If every average man dropped out of the dating market it would not affect women one bit. Their dating problems are entirely based on the behaviour of top tier men They don't get to have it both ways so they can keep wondering.	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 01:06 PM
5	If every average man dropped out of the dating market it would not affect women one bit. Their dating problems are entirely based on the behaviour of top tier men Now if only men carried the same mindset and weren't deadly afraid of being single. We'd be much more at peace.	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 01:04 PM
1	If every average man dropped out of the dating market it would not affect women one bit. Their dating problems are entirely based on the behaviour of top tier men Why not? It would be fun to see the whole dating market burn.	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 01:02 PM
–	If every average man dropped out of the dating market it would not affect women one bit. Their dating problems are entirely based on the behaviour of top tier men That willingness to negotiate downward is born from a fear of being single. It's not genuine it's manufactured to keep us desperate for women.	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 01:00 PM
1	If every average man dropped out of the dating market it would not affect women one bit. Their dating problems are entirely based on the behaviour of top tier men Less available men means fewer options for women taking away their inherent dating advantages and forcing them to be less picky. Equal playing field.	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 12:59 PM
11	If every average man dropped out of the dating market it would not affect women one bit. Their dating problems are entirely based on the behaviour of top tier men Facts	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 12:57 PM
2	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear I was in Vegas for NYE and it was funny seeing pretty girls settle for creepy old guys since no one their age was even approaching them lol Isn't that interesting...	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 12:56 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear You get it.	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 12:54 PM
2	The Provider Man Model No Longer Works in Modern Western Relationships. It's a scam. Exactly.	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 12:54 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear I think you’re oversimplifying the dynamics at play here. Your argument rests heavily on the idea that average men just need to "stay in their lane," but the reality is more nuanced. The problem isn’t that men don’t understand where they fit in the dating market—it’s that the market itself has changed drastically. Dating apps, social media, and modern dynamics amplify the attention certain women receive, creating the illusion of more options and inflating perceptions of their own value. This ske…	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 12:53 PM
2	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear I get that some guys could benefit from being more social, but dismissing the male loneliness crisis as just men being lazy ignores the bigger picture. Not everyone has the same confidence or opportunities, and modern dating dynamics make things harder for a lot of men. The point isn’t to complain—it’s to rethink how we approach fulfillment and self-worth.	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 12:46 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Practically, it starts with creating spaces—online or offline—where men can have these conversations without judgment. Discussions like this can plant the seeds for reflection. Beyond that, it’s about sharing stories of men who’ve successfully redefined their fulfilment outside of dating, supporting content that promotes personal growth, and encouraging mentorship or community activities. Workshops, meetups, or online communities focused on skills, hobbies, and personal development can also give…	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 12:44 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear I’m not denying biology or the reality of fundamental drives like the desire for connection, intimacy, or even reproduction. Those drives are part of being human. But comparing the desire for relationships to the need for food is an overreach—it’s not a matter of life or death, and humans are capable of regulating and reframing how they approach those instincts. What I’m suggesting isn’t 'just find something else to focus on, bro.' It’s about recognizing that societal narratives have amplified t…	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 12:39 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Your response is the exact attitude that prevents meaningful conversations about systemic issues. It’s easy to sit back and say "the problem is you" while ignoring the reality that the system is stacked against many men. Refusing to play a game that’s clearly broken isn’t cowardly—it’s smart. Pretending the game is fair when it isn’t? Now that’s delusional. Sometimes, refusing to engage with a broken system is the wisest and most self-respecting choice a man can make.	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 12:29 PM
2	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Your original comment felt bad faith, likely driven by an emotional reaction to my post rather than a genuine effort to engage with it. It’s clear you didn’t read it properly, as your claim that I want to "force women to adapt" is completely unfounded. How you arrived at that conclusion says more about your biases than about my argument, but I’ve seen comments like this often from women, so I’m not entirely surprised.	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 12:26 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Good to hear it.	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 12:21 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear That’s true, and I respect that but the difference is that women have movements like feminism advocating for their autonomy and choices, while men lack a similar support system.	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 12:21 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear That envy exists because men are conditioned to tie their self-worth to sexual and romantic success. The solution isn’t feeding into it—it’s breaking that conditioning and focusing on fulfillment outside of dating	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 12:17 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Well, that’s why I think it’s crucial to replace that external validation with something healthier, like personal growth, meaningful friendships, or contributing to a community. I don't believe rejecting societal expectations has to be about turning away from everything—it can be about redefining purpose and fulfilment on your own terms. Self-actualization isn’t easy, but walking that tightrope, as you put it, can lead to a much more fulfilling and balanced life if done with intention	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 12:15 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear I do think some of them read posts like mine and see it as a threat to their dating advantages. Fewer desperate and overly available men in the dating market would level the playing field, taking away the "upper hand" they currently enjoy. That’s not something many would want to give up	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 12:10 PM
2	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear I don’t think advocating for men to step back and restructure our views of ourselves, women, and dating is taking away anyone’s rights. Having fewer desperate and overly available men in the dating market is ultimately a net positive. Both sides having equal options is a good thing. Why anyone would be against a level playing field between men and women in the dating game is beyond me...	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 12:06 PM
2	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Nice. I'll check it out. Thanks.	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 12:03 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear You're right. Ultimately, this kind of change has to come from within, but that doesn’t mean we can’t spark conversations and plant the seeds for men to start reevaluating how they define their self-worth and fulfilment. The shift won’t happen overnight, but with men like me encouraging others to think differently, I believe it’s possible to spark meaningful change even if it's generations from now.	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 12:01 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Right...	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 11:55 AM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear But why would this matter if the goal is to find fulfillment outside of dating? So what if the dating market shifts? Overcoming the fear of being single gives a man significant advantages, but achieving that requires finding fulfilment outside of women, dating, and relationships. Once a man reaches that point, he’s no longer desperate or overly available, which naturally leads to a healthier and more balanced approach to dating—if he even chooses to continue it. The byproduct of this shift is a …	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 11:54 AM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear While I get your point about biology driving our desire for love and connection, that doesn’t mean we can’t reframe how we approach those desires. The men you mentioned who are happy while single—whether they have options or just fulfilling lives—are proof that self-worth and happiness don’t have to hinge on dating success. I completely agree though that the societal expectation for men to settle down to be considered successful needs to die. Men should have the freedom to define their own lives…	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 11:43 AM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear I get your frustration, but society has always evolved, and so must we. Men don’t have to abandon their biological drives, but tying their entire worth to finding a partner isn’t sustainable anymore. Instead of lamenting the past, we need to adapt and find new ways to thrive in the world as it is today.	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 11:38 AM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear I’ll never understand men like you and your insistence on believing everything is fine and flawless. Your data is useless and fails to tell the whole story but by all means, keep your head in the sand and continue to gaslight like nothing is wrong.	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 11:33 AM
2	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Not faimilar with stoicism but I think the societal narratives I’m discussing go beyond individual philosophy. They’re woven into cultural norms that push men into narrow definitions of success and worth, which can make it harder for individuals to step back and redefine fulfilment for themselves. I do understand your point about societal pressures on women, but I think it’s disingenuous to suggest that these challenges are equal between men and women, especially in the context of dating and soc…	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 11:21 AM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Right.	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 11:08 AM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Sorry, you feel that way.	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 11:07 AM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Boom. Very well said.	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 11:06 AM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear I think you’re misunderstanding what I mean by societal conditioning. It’s not about explicit lessons in school or introductions like 'Hi, I’ve had X relationships.' It’s more subtle and pervasive, embedded in the media we consume, the stories we celebrate, and the expectations placed on men from an early age. While men are certainly lauded for personal success, there’s still an underlying narrative that ties a man’s worth to how well he fulfils traditional roles—like being a provider or achievi…	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 11:05 AM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear At the very least, fewer men in the dating market would slow it down or, as you mentioned, make dating less common. Like I said, men are the ones keeping the machine of the current dating system running—it starts and ends with our involvement.	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 10:57 AM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear I see your point, but I think you’re conflating biological instincts with purpose. Those two terms should never be in the same sentence. We can exist and operate beyond our biological drives. We’re not hammers with a singular purpose; humans are complex beings capable of defining and pursuing fulfilment in countless ways beyond procreation. If someone chooses to build their purpose around family and marriage, that’s valid. But it’s equally valid for others to find purpose in art, science, servic…	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 10:53 AM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear The point is to encourage individual men to reassess their priorities, detach their self-worth from dating, and focus on building fulfilling lives outside of romantic relationships. There needs to be a mindset shift that, over time, could lead to healthier dating dynamics for everyone involved.	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 10:47 AM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear If most men would disagree with me, it’s likely because they’ve been conditioned to accept these societal pressures as normal or 'just how things are.' That doesn’t mean they’re right—it means these narratives are so deeply ingrained that questioning them feels unnatural or uncomfortable. That’s exactly the problem. Dismissing this as 'rationalising failure' completely misses the point. Acknowledging that systemic pressures exist doesn’t absolve men of personal responsibility—it highlights the n…	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 10:45 AM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear I think the key is to broaden how we define intimacy and companionship. Men need to invest more in friendships, with other men, as well as in communities or groups that foster genuine connection—whether that’s through shared hobbies, volunteering, or creative pursuits. We also need to create a culture where men feel safe being vulnerable and emotionally open outside of romantic relationships. If society stops equating intimacy solely with romance, men can start to meet those needs in healthier a…	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 10:20 AM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Well said, man. I truly believe guys like you are a step ahead.	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 10:15 AM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Very interesting. I'll look into that for sure.	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 10:14 AM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear I think the key is learning to reframe what we consider 'success' or 'achievement'—not suppressing those instincts you mention but channelling them into goals that are fulfilling on a deeper level. You’re right that hobbies or other pursuits can sometimes feel fleeting or like distractions if they’re not tied to something bigger. That’s why I think the shift I’m talking about isn’t just about finding new distractions but about redefining how men see fulfilment entirely. It’s not easy, and it’s d…	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 10:12 AM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Biology isn’t the whole story. How we respond to those drives, the extent to which we let them define us, and the way we channel that energy are all shaped by societal narratives. The problem I’m addressing isn’t the existence of these drives but how societal conditioning amplifies them in unhealthy ways, tying a man’s worth entirely to his success in pursuing sex or relationships. Men can still acknowledge their biological programming while learning to detach their self-worth from those pursuit…	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 10:07 AM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear No, but given the lack of conversation around solutions to this disparity, I’d say it’s news to a lot of people. It’s a difficult topic because the solutions are far from straightforward and often feel like pipe dreams.	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 10:02 AM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear To answer your question about why I think some women might take issue with this shift, it’s because the current dating market dynamics often work in women’s favour. Many women are accustomed to being pursued and having options readily available, and a reduction in men actively participating could feel like a loss of power or validation for some. Even if the long-term outcome benefits everyone, change often meets resistance, especially when it disrupts established norms. We see this with us men a…	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 09:57 AM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear It’s not quitting; it’s refusing to play a rigged game. And whether anyone notices or not is irrelevant—what matters is prioritising our own happiness and fulfilment. Everything is temporary so change is coming regardless.	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 09:52 AM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear I hope my insignificant Reddit post doesn't fall under the umbrella of making "a big deal about it".	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 09:48 AM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear But biology isn’t destiny. While those desires may be inherent, how we respond to them is shaped by societal narratives and personal choices. Men don’t need medical procedures to rethink how they approach fulfilment or redefine their self-worth. The goal isn’t to suppress biological drives but to detach them from the unhealthy pressures and expectations society places on men. We can no longer afford to be slaves to our biology anymore. It's causing more harm than good.	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 09:44 AM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Right. We need to wake up.	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 09:41 AM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Oh. That makes my comments seem a bit dumb now...	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 09:40 AM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Yeah, that sucks. Please don't fall to peer pressure though. Virginity can be powerful, especially for men where we're expected to be mindless sex machines with no standards. Take some pride in it.	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 09:39 AM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Haaa	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 09:32 AM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Sounds positive!	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 09:32 AM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear The point is that men shouldn’t view single life as a failure or something to fear. Fulfilment isn’t about whether you’re single or in a relationship—it’s about finding meaning in your life beyond female validation. For some people, single life can be a deeply fulfilling time for personal growth, pursuing passions, and building strong friendships. For others, it might be a stepping stone to a healthier relationship in the future. It all comes down to perspective and what you choose to focus on.	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 09:28 AM
2	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear You seem to be the trad type of woman so I can see why you'd advocate for that. I'm just not sure your peers are capable of such a lifestyle. Most modern men and women are no longer capable of being traditional but out of curiosity what are you suggesting when you say look at the past?	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 09:26 AM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear I think you might have misunderstood the point of my post. I’m not arguing that the dating system doesn’t work solely because of mismatched expectations about attractiveness. My focus is on how societal conditioning pushes men to tie their self-worth and fulfilment to romantic success, which creates frustration and burnout—regardless of whether someone is 'average' or not. That said, I do think the current dating market has created a dynamic where the 'average woman' often doesn’t view herself a…	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 09:24 AM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Well said!	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 09:11 AM
2	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Well yeah, desperation and a lack of self-worth often make men less desirable, which is why stepping back, focusing on personal growth, and finding fulfillment outside of relationships is so important. The men who remain in the dating market would presumably be those who are in a healthier mindset and genuinely ready to date. With fewer men available in the dating market, women wouldn’t have an endless "shortlist" of options anymore. In this hypothetical scenario, the numbers would balance out, …	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 09:10 AM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear If you actually read the post, you’d see it’s not about trying to stop anyone from dating or "getting play". It’s about encouraging men to find fulfilment in life that isn’t tied to relationships or societal pressure and in turn create a healthier dating market. Maybe try engaging with the argument instead of dismissing it outright	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 09:02 AM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Thank you!	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 08:59 AM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear I’d actually say that reinforces my point: unless we address the underlying societal and economic pressures, more people will opt out of traditional paths. The goal is to make that choice empowering, not a symptom of a broken system like it is in Japan. If we can do that the change resulting from that will be more healthy and less destructive.	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 08:58 AM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Interesting.. Thanks for your comment.	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 08:54 AM
2	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Good to hear it!	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 08:45 AM
2	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear I want a debate in good faith. Using that term will attract a bunch of angry women preventing that.	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 08:45 AM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear I guess? Just preferably without the misogyny and over-focus on women. I avoid using that term because of its controversy and it would just discredit everything I'm trying to say, unfortunately.	/r/PurplePillDebate	15/01/25 08:43 AM
2	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Yep and said 'challenge' is the current dating market. Agreed. We should challenge it by not feeding it.	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 08:26 PM
3	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear If men aren't slaves to our desires then the world doesn't know what to do with us hence communities like MGTOW being shut down.	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 08:25 PM
3	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Yeah MGTOW turned into something way to toxic but the concept is pretty good.	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 08:23 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Facts. MANS best friend.	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 08:22 PM
3	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Tying yourself to someone purely for financial convenience isn’t exactly a healthy solution either. The fact that everything is priced for dual-income households just highlights how broken the system is, not why men should cling to outdated ideas about relationships or self-worth. Instead of seeing single life as financially impossible, maybe we should focus on challenging the system that’s made it this way. Men shouldn’t feel forced into relationships just to make rent or survive economically. …	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 08:21 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear It's a scam. Well said.	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 08:17 PM
4	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear See how the pendulum has swung to the other side? We really need to wake up.	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 06:26 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Nice one!	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 06:24 PM
2	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Good to hear it!	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 06:24 PM
2	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear I’m not saying this shift is easy or even universally applicable. For men who’ve been single their whole lives and deeply desire a relationship, embracing single life might feel counterintuitive or even impossible. But the point isn’t to force men into permanent singledom—it’s to encourage them to redefine their self-worth and fulfillment so that it’s not entirely dependent on romantic success and that single life is longer something they inherently fear. MGTOW and similar movements might touch …	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 06:23 PM
6	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear I think you’re underestimating the extent to which societal narratives go beyond just advertising campaigns. While it’s true that marketing often plays a role, the connection between a man’s self-worth and his ability to attract a mate is deeply embedded in our culture and reinforced in countless ways—from media and entertainment to family expectations and peer dynamics. It’s not just incidental; it’s woven into the fabric of how society views men and their roles. I DO agree that individuals hav…	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 06:19 PM
8	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Ok so I’ll try to address things more concretely. I admit my comment boils down to the cheesy idea that 'real meaning is found within,' but I don’t think that’s a meaningless concept or a word salad. It’s about encouraging men to redefine their values and goals in ways that aren’t tied to societal expectations or external validation. That may sound abstract, but it has practical applications. Take hobbies, for example—not as distractions, but as opportunities to cultivate passion, skill, and mas…	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 06:07 PM
2	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear I am not denying those natural desires humans experience or suggesting that everyone should want to be single. I'm just trying reframe single life as a valid and fulfilling option for those who feel trapped by modern dating dynamics. If someone genuinely wants a relationship, that’s great, but the key is to approach it from a place of self-worth and independence, not desperation or frustration. The imbalance we both recognise is frustrating, but it’s largely fuelled by societal pressures and the…	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 05:58 PM
3	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear I think we’re coming at this from fundamentally different perspectives. While reality may have objective aspects, much of how we interact with it—our values, goals, and the narratives we live by—is shaped by society and culture. The idea that being single is a "teleological failure" is not some immutable law of the universe; it’s a perspective rooted in societal and, in many cases, religious teachings. In other words, it’s a narrative that has been widely accepted but is not inherently 'objectiv…	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 05:52 PM
2	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear I'm very concerned about the prospect of these women having sons to be honest. These women will most likely be with spineless yes men so their sons will end up being the same if not worse.	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 05:46 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear You get it!	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 05:45 PM
3	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear I encourage you not assume the worst with my post because I think you’ve misunderstood the point of it or just not read it properly for some reason. "This post focuses on the male perspective because, frankly, I don’t think it’s realistic—or fair—to expect women to make changes that would benefit men." I want to believe you're arguing in good faith but responses this ignorant make me doubtful. To be fair I predicted I'd get comments like this from women like you. This isn’t about "forcing women …	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 05:43 PM
5	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Come on man thats impossible. If they admit any of that it will weaken there victim complex which they often weaponise and use as a shield to defend against any criticism or wrong doing.	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 05:35 PM
6	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Of course especially in the context of dating in the west.	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 05:18 PM
2	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear That's a good way of thinking I guess	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 05:12 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Agreed!	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 05:11 PM
3	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Yeah there's definitely an innate toxicity to some male friendships but I for one don't believe being a virgin needs to be public knowledge nor is it anyones business so I'd question how and why your friends know. It's not required knowledge for a friendship. You seem a bit more open about it than others though judging by the fact it's in your user flair. Why is it something you feel a need to publicise?	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 05:08 PM
4	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Not familiar with the guy.	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 05:04 PM
3	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear You’re misunderstanding my point. When I say the modern dating scene doesn’t work for the 'average man,' I’m not talking about whether or not men are having sex. I actually don't think I once mentioned the word sex in my post. Sure, 87% of men might be having sex, but that statistic doesn’t tell the whole story. For the 100th time this isn’t about sexual activity alone—it’s about fulfillment, happiness, and the societal pressures that men face in the dating world. If the average man is constantl…	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 05:03 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Interesting take. I can tell you're done with it all and you're not alone in your frustration man.	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 04:56 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear The fact that men "freely give" these advantages often comes down to the pressure society places on them to chase validation and tie their worth to romantic success. Men are taught from an early age that their role is to pursue, provide, and prove their value through relationships, which reinforces these patterns. It’s not about women but about the system as a whole shaping these behaviours and expectations. I want to challenge us men to step back, reevaluate, and stop feeding into those dynamic…	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 04:56 PM
2	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear I agree with a lot of what you’re saying—men and women often have different emotional needs, and the gap between those needs can feel insurmountable in today’s culture. I also think you’re absolutely right that society misleads men into thinking they need six figures, abs, or some other impossible standard just to be deserving of love or intimacy. That’s part of the problem I’m addressing in my post: society conditions men to tie their self-worth to their ability to meet these arbitrary benchmar…	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 04:51 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear The problem arises when men chase relationships as their sole source of fulfillment while neglecting everything else. That kind of dependency leads to frustration, burnout, and resentment—especially in today’s dating culture. The point isn’t to replace relationships with hobbies or personal growth, but to shift the focus so that men can find happiness and purpose within themselves first. If someone finds contentment being single, great—that’s a valid choice. If they want a relationship, that’s v…	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 04:46 PM
10	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Yeah this is toxic as hell and it’s exactly this kind of attitude that creates the desperation and frustration in men that leads to unhealthy behaviour in the first place. Stigmatising single men doesn’t encourage improvement—it reinforces shame and isolation, which only makes things worse. Men don’t need more stigma and shame; they need opportunities to find fulfillment and redefine their self-worth outside of relationships. That’s what my post is about: creating a healthier mindset and a more …	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 04:43 PM
6	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear My post isn’t saying that all men should permanently avoid relationships. Permanent singledom isn’t the ultimate goal for everyone—it’s about reframing it as a valid and fulfilling option for those who choose it. The real issue is the pressure society places on men to derive their value and identity solely from being in a relationship. That’s what I’m challenging. But you are correct that what I’m advocating for is men finding themselves, their purpose, and their fulfilment independently of rela…	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 04:05 PM
5	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear I really don't agree that this issue is purely internal—it’s heavily reinforced by societal narratives. Men are constantly bombarded with messages that tie their value to their ability to attract a woman, provide, or succeed in traditional roles. This isn’t something that exists in a vacuum; it’s a product of cultural conditioning. Sure, some men may lack emotional maturity, but it’s hard to mature emotionally when society is pushing the idea that you’re 'less than' if you’re single or not fulfi…	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 04:01 PM
2	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Same post or word it differently? Considered it but didn't want to make it seem like i was karma farming.	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 03:57 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Sounded great. Past tense though? I assume the right person came along to mess that all up (half joking)	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 03:55 PM
9	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear I don’t think the goal should be to replace one external motivator with another—it’s should be to help men stop relying on external validation altogether. The problem isn’t that men lack a new 'carrot'; it’s that we’ve been conditioned to chase something outside ourselves, whether it’s romantic success, societal approval, or even religious salvation. What I’m suggesting is that men shift their focus inward and find fulfilment in personal growth, hobbies, community, and meaningful connections—not…	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 03:55 PM
4	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear My point isn’t that people should stop wanting relationships or spouses but that men need to detach their sense of worth and fulfilment from the necessity of being in one. The issue arises when society conditions men to believe that their value hinges on being partnered or successful in dating. This pressure creates a sense of desperation, frustration, and burnout for men who struggle in the current dating culture. By reframing single life as a valid, fulfilling option, we’re not denying the des…	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 03:46 PM
2	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Reality is shaped by societal narratives, and it can be whatever we choose to make it. If society truly wanted to reframe male single life as a positive and empowering choice, it could—and it would work. It’s already happening with women, and it seems to be successful. Many women now embrace single life as a fulfilling option, so there’s no reason why men can’t achieve the same. The difference lies in how society conditions us to view singlehood, and that perspective can absolutely be changed.	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 03:40 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear See you've done it. Hope to see more men like you in the future.	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 03:37 PM
3	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear I’m not saying self-improvement and dating are mutually exclusive. My point is that men need to redefine their sense of self-worth and fulfilment independently of dating, relationships and women altogether. Too often, men pursue personal growth only as a means to become more appealing to women, and when that doesn’t yield the results they want, it creates even more frustration and resentment. This mindset—tying self-improvement solely to dating success—is part of the problem. True self-improveme…	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 03:35 PM
2	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear With billion of us in existence I'm sure women like yourself are bound to come across some men that don't fit the general male behaviours I'm describing. Exceptions to every rule. Good on those men though and good luck to you! Maybe the universe is trying to teach you something...	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 03:30 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear I'm not sure how this negates my point. My post is primarily about men redefining their self-worth and fulfilment beyond romantic relationships and sexual validation. Your study doesn’t address the deeper issues I'm highlighting, such as loneliness, societal expectations, or systemic pressures. Again, having sex isn’t synonymous with fulfilment, happiness, or success in life—concepts that many men have a distorted perception of due to our worth being directly tied to our success with women. In f…	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 03:28 PM
3	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Well, yeah, that’s the entire purpose of this post: to destigmatise men being single and, more importantly, embracing it. Men often resist this idea because we’ve been conditioned not to. If we collectively rejected current norms, it could lead to significant societal shifts—something the powers that be likely don't want. Dating as we know it could undergo irreversible changes, and global birth rates might decline even further as a result. As a younger man (21), I think we might eventually see a…	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 03:12 PM
1	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Agreed.	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 03:05 PM
5	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear It's definitely a combination of both biological and social conditioning but I think society plays a significant role in amplifying those natural tendencies and tying them to a man’s sense of worth and identity. It’s one thing to desire connection—it’s another to feel like you’re a failure without it And you're right that both men and women are still learning to embrace singledom, but societal conditioning makes it harder for men because we’re constantly told that being single means you’re ‘less…	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 02:57 PM
5	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear I'm not sure how this means current dating culture is absolutely fine and balanced. Also, let’s be honest: having sex once a year isn’t exactly a sign of thriving. If anything, it shows how low the bar has been set for what constitutes success in dating. Men’s struggles in this area go beyond just sex—it’s about the lack of meaningful relationships, connection, and purpose. That’s why I’m arguing for a shift in perspective. Instead of measuring success by metrics like 'getting laid,' we should f…	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 02:49 PM
4	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Let me clarify. When I said it’s difficult for men as a whole to embrace singledom, I meant that it’s hard to push this idea on a mainstream level because society has conditioned men to fear being single. Men are taught that their self-worth depends on being in a relationship, and breaking out of that mindset is no small task. But that doesn’t mean it’s not a viable option—it just means it’s not easy to get men to see it that way. Change like this takes time and a willingness to confront ingrain…	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 02:45 PM
3	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear I can see that logic.	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 02:39 PM
12	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Right, see, that’s the kind of passive dating I’m talking about. In an ideal world, that approach might lead to more success, but that’s not how it usually works for most men. That said, you don’t come across as desperate, so I think you’re already halfway to achieving the kind of enlightenment I’m referring to.	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 02:36 PM
4	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Yeah so you're unfortunately one of the many victims of what I'm talking about. The hollowness you describe isn’t an inevitable outcome of single life itself but rather the result of societal conditioning that equates a man’s worth with his relationship status. When society tells us that being single is a failure or that fulfilment can only come from romantic partnerships with women, it’s no surprise that single life can feel hollow to guys like you. But that perception can change if we redefine…	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 02:28 PM
6	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Very true but what I'm seeing is that the abundance/quantity of men is the issue here. Not necessarily just quality. We're simply too available and we lose bargaining power with these lopsided gender ratios.	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 02:25 PM
22	For Men, Single Life Is the Solution—Not Something to Fear Many men operate out of a fear of being single, and that’s not healthy. I’d argue that over the years, this fear has overtaken genuine desire for companionship. It stems from societal conditioning that has led men to believe their only valid state of existence is when they’re coupled up with someone. It’s also worth considering that many of the larger social dynamics—like the breakdown of community spaces and the increasing isolation of modern life—are symptoms of the same systems that push men …	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 02:22 PM
1	It is up to Women to be proactive in the dating market nowadays You can express your point and not be a hypocrite at the same time.	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 07:52 AM
1	It is up to Women to be proactive in the dating market nowadays No, I actually have a backbone and other interests in life. Not putting women on a pedestal is a great feeling—you guys should give it a try.	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 07:38 AM
3	It is up to Women to be proactive in the dating market nowadays Do you mean "grow up" as in becoming more comfortable with the idea of being single? If so, then yes, I completely agree.	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 07:36 AM
3	It is up to Women to be proactive in the dating market nowadays Exactly. But the real question is: how do you encourage that? A lot of guys know that the only reason they’re experiencing even a little dating success is because they have no strict standards and are willing to entertain any type of woman. Raising those standards would likely result in less immediate dating success.	/r/PurplePillDebate	14/01/25 07:34 AM
2	It is up to Women to be proactive in the dating market nowadays Yep thats called maintaining the status quo. Adapting to a shit system when we could actually change said system is stupid. This whole thing starts and ends with us not them.	/r/PurplePillDebate	13/01/25 11:53 PM
2	It is up to Women to be proactive in the dating market nowadays The platforms changed therefore things changed. I'm gonna be the change I want to see in the world and seek fulfilment that isn't female related. Not gonna simp my life away for some shit lie like your gen did. I don't need to wait or even see 'it' because it's guaranteed to happen whether you like it or not. For the 100th time everything is temporary.	/r/PurplePillDebate	13/01/25 11:51 PM
5	It is up to Women to be proactive in the dating market nowadays If society encouraged us to opt out and remain single with the same energy they tell women to do the same, it could work. But trust me, those in power won’t allow that to happen because, as I mentioned, when we stop trying, the entire system falls apart and birth rates will decline even more rapidly. We’ve been convinced that we need women to an unhealthy degree, so much so that many men think they can’t live a normal life without one. This is largely due to intentional social conditioning by sa…	/r/PurplePillDebate	13/01/25 11:47 PM
3	It is up to Women to be proactive in the dating market nowadays Everything is temporary—undeniably so. It’s a scary thought, but not a new concept. Maybe I won’t live to see it, but it’s almost guaranteed that this 'gender consciousness' future will manifest in some way, or perhaps something even more extreme will occur. One thing is certain: the current dating system won’t stay the same forever. Hopefully, women make the most of it while it lasts. I’m not even sure why the idea of men opting out would spark any dissenting female opinions, to be honest. As y…	/r/PurplePillDebate	13/01/25 11:40 PM
1	It is up to Women to be proactive in the dating market nowadays Perfection. I'm trying to get like you.	/r/PurplePillDebate	13/01/25 11:32 PM
2	It is up to Women to be proactive in the dating market nowadays And you think things are the same now as they were then? No things have objecively changed. I know its a scary concept but EVERYTHING is temporary and thats not debatable. No one said this would be a quick process.	/r/PurplePillDebate	13/01/25 11:31 PM
1	It is up to Women to be proactive in the dating market nowadays Everything is temporary mate. You might not be around to see it and maybe I wont either but this current imbalance is not permanent. Women should make the most of this.	/r/PurplePillDebate	13/01/25 10:44 PM
3	It is up to Women to be proactive in the dating market nowadays Women initiating more would just make men feel better. This is precisely why what OP is suggesting will probably never significantly improve	/r/PurplePillDebate	13/01/25 10:41 PM
3	It is up to Women to be proactive in the dating market nowadays Well said.	/r/PurplePillDebate	13/01/25 10:39 PM
1	It is up to Women to be proactive in the dating market nowadays I’d tread carefully here. I think a woman’s pride often outweighs her desire not to be single. Every time we spout this nonsense about them eventually regretting their choices and wanting to be partnered later in life, they’re likely to dig their heels in even deeper and stay single out of sheer spite. Good for them, I suppose...	/r/PurplePillDebate	13/01/25 10:38 PM
1	It is up to Women to be proactive in the dating market nowadays Red pillers just want to maintain status quo. We will further regress doing things that way.	/r/PurplePillDebate	13/01/25 10:35 PM
8	It is up to Women to be proactive in the dating market nowadays God I wish most men just opted out. This whole thing crumbles when we stop trying.	/r/PurplePillDebate	13/01/25 10:34 PM
1	It is up to Women to be proactive in the dating market nowadays Woman are also not the ones hiding in bedrooms playing to many video games instead of socialising then complaining their struggling to meet anyone. One thing that does highlight as a red flag also is when women use lazy stereotypes and how quick they are to dismiss men’s struggles while reducing an entire gender to a caricature. You know a guy that got accused? I’m sorry that happened to him but he is in the tiny minority, I know 4 woman that did get raped and each rapist got away with it due to…	/r/PurplePillDebate	13/01/25 10:31 PM
11	It is up to Women to be proactive in the dating market nowadays The entire dating system operates on the premise that women date passively while men date actively. Unfortunately, it’s been this way for a long time. Understanding this highlights that the entire system begins and ends with male initiative and interest. If men were to collectively opt out on a large scale, the system would have no choice but to adapt and change. In other words, yes—if more men like you and me existed on a larger scale, we might see real change. But right now, we’re far too avai…	/r/PurplePillDebate	13/01/25 10:23 PM
3	It is up to Women to be proactive in the dating market nowadays Backwards thinking. Wake up. They want an equal world well then that means they have to put in some effort and initiate. Simple as that.	/r/PurplePillDebate	13/01/25 10:12 PM
6	It is up to Women to be proactive in the dating market nowadays Bingo	/r/PurplePillDebate	13/01/25 10:08 PM