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brunhyll Archive

View 1 post and 204 comments by brunhyll on TheRedPill subreddit and various other subreddits related to The Red Pill community.
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1

"I'ts obvious you think your suffering makes you superior. You practically said as much." I don't think anything of the sort. I'm merely saying, look, if I can manage to find purpose and meaning in spite of profound suffering, so can other people. It's that simple. Is it possible that some people have a neurobiology that blocks them from doing so? Perhaps. That's an interesting question. But as I said this isn't true for everyone. If there are those who truly can't, this doesn't make them inferi…
/r/PurplePillDebate10/10/23 12:12 PM
1

https://www.buddhanet.net/pdf_file/scrndhamma.pdf
/r/PurplePillDebate09/10/23 10:13 PM
1

"Like your idea that those who aren't successful with dating are just fatalists who don't try as hard as you supposedly do." This isn't my position at all. I fully agree that incels are describing their plight accurately and truthfully. My contention isn't that they aren't facing dating hardships, but that they (a percentage of them) aren't handling that reality wisely or skillfully. We all get dealt our own unique hand in life. Few have it perfect. "Chad" may wind up with multiple sclerosis or …
/r/PurplePillDebate09/10/23 10:12 PM
1

What if this world isn't trash, but a game or a test?
/r/PurplePillDebate09/10/23 05:00 AM
2

Of course a lot more stuff will be visible, as social media has increased in prevalence since 2016. How does this explain the shift from men trying to help each other, to men mostly complaining?
/r/PurplePillDebate09/10/23 04:58 AM
1

Is this just your personal theory? Or is there some sort of data you are drawing from?
/r/PurplePillDebate09/10/23 04:39 AM
1

How much do you suppose "the state of things" has changed over that short period of time?
/r/PurplePillDebate09/10/23 03:06 AM
1

I don't feel superior at all. I constantly burned by attachment and unexamined desire for the first decade of my adult life, and I suffered greatly because of it. I just wish I'd encountered helpful information sooner than I did. Nobody is immune to the destructive power of self-defeating ideas and emotions. On my end, it's the people who are obviously suffering, but who are resolutely closed off to ideas that might help that I find fascinating.
/r/PurplePillDebate09/10/23 02:08 AM
1

I was never there for the PUA component, but moreso just to open my eyes to the reality of modern relationships so as not to get burned by another one. I never had a problem getting women, but I had a problem falling too hard for them, getting into a relationship, and then developing oneitis and allowing myself to be betafied. TRP pill cured me of that fully, and that was really all the use I wanted from it.
/r/PurplePillDebate09/10/23 01:04 AM
17

Jesus fuck, I know. What's happened? Is it a generational thing? The level of fatalist , abject dejection I'm seeing here is off the charts. This comes from a guy who was on TRP sub back in the day, but was then completely off Reddit for 6 or 7 years, and so avoided the boiling frog phenomenon. Coming back and beholding this crazy shift has been legit shocking.
/r/PurplePillDebate09/10/23 12:44 AM
1

Honestly though, are you only here to defend your existing notions, or are you open to alternative ideas?
/r/PurplePillDebate09/10/23 12:03 AM
1

That's a fantastic assertion
/r/PurplePillDebate09/10/23 12:00 AM
1

Its predictable because it's obvious chief.
/r/PurplePillDebate08/10/23 11:56 PM
1

The majority of it isn't my own my guy. I spent the better part of a decade reading. Philosphy doesn't lend itself to citing sources. Where's your info coming from? The hight priests of science?
/r/PurplePillDebate08/10/23 11:46 PM
1

Not only that. Im also here to debate and exchange ideas. Why are you here?
/r/PurplePillDebate08/10/23 11:35 PM
1

If it's all pointless,then it's ALL pointless. What's the "point" of a wife and family? To merely make more families down the line? To what end?
/r/PurplePillDebate08/10/23 11:32 PM
1

Why are you here? For some nobler cause?
/r/PurplePillDebate08/10/23 11:30 PM
1

Not the people who are truly done, but the people who might still be helped. And it has nothing to do with morals. Moreso, it's about wisdom.
/r/PurplePillDebate08/10/23 11:26 PM
1

Your problem is that you cling to certain dopamine-produced feelings and then delude yourself into thinking those feelings can or should persist indefinitely. There comes a time in every man's life where he must learn to replace the childlike pursuit of "how can I feel the absolute most happiness all the time" to "how can I live with meaning and purpose." I have felt what you felt dude. I just learned that there is more to life than feelingsmaxing. The issue here is that getting there takes work…
/r/PurplePillDebate08/10/23 11:19 PM
1

I honestly hope sharing my view will encorage a few people to consider changing their perspective.
/r/PurplePillDebate08/10/23 10:36 PM
3

"but I don’t think they’ve experienced that real love and deep connection" Incorrect. I had a 10 year relationship from age to 16 to 26 and absolutely felt that way (head over heals, soulmate feeling). It was extremely difficult for me when it ended, and for a while life felt really gray and bleak. However, I used that time to better myself, and set about trying to understand why I seemed to need a woman to feel fulfilled. It was a ton of work to get there, but eventually I came to understand th…
/r/PurplePillDebate08/10/23 10:31 PM
1

"I think the way things are shows that most men are like me in this regard" Even if this is true (I'mm not convinced that it is), what the herd majority thinks and does generally serves as a bad blueprint for building a good life. Wisdom and fulfillment is often found on roads less frequently traveled.
/r/PurplePillDebate08/10/23 10:07 PM
1

Travel is only one example of a thousand different things a man can purposefully fill his time with. I have dozens of things that I could easily spend a lifetime doing happily and alone. Men would benefit greatly if they could learn to fully remove women from their focus, and instead ask: what does the world need, and how might I contribute? Then, once they have their answer, get busy doing it. Ideally, do it with other people who share a similar vision and find a sense of community there. A ful…
/r/PurplePillDebate08/10/23 09:50 PM
1

This. The vast majority of modern women are a Faustian bargain. I've done several long term relationships, and several long, deliberate MGTOW phases. The latter were vastly more satisfying than the former, and orders of magnitude less stressful. The problem these dudes are having is in generating their own inner sense of wellbeing and purpose; something that no woman can provide. This takes effort, and it might be that the capability is either in you, or it isn't. Either way, nothing external ca…
/r/PurplePillDebate08/10/23 08:39 PM
1

For the small but vocal cohort of men who do hold such childish ideals, I frequently do try talking some sense into them. What I've found is that they are almost universally hostile to anything that challenges their narrative. I honestly think that this sub disproportionately draws dudes with cluster B personality disorders, and those types will never stop lashing out if they aren't getting what they want. They are legit immune to criticism.
/r/PurplePillDebate08/10/23 08:18 PM
1

"All the men." There you go again.
/r/PurplePillDebate08/10/23 08:03 PM
1

Methinks you are cherry picking from what any average bonehead could recognize as an outrageously polluted sample, and then shitposting hyperbolic nonsense. But hey carry on if it makes you feel clever.
/r/PurplePillDebate08/10/23 07:34 PM
1

Fantastic
/r/PurplePillDebate08/10/23 03:56 PM
0

I'm referencing a religion, not appealing to one. The observation is logically and factually sound in and of itself. No doubt you'll have difficulty intuiting the difference between referencing and appealing. As for the reference, it was provided on the off-chance someone so-burdened might do some reading that could prove useful to them. Buddhists have expounded on the problem of desire far more deeply and eloquently than I could ever hope to. If it "sounds like imposing a worldview" to you, it'…
/r/PurplePillDebate08/10/23 03:52 PM
1

One, I'm not a Buddhist. I merely agree with some of Buddhism's conclusions. There is a lot in Buddhism that doesn't resonate with me at all. Two, highlighting the objective difference between biological necessity and psychological neurosis isn't in any way analogous to "imposing a worldview." The truth is never imposed; it simply is. Always enjoy a good no-true-scotsman though
/r/PurplePillDebate08/10/23 03:36 PM
1

I was responding to your statement as written. Also: which "men" made such a declaration? A few you met on the internet?
/r/PurplePillDebate08/10/23 02:17 PM
2

For the same reason that it doesn't matter to Sadhus, Buddhist monks, mountain hermits, etc. - because sex is nothing but a cheap animal desire and I can think of 1000 better things to dedicate my time to. Making sex the center of one's universe is simply pathetic in my view. That's tangential though. My reasoning is inconsequential. You said sex was " the most important thing in the world to men, and their entire reason for doing anything and everything." I was merely highlighting the fact that…
/r/PurplePillDebate08/10/23 01:53 PM
0

If you can sit there and equate starvation to celibacy with a straight face, you're a lost cause. There are only a few things that are true biological necessities. Food, water, shelter. Basically, the select few things upon which one's survival is contingent. Aside from these, every single other desire can be challenged, and with enough dedication, transcended. See: Buddhism. Desire is the root of all suffering. It's like a burning hot fire. If you're sitting super close and complaining that it'…
/r/PurplePillDebate08/10/23 01:34 PM
1

I'm a man an it isn't important to me at all.
/r/PurplePillDebate08/10/23 12:49 PM
2

"because it’s definitely easier to let go of those lesser things" Weird because I found it incredibly easy to let go of women, but have an extremely difficult time letting go of my desire for travel/adventure. Best not to make claims of certainty when all you really have is a half-baked hypothesis.
/r/PurplePillDebate08/10/23 12:42 PM
0

"For somebody who has greater needs in this domain, this is a very real, almost physical pain to live with." This honestly sounds like a mental disorder that you should seek help for, not an "instinct" that you should double down on. " Chronic loneliness is said to be as bad for a person as smoking. It's a real fucking thing." This is true for some people, but thinking one must have romantic involvement with the opposite sex to address the issue is absurd. There are many avenues to fulfill socia…
/r/PurplePillDebate08/10/23 12:39 PM
1

Lol. I've been with my girlfriend for 5 years and we both constantly misread each other, despite both of us being fairly intuitive people. And I mean constantly. Perfect strangers should definitely get it right though, "or else they're accosting creeps." God help the socially awkward dude who has to navigate a dating environment filled with myopic, disgustingly unreasonable people like you.
/r/PurplePillDebate01/10/23 04:01 PM
–

You: confidently proclaims that mind reading isn't required Also you: proceeds to explain how mind reading is, in fact, required
/r/PurplePillDebate01/10/23 03:24 PM
1

And here we come full circle back to mind reading
/r/PurplePillDebate01/10/23 03:16 PM
–

How is a man to differentiate between the receptive and the unreceptive?
/r/PurplePillDebate01/10/23 03:11 PM
–

But hold on while i make a rational counter against it. Lol
/r/PurplePillDebate01/10/23 03:06 PM
–

I'm pretty sure it's been long established that mind reading is impossible.
/r/PurplePillDebate01/10/23 03:05 PM
–

I'm honestly dumbfounded that you can make this ludacris argument with a straight face
/r/PurplePillDebate01/10/23 03:01 PM
–

Translation: men must become mind readers
/r/PurplePillDebate01/10/23 02:58 PM
–

"Yes. The unwilling or willing audience decides if attention is wanted or unwanted, as it has always been." Of course. But only the woman is privy to this information. Dudes can't read minds. The only way for a guy to find out is to try, and by the time he does, his fate is sealed. If he's socially awkward or otherwise "ick," he will automatically be deemed creepy just for making the attempt.
/r/PurplePillDebate01/10/23 02:54 PM
9

"Men: Do more housework. Be more supportive. Take some of her mental load, help with the planning." What in the everlasting fuck does this have to do with the OP topic?
/r/PurplePillDebate01/10/23 02:40 PM
–

Define "accosting." Or is it just whatever any woman decides that it is in the moment? Is there an objective standard that we can look to to figure out what constitutes "accosting" behavior, or is it a moving target that shifts based on how attractive the dude is?
/r/PurplePillDebate01/10/23 02:37 PM
1

The harder you pretend to be under my skin, the more I know I'm under yours. Sorry could resist. I'm really out this time.
/r/AllPillDebate30/09/23 03:07 PM
1

Last word is yours playa. Bet I can guess what you'll say...
/r/AllPillDebate30/09/23 02:46 PM
1

I see your problem. You don't understand what a fact is. That must make life difficult to navigate
/r/AllPillDebate30/09/23 02:45 PM
1

Only you can answer what's making you feel desperate
/r/AllPillDebate30/09/23 02:43 PM
1

You do realize that making up shit about strangers in your head and then asserting it as fact isn't actually the big winning move you pretend it is, don't you? It's actually anong the more cowardly debate tactics a person can employ
/r/AllPillDebate30/09/23 02:38 PM
1

Weird because you legit come off as more desperate than anyone I've interacted with recently. Maybe I'm reading you wrong, but I doubt it.
/r/AllPillDebate30/09/23 02:24 PM
1

Got it. Well, I suppose I'll go pedal it elsewhere. God speed.
/r/AllPillDebate30/09/23 02:20 PM
1

Lol. So it's true then?
/r/AllPillDebate30/09/23 02:13 PM
1

Interesting. What are you desperate for?
/r/AllPillDebate30/09/23 02:12 PM
1

I have no doubt you will outlast me. By all appearances, it's all you have to cling to.
/r/AllPillDebate30/09/23 02:08 PM
1

God won't help you bro. Only you can help you.
/r/AllPillDebate30/09/23 02:04 PM
1

You should repeat it a few more times. Maybe it will magically become true.
/r/AllPillDebate30/09/23 02:01 PM
0

Certain things are simply stupid to get worked up over. One need not "pose as a badass" to state the obvious. Fuck sake, school children are taught as much.
/r/AllPillDebate30/09/23 01:58 PM
1

Repeating the words phony, bravado, and posing over and over again..... Seems like an interesting defense mechanism.
/r/AllPillDebate30/09/23 01:56 PM
1

But seriously, you should read some actual Stoicism. “If you are distressed by anything external, the pain is not due to the thing itself, but to your estimate of it; and this you have the power to revoke at any moment.”
/r/AllPillDebate30/09/23 01:36 PM
1

Wisdom =/= bravado.
/r/AllPillDebate30/09/23 01:28 PM
0

Win what? Is there some sort of contest going on that I'm not aware of? And for the record, I fear plenty of things. The opinions of unhinged women just isn't one of them. If you think giving a bunch of idiot children power over you is in somehow self-serving, by all means carry on.
/r/AllPillDebate30/09/23 01:26 PM
1

I'll say it no matter what happens, because I'm not dumb enough to give the herd and its opinions power over me. If I loose a woman? Good riddance. If I lose a job? Fuck that job then. Stoicism > than being a whiny limp noodle.
/r/AllPillDebate30/09/23 01:22 PM
0

Nah Dawg that's straight wisdom right there. Caring about what other morons think or do is the foolhardy way to live.
/r/AllPillDebate30/09/23 08:56 AM
0

"Dude says hi to a woman and is ruined for life. Then there are those gym videos." If a bunch of harpies deciding to make fun of you for some tiny innocuous thing "ruins your life," you've got far bigger problems.
/r/AllPillDebate30/09/23 08:50 AM
1

Yep. The highest achievements in life don't come easy. Generally speaking, if the herd finds a principle difficult to embody, it's probably worthwhile. The herd should never be your guide. See: Buddhism
/r/PurplePillDebate30/09/23 08:37 AM
1

"Let's look at a single man who is not dating at all. He can be content with little, there is noone to impress and nobody to provide for. How is he supposed not to fall into complacency and acceptance? Ending up at the bare minimum he personally needs?" Learning how to live with the bare minimum and be completely content and fulfilled with it is the highest order of success a human can achieve. Having a woman in now way aids in this pursuit, and is more often than not a hinderance. Yours is a sp…
/r/PurplePillDebate30/09/23 01:45 AM
1

Aging gracefully =/= giving up
/r/PurplePillDebate29/09/23 09:08 PM
2

This is JNRobert's favorite game - making dumbshit claims, citing sources that don't even remotely back up those claims, and then pretending they backed them up. Everyone else, of course, is "only guessing" I had the good fortune of being treated to the same dog and pony show a few hours ago.
/r/PurplePillDebate29/09/23 09:07 PM
2

I wasn't implying they were out of your league. You probably dated a narc who imagined he was out of your league, or a borderline who projected their insecurities on you. The fact remains that I guarantee there are men out there who would jump at the chance to be with you, and who would be greatful for the opportunity, were you yo give them the time of day. You don't have to workout to merely get a guy who will be fully satisfied, but you may need to in order to get a certain caliber of guy who …
/r/PurplePillDebate29/09/23 06:41 PM
1

Please do. You might learn something.
/r/PurplePillDebate29/09/23 06:13 PM
1

Sorry I made you look bad and now you can't let it go
/r/PurplePillDebate29/09/23 06:08 PM
1

Strawman again, for the win
/r/PurplePillDebate29/09/23 06:06 PM
1

I also stated mine was a hypothesis. Go back and read my literal words.
/r/PurplePillDebate29/09/23 06:04 PM
1

You provided a Motte and Bailey fallacy. That is all.
/r/PurplePillDebate29/09/23 05:57 PM
1

I didn't make a truth claim. I made a hypothesis. Behold, the power of intellectual modesty.
/r/PurplePillDebate29/09/23 05:49 PM
1

Not even a little. You can piss off now you dishonest puke
/r/PurplePillDebate29/09/23 05:33 PM
0

To be fair, it's overwhelmingly likely, as a woman, that you could find a dude that worshipped you just as you are, IF you lowered your own standards enough. For men, if you don't meet a certain standard you straight go hungry. Legit nobody will want you. This is rarely true for the majority of women. That said, it's still shitty for women to have to deal with social pressures too.
/r/PurplePillDebate29/09/23 05:31 PM
1

Motte and Bailey much?
/r/PurplePillDebate29/09/23 04:58 PM
1

Another fallacy. You are either flagrantly dishonest, or incredibly stupid
/r/PurplePillDebate29/09/23 04:57 PM
1

Certainly all countries have methods of fostering patriotism and loyalty. And certainly, these methods have varying degree of success. It doesn't follow from this that the unique bonds military men describe are "unnatural," or that they can rightly be called "engineered." My argument is a biological one not a jingoist one you, you charlatan.
/r/PurplePillDebate29/09/23 04:55 PM
1

That's not the argument I'm making dummy. Strawman much?
/r/PurplePillDebate29/09/23 04:50 PM
2

Lol. K. Sorry you can't own your bad reasoning skills.
/r/PurplePillDebate29/09/23 04:32 PM
2

Yep. And you are still begging the question. The existence of trauma bonding does nothing to prove that it is the main driver behind the military brotherhood phenomenon. You are arguing fallaciously.
/r/PurplePillDebate29/09/23 04:29 PM
2

Where does your "evidence" supply proof to the claim "this isn't a natural relationship?"
/r/PurplePillDebate29/09/23 04:12 PM
2

You made a bold truth claim when in fact you merely have a hypothesis: "That isn't a natural relationship"
/r/PurplePillDebate29/09/23 04:09 PM
2

Sure. But this does nothing to demonstrate that the bonds described in the military can be largely attributed to trauma bonding. You are begging the question.
/r/PurplePillDebate29/09/23 04:05 PM
2

Of course the army wants to build a bond, and will do what they can in that regard. That doesn't mean that they can claim the credit for the phenomenon. I'm sure they'd like to, in all their grandiosity. Biology > psyops
/r/PurplePillDebate29/09/23 03:47 PM
2

That isn't a natural relationship, it's engineered by the US military which is tasked with ensuring collectivist ideology during war time. This is wild speculation. Evolutionary biology is an equally plausible explanation. Over the course of human history, men hunted in small groups with other men. The military is the closest modern day equivalent to that. Thus, as fucked up as it is, in the modern era the military gets men closer to the EEA (environment of evolutionary adaptedness) that human m…
/r/PurplePillDebate29/09/23 03:36 PM
5

Right, and how many people aren't dating at all? You should look up that percentage. It isn't small. And guess what? It isn't because they don't want a partner. The vast majority of people do. So why aren't they dating online? Because it's toxic and they've likely realized that when they tried dabbling in the past. The apps are still having a massive effect, even if a lot of people have realized the shitshow that it is. The people who use them are the people who are successful in using them, and…
/r/PurplePillDebate29/09/23 03:23 PM
3

It's not that we have new "information." Everyone has always known what it takes to look good. The issue is that now, with the rise of social media and influencer culture, people have no choice but to try to mimic the sorts of aesthetics that people are viewing online, all day every day. Those images infect peoples consciousness, and all of a sudden what was until yesterday considered excessive, is now considered standard. You are right that it's an arms race, but not because people back in the …
/r/PurplePillDebate29/09/23 03:17 PM
5

It's not just about clothes and hairstyle. If it were, you'd have a solid point. The thing is, since the social media era began people are not only pressured to keep up with current fashion, but ALSO to have impeccable bodies based on the fitness craze that has swept the nation. It used to be all you had to do with make a half-assed attempt at having style (something that can be achieved with occasional visits to Supercuts and a quick trip through Nordstrom's Rack once or twice a year). Now, unl…
/r/PurplePillDebate29/09/23 03:04 PM
2

Good comment. It's amazing how people in these threads gloss right over the clear and obvious narcissistic element involved in refusing to disclose multiple partners. There is one reason, and one reason alone to neglect to disclose - to have your cake an eat it too. It's PURELY a self-serving move, and a deceptive one at that. I can't believe how many people have fallen for the idea that we should all just accept that this is just "the way things are now." People have lost their minds, lost thei…
/r/PurplePillDebate28/09/23 08:34 PM
1

There absolutely can be a subjective greater good, depending on what society we (or the majority) wants to live in. It's not a matter of being "wronged," it's a matter of looking at the situation and recognizing that current trends are antithetical to the kinds of goals the average person holds. If for example your average person desires a stable long term relationship with a solid partner, and it can be reasonably established that hookup culture is actively sabotaging that goal, then it would b…
/r/PurplePillDebate28/09/23 06:16 PM
2

"My argument comes from my real life observations that even the highest standard individuals all cave in eventually to lower their standards forcing them to settle with someone close enough to meet routinely. " I guess all of the people observing higher status women choosing to be single rather than lower their standards are imagining thing then. Granted, these women may still date (eg. be used by) men who are out of their league and who refuse to commit, so in this respect they may still be sex…
/r/PurplePillDebate28/09/23 05:57 PM
1

https://www.reddit.com/r/AITAH/comments/16t1ana/aitah_for_ending_things_with_a_girl_because_she/ I agree that neither is the asshole, and went to significant lengths in the OP to explain why this is the case. It's not a matter of right and wrong, because there is no objective moral standard to appeal to. That said, that doesn't mean that one way or the other can't or shouldn't be considered best for society at large. That's the basis for social norms in the first place. Or at least it used to be…
/r/PurplePillDebate28/09/23 05:06 PM
1

Social norms are always an imposition on one group or another genius. If the social norm is open promiscuity, that will be an imposition on those with traditional values. Nice strawman though. Did you happen to read the numerous times I made clear that I'm categorically against legal enforcement? The world doesn't revolve around anyone's beliefs. Yet, we all have to figure out how to live together. In doing so, people naturally advocate for principles that they see as valuable. This is called po…
/r/PurplePillDebate28/09/23 03:07 PM
2

The point is, if all you’ve done is go on one date with someone and jump in bed, there is no reason to think you’re exclusive at that point, you don’t even really know each other. The context of the OP was that they'd been dating two weeks, been on 5 dates, been sexual intimate numerous times, texted constantly, and talked a bunch on the phone. All signs were that they were super into each other. After all this, OP has every reason to believe they were exclusive. Sure, after one sexual encounter…
/r/PurplePillDebate28/09/23 01:44 PM
1

lol. I'm not angry even a little. It's just rhetoric friend. Way to show your aptitude for psychic evaluation though. Ever considered making a career of it? "Best to let go of the anger and accept reality for what it is, and live within its constraints. Men aren’t going to undo millions of years of evolutionary biology and sexual selection to change women’s preferences on something made up like “principles”. It's not about changing biology, it's about putting up social constraints that put a che…
/r/PurplePillDebate28/09/23 01:30 PM
0

Nope. GTFO out with your "can't." I'll admit that it's a more dicey prospect than it used to be due to the modern hookup culture clusterfuck, but that's all the more reason for men to double down on their principles. Men SHOULD expect exclusivity, because it's the only way to alter the course of the current crazy train. When you say " They have life so easy and so many options, it makes total logical sense they’re casually fucking a whole bunch of hot guys," you are absolutely correct. But this …
/r/PurplePillDebate28/09/23 10:54 AM
0

Indeed we shall. I personally think industrial civilization is headed for collapse in the near-term, so I envision a lot of this naturally falling by the wayside as actual tribalism makes its inevitable resurgence. Sort of a tangent, but this is one reason why I don't spend a lot of time worrying about it. Something tells me nature will sort everything out for us.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/09/23 04:33 AM
0

Guess away. A fallacy remains a fallacy.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/09/23 04:26 AM
2

For sure. Tribalism is definitely an element, and that's a shame because the issues transcend "sides" at this point. We're all on this leaky ship together and it does nobody any favors to obfuscate the situation for the sake of scoring points. But yeah, everything you've said here is on point. Nobody is "winning" in the current dysfunctional context. I agree that women are probably getting the slightly worse end of the stick (I'm sure some feminists would challenge us here) but the fact is that …
/r/PurplePillDebate28/09/23 04:07 AM
1

Yep. And it goes far beyond simply not acknowledging it in a lot of cases. In this thread alone, the mental gymnastics people go through to actively argue that it isn't a problem is staggering. I can't make any sense of it. The problem is painfully obvious, and people seem hellbent on rationalizing it away.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/09/23 03:11 AM
1

Agreed. That's why many women know intuitively that they need to keep their promiscuity hidden from the very guys they are being promiscuous with. They KNOW how it's likely to be interpreted, and they aren't wrong. This adds a layer of manipulation/deceit to the whole thing, which makes it all the more repugnant from where I sit.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/09/23 03:07 AM
0

Yeah I definitely agree. I was just saying that even if the conversation never takes place, people should be prepared to reap the potential social consequences of their unchecked promiscuity.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/09/23 03:03 AM
3

"Proof" isn't necessary to point out a clear non-sequitur. Simple logic will suffice.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/09/23 03:01 AM
2

Can't disagree with anything here.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/09/23 02:57 AM
1

It won't entirely solve it, no. In my view, modernity has created so many problems, it's beyond anyone's ability to understand the complexity of the situation fully, much less come up with a definitive prescription for salvation.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/09/23 02:53 AM
3

Not really a matter of opinion here, as far as I can see. I'm pretty sure it's a cut and dry logical fallacy. But as you say, whatever you want to think.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/09/23 02:06 AM
3

You are conflating two separate things. A woman holding relaxed values about how quickly she will become sexual with a man has NO BEARING on the values she holds concerning how many partners she is willing to be sexual with concurrently. Yes, if she fucks a guy quickly, she has probably fucked other guys quickly. None of this makes it likely that she has fucked, or wants to fuck, multiple people concurrently. This is a classic non sequitur.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/09/23 01:45 AM
1

I think you downplay the power of social ostracization here. It does far more than bring promiscuity "a notch" down. And secular societies are just as capable of having these kinds of norms. They do not need religion to exist. In reference to your Nordic example, that is certainly one way to go, but it always comes with social problems of its own. It's always a trade-off. Those same people were also some of the most violent and war-mongering ever to exist. Not saying the two traits are necessari…
/r/PurplePillDebate28/09/23 01:37 AM
1

Well, I think we can both agree that the situation is somewhat complicated. And trust me, I do not think that social norms against promiscuity would be some kind of panacea and fix everything. I think that there are more problems at play here than just that, but that isn't to say that hookup culture isn't contributing in a way that is significant. It think that it is. And again, it's not just a matter of people not dating. It's also a matter of the quality of the relationships, trust, commitment…
/r/PurplePillDebate28/09/23 01:18 AM
2

Interesting observation. I don't spend a lot of time in this sub so I'm not familiar with that particular flavor of hypocrisy. Is it really a thing?
/r/PurplePillDebate28/09/23 01:15 AM
2

No. I've said elsewhere that this issue should categorically NOT be handled via legislation. Social norms are exactly that - social norms. It's possible that social norms can become laws, but I do not advocate for this. If changes were to happen, I'd advocate that it be done in a grass roots fashion, spurred on exclusively by popular sentiment "In my view, the more freedom you have without fearing someone will blow your head off or take you to jail, the better" Nobody is advocating violence or j…
/r/PurplePillDebate28/09/23 01:01 AM
1

Also, part of your linked data seems to show that people are simply either opting out of the dating game entirely (many people I've talked to do this because they figure out how toxic it is), or because they simply can't attract a partner and give up. These trends are new. What do we think is causing them? It's not that people don't want a relationships. Studies have been done on that too, and the conclusion is always the same. They do.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/09/23 12:44 AM
2

It's what she did after their first date that he found problematic. Yes, she slept with him. But then she continued to sleep with him, as she simultaneously slept with other people. The first fact need not lead to the second.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/09/23 12:41 AM
1

This stat may or may not be true (people lie), but even if it is, the dynamic is having an outsized impact on the current dating market. The vast majority of young people who have dabbled in the dating market will admit as much. It's a fucking crap shoot, and hookup culture has polluted the whole thing in a manner far to egregious to ignore. It makes it harder to find people, and it makes it harder to commit to the people you do find, and it makes it harder to trust your partner will commit to y…
/r/PurplePillDebate28/09/23 12:38 AM
2

The problem is that if you wait to have sex for as long as they did in the past, your pool of prospective dating partners will shrink even more than it already has. I used to wait for a long time, but then it became clear that this is increasingly seen as weird/strange behavior for anyone that isn't Christian or otherwise religious. Just because a lot of us have caved to the social pressure to be sexual quicker than we would otherwise prefer, this doesn't mean that we should abandon all standard…
/r/PurplePillDebate28/09/23 12:32 AM
1

"Also, going on dates with multiple people at once is still a monogamous framework for dating as long as you eventually pick one (or none)." Going on meet and greet dates in public? Maybe. Fucking several at a time? Nah sorry not buying that for a second.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/09/23 12:16 AM
1

We are still a monogamous society, more people are just choosing to find partners later or are foregoing it entirely. That's one way of looking at it. lol
/r/PurplePillDebate28/09/23 12:13 AM
1

I already live out my principles, every single day. Occasionally, I also come to Reddit to discuss what I view as the more pressing social/political/ecological topics of the modern era. This is one of them. This is all that I mean when I say that I will "fight" for my principles. Live them out personally, and when the opportunity arises, add a bit to the commentary. And to the extent I would advocate for "imposing" my view on others, it would only be via social pressure as was done in the past. …
/r/PurplePillDebate28/09/23 12:09 AM
2

That being said, if someone sleeps with you on the first date, you can assume they probably have had multiple recent partners even if not currently, so wrap it up, get tested, and do not assume exclusivity until that discussion happens. Yes, it would seem the safer route to simply assume as much in this day an age. That isn't the question though. My question is, do we want to live in a world where this is the case? 100 years ago you could safely assume the opposite. Personally, I think that woul…
/r/PurplePillDebate28/09/23 12:01 AM
1

I'll let you figure it out for yourself.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 11:46 PM
1

Socially enforced monogamy. That is all.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 11:29 PM
1

You're correct in that it's not a matter of "right." We could certainly say it's law of the jungle and let it be so. Might equals right, after all. But as history has shown, we don't have to do this. Social norms are powerful when widely embraced, can effectively mitigate human impulses that are deemed destructive to the social fabric. 100 years ago this woman's behavior would have been seen as highly abhorrent, and she would have suffered harsh Social consequences. I'm not convinced our departu…
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 11:27 PM
1

"Whatever. They'll probably both do fine after going through about half a dozen medium term relationships." Citation needed
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 11:17 PM
1

The phenomenon is plastered all over the news/in the wider social commentary. Do you live under a rock or is this willful ignorance?
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 11:14 PM
1

I wonder then how humanity solved it for thousands of years? True, i can't do it alone. But society can (and has) reigned in these natural human impulses before. And can again, if the wider population realizes the current model is only serving a few at the expense of the many. Our devices aren't our masters, ffs.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 11:10 PM
1

The current data doesn't bode well, unfortunately.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 11:04 PM
2

"That's what I don't understand. Her reaction seems over the top. Why was she so upset over this losing guy when she admitted to having several other guys on deck? Isn't that the nature of non-exclusivity?" Likely because she's used to being pumped and dumped, so she's come to expect that. So, when a good guy comes along she is hesitant to be exclusive at first (sacrificing concurrent options) for something that's not a sure bet. Just guessing here.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 11:03 PM
1

"For guys its necessary because the success rate is so low. For girls its preferred because its hard to find the right guy, the options are nearly unlimited, and because they get free meals out of it." And this, my friends, is what's known as a vicious circle.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 11:00 PM
1

Lol. No. That's a small part of the context. Go ahead and circle back, read the definitions of philandering, and tell me how my history in any way fits. I'll wait.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 10:51 PM
0

The dumbass here is the girl. Dude clearly has decent SMV and will likely have no problem finding someone with more integrity. Girl will probably keep getting used until her best SMV years are behind her, and may very possibly regret her decision to be hoodwinked by the "sex positivity" narrative
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 10:46 PM
1

It's not casual for more reasons than just 'I was looking for a relationship.' Context never matters for sophists though, so I won't waste any more time here
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 10:42 PM
1

Sophists gonna sophist
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 10:37 PM
2

Not withstanding a cataclysmic event, modern society is here to stay While we're making big claims with no supporting evidence, let me counter with: A cataclysmic event is guaranteed at some point, and the near-term breakdown of modern society is an inevitably. " Trust me, there's better things to do with your time but if this the path you choose to go on, I wish you the best" That was hyperbole smart guy, and applies only to limited extent that I engage in these kinds of conversations in the fi…
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 10:07 PM
1

" To philander is to flirt or casually date a large number of people. If you philander, you don't have one steady, serious relationship, but instead dabble in many casual ones. "
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 10:04 PM
1

philandering - "readily or frequently enter into casual sexual relationships with women." " the act of having sex with a lot of different partners without becoming emotionally involved with any of them "
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 10:02 PM
1

Sex is never casual for me. When I have sex with someone, this automatically means that I'm actively looking for a relationship, and that I am not entertaining other options. You are dishonestly stretching the definition of philandering here.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 10:00 PM
2

This need is only due to modern trends. For most of human society, there was no such need because society had strict social conventions surrounding appropriate dating behavior. It is not a need by default. We make it such by shifting our value systems. I say this current shift has led to worse outcomes.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 09:58 PM
1

I've had sex with someone on the second date. We're now together 5 years on. I'm also 38 and have had a total 6 sexual partners since the age of 17. Am I a "philanderer?"
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 09:55 PM
1

Nobody ever said anything about "should." He was asking if he was the asshole, not complaining that she "should" have done anything. The social problem arises when this dynamic becomes rampant, and then all of a sudden people can't find healthy functioning relationships anymore as a result. The story itself is a symptom of a wider problem.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 09:53 PM
1

Yeah and the people in Nazi Germany used the same logic as justification to turn a blind all to the atrocities surrounding them.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 09:49 PM
2

Traditional dating culture being the default is gone it's and never coming back. This is a foundationless claim. Human society is cyclical. Civilizations rise and collapse. Norms are adopted, abandoned, and re-adopted. I can't guarantee that we will see a return to traditional values, but you can't guarantee we won't. In the meantime, I'll stay here on the forefront advocating for what I think is the better option.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 09:48 PM
1

Any serious guy would know it’s unreasonable to ask someone to drop the other people they’re dating before exclusivity (in some capacity) is established. You are begging the question. I'm saying exclusivity should be the default assumption socially, not the alternative.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 09:43 PM
2

You're just trying to shove your own bias towards philandering down other people's throats. Have fun with that. I say that such paths lead to self-debasement, but hey that's just, like, my opinion.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 09:41 PM
2

Tell her that.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 09:38 PM
2

It's not about being upset, it's simply about having principles that one is committed to holding to. Nothing more, nothing less. In the same way that "people are going to sleep with multiple partners until they find the right person for them," other people are "going to reject promiscuous people until they find the right person for them." Hence, the crapshoot I outlined in my OP. I mean, if we're good with the obvious fallout of this situation as a society, then it is what it is I guess. I just …
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 09:37 PM
0

"That if you aren't exclusive, they are sleeping with someone else." Why shouldn't it be "if you're sleeping with someone, then you're exclusive?"
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 09:33 PM
1

Doesn't matter. People don't date for the betterment of society. They date for themselves and giving themselves the most favorable option at all times. Ding ding. Welcome to modernity, where narcissism prevails! Alas, there was a time where the greater good was, in fact, an important consideration. But hey, let's all just jump head first into the cesspool of debauched hedonism, shall we?
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 09:32 PM
1

It's true that both failed to communicate, but now what could have been a great opportunity has been lost. What if they were perfect for each other in every other respect? Neither wins in this situation. From the way I read the initial post, it sounded like the girl realized he was the best option, but too little too late. So when he walked away, she realized that her actions were a mistake. This was my interpretation anyway. In which case, how well did her "I'm secretly keeping my options open"…
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 09:29 PM
3

you have decided that sexually exclusivity is a super special unique thing that someone gets to randomly and unilaterally decide for another person without their agreement or consent, and then throw a fit when other people don’t live up to their imaginary rules. No, I haven't "decided" anything of the sort. This is a strawman. And if I were in the position of the dude from AITAH, I wouldn't throw a fit, I would just politely exit the situation. No harm, no foul. "The same way you don’t get to de…
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 09:24 PM
1

I'm talking about the widespread re-adoption of previous era social norms that put social pressure on people to refrain from being promiscuous. If these norms were held in the past, it's possible they could be held again, even with the presence of social media. We are under no obligation to continue behaving this way merely because "we have phones and apps now." Will this ever happen? Hard to say. But it would happen if people recognized he value in it, and decided to build a new ethic. It doesn…
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 09:20 PM
7

And you should always assume the person you are having sex with isn't ok with you having sex with other people simultaneously, unless told otherwise.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 09:17 PM
1

Sex and talking to men are leagues apart. You are making a false equivalence.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 08:46 PM
1

So we should all just embrace the fatalist attitude that social media will forever dictate our social mores and norms then? Fuck that. If it's clear that technology is having an outsized negative impact on society, the solution is not to simply double down on the problem, but to start talking about ways to mitigate it. Or should we all just resign to being slaves to our apps?
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 08:42 PM
0

I would argue that it would be healthier for the society to be upfront about your attitudes about promiscuity so you can find someone who shares your same values, but you do you See, I can make a blanket assertion without actually giving any reasoning too.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 08:39 PM
1

No worries, I do the same thing.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 08:37 PM
1

It would seem not.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 08:36 PM
1

What makes you think that dude wasn't going to make you his girlfriend? What if the one who actually cares winds up being the optimal long term partner for you, but you lost out on the chance because you wanted to look out for your own interests above all else?
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 08:10 PM
1

I reject this. There was no society-wide consensus on this question, and many people still carry the old value set. I'm not going to simply roll over and give it up because you demand it. Yes, this means people like OP will occasionally be blindsided and harbor resentment. But on the flip side, people like OP's dating partner will continue getting dropped like a bid habit. Nobody wins this game, it's a Mexican Standoff. And no, I don't "have to" have any talk. If I were dating, I'd use this very…
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 08:07 PM
2

Way to forward the dialogue bud.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 08:01 PM
1

If someone chooses to date without an agreement to exclusivity, they’re responsible for the fact that they’re dating without an agreement to exclusivity. Yes, for sure. I'm in no way arguing that the dude is not responsible for his own misfortune. Given the modern dating context, he certainly is responsible. But the girl is equally responsible for not disclosing, and then finding out later (to her dismay) that it was a deal breaker. Did you even read my OP? That's exactly my point- because neith…
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 07:59 PM
1

I thought you were setting a trap by trying to get me to defend literally something that cannot be defended literally. If it was a good faith inquiry into why I think, perhaps i will reconsider. If it seems like I'm coming out of a foxhole, it's because I've often baited in this way in bad faith on the internet.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 07:54 PM
1

"I agree with you that people are highly divided about this question of significance in terms of sexual activity. Given that there is not a consensus perspective on this value, we are left with two social questions: 1. How should societal norms be arranged? and 2. How should a person act whose personal values are not in alignment with societal norms?" Yes, this is exactly the crux of the matter. Again, I do not suggest in any way that those advocating promiscuity are immoral. I'm merely highligh…
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 07:48 PM
1

I bet you did.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 07:43 PM
2

It definitely used to bother me, but I spent a lot of time reading philosophy and eventually came to terms with the dog-eat-dog nature of animal existence, and stopped wishing things to be otherwise. Now I mostly avoid places where masses of humans congregate, as that seems to bring out the worst in people. Rural life in small groups isn't perfect either, but highly preferable to the toxicity of hyper-urban existence. If I insulate myself from it, it doesn't bother me as much. I engage to the ex…
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 07:41 PM
2

She is not assuming they haven’t made a commitment to exclusivity. She knows that. That doesn’t mean she’s assuming anything about his behavior. Incorrect. She obviously assumed he'd be ok with it, otherwise she would have disclosed up front, and wouldn't have wound up crying when she didn't get the result she was after.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 07:36 PM
1

Yes, if we can't establish a ruling social norm, then the only solution will be for each party to make full disclosure before they jump in the sheets together. I'm saying, shit sure would be a lot easier (and better) if we returned to the social norm where it exclusivity COULD be assumed.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 07:34 PM
1

Rhetorical hyperbole cannot be supported friend. That's why it's called hyperbole.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 07:32 PM
1

"It does not seem to me that most people consider having sex to be an important enough milestone to warrant automatic exclusivity. " The population is definitely divided on this issue, and that's the problem. Up until basically yesterday, there was near unanimous consent that having sex was absolutely an important milestone that warrants exclusivity. The question I'm posing: is this change an improvement??
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 07:30 PM
2

Similarly, your contention about it being a ‘free-for-all clusterfuck’ needs elaboration and a supporting argument. Lol. Yes let me go ahead and support my rhetorical hyperbole with facts really quick.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 07:22 PM
2

I absolutely do not need to show my work, anymore than the group arguing for ‘a sexually permissive society in which sexual exclusivity is not assumed until mutually agreed upon’ need to show that the same isn't problematic. Social analysis is a soft science. Do you know what a soft science is? Prone to subjective interpretation, bias, etc. No matter how many pieces of evidence I were to provide, those in favor of sexual hedonism will not be convinced. This sub, and others, are a testament to th…
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 07:21 PM
4

"Ideas on sex" make up a wide spectrum. Just because someone doesn't have as conservative, views as you do, does not mean that they aren't still somewhat conservative in their views. Jumping into sex quickly =/= being in favor of multiple sexual partners simultaneously. You are essentially judging a book by its cover here. This used to be common knowledge. Hell, even in 1995, this was still a widely accepted ethic even among horny teenagers.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 07:15 PM
1

The problems are well discussed in this forum. Ad nauseum, in fact. Maybe I'll make an alternate post about that subject if I have time, as it warrants its own discussion. And I very much dispute your contention. I would definitely characterize it as a free for all clusterfuck.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 07:08 PM
2

What? If you want to fuck people after date 1 or 2, say that. Make your debauchery known so the other person can either adapt, or move on. See, i can play that game too.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 07:03 PM
1

Yeah, and let us point to this exact observation as evidence for how dating apps have utterly befucked society. Look how casually we've all just accepted this new toxic environment, and how hesitant people are to question it because 'it is what it is.' So do apps rule our lives now? Make our moral decisions for us? Apparently so, by my readings in these kinds of threads.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 07:01 PM
1

Yep. Very insightful comment.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 06:59 PM
1

Yes, and it might be that nothing short of that will actually have any impact. Hard to say. The problem isn't an easily solvable one. What I'm saying is that that doesn't mean we should just throw the whole thing on the dust heap and embrace a free-for-all cluster fuck. I'm after a discussion, more than I am providing a blueprint.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 06:57 PM
0

I'm only stating my personal limits; this does not mean that this is where the social norm limits should be set. Perhaps we'd all be better off if we re-adopted the traditional courting phase, and were even more stringent. Idk. The question isn't what am I willing to tolerate, but what's best for society. I don't know what the exact answer is, but I categorially do not think that keeping multiple sexual partners at the same time without disclosure is the answer.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 06:54 PM
2

Yeah. Or even right after the first encounter maybe. The exact appropriate moment can be debated, but it should be before things are headed in the obvious direction of relationship and/or regular sexual encounters. If I had my first sexual encounter with someone and they then told me they weren't intending on being exclusive, I can't say I'd be super upset. But it seems that to me sex is an important milestone, and after that (in an ideal world) it should be tacitly assumed that there is exclusi…
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 06:49 PM
2

If you expect things to work one way, when they clearly don't, you open yourself up to a lot of unnecessary pain and misery because your expectations are grossly misaligned with reality. Sorry but I will fight for whatever I feel is the best path, no matter what the herd around me is doing. I will do so even if it causes me misery. In this case I don't see any misery because I have learned how to navigate dating/relationships in a way that works for me, but all the same, even it it did hurt, I'd…
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 06:47 PM
2

Agreed. But even in a "diverse" environment, there will still be social norms, or, in some cases like the one being discussed here COMPETING social norms.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 06:43 PM
3

If you’re going on a first, second, and third date with one person over the span of a few weeks, it seems likely that you might have a few other first dates in that time that didn’t work out, and perhaps second or third dates with other people. Hell, the guy in question could have been the relative latecomer, so that you went on date 1 with him the same week you went on date 3 with another prospect (who turned out to be incompatible). Yes and the cuttoff isn't hard to locate - as soon as you fuc…
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 06:42 PM
3

"care" = get what I want out of them
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 06:40 PM
2

" I suppose you’re saying that people, over coffee at date #1, should mention in passing, ‘by the way, since we’ve only just met and haven’t even slept together yet, I’m going to be very frank that I’m not sexually exclusive with you at this time’ as, I guess, a disclaimer? It’s not that there’s anything inherently awful in that, but it seems like it would land extremely weirdly in a context where two people are just trying to feel out if that attraction is even there." Sorry but this is a disin…
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 06:36 PM
1

A social norm is by definition hegemonic, else it would not be a social norm. At the end of the day, one or the other of the two position will invariably take up the dominant space in society, and whatever the dominant norm is, so the social trend will be. In the case of the AITAH example, the dude's friends were pressuring him to relax on his position (eg. trying to enforce their own perceive social norm). We live in an idea marketplace, and everyone is pushing for what they think the best dire…
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 06:23 PM
1

Yes exactly. But it's not an inconsequential consideration.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 06:12 PM
1

you should assume that someone who consents to sex after a date with you is also likely to be willing to engage in sex with others. Sure, but I'm saying they SHOULD DISCLOSE if this is, in fact, their intent. And by "should," I mean this should be the standard that society adopts. In the same way the person shouldn't assume the other person is being exclusive, the polyamorous person shouldn't assume their partner is ok with them sleeping around. Given neither assumption has any solid footing in …
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 06:09 PM
2

For my part, when I consider "success" the last thing I consider is a relationship with a woman. Literally. In point of fact, I don't even view a relationship in the modern context as any kind of success at all, but moreso a Faustian bargain. This may be where our positions differ slightly. I have no desire to be "successful" with the ladies, and haven't since maybe the age of 22 or so. I have way more important shit to do as an adult with a mission, and if I'm molding myself for any reason, it …
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 06:03 PM
3

I didn’t notice at the time, but now that we’re talking about it, it was kind of nice not to have to assume that she was doing something that I’d prefer she hadn’t. Welcome to: most of human history. Only recently do we have to "worry" about what our partner may or may not be doing. In the past, the social stigma against doing those sorts of things was so strong, most opted against it. Personally, I'd take that over this cluster fuck any day. But I don't like casual sex so maybe I'm biased.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 05:58 PM
2

Of course not. Nobody is entitled to anything. The question is merely a matter of what sort of social standard makes the most sense. A certain percentage of people will always go against prevailing trends, and that is fully within their right. This is why I said the issue isn't one of objective morality. I'm merely asking: which leads to the best social outcome?
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 05:56 PM
0

You can argue what you feel should be the morally correct way for society to conduct itself, however it rarely lives up to our ideals and everyone has a different take on it. This isn't true at all. The value system I'm referring to was successful implemented on a society-wide level for thousands of years, because people saw value in it. If we don't see value in it, of course it's going to go by the wayside. But I'm asking: what do y'all think? Is there value in that more traditional way of appr…
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 05:51 PM
3

Why not? If you are going to make a "should' claim, you should be prepared to justify it. I could just as easily say: if a person is in the early stages of dating someone and wants to have multiple partners concurrently, they SHOULD disclose that fact to everyone involved. Why is your position "right," and mine "wrong?"
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 05:42 PM
1

I'm not telling women anything. To the extent that I advocate for full disclosure, I think it should apply equally to every person. "The core of the ideology of our current society is freedom in the most individualistic sense." Says who? Also, what about the freedom of the person to known if their sexual partner has other sexual partners at the same time? Does this count for anything?
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 05:39 PM
3

I get that many people these days assume this, but do you realize that this trend is VERY new, and that it is causing all kinds of social problems?
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 05:38 PM
1

I've never had a problem getting women and I've never had to put on any kind of front to be successful in the dating market, so maybe my perspective is biased. Jobs are an unfair comparison because they literally hold the key to our ability to exist. Faking it because you're essentially coerced is not the same thing as faking it to gain a relationship in my world. Maybe it is in yours. I agree though, definitely lots of sociopaths out there. For my part, my dignity and self respect is more impor…
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 05:30 PM
2

That's fantastic and all, but what I'm asking is what the default assumption should be, socially speaking? Which position is better for society, the dating market, and ultimately, for the family unit, on the whole? Do you think that your attitude leads towards better relationships and greater social cohesion, on the whole, compared to the alternative? Or is it just better for you personally?
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 05:20 PM
2

I'm not approaching this from the angle of protecting myself and/or maximizing my own advantage. I'm in a secure LTR, and have had a series of LTRs since I was 17. I'm 38 now, and if my current relationship ends, I doubt I'll ever venture out into the dating market again. I've had my fill by now. If this one fails, it's likely monk-mode until death for me. I'm looking at it in the context of a larger social issue. Is this trend, as I've described it, good for society? I don't think so. And if it…
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 05:16 PM
8

Spoken like a true sociopath. lol. Not saying you are one, but that's card-carrying ASPD sentiment right there.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 05:13 PM
3

Ok, you stated your position, but said nothing about why this is the standard we should choose as a society. Why do you think your position is preferable to the other? Do you think that yours is the healthier of the two, socially speaking? Or is it more a matter of "as long as I get mine, I don't gaf?"
/r/PurplePillDebate27/09/23 04:54 PM
You can kill a man, but you can't kill an idea.

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