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jazzmaster1992 Archive

View 1 posts and 1,166 comments by jazzmaster1992 on TheRedPill subreddit and various other subreddits related to The Red Pill community.
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35

jazzmaster1992/r/ExRedPill01/02/19 02:32 AM
Showing the 1,000 most recent of 1,166 comments.
Upvotes Comment on Subreddit Date (UTC)
2

I don't think men being selective on its own will change much. If a man is attractive and desired his sexual attention is sought after, regardless of how "freely" he gives it. A dude who is already struggling won't gain much by going MGTOW or something, that's one of the biggest Manosphere myths that really should die.
/r/PurplePillDebate26/07/26 07:23 AM
1

I don't think it's being made up, I think it's being misunderstood. I don't think the same men who judge women as whores necessarily would sleep with them regardless, nor do I think the manwhore types still want chaste virgins. For the most part, people want someone who is around the same experience level. if most men will just move on after being made to wait, then why do women make men wait? Because, more often than not, "making someone wait" is code for disinterest, or at least a lack of stro…
/r/PurplePillDebate25/07/26 08:42 PM
1

Sure, but I was going based on the OP's argument of why women try to "manipulate" men, because they think it'll somehow signal that she's a higher quality partner, but in reality most men probably don't think in this maddona/whore binary and will just move on because he thinks her waiting is a sign of disinterest.
/r/PurplePillDebate25/07/26 08:21 PM
0

I meant more-so that "waiting for sex" doesn't really make sense and is pretty pointless. If two people like each other as people and want to fuck, they might as well fuck. When I was younger, I did get told this idea by my parents that sex is something you should wait for, but ultimately the waiting and prolonging I came to find out doesn't actually do anything. People aren't lower quality for "giving it up early", and often times the right person almost "paradoxically" is the one who's really …
/r/PurplePillDebate25/07/26 08:20 PM
1

Never been into casual, always preferred LTR or marriage. But, I had to adjust my expectations because I realized that the quality of an LTR doesn't preclude sexual compatability, or wanting to have sex early on.
/r/PurplePillDebate25/07/26 07:36 PM
1

In my experience, women who want to fuck quickly and women who try to present as "LTR material" are the same ones. Women who want to fuck like rabbits early on end up being the ones who want to commit, and more importantly have a higher level of interest, especially in a sexual sense which is usually a prerequisite for a stronger relationship. Conversely - and this is a fairly unpopular opinion here - women who "want to wait" aren't that interested. Specifically, even if she's say, very religiou…
/r/PurplePillDebate25/07/26 07:20 PM
2

I know a guy who genuinely has women walk up to him and ask for his number so they can start pushing for sex or a relationship over text. There is a completely different life some men live where tons of women throw themselves at them. I've even had women show pretty overt interest in me - it's not all that common, but it's happened enough to make me raise an eyebrow when I hear that men are supposed to be the ones doing it.
/r/PurplePillDebate24/07/26 04:39 PM
1

Unfortunately, in order for there to be a connection there has to be mutual attraction. Not everyone is going to feel it for you, that's just how the game works. I've dated a lot So what you're saying is you're not actually ugly, and men do go out with you? You're losing me here. Just a reminder that this a debate sub, not a dating advice sub, so there has to be a broader topic to discuss and with respect, it sounds like you're upset that one guy rejected you, not that all men are inherently wir…
/r/PurplePillDebate23/07/26 08:42 AM
1

I'll talk to a guy and we develop a great connection, but then we meet and he's not attracted to me. Suddenly he treats me like a disease he needs to run away from. Connections are ultimately built in person, not over the internet. Chemistry is also physical - not necessarily just raw looks but how you present yourself, your body language. If you seem closed off, arms folded in, avoiding eye contact, I'll think you're not interested, bored or something else. It's also possible you're misrepresen…
/r/PurplePillDebate23/07/26 08:04 AM
8

What you're talking about barely scratches the surface of what the Red Pill actually means to so many. If you really want to get through to these guys, you have to meet them where they're at. "But all the rich and powerful men are ruining the world" doesn't actually do much to debunk Red Pill ideas because it just re-enforces the narrative that Alphas are an elite class who own and control basically everything and the rest of us just follow along. Not only that, but it doesn't really touch on wh…
/r/PurplePillDebate19/07/26 01:01 PM
3

I think it's really hard to look at yourself and evaulate yourself as objectively unattractive, no matter what the reason is or no matter how improveable it is. "Yes, your genetics/income/personality is so flawed that women are fundamentally repulsed by it" is not a conversation anyone wants to have with themselves, even if it's true and even if it's necessary. I think what people miss is that when guys "complain" about women wanting Chad, being hypergamous, that sort of thing, they aren't neces…
/r/PurplePillDebate18/07/26 09:25 PM
1

Cracking down on the kinds of discrimination related to attraction which can affect professional lives and especially the ability to gain access to better income. It might never completely go away, but it's definitely worth calling out the most extreme cases of workplace discrimination. Past that, I'm not at all suggesting we force women to date people they aren't attracted to.
/r/PurplePillDebate17/07/26 09:30 PM
3

I'm pretty sure there is something we can do about it though, especially since the implications are much farther reaching than just handsome men and pretty women getting more promotions and all the likes on dating apps.
/r/PurplePillDebate17/07/26 09:13 PM
6

Life may not be fair, but technically speaking giving preferential treatment to someone in the workplace based on looks alone is a form of discrimination. I very much see it as a problem if someone is being given more opportunities to advance their career simply because of how they look and not because of their merits and achievements.
/r/PurplePillDebate17/07/26 07:03 PM
4

I don’t get why men act like women experiencing attraction and treating guys differently based on whether they’re attractive to them is so cruel and terrible and some sort of double standard? It's fine if you don't want to fuck every adult male on planet earth. The "problem" is that what makes men conventionally attractive is oftentimes pretty inseparable from what affords them a better quality of life. The same is true for women too, obviously, that the halo effect and prettty privelege are ver…
/r/PurplePillDebate17/07/26 06:42 PM
1

Wanting someone isn't the same as asking or demanding them to be with you, let alone settle with you.
/r/PurplePillDebate17/07/26 01:35 PM
–

You're not really responding to or acknowledging the point I made from the start, which is that no individual woman should feel some obligation to date men at her "level" because society broadly has a loneliness issue. The world could be full of wonderful men with no serious flaws and there would still be women not interested in them for a variety of reasons. And historically, there have been and always will be people trying to control or coerce women's sexuality, which is why we need to move on…
/r/PurplePillDebate13/07/26 02:30 AM
–

You said it was "unreasonable" in response to me saying explicitly that it is reasonable for women to hold out for someone they really want to be with, instead of settling with some guy just because he's in the same "league" as her.
/r/PurplePillDebate12/07/26 11:47 PM
–

What I'm saying is, if a large proportion of society is having an issue with forming relationships, that's a societal issue that should be addressed. If for example the stat that says 40% of people under the age of 35 are struggling to find relationships, have sex, have kids, form families, etc then there is a major social issue at play. I mostly agree with this, but this isn't all you said. You said that it's unreasonable for women to hold out for someone they actually like and want, instead of…
/r/PurplePillDebate12/07/26 09:08 PM
3

I've had women as close friends multiple times. People usually assumed we were dating, of course, and when they found out we weren't some would try to put us together. I will say I've noticed many women will kind of disappear when they get a boyfriend though. They're allowed to do that, but "centering" the opposite sex that you don't bother to maintain platonic relationships with people seems like an issue in general, some of it being biological wiring and some of it societal expectations for co…
/r/PurplePillDebate12/07/26 08:15 PM
3

You kinda got us here. I've been accused by other guys of being gay for having close guy friends. And it's not like I'm doing any kind of PDA, sleeping in the same bed with them etc. It's just "oh these two guys travelled to a city together on a vacationbto split costs, they must be gay". And it's been really funny, if not slightly awkward, to have to inform people who were so sure of my homosexuality that they were wrong. But I think it's also a symptom of how messaging for people I general is …
/r/PurplePillDebate12/07/26 08:11 PM
6

It's not inherently unreasonable, whether your standards are "realistic" or not. Even if a given woman wants 6/6/6 and absolutely, positively wouldn't be happy with anything else, that's her right to choose. There are enough women willing to date, marry and have sex with average or even less conventionally attractive men that the social media outliers who only want Chad can't really be blamed for a societal decline in relationships. Hell, if anything, the fact that people can choose instead of b…
/r/PurplePillDebate12/07/26 07:06 PM
19

If I or someone else "eliminates" a person it's not because I think I'm better than them, that I should do better, that they're below me. Maybe the attraction isn't there, or maybe we aren't compatible. I don't entertain women I'm not feeling it with even if they're good looking and probably good partners because I don't think it's fair of me to waste their time because I'm "supposed" to date them when my heart isn't in it. If I'm the other side of it, while it's not fun being rejected, I don't …
/r/PurplePillDebate12/07/26 12:42 PM
24

Women are constantly complimented, including the average ones and thus they created in their head this impression that they deserve the best of the best men out there. Eh, I think many women are discerning and experienced enough to know which compliments are actually valid - i.e. a genuine one or a Nice Guy trying to get laid. I also don't think many women are actually that delusional, it's just that they tend to be pickier and more selective, which is fine. I don't think the goal for anyone, ma…
/r/PurplePillDebate12/07/26 10:31 AM
13

I think the argument that "the Internet isn't real life" lost a ton of weight once COVID mandates forced everyone online. A lot of younger folks especially had many of their formative years basically robbed by pandemic stay-at-home mandates, where they got so much socializing done online instead of "IRL". This also means more people potentially missed critical social milestones, or at least had their life trajectory changed forever by being told, for a few years time, that being stuck behind a s…
/r/PurplePillDebate11/07/26 02:11 AM
–

Bachelor can be coded and understood different ways. It can be a guy who's decently attractive that chooses not to settle, or the guy who isn't really dating but doesn't have many options either.
/r/PurplePillDebate11/07/26 01:59 AM
2

This might sound weird to say, but I appreciate what you're willing to do for these guys. This is probably the most wholesome sex work adjacent job description I'll ever read. It makes a difference and is overall a net positive.
/r/PurplePillDebate29/06/26 09:37 PM
1

Clients?
/r/PurplePillDebate29/06/26 06:47 PM
1

Well, life isn't fair. I don't mean that to be a jerk, but ultimately it's not really up to us if we fall in love or find the right companionship. Hell, it's not even about deserving it. Yes, it's great for your life to have people who love and care about you, but other people loving you is a decision they make, not you. That's why it's hard to make a case for why women should give men a chance etc....if she's not feeling it, the relationship isn't going to work out anyways.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/06/26 01:18 AM
2

Sure, but from a pure survival standpoint a living person doesn't "need" romance or sex. You can work from home, door dash your meals and have everything else delivered. You can interact with people less than ever and still technically be alive, breathing and nourished. Is it an ideal way to live? No, and this is why I put "requirement" in quotes above. It's not technically necessary but it sure as shit makes life harder and miserable when you have nobody, not even close friends or family.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/06/26 10:00 AM
0

Except the context where approaching in any of those settings is reasonable and acceptable. i.e., she gives signals or some circumstance led to you talking and sparks started to fly, by pure coincidence.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/06/26 01:41 AM
4

What do you want women to do? I’ve seen be understanding, which is all fine and good, but it doesn’t change anything which is why I give the advice I do about changing yourself. I don't really want women to "do" anything so maybe this question isn't directed at me specifically. Yeah it's great when I'm wanted and desired, but obviously that can't be forced. The question of what men want in a relationship is a little tricky, because yes we generally want someone who loves, appreciates and desires…
/r/PurplePillDebate26/06/26 10:28 PM
26

So I am genuinely asking. Without being condescending, without feeling sorry for yourselves, what are you as men wanting to happen, since you won't better yourself, aren't happy and choose not to be happy single, what is it that you think will fix it? A little strange to ask a question like this when you have to pre-empt it with such disdain and cynicsm. So basically saying you want me to agree that women should date people they're not attracted to and give in to men and date the first one that …
/r/PurplePillDebate26/06/26 10:07 PM
4

> That's just something made up I don't think it really is. You have to remember that men are typically larger and more imposing than women. Even if you don't think you're cornering her, just towering over here in the canned soup aisle where nobody else is around could cause her to feel unsafe or at least wary, especially considering how often women do get harassed and assaulted.
/r/PurplePillDebate26/06/26 08:15 PM
5

If the guy in question isn't an exclusive boyfriend or husband, it's not truly having someone. I've met so many people in relationships that were undefined and when I asked them why, they said it's because they "don't need the pressure of labels". The reality just about every time was that one or both of them wasn't sure enough to fully commit. If the commitment was there, the label wouldn't carry enough weight to conveninetly "not matter" but also strategically never get used. Hell, most relati…
/r/PurplePillDebate26/06/26 03:25 PM
4

Context matters. At any of these given places you could make small talk, completely removed from any sexual or romantic tension. It could escalate further, if it's supposed to, organically, It doesn't have to and that shouldn't necessarily be the "goal", but it's possible. This is why some might say getting a girlfriend isn't really a realistic goal, because the idea of strategically forming a relationship isn't really possible. Even if you are relatively good looking, sociable and not waving as…
/r/PurplePillDebate26/06/26 03:15 PM
3

In fact they’re doing much better than the “respectful” men. I put respectful in quotes because the men that don’t approach aren’t actually respectful, they’re just scared. But now they’re realizing that too. Just because a man doesn't approach doesn't mean he's not being respectful. Especially if his understanding of respectful is something like “The women at the club are here to play sports. They do not exist for your pleasure so you have no right to ask them out.” Also I'd push back a bit on …
/r/PurplePillDebate26/06/26 03:09 PM
4

It’s just lots of men dont listen and think those women are awesome just because they’re hot and/or ‘slutty’. Again, it needs to be said that just because a man likes a woman you don't like doesn't "prove" that the woman he likes is low quality and just slutty and so on. Without knowing the full context or understanding of what even makes a woman low quality, I can't really trust that your definition of low quality is perfectly reasonable, let alone something I or other men should pay attention …
/r/PurplePillDebate26/06/26 02:54 PM
6

This is also why the “women love assholes” argument is so annoying. Men will point to women dating assholes or dangerous men and act like that proves women do not care about good men. This coming right after your insistence that men are all low quality who love shallow bitches because they're hot. I also feel like it's worth pointing out that just because one women or even multiple women label another woman is low quality doesn't make it true. I've walked in on someone calling a girl a bitch, sl…
/r/PurplePillDebate26/06/26 02:44 PM
4

One thing worth mentioning is just becuase she's "talking to" somebody doesn't necessarily mean she truly has someone. Guys tend to be more forward and initiative with women - as we are told and expected to be - so having a girl's number, snapchat, insta etc. and "talking" to her is kind of the expectation. And it wasn't that uncommon for the young woman a given guy was talking to wasn't really that interested, she barely knew him, maybe they went on one date etc....point being, just because peo…
/r/PurplePillDebate26/06/26 02:31 PM
10

If you live in the US where like 2/3 of adults are overweight, it's unlikely that the true average is considered cute.
/r/PurplePillDebate26/06/26 02:25 PM
4

I mean genuinely good guys, who have principles, who have inner moral compass and will to actually act on it. Just want to know how you see this. Okay, so this is going to come across as the boring, generic, copout answer but ultimately we can't even begin to answer your question without defining what principles are "good". Otherwise most people are going to say that they have principles and an inner moral compass and they'd all be technically correct in a sense. It doesn't matter if your princi…
/r/PurplePillDebate19/06/26 12:12 PM
1

I mean, it's always possible to pay for it where it's legal.
/r/PurplePillDebate14/06/26 07:35 PM
2

That's fair, initially it sounded like she just avoided them altogether which read like an avoidant attachment style or something. I can't really comment on or reassure that there aren't shitty boyfriends out there otherwise. From what I hear, these complaints are pretty common, and while some women find a decent guy, many give up on trying.
/r/PurplePillDebate14/06/26 03:54 PM
0

I mean this in the most respectful way possible, but seeing relationships with men as basically adversarial and having no desire for sex and relationships isn't exactly normal. It could be any number of reasons why, and they should of course be respected, but having this attitude of "I don't ever want to have a boyfriend or be married" isn't exactly that common for a woman, despite what it seems like on this sub or Reddit in general.
/r/PurplePillDebate14/06/26 03:35 PM
8

This topic has always been tough for me because in a somewhat practical, rational sense, I do have to approach if I want to exercise agency and take chances on people I'm interested in. Risking rejection is part of adult human life and should be encouraged at times instead of avoided. This is the same for men or women - you miss the shots you don't take. It's any given individual'a responsibility to take care of their own happiness by going after what they want. What I don't like is the framing …
/r/PurplePillDebate14/06/26 12:14 PM
–

Being "decent" isn't binary because you can be rude and nasty to one person (or they can simply perceive you as such) and be the kindest person to the next, even without really thinking you actively contributed to either perception. I never once made excuses for the balloon popping guy. There are tons of people out there however who think it's "morally correct" to discriminate against non cishet folks. They're completely vindicated in their beliefs and think they're good people for doing so, and…
/r/PurplePillDebate12/06/26 11:43 PM
1

Men aren't always blaming women, though. They're simply pointing out that the other guys, the ones who get women, are doing so because they have traits that women are largely attracted to, regardless of his flaws. At that point it's not really up to men or even women to decide that all the people who are attracted to people you don't like or care for are "shitty people", the way you love doing on this subreddit. Especially if you're not willing to critically exam what it is you think constitutes…
/r/PurplePillDebate12/06/26 07:48 PM
24

A lot of us don't care about each other nearly enough. Just as friends or as "brothers". Bro code is mostly dead and too many dudes will readily betray you to get their dick wet or make another buck. All the stuff Manosphere guys complain about isn't just true of women, it's also true of men, especially when it comes to judging your income, the car you drive, your height and hairline, and telling you to "man up".
/r/PurplePillDebate12/06/26 05:22 PM
1

You're suggesting that being a "decent person" is binary and not really up to interpretation when it clearly is. I've met countless folks who, despite having personalities that turn me and others off, clearly think they've done nothing wrong and the people they surround themselves with would agree. I could also come on Reddit and complain that they just need to do the work to be certified Decent Humans, of which I've already curiously self-appointed myself, but I genuinely cringe at how arrogant…
/r/PurplePillDebate12/06/26 05:11 PM
2

Just because you've surrounded yourself with people who like your company doesn't mean you are universally liked. This is the issue I have with your advice. No man or woman can make themselves so "decent" that they never hurt, upset or frustrate anyone, even the so-called people pleasers. You're trying to minimize how complicated it is to actually navigate the world and human relationships by just being a "decent person" when that's not only not sufficient, it's also incomplete and misleading ad…
/r/PurplePillDebate12/06/26 04:13 PM
3

Hate to break it to you, but almost everyone thinks of themselves as "decent humans". Whether or not it's actually true is going to be judged differently depending on any given other person's perspective, so saying online that you're a good person and everyone around you is good is effectively meaningless. Just like we get told "guys who say they're so nice, aren't actually nice", I myself am a little wary of self-described "decent people" who also only ever associate with other "decent people" …
/r/PurplePillDebate12/06/26 03:49 PM
3

People have its just alot of men dont wanna listen and want to play dumb. Nobody's playing dumb. There's too much disagreement over the nuance of what truly makes a good or even nice person. It's not as obvious as say, just be agreeable, especially if others might think there's times it's actually more reasonable to act like an asshole in response to people or situations that warrant it. This is what I mean by playing dumb. Did it ever occur to you that....WOMEN ARE PEOPLE. And NOT a monolith? I…
/r/PurplePillDebate12/06/26 03:37 PM
7

I think we really need to define what it means to even have a good personality or a bad one. Because some of the women in my life have said they don't really like nice guys. Not "Nice Guys", but agreeable people who aren't that offensive. Some women will straight up say they like guys who have a bit of an edge, or an ego, or even act selfish and arrogant. Obligatory not all women, but there's enough to make us question whether it's even good advice to simply not be "selfish and nasty", when you …
/r/PurplePillDebate12/06/26 02:11 PM
3

I never really cared for this framing because people in general want to be desired and sought after. It's not unique to women at all.
/r/PurplePillDebate10/06/26 11:33 PM
4

People don't want to identify with red and especially black pill talking points directly, because of what those associations suggest. They will agree with many of them, depending on how they are framed. That's why the Manosphere is what it is now.
/r/PurplePillDebate10/06/26 12:45 AM
4

I think "different men" tend to concentrate a few key traits toward the top, that's the thing. And no guy wants to be the second rate beta she settled for.
/r/PurplePillDebate07/06/26 10:13 AM
2

tall and masculine don't go hand in hand But they do. They absolutely do. From a societal perspective masculinity is tied to strength, size and dominance. It's much easier to be those things when you're tall. It's not just a "red pill obsession". Most straight women are not attracted to feminine men The issue isn't really with feminine men. It's men who don't perform masculinity. You can be a guy who's not feminine but also not very masculine. A guy who's just kind of "there" and doesn't really …
/r/PurplePillDebate07/06/26 10:11 AM
6

This still isn't proof it is the same woman though. Men are looking at Chads and seeing some women throw themselves at him, correct? They aren't always throwing themselves at him literally. They do talk about how attractive he is. I've witnessed multiple times what happens when a certain guy enters a given room and women notice him in a way they don't notice most men. Then, you meet a woman and go on a few dates. She prefers to wait with all men. But because different women throw themselves at C…
/r/PurplePillDebate06/06/26 09:03 PM
6

There must be a disconnect then. When men say they notice being treated differently, what they mean is some other guy didn't have to "work" as hard to move the relationship forward. And women on this sub think what this means is that men only want a quick fuck, but the reality is we notice that women consistently want to sleep with men they're attracted to quickly, so them wanting to wait is often a sign she's not that interested. Usually morons and not someone any man should care about anyways …
/r/PurplePillDebate06/06/26 07:11 PM
6

If it's true that women don't say that, then why do women come on this very sub to tell guys that we should expect to be treated worse or lesser if we aren't a Chad? I don't mean to defend the red pill in its entirety. I just noticed that there are some sensible things intermingled with the baggage and resentment, which while it's available elsehwre, the advice elsewhere comes with its own flaws and limitations.
/r/PurplePillDebate06/06/26 04:47 PM
6

women can do that So why do the overwhelming majority prefer not to? They figured out the nuance Yeah, many of us figured it out through rejection and some emotional pain. It's not really as "obvious" until you realize your girlfriend or wife is losing interest and attraction because you got too boring and stable. Which again, isn't really aligned with the "blue pill" wisdom that consistency and stability is above all else in long term partnership. Only stupid women find confident men attractive…
/r/PurplePillDebate06/06/26 11:45 AM
10

And that's stupidly ignorant of them, because alot of it has more to do with if they're likable and understand how humans work. The redpill caters to men who are neither. Again, you're doing the classic BP trope of "just be a nice guy and women will like you bro" when it's not that simple. Guys get "red pilled" because they hear this, then get whiplash when they realize women had a whole other set of expectations for a male partner - like that he "leads" by asking her out first, planning and pay…
/r/PurplePillDebate06/06/26 11:16 AM
10

For example, the most common "red pill moment" I heard is that "No one told me when women lists what they want in a guy, they added in he has to be attractive to her!" What I see with Red Pill is the idea that a man's attractiveness is predicated on his ability to perform masculinity, in a way that's somewhat subtle yet consistent and noticeable. And for many guys this can involve a lot of serious work, including moving past pre-conceived notions or incomplete ideas about what makes a woman inte…
/r/PurplePillDebate06/06/26 11:03 AM
10

why do you think women don’t “want” an average man on par with their looks? Though it's largely on places like Reddit and other social media, you can find a myriad comments detailing how most men aren't shit even though the bar is already in hell or something. I don't generally believe people who claim they have lower or even "average" standards because I think most of us tend to be picky in ways that don't necessarily mean "only dates Chad or Stacy", but can still filter out a significant numbe…
/r/PurplePillDebate06/06/26 09:51 AM
13

Note: I already know a common reply will be, "She has to treat me as well as she has treated that one top guy. She let him do everything! He could treat her however he wanted! So, the only issue is if I get less." But sir, you're not that top guy, and if you were, you probably wouldn't be invested in that average woman either (according to the RP logic). Shit like this is why people say you're not supposed to ask about people's relationship history when you're on dates. It's the kind of stuff th…
/r/PurplePillDebate06/06/26 09:44 AM
4

Emotional vulnerability needs to be contextualized for it to even be understood. I've had experiences with women wanting me to "man up", but even in different relationships those contexts were different. What it usually means in the discussion about giving women the ick, is seeming insecure, which is broadly accepted as a turnoff in the early stages of dating. But being vulnerable doesn't have to mean demonstrating weakness, it just means demonstrating a side of yourself that won't necessarily b…
/r/PurplePillDebate06/06/26 12:07 AM
6

The average man doesn't die alone and receive zero sexual or romantic interest. What you're describing isn't just "below average", it's virtually non-existent. It gets over-represented online, especially in subreddits like this one. But virtually everyone I know from age 20to 60+ is in or has been in a relationship, with older ones likely being married and even having kids. The types of guys who go their entire lives without ever being in a relationship are typically neuro-divergent, or in more …
/r/PurplePillDebate05/06/26 06:07 PM
3

Ok so we are just making assumptions now. I am not a part of any "sex positive" community or movement outside of not wanting to shame people for their own individual desires. Ironically, your language and tone around the subject is usually what causes people to feel shame and develop this "Madonna/Whore" complex. You're the one saying sex is bad and something to be ashamed of, and maybe you're the one who needs to be more honest about that instead of everyone else admitting falsely to what you'r…
/r/PurplePillDebate05/06/26 05:53 PM
4

Intimacy isn't a loaded word and it's not meant to hide anything. Most people know what it means in the context of a relationship. For better or worse, the expectation for many is that sexual intimacy is an integral part of a romantic relationship. Much of this is cultural upbringing and societal expectations. Other times it's down to the individuals and at least one person making sex a "condition" of being exclusive and in a real relationship. Others still just don't know what they want. I don'…
/r/PurplePillDebate05/06/26 05:18 PM
2

Nothing about it is "hiding". Nobody is trying to hide that they enjoy sex with a romantic partner, or even sex in general. This question got ignored It sounds like you come from an incredibly niche background where celibacy is celebrated, either for religious or asexual or other reasons. This question is "ignored" because it doesn't speak to any significant base of the population. This is about people constantly getting fucked. I have zero idea what led you to this conclusion. Like others have …
/r/PurplePillDebate05/06/26 05:02 PM
3

Sex is a part of intimacy. For some it's one of the highest forms of intimacy. Including the ones who barely have sex Oh, I know the types who barely have sex. Talking serious dead bedrooms, baby mama and baby daddy drama, on and off relationships and so on. They definitely aren't happy and probably wish they could have that intimacy, the issue is that experiencing sex as "intimacy" is not really something people get to just turn on and off at will.
/r/PurplePillDebate05/06/26 04:43 PM
5

they have to hide their love for sex under cutesy flowery language about "intimacy", "compatibility", and "a love full of passion". There is no hiding of anything here. Many people enjoy sex, under the context of it being with someone they're in love with. Many would say that sex for its own sake is meaningless and even somewhat upsetting when the context of romantic intimacy is removed. Wanting to enjoy sex doesn't preclude it being with someone you're in love with or at least care about.
/r/PurplePillDebate05/06/26 04:27 PM
–

The usual insults for men women aren't interested in: short, brokie, incel, tiny penis/compensating, and so on.
/r/PurplePillDebate03/06/26 08:45 AM
–

I think the point of the bald sub is to come to terms with hair loss, to the point you embrace it. Same can be said for short, to a lesser degree. When you start doing things to hide or "fix" inalienable physical traits, you're acknowledging that society sees them as bad or lesser and that's why it's controversial. Of all things for men to be insecure about that's out of their control, balding and height are definitely up there. So it can hit a nerve when other guys are basically affirming that …
/r/PurplePillDebate03/06/26 07:45 AM
–

Since you guys seem highly obsessed with pretty privilege and not the other traits that don’t require genetics or money to get. Eh, a lot of privelege for guys is based on something completely out of our control, and the elective surgery involves shattering our legs so we can re-grow the bones in order to be taller, which involves months or even years of limitations on how we use them. We did just have a sitting congresswoman (AOC) come out and say that her political opponent is "like 4' 10"" as…
/r/PurplePillDebate30/05/26 07:33 PM
2

Realistically, while I like the idea of someone being attracted to any life I've built for myself, I don't see that as a means to an end. I have to get up every day and work, provide for and take care of myself as a single man because I can't realistically expect anyone else to do it.
/r/PurplePillDebate29/05/26 07:54 PM
28

Ah yes, as men, our options are 1.) charismatic class clown 2.) incredibly focused and disciplined gym bro 3.) well read and high earning potential 4.) spontaneous bad boy. Such "easy" things to be, truly, that's why all of us are doing them.
/r/PurplePillDebate25/05/26 04:40 PM
1

Now, I'm not talking about the stereotypical sweet nerd with autism, because this is where being quiet and humble works. Setting aside whether you mean truly autistic guys or guys with genuine autism-spectrum disorder, like most things it works for mostly handsome men, or with women who are also neuro-atypical (and even then it's a challenge). Many neurotypical cishet women still largely expect men to perform masculinity (the so-called "bare mininum") and this includes having a requisite level o…
/r/PurplePillDebate25/05/26 03:12 PM
1

I agree 100% that nobody should be forced to be something they aren't and don't wish to be. I do think there is potentially a surplus of men who wouldn't mind being submissive (or at least, more passive) compared to women who don't mind being more dominant. Those are the traditional gender roles for a reason. And it's why I think it's part of why men insist on the dominant man/submissive women dynamic, it feels like the "natural" and socially established/enforced dynamic, whether or not it's wha…
/r/PurplePillDebate24/05/26 12:33 PM
1

What do you think then of women who say that they prefer to be feminine/submissive and want a man who is masculine/dominant?
/r/PurplePillDebate24/05/26 12:09 PM
2

because they also wish they could hurt women I always thought the "Chad is bad" thing was just another take on the age-old trope of "those other guys are abusive womanizers, unlike me, a Nice Guy". But now that you mention it, many times they are one in the same (nice guys being jerks and wanting to hurt women, that is).
/r/PurplePillDebate24/05/26 11:43 AM
3

Men's love is based on possessiveness, they see women as this cute possession that they own. Some men do, sure. Hence the whole "she's not yours, it's just your turn" truism the Manosphere likes to throw around. But I think there is another side to this, where men feel a sense of dread that they can't hope to ever meet someone's standards enough that she doesn't get a wandering eye. It's not necessarily about controlling the woman; sometimes, it's the worry that you're not really good enough in …
/r/PurplePillDebate24/05/26 10:56 AM
1

If it wasn't a moral failure, it wouldn't essentially be the go-to insult for men whenever they do something bad.
/r/PurplePillDebate24/05/26 10:37 AM
2

Again, if men can’t be picky or else they’ll be left with nothing, then it would be more reasonable that they would be more relationship oriented because far more women prefer relationships. Okay, except most women still want the guy she's dating seriously to be a good sexual partner. That includes her finding him sexually attractive. Your framing is odd to me because it suggests that men should just accept being a beta-bucks who gets settled for, and not holding out for women who see them as se…
/r/PurplePillDebate24/05/26 10:27 AM
–

All a woman has to be is skinny and white and she will automatically be hot to most men. It might seem "overrated" just like men say height is overrated, but ultimately what makes someone desirable to a group isn't up to them. Attraction is not a choice. Whether or not the woman or man in question doesn't seem that hot to a given person is irrelevant, if the pervasive narrative is that they're desired to most.
/r/PurplePillDebate23/05/26 08:12 PM
–

This depends on what "average" means. In the US for example, the truly average woman is middle aged, in some kind of debt, likely overweight and has a kid or two. If you're thinking "average" for Gen Z alone I think this still gets skewed because men I see still call thin, pretty women "average" or "girl next door" when in reality those women are actually pretty attractive and desired by most Gen Z men and probably even men in general. This is also readily apparent when people will call a 7/10 o…
/r/PurplePillDebate23/05/26 08:05 PM
2

I don't actually disagree with you that much, just so we are clear. The world most certainly is not just and fair. I can also however sort of see how the messaging around inceldom as a moral failure can translate into "sex is what happens when you're a good person". Especially when guys get told things like "women don't want to fuck you because you're sexist", as it heavily implies that sexism alone causes women to avoid men when they demonstrably isn't the case. I know the above take about sexi…
/r/PurplePillDebate23/05/26 07:38 PM
3

I see why you dislike the framing but there's another reason men see it as a "reward", it's the whole incel/virgin shaming thing. Men are basically told since adolescence that being unable to attract any women sexually is a personal and moral failure. The fact that they aren't having sex or haven't ever is equated to them being a bad person who doesn't deserve it, which means the corollary is being a good person who does deserve it, aka they earned it by doing the "right" things. We know that be…
/r/PurplePillDebate23/05/26 04:44 PM
2

> ((Sidenote: This is about countries where misogyny is widely unacceptable and feminism has a strong influence on the culture. If a society sees misogyny as the norm, that’s different.)) Not being cheeky here, I genuinely want to know which countries these are.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/05/26 12:34 PM
7

There's definitely a "cat's out of the bag" situation and I'm unsure how much it effects existing relationships, and how much it matters. Personally, it feels easier and better to just abstain from a relationship than be with someone who secretly wishes I was a little taller, or I wish she weighed a little less, shit like that. Maybe others make it work, but I'd rather be alone than either settle or be settled for. I do believe true love and long-term commitment is possible for many without all …
/r/PurplePillDebate22/05/26 12:44 AM
8

"Be beautiful" and "make money" are contested and controversial because they start flirting with the concept of the male burden of performance. Just like women say they don't like being seen as disposable warm wet holes, men don't all necessarily feeling like the only reason somebody is there is because he was taller than her and had a nice job. By all means, have your standards and don't feel forced to date somebody you're not attracted to, but I think with the internet at least people lost a l…
/r/PurplePillDebate21/05/26 10:55 PM
16

Big caveat: this is mostly true only if she's attractive. Clumsy awkward goth mommy gf = cocky want boing-boing, sure. But I suspect the same is not true for an overweight, middle-aged single mother.
/r/PurplePillDebate20/05/26 08:41 AM
3

No to both.
/r/PurplePillDebate16/05/26 12:03 AM
7

The only real place I've seen this contested is very far left circles where the entire concept of gender is challenged. Everywhere else you pretty much have to confirm to "heteronormativity", lower your standards or die alone. This goes for men and women both, and for many it can be painful, but ultimately most of them wouldn't want to date a gender non-conforming type because it would mean they don't adhere to conventional attractiveness standards.
/r/PurplePillDebate15/05/26 09:44 PM
0

If it's true enough that virtually all women especially the ones on this sub agree with it, it's true enough for me.
/r/PurplePillDebate09/05/26 09:01 PM
9

you severely over estimate the amount of men who have that level of sway I mean, I'm saying this as a really short guy who's had certain women throw pretty unambiguous "fuck me" signals my way. Wait too long Could be a week, or even just a few days. The timeline is irrelevant when she's the one setting the window, not me. Again, point being that I don't get to choose to take it slow and get to know you, because you already have a timer going that runs out if I don't ask you out and try to sleep …
/r/PurplePillDebate09/05/26 03:40 PM
-1

A lot of women I see talk about this don't frame it this way though. They frame it as "I'm tired when I come home from working my girlboss job and I want a man to take care of me and make decisions since I already do that all day". And it feels "unequal" then because I also have to work a job where I make decisions and tire myself out, and it seems unreasonable that I'm forced to carry the weight of a relationship because somebody else just doesn't want to. I don't think it's unreasonable for so…
/r/PurplePillDebate09/05/26 03:35 PM
15

I think it's really telling that the pressure is always on men to initiate. That's my main point here. Nobody is telling women that just sitting around waiting for a guy is bad advice - because ultimately that's what they do and it works, so long as the expectation continues to be on men to perform. We can talk about the virtue of hard work and taking care of yourself, but ultimately this advice is aimed at men more so than women, as it's generally understood that women can reasonably expect men…
/r/PurplePillDebate09/05/26 03:03 PM
19

you're pursuing very horny women Ironically, one of the "red pills" for me is that many women have the capacity to be horny as fuck for the right guy, but it's somewhat predicated on you striking while the iron is hot. Wait too long and she gets cold/bored and moves on to a guy that, on the surface, just wants sum fuk. There are women who are really pure about sex and like to wait, but they tend to be conservative and by proxy still expect the man to take the lead.
/r/PurplePillDebate09/05/26 01:52 PM
54

I've been told since a young age by most men and women, that men approach first, ask out first, pay on the first date, open the car door so she can get in, all the fixings. And there's been absolutely no hesitation for women on this very sub to come out and remind us men that if we aren't the ones taking initiative, we are probably going to die alone. I actually do love the idea of being compatible with a woman, but I've noticed in the past that if I'm not actively trying to escalate physically,…
/r/PurplePillDebate09/05/26 11:16 AM
10

If i want something i have to work for it. Nobody cares about me enough to simply give me what i want (and i already hear whining of men that men are literally throw themselves at me, but that's not that i want, i want specific things so i work to get them). I mean, you're basically enforcing this idea that relationships are a "reward" for doing the right thing, but I don't really think that's exactly true. Unfortunately, there's no real way to put in the "work" to get a relationship. This is re…
/r/PurplePillDebate09/05/26 10:58 AM
17

OP already addresses this in their last paragraph. If a woman finds you attractive and if she has any sense of agency, she will make her attraction to you known in one way or another, no matter how subtle. So chasing women and trying to impress them and so on is a waste of time, and it actually doesn't do men any favours as a collective in the dating world. And the trick here is that I don't think the pressure guys feel to "perform" when they're trying to court or seduce somebody is entirely sel…
/r/PurplePillDebate09/05/26 10:44 AM
–

Having a romantic partner is great if they're a good fit. It's absolutely fucking miserable if they aren't. For all the potential that a relationship of quality has, there is another side to this where you get dead bedrooms, partners that feel like roommates, only staying for the kids, or straight up toxic or even abusive dynamics. I too would love a quality relationship, but the problem is that this is much harder to find. I don't just want "a" girlfriend or "a" wife, I want the right person fo…
/r/PurplePillDebate08/05/26 01:30 AM
2

Without having any real context or understanding of your relationship, all I can do is speak from the experience of myself and men I've known. And from that experience, what happens is you get into a dead bedroom or otherwise really inert relationship pattern where sexual chemistry and love is in such a dire state, that the only thing keeping you there is some rationalized belief that you're supposed to stick it out with someone no matter what. I personally remember being sort of pulled into bre…
/r/PurplePillDebate28/04/26 12:12 AM
6

Guys here are going to say that only guys with options cheat (aka Chad). It's not necessarily just Chad, you see less attractive guys with less attractive women and they still cheat, even if it's with other unattractive people.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/04/26 12:03 AM
1

Talking doesn't mean much either. If a woman smiles and talks to me I assume she's being nice. It would take more than that for me to take the hint.
/r/PurplePillDebate13/04/26 02:33 PM
3

My disagreement is with your concept of shallowness. I think you have an understandably negative bias toward the concept, whereas I view it more neutrally. Just because someone is shallow in some regards doesn't mean they're bad people somehow. Especially not in dating, where people are free to have whatever preferences they want.
/r/PurplePillDebate12/04/26 10:56 PM
2

My bit about height wasn't really meant to contradict that. I'm just adding that loads of women can and do filter for height. I don't think women only like shitty guys who are tall, but that doesn't change that height matters, looks matter, all the shallow, superficial stuff matters, even someone cares about chemistry and compatibility too.
/r/PurplePillDebate12/04/26 09:53 PM
2

Please explain what your second paragraph is supposed to get across that you think I missed.
/r/PurplePillDebate12/04/26 08:40 PM
5

So? It most men want a woman with big titties, a fat ass, a small waist, and forever looks 20. So? Well, that's kind of the point. People want to date attractive people, simple as. For some reason it strikes a nerve when people bring it up in certain contexts. If I'm saying women like tall guys as a generality, I'm not saying they are horrible people who only care about height, just that height filters have proven to us that most women do not want to be with guys below a certain height. I'd argu…
/r/PurplePillDebate12/04/26 08:29 PM
6

But red pill acts like only millionaires or higher are attractive. It felt kind of inherent in your premise. I don't believe I've ever seen RP say only millionaires are attractive. I mean sure, a guy with lots of resources as they put it will get interest in women, but RP as I recall talks a lot about the "beta bucks" trap of guys being used by women who want to settle down with a nice guy who offers stability, but not necessarily sexual excitement. I don't even think that's true of many women e…
/r/PurplePillDebate12/04/26 07:56 PM
6

I find it a little telling that you're omitting what makes men physically attractive. Gainful employment won't matter much if she doesn't like your face or your body.
/r/PurplePillDebate12/04/26 07:43 PM
8

For example, everyone knows there are women out there who would they absolute scum just because she found him hot or he’s rich. The issue is when people act as if hot rich people aren't inherently more desiriable than less good looking and less financially stable people. The "shallow" aspect of dating, as highly contested as it is, doesn't really seem to be reliable disproven. Us men for example, just know deep down that an huge majority of women like guys who are tall. It doesn't mean women won…
/r/PurplePillDebate12/04/26 07:04 PM
5

Smiling and prolonged eye contact don't mean much out of context. On the surface that indicates friendliness but not necessarily romantic interest. I wouldn't feel like a woman was inviting me to make a move based on smiles and eye contact alone.
/r/PurplePillDebate12/04/26 06:43 PM
–

I see kind of the opposite. Red and black pill adjacent stuff floats to the top and is met with tons of agreement. My theory on why this is: the concept of "pills" is mostly relegated to guys who find themselves in the online Manosphere talking about these very things, so they attach an identity to it. And that means they're more likely to seek out subreddits that offer them a place to present and discuss those world views, which would be this exact one.
/r/PurplePillDebate07/04/26 12:48 AM
–

It's not really the structure of dating though, it's the structure of everything. It may disproportionally affect men if say, third spaces disappear and you only have dating apps left to mingle, but that's not because women strictly have higher standards or something. It's harder to date in large part because it's hard to get in front of the right people to begin with. What the Manosphere is doing is causing men to become extremely self conscious about their appearance. It gathers up all the con…
/r/PurplePillDebate21/03/26 12:38 AM
42

conservative women praise you for breaking gender norms Lolwut? Still work part time I thought the conservative and tradwife thing meant traditional dating standards, aka the guy is the breadwinner and adheres to traditional masculine roles overall? Is my understanding of "conservative" really this off now?
/r/PurplePillDebate20/03/26 08:04 PM
–

Depends on what the "trouble" is. If the trouble is your relationships always fail, that's part of life for many, and there's opportunities to do better. It also means you can attract people and start relationships so not all hope is lost. If you can't get dates at all, you troubleshoot and figure out why that is. It could be a lack of intentional effort, not knowing how to socialize or flirt, or finding it hard to "close" when you're talking to someone. It could also be that deep down there's s…
/r/PurplePillDebate14/03/26 01:37 PM
2

You're probably right, and I think the lack of interest in pursuing or being seen has less to do with some issues with wanting to be attractive or be attracted to someone else, and mor about being burned out when things didn't work out before. It's one thing to want to have someone who's nice to look at, and also look nice for them. It's another when you feel like you can't relax around someone because you risk them no longer liking or caring about you. I do think this anxiety over relationship …
/r/PurplePillDebate09/03/26 01:11 AM
3

What I see is everyone has different "tiers" in which this is a problem. For some people they're in and out of relationships constantly, never spoiled for choice or single long, but nothing ever sticks around. For others it's a pure struggle to actually find anyone in the first place. More conventionally attractive people deal with the former, and less attractive people the latter. The pill discussions and this subreddit often has people talking over each other because they come from different p…
/r/PurplePillDebate09/03/26 12:59 AM
4

It hits some people harder than others. The anxiety around finding and keeping a steady relationship is very real for some.
/r/PurplePillDebate09/03/26 12:49 AM
12

The point of Red Pill Awareness IMO is realizing that being attractive and desirable is the single most important thing that's going to determine sexual success and relationship outcomes. The "Blue Pill" in this case is simply that being a good, nice guy who respects women is what makes you attractive to them. The reality is that being attractive to someone involves having qualities that don't really have anything to do with being a "good" person. I've said it before, but I honestly believe rela…
/r/PurplePillDebate09/03/26 12:26 AM
3

I can already imagine how this thread will go. Answers that affirm red pill beliefs that women only choose the top X% of men get boosted to the top via confirmation bias. More nuanced or less cynical comments get ignored or downvoted.
/r/PurplePillDebate08/03/26 03:41 PM
37

Dude, it's not that serious. If a guy doesn't want to date a single mom, so be it, but let's not act like every man out here is some amazing prize. Most guys don't have the sexual capital to endlessly hook up with young hot 20 year olds themselves. If you're a man and you don't want to date someone, just politely reject people you're not interested in and move on with your life.
/r/PurplePillDebate05/03/26 01:13 AM
1

Sure, people can and do feel desire without having sex right away. I believe the issue is when one person wants it more than the other or they have a disagreement about the timing. Sex should definitely involve mutual and overwhelming consent, but that means it gets tricky fast when one person wants it and the other person is saying to wait. We can pretend it shouldn't be an issue, but it's hard for anyone not to feel rejected or wounded because somebody rejected physical intimacy. I've had wome…
/r/PurplePillDebate01/03/26 05:09 PM
8

A good example of OG RP is Kevin Samuels. He always handled his shows with a level of decorum and level headedness. And although the clips that went viral were usually of him dunking on women, he dunked on men just as hard. I honestly don't think Kevin Samuels is a good example at all. Him authoratively talking down to both men and women like an abrasive asshole under the defense of "telling it like it is" is exactly what's wrong with not just "modern" red pill, but red pill as a whole. If Red P…
/r/PurplePillDebate27/02/26 05:21 PM
4

As someone who actually read the first Rational Male, it seemed like he had some meaningful insight into how to be a better man who's more attractive to women. Unfortunately in hindsight, it seems more and more like you actually have to take his writing "out of context" in order for it to not be Manosphere rage-bait.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/02/26 05:09 PM
1

I'm assuming "pres" means "president". But yes from experience, when a woman is into me or someone else she makes it pretty obvious and borderline chases you down. I wouldn't always say not to "shoot your shot,"but I've never actually started a relationship with someone that wasn't really keen and show a lot of interest herself.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/02/26 08:04 AM
1

I was expecting more along the lines of "women only want to be part of Chad's harem so they're implicitly allowing cheating anyways".
/r/PurplePillDebate26/02/26 09:43 AM
31

At the same time men are more willing to compromise and put up with dissatisfactory relationships - which is why only a minority of divorces are initiated by men. Because men are significantly more into women and especially their girlfriends/wives than vice versa. Ironically, this is where the Red Pill alpha bros that tell you to quit being a SIMP, get over your oneitis and start living in abundance are truly on to something. You're really benefitting at all from being with someone who basically…
/r/PurplePillDebate31/01/26 11:35 AM
1

For most people, dating is something that occurs organically, as sort of a consequence of natural socialization. Men especially are far more likely however to "fall through the cracks" and miss important social milestones, which don't necesssarily doom them to a life if inceldom BUT it does make it significantly harder. The male loneliness "epidemic" is a somewhat exaggerated online discourse, but it's not completely invalid. As it's been pointed out here before, a place like Purple Pill Debate …
/r/PurplePillDebate28/01/26 12:32 AM
2

When guys say they have to be on point, what they mean is that they have to be on point to attract the women they're attracted to, which conveniently concentrates toward the same predictable traits that men find desiriable in women. Guys who complain that nobody wants them aren't always telling the complete truth; what they often mean is that the cute/hot/girl-next-door types that most other guys would be into aren't giving them much attention.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/01/26 12:27 AM
2

However, when it comes to relationships that start offline a lot of women end up dating the guys in close proximity to them i.e. through their friend groups, friends of friends, work and so on. True, and often times women who go to apps are doing it precisely because they don't find their local options to be desiriable. Thing is, I don't really know that who she meets locally and is satisfied with will differ that much from an online match. She might have more time to get to know somebody IRL th…
/r/PurplePillDebate28/01/26 12:24 AM
0

IDK bro, on the whole I wouldn't say "most women today", if we're talking about every adult woman on earth. If she's reasonably attractive around 20-35 yes probably. If she's any of the following: overweight, old, or a single mom, then probably not so much, at least not from any serious suitors.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/01/26 12:16 AM
2

1.) This point can be more true than it was when you're younger, but even in my 20's I met a lot of people who had been with the same person since high school or early college and they thought they'd be together forever. A lot of them were not together forever. 2.) You will not be treated as a threat or weirdo by most people if you're a man in his 30's and single. Women might naturally have their guard up around men, and people might wonder if you're gay if you don't talk about your dating life …
/r/PurplePillDebate17/01/26 08:02 PM
4

Could also be that a lot of RP guys are stuck in their "anger phase".
/r/PurplePillDebate13/01/26 08:41 AM
1

That's fair. What I'm alluding to is more so that you can't expect everyone to be into you, and if you're making yourself vulnerable to rejection by asking more people out, you'll get rejected more and it's better to accept this early on than let every rejection be a sign that you did something "wrong".
/r/PurplePillDebate04/01/26 12:18 PM
7

Isn't that how relationships are supposed to work? You meet a girl, be friends with her, get to know her, grow feelings for her, ask her out, The problem here is we're not even sure if the feelings aren reciprocated. Another issue is so many guys will see a girl they like, but instead of asking her out early on, they play the "get to know her and be her friend" game. They do this for weeks, months, years even. Women are pretty wise to it becuase it happens to them so often. You really are just b…
/r/PurplePillDebate04/01/26 12:16 PM
1

They can be true, sure, but ultimately the idea is you're having an "abundance mentality" and accepting rejection without letting your entire concept of self worth ride on it. If you feel like you're consistently unsuccessful at attracting people, there's a whole lot of "trouble shooting" you can do to figure out why that is instead of just swallowing black pills and giving up.
/r/PurplePillDebate04/01/26 12:29 AM
2

There is such a thing as over-generalizing, though. Just like different jobs require different skillsets, different women have different relationship requirements. What you're suggesting is that the high schooler gets a degree in mechanical engineering and then applies everywhere with it, including to a law firm or doctor's office. If you just say "get good skills to get a job", it's helpful, but also vague. You could consider asking the right leading questions and narrowing down specifics, i.e.…
/r/PurplePillDebate04/01/26 12:21 AM
3

I think you might be a bit too hung up on being accepted. You keep going back to the concept of "being given a chance", vs. "finding the right person" or "realizing not everyone is going to be into you, which is okay". I understand why that is important, to a point, but a lot of guys get trapped in these "pills" because they become too obsessed with essentially not wanting to be rejected, often because of the pain of prior rejection. But a healthy relationship is, ultimately, built on some found…
/r/PurplePillDebate03/01/26 11:43 AM
4

Being given a shot is nice, but I think it's probably more worth it to ask yourself if she is actually a good fit for you, instead of just trying to win her over.
/r/PurplePillDebate02/01/26 09:46 PM
50

I think the problem here is you're externalizing way too much. You're trying to create an aggregate of what all women want and build yourself into the "perfect" man for basically every girl so you never get rejected. The reality is that no matter what you do, you'll never be everyone's cup of tea. Some women might find you have the right sex drive, while others think it's too high or too low. Different women have different thresholds for what's needy vs. emotionally available. Some women like an…
/r/PurplePillDebate02/01/26 01:29 AM
–

Maybe. I still feel like they do, in a roundabout way. When Red Pill guys say women don't feel attraction for weak, effiminate betas/simps/afcs/whatever, they're not necessarily saying that's wrong and women are bad for it. It's a very polarizing narrative and highly contestible, and I think knowing this makes people reflexing defensive because it implies women are "shallow" and bad because of it.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/12/25 02:45 AM
2

Sure, it's not good to advise anyone to basically try and date people they're not attracted to, to a point. There is though, IMO, something to the Attachment Theory of adult relationships, and how someone who is anxious, insecure or avoidant is picking people based on a compass that doesn't face north. In those instances, "attraction" is not just about how physically good looking someone is, it's how they actually make you feel beyond just thinking they look good, even if those feelings aren't n…
/r/PurplePillDebate20/12/25 04:21 PM
2

You cannot blame women for having their sexual preferences, In a roundabout way, this is or at least was what the Red Pill aims to do. It was essentially "women have standards and they like masculine men, if you want relationships with them then you need to understand this". For some reason many folks will take what TRP says and spin it as blaming, which I can sort of understand why. It's just odd when i.e. someone says "women trend to prefer tall men" and there is a torrent of responses saying …
/r/PurplePillDebate20/12/25 03:48 PM
3

In America, the average person is overweight, has debt and other baggage like kids, depression, issues with comitting, along with other things that would be considered possible compromises or red flags in a relationship partner. This of course means women and men here tend to fit this description.
/r/PurplePillDebate14/12/25 04:19 PM
3

I don't even believe other men when they say they'll have anyone. Their idea of "average" is 7/10, which is obviously above average. Their version of "settling" is taking the cute, thin, young, girl-next-door that every other guy wants. If an old, overweight single mother was hitting on them they wouldn't be interested at all.
/r/PurplePillDebate14/12/25 03:16 PM
3

Autism has become an umbrella term for people who are either just remotely awkward, have niche hobbies, or in the case of a certain contentious CEO and public figure, have a weird tendency to throw up "Roman salutes" at presidential rallies. That's why people don't take it seriously or see it for what it is, which is a real problem. I've known a handful of truly autistic people in my life. They aren't just high functionining but slightly weird adults, or smart but edgy guys like some dudes proje…
/r/PurplePillDebate13/12/25 12:12 PM
2

I've never really seen a favorable use of the term "sluts" in my day to day. Maybe I'm wrong, but overall it just doesn't seem like a term that would be used (much less received) positively. For example if a girl sleeps with a taken man once, she gets called a slut becuase she knew he was taken and was trying to be a homewrecker on purpose, that sort of thing. The last time I heard this word used, it was a friend complaining about another girl hitting on her boyfriend ("I HATE her, she's such a …
/r/PurplePillDebate12/12/25 09:29 PM
3

A slut is having fun with the men who don't care she's a slut and are probably sluts themselves. This is a pretty charitable interpretation of what a slut is. Puritianical culture is not the only thing that makes someone wary of dating one. The average person may not care that much about exact body count, but they do care about relationship behavior and patterns. Someone with an unusually high body count does at least eyebrows, because of concerns like: having STD's, being unable to commit, not …
/r/PurplePillDebate12/12/25 06:48 PM
5

Being a slut is a stigma, just like being an incel is a stigma for men. You know how "incel" doesn't necessarily just mean a virgin, but a guy who can't get laid specifically because he's repuslive and offputting to women? The idea of a slut is someone who just mindlessly sleeps around with men, not caring about their feelings or what homes they might be wrecking in a process. Guys can and do apprecaite sexually available women, the problem usually lies in the perception that someone women are s…
/r/PurplePillDebate12/12/25 03:14 PM
–

I'm curious to know what a "high earner" is. Is it $70k, $100k, $200k?
/r/PurplePillDebate12/12/25 02:07 PM
9

This is a trend I've noticed in a lot of women's dating advice, in that they seem to view dating as "Men I've dated or met.", and then approach the problem in a sort of backwards induction: "What would my ex have to be in order for him to have kept me?" I mean, that's not what I was really addressing. I was telling OP why women aren't all so eager to have random guys trying to approach them in the hopes they can fuck. As for your point about "men I've dated or met", a lot of the Manosphere is ba…
/r/PurplePillDebate06/12/25 04:24 PM
1

I think you're misunderstanding those posts. People in general enjoy sex. What makes them not enjoy it is when the sex is mediocre, or it feels like forced/coerced sex with someone you're not attracted to. Women may take sex for granted because they're used to men, who will sleep with anyone, wanting to have sex with them, but that doesn't mean they actually don't enjoy it. I think to a point, women are socialized to act coy. Thing is, from experience, their coyness still has subtext of consent …
/r/PurplePillDebate06/12/25 03:45 PM
–

It's not like you're old, but I will say that being out of Uni could be an "issue" since you're not around nearly as many people anymore. You'll be fine, as long as you make the right effort. I wouldn't worry about it, but I wouldn't put it off too much longer either.
/r/PurplePillDebate06/12/25 01:00 PM
34

The thing to keep in mind is that when you vaguely describe the concept of approaching a woman with some kind of intention, women are understanding that idea very differently from men. A lot of women - probably more than you realize - have experienced some form of sexual violence in their lives. So without knowing anything about even the most truly harmless men, all they know is a complete stranger that wants access to their body is approaching them. In the past, their saftey possibly got compro…
/r/PurplePillDebate06/12/25 12:49 PM
2

I'm a bit skeptical of the idea that even Disney was pushing the idea of beauty not mattering. The classic Disney animated stuff I watched on VHS as a kid would depict handsome bad boys and prince charmings - not timid "nice guys" or walflowers - getting the girl in the end. Hell, even in stuff like battle shonen anime, the billy badass protaganist with god genes who saved the world is the one who got the girl, even if he was sort of a dorky "loser" at the start. In fact, I seriously can't think…
/r/PurplePillDebate06/12/25 12:34 PM
2

Female Dating Strategy.
/r/PurplePillDebate06/12/25 12:30 PM
–

This kind of shit is why people think the "male loneliness crisis" is bullshit. Men get sad because they have worries over whether they're attractive enough to sleep with a hot woman who's significantly younger than him. And dude, you're 27. Worry about being 40 in 13 years, not now. Don't put off your entire life and desires while you "work on yourself", get it figured out and go get real world data through actual experience.
/r/PurplePillDebate06/12/25 12:18 PM
3

I remember seeing some stat on a website some time ago, indicating that something like a third of FDS members were cross-posting on this sub. I feel like I have to remember it whenever I read comments here, because it's very telling. Also, what's IT?
/r/PurplePillDebate05/12/25 04:55 PM
2

For example, where's the "I went undercover as a man and it's not nearly as hard as people think" book or video? Where's the "My girlfriend tried online dating as a man, and she was surprised how EASY it was" video? Where is the "Normal guy tries wearing a shirt that fits. 100+ matches." video? Where is the "normiefishing" experiment where some regular guy admits to horrible crimes in his bio, but gets matches anyway because different people like different things and his normal features must be …
/r/PurplePillDebate05/12/25 03:13 PM
3

The post in question does what pretty much all pill/Manosphere adjacent posts do: generalize the fuck out of entire groups of people, in a way that's seriously misleading. It's fair to say a lot of men who end up in these spaces probably had experience with being a super Nice Guy, having their Oneitis crush and ultimately getting Friendzoned and "used", so my point is to acknowledge that it does happen, but it's not something all or even most women do, and guys shouldn't go around resenting wome…
/r/PurplePillDebate23/11/25 03:23 PM
17

I don't think all women use nice guys, or even try to. From experience if a person isn't interested, they usually just don't interact much and keep you at arm's length. There does seem to be a subset of men and women who will "use" people who are attracted to them, because the attention feels good, and the nice guy/girl in question has issues with boundaries and people-pleasing.
/r/PurplePillDebate23/11/25 02:57 PM
6

The thing about "blue pill" is it's not really any organized, consistent set of ideals. It only really exists because TRP was developed as a concept, and would criticize what they perceive as a "blue pill" type of magical thinking. But you'll find there's a lot of BP on here who agree with broader statements like: virginity is weird past a certain age, because women don't wanna fuck loser men who nobody else wants.
/r/PurplePillDebate31/10/25 10:45 PM
1

I think I largely agree with the premise here. Look at posts on this sub about mens' issues and it's largely either guys getting into blackpill circlerjerks, or pointing fingers at each other, or feeling better about themselves because they're above the sad, lonely guys on here. Hell, I've probably been guilty of any of the above myself at some point.
/r/PurplePillDebate31/10/25 10:42 PM
1

I don't think women all care about virginity so much as they care about the baggage attached to it. They're already very picky as it is, and for good reason, so it kind of makes sense that they'd select for a guy who's going to offer them something like sexual satisfaction, as opposed to somebody who they believe can't. Sure, some later-in-life virgins could put in the effort to learn and be good people. But just like many workplaces won't hire someone who has zero experience to speak to what th…
/r/PurplePillDebate31/10/25 09:52 PM
5

There's an assumption that most men are primarily motivated by sex. If all men are primarily motivated by sex, men that aren't successful at losing their virginity have something wrong with them. I said it in the other thread, but there's a huge leap from "I assume every man alive is actively trying to fuck me" to "him not trying to fuck me makes him a loser".
/r/PurplePillDebate31/10/25 09:28 PM
4

There's been women on here who would agree with OP but they get downvoted to oblivion.
/r/PurplePillDebate31/10/25 09:08 PM
1

I don't think parents should teach men how to talk to women, I just think they should help steer them towards the correct path of socialization so they actually stand a chance in the real world, including not bombing at relationships.
/r/PurplePillDebate31/10/25 08:48 PM
2

I mean you're not entirely wrong. People will not always be honest about their intentions, likely in large part because they don't always know exactly what they want. And even if they think they do, those wants can change. The guy who said he wanted a relationship but ghosted after sex may not have lied, but simply changed his mind. I don't think that's exclusive to women though.
/r/PurplePillDebate30/10/25 11:01 PM
-3

I mean, isn't this true of anyone? Men lie, posture, contradict and misrepresent themselves all the time. i.e. men will say they want a relationship with a woman, then ghost her after having sex with her. Or many virgin, lonely guys say they'll have anyone, but when "anyone" is overweight, old, a single mom, suddenly they have standards. I bring this up, because I feel like you're suggesting women are fundamentally different in men some specific way, as if men's actions always match their words …
/r/PurplePillDebate30/10/25 10:53 PM
3

It's not so much 'baggage' but some type of sub-concious 'ick' they get from my experience of admitting to it, There's some reasons for this, one of which could be women having icks or preferences which excludes virgins. But I think another possible reason could be the idea of a guy "confessing" and carrying all sorts of shame about his virginity. At the end of the day, not everyone is going to like it, but if you carry yourself with some semblance of confidence and not as much shame, it's not a…
/r/PurplePillDebate30/10/25 10:14 PM
19

I'm split on this. I've been hearing that virgins are "red flags" since I was in my early 20's, by people who've had sex like twice in their lives. At the time, it felt like people were saying it just to sound cool, by proclaiming they need somebody with "experience". As it turns out, you can be "experienced" with lots of low quality hookups and not actually learn how to satisfy anyone sexually. And there's zero guarantee that just becuase somebody slept with someone prior to you, or even multip…
/r/PurplePillDebate30/10/25 08:55 PM
7

It sounds cliche, but I travelled abroad to Finland over the summer, and the way the country is built around people and communities instead of cars and consumption was borderline intoxicating. I think we can and do have "third places" in the US, but among the biggest issues is you have to drive quite a ways just to get to them. Many of my coworkers have 30-45 minute or longer commutes which is wild to me.
/r/PurplePillDebate29/10/25 08:38 AM
3

however, women are becoming more and more like men - in the sense that a guy must be "fuckable" before she even considers him a viable romantic option - and when I say "fuckable" I mean "oh, he's sexy, oh he's cute" - It can't be a simple "oh, he seems nice". I am not sure if this is true, in the sense that women have "changed". Good genetics were always going to be the most attractive, regardless of the time period. For men this means the same thing as always: being tall, having hair on your he…
/r/PurplePillDebate28/10/25 12:15 AM
6

I don't think OP said that women only find 5% of men attractive, but that a given woman would only find about 5% out of a random sample of men attractive at most. Based on what I read on this sub, and what statistics show, I believe this bears out.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/10/25 12:01 AM
7

Most guys don't and didn't do half of what you're suggesting. They check out of the dating market after stumbling into a few relationships before settling down. The whole idea of consciously and actively dating inspires dread in a lot of people, as it's notoriously difficult and wrought with failure/rejection, something humans don't naturally cope with. Men in the past didn't "put themselves out there", they found someone in their circle or had it arranged. Most people do not have the charisma o…
/r/PurplePillDebate25/10/25 09:18 PM
2

My point ultimately is that if she's good enough looking she has options. Men will insist that having kids makes her "low value" but if she has the right proportions, they act like fucking dogs. I know this because I've seen exactly how men behave around any woman that they always claim is average or "just" a 7/10. You have to consider that men themselves largely fall into an average bracket, and in the US especially that's 5' 10 or so, overweight, $60k salary and has a kid or two.
/r/PurplePillDebate25/10/25 07:32 PM
9

The issue is that when you're at a point where you are behind on critical social milestones and essentially have zero social or dating capital, knowing where to even begin is difficut on its own. The idea that you just go out and socialize seems obvious, maybe, but it's also not something the majority of people are actively thinking about. It's just a consequence of every day life. At least it was, until the pandemic happened and accellerated the trend towards making people terminally online doo…
/r/PurplePillDebate25/10/25 07:27 PM
8

And you can still meet and talk to people you want to date in those spaces and be successful. The thing is, there is a requisite amount of social skills you typically have to develop before meeting somebody through those avenues is truly an option for you. If you don't actually know how to develop a friendship or flirt and escalate with intent, simply coming into contact with women won't be enough. You can certainly start to learn by putting yourself out there, but what I'm geting at is that a l…
/r/PurplePillDebate25/10/25 06:42 PM
5

Yes actually. A lot of single moms are very pretty, and as much as guys like to talk about what a turnoff single moms are, they would absolutely look for casual sex if not a straight up relationship. Especially older men who may have kids of their own.
/r/PurplePillDebate25/10/25 05:59 PM
14

I think even among "average" guys who are in relationships, they would struggle hard to find somebody new if it ended tomorrow. The world is not set up for average men to find relationships with ease. Every guy thinks they're great with women until they actually have to feel pressure to successfully date them, and then you find out who has "game" and who doesn't.
/r/PurplePillDebate25/10/25 05:08 PM
7

6.5/10 is 1.5 points above average. Probably girl-next-door type, among the cutest girls in your class or workplace. It's wild that men rate women who are 6-7/10 as just plain women bordering on ugly. The reality is, from experience, these are the men that borderline "go to war" over and will act like they're settling if she picks them, when she's probably the best he'll ever get.
/r/PurplePillDebate25/10/25 04:16 PM
3

I'm sure they make it work, but even with the average household income being in the $70k range, I cannot see how inflation is not eating them alive, unless they bought a house before the pandemic.
/r/PurplePillDebate25/10/25 01:48 PM
23

OP, it sounds like you're college aged and pretty young. Good for you that you're on the right track, but that doesn't mean almost everyone is doing great or has access to the same things you do. This nasty little bug was going around about 5 years ago that forced countries and governments around the world to tell basically everyone: stay inside and do nothing for several months on end. This definitely did a number on people's social lives, especially Gen z as they were entering what should've b…
/r/PurplePillDebate25/10/25 01:41 PM
2

$36k gross annual salary with $3k in the bank and two kids is crazy.
/r/PurplePillDebate25/10/25 01:25 PM
9

I think the broader "issue" that gets touched on here is this: men are still by and large expected to perform masculinity. And this certainly matters outside of sex and romance, as much as people will insist it doesn't. Stronger, taller, more confident men just tend to get treated better and respected more.
/r/PurplePillDebate24/10/25 01:05 PM
1

You can make your intentions known through plausible deniability. That's how flirting works, and how you test the water. It's perfectly acceptable to be up front with your intentions, depending on the delivery and how well you handle rejection. You can ask to meet someone for coffee or ask to go back to your place shortly after meeting; what matters is being able to read the room. Nobody is saying the first words out of your mouth to someone should be "ayo, want sum fuck?" It's more like you int…
/r/PurplePillDebate21/10/25 12:08 AM
7

Classic PPD dichotomy: you're either an ugly autistic bald manlet incel, or gigachad Adonis. Zero in-between.
/r/PurplePillDebate18/10/25 01:41 PM
5

I don't really find it all that true. Average and even mediocre men are able to find relationships. They may not engage in a lot of casual sex and their relationships could have problems, but that's how most normal average guys live their lives. The issue with low value guys isn't that the world left them behind and women have all the leverage, at least not entirely. Some of the problems they face can be more systemic, i.e. a lot of lonely single men are neuro divergent. But for many of them the…
/r/PurplePillDebate17/10/25 05:02 PM
6

My common sense tells me that the party that routinely finds favor with right wing extremist groups, is probably not my friend and does not have my best interests at heart. If we're following your logic, far more people shouldn't be voting for the right in the states because right now they are basically trying to alienate and demonize everyone who doesn't agree with them on absolutely everything. But, please do tell me more about how the party that basically prides itself on demonizing and alien…
/r/PurplePillDebate17/10/25 04:46 PM
6

Bullshit it doesn't. I've been hearing variations of "feminism alienates men and pushes them to right wing extremism" plenty for the past year and a half. Especially when it comes to saying things like Trump won because right wing extremists talk to men, and the left/Democrats don't.
/r/PurplePillDebate17/10/25 12:56 PM
9

You're pretty much proving my point. Your argument that women all want "high value" men and ignore every day/beta men is basically a variation of "social media and feminism are the reason women are so picky and men get left behind". And this can often lead to some "radicalization" of said men, usually by podcast bros who blame feminism, women's standards or any other boogeyman for men struggling to date.
/r/PurplePillDebate17/10/25 12:38 PM
11

A lot of pilled guys say things like "women having all these choices makes their standards unreasonable, unlike before when average guys were good enough because women didn't have economic freedom". Or something along those lines.
/r/PurplePillDebate17/10/25 12:25 PM
4

They could make it impossible, sure. Ultimately that's up to the person choosing to decide. If a woman's standards filter out the overwhelming majority of men, I don't think that means she should lower or change them. It'll make finding somebody harder, but it's better if she's happier alone vs with the wrong person. IF she decides her standards are too exacting, that's her decision to make to lower them; it's not something she can be reasoned into.
/r/PurplePillDebate13/10/25 08:32 PM
10

I don't think it's unreasonable not to want to date somebody you're not attracted to and/or don't see a future with.
/r/PurplePillDebate13/10/25 05:35 PM
11

You can't force attraction and you can't force yourself to be with somebody. If it's not there, it's not there. There's a reason that even in fiction, the magic genies and wish granting dragons cannot force someone to fall in love with you.
/r/PurplePillDebate13/10/25 04:39 PM
10

I get what you're saying. I've been given "advice" on more than one occassion that I should basically be a dick to women. Not in a "stop being a nice guy, be confident and assert yourself" way, just straight up "be an asshole, bitches love that shit". It's actually a good amount of men I've encountered who have this worldview, maybe around 40% annecdotally which is quite a bit. I don't blame you for wanting to abstain. I wish I could just say it's not every guy, but obviously those comments repr…
/r/PurplePillDebate13/10/25 12:27 AM
11

All of this sounds like premiere, douchebag, Manosphere-adjacent behavior, but I would hazard a guess that simply not having these traits isn't inherently enough to make a man truly desirable. And I believe what OP is gesturing at is that men aren't all inherently bad (though it's possible since you're saying that they are), but that they aren't good enough because they aren't attractive enough. In other words, they're "Nice Guys". I could be wrong.
/r/PurplePillDebate12/10/25 11:29 PM
8

They even made a movie with this very premise - 500 Days of Summer. One of my favorites.
/r/PurplePillDebate11/10/25 10:02 AM
0

I don't think these questions are entirely unreasonable. It's not bad to ask yourself if you habitually choose people for the "wrong" reasons, i.e. you don't want to be alone so you settle for your coworker because nobody else seemed available, or you have unaddressed childhood abandonment problems aka "daddy issues" that cause you to choose emotionally unavailable partners.
/r/PurplePillDebate10/10/25 05:00 PM
7

The types of women who care this much about a guy having a lot of sexual experience, usually have more experience themselves. And they filter for guys who put out a "fuckboy vibe", respectuflly. They would either chew the virgin up and spit him back out, or more likely just not be interested in him at all.
/r/PurplePillDebate05/10/25 09:51 AM
10

I believe by the numbers, most men and women have a handful of partners in the single digit camp throughout their entire life. This is largely because many people are still monogamy minded, for religious reasons or otherwise. In this way, all that arbitrary experience is kind of pointless; if the connection and foundation doesn't exist for a meaningful LTR, it won't generally matter if a guy has slept with women at all, or with how many. Without understanding what the issue is that's holding an …
/r/PurplePillDebate05/10/25 09:40 AM
5

Most women would disagree with you, relationship/sexual experience is a deal breaker for them. I honestly believe if a guy is good for her and she's attracted to him, this will not be an issue. The thing is, what happens to make a guy experienced also happens to be what makes him attractive in the first place. I don't think most people consciously see getting experience is a goal or requirement, it just happens as a part of a typical life trajectory, which is why it's called experience. The type…
/r/PurplePillDebate05/10/25 09:35 AM
12

It's pretty easy for average men to get into a relationship with a desperate below average woman who wants to date up, TBH, if you're the kind of guy who thinks he needs to use practice girlfriends, I hate to say it but there is a very strong chance you're not average, you're below average. By this I don't necessarily mean you look ugly, but by pure averages the overwhelming majority of people at a certain age have enough requisite experience and aren't really interested in wasting their time wi…
/r/PurplePillDebate05/10/25 09:30 AM
16

Most women don't struggle to find a suitable partner, at least not in the long term. Their standards are exacting and they can be picky but I don't think that means they are unrealistic or too high. Despite what podcast bros try to tell you, women are not exclusively after 6/6/6 guys or some shit.
/r/PurplePillDebate04/10/25 01:19 AM
–

I'm saying that said narrative and its associated baggage are why people dislike Red Pill theory in general.
/r/PurplePillDebate03/10/25 11:47 AM
–

The second half of your post explains the whole problem. Saying women have a broader general desiriability for masculine traits is one thing. Saying women are all immature children who want to ride the cock carousel with Chad before they cuck Mr. Beta by monkeybranching to the next tingle inducing HVM after draining him of his resources, only to eventually settle down after Hitting the Wall (TM)...well, the latter clearly carries a sense of resentment, bitterness and even straight up anger at wo…
/r/PurplePillDebate03/10/25 11:34 AM
–

One of the biggest players I've ever known is like 5' 6". He's also muscular, handsome and charismatic. It may not fit your black pill world view but that doesn't make it wrong.
/r/PurplePillDebate02/10/25 08:33 AM
–

Attraction is an aggregate of qualities. Short guys can be attractive if the right combination of other factors i.e. proportions, muscles, face, facial hair, hairline, not to mention any personal qualiites. The same goes for women: the term curvy is mostly describing someone with nice proportions and a pretty face, too.
/r/PurplePillDebate02/10/25 07:47 AM
1

The thing about the Manosphere nowadays (and perhaps even at its core) is that it primarily captures a group of sexually frustrated men, and this same group of men in the right environment often gives rise to fascism, which has an inherent property of seeing people as a monolith. So while the manosphere does care about men, it doesn't care about them on an individual level; it cares about them as a monolith, and treats them as a group that needs to be "handled" correctly in order to suit its own…
/r/PurplePillDebate30/09/25 09:32 PM
4

So some people's idea of fun is different from others. Maybe engineering guy was genuinely exciting to someone else and not a "beta bucks". Either way, I wouldn't encourage anyone to choose someone they are actively bored by. Sure, being excited doesn't alone mean the relationship will be good, healthy or stable, but boredom is probably not a good way to start a relationship either.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/09/25 05:24 PM
9

I just want to understand: the woman who passed up the engineering guy is proof that women are inherently illogical and emotionally driven, as well as self destructive. But the woman who actually chose the engineer is not an indication that women aren't a monolith with the same preferences in men, and that it's maybe better as a guy to move on from rejection and find somebody else instead of spiraling into the red pill rabbit hole that encourages you to resent women and harbor revenge fantasies …
/r/PurplePillDebate28/09/25 05:11 PM
10

Men aren't logical. Far from. I'd go so far as to say that humans in general have their "logic" and "rational decision making" informed by their emotions, not the other way around. And I've worked with way too many men with huge yet fragile egos who get bent out of shape and try to go scorched earth on their team or the workplace because someone "disrespected" them.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/09/25 05:07 PM
1

I disagree. Average guys won't always have so many options but it doesn't mean they have to settle for whoever will have them. Again, saying they should or have to is how you get "betas".
/r/PurplePillDebate26/09/25 11:00 AM
3

It's been my exact experience. They either get into your orbit and start talking, or they could be overt enough to break the touch barrier or be introduced by someone ala "my friend thinks you're cute". The thing with the former is it's not what they say or do but how they say it. Flirting is usually about plausible deniability and saying it without saying it. Someone liking you after you meet them and start talking doesn't contradict the idea that someone has their mind made up about their inte…
/r/PurplePillDebate26/09/25 09:46 AM
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In today’s world, people don’t need each other. Yes, we do. We are communal and social beings. Women can work, make their own money, and own a bank account. Men can buy food, hire a maid, and get off to the internet. Even in the context of "casual" relationships, some sort of feelings and attachments become involved. Attraction is not strictly about looks. Looks matter a lot for attraction, no doubt, but the chemistry, the vibe, how two people relate to each matters a great deal. Yes, even in ca…
/r/PurplePillDebate17/09/25 10:13 PM
2

I'll bite. Some men are assholes, some women are assholes. That said, "asshole" can be subjective. Typically, water finds its own level. Which means asshole men and women end up together, just like people with complimentary yet dysfunctional traits end up in intoxicating situations. Some men correctly identify that what they think is an asshole is just a guy with a backbone. They think disagreeing with a woman or arguing with her makes him an asshole, but then later finds out that many women lik…
/r/PurplePillDebate13/09/25 11:41 PM
6

I'm not concerned with how many women she has slept with. I just don't want to be let down because I ended up in a relationship with someone who was lukewarm at best. I would probably never find out who she slept with because I wouldn't ask about n counts etc...so maybe it's a moot point. I just don't want to be settled for, and I don't think women do either.
/r/PurplePillDebate13/09/25 06:15 PM
1

I am honestly sorry you feel that way. I was depressed for most of my 20's so I understand. And I also understand you can't just pull yourself out of it, especially if it has to do with "shit life syndrome". I will be honest and say I had to just suck it up and deal with being miserable while I took steps to not be. Everyone's path is different so it's hard for me to give advice, since your set of circumstances can't be identical to my own. I hate that answer because it sounds like a copout, but…
/r/PurplePillDebate12/09/25 09:55 PM
32

But what i dont get why you guys are super upset, cause you end up settling with the women you dont want anyways either, but at least you guys still get some pussy though 🤷‍♀️ so its not all that bad. So many generilizations. I've never settled for somebody just to not be lonely. It wastes both of our time, and the last thing I want to do is hurt somoene else because I just used them to wet my dick and not be lonely. I can just go jerk off and avoid all the emotional messiness of asymetrical rel…
/r/PurplePillDebate12/09/25 09:53 PM
2

There's really no reason to not try to do better in life, especially if you're not happy where you're at. You say you're depressed, so I'd start with therapy, or at least some kind of mindful practice to improve your outlook.
/r/PurplePillDebate12/09/25 09:17 PM
62

I just want to be desired. And if I feel like I'm not as wanted by women as some other guy, I'd rather improve until I am, or just accept being less desired and stay single. The last thing I want is to be seen as some mid dude you settled for because you were lonely and desperate, but aren't all that attracted to.
/r/PurplePillDebate12/09/25 07:15 PM
8

If I had to put a pin on the issue with men finding womens' sexuality "annoying", it's that it belies a sort of entitlement toward sexual access. If you gracefully accept rejection and the fact that not every woman is going to find you attractive, there shouldn't be an "annoyance" when some of them choose someone who isn't you. Even if the rejection stings a bit, the "annoyance" sort of suggests that it gets in the way of you having sexual access to somebody, in away that makes them wrong for no…
/r/PurplePillDebate12/09/25 06:19 PM
5

The funny thing is that what you said was basically a textbook TRP teaching for the longest time. "Quit bitching about women not liking you, stop with the excuses and mental masturbation, go out and talk to them until rejection doesn't scare you and you get better" was always the final task, at least until the current podcast-bro era took hold and all they do is complain about hypergamy.
/r/PurplePillDebate07/09/25 03:23 PM
2

Yep. And before the podcast bro era of TRP emerged, many of those guys would tell you that having those qualities went a long fucking way. Yeah, being good looking always helps, but it doesn't have to damn you to a life of being a lonely, miserable sadsack. Neil Strauss, who wrote The Game, is short and bald. But sadly, that age of PUA "optimism" which says that even if you feel like a loser now, you don't have to be forever, is all but entirely non-existent in the current Manosphere.
/r/PurplePillDebate07/09/25 03:19 PM
2

Thank you. I'm aware that the alpha beta discourse gets cringe and exhausted by the usual bad actors, but I hate to throw the baby out with the bathwater so to speak. There's a lot of Red Pill thought that connects deeply with many men including myself. Even if I don't agree with all of it, I think I can mostly understand what those guys are saying and why it resonates so strongly with us, at least when we are in agreement.
/r/PurplePillDebate07/09/25 03:15 PM
16

When you have to be nice and supplicating because you have nothing else to offer, you will finish last, or close to it. If your kind, gentle nature is accompanied by other qualities, it's another thing, but if all you have going for you is not being an asshole, it's not exciting, interesting or attractive. In other words, it's a neutral quality that dosesn't really positively or negatively affect people's perception of you. Not just women's, but people's.
/r/PurplePillDebate07/09/25 03:06 PM
8

I think Alpha is like an abstract concept, it means different things to different people. Yes, "average" guys can get laid sometimes or even be in relationships, that doesn't preclude the existence of players. We've always had players, aka guys who were better at attracting women than most. Call them alphas, PUAs or anything else; I'm sure you've known a couple guys in your life that just did really well with the ladies, while others would struggle more. You couldn't always pin it on one exact c…
/r/PurplePillDebate07/09/25 02:55 PM
2

It's not always that blunt, but that's the M.O. Again, speaking from overwhelming experience and not at all in a slut shaming way.
/r/PurplePillDebate06/09/25 06:45 PM
10

> expect her to randomly initiate I've seen and experienced how women act with guys they are attracted to. I've been on the receiving end of women attracted to me. And I've tried "taking my time" with someone when I was younger and more naive. Women move goddamn mountains to be with a guy they set their sights on and feel genuine attraction for. She'll immediately drop the 10 dudes texting her trying to hang out and even ghost the guy she was "going slow" with. While I can buy that women genuine…
/r/PurplePillDebate05/09/25 07:47 PM
4

I disagree. In an ideal scenario, we aren't competing for or "earning" each other's affection. We are good enough as we are, we excited each other, and we're excited about being together. Yes there's a moment where we get to know each other, but from experience people usually know what they want, or whether somebody is interesting to them or not, and women especially have their mind made up about somebody in the first few moments of interacting. I think the idea of taking your time to get to kno…
/r/PurplePillDebate05/09/25 07:11 PM
6

That's not an unrealistic timeline at all. The number of dates isn't the concern for me, but a perceived lack of interest from her and the idea that I have to "win her over" is.
/r/PurplePillDebate05/09/25 06:50 PM
7

I don't think it's paranoid. If someone isn't excited about me pretty early on, I doubt a relationship with them is a good idea.
/r/PurplePillDebate05/09/25 06:46 PM
10

Not really. "hey you're cute and I like your vibe, wanna fuck?" Is how countless people meet. It's not about somebody worshipping me, it's about a mutual level of high attraction and sexual desire. Most of the time when a woman has been interested in me, it was a problem if I wasn't trying to fuck her pretty quickly. Because she could just move on to some dude who would. Many women have said they will lose interest in a guy who's not actively pursuing them and escalates, especially after she dro…
/r/PurplePillDebate05/09/25 06:43 PM
15

Women who want to hookup with you tend to make it pretty obvious. Can't keep their hands off you, double texting, messaging first on apps and etc.
/r/PurplePillDebate05/09/25 05:58 PM
12

I don't mind that a woman had sex with other men or find other men attractive. I just don't really want to be with someone who secretly thinks they could do better. Whether that means I need to improve myself, find a different partner, maybe even both, the point remains.
/r/PurplePillDebate05/09/25 05:57 PM
43

They don't give a single fuck about her if she doesn't fuck him as fast as her hookups. No. I just assume that if she doesn't want to bang me as quickly as some guy she met at the club or on an app, I assume she's not as attracted to me as she was to him, and I'm not interested in that kind of relationship where I'm put in a lower tier of sexual desirability.
/r/PurplePillDebate05/09/25 04:25 PM
1

I wonder if it's different now. The narratives around some of this "black pill" rhetoric seem to have really amplified and gotten louder. Not just from incels; men I meet in my every day are obsessed with their hairline, height and overall appearance and seem thoroughly convinced that not having the "right" genes makes you doomed to be alone. This is especially noticed in my age bracket (young millennial) and below. So either guys are just being made more aware of their physical flaws by the onl…
/r/PurplePillDebate03/09/25 11:41 PM
1

It's possible that through cold approach, you overcome some sort of fears and self-sabotage that are keeping you from entering relationships. You can also cold approach at bars and night clubs where people expect to get hit on; it doesn't have to be at a grocery store, mall or park. Women are not all entirely against being approached in public. The majority of the time they want to be left alone by men who obviously have some kind of sexual or romantic motive, but once in a great while it can be…
/r/PurplePillDebate01/09/25 09:25 PM
15

I can treat others well and accept them, that doesn't mean I'm obligated to pair up with someone just because they're not horrible. There really should be some level of chemistry and mutual attraction for it to go anywhere.
/r/PurplePillDebate01/09/25 04:50 PM
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Tbh as a short guy I can accept being less attractive to women romantically, but it doesn't necessarily stop there. Many people take you less seriously and respect you less which can make other aspects of life far more challenging. If I said I could just live my life normally outside of dating being harder for being short it would be one thing, but "heightism" seems to extend beyond women simply having a preference.
/r/PurplePillDebate01/09/25 03:18 PM
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I think one issue when we talk about dating is that far too many people don't really go through more than a few partners at most before settling down. "Dating" is a broad term that can mean anything from having a chat over coffee with multiple people to hooking up etc...and I suspect many people don't do this kind of serial dating thing, asking people out all the time and constantly meeting new prospective partners. If you go to any one place to "meet people" and it's not a singles event, there …
/r/PurplePillDebate31/08/25 02:20 AM
12

This is actually the subtly brilliant aspect of the "rule 1 and 2 meme". The idea of "be attractive, don't be unattractive" seems like a joke, as if those things are an oxymoron. In reality you can be actively not repulsive, but not exactly seem desirable. I think this is why Mark Manson talks about being polarizing in his book "Models"; the only way to make some people like you is be so authentic that it filters out people who don't, and a lot of dudes end up in a middle ground of trying to ple…
/r/PurplePillDebate30/08/25 03:51 PM
5

I've had comments nuked as "contentless rhetoric" or "circle jerking" when I've criticized Red Pill thought but wasn't constructive about it. It's not one-sided.
/r/PurplePillDebate30/08/25 02:17 PM
15

Tbh this sub seems to lean heavily "red pill", but it's likely because the concept of pills is mostly one-sided, in that Red and Black Pill men identify themselves as such but people outside those spheres don't usually identify with any pill at all.
/r/PurplePillDebate30/08/25 01:02 PM
3

Nobody's point is being dodged. Your arguing that unattractive women are still highly desired, which makes zero sense.
/r/PurplePillDebate30/08/25 09:06 AM
3

you and I both know that I must live in a different realm or something. In the US, the "average" woman is overweight and over 40, and this is decidedly not what men express attraction for. It's fit, young and perky. The age doesn't matter if she has a nice body, but only if. If you're going to troll It's not trolling. You're the one saying all women have endless options, which would include overweight women, disabled women and single moms. That just isn't true.
/r/PurplePillDebate30/08/25 08:56 AM
5

People don't have to date anyone, they can date whoever they want. Short girls don't have to date short men if they don't want to. It may sound unfair but no amount of men telling women to date guys they're not attracted to is going to change who they're attracted to.
/r/PurplePillDebate30/08/25 08:35 AM
1

Yes I am. In men especially, being rail thin can be seen as unmasculine, unless you're very tall. That's why most male dating advice starts with "hit the gym, asshole".
/r/PurplePillDebate30/08/25 08:31 AM
6

Yeah they do. Go talk to your 40+ year old overweight coworker on disability and I guarantee she's not getting the kind of attention you think all women do. Tall is pure genetics This is one of the aspects of dating that's unfair, but oh well.
/r/PurplePillDebate30/08/25 08:24 AM
3

Depends on what you mean by skinny. Skinny doesn't mean you're in shape. If a skinny - not in shape, skinny - guy who's average height and just "okay" looking is with someone overweight, it could be said their partnership is more sensible than you might think.
/r/PurplePillDebate30/08/25 08:16 AM
13

A very small portion of men actually like very overweight women. Most don't. Most prefer the range between curvy and slim, but generally "fit". You know, the equivalent of women liking tall and fit. As a guy I always see the same women get attention and interest from most men, while many go unnoticed. I think some guys like to act like men aren't as "shallow" as women, but I've seen enough content online that basically drags women through the mud for not being conventionally attractive to know i…
/r/PurplePillDebate30/08/25 07:36 AM
5

Something tells me the responses here are gonna piss guys off, just because.
/r/PurplePillDebate30/08/25 07:22 AM
10

TRP loves to convince guys they will be millionaire studs and need to guard their vast riches some day, in reality most people make probably $50-65k a year individually, basically for life.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/08/25 12:00 PM
2

I don't think the issue with nice guys is that they're not that nice, I think they basically hit a wall where they don't have enough going for them to be attractive. And they know that it's their lacking in looks and personality that ruins their chances. Elliott Rodger is an outlier. Most sexually frustrated men are not like him.
/r/PurplePillDebate26/08/25 05:01 PM
5

Like I said, unless we at least attempt defining "good personality" it's tricky to decide who has one and who doesn't. From the surface it seems like that judgement is made based on whether a guy can appear to attract women or not, which has limitations. Guys can't be upfront Sometimes. But I think the idea that men only want sexual satisfaction seems misguided. I honestly think men want the whole package - attraction, connection, long term compatibility - the same way women do. Yeah they'll hoo…
/r/PurplePillDebate26/08/25 01:06 PM
6

I guess my issue with this is that from experience, my looks took priority before I was even in some kind of "talking stage" with a woman. This isn't speculation either; pretty much every woman I've ever had some involvement with has more or less said she wouldn't be interested at all if she was not physically attracted to me. I could be all those things you mentioned above, but if I didn't look acceptable I would be in the "friendzone". I know that might seem a bit obvious, but I can sort of un…
/r/PurplePillDebate26/08/25 12:33 PM
7

Without knowing what a "good personality" is, it's difficult to have this discussion. Because that in and of itself can change definitions depending on who you ask. And I think some guys kind of see a real contradiction, where they are told having a good personality makes people like you, yet in reality it's that feeling of attraction which makes a person even consider anything with you that's not strictly cordial or platonic.
/r/PurplePillDebate26/08/25 11:55 AM
15

I don't know many women who actively complain about being treated well. Many of the women I know are honestly in relationships with the same guy they've been with for years. I think the whole "women like jerks" thing is a little overblown and misunderstood. A spectrum exists between placating, nice guy doormat and huge gaping asshole of a human and most guys fall somewhere in between. They have flaws and strengths like any normal human. The women they are with accept any flaws as not being deal …
/r/PurplePillDebate25/08/25 09:35 PM
1

Many women don't really want to hook up and only want relationships, so it's kind of a moot point whether they would hookup with Chad vs date him.
/r/PurplePillDebate24/08/25 06:51 PM
5

Taking anyone who will have you. Getting "oneitis" aka obsessing over one woman you hardly know and haven't even dated. Reading some kind of romantic or sexual interest into every interaction you have with a woman that's mildly pleasant. Hoping a given romantic interest likes you so much that you ignore red flags and don't really even consider if she is a good fit or not.
/r/PurplePillDebate24/08/25 06:16 PM
13

I think people realize when they're being settled for, or chosen by someone who thinks they can't or shouldn't do better. Don't date ugly people means don't date someone you think is ugly, because your behavior will broadcast to them that you find them undesirable and both of you will grow to resent each other.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/08/25 08:15 AM
4

On the surface, no. I agree that any individual woman will find most men unattractive, but I disagree that they all find the same men attractive. Some men will clearly have more "pull" than others, but most guys at least have it in them to be attractive to women. For multiple reasons they seem not to do that, ranging from how they are socialized to their own personal decisions and failures.
/r/PurplePillDebate17/08/25 01:25 PM
2

There's likely very few people in life who check all or even most of the boxes for somebody. It's not necessarily about "maxxing" stats either, it's about compatibility, chemistry and specific taste. Some guys are inevitably more attractive to more people than others, but I think for the most part many guys can find a "niche" of women that are more into them than most. What I think some people confuse with women finding most men unattractive is that they find all the same men attractive. In real…
/r/PurplePillDebate17/08/25 01:15 PM
16

Statistically something like 8/10 women at a minimum experience some form of sexual assault/intimate partner violence in their lives. About 1/5 have had rape at least attempted on them. Many men don't understand this, at least it seems that way with how often the Manosphere cries about false rape accusations by comparison. I would be at the very least cautious about men, if I was a woman and this was the world I lived in. For the same reason I leave space and check my surroundings while driving …
/r/PurplePillDebate14/08/25 12:32 AM
6

I agree that shallow is often considered a value judgement, and often in a negative way. I'll put it this way: I'm a short guy. And I've had women reject me specifically over my height. When I tell people this, the classic response is something like "if someone is so shallow they can't look past that, they weren't good for you anyways". And I don't really care for that response, because it basically suggests that the person rejecting me is a bad person. I think technically, if we remove the bagg…
/r/PurplePillDebate10/08/25 10:08 PM
6

Not sure I agree with this completely. People can and do form meaningful relationships after they make those initial shallow connections. It's just that, well, there has to be something there to draw them in before they are willing to develop that relationship, and that kind of thing has to be evaluated on a surface level because you cannot possibly know if somebody is the love of your life even after a couple of dates.
/r/PurplePillDebate10/08/25 09:44 PM
34

Dating is inherently shallow, in the sense that it lacks any depth in the beginning. You can't really get to know someone that well upon an initial visit, you have to actually spend time with them. It doesn't matter if you get for looks, status, sense of humor, personality, whatever; at the end of the day you're judging people based on superficial, surface level characteristics, because it's not possible to know them on a deeper level without putting in that investment. And people don't want to …
/r/PurplePillDebate10/08/25 06:53 PM
2

I wouldn't want that at all, actually.
/r/PurplePillDebate10/08/25 12:26 AM
27

Maybe men should stop using women for sex so they can bust a nut and boost their ego. Maybe men should stop telling their friends in dry spells to use women they don't really like as practice girlfriends to get the confidence back up. Especially for all the insistence from the Manosphere that women and women alone have issues with "accountability". Stones and glass houses and all that.
/r/PurplePillDebate09/08/25 11:42 PM
3

Having a romantic partner is better than being alone. Even if you think most of the people you desire are "bad", it doesn't change that feeling of longingness. And as often as its said not to make being with someone the focus of your life, in reality when you find someone, they become part of your life in a way that eclipses just about everything else. It also makes life feel easier, less stressful, less terrible, when you have somebody to share it with, and let's be honest, most people aren't r…
/r/PurplePillDebate09/08/25 03:14 PM
2

I don't think women necessarily want to waste time with men they don't want any more than interviewers want to turn down unsuited candidates. With a job opening, a position has to be filled, so the sooner they find the right person the better. They have to turn down some people because of filtering requirements, sure, but ultimately they want you to be the right match. Likewise, I believe many women, if they've even bothered to give you their number and go on at least one date with you are consi…
/r/PurplePillDebate09/08/25 02:11 PM
5

The RedPill was a tool to help men in their general lives, not to shame women. I used to think this. But when I go back to even OG Red Pill and game theory - stuff like The Rational Male Year One - there's some cracks that begin to show. It's not the outright podcast bro resentment toward women and society, it was perhaps more subtle, but it was there. Especially the anti-feminism bits, or the biological absolutism that women are all in their feelings and men are more stoic and rational. There w…
/r/PurplePillDebate09/08/25 01:56 PM
1

Not everyone is a "maybe", not really. Some people are stronger candidates for jobs, as romantic prospects, or anything else. If you "shotgun approach" most things, you're going to be turned down a lot, that's true. But even with this approach, it becomes pretty readily apparent when something is going somewhere and when it isn't. If a woman takes days to text you back, you should probably move on. If a job doesn't schedule a second interview or ghosts you entirely, you should probably look else…
/r/PurplePillDebate09/08/25 01:40 PM
4

Honestly, most jobs I've had I've gotten hired on the spot. I was a prime candidate in their eyes, standing out as well qualified and highly desired for the position. If I was getting jerked around, and made to wait weeks and weeks while they interview 50 other people, I would move on to a place that wants to hire me. And that is also exactly how I would look at a potential partner: if she's not sure about me, then she can figure out what she wants while I find somebody who IS sure.
/r/PurplePillDebate09/08/25 08:37 AM
1

Im not decoupling them so much as suggesting that fuckboys are a more desired group of men than you're suggesting. I would put them higher than average "beta" guys and, depending on who you ask, higher than what you're describing as "ideal".
/r/PurplePillDebate09/08/25 02:34 AM
5

I think the trick is they say it without saying it.
/r/PurplePillDebate09/08/25 02:28 AM
10

I hate to say this, but the dating app thing seems like it's been debunked time and again. An average and above guy can have some succes. If you're a man and you're short or otherwise unattractive, forget it. Women on those apps can and do filter by looks, and their filter is very punishing. Some guys can learn to make their profiles better, but they can't, say, add inches to their height in order to be visible to the women who are automatically filtering them out based on height in the app itse…
/r/PurplePillDebate08/08/25 10:12 PM
4

To a degree, but I still see them as put into a category that's typically considered bad or at least "acquired taste". I've known a couple true fuckboys in my life. They were very socially skilled, outgoing, funny, confident, and had no problem with relationships. Some women might cry about being used by them for sex, but the reality IMO is those women were pretty much chasing after them and hoping for a shot at them. Those guys might get villianized in retrosepect after he breaks up with or dum…
/r/PurplePillDebate08/08/25 05:22 PM
1

That's fair, but for many people it isn't that simple.
/r/PurplePillDebate08/08/25 02:52 PM
5

As a man, I feel like we have the choice to either act like a fuckboy or at least by "fuckboy adjacent", or stay single and involuntarily celibate. None of those alpha or beta traits seem to matter much when we're overwhemingly expected to initiate and escalate physically and romantically. The number one complaint about fuckboys is that they're non-commital and bad in relationships, yet it seems like those guys are the ones finding multiple relationships with ease, specifically because women are…
/r/PurplePillDebate08/08/25 02:50 PM
0

Because attrraction isn't a choice.
/r/PurplePillDebate08/08/25 02:07 PM
1

Most men can find a girlfriend, but many have strong physical preferences for the most attractive women.
/r/PurplePillDebate05/08/25 07:36 PM
3

Men also say they'll take any woman who has them, when what they really mean is "I want the cute/hot girl to notice me and fall in love with me". It is what it is.
/r/PurplePillDebate05/08/25 08:37 AM
0

I think you're confusing settling for "putting up with less for a man she's already attracted to". Generally people have ideas about what they want in a partner they are attracted to and desire, but when they meet someone who meets that threshold they're more likely to relax their standards in other areas. That's as far as I can tell, anyway.
/r/PurplePillDebate03/08/25 08:21 PM
–

I see men everywhere say to "settle" for a 7/10, which is 2 whole points higher than average. This says all you need to know.
/r/PurplePillDebate03/08/25 07:16 PM
2

This is not an unreasonable idea, but the problem is that with "heterodivergence" comes non-conventional attractiveness standards. If you want to date a woman who is not expecting you to be a manly-man, you realistically can't expect her to be a girly girl. That means she doesn't shave every day, doesn't keep her hair long and perfect, doesn't necessarily put emphasis on her figure and appearance the way traditionally feminine women do, that sort of thing. For a lot of men who have struggles wit…
/r/PurplePillDebate02/08/25 11:23 PM
1

Hell, I'll throw a bone and say that I can be one of these guys, in the sense that I've felt vulnerable to some of the demoralizing rhetoric. I've been "accused" of being Chad simply becuase women paid me any attention at all, but in reality I'm what I think would be considered average when I aggregate all my positive, neutral and negative qualities. I meet women sometimes who are really into me, most are neutral, some are completely turned off. I don't think men being completely involuntarily c…
/r/PurplePillDebate02/08/25 09:47 PM
2

I wonder if this is one of those incidents of comparison stealing joy. Many average guys get some success, but because of the Internet they are exposed to those top shelf guys who get way more attention. So they look at them and think it's basically over because if they aren't winning that much, it's hopeless. Then they go into various rabbit holes which tell them that their dating life is fucked if they aren't Chad so they should give up. Nevermind that they got some attention; if they're not g…
/r/PurplePillDebate02/08/25 09:30 PM
4

And on the other hand, when women turn to feminism and try to make programs ‘teaching boys to be ashamed of their masculinity’ (teaching them not to be menaces to society), refuse to date Trump supporters, wont date bigots, the MeToo movement, cancelling men they find to be awful, etc. then the reaction is “YOU GUYS ARE INSANE! None of this will work and will drive men to the redpill!“ I'm responding to this paragraph here. My point is that this is not exactly correct. Women are not "turning to …
/r/PurplePillDebate01/08/25 08:53 PM
6

It's not unrelated. I'm disagreeing with your take that women turn to feminism and "punish" guys who seem more conservative leaning, because most people are arguably more conservative in the sense that they would rather preserve the status quo. They might want reforms to things like healthcare and minimum wage, that doesn't necessarily mean they want to dismantle capitalism or even that they don't have the capacity to be bigoted. Most women I meet and talk to don't seem very feminist, if we're b…
/r/PurplePillDebate01/08/25 03:38 PM
4

True. I don't think it's completely unreasonable to think it at first, since political polarization runs super rampant. But it's a bit sobering to remember that just because someone thinks healthcare in the US is too expensive, doesn't make them a radfem leftist by default.
/r/PurplePillDebate01/08/25 03:14 PM
4

The issue isn't that being outgoing and funny aren't being nice, the issue is that women don't prioritize kindness, altruism or whatever traits men think they should prioritize during mate selection. I used those as examples but they could be interchangeable with basically anything. The thing is that personality can vary, like music genres or movies. And when someone says they like a good personality, you might hear that and interpret what it means when the person saying it means something else.…
/r/PurplePillDebate01/08/25 03:03 PM
0

Men hear that women like a "good personality", then pre-suppose/project their own idea of a good personality. Then, they get upset when some womens' idea of a good personality is outgoing, funny, maybe even a bit asshole-ish and arrogant over simply being a nice, good, pleasant guy. As it turns out, not all women are sweet kind little angels who only say they want to date sweet little nice guys who wouldn't ever upset them. A lot of women want a guy who they can relate to, feel chemistry and att…
/r/PurplePillDebate01/08/25 02:47 PM
6

Not wanting to date someone because you're not attracted to them doesn't mean you're treating them worse. Sure, there's something to be said about halo effect and pretty privelege, which I won't deny, but strictly not dating or fucking someone doesn't mean treating them unfairly. If we think there should be an "equitable" dating market, then men need to start lining up to date overweight, old, single moms. Otherwise, they're just as guilty of prioritizing looks and feelings of attraction and are…
/r/PurplePillDebate01/08/25 02:23 PM
27

I think one belief that needs to die is that women are overwhelmingly feminist and liberal. Plenty of women are "selectively" feminist/liberal and hardly true leftists depending on who you ask. Even more of them are probably more conservative than you think. It seems that way when you come on Reddit sometimes, but even in this sub there is a decent amount of trad women. Women aren't turning to feminism to deconstruct masculinity en masse, and they're not enabling men to be conservative or tradit…
/r/PurplePillDebate01/08/25 02:10 PM
–

Yeah, actually, her appearance alone makes her desirable to men. Because men by their own admission will tell you it's the most important thing, or else why would all the Manosphere guys keep saying they don't care about degrees or social status or anything else, they just want the cute 22 year old Starbucks barista? Most single late 30s dudes would dream of hooking up with a hot woman his age, let alone truly date her, let's be honest.
/r/PurplePillDebate30/07/25 06:03 AM
–

The idea that she's 8/10 so she must be crazy, have a terrible personality or is otherwise "past her prime" is a cope, sorry. No true 8/10 woman at any age is lacking options, especially not in her 30's.
/r/PurplePillDebate29/07/25 11:46 PM
–

If a woman truly is that attractive at that age, she's desirable. There would be no reason to call her an 8/10 if she was not attractive to a significant amount of men. Especially considering that the only men looking at her are typically unmarried bachelors themselves, whose strong desires for good looks haven't changed.
/r/PurplePillDebate29/07/25 10:53 PM
–

An 8/10 woman doesn't bring anything to the table? Seriously, a significantly above average woman brings nothing to the table?
/r/PurplePillDebate29/07/25 09:36 PM
1

That's well and good, but I can think of very few women over the course of my life (like ones I've dated) who haven't wanted a typical masc guy, including progressive and liberal women. They wanted someone who, at the very least, was a little taller than themselves, asked them out first, and kept emotional vulnerability and weakness at a minimum.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/07/25 06:07 AM
4

You said not to point out that men are not a monolith, but I think that's your issue. You're presumably not looking for a relationship with men (plural), you just want a man (singular). In that case, vet strongly, take no shit and don't accept qualities you don't want. It could mean being single for a long time, but that's better than being with someone that's not a good fit for you. Many people have to go on a lot of dates and meet a lot of people before they find someone for them, and while I …
/r/PurplePillDebate28/07/25 12:40 AM
1

Usually it was aimed at me alone, though I'm not sure why it matters. I believe what that other comment was alluding to is being rejected sucks and stings for most people.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/07/25 11:39 PM
1

Not always. I've rejected women and experienced them being pretty cold or even sort of nasty about it.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/07/25 11:26 PM
6

If your point is that average people can get into multiple relationships then I agree. That said, there is a certain group of men who tend to be more sought after than most. And they tend to have many of the qualities that a large group of women select for. When it comes to what people want, there is variation and most people are attractive to someone else, it just so happens that a certain group of men and women are more attractive to more people than the rest of them. It may not be as extreme …
/r/PurplePillDebate27/07/25 09:55 PM
6

I think women can be horny, it's just that because of how selective they are about who they partner with, they can't meet suitable partners as easily. Most people want sex and relationships.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/07/25 06:20 PM
10

Most of those guys look pretty attractive. Good hair, symmetrical faces, in decent shape.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/07/25 05:37 PM
1

OP said men on the app, not men on this sub.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/07/25 04:37 PM
8

This is terrible advice. Having a "likeable personality" is not the same thing as being attractive. Especially not in the case of men, where not performing masculinity - which is arguably more important that being "likeable" - essentially means a life of inceldom. Where many men struggle is simply that being masculine and performing masculinity is not something they feel naturally disposed to. It doesn't just click, it doesn't just come without thinking. They have to consciously adjust their beh…
/r/PurplePillDebate27/07/25 11:21 AM
1

For many people, they get rejected, they feel hurt and want some kind of closure, because making yourself emotionally vulnerable to rejection is pretty difficult for most people to do. When they do get rejected, they possibly look for reasons as to why it happened so they can avoid/correct behavior and avoid rejection in the future. This especially happens with people who aren't necessarily very secure with themselves, and get anxious/preoccupied with romantic outcomes. In this search for answer…
/r/PurplePillDebate27/07/25 12:45 AM
10

I hate how much the masculine and feminine "energy" has been bastardized to basically mean: women are like meak children who can't make decisions because it makes their tummy hurt, and men are brutish oafs who are naturally disposed to try and impose their will on everyone else around them. Yeah, maybe there is some truth to there being a "masculine" side of me that wants to protect, provide and take initiative. The way I've always seen it is that those are things I do when I feel desire for som…
/r/PurplePillDebate25/07/25 04:05 PM
2

I think unattractive can mean a host of things, not just physical appearance.
/r/PurplePillDebate25/07/25 02:51 PM
5

I have yet found a guy here who can tell me what this guy did wrong and why most women rejected him: I will say the way he just metaphorically shouted transphobia is off-putting, but unfortunately is something in traditional masculinity and "bro culture" that never seems to die. There are also plenty of women who would embrace a transphobic guy but I don't wanna get into that here. When I talk about smelling those traits, I mean that they're unattractive. Again, the "issue" is that it's not abou…
/r/PurplePillDebate25/07/25 02:14 PM
8

The "contradiction" is that women's intuition is about detecting bad men. In reality it's more often about detecting attractive vs unattractive ones. It doesn't mean all incels are just really nice guys or that all attractive guys are really assholes, more that women's "intuition" isn't really about good vs bad, it's attractive vs unattractive.
/r/PurplePillDebate25/07/25 02:09 PM
20

Gonna be honest, I think men feel we are being told two conflicting things. On one hand, women can "smell" neuro-divergence, desperation or incel-dom from outer space. On the other hand, this magical ability to detect men's inner qualities and avoid problematic men goes out the window when a hot bad boy shows up. Obviously being attractive is going to get you much farther (rule 1 & 2), but that's the whole "problem". It's not always about avoiding bad men, it's about avoiding men you're not attr…
/r/PurplePillDebate25/07/25 01:32 PM
2

That's fair. I am not close to mine either, and I think many people have strained family relationships at best.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/07/25 12:06 AM
4

Why don't you want him close to his family? I ask because usually people say the opposite, in that not being close to family is a red flag.
/r/PurplePillDebate20/07/25 11:51 PM
8

To me it seems like the amount and frequency with which people "approach" each other is vastly over-stated. There are so many other ways people meet - at church, work, school, co-ed activities, through mutual friends or family. Even dating apps almost don't count as "approach" because most of them require you to match each other first, not just go and initiate a blind interaction with a stranger. I have to wonder if women are being led to believe that they should just sit and wait for guys to "a…
/r/PurplePillDebate19/07/25 03:19 PM
5

I think for some guys it's more like "if I approach I won't succeed unless I'm Chad so there is no point". I don't necessarily agree with this point, but it can be seen as valid depending on who is saying it. To which the answer tends to be "work on yourself first", but still.
/r/PurplePillDebate19/07/25 12:04 PM
33

Whenever these generalizations come up, the first question I have is what groups of people you're selecting for. Plenty of boys/men do not ask for pictures early, do not blow you off to satiate your pron addiction, do not set mandates on how you dress, act, behave or restrict who you can spend time with. Predictably, the ones who don't do these things are either often taken or not seen as desiriable. It's the same when men claim women all act a certain way, i.e. the truisim that "she's not yours…
/r/PurplePillDebate18/07/25 04:02 PM
2

I think you and I agree more than we disagree. I'm always trying to fix, solve, change and do better. And people around me say I worry too much, I beat myself up, I already do enough and shouldn't stress so much. I wish I could just not stress and let things flow, but I also like to "take action" when I can. Thing is, if other people involved don't want to take the same action or any action at all, it makes it that much harder. It can be a struggle to want to change and do better when the people…
/r/PurplePillDebate18/07/25 01:36 PM
1

Sometimes there isn't a problem you can solve easily if at all. Sometimes shit just happens. Sometimes you couldn't have necessarily done anything better, especially if other parties with agency are involved that were going in a different direction either. If your girlfriend breaks up with you because she lost feelings for you, you can beat yourself up and say that being more manly would have made her stay. Or you can accept that people and circumstances change and not everything works out. I be…
/r/PurplePillDebate18/07/25 12:26 PM
3

Ultimately, therapy is just escapism. You're not actually confronting your faults, you're escaping from them through dishonest analysis and the endless pursuit of excuses. I disagree with this, and strongly. I believe people conflate "actionable advice" with being useful in a way that it's not. It can be much more difficult to take that action if you're stymed by social anxiety, insecurity, shame, a deep sense of unworthineness, or any other myriad things. Ideally, therapy is helping you work th…
/r/PurplePillDebate18/07/25 11:15 AM
6

As a guy, I like to "talk about my problems" because sometimes I just have shit going on and need to shoot the shit with a friend over a beer or something. I'm not necessarily seeking advice or any actionable solution. If someone comes to me talking about a bad day at work, what advice could I possibly give them? Sometimes shit just happens, and you wanna talk about it with someone. I sort of resent this idea that men only ever want to "solve problems", because I noticed people hear this and the…
/r/PurplePillDebate18/07/25 11:01 AM
3

I honestly believe that the people who need this the most struggle with it because they haven't had a good model for pro social behavior growing up, or they had a thwarted sense of belonging at some point in their life. There are other factors including accountability for the individual, but ultimately I think when someone has a failure to launch in a social sense, it's a symptom not a cause. i.e. someone who can't talk to women/people feel some overwhelming sense of shame or like they aren't go…
/r/PurplePillDebate13/07/25 05:49 PM
31

I do think men are a lot pickier than they will let on. Every time I read on this sub that men "just want someone who will have them", I find it curious because it doesn't seem to match what I see in person. Frankly, I'd argue there is an 80/20 effect with how many men pursue the same smaller pool of women who range from "cute" to "hot" on the conventional scale. They also confuse the fact that those women that they don't desire have some options, with those women having seemingly limitless opti…
/r/PurplePillDebate13/07/25 11:27 AM
–

With the exception of tall, I don't think "dark" or even "handsome" are specific enough to generalize as a preference for most women. We aren't supposed to talk about race on this sub, which makes responding to this post tricky because ultimately, the "dark" in tall, dark and handsome doesn't necesssarily mean the same thing to different people, and handsome can be subjective for the same reason.
/r/PurplePillDebate13/07/25 11:14 AM
–

To be fair there is "gaslighting" sometimes, especially on social media. Oh, people don't really care about height/weight/hairline/income/dick size etc. Looks just get you in the door, personality is what counts! Of course that implies the door doesn't open at all if you don't have the looks, but I digress.
/r/PurplePillDebate13/07/25 08:37 AM
9

I've noticed a lot of people concentrate their "preferences" into a narrow subset of people at the top where the conventionally attractive ones are. You can be kind and decent to people you're not attracted to sexually or romantically, and advocate other people doing the same, but also not want to be with them.
/r/PurplePillDebate12/07/25 02:58 AM
2

"Men are socialized differently than women" seems to have started to warp into being simply that women get told how to talk to each other and men don't, but I don't think that's true. When I hear things like "men don't want to talk about their problems" or "men like to compete and show off", I have to raise an eyebrow. Those things don't always apply to me, and even if they do, it's not always in the way people think. But if society is being "trained" that men and boys are a certain way, people …
/r/PurplePillDebate05/07/25 03:45 PM
1

One other thing I have noticed is women sort of have this inherent social desirability that men don't. Them simply being in the room or on the couch next to someone is often a welcome addition, but men aren't typically as well received and their presence isn't as desirable. To be fair I believe there is a point women do need to look out for themselves and put themselves first. But since they're human beings just like men, they also have this notorious self interest guiding them, so they can of c…
/r/PurplePillDebate05/07/25 02:52 PM
4

It seems like we have these built-in biases about how girls/women and boys/men are different and it colors our perception of what's really going on. Young men have to deal with the pressure of being expected to initiate and "lead" their relationships in a way women aren't. We also simultaenously have this belief as a society that women are just inherently better at socializing. So not only do men feel more pressure to succeed socially, they are being told that they are almost expected to fail or…
/r/PurplePillDebate05/07/25 02:24 PM
12

It's sad that we've gotten to a point where so many people feel like painful and expensive cosmetic surgery is what they need in order to make their lives better. Especially something that compromises their ability to perform basic functions like walking or climbing stairs.
/r/PurplePillDebate05/07/25 02:04 PM
1

A lot of younger Gen Z women I've talked to as a younger millennial have this same problem. It's obvious after a few interactions that an increasing number of younger folks have issues that come from having their face stuck to their phone all day. I know there is this narrative that women are all social butterflies with expansive networks of people, but I seem to meet quite a few who have trouble keeping friends and struggle to get into healthy romantic dynamics. They will constantly get into fi…
/r/PurplePillDebate05/07/25 02:00 PM
5

Sort of, but in a different sense. The women I know who "struggle with dating" struggle to have men that they want, whereas men who struggle often struggle to attract attention at all.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/06/25 03:55 PM
16

I think tragically, a lot of MGTOW is a lot of dudes with little/no experience with women, who get jaded by stories and content they see online which makes women out to be evil succubi, before they've had much opportunity to really meet different women and potentially date some of them. To your point though, you see guys who date "golddigger" women and project that on to all women, and tell all men to avoid women because "AWALT". Next thing you know, we have an entire "movement" of guys who swea…
/r/PurplePillDebate27/06/25 09:39 PM
32

Generalizing here of course, but from what I've seen women have less issue "decentering men" than the other way around. Largely because they are the ones being pursued, so they can simply reject any/all romantic invitations and remain alone until they feel otherwise. Men who give up on dating very often weren't being chosen or having much luck at all.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/06/25 09:28 PM
105

It's not something men will wear on their sleeve outside of internet anonymity because it invites way too much shame.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/06/25 08:45 PM
3

True. COVID in particular did a number on society by accelerating the social atomization by normalizing it, and I think its effects on our socialization among other things will be studied for decades to come.
/r/PurplePillDebate23/06/25 01:10 AM
–

I mean, I encourage anyone to try. I'm 5' 5" myself and have been rejected over it, but I've also had women show a lot of interest, even ones taller than me.
/r/PurplePillDebate23/06/25 12:54 AM
–

5' 8" is fine. It's not until 5' 6" and below that you're considered really short to the point it's a deal breaker.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/06/25 11:28 PM
19

This is true in some ways, but like many things requires some nuance. I don't think society really cares that much about women. I think there is a surface level consideration for women that appears more conscious than it is for men, but it's usually for attractive women. Feminity is something you "earn" by being conventionally attractive, as people aren't climbing over themselves to take care of you if you're not good looking. But besides that, throughout history women have been oppressed and co…
/r/PurplePillDebate21/06/25 09:23 AM
0

Are men really that much more attracted to women? I know a lot of guys predictably get down bad for the same range of "girl next door" to "drop dead gorgeous", or in other words cute to very pretty women. I don't see most of that attention concentrated around very plain or just not very conventionally attractive women. Likewise, women predictably line up to go after the same handsome, tall, broad shouldered athletic and masculine guys. The reason I bring all this up, is that I think the attracti…
/r/PurplePillDebate20/06/25 02:23 PM
80

I believe that sometimes, when people talk about setting boundaries, they treat it like it's a magical button you push to get people to respect you. It isn't. Sometimes when you set a boundary, the person you're trying to set it with won't agree with it or have issues with violating it multiple times. The point of boundaries isn't really to control people, although I think that's what people think they're there for. The idea isn't to get people to fall into line with your life, it's to vet for w…
/r/PurplePillDebate14/06/25 12:07 PM
3

You can want whatever you want. I don't mind the idea of treating a woman extremely well in a relationship, but that's something that happens as a consequence of desire and love, not something you're owed. Just like we tell men women don't owe them sex, men don't owe them special treatment.
/r/PurplePillDebate11/06/25 02:44 PM
18

If you think women are all selfish, entitled and bring nothing to the table besides looks, maybe you shouldn't be pursuing them, I agree. For most men, they want to experience intimacy and are willing to face potential rejection to get what they want. If you think that men ignoring women en masse will make those women want them, unfortunately a lot of the guys who think like you do (that women are entitled and offer nothing) aren't really the ones women are after, yet are usually the ones who th…
/r/PurplePillDebate10/06/25 08:52 AM
6

I think there is a darker side to this where girls are forced to grow up because the world around them is sexualizing them at such a young age.
/r/PurplePillDebate07/06/25 08:33 PM
3

Probably because it betrays ideas men have about women as purile virginal wives vs depraved sex fiends, aka the Madonna-Whore complex. It's also about feeling like you're not good enough as you are because of your passivity; you want to be sweet, kind, maybe even meek and timid because it doesn't challenge you and ask more of you. It's hard to change sometimes because it means accepting that what you're doing isn't working and sort of implies that who both are right now isn't good enough.
/r/PurplePillDebate07/06/25 12:31 AM
9

I think the disillusion and "lying" isn't about believing women don't like the athletes and dude bros and alphas. I think it's when guys come to realize they are expected to perform masculinity, in a way that feels alien and not like "being themselves". By all means, most men learn sooner or later that being the alpha - that is, having the status, resources, something to offer - is appealing on the surface. What they're not necessarily prepared for is the way they have to perform masculinity con…
/r/PurplePillDebate06/06/25 03:34 PM
–

I think what's more telling is the lack of connection. I have a lot of interests, many of them are kind of niche and personal. I can find people to get involved in what I'm doing but there has to be a connection first. You don't generally go from meeting someone to hanging out at the bar watching a game - you make conversation and organically from relationships and get invited out. At the end of the day the connections and feelings people have with you matter far more than liking the same shit i…
/r/PurplePillDebate04/06/25 12:23 AM
6

I don't really expect or want women to make things equitable, they can do whatever they want. I'd rather women operate in their sexual and romantic lives with freedom and knowing they desire the people they're with. I just don't agree with this notion that women having it easier is solely imposed by men. Men are constantly told that we have to be the ones to take the lead and pursue/escalate all our relationships with women, by other men and women alike. We are told that outcomes in relationship…
/r/PurplePillDebate01/06/25 01:00 AM
3

All I said is that women themselves said they don't give a shit. Not that they should give a shit. you do realize them having an easier time is cause of men right? Well, yes and no. I think some women are complicit to systems which elevate their advantages at the expense of men, the same way many people in general engage in some level of self interest before the interest of others. There are, for example, camgirls/sex workers who obviously rely on the economy and existence of a steady supply of …
/r/PurplePillDebate31/05/25 10:33 PM
9

I've seen multiple comments on here from women saying they know it's easier for them to date and have sex, and they don't give a shit, so I'm not sure what you're talking about.
/r/PurplePillDebate31/05/25 09:04 PM
3

I suspect a lot of incels that notoriously struggle to date also have a desire to be with more traditionally feminine women. As much as some guys accuse women/feminists of being hypocrites for wanting masc men, I have reason to believe a lot of those guys wouldn't necessarily go for women who defy gender roles by doing things like not shaving their body hair every day, or meticulously watching their weight.
/r/PurplePillDebate31/05/25 03:01 PM
–

I haven't been able to find the qualities I look for in a partner in all but a handful of people. It didn't work out with those people, so I've decided to stay single "indefinitely". I don't put in much easier effort to find someone because I don't really believe what I'm looking for is out there, unless I left the state/country which isn't in the cards right now. Disclaimer: I am not talking strictly about conventional attractiveness, nor am I alluding to some notion that "western women" are of…
/r/PurplePillDebate28/05/25 12:06 AM
1

Most people don't respond well to vulnerability in my experience. At best they simply don't know how to handle it, at worst it puts them off. I've actually ended up losing guys as friends when I was younger because I turned out to have a "soft side", and many men inherently can't respect that, let alone women finding it unattractive. There's different reasons for why different people do it, but as a rule most people find confidence, assertiveness and strength attractive, and signs of weakness un…
/r/PurplePillDebate26/05/25 12:36 AM
1

The "bare minimum" is to be attractive to the other person. When I say attractive, I don't just mean looks, although they obviously play a large part. Overall I see attraction as an aggregate of qualities; not just raw physical appearance, but how you present yourself, your mannerisms, the way you relate to others, especially the one in question. You know how people say when someone is into you, they make it easy? That's because they find you attractive. All those things you mentioned certainly …
/r/PurplePillDebate23/05/25 09:34 AM
1

Half expect it to get nuked for "creating a circle jerk and inciting rhetoric".
/r/PurplePillDebate22/05/25 09:03 PM
2

I don't just indiscriminately befriend men or women just for the sake of a perceived gender-specific friendship dynamic. I befriend people who I get along with, ideally without any ulterior motive. Maybe a long time ago I was naive enough to get stuck in the trap of trying to befriend a woman before dating her but I quickly grew out of it, as I imagine most people do.
/r/PurplePillDebate19/05/25 09:36 PM
8

My life is better than it's ever been at the moment. Even without a relationship. I had to work my ass off and face many difficulties to be in this place, but so do most people, man or woman.
/r/PurplePillDebate19/05/25 12:36 AM
1

I'm curious to know if you think those women are a good representation of their entire gender. Because from where I sit, it takes a certain type of woman to even attend a speed dating event; particularly, the kind that wants to filter for "Chad" in the first place.
/r/PurplePillDebate17/05/25 08:38 PM
3

It doesn't seem like most men have access to sex for free, with any consistency, outside a committed relationship (and that still is no guarantee). Maybe I'm wrong.
/r/PurplePillDebate12/05/25 02:27 PM
5

I'm of the opinion that things work out if they are supposed to. If I have to "fight" for a relationship, it likely isn't meant to be.
/r/PurplePillDebate11/05/25 07:30 PM
-1

Social + biological pressure for sexual success. Sexual frustration is a difficult load to bear, especially for a long time. No, sex is not a need in the way that food and water are. No, sex is not owed to anyone. No, women shouldn't have to lower their standards to date men they don't find attractive. Yes, having a decent attitude and pushing to improve and try for what you want is beneficial. This doesn't preclude "feeling some type of way" when you just want to enjoy the warm embrace and plea…
/r/PurplePillDebate03/05/25 04:29 PM
–

That's not what's wrong. What's wrong is if a bunch of dudes want relationships and can't get them. I think that's kind of sad, and it would be nice if men who wanted to be in a relationship had the emotional tools and practical means to make it happen. Again, not through some kind of state mandated "girlfriends for incels" program, but by socializing more men to be able to find and form good, quality relationships with women.
/r/PurplePillDebate02/05/25 04:05 PM
-2

There are just too many My Tinder Data posts of people swiping literally thousands of times and getting nothing. We are talking about men who put in months, years of effort, hundreds of dollars in premium tiers, and get almost nothing. For the men this applies to, as unfortunate as it is, I'm not so sure it's a sign that dating is broken, at least not in the way you're describing. It sounds more like they aren't doing the right things in order to be attractive to women. Just because you're putti…
/r/PurplePillDebate02/05/25 03:53 PM
3

People in general just want a partner they like and are attracted to, and share their life goals. I don't think its much more complicated than this, nor does it need to be. You can make yourself crazy feeling resentful toward people who don't find you attractive when you think they "should", or you can move on and find someone who is. If you can't find anyone who's attracted to you, maybe you need to change something, or maybe you're just unlucky. I don't really know how many women are picky bec…
/r/PurplePillDebate02/05/25 03:16 PM
–

I don't expect women as a group to fix male loneliness. I've already said that I advocate for their sexual liberation and freedom, and I don't expect them to date down or try to "help" men outside of basic social kindness. And the thing is, it's actually really difficult to "help" men when their problem is essentially "I can't get a girlfriend". Many guys have some redeeming qualities and some not-so-redeeming qualities, and it seems almost like a luck of the draw that some guys partner up and s…
/r/PurplePillDebate02/05/25 02:23 PM
–

That is an interesting find. It's also not that surprising. I've known maybe a small handful of women who had issues dating, but it was almost always about the quality of options, not a distinct lack of them.
/r/PurplePillDebate02/05/25 01:35 PM
–

This is all true, though I'm not sure explains all the "disparities" I see. Like, we could say that only the most genetically blessed guys get to procreate, but we see short/bald/unattractive men with partners all the time. Thing being there, is they are usually with their looksmatch/socio-economic equal. And a lot of the "lonely, sexless" men get really hung up on dating more attractive women, perhaps without even realizing it. I think for the most part, people who just want a relationship can …
/r/PurplePillDebate02/05/25 11:38 AM
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If you look at my post history here, you'll see that I consistently advocate for sexual freedom, consent, and not relying on forces like economic or societal coercion to force women to date unattractive men. I still do. When I say "something went wrong", I mean that it could possibly be telling that more and more men aren't socialized well enough to attract women. This is not the fault of women, it's just possibly a consequence of women not having to settle. The solution isn't to make women sett…
/r/PurplePillDebate02/05/25 11:33 AM
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I don't disagree, but if there is an alarming number of people who can't get relationships, maybe something somewhere went wrong. Even down to an individual level, it's not always his "fault" that he was born in circumstances that make attracting someone more difficult. It is, however, his responsibility.
/r/PurplePillDebate02/05/25 10:42 AM
1

5) Most women prefer lean muscle, not body builder builds. Think swimmer’s bodies. Interesting. There's an entire post here from yesterday about "most" women preferring bulky, stocky guys.
/r/PurplePillDebate30/04/25 07:45 AM
81

Have a reasonable level of wariness around all human beings, regardless of gender. I can't imagine you believe men are inherently more trustworthy than women - because they aren't. But the whole "if they wanted to they would" truism is supposed to teach people to manage their expectations and not self-inflict romantic pain by becoming needy and desperate and falling into a sort of limerence/oneitis/anxious attachment. There's a reason PUA and RedPill guys have made countless articles and videos …
/r/PurplePillDebate28/04/25 12:37 AM
5

One that's born out of the most desire, and the least coercion and societal/financial pressure or influence. Meaning, if two "trads" want to partner up, they are passionate and in love and they consent to a male breadwinner/female supporter dynamic or something, that's their call and it's nobody else's to make. Likewise if two more "progressive" people want a more equal relationship, without roles or with different roles, they both consent to it, it makes them happy, it's their choice to make an…
/r/PurplePillDebate26/04/25 05:30 PM
12

I don't think this has stopped all that much. Even if only dating is the "most popular" method, it still accounts for like 1/3 of how couples are meeting (vs 2/3 who meet elsewhere), and it's a tool to facilitate an in-person meeting anyways. Many people can and do want to meet in person. They just don't want to have their time wasted by the wrong people, meaning people they aren't attracted to and aren't compatible with. As tough as it is to accept, rejection is going to be a more common occure…
/r/PurplePillDebate26/04/25 05:14 PM
10

IDK man, if you struggle with family issues it could just be an unfortunate or even toxic family dynamic. If you feel like you don't have friends, ask yourself if you had friends before and you drifted apart or had indifferences. Sometimes it's not necessarily anyone's fault, things just don't always work out or stand the test of time. You even say yourself that "important relationships remain but women leave" but this is not always true. For many adults I've met, their romantic partnerships and…
/r/PurplePillDebate26/04/25 12:44 PM
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We make it depressive by thinking about it in terms of good and evil. This isn't reallly about good and evil. This is about perspective. This is not sucuumbing to any number of bias, and how it affects your outlook. Whether you realize it or not, your outlook and perspective can and will shape your outcomes. This in itself is basically a self-fulfilling prophechy. Again, maybe without realizing it, your post basically reads like yo fellas, if you haven't had luck in dating, there's not really mu…
/r/PurplePillDebate26/04/25 11:29 AM
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I definitely think the dating app discourse has poisoned the well. I remember seeing a post/comment here the other day about single moms, specifically asking why men seem to think single moms at 30 are all that common when they aren't. The reason is becuase of dating apps, and probably social media.
/r/PurplePillDebate26/04/25 11:15 AM
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Man, this whole premise is just so depressing and demoralizing. If you're single later in life, it must be because you're a desperate lonely virgin and the only women left are crazy, horrible partners. Is that really what you're rolling with? By all means having no "luck" could mean it's time to reflect, but it's also largely a numbers game. Plenty of people meet the love of their life past the expected milestone marker of around ~25. It's really telling what your opinion is on people if you thi…
/r/PurplePillDebate26/04/25 10:27 AM
2

I (21F) often hear from other women that successful women have a harder time dating because men are intimidated. Being successful is a non-starter. It's sort of like being a "nice guy". Without other considerations, it doesn't alone make for relationship success. If someone struggles to date, it's probably not because they're too successful. It could be because they struggle to meet someone who matches or succeeds them in their success. It could be because they describe themselves as "successful…
/r/PurplePillDebate24/04/25 10:41 PM
16

Realistically, there is no shortcut. Dress better, socialize often, acquire status, talk to women, and be comfortable hitting on them and asking them out. Many guys think they do this but they don't. They dress okay, and have a social circle, but so do most guys. If the issue is getting a girlfriend at all, the advice is that they will find someone some day who "likes them for who they are". But if the goal is to learn game and become more attractive, they have to put in the work, because player…
/r/PurplePillDebate19/04/25 07:26 PM
10

How many men vs women watch porn as a group? I suspect far more men overall watch porn compared to women, so the group of women who even watch porn, let alone the violent hardcore stuff, is still relatively smaller compared to what it is for men.
/r/PurplePillDebate18/04/25 11:00 AM
7

Many men get the idea that being nice will earn them favors with women when they hear women complaining about men being assholes and treating them badly. What they don't realize is that people complaining about their own relationships is fairly normal, and not necessarily an indication that being "better" than the people they're complaining about will make them inherently more desiriable. I was raised with my sister, by our mom. Between the two of them, they were not exactly shy about what made …
/r/PurplePillDebate15/04/25 08:12 AM
3

Don't worry about your standards being high. Worry about finding someone you connect with and feel attraction for. Not many men will meet all your requirements but that's not necessarily a bad thing. It just means you have to be actively trying to meet more people until you get in front of the right person. I don't think height should matter that much because of one bad experience with a short guy, but I won't tell you who you should or shouldn't weed out. Just to maybe be open to it if he offer…
/r/PurplePillDebate13/04/25 08:54 PM
2

Yes, and a lot of guys get into deeper night life stuff. Partying. Aka drug and alcohol addiction. But none of us are perfect and I understand they have something to offer even if they take some darker paths in life.
/r/PurplePillDebate13/04/25 08:47 PM
2

I don't see much issue with this. It's not going to work with everyone, but not everything works for everyone. You have nothing to lose at least trying to better your situation with sex and romance, especially if it means presenting yourself the best way possible and learning to socialize as a whole. This is the kind of "Manosphere" content I miss; motivational, inspiring, but not without the reality that it takes work to get good at relationships with people, let alone with women. I had a frien…
/r/PurplePillDebate13/04/25 08:12 PM
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Honestly I feel like you're doing the opposite thing, telling single people they basically should be miserable and that they need sex and a relationship in order to live a good life. Maybe that's not your intention but it's how it comes across. This just kind of re-enforces the misery and desperation a lot of single people tend to feel. Keep in mind that when many people are frustrated that they can't find a relationship, what they might mean is they can't find a satisfying one. Being in a relat…
/r/PurplePillDebate13/04/25 12:19 PM
12

This might sound harsh, but the type of person that a dating app appeals to is often not the same type of person who has a lot of luck on there. If you live a good social life and demonstrate it in your social media profile, it's easy to port that over and show it to the world and attract people with that. But if you're pretty insular and don't go out much, you don't have many photos of yourself especially not with other people, so dating apps are going to be less fruitful. I'm sure many people …
/r/PurplePillDebate12/04/25 05:13 PM
0

I can't really think of a male space that's a corollary to feminism. The term feminism is loaded with baggage because it's been co-opted by different groups to mean "female empowerment over men", when in reality its about doing away with patriarchy, and its oppressive gender roles and expectations. Ironically it could be the biggest Red Pill ally, because it means men no longer feel like they are expected to perform masculinity in order to be rewarded by society, as RP states it. But the thing i…
/r/PurplePillDebate12/04/25 03:12 PM
4

But having someone interested in the same things isn't that unrealistic. That kind of "hyper fixation" on random subjects is typically a neruo-diverse trait, and often (but not always) pairs with other qualities that make socializing and pairing off more difficult.
/r/PurplePillDebate11/04/25 07:41 PM
11

I don't think being into nerdy things like anime and video games is nearly as detrimental to dating as neuro divergence, which is often present in nerdy guys to some degree.
/r/PurplePillDebate11/04/25 07:24 PM
2

This is one of those things that happens to enough guys, I think. Most men I've talked to have expressed more or less that they feel like they have to act a certain way in order to get women interested, and keep them interested. And that expressing certain emotions makes them seem weaker and less attractive. Of course, the argument to be made up front is that well, if you are unregulated and just emotionally vomitted to someone, it'll turn them off. And I can see that, to a degree. But I think i…
/r/PurplePillDebate11/04/25 06:03 PM
38

don't want to pay, don't ask anyone out It's funny how we men often get told that we must ask you out, then it gets turned into "since you asked me out, you should be the one to pay".
/r/PurplePillDebate11/04/25 02:19 PM
4

I don't think the demand matters. Women aren't thinking they are attractive because guys throw themselves at them. They want what they want and are not going to settle for someone they aren't attracted to. I really don't think women walk through life believing they're unattractive, download an app and then decide they want a better choice because they have options. They wouldn't settle even if they had less options, which is perfectly understandable.
/r/PurplePillDebate11/04/25 02:01 PM
4

To be honest, the women who receive loads of attention usually either go out of their way to find it or they're actually pretty attractive. Wherever I go it's usually a smaller group of attractive women that get more attention from men. If she's old or fat, it's less likely she's drowning in options. Guys don't just obsess over any women, they want someone who, in their opinion, is hot, or at least cute.
/r/PurplePillDebate11/04/25 12:19 PM
3

OP, think about the last time a woman you weren't attracted to was showing interest. I mean, someone you wouldn't even sleep with, let alone date. Think about someone you just felt nothing for at all essentially throwing themselves at you. That's how women feel about a lot of their options. At best, you're flattered that someone finds you attractive but you still have to let them down nicely. At worst, you feel turned off and just want them to go away. But it's not always an ego boost, especiall…
/r/PurplePillDebate11/04/25 12:00 PM
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This feels like a really small minority that gets called upon to justify misogyny, if I'm being really honest.
/r/PurplePillDebate09/04/25 12:46 AM
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I'm confused. I don't know what your point is. You're the one basically self identifying as a misogynist, to the point that I wonder why you'd even bother getting married. And being in a shitty marriage for 15 years doesn't make you "better", sorry to say.
/r/PurplePillDebate09/04/25 12:45 AM
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I said nothing about being an incel. In fact I said nothing that really suggests that having frustrations around things like dating and relationships means you have never experienced them, especially not when you consider you'd have to experience them to have those frustrations. You're the one claiming you essentially hate an entire group of people and hold them in contempt because of their "nature", which again, is a pretty bad road to take.
/r/PurplePillDebate09/04/25 12:22 AM
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You sure this is the word you wanna use? From a Google search defining misogyny dislike of, contempt for, or ingrained prejudice against women. Like, it's fine to have dating struggles and vent about being ghosted or be upset when you're cheated on, broken up with etc. But straight up hating women because you believe their "nature" as prescribed by a bunch of internet dudes is the source of your frustration? That's not a road you wanna go down. I promise you.
/r/PurplePillDebate09/04/25 12:15 AM
2

I've never seen anyone on any side say that personal growth or change in a desire to improve outcomes is bad, except black pillers. Maybe that changing in order to get people to like you is bad, but "becoming the best version of yourself" is never seen as bad. "Blue pill" is not telling people to bury their head in the sand and act like attraction isn't important. Arguably it doesn't even exist, since blue pill doesn't mean much except "not red pill", and often times all it takes is for a dude t…
/r/PurplePillDebate06/04/25 07:30 PM
3

A lot of the most useful red pill advice can be had elsewhere, from normal guys with relationship success that don't have to tack on the obligatory resentment, misogyny and anti-feminist rhetoric that cannot seem to be detached from red pill. It would be one thing if it was just the dudes trying to figure out dating, like in r/seduction. But no, it's an entire worldview where you have to swallow a metaphorical pill and "wake up to the reality" which is something like: feminism, hypergamy and oth…
/r/PurplePillDebate06/04/25 05:13 PM
1

Some guys won't date female virgins for similar reasons men won't, but the number one turn offs I hear about women who are virgins is that their lack of experience makes them bad in bed, and/or they get concerned that she'll be attached to him because he was her first. And oftentimes, people who prefer sexual experience for the sake of a better lay are the types to have casual sex and higher body counts, and not necessarily place value in low body count or intimacy with the "right" person. So it…
/r/PurplePillDebate06/04/25 04:57 PM
2

I sort of call bullshit on men peaking at 50. Unless we are talking strictly financially, most men at this age are certainly not more sexually desiriable. People like Brad Pitt are obviously the exception and not the rule. I will give you this, society at large places a lot of emphasis on the idea that younger=hotter for women. Some of it is biologically informed, some of it is societally re-enforced. But it also places a lot of pressure on men for their looks, especially when it comes to things…
/r/PurplePillDebate05/04/25 12:37 PM
2

I don't know of any guy who thinks needing to be employed is asking too much. But a decent amount get sucked into online content spheres that tell them average incomes aren't enough and you have to be able to spend like $300/week to date a woman at minimum.
/r/PurplePillDebate05/04/25 03:01 AM
5

I know multiple men who are married to women who make more than them. Even if it's statistically uncommon, a good number of men and women don't subscribe to the belief that one gender should match or exceed the earnings of the other as some kind of principle.
/r/PurplePillDebate05/04/25 01:54 AM
2

You can marry your HS sweetheart and be with them for life. You can manage a string of several relationships for decades that never stick, and end up alone later in life. I don't think we will ever agree, but I don't see how a relationship that ends, especially because one person just said "sorry, I can't be with someone who has the health issues that you do" isn't a failed one. No amount of learning relationship skills is going to make the wrong person want to be with you.
/r/PurplePillDebate04/04/25 02:39 PM
1

Yeah. Relationships fail. And if they fail, again, I'm arguing they weren't really that great. If they were, there wouldn't be compatibility issues or interpersonal skills dooming them. And maybe those act as life lessons for the future, but my concern is with guys who think a relationship is just 24/7 access to intimacy and validation without any downsides. These types of dudes are usually the ones who catch oneitis, get blindsided by a failed relationship, and end up taking the pills.
/r/PurplePillDebate04/04/25 01:54 PM
1

I've said no such thing. I've said that relationships that end, probably end for a reason, and I would argue that a relationship which ends is a failed one. It doesn't matter how good it was at the start, of how you felt, what matters is if the commitment lasted. You can call it black pill if you want, but to me a black pill would be telling the guy with health issues that no woman would ever want him. My idea is more like, those women and relationships were not the right ones if they didn't wor…
/r/PurplePillDebate04/04/25 01:38 PM
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I think the fact that we've started to equate people's value with somoene wanting to have sex with them or date them is pretty twisted. Even if you consider the best case, where mostly only "good" people with all the on-paper attractive qualities get into relationships etc., you're still having to factor how completely arbitrary a person's standards are, or their resonance/chemistry with another that makes them even want to be together.
/r/PurplePillDebate04/04/25 11:42 AM
4

Honest question: have you tried reframing any of this? I'm not trying to debate you into submission, I just wonder if this way of thinking, even if you believe it to be so true, is hurting or helping you. Relationships can often be wonderful for a time. Many relationships enter and exit a "honeymoon phase", and after leaving that phase, one or both people realize they can't stand each other and break up. This happens all the time in romantic relationships. I think if they end, it's usually becau…
/r/PurplePillDebate04/04/25 01:23 AM
-1

Dating is in the cards for most men. The reason many men are single is more of a choice than they realize. Their frustration is not with the fact that no woman pay them attention, it's that the attractive women - at least, the women they find attractive - don't pay them the kind of attention I want. I'm not saying men cannot be lonely, or that all men are super shallow. But in my observation, having known many men, and having been in many mixed-gender environments, I see the same dynamic prop up…
/r/PurplePillDebate04/04/25 01:10 AM
1

A couple things: One, if those romantic relationships you had were so wonderful, why did they end? Wouldn't the best romantic partnership stand the test of time? Two: you're really underselling the value of being without the stress and nonsense of a bad relationship. A toxic relationship. You're basically romanticizing the best possible romantic relationships while, going back to point one, glossing over why so many of them tend to end in the first place. Those butterflies, the romantic intimacy…
/r/PurplePillDebate04/04/25 12:51 AM
2

Almost every time I've gotten advice from someone else, it's either been irrelevant or blown up in my face. I tend to trust my gut about how I feel around the situation and someone else's behavior. I'd say it's like 90% accurate.
/r/PurplePillDebate02/04/25 02:29 PM
1

There's nothing about that advice that "cedes to the red pill", nor is it accepting loneliness. Accepting rejection as a likely outcome isn't about just "lying down and rotting" ala blackpill or checking out like MGTOW. It's about knowing that most people probably aren't going to be interested in the real you, or that your intentions for a relationship - be it a ONS, or LTR - won't be the same intentions she has. Being upfront about your intentions is not saying "just be yourself lol", it's sayi…
/r/PurplePillDebate31/03/25 08:03 AM
8

Maybe, but I've seen Mark Manson get dragged in red pill spaces (including by Rollo Tomassi, the RP "godfather"), because he's too plugged in/blue/beta, whatever that even means.
/r/PurplePillDebate30/03/25 11:41 PM
8

I honestly believe that COVID did a number on socializing for a lot of younger people. Hell, I suspect even older adults are feeling it too. The simultaenous social atrophy and screen addiction that resulted from the pandemic is one that should probably be studied for decades to come, before we truly understand the impact of it. When you really think about it, there are untold millions of young adults who had little/no socializing opportunities for a few of their most critical formative years be…
/r/PurplePillDebate30/03/25 10:59 PM
43

The only "blue bill dating guide" I can think of that's decent is Models by Mark Manson, strictly because it emphasizes working on yourself, accepting rejection as a likely outcome, and being up front with your intentions. It doesn't try to entice you with false hopes that by reading it, you're going to have everything you need to start attracting women "effortlessly".
/r/PurplePillDebate30/03/25 06:39 PM
6

Women who want to be approached either start the conversation or give "choosing signals". Otherwise you're being a door to door salesman for your dick, which is not an easy sell.
/r/PurplePillDebate30/03/25 06:31 PM
3

Even in those contexts it's generally less that one person approaches another as much as two people start talking. Maybe I missed something but I know way too many people who "met" somebody as opposed to "approaching" them. Unless you count striking up a conversation as approaching them, but I don't think most people view it that way. Approaching generally means going up to someone with romantic and sexual intentions out of the gate, opposed to simply talking to people around you and finding che…
/r/PurplePillDebate30/03/25 05:41 PM
6

I can't help but think that approaching is something most people don't do, regardless of gender, and it's not going to have a high success rate for just about anyone. The social "game" where you meet someone through friend groups or shares activities is probably best for most people, but it takes longer and can't be forced as easily as talking to the cute girl on the street.
/r/PurplePillDebate30/03/25 05:29 PM
–

This depends on your goals and priorities. Sleeping around isn't the aim of everyone, and some people are actually turned off by partners with high body counts, men or women. On the other hand, being attractive overall provides a lot of benefits, including but not limitied to improving your romantic success, regardless of whether you want to sleep around or find a special someone to settle down with. What I would caution against is that, for one, being a fuckboy is something you start to "wear" …
/r/PurplePillDebate30/03/25 11:07 AM
10

Unfortunately I think this was an inevitable outcome. While many of them claimed not to blame women or that you shouldn't blame women, there was always this underpinning of resentment toward women and the idea of hypergamy.
/r/PurplePillDebate30/03/25 11:00 AM
15

What I miss most about redpill is that it somewhat used to try to empower men, at least on the surface. It would talk about living in abundance, and not taking rejection personally. It would talk about improving your mate value being something you could do, even if you weren't genetically blessed in every way. It would tell you not to get "oneitis" and obsess over someone who isn't good for you, over moving on to people who are. In some ways it still made women the focus, but it was trying its h…
/r/PurplePillDebate30/03/25 10:42 AM
3

Thanks for your take. Yeah, women definitely have valid reasons to be guarded. I don't blame any of you for it. Guys in the Manosphere used to even tell each other that it's not uncommon for women to be guarded and needing to feel safe, so i am not sure why it's such a point of contention now.
/r/PurplePillDebate30/03/25 10:20 AM
6

Some guys might shoot out of their league, that's why I said it's a potential reason, not the only reason. At the very least, men who struggle in dating might often go after the most sought after women, and simply get out-competed in a sense. >Even if youre a quiet, overweight, nerdy librarian looking chick pushing 30 you have options now. Shit like this is exactly why men should decenter women and relationships to a degree. If you're only after the woman you don't think is that attractive ou to…
/r/PurplePillDebate29/03/25 11:22 PM
5

Average and below men get into relationships all the time. When they don't it's due to a variety of factors, like shooting way out of their league, solely relying on Internet dating and not going out, or just not socializing well.
/r/PurplePillDebate29/03/25 10:52 PM
2

Have you actually talked to feminists writ large or are you getting your ideas about them from reactionary internet content? I won't say some feminists aren't toxic and bad, but you're strawmanning feminism pretty hard here. Generally feminists aren't just seeking to make men miserable, they simply want gender roles and expectations to stop harming anyone and let people choose.
/r/PurplePillDebate29/03/25 10:10 PM
8

By the logic that women are approached by tons of men already, she already has a leg up in approaching first because she'll still have a higher success rate. Some women do take advantage of their desiriability by approaching more often, though they often get scolded for being too easy or something, depending on who you ask.
/r/PurplePillDebate29/03/25 08:59 PM
6

Not necessarily. Feminists don't all hand wave away any differences in men and women. They encourage both people to choose for themselves instead of feeling coerced into specific roles by things like patriarchy.
/r/PurplePillDebate29/03/25 08:51 PM
4

It's definitely either people don't understand what it's like to have a bad parent, or they get lost in their own sauce. In a way, I feel like the only one of my siblings that fully "broke from the matrix". While they're caught up trying to forgive the bad parents and seek their approval, I put a large distance between us and won't put up with the BS. And while none of them would admit it, the bad parenting shows up in our lives in ways of dysfunction and self-sabotage, like defensiveness and an…
/r/PurplePillDebate29/03/25 05:08 PM
6

It's partly outdated ideas about parents and "authority". And some of it is the struggle children have where they want to believe they are loved by their parents even when it's not true. It took me a long time to really come to terms with my deadbeat dad. In a conversation with a long time friend, he told me something like "you know, it's always bothered me that your dad was never in your life. It's just not right". And that triggered something in me I probably was suppressing and ignoring for s…
/r/PurplePillDebate29/03/25 02:37 PM
7

I don't think feminism and the abolition of gender rules would preclude obvious realities like gender dimorphism, or some underlying biological truth. Some women do approach men - I've been approached before myself. Many choose not to for different reasons. Some would argue it's because they don't have to, others because they lose attraction for men who don't initiate. It's really up to the individual. Much of the discourse around this misses subtlety and nuance. There very well could be this un…
/r/PurplePillDebate29/03/25 02:16 PM
11

The answers have already been the opposite of what you may have expected.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/03/25 10:18 PM
9

Oh man. This could be an interesting thread if it's not deleted in like two hours.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/03/25 09:56 PM
9

He is? In what way? Please tell me, because I'm not seeing it or hearing it, but apparently you know more.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/03/25 08:55 PM
9

Suppose he did. Does it matter if he did fuck all to show it?
/r/PurplePillDebate28/03/25 08:45 PM
11

Actions and behaviors, as well as words or lack there of. Parents who care and want to be there for their kids try. My mom had some issues with being emotionally unavailable but she would show up in other ways. Can't say the same for Dad who didn't show up in any capacity ever. At some point you accept that someone just can't - or won't - be there for you emotionally in the way you need them to. And maybe this will be a lesson for some men on here who aspire to be dads and husbands; it's not eno…
/r/PurplePillDebate28/03/25 08:38 PM
13

I did make attempts to reach out. Always got ghosted, or left waiting until I inevitably got ghosted. I saw him for the first time in ten years, years ago, he made zero attempt to connect or put effort into getting to know me, before leaving to go drink with his friend. I was done after that.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/03/25 06:34 PM
–

That's fair. To that point, my mom was always on my ass about stuff like getting good grades, tightening up my resume, and learning domestic skills like cooking and cleaning. As a full grown adult, I think I owe a lot to that, since I've managed to ace job interviews and overall be a functional adult that can take care of himself. My dad never even tried to help me with any of those things.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/03/25 04:04 PM
–

I was raised by a single mom. I think there are some areas which she could have done better, without a doubt. I don't however, believe she set me up to fail with women, at least not for the reasons you've laid out. She would not be the person to teach me "how to be a man", but she didn't shy away from letting me know what women seem to want in men. No, it wasn't "women want a nice sweet guy", it was very much "women like it when men take some initiative and ask them out first". The only thing sh…
/r/PurplePillDebate28/03/25 03:49 PM
56

I saw a comment here recently that made me think of it. It was something about the dad abandoning his family to go make a different one with a new woman. That's exactly what my dad did; ran off and started a new family with like 4 kids. But he'll randomly reach out every few years and act all "sad" that I won't talk to him, after he was a shitty dad for my entire 3+ decades of living. People will tell me "oh but that's your dad! You won't want to feel guilty when he dies!" And my response is alw…
/r/PurplePillDebate28/03/25 03:29 PM
111

I think it's pretty standard for people to cherry pick stats that fit their world view. I was raised by a single mother. I turned out fine. She's not perfect by any means, but at least she tried, in a way my dad didn't. But when I say this to men online or IRL, they really want me to know that maybe there is a very, very good reason my dad completely avoided interacting with me as a child and into adulthood, and he's not really at fault, it was my mean scary mom making him stay away and preventi…
/r/PurplePillDebate28/03/25 02:07 PM
2

Sure. putting their hands on my shoulders, arms, grabbing my arms and hands sending suggestive texts, including unsolicited topless pics asking mutual friends about me/trying to set us up matching on dating apps and messaging first to tell me how attractive I am asking for hookups I'm obviously leaving out the stuff like "staring and smiling" or "acting flirtatious" because I'm aware those can be non-serious or even misread, but yeah. When someone texts you in the middle of the night saying they…
/r/PurplePillDebate23/03/25 09:02 PM
2

I don't think 5' 5" and balding is going to be considered conventionally attractive pretty much anywhere you go. Hasn't stopped me from meeting women who were really into the way I look. Maybe it's because I carry it well, maybe it's because I'm in decent shape and have my shit together, maybe it's just my personality, who knows. But "be what women want" is going to be controversial because not every woman wants the same thing. What gets missed a lot in these discussions is that while women have…
/r/PurplePillDebate23/03/25 06:45 PM
5

I'm 5' 5", balding, non white. I have a slightly above average income, an okay face, I've been described as attractive/good looking by multiple people, and I've had women display pretty non ambiguous signs of attraction. Without a doubt there are people out there to find me repulsive, but this is also true for the 5' 9" white guy with all his hair, even if it doesn't affect him as much. I don't necessarily believe in someone for everyone, but I don't understand why men are the ones usually telli…
/r/PurplePillDebate23/03/25 06:06 PM
16

This might sound harsh, but I think enough people have found some success with dating apps that they aren't as damning as people make them. I know many men are frustrated with apps, but that's been the case even before the apps took off. "Average Frustrated Chumps" were always a thing, but even they find a nice girl to settle down with eventually. Men who have absolutely zero positive experiences with women are a very small minority. The fact that many men aren't attractive to most women has arg…
/r/PurplePillDebate23/03/25 12:02 PM
9

> At the end of the day women are, in their own words, attracted to what they perceive as confident, tall, physically strong men - essentially markers of dominance. I have to agree with this for the most part. But I'm also going to challenge this idea that men are somehow "lied to" about what women find attractive. This may not be explicitly stated in your post, but it's typically inherent in Red Pill ideology - the belief that men are being misled about what women find attractive. Since I've st…
/r/PurplePillDebate22/03/25 10:07 AM
6

As a man, being in the wrong relationship can truly suck. It can rob you of your peace and you'll wish you were with someone else or just single.
/r/PurplePillDebate20/03/25 08:51 AM
7

The more tries someone has the better the chance they are in a fulfilling relationship, which is what everyone wants. Maybe. It seems to me that having more dating opportunities doesn't necessarily make it easier. It can, but a string of bad relationship attempts can be costly. Even if most of the results for women are bad the fact they’re still entered into the game is better than the other way around. Most men are in the game too. Maybe they don't realize it somehow but I've rarely met a man w…
/r/PurplePillDebate20/03/25 08:40 AM
6

IDK man. I think finding a satisfying relationship that serves both parties through a mutual sense of desire, respect and wanting to grow together is fantastic. Being with someone who treats you like shit, uses you for sex, or is even just a live in roomate, isn't nearly as pleasant as you think it is. I think you could be biased toward what you see on social media or how you see couples in real life, and assume every relationship is currently wonderful and not rife with issues, ranging from dis…
/r/PurplePillDebate20/03/25 08:03 AM
3

I've seen a lot of below average/average guys reject girls in their league or under with visceral disgust. I've been one of these guys to reject women more than once. Not out of visceral disgust, but I've felt like she wasn't a good fit for me, or I rejected her without meaning to because I've been oblivious to her showing signs of attraction. Either way, I don't relate to this whole notion of being so desperate to have any woman that I'll just have anyone who shows me a little attention. And I …
/r/PurplePillDebate18/03/25 08:49 AM
1

This is an interesting point. I've noticed the same thing with the rise of social media and unlimited texting. Whereas in the past, you might break up with someone and never talk to them again, these days so many people reconnect with their exes or just keep them in their back pocket indefinitely. To the point of the top 20% though, I think what gets missed in that conversation is that sometimes you form a really strong emotional attachment to someone even if they aren't the most conventionally …
/r/PurplePillDebate17/03/25 08:42 AM
3

I think a lot of us understand it, but still tend to hope that we'll appear safe and attractive enough to override it.
/r/PurplePillDebate15/03/25 05:48 PM
–

I really don't know why it's difficult to understand that being able to have physical intimacy with people you aren't attracted to is not a privilege. To use your own example, carrot juice is gross to me. Having access to it at all times is not a benefit in that regard. Now, do some women have an easier time finding men that scratch that itch? Sure, I don't doubt it. But many more either simply aren't going to entertain the options they have because they aren't attracted to them, or they may not…
/r/PurplePillDebate15/03/25 05:16 PM
3

I think it's shallow, and I don't think it's a bad thing. Dating is inherently shallow. You can say you don't care about money but just want him to be a little taller than you, or have a "good sense of humor", or whatever surface level trait even if it seems reasonable. At the end of the day it's all shallow in that it lacks depth, because you can't have depth until you get to know someone and build a meaningful relationship with them. Pretty much all relationships have to begin with a place of …
/r/PurplePillDebate15/03/25 04:41 PM
7

I don't think it's fake. I think that folks have their own needs and self interests to concern themselves with first before they worry about "helping" others. For starters, I don't really know what women could possibly do to help men with their loneliness. What gets suggeted is basically take pity on them, and enter romantic and sexual relations with them in order to make them not so sad and lonely. The issue is that this wouldn't come from a place of desire, it would feel coerced and forced. An…
/r/PurplePillDebate15/03/25 04:12 PM
10

And you think this reflect the average male experience? Yes. Honestly your comparison is r*, you're comparing something that don't interfere with the objective vs something that goes against the objective. Yeah, no. If you will "take whatever you can get", that means you take whatever you can get. If you have any kind of standards, which most people do, you will not take whatever you can get. Even the seemingly most desperate people won't admit that their desperation is for a partner they desire…
/r/PurplePillDebate15/03/25 03:48 PM
6

There's like a few people here who actually think male loneliness is some kind of joke and something they revel in. The rest either simply don't care, or are empathetic but not trying to "pity fuck" desperate men they aren't attracted to.
/r/PurplePillDebate15/03/25 03:40 PM
9

How do you know they have dating prospects? Because they've been in multiple relationships, and have had women interested in them at almost any given time. They take wathever they can IF it fulfill their desire of having a family of their own. This goes against the idea of taking whatever you can get. It's like saying "women will have whatever guy they can get as long as he's tall, handsome and confident". Ok and what prove you have of it? The simple fact that I've never really known but a small…
/r/PurplePillDebate15/03/25 02:29 PM
21

I don't have the same experiences that "most" men apparently do where they have like zero options and take whatever they can get. I've never felt like I should have to settle for someone I'm not interested in just to be happy. I would rather be at peace and single than in a relationship with someone just because they wanted me, because then I'm just wasting her time as well as my own. And honestly I don't really know any guys at all who have literally zero dating prospects, sans a couple truly v…
/r/PurplePillDebate15/03/25 12:12 PM
1

A lot of dudes will gladly proclaim they are after money, status and sex. Please miss me with the whole "men are altruistic angels that just slave away all day and give their souls to the world and get nothing in return". Most people don't do something for nothing, and they often don't even pretend that's the case. They at least expect some kind of reciprocation, which is understandable. I work with all kinds of people, and the majority have desires and motives with their actions that they gladl…
/r/PurplePillDebate14/03/25 05:31 PM
0

I am not saying to do all that hard work for nothing. You don't slave away at a company that doesn't give a shit about you forever, you look for a better job with better pay. You don't simp for women that don't want you, you pick up and move on to someone who desires you. And if you get rejected constantly for better job offers or dates and romantic options, it might be time to consider if there's something you yourself could change, i.e. how you approach getting what you want and what your expe…
/r/PurplePillDebate14/03/25 05:03 PM
-2

I'm not making stuff up to make men look bad, at least that isn't my intention. It's just been my observation, both from viewing their content online and talking to men in real life that the whole "average frustrated chump" thing is very real. And sure, many guys don't necessarily think the world owes them sexual, societal and career success, but something comes across in their frustration over working so hard and not being rewarded for it. There's a reason there's such a market for books like N…
/r/PurplePillDebate14/03/25 04:31 PM
-2

Maybe you did only a little wrong, or nothing wrong, and you still failed and are suffering. I can see that. But it's not going to kill anyone to be realistic about their expectations. Average men *can* attract and date women, the thing is that those women might not always be the bombshells that some guys seem to think they're owed by society simply for existing, having a job and not doing drugs or whatever other arbitrary components usually make up a "good man". But their failure to attract a w…
/r/PurplePillDebate14/03/25 04:01 PM
6

While I think sexual frustration can play a part here, I think it's overall that average joes get lied to and told that they are entitled to more than what they have, including what they've actually put in effort to achieve. It's usually grifters atop the Manosphere telling men that they've been lied to, being a "good man" should entitle them to sex and wealth and status, but it doesn't, and they should be raging assholes instead. Yes, men's mental health is an issue and there are blindspots and…
/r/PurplePillDebate14/03/25 01:06 PM
11

I think this site over represents male virginity, especially past a certain age. It's been said before, but neuro divergent men are attracted to places like Reddit for being alternative social media, more in line with old-school web forums. The overwhelming majority of men past a certain age are not virgins. Some of them may have not had sex in a long time, and struggle to meet and attract women regularly, which I think is a different conversation to have, but they aren't virgins in the technica…
/r/PurplePillDebate14/03/25 12:38 AM
1

I know people from Gen Z to X and honestly, being in a relationship with one person for a long time, being married, having kids etc is the norm. Having literally zero friends and zero romantic experience is just not normal for anyone. On Reddit it gets played up especially for men because this is an "alt" social media site with mostly male users who probably skew neuro divergent. But I also think the pandemic played some role in making a disproportionate number of younger people simultaneously m…
/r/PurplePillDebate13/03/25 12:32 AM
18

I wouldn't say the issue for women is being shy, but rather appearing unapproachable. I've had women just "exist" around me, avoiding eye contact and hardly talking to me, only to find out later from someone else that they were attracted to me and wanted me to make a move. Some guys will just approach whoever, but for me and many other men, I think we like to observe some kind of indication of interest first.
/r/PurplePillDebate09/03/25 08:55 PM
15

IME flirting comes easy when the chemistry is there and she is into you. It's all about how you say things and not really what you say. It may more likely come across creepy when she's cold and uninterested, regardless of how smooth you might be. Of course there's always that initial step someone has to take to open the door, but I feel like for the most part this stuff comes naturally. To the OP point, people can and do overthink this by believing they can just do or say the "right thing" to an…
/r/PurplePillDebate08/03/25 04:45 AM
5

Nobody's forcing biologists to abandon terms and stop being scientists. Certainly not in the same way that anyone who isn't heteronormative isn't either outright harassed or hunted for blood sport, and actively targeted as the source of the world's ills.
/r/PurplePillDebate07/03/25 06:35 PM
5

By their definition, it's probably only social media brainwashing when it's feminist groups on Facebook, not when Elon Musk buys up X so it can be astroturfed by far right extremists and russian bots.
/r/PurplePillDebate07/03/25 06:33 PM
6

It's really the other way around. LGBT folks are politicized as an "other" and forced to adopt political movements in order to protect themselves and their rights. They want nothing more than to be left alone and stop "shoving it down your throat", but the world is actively against them so they have to fight in order to survive.
/r/PurplePillDebate07/03/25 03:13 PM
1

Lol I fucking love this GIF
/r/PurplePillDebate07/03/25 12:54 AM
5

What makes a man good, OP?
/r/PurplePillDebate03/03/25 10:43 PM
2

Saw this posted a couple of times in this thread, and it's just now clicking for me that people were basically saying "this you?" after seeing OPs post history.
/r/PurplePillDebate03/03/25 06:11 PM
2

I really have to wonder how old you are, where you live, and what type of women you're trying to court. For most of the US, $70k is above the median household income, and men who make half that are able to date.
/r/PurplePillDebate03/03/25 01:28 AM
5

I owe people basic respect or kindness. Not friendship or romantic intimacy. You might sound like an asshole when you decide you don't want to be with a partner or be friends with someone anymore, but it doesn't mean you're wrong.
/r/PurplePillDebate02/03/25 01:47 PM
1

There's a lot that most people can do to make themselves more attractive. Unless a given person is mentally well, physically healthy, practices good oral hygeine, dresses and grooms properly, AND socializes reasonably, they have something to work on. And by the numbers, most people have room for improvement in one or two of these areas, especially the weight category in the US. Which means most "sub 5's" have a chance, but not without effort, which they seem to despise for some reason.
/r/PurplePillDebate02/03/25 11:58 AM
4

I feel like much of the time, when someone proclaims to "not owe anyone anything", it's like they're trying to excuse their own guilty feelings of selfishness. Basically, if you say to someone's face that you don't care about them and don't want to do anything for them, and they are a good friend, family member or relationship partner, you look like an asshole. But if you say you don't owe them anything, because nobody owes anyone anything, now you've made a declaration about how society works a…
/r/PurplePillDebate02/03/25 11:00 AM
4

I can't help but notice a lot of dudes who complain about stuff like being sub 5 and invisible to women only ever show interest in more attractive people. And as much as they don't wanna hear it, fixing up their physical appearance and gaining more social access really is what they need to do, if they don't want to settle for someone on their "level".
/r/PurplePillDebate01/03/25 03:57 PM
5

For starts, conservative and liberal aren't really all that different. Neo-Liberalism is conservation of the status quo, and doesn't really seek to uppend existing insitutitions like capitalism or patriarchy. Talk to a lot of Democrat voters in the states, and you'll notice that despite all the claims of them being far-left communist types, they tend to still go to church, still uphold capitalism, and probably aren't all as in favor of things like abortion or gender-reaffirming care as you might…
/r/PurplePillDebate01/03/25 03:19 PM
11

in the west women have equal rights. Problem is, said rights are constantly under fire. IMO, it's not enough for people to have "equal rights" on paper, when all sorts of people are consistently desiring for them to be taken away. Despite what you might believe when you browse on Reddit, the world in general is still pretty conservative. It ends to uphold institutions like religion, capitalism, and yes, patriarchy as well. The latter being the one that tends to demand the kind of strict gendered…
/r/PurplePillDebate01/03/25 01:06 PM
2

I made my point in the body of my original comment. If you have something to say about Attachment Theory being pseudoscientific, it's up to you to actually make an argument for that. But it seems like what you really wanted to say was something to do with my "worldview", as if you constructed some kind of idea of who I am pre-emptively and used that idea to make the case that Attachment Theory is pseudoscientific, which is a logical fallacy.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/02/25 06:47 PM
2

Wait, do you actually have a point you're trying to make or any other disagreement to express? Is there something specific about Attachment Theory that you're arguing about?
/r/PurplePillDebate21/02/25 06:34 PM
3

I don't have a world view I need to have coddled. Unless there's some other explanation you have for the consistency of a person's childhood experiences shaping how they engage in adult relationships, which I'd love to hear.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/02/25 06:05 PM
6

I don't really see overweight people of either gender "dating up" nearly as often as I see claimed on this sub. Especially not in the way people claim overweight women are dating up and only going after "Chads". Whenever you refer to online dating behaviors for women, remember that they are typically outnumbered on those platforms by men by like 4:1 or more. There's tons of women who aren't using the apps at all, either because they don't have to, or they didn't like their options on there, or b…
/r/PurplePillDebate21/02/25 04:15 PM
15

One thing I think TRP consistently gets right is that attraction is not a choice. Truly desiring someone is powerful, and it doesn't have any real concern whether or not this person is good for you. I think usually it's about an aggregate of things, ranging from some deeper psychological resonance to just pure physical attraction. People end up in maddening situations because the passion and desire is what's keeping them there, not any rational choice making which would lead them to a boring, st…
/r/PurplePillDebate21/02/25 01:57 PM
6

Honestly, when I saw the title, I was expecting the typical Manosphere truisim about women saying they want nice sweet guys but only dating abrasive, cocky alpha chads. I was not expecting the body of the post to be about women saying they want feminine men who are in touch with their feelings but then going after...guys with tattoos and a "rugged" appearance. Especially given that tattoos themselves these days are hardly just a masculine thing. I see them all the time on twinks and pretty boys …
/r/PurplePillDebate15/02/25 01:49 PM
19

TIL: having muscles, beards and tattoos means you are not in touch with your feelings. There is no way you could possibly be in touch with your feelings and have tattoos, especially not if said tattoos have any personal, emotional meaning to the person wearing them specifically.
/r/PurplePillDebate15/02/25 01:19 PM
0

I don't think it's being "red pilled" to not want somebody who cannot consistently provide a reasonable income. There's a huge gap between "high status multi millionaire" and "dude in his 30's making less than $30k per year with nothing to show for it". I don't think it's unreasonable to not want the latter.
/r/PurplePillDebate10/02/25 10:59 PM
0

I don't think it's simply feminism that makes society broadly have a subtle "Women are Wonderful"/anti-man bias. If anything, it's the consequences of gender rigidity and gender norms and expectations that punishes men and women in different ways. Unfortunately someone like Bell Hooks, that actively exams patriarchy and wants to see it dismantled so that both women and men are no longer harmed by it, is going to get drowned out by the girl boss or radfem FDS user who is really only there to lift…
/r/PurplePillDebate08/02/25 08:25 PM
4

Like this is the most common sense thing. It's fucking Everywhere in media. Everywhere. Music, television, EVERYWHERE, and yet people still say oh no it's not that big of a deal. I'm not quite sure if you were saying that the idea that less attractive guys date hot girls is everywhere, or that people dating their looksmatch is everywhere. But from what I've seen, most popular media doesn't really push the idea that hot women don't want hot men. Reality TV is hot women and hot men pairing up. Eve…
/r/PurplePillDebate08/02/25 07:32 PM
3

Most men are neither model-tier felons nor short bald Indian janitors. Most men fall somewhere in the middle, with some good physical attributes and some less desiriable ones. Even Meeks had horrible teeth and a bad hairline. He also probably isn't universally desired by all women, which seems to be what guys believe when he's brought up; he dated one woman, therefore all women must want him. This is not true, and is basically the "Chad fallacy". He's got a niche market of groupies that are real…
/r/PurplePillDebate08/02/25 07:08 PM
6

The impression I get is that it calls for the freedom to choose. You can be as feminine or masculineor inbetween or nonbinary as you like.
/r/PurplePillDebate08/02/25 07:02 PM
1

I could actually see why driving people to remain single and atomized benefits the corporations, even if it's not necessarily intended. Every person who is indefinitely single probably has their own place, their own vehicle, their own mortgage/rent payment, their own set of bills and so on. Then you look at how more and more companies are moving to subscriptions and services as business models over allowing people to buy and own things outright, not to mention something like streaming sites crac…
/r/PurplePillDebate07/02/25 05:33 PM
1

I think one thing I've noticed with the trending online discourse is how having options gets discussed. According to the internet, you're either an alpha chad who gets women or you're a beta who gets nothing, or gets settled for. In the experience of myself and many others, I do have options but that doesn't preclude me getting rejected. But I've noticed that when I mention having dated at all, it's assumed that I'm way more attractive than I'm letting on, even though according to modern discour…
/r/PurplePillDebate07/02/25 01:57 AM
9

You can’t say anything about women without people totally up in arms about it. Yes, you can. There's tons of places for men to go say unflattering things about women, including on this sub. I read a comment here maybe a day ago proclaiming that women are pretty much universally boring and that men only take interest in them because they want to have sex with them. The comment was getting upvoted and had other men responding to agree. Other people will obviously disagree with it, which is underst…
/r/PurplePillDebate07/02/25 01:38 AM
2

I don't think all women have these expectations broadly. If they did, I wouldn't keep seeing younger couples with a bigger/skinnier/out of shape man in them. I'm sure very attractive women want men who are very attractive, but that seems less like hypergamy and more like wanting to date someone with similar values and attractiveness, which is understandable. Despite all the posting to the contrary, everywhere I go women of all ages continue to date their "looks match".
/r/PurplePillDebate07/02/25 01:28 AM
1

Half the people arguing have been married for 10 years telling you how wrong you are. Then the other half haven’t actually made attempts to date and just go through social circles only a few times and it worked out. I don't think all married people are disagreeing. A lot of people with red pill type views are married. Even guys who are blackpilled can be in relationships. I can see why one would think that social media has changed dating. I think it's introduced a new layer to what was already t…
/r/PurplePillDebate07/02/25 01:19 AM
6

I have to say I've noticed the exact same thing with men. For many of them, the caring, considerate, gentlemanly nice guy stuff doesn't come out unless she's super pretty and he's trying to smash. Which leaves little wonder why some men also interpret simple acts of kindness and friendship as an "invitation" of sorts.
/r/PurplePillDebate04/02/25 08:57 AM
3

I haven't seen anything in the body of the OP remotely suggesting "acting horrible to men". I've only seen the notion of choosing your own peace/protecting yourself/"choosing the bear", as an alternative to men reading into your kindness as some sort of invitation for them to start acting really sexually aggressive. And I can think of no reason why certain guys can't accept women being guarded, other than the fact that they know deep down they weren't "just being nice"; they alawys had an ulteri…
/r/PurplePillDebate04/02/25 01:39 AM
4

If women being less kind toward men in general out of the interest of their own safety and peace of mind, provokes those men to act even worse, perhaps those women were better to avoid those men in the first place. FWIW, I don't have this "problem" with women because I understand that some women just want to be left alone, or don't want to talk to me, or might even simply not like me and that's okay. I've had other women want to be friends, and/or have romantic interest. This is a completely nor…
/r/PurplePillDebate04/02/25 01:16 AM
6

What I'm reading in that quote is that she's being told by other people, primarily other men, that men can and will misunderstand generic kindness and flirtation, and try to escalate it beyond what it is to the point that it's violating boundaries. Again, better to protect yourself from that than be worried if you're "repelling" normal men. Especially if said "normal" men are going to act pushy and annoying, as told by other men, or in the experience of countless other women. IF the narrative wa…
/r/PurplePillDebate04/02/25 12:57 AM
8

Because she keeps asking and asking, taking and taking, and for her there's no thought in her mind that this is anything but normal and the guy is like well, she knows i'm taking time of my day for her, yet she keeps asking, maybe she likes me and this is her way of saying it. This must be where I'm disagreeing, because I don't inherently see doing something for a friend as them asking and me taking. When I'm good friends with them, I do what I can for them, when I can. If there's something I ca…
/r/PurplePillDebate04/02/25 12:38 AM
2

I actually see the opposite all the time. Dudes with no serious ambition but decent charisma and "game" can get into relationships too. I think the only real generalization that can be made is that you have to bring something to the table. Whatever you think is holding you back from attracting someone, there is someone out there with that same "flaw" who is in a relationship.
/r/PurplePillDebate03/02/25 11:53 PM
14

I'm trying to parse this part of your comment "I only see you as a friend," while the guy is thinking of all the times he had to put his "friend" first, forsaking his own problems and hobbies. Men at a baseline level, understand how important time is, and how spending it for somebody else is a BIG commitment. Women don't. With this one Because again, MEN KNOW when a girl likes a guy so much they can't think straight and when the girl is lukewarm at best. If men always KNOW when a woman is super …
/r/PurplePillDebate03/02/25 11:46 PM
–

I feel like TRP and PUA had a point, which was to get men to kill the beta, stop being an "average frustrated chump" (nowadays called a simp), and grow and develop into a person that can attract multiple women so they don't get so hung up on their old crushes or failed relationships. There's often a lot of trauma that brings guys to this place in their lives. In some ways, TRP sort of promises you that if you do the right things, you'll never experience that kind of pain again. Obviously that's …
/r/PurplePillDebate03/02/25 10:55 PM
15

Agree completely. I have two really good friends, and we go a long way to compliment each other and get along extremely well. I wouldn't say we are "equal", but complimentary. I think the relationship score-card thing is kind of toxic anyways.
/r/PurplePillDebate02/02/25 09:11 PM
12

I think TRP obviously has some reasonable truth. Back in the early 2010's, when Rollo's Rational Male blog started taking off, the best of year one section had some really humbling truths in it. Things like not avoiding rejection, not looking for a unicorn, The problem seems to start with how the information is disseminated. Concepts like not getting Oneitis/not SIMPing might seem obvious, but sometimes lack nuance. Like, some TRP guys will accuse guys who are in loving, long term relationships …
/r/PurplePillDebate02/02/25 09:09 PM
–

If she had children from multiple fathers, at some point it would also be up to the men who keep knocking her up to choose better. At some people people reveal who they are, so if you're choosing to date a single mom who has massive red flags, you can't just put the blame on her alone for not choosing correctly.
/r/PurplePillDebate02/02/25 08:53 PM
–

I think in a roundabout way, the Manosphere is not helping because it doesn't posit much of a solution outside the existing status quo. Their frustration is not, say, that outdated gender expectations are harming men becuase they cannot live up to them, or that trying to is making their lives worse. Their problem is that those expectations, in their worldview, are there for a reason, and men should aspire to them instead of trying to fix any "systemic" issue.
/r/PurplePillDebate30/01/25 06:17 PM
–

I think people are probably overstating just how much the "manosphere" had any influence on the election. There is definitely some coorelation between men who feel lonely and alienated moving to the right and Trump's reelection, but this is far bigger than something brought upon than a simple "crisis of masculinity". There is an important connection between concepts like masculinity and patriarchy, and what causes people (especially men) to move left or right, but the "manosphere" is probably st…
/r/PurplePillDebate30/01/25 03:51 PM
1

'Social" media does a great job at convicing people they're socializing when they actually aren't. People have their faces locked onto their screens, mindlessly scrolling and ocassionally responding to DM's or group chats, and because they had some sort of engagement with human faces it's good enough to count as socializing. This is before we even get into the idea that this type of "socializing" is affecting their brain in a way that's making in-person, real life interactions more difficult. I …
/r/PurplePillDebate30/01/25 03:40 PM
19

I honestly think this happens for different reasons, but from what I've witnessed IRL, most men are not giving up on women. They still desire to date, and feel frustrated, sad and lonely when they get rejected or a relationship fails, some more than others. If I were to be brutally honest, the small handful of people I know who are chronically single, usually have really exacting standards that involve the people they desire being pretty conventionally attractive, while they themselves are not c…
/r/PurplePillDebate29/01/25 09:20 AM
3

This is a reasonable observation, but maybe needs a little more nuance. I don't think individuals wake up and decide one day that they're desperate and lonely. I think society re enforces the belief that romantic relationships are among the ultimate goals for life, one that everyone should stive to obtain. I've also noticed that a good many people prioritize their romantic relationships, especially when children are involved, to the point that not having one will make you more lonely when everyo…
/r/PurplePillDebate23/01/25 09:34 PM
1

Date with some kind of intentionality. That means going outside looking your best and staying on top of "social game", actively seeking out new people and experiences and being more willing to initiate. What dating apps severely lack is intentionality, because they allow you to import a social media profile. That works for the people who actually have a social media profile with updated pictures of them in a variety of situations where they look attractive, but most people have badly taken selfi…
/r/PurplePillDebate16/01/25 10:23 PM
4

I think the pressure people feel - and put on themselves - to be in a relationship, is what needs to fade out. Not the concept of relationships/marriage itself. At the end of the day, relationships and love are beautiful things, but it requires true compatability, chemistry, and a shared desire and enthusiasm for each other. Some people may not be relationship material, not because they're "bad people", but because they lack the qualities that make them a desiriable partner. The reason that they…
/r/PurplePillDebate11/01/25 11:43 PM
2

I think many of the guys who struggle so much with dating that they're always online complaining that women have insane standards, really just struggle to meet the basic standards themselves, on top of not having those social networks in place to be introduced to eligible women. Guys still get introduced to their friends' single friends and such, but this only happens if you pass a certain threshold, and you have the right social network to make it happen. There's a lot to be said here about mis…
/r/PurplePillDebate02/01/25 11:53 PM
1

The best answer I've heard for why this analogy doesn't work is that fish don't want to be caught, but women actually want men to be successful in their pursuit.
/r/PurplePillDebate29/11/24 01:14 AM
2

I'm sure this wasn't your intention and maybe I'm being too pedantic here, but by definition a 6 or 7 out of 10 is 1-2 whole points above average. Unattractive men don't look 10 years younger at 50 and have all their hair remaining on their head. The OP comment is talking about isn't saying anything specific about what makes men attractive or not, but you being above average and able to attract women doesn't really contradict his point in any way.
/r/PurplePillDebate29/11/24 01:08 AM
1

Responding to this late because I don't use reddit much anymore. But, I really think women only have it that easy relative to how attractive they are. And men could learn from women the art of simply not caring so much about what the opposite sex thinks of them.
/r/PurplePillDebate15/08/24 10:36 AM
-2

Nothing you said disagrees with the comment you responded to, so I'm not sure why you're being so snarky and condescending.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/06/24 06:02 AM
2

I think Reddit in general is a liberal/progressive bubble. I meet far more conservative people in my every day life than I do progressives.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/06/24 04:44 AM
5

I'm not entirely sure men get socialized to deal with rejection in the way people think. There's still sort of an expectation that men will just meet somebody through co-ed, work or in a friend group, or maybe an app, and end up dating and/or marrying them. I don't really know if that many men go through a "rejection gauntlet" to find somebody. Most people I've talked to have not been on tons of dates with different people and had to face numerous rejections. Men have even told me they don't ask…
/r/PurplePillDebate28/06/24 12:27 AM
4

That's really debatable. There are definitely guys who have a lot to gain by putting themselves out there more, but on the other hand there are other men who are not as decent - nor as attractive - as they think they are. The reality of how dating functions will humble most people real fucking quick, when they realize all they have to offer, or what they think they have to offer, isn't something everyone wants and they're not God's gift to the opposite sex. I think one really important skill for…
/r/PurplePillDebate28/06/24 12:10 AM
2

I think people just don't like approaching because they don't want to risk that kind of rejection and humiliation. Especially since it makes you question your entire sense of self regarding how attractive you are to other people. But there's also another side to this, where women might still feel like something is wrong with them if nobody or not "enough" people ask them out. Generally it's not great to have your feeling of worth predicated on how others feel about us, but unfortunately that's a…
/r/PurplePillDebate28/06/24 12:08 AM
7

If he’s a good decent guy, none of this matters Women don't just show up wanting to fuck somebody because he's a "good decent guy". It's really critical that he knows how to relate to someone to be able to even communicate his qualities, or he will remain invisible. This might seem obvious to you, but I don't think it's obvious to enough people especially men who complain about this stuff, or they'd be doing it already.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/06/24 05:14 PM
7

The argument is that the "systems" in place made meeting people and pairing off much easier. I don't think I've seen the argument that average guys could get laid with anyone easily, so much as it's that finding someone was sort of an inevitability. The idea is something went wrong which caused issues with how people get socialized, so you have less young people meeting and dating than ever before. The issues I've seen pointed to range from social media and dating apps, to the disappearance of t…
/r/PurplePillDebate27/06/24 05:02 PM
18

Depending on your goals and desires, relative to your social skills, attractiveness and overall circumstances, dating can be relatively easy, sort of a pain or a complete minefield of tedium and frustration. I honestly don't even know if many people are really very "good" at dating. The types of skills you need to actually date "successfully", like being very pro social, developing charisma and charm, knowing how to flirt and so on, are somewhat different from skills and requirements in long ter…
/r/PurplePillDebate27/06/24 04:58 PM
3

It doesn't really when social media and apps are how so many people meet and start relationships now.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/06/24 04:45 PM
6

Okay, so let's parse that with the comment I'm responding to The introverted women that I’ve dated did not care that I was not particularly social, and they did not particularly want me to be. The thing is, there must be some disconnect between people where, and a disagreement over an "acceptable" level of introversion. To some people, "not particularly social" means they don't socialize at all, and to other people it means "prefers to spend time alone but will occasionally leave their bubble to…
/r/PurplePillDebate27/06/24 04:37 PM
3

To be clear, the advice makes perfect sense, because obviously nobody is going to just wander into your life if you don't socialize at all. But I think there is a disconnect between people who claim they're not very social and still end up in multiple relationships, and people who claim they aren't very social and have been single for a long time. One person's "not very social" might just mean they only go out twice a month, for some people it means basically never talking to anyone outside what…
/r/PurplePillDebate27/06/24 04:08 PM
5

Sure, but many guys feel the expectations of having to take initiative + the advice telling them to constantly put themselves out there is basically like saying "you cannot be an introverted man at all or you're going to die alone". At least that's the sentiment that I see from many men who are frustrated, which is that they always have to be "on" in order to hope to attract anyone.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/06/24 03:25 PM
3

Yeah, I get that impression too. It's telling that he thinks she will or should be easy, but isn't.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/06/24 03:16 PM
6

The introverted women that I’ve dated did not care that I was not particularly social, and they did not particularly want me to be. But if a guy is not socializing and chronically single, the first thing he will be told is to put himself out there and socialize like crazy. I'm not saying your worldview or experience is not valid, it's just that two people who are "introverted" and hardly meet others, even if they're super compatible are less likely to meet, so it's a bit of a bind.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/06/24 03:11 PM
9

I saw a cheeky line a while back that asked "are the straights okay?" and this made me think of that. It's really wild that people stay in situations they are not happy with. I've heard men and women both complain about their relationships, how they are not treated well, neglected, always arguing, borderline being abused. But they stay. Like there is this "heteronormative" obligation to endure what you dislike about your partner or perceive to be a universal trait for the opposite sex. I really …
/r/PurplePillDebate27/06/24 03:05 PM
–

I'll never get the sentiment that your life is over after 25-30, and anything you didn't get to do then is forever beyond your reach.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/06/24 10:55 AM
13

I have to do all the initiating, all the planning, all the flirting, all the escalating, while they basically sit back and enjoy the ride until they want to bail. These are women who are in no way out of my league to put it politely. I'm 6'5 and fit and I actually prefer chubbyish women who foreseeably aren't quite as egotistical as the typical hot girl insta queens. If you "prefer chubby women" because they are not "hot girl insta queens", there's a good chance other men feel the same. Especial…
/r/PurplePillDebate27/06/24 05:16 AM
1

I do, because it makes the same logical errors of telling people that doing the "right" things will give them what they want in life, especially romantically. In reality there's no guarantee either way.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/06/24 05:05 AM
1

To clarify I don't agree with that sentiment very much, I'm just elaborating TRP perspective. Yes you can feel like that is true and it'll color your worldview pretty red or black. But that doesn't make it any less distorted than blue.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/06/24 04:49 AM
2

Honestly, I don't mind a little drinking but it kind of stops there for me. I've heard other people in this thread say they won't date someone who's not into things like weed, and now that I'm seeing responses in this thread it makes a little more sense for me. It pretty much comes to a lifestyle choice for me, that in hindsight I may be a little more exacting about than I realize. Hard to say if it's something I should lighten up on or not, but I kind of doubt that I will.
/r/PurplePillDebate26/06/24 10:33 PM
1

I'm not sure I know what that means
/r/PurplePillDebate26/06/24 10:29 PM
1

It kinda makes sense that people with "conservative" relationship values are likely to remain single for longer, if the general population is really into using substances in order to have a good time. It's actually something I had not thought of much, but I guess it explains why people think I should find a nice religious woman to marry even though I'm an atheist. And it's because I'm an atheist that I feel like our lifestyles won't match, and I don't want to waste a religious person's time. May…
/r/PurplePillDebate26/06/24 10:22 PM
5

My mom and dad both abused drugs and alcohol, and it made them into really shitty parents. And even at a very young age I decided to be the opposite of them. It's not necessarily the most "logical" decision to be so straight edge, but it's served me well and kept me out of trouble. I was also raised in a pretty "religious" household, probably by a mom who turned to religion to deal with regrets she had earlier in life (she broke down crying to me when she admitted that her substance abuse proble…
/r/PurplePillDebate26/06/24 10:08 PM
3

In theory no, in practice many guys hold onto the anger and frustration.
/r/PurplePillDebate26/06/24 12:58 PM
28

This has always been part of TRP. Even in the early days of the "Godfather" of Redpill Rollo Tomassi, there were posts and walls of text about how marriage is broken and relationship dynamics are all cursed, because women always want the bigger better deal, and hypergamy doesn't care. The idea of adopting those mindsets you mention, was to cope with this "reality", but it almost always comes from a place of being jaded and cynical. These men lament not being able to be hopeless romantics, and ha…
/r/PurplePillDebate26/06/24 08:51 AM
-1

I guess we'll have to agree to disagree. Feels like an approach if someone is doing the initiation, even if they don't intend to "close". As for "stats" I'm probably not nearly as tall as you're imagining. I'm not extremely ugly or anything, and have been told I have a pretty good looking face and smile. When I've gotten approached, it was almost always while I was walking around with a camera photographing things, and some people are really into that in general. If it's not that, it's when I'm …
/r/PurplePillDebate26/06/24 01:03 AM
2

This is all very true and a great point to make. We absolutely get socialized to continue on gender normative things even when the conditions that created them have changed so much. I think another thing that gets jammed down our throats is that a relationship is a mandatory life goal, and not having one makes you a complete loser. It's really unfortunate that people feel so much external pressure to perform gender roles so they can go through the emotions of a relationship and prove to everyone…
/r/PurplePillDebate25/06/24 10:22 PM
2

There's a lot of people who try to give advice and seem so confident and sure of themselves when they tell you. The women in my family constantly told me that women don't want a guy who can't pay for dates and do other "traditional" things. But a bunch of others will insist that you can date while broke. At the end of the day, whether you're "ready" seems like a decision you have to make on your own. It's really hard to say what will work because everyone's circumstances and outcomes are a bit d…
/r/PurplePillDebate25/06/24 10:07 PM
2

Yes, for genuine connections it often fails, but unfortunately people get jaded and burned by bad experiences, and lose hope in ever finding that connection, both men and women.
/r/PurplePillDebate25/06/24 09:59 PM
2

In you hypothetical scenario, that couple may remain together, but the sex frequency may drop off a cliff. That's possible, but not always the outcome. Some people get extremely lucky and meet the love of their life, and stuff just clicks basically forever. I know many such couples myself, who've been together 10+ years and everything is great. Also, "sex frequency" may not always be as important to other people, for different reasons.
/r/PurplePillDebate25/06/24 09:55 PM
2

Yeah, I feel that. It's always obvious when she likes you, until it isn't.
/r/PurplePillDebate25/06/24 09:29 PM
-2

For some people that's exactly what happens though. They are just being themselves and they meet the love of their life through a mutual friend, at work, or got lucky on a dating app. So it's hard to say that didn't work for them when it seemingly just happened to them by chance. Also to be clear, I'm not shaming guys who are insecure or anything like that. But I really do think that for a lot of them, the belief that you have to have all these insanely "maxxed" external qualities to make someon…
/r/PurplePillDebate25/06/24 09:29 PM
19

I think the idea that you can self improve enough that you can "make" people like you more is really intoxicating. Even though TRP is supposed to be a "harsh truth", there's some genuine idealism in being able to lift weights, make tons of money and become so socially adroit you're basically irresistible to women. It does come from a place of insecurity often, but I feel it's more like "if only I was more like Chad, I'd never have to experience the pain of rejection ever again". The handful of g…
/r/PurplePillDebate25/06/24 09:25 PM
0

you are an idiot for thinking this. He's really not. If you take a critical look at how the info of TRP is delivered, you can see where the insecurity comes though. For example, when men wax about "hypergamy", sometimes all I'm really hearing is frustration over not having enough of the right qualities because of only they did, they would get a text back, have sex, start a relationship and so on. And when a lot of men actually follow the actionable advice of working out, socializing with intenti…
/r/PurplePillDebate25/06/24 09:11 PM
2

It depends a lot on the context and what was said in those texts. But if she's up late talking to you every single night, I'd hazard a guess there's some interest in you as a person at the very least.
/r/PurplePillDebate25/06/24 08:54 PM
5

I've had women approach me before. Almost every girlfriend I've had involved her being really interested in me as a person, and dropping subtle hints that she was attracted to me and wanted me to ask her out. Obviously this doesn't have to be the only way a relationship starts, but I just wonder where this idea that women "never" approach men comes from. I've had women come up to me in public when we were both alone and strike up a conversation, or ask a friend if I was single, that sort of thin…
/r/PurplePillDebate25/06/24 08:09 PM
2

I'm not saying become best friends with every person you meet. What I am saying is that going out with a goal of finding "a" girlfriend, without much thought or care about who she is as a person, isn't likely to yield great results. Sure, approaching people and talking to them makes sense, and maybe we don't disagree with each other as much as I might think. I'll also add here that people have been saying that "if you're struggling to date now, your life is basically over if you don't commit to …
/r/PurplePillDebate25/06/24 07:33 PM
3

If someone is socially awkward, then practicing socializing until they become less awkward seems like a better solution to their overall quality of life than simply approaching tons of women with the sole intention of getting laid or starting a relationship.
/r/PurplePillDebate25/06/24 07:18 PM
3

I don't think the shotgun method of approaching dozens or hundreds of women in a desperate attempt to get a girlfriend is always the best idea because it puts a lot of women on guard, since they know so many guys are just trying to get a date, hookup or a girlfriend and don't always care about who it's with. I think it's generally better to focus on making genuine connections by simply being honest about who you are and getting to know the other person. Any relationships - be the platonic, or se…
/r/PurplePillDebate25/06/24 07:14 PM
1

One of the most difficult components of a long term relationship is for two people to be pretty much matched in their level of investment, desire and interest in the other person and the relationship. It's not enough to simply have someone into you, if you're not into them yourself. And to be honest, with how men are socialized to take a "shotgun approach" where they ask out tons of women before there's necessarily even any real chemistry or connection established, it's hard to say that these gu…
/r/PurplePillDebate25/06/24 06:23 PM
1

Maybe I'm off on this, but this is not what has been my own experience. I don't think women normally reject guys for being nice, nor is it necessarily about "escalation" like other guys here are saying. Maybe sometimes it is, but I haven't found much of a difference being made when I was the first one to make a move. When someone is genuinely into you, I think they make themselves available, show interest and let you know they're single etc. If you ask someone out and they say no, it's more like…
/r/PurplePillDebate25/06/24 05:59 PM
5

I believe it's genuinely out there and can be "found" or cultivated. But having seen relationships go south, and having my own rough experiences, I feel like it's something that unfortunately not everyone will find, at least not easily, but they want so badly to find it that they try to force it or will it into existence out of desperation.
/r/PurplePillDebate25/06/24 01:28 AM
2

Genuine kindness and consideration for others.
/r/PurplePillDebate24/06/24 10:14 PM
4

The reason men do this is because we get told constantly that we have to take the initiative and be really sexually forward, or we risk getting friendzoned. To be clear, I don't agree with that at all and would rather talk to women like an equal human being, and if a relationship is meant to happen it'll develop organically from those interactions.
/r/PurplePillDebate24/06/24 09:24 PM
6

If you are confident, charismatic, bold and assertive, with some sprinkling of arrogance and wit ("cocky-funny" as the old PUAs called it), this is the "personality" women usually find attractive. What turns women off is neediness, desperation and lack of decisiveness, as a rule. You cannot make someone who doesn't like your looks at all, suddenly want you for how you look, that's true. But you can demonstrate other qualities that make you attractive and interesting to people. I don't agree with…
/r/PurplePillDebate23/06/24 10:22 PM
3

Been saying this for a while now. Even in kids media that has a romantic couple at the end, the guy is almost always some charismatic bad boy, a prince to be, or some insanely overpowered shounen protagonist. It's never some super average run of the mill guy cleaning up and getting some extremely gorgeous wife or girlfriend at the end. I don't think anyone is "lying" about what is attractive, I think a handful of people are just hopeful that they can date someone out of their league.
/r/PurplePillDebate23/06/24 10:15 PM
16

Not to mention people can be depressed and have issues and be in relationships. Some folks think being in a relationship is a signal you've fixed everything in your life, or that a relationship will fix everything in your life, but neither of those are true.
/r/PurplePillDebate23/06/24 08:26 PM
2

I got the same award from the same user and was not sure if I should feel flattered or insulted. Glad this got clarified, lol
/r/PurplePillDebate23/06/24 01:48 PM
11

You're conflating the fact that men get involved in physically laborious infrastructure projects, with some idea that women need men as romantic partners and providers. Women now can choose to be with a man or be alone, and this alone is frustrating to the men who can no longer rely on a woman being coerced or shamed into a monogamous relationship with him. It's not really an issue because most men still pair off, but there's obviously a handful of angry men online who resent women for having mo…
/r/PurplePillDebate23/06/24 11:58 AM
3

The modern hook-up hypergamy 80/20 bullshit is unsustainable. Well it sure is bullshit because men and women of all "levels" pair off all the time. How am I supposed to cope, after all of this constant rejection? Just keep “working on myself”? I’ve been doing so for years… how many years must I do this? And for what? I mean, if literally zero women are interested in you (and I doubt that's a really true), all that's left is to work on yourself. Hell, even if women did like you as you are now (an…
/r/PurplePillDebate23/06/24 10:37 AM
3

I didn't mean you specifically, I meant "you" as a generality. Anyway, if you attract women just fine, what's the issue with fat women getting love and sex too? I'm starting to wonder if certain men either secretly like chubby girls and that's why they , or they resent women they perceive as less attractive and therefore "undeserving" of sex and love to be getting it. Probably a little of both.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/06/24 10:27 PM
3

obese women still get dick and love From who? Handsome chads or guys at their level of fitness? Do those men also not get pussy and love in return? Do men not have the option to just not date obese women? If your only options seem to be obese women you could just stay single, and work on yourself and get out more until you can attract better. Otherwise, nobody is holding a gun to your head forcing you to date women you're not interested in.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/06/24 09:53 PM
3

Then why point fingers exclusively at women? It's hard to feel bad for all the men who aren't spoiled for their choice of fit young sorority girls when most of these men are hardly the living of embodiment of a handsome stud.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/06/24 08:56 PM
5

Truly average men and women are overweight or out of shape, in some kind of debt, not insanely socially skilled, make average wages and so on. And statistically the men do end up in relationships or marriages with children, with their socioeconomic equal. Which means the women are arguably settling too, if you go by the assumption that most women only truly want Chad. But honestly I find that's a bit of a myth, a copout. The men who complain that women only want Chad, quite honestly, give the im…
/r/PurplePillDebate22/06/24 08:53 PM
7

The average man is also overweight, at least in the US.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/06/24 08:40 PM
3

It's really not though. Especially when a woman posts about being happy on Instagram and makes zero mention of men, and some men still inferior she's secretly lonely and miserable.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/06/24 07:26 PM
12

Not if the message is that women are better off without.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/06/24 07:23 PM
7

Unless the woman is seriously going out of her way to say she's happy single and doesn't need a man, she's isn't coping, and those guys insisting she isn't happy are just angry at her for existing and not needing them to validate her.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/06/24 05:19 PM
67

It validates their worldview that women "need" men, and also that women get punished for choosing the "wrong" men.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/06/24 04:50 PM
0

My thinking is that women who are that selective for the 6/6/6 stuff, probably go online because that's exactly the type of place to get to filter for those qualities immediately. Most women aren't even on apps these days, so we can't draw too many conclusions for women's dating habits based on how they swipe alone. Yes women are still selective IRL, but from observation they're not looking for the hottest guy in the room, they're looking for the person who really connects with them, and is a pr…
/r/PurplePillDebate22/06/24 02:32 PM
-1

I think most women handle rejection fine, but so do most men. Those stories of yours stand out because of the way the women acted, but I believe most of the time when women get rejected or feel rejected, they probably don't do or say much of anything. I say this because I've ignored or politely turned down women in the past, and most of the time they just kind of accepted it and moved on. Only a handful of times did they get sulky, or act pushy or desperate, or turn on me and get nasty. Unless y…
/r/PurplePillDebate22/06/24 12:53 PM
1

terminally online Pretty much every man I talk to or interact with is crazy about good looking women. This includes men who are married or in relationships. They do not notice or pay much attention at all to women who are average and below, or just do nothing for them physically. It's not hard to see why there is a stereotype about guys fixating on looks, but ultimately "settling" with their looksmatch. The pill theories are on to something with this at least. Young pretty women are the ones men…
/r/PurplePillDebate22/06/24 11:26 AM
3

You're too much on the internet in real life men are happy that women breath in their general directions. If she's good looking, they are happy. If he's not attracted to her, he probably doesn't notice or care. The average woman is a feminist and the average man is at worst neutral at best a feminist ally. You are probably thinking of liberal "girl boss" feminism, which unlike the radical Marxist feminism of decades ago, does not really seek to dismantle the patriarchy but more so "reform" it. I…
/r/PurplePillDebate21/06/24 08:01 PM
1

I can see where you're coming from. It just depends on your goals for your own life, but I can see why having kids sooner is a better idea. I just know from observation that plenty of people rush straight into marriage with the wrong person, almost as if they think tying the knot and having children will fix it, and that's also a recipe for disaster.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/06/24 03:22 PM
1

Huh? You got married older because you were discerning, but you're disagreeing that people should wait longer to get married if that's what it takes to find a good partner?
/r/PurplePillDebate21/06/24 02:43 PM
7

It's pushed extremely heavily on Facebook, Instagram, YouTube and TikTok. Without having to do anything, those podcast bro clips where they tear apart "female nature" show up in my feed constantly with hundreds of thousands of views, and all the same predictable comments where men are saying they will never date again because women are all 304s, and so on.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/06/24 02:42 PM
21

Sure, it's true that some women want us to occupy what are considered gendered expectations for men, even ignoring that many of those "roles" are just part of being a functioning human adult. But, from what I've observed, many men expect the same of women. They want women to be demure and submissive, and to pay extra attention to their physical appearance. The "feminine" ideal men have of women, much to their surprise, is not really something women just naturally become, it's usually something t…
/r/PurplePillDebate21/06/24 12:23 AM
3

It gets better later for people who took time to address issues and hangups, and stop making the same mistakes they did when younger. It's kind of telling how obsessed people get with finding a lasting relationship when younger, out of sheer anxiety that not doing so is a death sentence. I feel like the pressure put on people to feel desperate to settle can cause more problems than it's worth, and it's the folks who are serially monogamous (in and out of relationships constantly, while repeating…
/r/PurplePillDebate20/06/24 05:03 PM
1

It's not controversial. There are variants of tropes where men are chronically single and live in a perpetual state of rejection unless they are exceptionally attractive or something. Even in kids media that people cite for giving men false hope that the loser kid ends up with the hot girl, it seems far more common that the prince-to-be, cocky bad boy or plucky shounen protagonist with god-like genes is the one who rises to the top and "gets the girl". But this doesn't stop men, from mediocre to…
/r/PurplePillDebate20/06/24 04:53 PM
0

Ironically, what I've observed is that the "relationship oriented" people sometimes end up being the ones that rack up high body counts, because they use sex and relationships as a means to validate themselves and deal with insecure and anxious attachment issues. And the ones who are taking their time not being extra concerned with relationships might find a life partner sooner or later, but their internal emotional security keeps them from tying down with the wrong person because the outside wo…
/r/PurplePillDebate20/06/24 03:22 PM
0

I think men don't understand that the equivalent for them would be a bunch of women they're not attracted to, throwing themselves at them and begging for validation over nothing. Not a harem of Victoria's Secret models lined up at their personal brothel. Sex is supposed to be mutually enjoyable Which is exactly why being able to easily sleep with someone you're not attracted to and have no connection or feelings for is not "having life on easy mode" the way men think it is.
/r/PurplePillDebate20/06/24 02:25 PM
10

Men are far pickier than many will admit. To them, a woman has to be exceptionally physically attractive while also not "annoying" or a "nag". That isn't just any woman, and some guys even use the term "unicorn" for a reason.
/r/PurplePillDebate20/06/24 01:27 PM
1

That's fair
/r/PurplePillDebate20/06/24 01:24 PM
5

Some guys will always think women have it easy because they have a buffet of dick at their disposal at any given moment, as if they should feel humbled that so many men will just willingly use them for sex and nothing else.
/r/PurplePillDebate20/06/24 01:16 PM
4

There are variations of "chase excellence and women will follow" thrown around on the Manosphere pretty regularly. The advice usually doesn't specify that "chasing excellence" includes cultivating a requisite set of social skills that make it possible to enter a relationship and be successful in one.
/r/PurplePillDebate20/06/24 01:13 PM
0

Depends. There are also women that "focused on themselves" in their 20s and end up in their late 20s or early 30s with all their shit together but no boyfriend or husband. And they probably received similar advice about "focusing on themselves". "Relationship oriented" people can sometimes have some troubling qualities. Things like anxious attachment style, codependency and serial monogamy play out often for them and it doesn't always end well. It's up to an individual to decide for themselves i…
/r/PurplePillDebate20/06/24 01:08 PM
–

If someone is being nice to you, don't assume anything. Don't assume they are just being nice and don't assume they want to bang or start a relationship. If you really feel attracted to them and they haven't given any indicators of strong disinterest, plus appear to be single, go ahead and ask them out, it's not going to kill you I promise.
/r/PurplePillDebate19/06/24 11:18 PM
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When women wax on about "equal contribution" they're usually ignoring men's greater financial contributions. And when women trash men for wanting to split the bill, or not buying them flowers, or whatever, they're quite literally demanding extra burdens on men. I don't think I've ever seen a woman trash a guy for any of these things. What I have seen is men going out of their way to do all these mechanical, performative things to try to gain favor with a woman and end up being rejected or ghoste…
/r/PurplePillDebate19/06/24 08:08 AM
–

Several of the examples I listed are textbook cases of "masculine expectations" women enforce on men. Sorry but no, they aren't. Being expected to contribute equally to a household and relationship is not an unreasonable and needless gender standard, it's a perfectly acceptable relationship expectation. As if women haven't been incredibly antagonistic towards us. Not all of them are. Two wrongs don't make a right. Why is that bad? What if they are to blame? Generalizing an entire gender is bad f…
/r/PurplePillDebate19/06/24 07:04 AM
–

The Manosphere is the closest thing we have to what you're suggesting, especially if you think the only way to "advocate" is to somehow tear down on the other gender. Looking at the body of your post, that sort of seems to be the case. And the Manosphere already does that. It tells men that women hate accountability, encourages them to sleep around and cheat instead of settling down, is decidedly against "simping", advocates abortion rights for men, excuses men who cheat on or abuse their partne…
/r/PurplePillDebate19/06/24 06:41 AM
3

Perhaps it was because the guys in the post did not provide consent to having their full profile photos shared. I only skimmed the thread so I wouldn't know for sure.
/r/PurplePillDebate18/06/24 08:50 PM
–

Sadly it isn't lol
/r/PurplePillDebate18/06/24 08:18 PM
11

You're not locked out, nobody is. You do sometimes have to be willing to be realistic and reasonable with any standards and expectations, and I suspect many men feel some sort of resentment at what that could mean.
/r/PurplePillDebate18/06/24 01:50 PM
7

Because there are no consequences for that. The man isn't suffering. The consequence is the suffering of others, and it's even worse if that is because someone else's bad behavior. I'm not excusing women or absolving them of their issues, but relationships involve two people and so he is also to blame if it goes south. People with baggage should date people with baggage. Also, not getting laid is not baggage. Depends on who you ask. Lots of people view being an incel or late bloomer as a huge re…
/r/PurplePillDebate18/06/24 01:36 PM
13

It feels a little telling that women get blamed for "choosing wrong", but men don't get blamed for things like pumping and dumping or being deadbeat fathers, especially when certain corners of the Manosphere encourages guys to lie about their intentions in order to sleep with more women. I don't think women should be locked out of the market for having baggage and neither should men. Otherwise, you also agree that red pill guys with a chip on their shoulder, incels, late bloomers, divorced guys …
/r/PurplePillDebate18/06/24 11:26 AM
2

I've turned down a decent amount of opportunities where I wasn't sure enough, because I wanted to spare both of us from wasting any time or causing any emotional pain. I know a lot of guys will either "take what they can get" or use those women for sex/temporary pleasure, but that always felt so wrong to me. My therapist did tell me my compass wasn't facing north, and that did have me question whether or not I should've given some of those women a chance. But it's probably for the best I didn't …
/r/PurplePillDebate17/06/24 10:24 PM
2

When I was younger, I had it easier in dating in part because I felt more motivation to keep trying even when something didn't work out with one person in particular. But after some bad relationship experiences (of which I take responsibility for creating on my own), I felt pretty jaded about trying to date. At the very least, I was hesitating more because I didn't want to repeat mistakes I made in the past, among which were pursuing women too hard and too strong, and getting attached too quickl…
/r/PurplePillDebate17/06/24 10:15 PM
3

The response here will vary based on the person, but I'll say this much for myself. I don't really mind the idea of being the one to initiate, especially if I feel good enough about myself that I'd be willing to risk rejection in order to potentially go out with someone I like. The problem I see is when I feel like it's an obligation, and it's something the other person takes for granted. For many of us, it still takes a level of courage to put ourselves out there. So, when it seems the other pe…
/r/PurplePillDebate17/06/24 09:47 PM
1

For America, cheap shitty food is easier to access than healthy food. And to be honest, sugar seems to be in fucking everything here. Fruit juice, tea, soda, those energy drinks all have more than your daily recommended sugar intake in one can or bottle, and because they're "liquid calories" they're easy to just gulp down and not actually feel full. Add on top that of course it's added sugar, which is so much worse than natural sugar. I was fortunate enough to be raised in a house where we didn'…
/r/PurplePillDebate17/06/24 08:27 PM
3

I've known instances where the man would keep asking her out multiple times before she agreed, and they ended up staying together for a decade or longer. I think it is less that he wore her down, and more that she decided to give him a chance after considering how much good someone could be for her that continued to respectfully pursue her. But for every instance of this, there's many more of men "simping" and burying themselves to no avail.
/r/PurplePillDebate17/06/24 03:56 PM
1

I feel like anyone misses out by not making the first move, but I also understand the reasoning behind why men are typically expected to do so.
/r/PurplePillDebate17/06/24 12:02 PM
6

Indicator of interest
/r/PurplePillDebate17/06/24 11:55 AM
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This post will probably get deleted because there is a rule against threads about race and dating. But yes. Race plays a huge part. Apparently FDS users skew largely African-American, and there also seems to be a trend of men of color in the current "Manosphere". There is likely some reason why we seem people of color, especially in the USA, get drawn into these kinds of ideologies which urge them to prioritize themselves and try to "game" the dating market the best they can, even at the expense…
/r/PurplePillDebate17/06/24 08:29 AM
4

This is well put. One sentiment I see on this sub often is that people can have whatever standards they want, regardless of them seeming unreasonable or hypocritical. I tend to disagree; I wouldn't ask for a woman to bring something to the table I wouldn't myself. There would obviously be a level of "complimentary" qualities in a partner, but for the most part I'm big on becoming the type of person I want to attract, over simply demanding someone else have things I want.
/r/PurplePillDebate17/06/24 08:05 AM
6

Ideally yes, but that assumes people have been given the tools and upbringing to attract and start a relationship with someone, and it's not always that simple which is why relationships end so often.
/r/PurplePillDebate16/06/24 09:28 PM
3

That might be true in the grand scheme, but for then guys who complain about this kind of thing and end up in the Manosphere, there is usually a strong tendency toward wanting young/hot/fit women.
/r/PurplePillDebate15/06/24 02:49 PM
0

I've met women who want older guys. Some women do either have a thing for older men, or simply don't care so much about age in the first place.
/r/PurplePillDebate15/06/24 12:07 PM
2

I don't necessarily disagree that pursuing the hottest person you meet, even if they demonstrate early on that they aren't necessarily interested in the way you'd hoped, is foolish. And I believe many people have done this, men and women. Many of the guys who end up in the "Manosphere" had their heart shattered when they were after a really attractive person that either completely rejected them or broke up with them later. Unfortunately, many people are after a rare combination of strong feeling…
/r/PurplePillDebate15/06/24 12:02 PM
4

There is no reason to date someone unless you're attracted to them. The good guys might actually be genuinely good people who make good relationship partners, but if they don't have enough attractive qualities women won't be interested in them. Those qualities can be anything from physical appearance to confidence and pro social behavior.
/r/PurplePillDebate15/06/24 11:43 AM
6

They get into relationships with those men because they find them attractive.
/r/PurplePillDebate15/06/24 11:39 AM
6

Again, it's implied in the narrative that women specifically choose to pursue "bad boys" instead of pairing off with "good men". It's not even just men saying it. I've seen women on YT and TikTok making videos stating that women should choose good men, which are defined as providers and looking to settle down, instead of getting used up by attractive players. I know a lot of that is people gaming the algorithms, but still.
/r/PurplePillDebate15/06/24 11:37 AM
7

When some guys complain that they are good men and women ignore them for bad boys and alpha jerks, they're sort of implying that the women should desire them for the qualities that the men have decided should make them suitable candidates. If you're a "good man" and a woman isn't interested, she may just simply not be physically attracted or maybe she's gay or already in a relationship. If seemingly no woman is interested then it means there is probably something about yourself or your approach …
/r/PurplePillDebate15/06/24 11:28 AM
–

Redpill does not judge TRP notoriously infantilizes women, calls them immature and illogical, and essentially posits that they are lesser than men in many ways but that this is somehow neutral and shouldn't be taken negatively. It doesn't take a lot of critical thought to understand why one specific group of people being called inherently inferior to another is offensive and polarizing. Or call women whores Sure. Explain the "cock carousel" idea, then. Why are women attracted to some and not oth…
/r/PurplePillDebate15/06/24 11:25 AM
12

I don't think anyone is telling men to save women from anything. A lot of guys play themselves into situations where they are friendzoned/simping/white knighting/getting oneitis or whatever you want to call it, but I never see anyone asking them to do this. Instead they have this misguided belief that being some kind of "good" man will make their target fall in love with them, and at the worst they get jaded and make posts like this one where they essentially blame the woman for choosing wrong i…
/r/PurplePillDebate15/06/24 10:53 AM
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I'm not even sure about this one anymore. The "godfather" of RP theory and text, Rollo Tomassi, has not only been acting like a huge grifter but he spends a lot of time with the other podcast bro grifters like Fresh n Fit or the Whatever Podcast. And when I take a closer look at the early days of the Rational Male, I do notice some of the same messaging, which is that women are illogical and their sexual selection is rooted in moral failure especially since the advent of feminism. His political …
/r/PurplePillDebate15/06/24 10:00 AM
8

How does marrying young ensure that the children born are raised with the "resources and vigor" they deserve? How does this strategy account for divorcing older women in the event you've already had one or more children with her? Do those children just get screwed on getting taken care of, and end up the statistic of a single parent household, which the Manosphere loves to cite as not only a reason why men aren't raised right, but love to exclusively blame women for?
/r/PurplePillDebate15/06/24 09:49 AM
3

I tend to agree, but there is a lot of stigma against men who are single. Especially on this sub. The idea is that being single means you can't get laid, which means women don't want you, which means something is wrong with you. I don't agree with that, but that's how many other people feel and something single men need to contend with.
/r/PurplePillDebate13/06/24 06:38 PM
4

Your last paragraph I definitely agree with. So many people I meet, their entire life is defined by their job and their romantic attachment. When they're not working they're with their SO. And I don't blame them for that because it's not like we have much in the way of "third places" or other avenues to meet people organically on a consistent basis outside of universities. I've been doing what I can to get outside and see new faces on a consistent level, but it sometimes feels like I'm doing som…
/r/PurplePillDebate13/06/24 04:50 PM
9

I've definitely had moments where I basically felt like I had to have a girlfriend, or I wouldn't have any consistent feelings of connectedness and closeness with anyone. Whenever my family members or friends, regardless of gender would enter a relationship, I could count on basically never seeing them because all their free time and energy was spent on that relationship. Everything on their social media is about their SO and their new coupled up/married/family life. It sometimes genuinely seems…
/r/PurplePillDebate13/06/24 04:38 PM
1

It's not a scam unless you are doing it out of a belief that you'll receive some sort of external benefit or reward. The reality is that you can "improve" yourself until your dying breath and it's no guarantee that women (or anyone) will appreciate the effort you put into that improvement, especially if it only really benefits you and not them. If you're working on yourself because you want to be a better you every day, have right at it. If you're doing it so other people like you, you're at the…
/r/PurplePillDebate13/06/24 04:07 PM
8

I really have to wonder why somebody would vocalize their "preferences" if they were not actual deal breakers. For many people, a preference is interchangeable with a requirement. Many guys want to feel really attractive to women, or at least the woman they intend to date or marry. I don't think it's a reach to see why when a guy finds out a woman he's into - much less dating or considering marrying - has a preference for things he lacks, he would not feel "some type of way". This is one reason …
/r/PurplePillDebate13/06/24 02:24 PM
1

I think part of the problem is how people will talk about how their relationships started. "Yeah we knew each other/we were friends for years/decades before we got together". Some people hear this and think if you just act like a good friend and never make any sort of intentions known, the other person will eventually just fall for you because of all your good qualities. This does happen sometimes, but more often than not there is an existing, underlying romantic or sexual tension between the tw…
/r/PurplePillDebate13/06/24 10:52 AM
–

Some people care and some people don't. This can be said about just about anything. You might be surprised to see women who simply don't mind being with a guy that is less physically blessed, especially if he brings other qualities to the table. I know it feels cliche, and many people can be varying levels of "shallow", but I hope you don't give up. I agree that body shaming and attacking people's appearances is wrong no matter the context. I'm sorry if you keep catching strays every time somebo…
/r/PurplePillDebate13/06/24 10:31 AM
3

I'm a younger millennial, with gen X siblings and boomer relatives. We grew up with similar patterns of childhood neglect from our parents. Most of them posit that they "turned out okay", despite having a myriad issues like alcohol and substance abuse, emotional detachment and unavailability, anger and even getting put in jail over different crimes. I'm the only one among my siblings or parents that actually sought out therapy at a younger age because I wanted to break the obvious "generational …
/r/PurplePillDebate12/06/24 02:02 PM
2

I feel like some of you guys try a little too hard to be this perfect specimen for all women, instead of just having the confidence in yourself to accept that not everyone going to like you for different reasons, and that's okay. My experience has been if she does not like you, no amount of being more alpha or masculine or not having female friends or not talking about your problems until sex will make her change how she feels about you. On the other hand if she likes you enough, you can be impe…
/r/PurplePillDebate12/06/24 01:26 PM
31

They are way too generalizing, and can be pretty sexist to both genders. I feel that they can be true of some people some of the time, but too often they draw the wrong conclusions based on their pre-existing outlook. For example, stating that a woman is being "hypergamous" for simply having a practical consideration about the income situation of someone she is marrying when she wants to buy a house or start a family. Or when it posits that men only care about looks, when it's pretty clear that …
/r/PurplePillDebate12/06/24 10:43 AM
0

I was under the impression that "low value women" were less sexually attractive, especially regarding looks. The lawyer woman with the type A personality and smashing looks is desirable to many men, but because of her career and socioeconomic prospects is out of the league of most of them. Its easy to rationalize why the woman who is hot and has her shit together is boring compared to the one who more available sexually, even if the latter is not as put together. Part of what makes someone desir…
/r/PurplePillDebate12/06/24 10:15 AM
3

Social media is the Zoomer version of what we had in the 90s: reality TV. You might as well believe that professional wrestling or Jerry Springer is real. It’s the empiricism of imbeciles. You are letting an algorithm feed you information that has been shaped by multiple layers of systematic bias, and in many cases is a deliberate performance. This feels so true. I mean, I'm a millenial and I remember the era of "prank videos" on YouTube, before they cracked down heavily on what types of content…
/r/PurplePillDebate10/06/24 10:04 PM
8

My sister said as a teenager that she likes "nice guys with an edge". And one of my exes said she likes guys who are a bit on the arrogant side as long as it's earned. PUAs have long described "cocky funny" as a way to lead an interaction that turns women on. It bothers guys who are socialized to be kinder and gentler and not offend others, and I don't think that's what every single woman on earth wants, but it's definitely one of those not so nice qualities people find sexy.
/r/PurplePillDebate09/06/24 05:49 PM
1

Can we have a practical example please? Herr and Frau Clinton. With Herr Clinton clearly having some sexual contact with other ladies. This sort of thing? Pretty much yeah. Any time it's clearly not working out, and pretty obviously never will. I'm all about people working things out and relationships standing the test of time. But I also believe there is a point of no return for just about any relationship, where it's gotten so bad you have to cut your losses and move on. I think it's up to the…
/r/PurplePillDebate09/06/24 03:13 PM
1

What is "good for" someone is very VERY subjective. Wanting to change something in your partner does not automatically make your partner "not good", merely not perfect. (and nobody is perfect). That's exactly why I said not good for them, not that the person isn't good. If the person you're with is emotionally unavailable and refuses to commit, is constantly cheating on you or you're always off and on, that sort of thing. I'm not talking about people who occasionally have minor disagreements; I …
/r/PurplePillDebate09/06/24 02:55 PM
3

There is still an idealization of men and relationships in the media. Like the commenter said, it centers around men being providers, protectors, and family men. It is the ideal of the "good man" who will marry you, buy a house with you, and start a family with you. Or that this is what most men want, and many men say they want. But women become understandably disillusioned when a guy says he wants all this, yet his desire and attention is directed at the hot party girls in her early 20's. Just …
/r/PurplePillDebate09/06/24 02:47 PM
1

Desperate women do exist. I think a key difference is they are still notably choosier than men, but women absolutely do "simp" for guys they're into. I've known a handful of women who basically stay in relationships with guys that aren't good for them, hoping they change. And those guys aren't always chads or even just moderately attractive. They're just ordinary dudes who basically do nothing except have some kind of strong emotional resonance with her. It's a little complicated but what I can …
/r/PurplePillDebate09/06/24 02:34 PM
1

Women think you should settle down once you find the right person. Men think you should settle down when your life is in order. Interesting. I was told by family members and friends that it's better to wait to get my life together before even trying to date, let alone consider marriage, or children. And this idea has been re-enforced by others I've spoken to or heard from when this topic came up, so I've spent a lot of time "working on myself" and not pursuing anything serious because I felt lik…
/r/PurplePillDebate09/06/24 02:25 PM
6

There are women who put men on a pedestal of sorts, and treat having a boyfriend or husband as a substantial life goal. They will watch videos on how to be more attractive and feminine, how to please men, how to be a good partner etc. Most people, men and women, gay or straight, would prefer having a partner to not having one. And some of them find themselves in situations where they are sort of desperate for it.
/r/PurplePillDebate09/06/24 02:12 PM
1

Because other people say you should be friends first It doesn't matter if you are friends first or not, if there is not already any existing romantic or sexual tension. I feel like "friends first" is how some people describe slowing down and getting to know someone better first, or they look back in hindsight on a current partner and say "oh yeah, we were friends for years before we got together". Point is, I would not befriend someone with the hope or expectation that it turns into more. or the…
/r/PurplePillDebate08/06/24 02:40 PM
0

No, but I'm not sure why it matters.
/r/PurplePillDebate08/06/24 02:25 PM
1

You can substitute whatever you think is just plain unattractive, but at the end of the day, many guys who say dating is difficult, believe so because they don't have the options they want, not because they have none whatsoever.
/r/PurplePillDebate08/06/24 10:38 AM
5

I'm in a similar boat of having to put the brakes on dating while I work on myself. But what my therapist told me is that I should stop putting all this pressure on myself to be perfect for everyone, and instead be happy with where I'm at and ask myself if I like the women I'm trying to date, instead of getting in my own head and worrying if I'm good enough for her at all. I think somewhere in that seemingly cliched response is where a real break through lies. People say confidence is attractive…
/r/PurplePillDebate08/06/24 03:41 AM
1

I believe it's possible too, but sometimes guys try to be friends with women in the hopes it'll help them get laid. This is why people say to just be up front with your intentions instead of doing favors in the hopes she realizes you're trying to demonstrate what a good boyfriend you are instead of just asking her out.
/r/PurplePillDebate08/06/24 03:12 AM
15

Many men probably have options including morbidly obese women or single moms, but they're not interested at all in those. They usually are interested in the same types of women, and won't truly just go after anyone who is willing despite how often they say they will. This is the real reason men complain that dating is hard; it's because they can't always have the women they want.
/r/PurplePillDebate08/06/24 02:54 AM
1

Yeah man I get it. It's a difficult environment to find a quality relationship and stay in one, so I can see why people become so jaded so easily. As intoxicating as those narratives are, they don't provide a solution because they generalize too much and don't leave room for a happier alternative.
/r/PurplePillDebate07/06/24 08:00 PM
2

I feel that obsessing over this stuff is going to make a lot of people bitter. Even if parts of it are true at times, it casts massive generalizations onto the entire population and those generalizations are pretty much always negative ones. I believe TRP stuff is true some of the time, in certain situations, and for a lot of people it shatters the illusions or expectations they may have had. I remember finding The Rational Male shortly after going through a very bad breakup when I was very youn…
/r/PurplePillDebate07/06/24 07:50 PM
17

If your friend stops being your friend because you rejected them romantically, it's not unreasonable to wonder if they were ever your friend in the first place. But it's also not unreasonable to feel that it's difficult to be around someone you're attracted to, to the point you need to see them less. I've had women do nice things for me, in the hopes I would notice them and be interested in them. For the most part when I wasn't romantically available to them, it was not an issue and we could sti…
/r/PurplePillDebate07/06/24 07:36 PM
3

I think that 3 month school would be easily replaced with a good father or other male role models growing up.
/r/PurplePillDebate07/06/24 01:42 AM
4

I wish I could say the bad stuff is getting pushed out, but then I keep getting recommended hoe_math or psych hacks videos despite avoiding them. They're just the latest in a long line of weird dudes trying to "talk" to sexually frustrated men. I don't know, maybe it's something many guys go through and we just grow out of it, but it feels so exhausting to see the same concepts get repackaged and sold over and over again.
/r/PurplePillDebate07/06/24 01:33 AM
2

One decent voice is Dr K from HealthyGamer, another one is Mark Manson. Mark Manson did do the PUA thing and wrote a book about it called "Models", which has good actionable advice on how to get laid or find a relationship that doesn't advocate seeing women as subhuman. The one issue there is that Mark Manson is very "normie" aka neuro typical, so his advice might not always land. Dr. K is really good at talking to neuro divergent folks and meeting them where they are at, and he is overall extre…
/r/PurplePillDebate07/06/24 01:29 AM
8

Most of the men who act as authority figures in the Manosphere are anti social jerks, and when other guys show adjacency to that crap they are considered to be anti social jerks as well. When your thesis about the crisis of masculinity is that not addressing it leads to the rise of extremely toxic, misogynistic and authoritarian figures, it does seem like a threat, or at the very least a warning. It's basically saying that if left on their own, men can't help but become incredibly toxic or even …
/r/PurplePillDebate06/06/24 10:40 PM
3

I think it's better to be single than in a miserable relationship, but this applies for everyone. Too many people IMO take their relationships for granted and probably see the other person as a means to an end. It's really unfortunate to think of how many people get together and stay together when they aren't really happy.
/r/PurplePillDebate06/06/24 10:10 PM
3

It's like telling your partner you'll kill yourself if they break up with you. There isn't much of a solution being provided that incentivizes anyone to want to understand let alone make meaningful yet reasonable changes. Frankly from what I've observed, many of these manosphere men don't have a whole lot of empathy for the guys around them. Their attitude is pretty "fuck you, I got mine" when it comes to having desirable life outcomes. It's not like men don't deserve empathy or understanding, i…
/r/PurplePillDebate06/06/24 08:30 PM
3

My thoughts exactly. I wonder what level of self awareness someone has to think everyone they can have sex with is less attractive than they are.
/r/PurplePillDebate06/06/24 08:08 PM
7

You might not intend this, but much of your post comes across as a threat. I see this too often when men bring up the "crisis of masculinity" and insist that society will somehow pay for it, then go on to cite people like Trump, Tate, Elliot Rodger or so on. It's like saying "the toxic masculinity will continue until we get what we want". Not to mention that the solutions often involve some variation of women lowering their standards and entering relationships with men they are not attracted to.…
/r/PurplePillDebate06/06/24 08:06 PM
3

nobody says that That one YT channel called hoe_math, yet another Manosphere figure, claims to have had a "harem of 4's" as a self-reported 8. And he also keeps insisting on that one chart where women only date men above themselves instead of their equal. There are people who believe it, even if it's nonsense.
/r/PurplePillDebate06/06/24 07:33 PM
2

tons of men settle with the mindset of "eh i can work with this" Well, have you seen most men? Most men are statistically overweight or obese in the US, just like women are. The "average man" is middle aged and somewhere in the 25-30 BMI range. So it's almost amusing when they say that guys just absolutely lust after the skinny 22 year old college girls, as if those women are anywhere in their league, and claim that the equally overweight and median income earning women his age is something he h…
/r/PurplePillDebate06/06/24 04:10 PM
3

I'm not denying that's true. I'm challenging whether or not the assertion that her merely being physically attractive is what gets you going. Things like body language and presentation, how she carries herself, and her perceived availability can also play a much larger role. I believe attraction is more than simply about being good looking, it's about having an aggregate of qualities that make you desirable, of which being physically appealing is just one. Like I said, if it was just about how h…
/r/PurplePillDebate06/06/24 03:44 PM
4

I think the issue is you’re projecting feminine thinking onto men. This isn't a feminine thing. I've met my fair share of women who simply wanted to sleep around and not be attached in any way. I’ve slept with enough women to know that sex with a skinny, enthusiastic and attractive woman is so much better than sex with an “average” woman You're having to load up the scenario with her being "enthusiastic" which says everything I need to know. "Average" women can be enthusiastic and good in bed an…
/r/PurplePillDebate06/06/24 03:37 PM
5

It doesn't have to be. One of the best things you can do for yourself is rid yourself of gendered expectations and timelines set out for you by random people. That can include even your family, friends and parents. Having a "girlfriend" doesn't magically absolve you of all your frustrations with life and even necessarily with dating. If you experience even one bad relationship, you might even start to wonder if all that fuss over trying to find one was even worth it. Sure, people will make proje…
/r/PurplePillDebate06/06/24 03:21 PM
16

I'd argue it's worse to be forced to have kids you don't want. As someone raised by emotionally unavailable parents who made me feel like a burden, the last thing I want is for any kid to come into this world because they were forced into it. If we aren't creating environments for enough women to want to have kids in the first place, that's probably what should be addressed if anything.
/r/PurplePillDebate06/06/24 03:09 PM
5

I feel that you're projecting a whole lot of idealism about what sex with an attractive woman feels like. Just because she's hot doesn't mean she's going to give you the best experience you've ever had. There is just so much more that goes into physical intimacy. If that's really all that mattered, most men would find a legal sex worker and be done with it then and there, but even most men I suspect desire some kind of emotional connection even if they claim otherwise. Being physically attractiv…
/r/PurplePillDebate06/06/24 03:03 PM
14

There's definitely a weird obsession some guys seem to have with having "a girlfriend" as if they are a trophy, or represent some social milestone. And so their standards ultimately amount to "she has to be a woman that I can show off to other people, like an 'Unlocked Achievement' on my Steam dashboard, which tells the world that I in fact have the seemingly requisite social skills in order to enter a relationship". I wish some dudes realized it's not all that serious, and obsessing over it isn…
/r/PurplePillDebate06/06/24 02:16 PM
8

If a man neglected parental duties due to depression, if he quit his job or did nothing around the house, would HE be shown the same grace? I bet money he wouldn't. Some people might defend him and some might not. I think a lot of issues in relationships quickly become polarizing in Social Media Court because of all the missing context and emotional attachment to the situation. I'm not going to "defend" neglectful parenting, but I'm also not going to attack the person doing it and assume the wor…
/r/PurplePillDebate06/06/24 01:22 PM
1

I've noticed some people are just perpetual victims. No matter what happens in their life it's never really their fault. If they go through a breakup or get rejected, it's because the other person didn't treat them right or didn't see their value. By default, any relationship this person enters will somewhat involve them being saved or rescued from the cruelty of life by someone else. On the flip side of course are the saviors. The knights in shining armor, and the ones who fix and protect damag…
/r/PurplePillDebate06/06/24 10:24 AM
13

If a man deflowers a virgin, marries her and lives a life of wedded bliss I'm pretty sure the sex will get better over time. It would almost be an impossibility for it not to get better. I think the concept of "good sex" is not something absolutely everyone cares about. I definitely agree there can be great sex from a standpoint of pure physical pleasure. And yeah, there is sex that can be exceedingly bad, when the mood isn't right, there's zero attempt from one or both people to pleasure the ot…
/r/PurplePillDebate06/06/24 12:09 AM
2

This post might be outrage bait or not. I wouldn't be surprised if this is how many people feel. I've had guys encourage me to ask out women I knew were taken, which kind of says everything I need to know about how the world works.
/r/PurplePillDebate05/06/24 03:13 PM
1

I agree with the title of the post, not so much the body. This shows us how a man will become unattractive if he actually loves and prioritizes a woman. I've seen this sentiment before. I have to wonder whether the man changed between the woman he "loved and prioritized" and the one he's with now that he seems to just use for sex. There is a good chance he stopped being especially needy and desperate for validation from any one person which is good, but the problem is with being emotionally unav…
/r/PurplePillDebate05/06/24 05:05 AM
2

I thought the ending was solid. Maybe a bit cheesy with the Autumn thing, but I appreciate how much growth Tom demonstrates at that point. Compared to how he acted with Summer - really desperate and needy, and basically seeing her as a means to an end - he basically shoots his shot with Autumn once and moves on after she initially rejects him. The fact that she agrees to a date feels canned but it's a nice send off. Summer may or may not have grown too, but it's hard to say since we don't really…
/r/PurplePillDebate05/06/24 04:52 AM
10

(500) Days of Summer hit super hard on a first watch. Not because it's about a good relationship obviously, but exactly because it rips the curtain right off of ideals about love and the hopeless romantic trope. I saw so much of myself in Tom, and it felt like a huge wakeup call to the dangers of over romanticizing anyone too early, especially if they've shown signs they aren't the right one for you. Midsommar is a great allegory for how toxic and destructive codependent relationships can be. An…
/r/PurplePillDebate04/06/24 11:07 PM
9

I don't think most men have access to hot twenty something women, whether they are within their preferred age range or not. Those are the Stacy's, and Stacy dates Chad.
/r/PurplePillDebate04/06/24 03:25 PM
1

You might be right. I'm an early 30's millennial and most of my meetings with women were offline, but it's very possible I was among the last generation where that was statistically the norm. Most of my peers have paired off and increasingly more seem to meet online as time goes on. The people who meet offline seem to be mostly older millennials and gen X.
/r/PurplePillDebate04/06/24 11:50 AM
4

My take is that if gender roles exist naturally, as a consequence of some very nuanced difference in biology, then it's a far cry from being the sort of determinism that so many make it out to be. Whenever I see someone try to explain why men and women are "fundamentally different", it seems like those differences are exaggerated. I don't see how confidence isn't attractive in a woman, for example. I can see how one would interpret it to be so, in an environment where men are expected to lead an…
/r/PurplePillDebate04/06/24 01:51 AM
3

I actually agree with this and feminist and leftist theory are what mostly pushed me out of the "Manosphere". Although I can also see how folks hesitate to call that a solution when they don't imagine it working out practically, or believe there is too strong a biological basis for these roles.
/r/PurplePillDebate04/06/24 12:44 AM
3

That makes sense, although I'm not sure we disagree all that much. Being masculine, self assured, intuitive, outgoing and so on seems to be what most people are getting at when they say the guy is "leading" the interaction.
/r/PurplePillDebate04/06/24 12:36 AM
3

What is it about being well socialized that makes men attractive in a way that's not applicable to women? I'm genuinely curious about your answer.
/r/PurplePillDebate04/06/24 12:27 AM
30

inb4: "Why the focus on boys? Girls nowadays are antisocial too!" Because being non-sociable detrimentally affects males more than females when it comes to being sexually desirable/available to the opposite sex. Since this sub is about sexual attraction and romantic dynamics, I'm focusing on that aspect. It's actually for this reason I believe the focus should be on socializing everyone. The gendered expectation that men "lead" relationships may have always sort of been there for different reaso…
/r/PurplePillDebate04/06/24 12:24 AM
2

They really don't care that much at all. At worse there will be women who will reject him for his height and taller guys who make manlet jokes, but for the most part nobody cares any more than they care about other random people trying to make their life better.
/r/PurplePillDebate03/06/24 10:15 PM
10

I believe 1/2 to 2/3s of relationships still begin outside the apps though.
/r/PurplePillDebate03/06/24 10:08 PM
14

I think for many people, "dating" is not a process of going out with random people they meet online or at a bar. It's still through friend groups, at school or at work. They ultimately end up pairing off with someone they meet while living their life normally, not through some intentional process of going way out of their comfort zone and talking to untold dozens - perhaps hundreds - of strangers. In other words, for many people, they didn't really "date", they just ended up starting a relations…
/r/PurplePillDebate03/06/24 09:59 PM
–

It does take effort. I was raised by emotionally unavailable parents and it did a number on my socialization. I spent a good amount of time in therapy and getting out of my comfort zone, and now I'm in a place where I feel much more emotionally healthier and secure. I would be lying if I said I didn't wish I had it figured out sooner, or that I had "better" parents. I will say this much though: I believe a pretty decent portion of people have some kind of attachment/security/socialization issues…
/r/PurplePillDebate03/06/24 09:50 PM
–

If there's one thing a lot of the depressed blackpill people are right about, it's the significance of a strong family upbringing that develops a secure attachment style in children. Without that, they will very easily spend a significant amount of their lives chasing after the same cursed relationship patterns with people who are no good for them, or they just struggle to socialize at all depending on how bad it is.
/r/PurplePillDebate03/06/24 09:24 PM
–

I'm honestly bewildered that your takeaway from a large number of reports of men acting angry towards women for rejecting them, is that women are the problem. It's okay to feel frustrated that you're unable to meet someone who is interested despite your efforts, to a degree. As long as it's along the lines of "man, I wish I could find somebody, dating can be tough sometimes man". But it's really not okay to be upset with the women who aren't interested, as if they owe it to you to be interested …
/r/PurplePillDebate03/06/24 09:19 PM
–

Yeah, it's true. You don't have to be exceptionally tall, handsome or rich to get a girlfriend. That is a Redpill myth. Money, physique and status can and do matter, but they matter in different ways to different people. Sometimes, not at all.
/r/PurplePillDebate03/06/24 02:37 PM
–

You as a man have to be taller than her, make more money than her, have a higher degree or more degrees than her. I wish TRP would stop saying this shit. This applies to some women but definitely not all. Many of the women I've met care about if the guy is fun and interesting to be around, and does things to make her feel valued, appreciated and respected. They want the presence of a man who's emotionally available, committed and confident. They couldn't care less about you towering over her phy…
/r/PurplePillDebate03/06/24 02:10 PM
13

It's odd that a man who doesn't pursue is a pussy and a coward, yet if he does he is also desperate for pussy. I mean, maybe he wasn't interested, but maybe he just felt based on her behavior that she wouldn't say yes anyways so there was no point in asking. Or maybe he just wasn't sure enough about her to really make a move. And then these dudes wonder with bewilderment and blame society why they can’t get pussy when they don’t even pursue women that are interested in them when they are right i…
/r/PurplePillDebate02/06/24 04:14 PM
5

I'm going to give the benefit of the doubt and say that a good number of guys who "can't attract women" actually have been attractive to women and had their interest. The issue is that men are not always told that they have to be the ones to initiate. I've found out weeks, months or even years after interacting with a woman that she was wondering why I didn't ask her out or try to hook up with her, even when she wasn't flirting, and it felt like there was no chemistry between us. I also think th…
/r/PurplePillDebate02/06/24 02:48 PM
25

The reason people might say that shared interests can help you find a partner is because they can be the reason two people even meet and talk to each other in the first place. I don't know any people who actually insist that those are the glue keeping the relationship together.
/r/PurplePillDebate02/06/24 09:37 AM
2

It's one thing to say that somebody is just being shitty, and another to say it's inherent in their nature to do so. A lot of what TRP deems "women's true nature" really just seems like generalizations you could make about people at large. For example, cheating on their partner in order to get a sexual "need" met that isn't met in the current relationship, desiring the best they can get, or even caring about how someone makes them feel. You can be attractive despite having an unattractive trait …
/r/PurplePillDebate02/06/24 12:20 AM
2

It's one thing to say that somebody is just being shitty, and another to say it's inherent in their nature to do so. A lot of what TRP deems "women's true nature" really just seems like generalizations you could make about people at large. For example, cheating on their partner in order to get a sexual "need" met that isn't met in the current relationship, desiring the best they can get, or even caring about how someone makes them feel. You can be attractive despite having an unattractive trait …
/r/PurplePillDebate02/06/24 12:14 AM
25

There was a post on here days ago about why women should avoid dating late bloomer men. Maybe it's just a coincidence, but the way this post is formatted makes it feel pretty meta. Actually never mind. After going back to the post in question, this one is basically ripping the points straight off of it as some sort of gender reversal "gotcha". I really do spend too much time here lately.
/r/PurplePillDebate01/06/24 11:32 PM
15

I both love and hate that I know what post this is referencing.
/r/PurplePillDebate01/06/24 11:28 PM
4

I have a hard time believing Red Pill does not resent women, when some of their biggest public figures make a habit out of creating environments that are designed around basically shaming, belittling and scolding women for their sexual preferences. It doesn't appear like they've truly just accepted what they believe is women's nature, because if they did, they would not act so bitter about it. I believe TRP has a flawed understanding of how attraction works. There is certainly a shallow nature t…
/r/PurplePillDebate01/06/24 07:03 PM
1

I've myself noticed I would conflate this sort of anxiety around trying to figure out if that person who blows hot or cold and seems aloof at times, with some kind of love. I think it's normal to have some interest in somebody despite them being emotionally unavailable to a degree; the real trouble starts when you are desiring someone because they are emotionally unavailable. Sometimes, people get socialized and brought up to treat others with an elevated level of kindness and consideration. Thi…
/r/PurplePillDebate01/06/24 03:38 PM
6

There are few things I find more irritating than the trope of younger women who go "hehe, women mature faster than men, this is why I go for older, guys my age are immature", then when they get older it's all "oh my god will these creeps stop dating younger, just date within your age range". How confident are you that it's the exact same women making both statements?
/r/PurplePillDebate01/06/24 01:54 PM
8

These bad things that red pill says women do aren't intentional most of the time ,they are just a result of how female sexuality works. They say that, but the resentment towards women paints another picture. She can't turn off hypergamy just because she got into a relationship , she can't choose to be attracted to beta behaviors ,she can't logic herself into being attracted to someone or stop herself from being attracted to someone else .Similar to how men can't stop themselves from finding boob…
/r/PurplePillDebate01/06/24 01:33 PM
15

The problem is that Red Pill men conflate "being used" with psychological warfare that every woman is waging on them on a constant basis. And their cure is always to play the same game, but better, so they come out on top. In their mind, every woman will take advantage of any good behavior or weakness instead of appreciating it or even loving you for it, which is just straight up sad.
/r/PurplePillDebate01/06/24 11:50 AM
17

I've missed seeing memes like this one.
/r/PurplePillDebate01/06/24 11:40 AM
–

I think part of the problem is that people genuinely believe that the only reason anyone ever fails or succeeds at dating is because of the superficial things (looks, money and status). I'm not gonna bullshit you and say that those things don't matter, but the truth is that they matter in different ways to different people. And they don't really speak much to any other seriously important qualities. Qualities like "do we not just have good values, but share important ones?" or "has this person c…
/r/PurplePillDebate01/06/24 04:35 AM
34

I've never met someone I thought was "beneath me in every way".
/r/PurplePillDebate01/06/24 04:18 AM
73

Bro, I just want someone who loves me that I love in return. A relationship where we do good by each other, put effort into ourselves and the relationship. I really cannot get into this RP obsession with making sure I'm always winning some kind of power game, that I'm maxing out my sexual stats like I'm trying to stay on top of an imaginary leaderboard. And I cannot see how obsessing over a woman's past or "nature" so much that I make myself angry thinking about how much she "should" be fucking …
/r/PurplePillDebate01/06/24 04:06 AM
0

I feel like Red Pill almost simultaneously tells guys that they need to better themselves if they want to be attractive to women, but that they should feel resentful towards women or superior to them in the process. It's unfortunate because if you removed the toxicity and misogyny from their world view, it could be a lot closer to "put on some muscle, watch how you dress and lead with confidence and you're golden". But that may be too much to ask of guys who get into it because they have a chip …
/r/PurplePillDebate30/05/24 02:59 PM
35

Wanting something = desiring it, engaging with a process and in order to eventually get it, but accepting that rejection and failure are part of said process Feeling entitled = thinking that because you did the "right" things, you are owed the desired outcomes or rewards
/r/PurplePillDebate30/05/24 02:55 PM
–

I think she is super hot, and fun to sleep with, so I’ll probably still hit it a few times more for sure, but the moment I heard that number I lost all respect for her and am somewhat disgusted by the idea of committing to her If she is super hot and fun to sleep with out of the gate there is probably a reason for it, and it's not because she was a chaste virgin until meeting you. This whole post is a text book example of a Madonna/Whore complex if I've ever seen one.
/r/PurplePillDebate30/05/24 12:38 AM
1

I think "keeping score" is kind of toxic and can be exploitative. As an example, someone does something for you seemingly out of kindness, but you've actually entered a contract you were not aware of and they expect you to pay them back for it later. If you don't pay up, they start to resent you for it or bring it up in the future. This is of course, not the same as doing things out of love and consideration for another person out of love, and having a reasonable expectation they would also do t…
/r/PurplePillDebate29/05/24 09:59 PM
–

Not entirely. A lot of people are taking OP to task in this thread.
/r/PurplePillDebate29/05/24 03:54 PM
–

Maybe. It's hard to tell if someone truly was so focused on school they didn't have the energy and time to date, but I don't think they have to prioritize dating at any given point if they just don't want to, reason or no.
/r/PurplePillDebate29/05/24 02:02 PM
–

Some women care and some don't. I think being socially awkward is going to be a turnoff for more people as you get older, but ultimately the fixation on sexual experience will vary depending on the person.
/r/PurplePillDebate29/05/24 02:00 PM
–

I don't think anyone needs an "excuse" not to date. If they don't feel like dating then they don't have to.
/r/PurplePillDebate29/05/24 01:49 PM
–

Well no, that's not what I'm saying. I think "getting it" can imply establishing a basic level of social awareness and confidence.
/r/PurplePillDebate29/05/24 12:07 PM
–

It's not entitled to expect love. It only becomes entitlement when you feel you're owed it for doing the right or wrong things. A guy who sleeps around a lot, who feels he is God's gift to women, could be seen as entitled if he gets really pushy and won't take no for an answer. You can lie, or casually omit your lack of experience. All told, if you're in a casual social setting, you meet a girl and hit it off, and it gets to physical stuff you don't have to say a word. Many people have their own…
/r/PurplePillDebate29/05/24 11:50 AM
–

I don't care to make any generalizations, but I believe that confidence, self assurance and knowing how to socialize well are important life skills for everyone. It's just that in dating, they matter in different ways and for men they are typically expected to demonstrate a lot of confidence and take the lead from the jump. When you look at the OP post closely, it's not stuff that's inherent to "later bloomers". It's assumptions people make about guys who lack experience. But men who are late bl…
/r/PurplePillDebate29/05/24 11:16 AM
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I don't often agree with TRP but this is one of those things. It sounds like women want men who just get it. . So the takeaway isn't "die alone if you didn't figure it out at 21", just don't let people know you're inexperienced or something. Which I don't think is true all of the time for everyone, but oh well.
/r/PurplePillDebate29/05/24 10:47 AM
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No woman can have "any guy she wants". That's just not true. They can just sit around and wait for a guy, but this doesn't always work because the right guy won't just magically appear in any given place. I'd argue women even have to learn some form of "game". Maybe not the same as men, but just knowing how to position yourself in a way for a man they want to approach them, setting the table so to speak, is like a skill they have to learn. Hell, I've talked to women and they've told me that they…
/r/PurplePillDebate29/05/24 07:46 AM
–

The reason why many of us men don't want to market ourselves is because being ourselves is the true form of the product we're selling. Counterpoint: your "true self" is not inherently tied to being socially anxious, or avoidant, or being "introverted" which by the way, doesn't actually mean you prefer to spend time alone, but I digress. A good number of people who feel stuck where they are, basically don't want to have to change anything about themselves or try anything new. They want to stay in…
/r/PurplePillDebate29/05/24 07:13 AM
–

Just like online dating, cold approach is one of those things that people are potentially very good at, but many will struggle with. And it's for similar reasons: being able to "market yourself" is something many people aren't willing to do, because it feels demeaning, manipulative, or just seems exhausting and time consuming. Ironically, I think this is why many people struggle; not because they're average, but because so many folks want to just "be themselves" and hope to essentially happen in…
/r/PurplePillDebate29/05/24 12:10 AM
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Then you're probably not doing much, if anything, wrong. I don't know you so I don't know the full picture but ultimately, it takes time. For a lot of us, we are unfortunate enough to have to wait a little longer before we find the right person, so it's extra important we learn to be happy without someone stable and committed until they come along.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/05/24 10:04 PM
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All the red pillers will say, your life needs to be exciting and you need to be a man of purpose and have stuff going on. You need to have your woman look up to you. I'm not a Red Pill guy but I believe there is some truth to this. The "trick" is that most people are going to be pretty ordinary in the grand scheme of things. What matters is not that you're literally a complete stand out to everyone and everything else, you just have to stand out and catch the attention of the right person, assum…
/r/PurplePillDebate28/05/24 10:01 PM
8

It just seems a woman can go on and on how hard life is, how hard it is to be a woman, etc etc, its really normal and frequent to have a little emotional pity party as a woman. Depends on the audience. Women on a sub like this will be told their issues are irrelevant because they only select for Chad. And men will cry together about how hard dating and life is, and get really defensive when someone tries to provide a solution instead of just pitying them.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/05/24 03:58 PM
4

I think she means there is a certain type of functionality in the male brain that's often coded as autistic. I.e., strong interest in and preferences for structures and patterns. One of the things that's sort of a stereotype for autistic people is a fascination with trains, because of their schedules, routines and organization. And with a lot of "normal" men, many of us have an interest in vehicles in general (locomotives, cars, trucks, rockets, boats, planes).
/r/PurplePillDebate28/05/24 01:27 PM
4

If someone is being asked for advice, they're being put in a position where they have to try and find something wrong with you, and with internet strangers all they can go off is what you tell them. But no two people are interchangeable, so everyone will come from a different place on what you need to fix. In reality all I can really say consistently is to keep trying. Keep trying to meet new people, keep trying to change what you don't like, but also keep trying to accept yourself for who you a…
/r/PurplePillDebate27/05/24 09:51 PM
9

I don't think all men pursue the top subset of women, but I think there is a strong overlap between men who do compete for the "best" women and the ones who complain about "hypergamy".
/r/PurplePillDebate27/05/24 08:47 PM
2

I think dating is harder than it used to be for younger people, but I don't believe it's because women are exclusively chasing top shelf guys. I believe men are struggling to socialize and meet women because of various factors that have nothing to do with "female hypergamy". If you're not in an environment in which you're around a lot of people consistently (like university), you're not exposing yourself to fresh faces often enough to improve your chances of meeting someone or even multiple some…
/r/PurplePillDebate27/05/24 08:09 PM
6

Okay, I should go relay this to the women I've befriended and dated over the years, including when I was making minimum wage working in retail.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/05/24 07:41 PM
2

I'm not talking about approaching. I'm talking about being in places where you can meet and talk to other people, which may or may not include a woman you have a connection with. There is an element of luck involved in starting a relationship, but the more opportunities you have to meet someone over a shared interest or circumstance, the more likely it is to happen for you.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/05/24 07:40 PM
3

It means that other things come into play. Similar values and goals, similar lifestyle choices, and a general sense of connection and chemistry. Someone can be similar to you but not be a good romantic fit for you. That doesn't mean either person only exclusively cares about surface level qualities or wants someone better than themselves.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/05/24 07:34 PM
3

Women don't only seek Chad, and I'm not sure why you think that's the case.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/05/24 07:29 PM
3

Anywhere that it's possible to meet women. And I mean literally anywhere. Just don't act desperate or creepy and learn to accept rejection when it happens and you'll be fine.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/05/24 07:26 PM
-1

Average women reject men, yeah. Just because guys self-report as average doesn't mean they are entitled to sex or a relationship with any other woman he deems in his league. Being on the same level helps, but it's not sufficient.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/05/24 07:25 PM
18

Female standards for status, looks and money are increasing every year, which makes the vast majority of men not capable of making the cut and finding companionship/intimacy. Is this really true? From what I've seen many women just want a socioeconomic equal. A hot 22 year old who's in university studying law or medical science wants someone on her level of ambition, fitness and status. That's not an unreasonable ask considering what she brings to the table. I really think more guys than they ca…
/r/PurplePillDebate27/05/24 06:54 PM
1

I feel that many of the so-called mind games and shit tests aren't actually what TRP says they are. I'm not convinced that women - or really, anyone - are consciously playing a game or trying to test you. They might be unsure about themselves, unsure about you, or unsure about the situation, and this can manifest in flaky behavior like taking a while to respond, getting cold feet or being wishy washy about making plans. Whether or not someone should endure that is up to the individual, and I app…
/r/PurplePillDebate27/05/24 05:39 PM
6

Have you ever heard the expression that goes something like, don't assume malicious intent in what could be explained with incompetence? I think dating and relationships are like that. I'm not really sure most people are as self aware and good at communicating their own intentions, let alone being so socially adroit that they are really capable of consciously manipulating a situation. Most people I talk to are honestly varying levels of shy and awkward; that's just part of being human. I almost …
/r/PurplePillDebate27/05/24 09:56 AM
5

It's pretty relevant when the Manosphere is always crying about how women are evil and aren't held accountable for their shitty actions, because they either don't understand the situation and project their insecurities onto it, or they willingly get involved with the exact kind of women that do this in a self fulfilling prophecy type of way. There is no convincing men that no woman will ever hurt them, but there is no logic in the idea that not only are all women shitty, they are a unique brand …
/r/PurplePillDebate26/05/24 10:39 PM
2

It is manipulation when you're playing mind games and doing things like pretending to be scarce or fucking with people's anxious attachment styles in order to get them to sleep with you. Doing things for your partner out of love and respect is not manipulation.
/r/PurplePillDebate26/05/24 09:29 PM
5

I think those ideas are fine, until someone is expressly manipulating the situation and the other person involved. It could be said of a lot of game in general, but there is a difference between, say, not always being available because you are somewhat emotionally guarded and lead a busy life, and trying to purposefully exploit someone's emotions to get a favorable outcome.
/r/PurplePillDebate26/05/24 05:15 PM
18

It's "dread game" + "plate theory", and is seen as some antithesis to "female nature". In reality it's more like, two wrongs don't make a right. But just like FDS, TRP wants to gain some advantage and leverage over their partners, it's some weird power game.
/r/PurplePillDebate26/05/24 04:52 PM
4

You may be thinking of that Entrepreneurs In Cars guy. Rollo has been married to the same woman for a long time now.
/r/PurplePillDebate26/05/24 04:43 PM
9

Exactly. It's one of Tomassi's "Iron Rules" if I recall correctly.
/r/PurplePillDebate26/05/24 04:22 PM
–

Like the other person said, I don't think many people really know how to comfort anyone, man or woman. There may or may not be some relationships between gendered expectations and patriarchy, and men feeling like they cannot open up, but I feel as if it's too much to jump straight into the conclusion that all women inherently feel disgusted when their partner becomes vulnerable. I've had guy friends basically ghost me because I was opening up about problems in my life, and while I can't just bla…
/r/PurplePillDebate26/05/24 04:20 PM
17

The point that you're trying to keep dodging, is that women and men can both do shitty things like try to humiliate their partners in front of other people, or actively search for new ones while seeing someone. This behavior is not unique to women at all, but it's somehow being framed as such.
/r/PurplePillDebate26/05/24 02:11 PM
13

Because it doesn't hold men accountable for their shitty behavior, yet constantly screeches about women not being held accountable for their own participation in the perpetuation of toxic relationship dynamics.
/r/PurplePillDebate26/05/24 01:52 PM
24

Because TRP notoriously excuses the same behavior when men do it; it's only condemned or seen critically when women do it. i.e. cheating is acceptable for a high value guy because something something, lock and key analogy. That sort of thing.
/r/PurplePillDebate26/05/24 01:44 PM
3

You make a great point about male validation seeking. Basically the "Fight Club Effect" of joining a cult of dudes where you have to stay in by being cool, edgy, indifferent, badass, whatever. It's actually sort of ironic that the co-founder of RSD, Owen Cook, chose the alias "Tyler" in reference to Tyler Durden from Fight Club. I agree it was a lot more positive. Owen Cook and Julien Blanc still make content and do public speaking sessions, although their brands pivoted from pickup to "lifestyl…
/r/PurplePillDebate26/05/24 01:15 PM
16

I know when a woman is chancing her arm and trying to gain the attention of another man. This girl I was dating wasn't a bad person, she was one of the most mature and reasonable women I had ever dated. And I, was much better looking than the person she was flirting with. Well, if it's true that she was heavily flirting with someone else while with you, maybe she isn't as mature and reasonable as you think. Even if she isn't a bad person, she can certainly do things in a relationship that are a …
/r/PurplePillDebate26/05/24 12:58 PM
67

However, they will have sent out conscious and subconscious cues to the man of their desire. It's a woman's nature to guarantee her best partner. If a woman has an opportunity to sell herself as a potential partner to a HMV, in the rare instances she can be in a situation like this, why would she not risk everything to do it? This isn't how human nature operates. Nature doesn't care about morals and relationship etiquette. I wanted to highlight this paragraph, because this is among the most pecu…
/r/PurplePillDebate26/05/24 12:45 PM
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/r/PurplePillDebate26/05/24 12:29 PM
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/r/PurplePillDebate26/05/24 12:01 PM
1

That's probably because over the last ten years the dating scene has just gotten worse and worse. How can you stop a man from becoming more blackpilled when all he knows is frustration and rejection regardless of how much self improvement and game he's used? You tell them that what they're doing isn't effective and they need to try something else. The same way you tell someone that's losing in a game to "get good" or say "skill issue" as a roast or joke.
/r/PurplePillDebate26/05/24 11:46 AM
7

TRP seemed useful when it was telling guys to become the best version of themselves they could possibly be, not just to attract women but to make themselves happy, especially by not putting women and sexual validation on a pedestal. I've had criticisms of it before, but it felt like there was a redeemable quality surrounding personal development and tough love. But it seems like all the blackpill fatalism has started creeping in, and now it's way too negative and cynical about women. It went fro…
/r/PurplePillDebate26/05/24 09:57 AM
2

I remember seeing a post about Reddit user data that suggested the number one sub that overlaps with FDS users is this one. I wonder why that is.
/r/PurplePillDebate26/05/24 09:29 AM
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/r/PurplePillDebate26/05/24 09:17 AM
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/r/PurplePillDebate26/05/24 09:01 AM
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Many men would know deep down that the sex bot doesn't really love them. What I've read here and elsewhere is that men want to feel "genuinely desired", which doesn't happen with sex bots or prostitutes. A better solution is helping men do better with their general lives and learning to be less desperate for sexual validation from women, by accepting that they are enough on their own.
/r/PurplePillDebate26/05/24 12:59 AM
1

I can see that, but when I see consequences I don't necessarily think "accountability". Especially when the circumstances of those consequences can be manipulated in the person's favor or have no lasting impact. I.e., a company that spills oil into the ocean is simply fined instead of having serious restrictions placed on their growth or operability. Or a person in a relationship might cheat multiple times, but either the person they cheated on stays with them or they just go on to be in a relat…
/r/PurplePillDebate25/05/24 07:27 PM
1

I can't imagine it any other way. A fine, jail time, losing a job, going on probation, or even losing a friend or loved one over a mistake. Otherwise, I don't see how somebody could be held accountable or take accountability for something.
/r/PurplePillDebate25/05/24 07:08 PM
1

I think the real factor that determines how much someone is "held accountable", aka punished for anything, is how much money, power, and influence they have over a situation, court or institution. It's why corporations and celebrities get away with the most vile shit, and most of the rest of us have to play by the rules or else. It also comes down to interpersonal relationships and biases. Your boss doesn't get fired for his bad decision making that tanks the business before you do, when he can …
/r/PurplePillDebate25/05/24 06:53 PM
0

Sure. But by this same logic so can men. They may not be the relationships they want, but most people can "just exist" and get involved with the very next person that shows interest in them. If I am not approaching and talking to women, I don't get a girlfriend. In other words, you need to take initiative and be proactive as a man. If you're a man who is single and doesn't want to be, 99% of the time it's because you aren't asking out enough women. I've seen comments on this sub that basically s…
/r/PurplePillDebate25/05/24 06:24 PM
0

You seriously can't tell me that a fair amount of men can find a relationship easily. I can seriously tell you that. I can tell you that most guys have options if their standards for a sexual or romantic partner are literally "she has a pulse and a vagina" and nothing else comes in to play. Far more men than they care to admit have some semblance of standards and some deal breakers, which is fine, but then the issue isn't "he has no options", the real situation is "the options he has so far aren…
/r/PurplePillDebate24/05/24 08:01 PM
-3

And I'm not talking about dudes specifically in this sub. I said it here a day or two ago how I work with 6 guys in gen z. Of those dudes only 1 are in a relationship. You seriously can't sit here and say most dudes who go out and have a social life will date. That's not realistic. Especially the younger generation It seems realistic to me. There might be growing pains but if you figure out what you can improve on - which is different for everyone - it's absolutely achievable. If all you ever in…
/r/PurplePillDebate24/05/24 07:35 PM
3

you know no average guys so by your account most men just make shit up on the internet Because my own personal experience and observations have conflicted with the terminally online blackpill fatalist world view that every guy who is not an 8/10 or better is doomed? Right, sure. I'm not talking about "most men" here. It might seem like every guy ever is struggling to find a relationship or get laid, if all you do is spend time in online spaces where lonely single guys congregate to talk about it…
/r/PurplePillDebate24/05/24 07:11 PM
1

Probably like 80-90% at least. I know men of all kinds from Gen Z to X, as an early 30s millennial myself. With a few exceptions, I can't think of any guy who's actually normal, average looking, and has a decent social life who cannot find a single woman (or really, multiple ones) interested in them. Most guys I know are in relationships, married and/or have at least one child. This includes short men, fat men, and balding men. This idea that men "struggle" to find women is pushed on the interne…
/r/PurplePillDebate24/05/24 06:44 PM
3

I knew exactly what you meant. I'm not disagreeing with you nor am I calling you insecure. Just adding my own thoughts to your comment I responded to.
/r/PurplePillDebate23/05/24 09:56 PM
4

For some reason, a lot of people feel like it's wrong that they should be expected to provide something in a relationship, and would rather someone just worship their very existence. When they say the other gender is entitled or have insane standards, it's often times an admittance that they don't believe they can be good enough for someone else, so they'd rather the other person not have standards or expectations at all. Whenever I see men ranting about "hypergamy", I bet the impression that so…
/r/PurplePillDebate23/05/24 09:14 PM
0

And before you go on about how working out is somehow him doing the effort to get the ladies, do you really believe a person, not so smart, who only plays soccer and goes to the gym, has a lot of interesting stuff to say? Your guess might be right, he doesn't. I think that if a guy has an aggregate of qualities that make him attractive to women already, then he probably shouldn't give a shit what anyone else thinks, especially not guys who claim he is boring or unintelligent. Maybe those women a…
/r/PurplePillDebate23/05/24 04:35 PM
-3

I find most blue pillers are just in denial of reality. They rely on plausible deniability to pretend women are somehow not shallow. The only "reality" I see is that plenty of men have the ability to make themselves desirable to women, but they don't want to have to try. They want women to throw themselves at them sexually without having to put effort into it, because they're upset that they perceive other men exist who "don't have to try", which oftentimes is not even true.
/r/PurplePillDebate23/05/24 04:22 PM
81

Plenty of dudes online insist women are only good for one thing, and their time will come when they "hit the wall" or AI sexbots take over. If you're not one of them, good for you, but maybe then don't also align yourself with content spaces that push that narrative constantly.
/r/PurplePillDebate23/05/24 03:37 PM
1

What do you get out of being salty about the fact that women like attractive men? Are men supposed to just be universally desired sexually and romantically by women while they contribute nothing to themselves or the relationship? My argument is that guys who either want to get laid a lot or simply find a good wife put in the effort to do so. If that includes making themselves more desirable to the opposite sex then they embrace it. But you're basically arguing that said effort doesn't matter and…
/r/PurplePillDebate23/05/24 03:24 PM
1

Show me an example of a man that you think looks like a Chad while also putting absolutely zero effort into his appearance or lifestyle. This won't change how ridiculous it is to be salty over an incredibly small number of men being genetically "perfect", since it's usually just an excuse not to try, but I'm curious anyways.
/r/PurplePillDebate23/05/24 03:18 PM
1

So what exactly is a "Chad" if not somebody that has qualities that are desirable to women? Is there some incredibly small number of men who are so overwhelmingly attractive that they quite literally have to do nothing in order to be attractive? Maybe. But I definitely believe you're coping extremely hard in order to maintain your world view. You have to make an argument that men who are attractive to women don't have any redeeming qualities that they cultivated or put effort into, but rather th…
/r/PurplePillDebate23/05/24 03:09 PM
1

being athletic doesn't require dedication and effort Yeah? We're really doing this now? That French guy didn't socialize He made himself available to women, that's part of what socializing and "putting yourself out there" means. I've seen enough women that don't party or "aren't like that" bend their rules for a good looking guy to know all women are open to a night of passion with chad under the right circumstances. I'm starting to feel like you're misrepresenting details to make a weak argumen…
/r/PurplePillDebate23/05/24 02:35 PM
-1

Man what are you on about, none of the guys I'm talking about put in any work to be chad, You said that your friend was "ripped". That requires hard work and dedication to do. just went out partying 3+ times a week So you actually went out and socialized, which means you did something. I don't know why some of you guys get so upset at the idea that attracting women or having access to sex should require any sort of effort or intentionality, to the point that you play down any of the things you m…
/r/PurplePillDebate23/05/24 02:07 PM
-1

these guys really are out there getting pornstar experiences and people act like eventually convincing someone to have vanilla sex with you every now and then in exchange for commitment is something to strive for. Plenty of people actually desire to have committed relationships, marriages and families, and find strings of casual sex and one night stands to be repulsive. I can't help but feel like there is a subset of men who desire a certain type of sexual life, which involves lots of access to …
/r/PurplePillDebate23/05/24 01:51 PM
0

No, because that's not all that women care about. Unless you consider their concern for some semblance of stability and comfort or wanting to be attracted at all with "looks money and status is all that matters".
/r/PurplePillDebate22/05/24 06:14 PM
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Objectively perfect men and women don't exist.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/05/24 04:53 PM
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What does this have to do with it making either gender uncomfortable when the "wrong" person uses a toilet? It's not like the women were squat peeing on the urinals or something.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/05/24 02:13 PM
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Sometimes the lines for women's restrooms are so long (for obvious reasons) that I don't blame women for wanting to skip that noise and use the male ones instead. I think some of you just "see what you want to see" re: women being able to get away with more, or not being held accountable, or whatever narrative the Manosphere spins about women living life on "easy mode". This really isn't that big of a deal. I was just inside a business where the male restroom was occupied, and the people there t…
/r/PurplePillDebate22/05/24 02:08 PM
1

The hesitancy to put a label on it makes me think a lot of people want an easy out. The desire for a "lack of pressure" seems too non-committal for me, since I want a relationship where there are roles and expectations that develop for the two people involved. The trade con thing seems like a sort of over correction for the above. It makes sense to some people, but also feels too stifling. What I want is pretty simple. Maybe not easy, but simple. A dedicated and stable marriage, and kids too. It…
/r/PurplePillDebate21/05/24 07:32 PM
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I think some of you guys really over-state what it takes to find "a" woman. If most of you wanted to, you could date somebody right now. But you probably have your reasons for not dating just anyone, which is understandable. This idea that men don't get to choose at all is a meme; it's more like men are mostly after the same kinds of women, just like they accuse all the women of doing. Just understand, when you look at a woman and think "there's no way, I would never", women can do the same for …
/r/PurplePillDebate21/05/24 10:28 AM
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To be honest that doesn't sound like "accountability", but more like "self awareness". And if a woman says or does something that turns a guy off enough to pull back, in her mind she's just filtered out a guy who's not a good fit. I think we stand to learn a lot from this sort of mentality of "take me as I am, I'm already good enough", because as I recall this is what the dating gurus, PUAs and red pill men would advocate as an "abundance mindset".
/r/PurplePillDebate20/05/24 08:18 PM
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Knowing that certain men can be like this, it's no wonder they have a tendency to assume romantic or sexual intent when a woman asks how his day is. It's because he's projecting the fact that he only acts nice or curious with women he wants to sleep with.
/r/PurplePillDebate20/05/24 05:45 PM
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I've noticed for a while now how it is with a lot of men. Being stone faced and indifferent to everyone around them until a good looking woman is in front of them. Then they really just want to ask about her day etc. Even married men do this.
/r/PurplePillDebate20/05/24 05:35 PM
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I'm curious what those IOIs were. I've had friends try to tell me a girl was hitting on me because she smiled and acted nice. And while there are different ways to "smile and act nice", I really think a lot of dudes read interest into ordinary behavior from women. In fact, it's sort of implied to be the case.
/r/PurplePillDebate20/05/24 06:32 AM
5

Idk man. I think some people just don't know what they want. They get told what they should want or look for by others, or sometimes they say they want certain things to appear well adjusted in front of others. When you're young especially, you don't necessarily have the experience or wisdom to understand what you really want or need, or what expectations are realistic vs unrealistic.
/r/PurplePillDebate19/05/24 11:28 PM
4

I think that someone being really into you is desirable, but not sufficient. You have to be attracted to somebody and desire them in order for their interest in you to be reciprocated. If you're not really into the person who is after you, then their interest in you alone won't make you want them all of the sudden. We don't choose who we are attracted to.
/r/PurplePillDebate19/05/24 10:53 PM
3

Meh, I've seen especially women with lower self esteem become uncomfortable when they were treated really nice by someone, because they feel like they don't deserve it. I don't disagree with this at all. That's what I meant when I said some women get "socialized" to put the needs of others above their own. The idea that someone is being nice and pursuing and valuing them becomes such a foreign concept that it's basically alien. I'd say this goes even beyond dating and into every day life; lots o…
/r/PurplePillDebate19/05/24 10:07 PM
-4

I don't think all women inherently desire inattentive men. It's more likely that some are socialized to put the needs of their man before their own (I would call this "nice girl syndrome"), because she doesn't necessarily know any better and was raised to not put herself before others ever. That, and you don't always choose who you're attracted to. People who "simp" do it because they really like somebody and want that person to like them in return, which can often manifest as placating behavior…
/r/PurplePillDebate19/05/24 09:50 PM
-1

What exactly are you talking about? What conversations are they having that used to be so controversial but aren't anymore?
/r/PurplePillDebate19/05/24 08:24 PM
3

Maybe save isn't the word. It would require a dramatic change in behavior and that's usually not going to happen. This is true of all types of relationships and not just romantic ones. Once you're at the point that you wish your partner was fundamentally somebody else, it's pretty much a goner.
/r/PurplePillDebate19/05/24 03:44 PM
14

The overwhelming body of your post is a personal story, so it kinda seems like you're here to get "answers" to solve your own personal problem.
/r/PurplePillDebate19/05/24 01:30 PM
25

This post will probably get taken down because this sub isn't for asking for relationship advice. Yeah, men can save the relationship if they are attentive to their partner's needs. No, it's not always the man's fault. Sometimes, a relationship just needs to end, especially if one or both of you is especially miserable.
/r/PurplePillDebate19/05/24 01:20 PM
1

You have to ignore this, which is funny, since I’m assuming you don’t like women’s answers to calling you a worse predator than a bear, but it’s reality to how they see you What I'm seeing is that they have experienced enough unwanted attention and harassment from men that they'd rather be alone in nature. In their mind, the bear is not going to bother them if they don't approach it or provoke it, which is not always true of men. The fact that some men have to cling to being less physically powe…
/r/PurplePillDebate19/05/24 12:03 PM
2

This is a debate sub. We aren't here to just mindlessly agree with each other. TRP is flawed in its understanding of how the world works, and this is why even as a "tool" it's ineffective.
/r/PurplePillDebate19/05/24 11:46 AM
1

I don't care what you think about TRP because my interpretation is flawless and it's perfect and you're not allowed to criticize it at all Oh, okay.
/r/PurplePillDebate19/05/24 11:41 AM
1

”. Even now with dating woes we see plenty of people saying “men need to do better”, rather than giving any responsibility to women on mate choice. No accountability, like a child Men are on different platforms creating echo chambers where they talk down to women and tell them to pick better guys. When you see "people" telling men to do better, it's usually other women forming their own groups or echo chambers. They'd rather be around a bear than see you I really don't want to go into the weeds …
/r/PurplePillDebate19/05/24 11:39 AM
2

how does that equate to him telling women are the enemy That's easy. Whenever you read the comments here from men proclaiming that women are incapable of real love, that they all have the desire for the shame top shelf guys and they'll leave you if you aren't him, unless she's doing beta bux in which case she will stay with you to be provided for, but she still doesn't love you anyways. You really think all the dudes repeating this same thing over and over to each other are not hurt or resentful…
/r/PurplePillDebate19/05/24 11:15 AM
3

Taking off the blinders and seeing how life actually is does not mean you hate women. It’s just acknowledging the facts about relationships and women Hate is a strong word. But saying all women are incapable of feeling love, that they are solipsistic in nature, and on top of this are fundamentally illogical and inferior to men in the matters of critical thought, is hardly saying flattering things about them. Them calling women crazy does not mean they hate women, it’s just acknowledging how wome…
/r/PurplePillDebate19/05/24 03:45 AM
1

you would know that if you read any of his books I have read all of his older blog posts, and I've seen his podcasts. He is certainly not telling men that marriage is a good idea because the world is full of quality women that will love them. He has said multiple times that marriage is a "raw deal", and gone so far as to argue that women do not love men, they love what men can provide for them, and seek to extract resources, status and "tingles". He talks about things like the "rationalization h…
/r/PurplePillDebate19/05/24 03:16 AM
6

TRP of 10+ years ago was all about personal responsibility, or at least it seemed that way. "If your life sucks and women don't like you, it's up to you to fix it" was the general message. Nowadays though? There are so many podcast bros blaming women and feminism and the left for their problems. And dudes make it sound like they have no choice but to sleep around and use women as personal flesh lights. Though in hindsight, maybe it's always been that way. Even in the very early days of the Ratio…
/r/PurplePillDebate19/05/24 02:51 AM
4

Good points. I don't think it's inherently gendered, there may be some foundation in gender but overall it's a lot of historical carryover from the days women simply were not allowed to work. I think it doesn't matter as long as both people contribute something. I feel the same way about working; I don't get a chip on my shoulder if I'm working "harder" than other people, as long as I'm enjoying what I'm doing enough and don't feel pressured like I have to literally do it all, or the world will …
/r/PurplePillDebate18/05/24 04:06 PM
4

A lot of the married men I know have a "provider" mindset. They just stick to maximizing and maintaining strong and steady income potential and seem to "forget" or simply ignore doing chores. In the minds of many women, they also work full time and have to pick up everything around the house. But in the minds of many men, they work hard all day on top of their weekend yard work, so the idea that the trash must be taken out right this exact moment. Truthfully, I can see both sides here. I can see…
/r/PurplePillDebate18/05/24 03:13 PM
5

Most women don't have the option not to work, and historically never did. Even in the "good old days", single income households were locked behind pretty strict racial and class lines, and that's before you even get into the semantics of being a stay at home wife or mother actually being a full time job without pay.
/r/PurplePillDebate18/05/24 03:06 PM
4

I've lived alone for over a decade now. There are times I think "if I had a girlfriend or wife, this might be more easy to handle". Sometimes I even think back on women I dated or had opportunities with, but I simply didn't take that next step because something made me take pause. I wonder if I'd just given certain women or relationships a chance, how much different life would be for me now. But I don't really want to be with someone just so they can make my life easy, I want to be with someone …
/r/PurplePillDebate18/05/24 11:43 AM
9

People don't really take women who have "unrealistic demands" seriously, outside of the types of online spaces that platform them just to generate engagement so they can make money. And stuff like that (Fresh & Fit and the Whatever Podcast come to mind) is basically a modern version of reality TV. It's most likely embellished specifically because the "conversation" is what hooks people so they keep going back and keeping the views and ad revenue up. I wouldn't even be surprised if these people h…
/r/PurplePillDebate18/05/24 04:23 AM
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billions of views and millions of likes More than likely a good chunk of those are just bots.
/r/PurplePillDebate17/05/24 09:48 PM
4

I've always thought it described as an awkward uncanny valley of a relationship. It acts like a relationship, but clearly isn't one and it's just enough uncertainty, but not entirely huh certainty to be unsettling/miserable. One of those FWB situations where one or both people have strong feelings one way or the other and it's at odds with their own behavior and what's happening. Usually it happens because both people aren't being as honest about their intentions as they claim they are, or simpl…
/r/PurplePillDebate16/05/24 11:50 PM
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Probably the same reason people like other similar qualities: they demonstrate some sort of value. Having "status" can signal any number of positive things, from "this person is good at establishing and maintaining relationships" to "this person has a reliable network that can assist them in harsher times". For the most part, having a good social and peer network means other people find you pleasant to be around, and you're less likely to be a complete creep or weirdo. Likewise, being good at so…
/r/PurplePillDebate16/05/24 09:11 PM
3

I sincerely doubt you are irredeemably ugly. I challenge you to go out into the world and try to be a little more positive and interested in other people. Just go outside and enjoy nature, make brief conversations with coworkers or strangers, so whatever you can. Challenge this belief you have that you have no hope of escaping your personal hell. Be kind and open with others, take care of your mental health to the best of your ability and see where it gets you. You would be surprised how many ot…
/r/PurplePillDebate16/05/24 01:38 PM
5

Worst I've had happen is someone walking away from the interaction or ghosting after the fact. It only ever felt intense, miserable and super embarrassing at times because I was so emotionally invested in her response. It's true what the old PUAs used to say about having abundance and staying indifferent to her reaction until you've started a relationship. Most of the time it won't go that badly even if you get turned down, as long as you are respectful in your approach and accepting of her answ…
/r/PurplePillDebate16/05/24 12:17 PM
16

That sounds like cringe. Not in a haha "haha that's so cringe" way, but a genuine social cringe, as in "how the actual fuck could anyone believe holding on to a person and screaming at them is public is acceptable behavior?"
/r/PurplePillDebate16/05/24 12:07 PM
7

I've been rejected before, I've been humiliated, I've been in situations where it all felt hopeless. So, I get what it's like to come from a place of pain on this topic. But that said, I really feel like telling yourself and everyone else that being undesirable is a fixed state which you can never change, is not only dishonest, but also harmful. The obvious questions would be asking, what happened when you tried to socialize and it didn't go your way? What could you have done better? Do you have…
/r/PurplePillDebate16/05/24 12:00 PM
8

You said it yourself, you need chemistry Yeah. Learn how to communicate yourself, your desires and your intentions authentically, and be willing to be vulnerable enough to risk uncomfortable situations like rejection in order to establish those connections. Have a genuine interest in speaking to the women you want to date. That's a good starting place to find "chemistry". And to offer something This can be so many different things. Charisma, charm, wit, a sense of humor, confidence, a dominant a…
/r/PurplePillDebate16/05/24 11:19 AM
3

I don't think men who complain about women being too choosy are selecting for a specific group of attractive women in the first place. More often than they care to admit, that's exactly what they do. I know and have known many men. I see the same patterns play out every single time. The more attractive women get hit on, approached or simply talked to by all the guys, and the rest are ignored. She can be "conventionally attractive", or she can be "big titty goth girl" attractive, or she can be "a…
/r/PurplePillDebate16/05/24 11:05 AM
16

Attractive women are pickier on dating apps. So this idea that men are selecting for a specific group of attractive women makes no sense to me. Men desire and pursue the women they find attractive. Whether or not they succeed isn't really relevant. That's why some women have guys blowing up their DMs and others might as well be invisible. if you are in the bottom 50%, you have limited options as a guy. when they are complaining about women being choosy they are complaining about lacking choice a…
/r/PurplePillDebate16/05/24 07:20 AM
21

Maybe I'm off on this, but I can't help but feel like there is a notable overlap between men who complain that women are too choosy, and men who select for a specific group of attractive women. They can tell themselves that all these women are "mid" or "average" until they're blue in the face, but it just comes across like cope. If she presents in a way that other men desire her, then she is attractive even if somebody somewhere thinks her boobs are too small or her waist is too big. The reason …
/r/PurplePillDebate16/05/24 06:53 AM
16

in reality most people expect to be able to get someone similar to them in all areas I'll grant you that having someone who feels like an equal is not an unreasonable ask. But you also have to understand that "someone similar to them in all areas" is pretty picky and exacting. There is a difference between wanting someone who you have the right things in common with you, similar values, and compliments or even challenges you elsewhere, and someone who is basically an exact version of yourself bu…
/r/PurplePillDebate14/05/24 09:05 PM
14

I'm not even remotely surprised by this somehow. When you see the data that most men want a slim young woman in her early 20s regardless of his own age it makes so much sense.
/r/PurplePillDebate14/05/24 08:51 PM
1

I mean, dressing better is actionable advice. It alone isn't sufficient enough that you can go out dressed in a suit and women will just fall on your dick. But if you dress in clothes that look good and fit well, and you get in shape and style your hair/groom properly and look people in the eyes when talking to them with a smile and you're confident enough to be sociable and approach women you're attracted to? Well now you're seriously cooking with fire. Nobody has the exact formula necessary fo…
/r/PurplePillDebate14/05/24 08:31 PM
1

Well, women get pressured to date men they aren't attracted to as well. I can't deny it happens, but the only lesson I can see is to not succumb to that pressure.
/r/PurplePillDebate14/05/24 05:05 PM
1

Honestly, not many people are actually telling men they need to be exceptionally above average just to have "any" woman. It's often men telling other men this is the case, it isn't. Putting in effort and trying is something you do to satisfy yourself. If being in a relationship with someone you desire is something you really want, it's up to you to "put in the work"so you can become the person you want to be in your relationship, and attract someone you want. This doesn't mean settle for anyone …
/r/PurplePillDebate14/05/24 03:23 PM
1

I find the fact that life "isn't fair" to be a bit harsh, but also a call to action. The fact that I'm not guaranteed anything, especially if I don't put in the work, is motivating. It means I have it in my control to change, do better, and try. This is true of most people, who aren't born exceptionally attractive and blessed. I may not ever find true love, but the worst case scenario is that I tried and my life was better for it.
/r/PurplePillDebate14/05/24 11:21 AM
4

In my experience, when the filter is off or they're comfortable being honest with you, women are pretty damn brutally honest about what they want. "I want him to take the lead and initiate within a masculine role, I like guys with muscles, I prefer guys taller than myself, I like guys who know how to dress", shit like that. If you hear women say they want someone who is nice or funny, that's not necessarily wrong. She's not going to tell you each and every last thing you could possibly do to be …
/r/PurplePillDebate14/05/24 01:19 AM
4

The Manosphere seems to be only partially composed of guys who are successful with women, with quite a significant amount being bitter and unsuccessful. This isn't exactly anything new, as the old PUAs would call out "mental masturbation" aka just talking about "the nature of women and dating" without ever actually engaging with it. I genuinely think of a lot of these men just went out there they would see that while it can be painful, if they learn to accept the rejection and pain they can push…
/r/PurplePillDebate14/05/24 01:08 AM
1

You're going to one extreme using serial killers as an example of what women like and how it's unfair. I'm saying that not every incel is a morally upstanding good guy who deserves to get laid, while all the evil bad men are the ones getting all the real action. In reality, plenty of truly good and well adjusted people find partners, even if they aren't necessarily people you like on a personal level.
/r/PurplePillDebate13/05/24 02:32 AM
2

Elliot Rodger was an Incel, yet also far from innocent.
/r/PurplePillDebate13/05/24 02:20 AM
5

I think both are potentially true. Location matters insofar as being placed where you can flourish with the right career, environment and community. But on the other hand I believe that wherever you go, there you are. I've known people who are stuck in the same place because they believe that's all they deserve and can't do better, in terms of a city, job or relationship. But there are also those people who run away from their problems by always walking away from jobs or keep moving, and never r…
/r/PurplePillDebate13/05/24 12:48 AM
16

I was just talking to a coworker about this. This guy she is "seeing", lives in another state, doesn't really reach out or make her feel loved, wanted, appreciated, valuable etc. He does nothing for her birthday and they have no plans to move closer together. She told me she doesn't love him like she used to, and that she gave up being as caring because she felt she was being too masculine by initiating everything. I wish any of this made sense, but all I can think is "attraction is not a choice…
/r/PurplePillDebate13/05/24 12:38 AM
7

I'm not sure it's an "excuse". Women don't have to find an excuse not to date someone they're not attracted to. It may not make sense, but a polite rejection is a rejection. I wouldn't read too much into it other than "anything that's not yes is no".
/r/PurplePillDebate12/05/24 07:39 PM
8

I'm not saying there isn't a reason. It's just that it's not just about looks. It's usually something more like "they remind me of my parents/primary caretakers and it activates my attachment style". Or it's "they make me feel safe" or "I see a future with them, they're my person". It's behaviors and attitudes and lifestyle choices that make the difference, not simply being hot.
/r/PurplePillDebate12/05/24 07:25 PM
13

Chemistry is more than just feeling physically attracted to someone. It's the difference between being in love and seeing a life together vs simply fantasizing about one night with them.
/r/PurplePillDebate12/05/24 04:57 PM
4

Who is looking down on masculinity and how are they looking down on it?
/r/PurplePillDebate11/05/24 05:49 PM
-4

Plenty of men are always saying how women are like children who cannot accept personal responsibility or be held accountable, or that they're evil hypergamous demons out to suck your life dry of any sense of happiness. They express that women are "only good for one thing". Do other men call out this behavior enough? Do they call out the rampant misogyny, the sexism, the sexual assault and intimate partner violence born out of those attitudes? The few men that do, often get called white knights a…
/r/PurplePillDebate11/05/24 05:45 PM
2

It's sort of true. A nuclear reactor is objectively more dangerous than a stranger because its capacity to kill me is far greater. But I'm far less likely to come into contact with an exposed reactor than I am a stranger that could harm me, and more people are killed by the needless acts of violence of other men than they are by those nuclear cores. I'm sure the hypothetical could be tweaked a bit to make more "sense", but I also feel like certain men would still react the same way, which is to …
/r/PurplePillDebate11/05/24 04:38 PM
3

True. I'd even add that there seems to be this badge of honor people feel they need to wear by being "balanced and reasonable" instead of on any one extreme. As if holding an "extreme" take is always a bad thing. I can see where "nuance" is valuable, but that term has been bastardized to mean "always sit on the fence, never take a stance on anything so that you can agree with everyone" and I sorta dislike that.
/r/PurplePillDebate11/05/24 01:53 PM
2

Not only are men active participants on the "decline" of dating in the West that they rail against in the manosphere, they exclusively love to blame women and other exterior groups for it. Nobody is actually holding these guys at gunpoint and making them sleep around with women they aren't attracted to or interested in that much. They act like they're victims because they can't have sex with every single woman they really desire, and they're "forced" to date someone who is "below" them to get so…
/r/PurplePillDebate11/05/24 01:14 PM
29

Why does it seem like basically every man on here who identifies as "purple pill" speaks exclusively in red and black pill talking points? The idea that marriage is purely transactional, and relationships can only be seen through cost benefit analysis to avoid "simping" or "oneitis" has been a talking point for TRP for like the last 10-15 years or longer. Just an observation.
/r/PurplePillDebate10/05/24 09:19 PM
–

I wonder if the same men who are crying so much about misandry and being unfairly blamed for things they don't do, are just as upset when Manosphere content creators make posts and videos that amount to "women are all basically evil monsters driven by hypergamy, out to rob you of your happiness, also they're all basically children and don't like accountability lol" (The answer is no, they don't)
/r/PurplePillDebate10/05/24 08:11 PM
–

Any time a man makes such sweeping generalizations about women based on the bad ones he is labeled a sexist, but when it's reversed it's totally acceptable to society. Not really. Men have had their personal safe space called the "Manosphere" for the past 10-15 years or longer. Go look on YouTube comment sections where the topic is dating or "how women work", and it's a bunch of dudes crying in each other's arms about how the evil, hypergamous demon women are out to destroy their lives and happi…
/r/PurplePillDebate10/05/24 08:06 PM
2

Suits with broad shoulders don't exist. Platform shoes don't exist. Protein powder doesn't exist. Hair loss treatment, transplants, steroids don't exist. And men certainly never lie about or obfuscate their intentions in order to sleep with women.
/r/PurplePillDebate09/05/24 12:57 PM
-1

Manosphere Grifters and Dating Coaches certainly do.
/r/PurplePillDebate09/05/24 03:44 AM
–

But people can become highly skilled and respectable in most things with practice and effort. They may never "make it big", but they can become so good at it that they're at least able to sell a few pieces of art, or be the guy who brings the best food to the potluck, or a man who is great at charming enough women that it's not an issue for him.
/r/PurplePillDebate08/05/24 01:01 PM
–

Attractive women have this privilege. Average and below ones don't. Pretty privilege can actually be even more punishing for women, depending on the situation.
/r/PurplePillDebate08/05/24 12:46 PM
5

Yeah they can. It's usually mean telling other men that they have to fuck everyone that's willing, then simultaneously blame women for getting "ran through" when men are the ones that use women for sex because they can't be disciplined.
/r/PurplePillDebate07/05/24 02:16 PM
4

Emotional availability is more than just "falling in love". People can and do succumb to emotions or hormones, especially out of desperation, but this doesn't make them truly emotionally available. Emotional availability means being present with the person you're with, to show up in a way that allows a true connection to form. It means being willing to share how you feel, even if it means rocking the boat, because that level of authenticity is how you either strengthen the relationship or potent…
/r/PurplePillDebate07/05/24 08:04 AM
–

I'm a below average looking guy and I feel I get noticed by women every once in a great while. I do what I can to take care of what I can control and there are genuinely some women who find it attractive. Some people will find your looks to be appealing even if you're not a knockout.
/r/PurplePillDebate05/05/24 10:00 PM
-1

Hmmm, I don't really think so. Nice guy is liked by other people, and doesn't necessarily have issues getting a job. Nor does he always have issues finding relationships. Even Dr Robert Glover, the author of "No More Mr. Nice Guy", writes at length about the issues nice guys face in relationships, and how their girlfriends or wives get irritated when he is too much of a people pleaser. But just like anything else, there's nothing always inherently keeping him from finding intimate partnerships. …
/r/PurplePillDebate05/05/24 09:35 PM
0

You could argue there is, if we are talking about genuinely kind women who tolerate fuckboys and jerks who cheat on them constantly etc. Being a pushover is not a "winning" trait for either gender, and I'm not sure why guys on this sub think it is.
/r/PurplePillDebate05/05/24 09:02 PM
0

Well, in a sense for sure. Men who are passive won't get rewarded as much because women expect you to take the initiative. But there's still a difference between "being kind, but being assertive and willing to take initiative" and "being a complete jerk to everyone around you". I don't think men get punished for being nice, it's just that they aren't able to succeed in dating if they don't take action and assume the role of initiating.
/r/PurplePillDebate05/05/24 05:43 PM
2

This isn't what you wanna hear, but all you can do, is do better and/or do something different. It sucks, but none of us "deserve" a relationship. You can learn to like the people who are interested in you, or stay single until you find what you want, but a relationship is not something any of us - man or woman - are guaranteed in life.
/r/PurplePillDebate05/05/24 05:02 PM
0

Well, yes. I'm agreeing with you. I don't think women get rewarded for being nice. I think men are mostly competing for the same type of cute/pretty/hot women, and because of pretty privilege they assume these women are nice. In other words, just like men insist women only want a certain type of guy, a lot of men mostly go after the same types of women. Their "niceness" is not a factor at all if they don't pass the looks test.
/r/PurplePillDebate05/05/24 04:03 PM
26

Attractive people are rewarded for being attractive. Attractive people are assumed to be kind, smart and all sorts of other wonderful things because of pretty privilege. Go ahead and ask these men what they think of overweight women with kids, and how much they believe these women get a pass for being nice. Being nice is never enough. But people who are attractive get a pass and are seen as "nice", because people project their desires for attractive people to check off other boxes.
/r/PurplePillDebate05/05/24 03:45 PM
2

I believe you. I'm not saying no man has ever exercised because it adds positive things to his life. Just that some guys say they work out for themselves, but actually they do it for women.
/r/PurplePillDebate05/05/24 03:02 AM
12

We aren't talking about "adopting female behavior", whatever that means. We're talking about men who allegedly agree with women because they think it'll help them score.
/r/PurplePillDebate05/05/24 02:56 AM
1

I don't think you have to endure a bad marriage. You can learn to appreciate people who choose you and want to be with you, and you can also be alone and not be with someone you don't want.
/r/PurplePillDebate05/05/24 02:32 AM
5

But the women here would probably call that shit out.
/r/PurplePillDebate05/05/24 01:51 AM
15

Do you have any evidence that blue pilled dudes are sliding into the DMs of women here? Guys can also "lie" about just doing things like working out for themselves, when they actually do it to make women interested in them. I don't think being considerate of how women feel and trying to work on things that make you more attractive and interesting is wrong, unless you're expecting it from specific ones.
/r/PurplePillDebate05/05/24 01:10 AM
47

I feel like you could say this about anyone who exhibits a certain behavior only because they expect a certain outcome. That includes guys who work on other traits like fitness or finances and still struggle to date.
/r/PurplePillDebate05/05/24 01:02 AM
–

Well, are you "ran through" yourself? I'm not assuming one or the other, but realistically someone who is attractive and has options will have had past partners. I know that sexual selectivity is desirable to certain people, but that could mean "waiting for marriage" or it could mean "has enough experience, but is also discerning in who they get with". I don't really think there is a right answer, but it also helps to know what "ran through" means. It will be difficult to find someone with a bod…
/r/PurplePillDebate04/05/24 04:39 PM
–

It's not. What is, is believing you have done the "correct" things, and this makes you earn or "deserve" relationships and sex. If this isn't how you feel, then good. Unfortunately, this sentiment is peddled everywhere. It's not just the jaded manosphere guys (although it's certainly a lot of them) who think things like this. That X person could do so much better than whenever they are with, and even further, that they should be with you instead. It's a similar situation when somebody gets promo…
/r/PurplePillDebate04/05/24 04:21 PM
–

People aren't asking you to be with women you are not interested in. In fact, you're free to date or not date whenever you choose, just like women are.
/r/PurplePillDebate04/05/24 04:11 PM
–

nobody thinks they are owed anything for being nice There's just so, so much evidence to the contrary though.
/r/PurplePillDebate04/05/24 03:11 PM
–

For too many guys, their "frustration" with dating is that think women don't see their value, but they should. They don't see what a nice guy they are, how good of a provider they are, what an amazing boyfriend, husband or father they are. They believe women and the world owe them something, because they have unknowingly entered a contract where the man provides something, and is to get something in return. When it comes to dating, they think that they have done the right things, and therefore d…
/r/PurplePillDebate04/05/24 02:46 PM
–

Most people know online dating is not the best way. I think the people who complain about it incessantly online, are simply bitter/jealous that they can't be a "Chad" who has tons of sexual options available to them on an app. Most men will never be this, and have to try, but end up finding someone or multiple someones anyways. It's usually the ones popping pills that are so frustrated about it.
/r/PurplePillDebate04/05/24 11:16 AM
1

Nobody said women are perfect and do no wrong. You red pill people are such whiny, put upon victims about fucking everything. Hell, the old red pill was responsible enough to teach guys that if they can't get laid, if they're always in the friend zone and being rejected it's their job to fix it. But in the last few years, the podcast bro culture took over and told you all to blame women and feminism and society for everything, and you're all perfect sweet little angels that need to change nothin…
/r/PurplePillDebate04/05/24 10:52 AM
8

It's more like "you aren't owed this specific job at this specific company, where you don't even fit the requirements and your resume doesn't reflect the proper experience". Would you run a company that employs people because they're really nice, even though they not only suck at their job, but cause problems for the business? If you wouldn't, then maybe consider why women aren't eager to settle with a man they aren't interested in, who can't provide what she needs to feel emotionally and sexual…
/r/PurplePillDebate03/05/24 07:34 PM
-1

Oh man, you're actually so wrong about what you think I'm projecting it. I've just noticed guys exert far too much effort and attention on women, and it's little wonder why they feel so jaded when it's not immediately reciprocated. As if the woman even asked for the guy to act so sweet and pay so much attention to her, especially if she's given zero indication that she even desired him. Her desire for him won't somehow change magically because he did nice things. Attraction is not a choice, and …
/r/PurplePillDebate03/05/24 07:30 PM
2

I haven't really thought about it. I know a lot of men say what women should or should not do, but to me it's more or less the same as for men. You aren't owed anything, if you want to have something you have to work for it, but somewhat paradoxically you can't just expect that the work you have done means you are owed a positive outcome from others. You can only do your best and put yourself out there until you meet somebody or find what you're looking for.
/r/PurplePillDebate03/05/24 07:19 PM
4

If someone can't be bothered to treat you with basic decency and respect, you don't owe them your time or politeness in return. You're allowed to tell them to fuck off or simply walk away.
/r/PurplePillDebate03/05/24 07:15 PM
1

Nobody "lines up" to be with unattractive people, that's true. But you can make yourself someone that others want to associate with, with the caveat being that it'll take work and effort on your part. This goes for anyone who has "status" for their work, contributions and how they make others feel. If you are genuinely fun and interesting to be around, or you otherwise provide value for others, they'll want to associate with you. For some reason this gets a lot of guys tilted, and that's exactly…
/r/PurplePillDebate03/05/24 07:13 PM
4

Being "frustrated" isn't the problem. Being angry at other people for not giving you something they don't owe you is. Sometimes people get upset and have a little outburst Thing is, if you're a woman and you're used to men reacting with resentment, anger and entitlement, it's little wonder why you're going to be less charitable. It's honestly so much better for everyone if guys learn to manage their anger, and don't act like women owe them something, than it is to tell women they have to just sm…
/r/PurplePillDebate03/05/24 12:16 PM
3

There is a big difference between She ain't into me bro, bummer, but I respect it And Fucking stupid bitches don't see what a nice guy I am, what is wrong with everyone else but me?
/r/PurplePillDebate03/05/24 11:34 AM
9

I don't think you understand. Respecting consent doesn't mean you deserve sex. Nobody can guarantee you ever have sex or find love. Nobody is saying that not raping a woman will make her want you. We are saying don't rape because that's a horrible thing to do. I get that you're frustrated and sad. You can do things to change it. You can work on your fitness, find hobbies to explore and use those to meet other people, among other things. You owe it to yourself to try, because that's all any of us…
/r/PurplePillDebate03/05/24 09:46 AM
5

there is no unspoken agreement A non-insignificant number of men do not understand this though. Even if they don't say "she should fuck me because I paid for her food", they say "dumb woman doesn't see what a nice guy I am for buying her food. Her loss"
/r/PurplePillDebate03/05/24 09:41 AM
10

Unfortunately, life isn't always fair. We aren't always going to find a partner at the end of the rainbow even if we do all the "right" things. But the overwhelming majority of the time, if you simultaneously work to make yourself better and meet new people often enough, you will not die alone. I don't know you or your situation so I cannot begin to speak on what makes you a virgin who struggles to find someone. I can tell you that I've met men who were shorter than me, fatter than me, or making…
/r/PurplePillDebate03/05/24 08:14 AM
6

Again, a very murky definition that does not take into account the history and culture. Oh, come on. Don't go around acting rude and nasty to people for no reason. Don't abuse, assault and harm others physically or emotionally for no good reason. I can't think of many places where these are not agreed upon and accepted social norms for obvious reasons. You mean those complaints about 'low effort' guys, one-word openers on OLD, men not doing their 'bare minimum' in relationships? That's not compl…
/r/PurplePillDebate03/05/24 08:01 AM
4

From what I've seen, women have no issue being completely polite and kind to guys they have zero sexual interest in. The same does not seem to be true for men. There is a reason that we have a stereotype that dudes assume the most basic level of kindness from a woman is born out of a desire to fuck him. It's because they are more open to sexual opportunities so they read into behavior, but also because they know they themselves use "being nice" as some sort of tactic to get laid. When I say indi…
/r/PurplePillDebate03/05/24 07:50 AM
14

Now this is just bullshit. Many 'good things' are merely enforced - either via social pressure of straight up violence. Not to mention that the definition of 'good' is very murky. Let's be honest, the "good things" are often just the bare minimum, not-shitty things to do. Things like being polite and extending the most basic respect. Not being a complete ass, and generally being considerate of others. And in the case of men who complain about being unnoticed by women, it's things done with the b…
/r/PurplePillDebate03/05/24 02:41 AM
31

I used to struggle with this concept myself. I thought there was no way I'm entitled, there's no way I think anyone owes me sex right? But I look back on some of my past behavior, my comments online and my approach to dating. And I look at the content I consumed, and the picture I started to paint for myself. It was something like this You're a good guy, you work hard, you treat others well, you don't get in trouble and people seem to like you. Some day this will all pay off and you'll get rewar…
/r/PurplePillDebate03/05/24 01:55 AM
3

I actually don't disagree that letting go of resentment and frustration, and demonstrating pro-social behavior, is good advice to attract someone. But this doesn't negate the significance of physical attraction either. A guy who is short, but works out, takes care of himself, and is fun/interesting to be around will usually do just fine. Even then, some women just won't like him because he's short. That doesn't make them bad, shallow people, it just means they weren't physically attracted to the…
/r/PurplePillDebate02/05/24 07:05 PM
1

Women can and do go without affection for extended periods. The fact that a bunch of dudes want to bang you isn't as compelling as you think. I think men really struggle with this because in their mind, a bunch of desperate women who they're not that into wanting to bang them still sounds pleasant because they could at least get their sexual "needs" met. And the fact that some are so open about essentially using women they're not that into for sex, is just another great reason for women to be se…
/r/PurplePillDebate02/05/24 06:46 PM
3

Men in the 'sphere tell women they need to be more "accountable" for the actions of the evil, hypergamous gold diggers, but when men are told they are accountable for those of us who are violent and sexually entitled, it's "not all men"? I want men and women to respect and desire each other. I don't want either of them forced into it. Women can choose now, and this frustrates a lot of guys, which is telling.
/r/PurplePillDebate02/05/24 06:04 PM
5

I don't know how much it matters. Women can find men they're attracted to and feel safe around and pair off with them. They can ignore the rest. If that means a decent amount of men get left out and die alone, then I guess that's what happens. There really is no "solution" which empowers men here, which focuses exclusively on getting men's needs met, that doesn't involve sexual or economic coercion and force. And this is why so many of these manosphere dudes wanna go back to a time where women c…
/r/PurplePillDebate02/05/24 03:46 PM
1

You're the one making affirmative claims, it's your job to explain them. Not our job to read your mind.
/r/PurplePillDebate01/05/24 07:06 PM
2

You haven't been contributing jack despite being given an open invitation to do so. And since you don't want to discuss anything it's not worth providing you a serious response.
/r/PurplePillDebate01/05/24 05:54 PM
1

Lmao. Talk about "mental masturbation".
/r/PurplePillDebate01/05/24 05:48 PM
3

I have no interest in having discussions So why are you in a thread flared for discussion? Are men and women different? How they are different is the topic of discussion/debate. For someone who doesn't want to "mentally masturbate", you sure sound pleased with how knowledgeable you are in your own head without being willing or capable to share that knowledge on a subreddit that was created for such topics.
/r/PurplePillDebate01/05/24 05:03 PM
3

If it's so obvious, you should be able to say what it is without being so aggressive. Or are you concerned any of your biological absolutes could get challenged?
/r/PurplePillDebate01/05/24 04:38 PM
4

Different in what ways exactly?
/r/PurplePillDebate01/05/24 03:57 PM
–

I hear this all the time here, but almost everyone I know from Gen X to Gen Z has been able to find stable commitment. The ones who don't, typically just don't want it.
/r/PurplePillDebate01/05/24 11:29 AM
–

What's the tier list if you want to find something serious, stable and long term?
/r/PurplePillDebate01/05/24 11:10 AM
–

I imagine the trauma of sexual assault pretty much ruins your life to the point that many women who experience it will, tragically, have moments of wishing they were no longer alive.
/r/PurplePillDebate30/04/24 06:05 PM
31

Is this another weird revenge fantasy the manosphere has? The idea that "mediocre" women, who should just be with "Nice Guys" that resent them after being rejected, deserve to be cheated on or abused or emotionally manipulated? Mind, those same "mediocre" women are still attractive and desirable to men, at least up until she rejects them, but apparently the only thing she deserves is to be with a dude "at her level" that actively resents women for being free not to choose them. Please, make it m…
/r/PurplePillDebate30/04/24 10:45 AM
–

It's wild to me that you just came out and said that guys should care about the "respect" of random men online over their own feelings towards the other person in their own relationship.
/r/PurplePillDebate30/04/24 08:04 AM
5

The mature young men who have something going for themselves. Not your typical Gen Z guy that people may expect. I'd like to know exactly what a mature man who has something going for himself is, and what the typical Gen Z guy is. Because more often than not, there is usually some other critical factor being unexplored here. Most notably, a lot of guys who miss out on dating have a predictably absent set of social milestones in their lives, and they're not really socializing in a way that allows…
/r/PurplePillDebate30/04/24 02:20 AM
16

I'm wondering if there is any control for the "attractiveness rating" of the women who were rated as "wonderful". It seems like whenever there is a generalization about women, especially in regards to their perceived social and dating advantages, it's almost always down to how young and pretty she is. I see certain women getting the Wonderful treatment, and it's usually the especially good looking ones being asked out a lot, having lots of guys wanting to talk or say good morning, and so on. The…
/r/PurplePillDebate30/04/24 02:06 AM
2

This is another one of those things that seems easily proven through a combination of anecdotal evidence, and collective experiences of men shared online. But it's easily disproven in the same way. I've seen sentiments that women are generally kinder, nicer, more mature and better company, echoed throughout social media as well as sometimes IRL. I actually just came across that sentiment not too long ago on FB, where people were saying the usual "women are great, men are trash" type stuff. There…
/r/PurplePillDebate30/04/24 01:56 AM
2

I feel like Alpha and Beta as a concept are sort of abstract, and difficult to define through a list of qualities or characteristics. You could say it's about money but there are people with high income that have little "game" or social awareness. You could define it in terms of having good looks but being handsome doesn't preclude being "submissive" or lacking confidence with women or in life. You could say it's about leadership, but just how many people find themselves becoming middle managers…
/r/PurplePillDebate24/04/24 01:16 AM
–

All the things certain men will accuse women of doing, they often do themselves. Obsessing over the highest tier of available partners? These men are obsessed with beauty and youth just like women are allegedly obsessed with status and looks. Ignoring the sub-5 women when making broad generalisations? Men do this all the time. The "average" woman to them is probably college aged and quite pretty. I've said this before, but these conversations really change when you realize all the frustration th…
/r/PurplePillDebate14/04/24 05:36 PM
3

The average woman is not doing half the stuff that red pill accuses them of. Things like sleeping around and driving up body counts, always looking for the better man, and having 100 guys in their DMs. From what I've seen, those things usually happen with a certain "type" of woman. One seems to position herself in those places where she's jumping between relationships and getting involved in a lot of casual affairs. I've met women who sleep around a lot, and I've met women who are strictly monog…
/r/PurplePillDebate14/04/24 05:24 PM
3

In the past, women would occasionally approach me and talk to me, because they thought I was attractive and wanted to say hello. I usually had to be the one to actually ask them out, but they made it somewhat easy and obvious that they wanted me to. Only in the past few years have I seen this consistent narrative that women never approach men. I didn't see this hardline stance of "I will never message first :)" back like 5-10 years ago nearly as often as I do now. I have to wonder if something c…
/r/PurplePillDebate12/04/24 06:55 PM
37

This feels like yet another way the 'sphere makes men resent women. Imagine going through life thinking every woman wants to bat out of her league, and if she can't she must settle for you. This now makes you think that if a woman is into you, and you self-report as "average", then she is either ugly and below you, or settling for you and won't actually love you. How miserable that must be.
/r/PurplePillDebate12/04/24 05:11 AM
1

Maybe. Telling yourself you could totally have options and could date if you want can easily become a cope. Especially since there's many more steps between actually entering a relationship and simply getting a phone number or a Tinder match.
/r/PurplePillDebate11/04/24 11:10 PM
2

I'm not sure about this. I don't think you can really have "options" unless you're actually talking to people, flirting with them and asking them out on dates. Someone being attracted to you initially and agreeing to a meetup or first date doesn't mean they're in your back pocket and you can take them for granted. The only "options" you have are the people you invest a decent amount of time in who also invest back, and this can't happen if you've decided to swear off relationships indefinitely.
/r/PurplePillDebate11/04/24 10:44 PM
–

You don't owe women anything. Nobody but other men are saying they need to hoist the mountain tops, drink the oceans, and split the earth just to get women to pay attention to them. It's men telling other men they're not good enough and no woman will ever love them because they think that men are either universally attractive to all women, or they repulse them all. How is this off putting to women Just because you don't say you resent "average women" for not dating in their league, doesn't mean …
/r/PurplePillDebate11/04/24 04:12 PM
–

Average men are in relationships with average women. The women who "don't want to settle" because they have insane standards that nobody can reach, are not the norm. It's also not a "problem" in the slightest that women are choosing not to date certain men, for any reason. They do not owe us time, they don't owe us kindness or to give us a chance, they are not obligated to date us because we claim to be on the "same level". Saying stuff like "average women don't want average guys" is a little su…
/r/PurplePillDebate11/04/24 09:45 AM
–

it's impossible meeting girls outside It really isn't. I meet people while out and about all the time. Girls there are either taken or uninterested It's always been this way. There is no one place you can go that only single women looking to date are hanging out, unless it's advertised as such an event. My instances of meeting women were always kind of "random", anywhere from parks, to weekend retreats, to work, to classes, to online (not dating apps, but things like forums and chatrooms). There…
/r/PurplePillDebate11/04/24 09:33 AM
–

The Red Pill used to feel like it was all about a harsh reality check, and realizing you aren't shit (yet) so you can focus on bettering yourself and your life, with becoming attractive to women being a consequence, not a goal. Maybe I'm looking back on all that stuff with rose tinted glasses and it's always been this way, but the constant stream of both blaming women and telling men they're basically trash unless they're better than everyone else is just so exhausting. I remember that group of …
/r/PurplePillDebate11/04/24 09:17 AM
18

I think this is one of the more unsettling realities about dating, that goes ignored or pivoted away from. No, the women who reject short men because they are short are not horribly shallow people that aren't good relationship partners. They have standards for physical attraction which happen to exclude certain people, but that doesn't make them bad people. Same with guys not wanting single moms, or overweight women. It's comforting to tell folks who are hurt that the person rejecting them was a…
/r/PurplePillDebate10/04/24 03:17 PM
2

Younger people in general focus more on physical attraction. This is not a gendered thing, this is not hypergamy, this is not exclusive to women. Most of the dudes here complaining that women "don't notice them" are only upset because the cute girls that they like don't always like them back. It's one thing to say that "women don't seem to find me attractive at all", but the conversation completely changes when you realize that most men are upset because they don't have exclusive access to the m…
/r/PurplePillDebate10/04/24 02:00 PM
1

This world view is extremely limited. It reduces relationships down to two very narrowly focused "stats", which denies both women the capacity for deeper values and qualities they desire, and men to a very limited amount of things they can ever hope to have in order to satisfy women which, conveniently, are things outside of their control. I understand that online dating and social media makes it seem otherwise, but women can and do evaluate far more qualities in a man than face and height. If t…
/r/PurplePillDebate10/04/24 12:50 PM
-1

Dudes will accuse women of not noticing men who aren't in the top 20%, yet so many guys don't notice women who aren't 22 year old fit bombshells. It becomes a different conversation when you realize men have options, it's just not always the options they want or feel entitled to.
/r/PurplePillDebate10/04/24 08:17 AM
5

But so many dudes here claim it's impossible. I was reading comments just the other day that basically said if you're below 5' 6" you have zero dating prospects. I guess I should tell that to all the women who approached me and flirted with me before, when I was at eye level with many of them, sometimes even below.
/r/PurplePillDebate10/04/24 12:15 AM
5

To be fair, it might be somewhat true that most women don't find most men attractive. But I don't think it means what a lot of people interpret. It's usually understood to mean that 80% of women find only the top 20% of men attractive. In reality, it seems to suggest that because women are generally more selective and more exacting on their standards, most men simply won't make the cut. Not because she only wants 8/10+ Chad, but because she's interested in the aggregate of qualities that make a …
/r/PurplePillDebate09/04/24 12:30 AM
1

I don't think most men who are attractive put in little or no effort. They have to put in effort to learn charisma, social skills, humor, work on their fitness, finances, confidence and so on. Unless you're talking about the extremely limited pool of men who are just so genetically blessed they don't seem to try, and even then most of them actually put effort into simply remaining in good health and staying sociable.
/r/PurplePillDebate07/04/24 09:38 PM
–

I feel like you're selling yourself and your change short, for whatever reason. The fact that you went on this journey to transform yourself physically and probably mentally, is likely coming through your dating profile in a way you don't realize. To you, you didn't try hard to put up a profile but I think that's not a point that necessarily is at odds with my own. For most dating profiles, the work into making them attractive is done on the back end. Your fitness, your subtle body language cues…
/r/PurplePillDebate06/04/24 09:22 PM
–

Do you date these women who you feel are below your standards and looks threshold? I don't mean just screwing around with, I mean dating with the intent to marry. If the answer is "no", then it's not true that men are exclusively forced to settle. Just from all of the people I know, and from the couples I see while out and about, people typically end up with someone in their "league". I actually have a hard time thinking of a man I know who is perpetually single and doomed to a life of inceldom.…
/r/PurplePillDebate06/04/24 08:41 PM
–

I feel like women are more concerned with the overall picture of who they date. They see the whole forest and not just the trees. Men have this idea that they have to lower their standards and settle for anyone because "it all feels the same". But nobody besides other men are telling men they have to fuck everything with a pulse. The "Manosphere" is especially egregious when it comes to perpetuating warped and bastardized gender roles and expectations. They are the ones telling each other they h…
/r/PurplePillDebate06/04/24 06:43 PM
17

I agree with your sentiment, but I don't believe it really is at odds with mine. If a woman really isn't into you, and she's playing games and stringing you along, you'll know as soon as you get remotely serious or show any kind of vulnerability around her. If you try to make the relationship go beyond a few dates or other casual encounters and she keeps deflecting or avoiding, that's your answer. If you encounter a "shy" woman, she will be open to your advances but still wait for you to make a …
/r/PurplePillDebate05/04/24 05:31 PM
156

If she likes me and isn't afraid to show it, she's a keeper. If she likes me, but puts up walls and plays hard to get so I can win her affection, it's not going to be a relationship I'll enjoy anyways.
/r/PurplePillDebate05/04/24 12:26 PM
1

Because marriage is good for everyone when you're with the right partner. But some men might think marriage is an entitlement to limitless sex and validation from another person, and not a partnership with another person.
/r/PurplePillDebate05/04/24 12:12 PM
2

Everyone has desires and needs. People are still able to get into relationships despite the existence of feminism and hypergamy and the self interest of women. Blaming that makes zero sense when marriage works like it's supposed to, as people get together when they want to, not out of societal or economic coercion.
/r/PurplePillDebate05/04/24 11:34 AM
5

Normal, average every day men get into relationships and start families with normal, average, every day women. They don't spend their days crying on the Internet about how unfair it is that women only want Chad, and that men want women to be beautiful, young and chaste angels that only put out for them. They don't make posts about marriage not being worth it because women aren't essentially just submissive sex dolls that exist to placate men's desires in order to obtain financial security. These…
/r/PurplePillDebate04/04/24 10:12 PM
3

Demanding or even "strongly preferring" that is pretty exacting. It means they expect tight skin, no wrinkles, not too much body fat. And that's not even getting into other physical preferences for things like tattoos, piercings, natural vs dyed hair, skin color and bust size, which some of them are quite vocal about. Again, this is red pill spaces specifically making these demands, and it usually comes from a place of "I must have this in order to want to date/marry/get you pregnant", even thou…
/r/PurplePillDebate04/04/24 09:35 PM
8

most young men are single No they aren't. This is an issue for younger men I happen to know a lot of gen z guys and most of them do not have this issue. How can men be obsessed with beauty and youth but also have no standards That's what the red pill claims. That men simultaneously have no standards for casual sex, but also that they're very exacting for appearances and want good looks and a youthful appearance. If you tell me that it's different men saying different things in the manosphere, th…
/r/PurplePillDebate04/04/24 09:06 PM
16

If 90% of men get rejected by women based on looks then why are most men in relationships? If men aren't able to get their foot in the door then why do ordinary, average men get into relationships, get married and have families consistently? If men don't filter by appearance like women do, then why do men claim they are obsessed with beauty and youth?
/r/PurplePillDebate04/04/24 07:46 PM
25

Of course this had to be a post blaming women for making relationships worse. I feel like a lot of these "pills" guys are taking, just tell them to resent women for being human beings with needs, desires and agency who won't magically fall in love with them for simply existing. The fact that dudes claim that they have no standards for women other than "don't be too fat", then turn around accusing women of having their standards too high because they even try to consider practical aspects like fi…
/r/PurplePillDebate04/04/24 06:58 PM
1

Most people I know will be "talking to" multiple people at once, but very few are actively dating and sleeping with more than one person. They usually end up going with the option they're most eager to be with and focus on them. I agree that it can make it harder. But at the end of the day, someone either ends up with you or they don't. You'll probably not realize or need to care about them engaging with other people if all they're doing is talking to them, and they end up choosing to be with yo…
/r/PurplePillDebate04/04/24 06:49 PM
0

It's definitely a mix of guys telling you that women hate you if you're short, and you should take the black pill, and red pill guys who are obsessed with body counts that want to maximize sexual options. And there is definitely a noticeable trend of dudes that lean into the red pill stuff, who are obsessed with looks, status and partner counts. Most people I know aren't like this at all. I think what happens is people end up leaning and playing into whatever works for them; path of least resist…
/r/PurplePillDebate04/04/24 09:50 AM
14

A good rule of thumb is to date for compatibility, and that includes sexually. Is your goal to be as successful with as many women as possible, or is it to find a good fit for you? If it's the latter, then it's important to be considerate of her wants but also keep your own in mind. If you don't want to lead with the sexual stuff, then don't. This may turn some women away, or confuse them and make them think you don't want them. But you have to decide if your desire to "not make them uncomfortab…
/r/PurplePillDebate03/04/24 08:21 AM
-2

Many dudes who are not tall and strong and rich find girlfriends and wives all the time. And I generally find the "gender role" obsession lately is kind of too strongly focused. Yeah, there are likely unspoken expectations or desires from women to men or men to women that are rooted in some biological imperative, but there are just so many more considerations for lasting relationships that don't involve things like: how tall is the person, how much money do they make, who pays for dates, how str…
/r/PurplePillDebate03/04/24 06:11 AM
1

Idk man, I get why men feel this way, for all sorts of reasons. But coming here on and off and reading the comments it seems like mostly men telling each other they're doomed and it's over unless you're a gigachad or a "normie". It's a little disturbing to see other guys tell each other that they're hopeless if they're not conventionally very attractive. And that mentality, which spirals you into a deeper pit of despair, seems like the most unhelpful and most crippling thing for you than any "ob…
/r/PurplePillDebate03/04/24 05:57 AM
1

I don't disagree that it can seem paralyzing and hopeless, but that's maybe why online dating is a meme and people should not treat it like the absolute be all and end all of dating. Most normal dudes aren't out here banging tons of women, and they don't have the option to do so. Even some of the best looking guys you know get rejected. Do they have it easier? Probably, but maybe not as much as you think. Getting ghosted and flaked on is something just about every guy faces while dating especial…
/r/PurplePillDebate03/04/24 05:40 AM
1

I dont think it would work for most men. I doubt a woman would be interested in an average looking guy trying to chat her up to get her number or set up a date. But average looking men get dates and form relationships, marriages and families all the time. Through online and online interactions, these guys find relationships all the time. They may not be appealing to every woman in existence but they find a way to make it work. Nobody can promise you that you won't get rejected, but telling guys …
/r/PurplePillDebate03/04/24 05:32 AM
2

I believe people have a reasonable expectation of dating people they're attracted to, and that's totally fine. The only "issue" is when the standards become so exacting that they're hard to reach, or your standards are for such conventionally attractive things that you're going to have to deal with things like competition, rejection or those people already being taken. Some people aren't necessarily ready to deal with the humbling reality that they're not necessarily entitled to an attractive pa…
/r/PurplePillDebate03/04/24 12:52 AM
7

Because a lot of dudes who say "women don't like them", don't find certain women attractive, so they don't "count". Just like they accuse women of ignoring everyone who isn't Chad. I've noticed a lot of the red pill leaning guys especially are really focused on the physical attractiveness of the women in question, and it goes a long way in explaining why they complain about women being so "hypergamous", among other things.
/r/PurplePillDebate03/04/24 12:16 AM
1

I don't think Tinder rejection is always actually rejection. There is some painful reflection that comes after swiping right on like ten thousand women and getting little or no matches. But the thing is, most of those women probably aren't even seeing your profile because of how the app works. That's down to how the app functions and nothing more. It's not to say they couldn't be hotter and do better, but Tinder seems like it's dead for everyone except "Chads" as far as men go because it's been …
/r/PurplePillDebate02/04/24 10:46 PM
3

If someone doesn't want to date to get to know someone, I don't think of that as a "horror". They may be misguided or have intimacy issues (like being unavailable). All I could possibly think is to suggest therapy and not date someone like that in the first place. But I don't think they don't deserve love, they can't change, or shouldn't ever be allowed to date, as long as they communicate honestly what they're looking for at the time.
/r/PurplePillDebate02/04/24 10:37 PM
0

So what are we supposed to tell them? Give up and accept no woman will ever want you? That's not only unnecessarily harsh, it's just not true.
/r/PurplePillDebate02/04/24 10:32 PM
4

Well, my thinking is that the "point" of dating is not always the same for everyone. Perhaps it's too presumptuous and uncharitable of me to say those folks just don't want to put in the work, but ultimately not everyone wants a relationship for the same reason.
/r/PurplePillDebate02/04/24 10:30 PM
2

I'm not sure what that means. What's being short and balding have to do with other people being "NPCs"?
/r/PurplePillDebate02/04/24 10:17 PM
4

The whole point of dating, cohabitation and engagements is to get to know the whole person That may seem like the more optimal goal, but for some folks the point of dating seems to be validation and sexual satisfaction. Getting to know somebody and building a relationship is too much work for them.
/r/PurplePillDebate02/04/24 10:08 PM
4

Reading this as a short balding guy and not sure what to think. Lmao
/r/PurplePillDebate02/04/24 10:05 PM
1

I don't really think that's wrong. If you put in enough work and talk to enough women, aka play the numbers game, you can and will get a decent amount of action most of the time. I think for many people though, "effort" is not going out and socializing, it's using the damned dating apps and feeling like shit when the 10,000 women you swiped on didn't swipe back.
/r/PurplePillDebate02/04/24 10:02 PM
15

It seems like it's damned if you do and damned if you don't. There are definitely benefits to being single. Among them are not having to answer to anyone while not at your job, being free to engage in casual affairs perpetually (though I'll be honest, this doesn't "work" for most people), or just enjoying the peace of being alone. However, romantic partnerships are a considerable aspect of life that simply can't be replaced by filling your life with hobbies, pets and friends. Especially since ma…
/r/PurplePillDebate02/04/24 09:56 PM
1

Some women are like that. The men who experience it even once create a lot of noise about it, and it scares other guys into thinking all women are like that. Also, I think some of us men confuse verbal diarrhea/emotional dumping all our problems on our partner as "opening up". That shit can be overwhelming for both men and women. Not all men are angels who just listen to their partners problems without issue; in fact, they often complain that women just want to talk or "bitch" about their proble…
/r/PurplePillDebate02/04/24 01:39 PM
12

It's funny how many people have one or two relationships, and think they know everything about how human romance works just based on their incredibly limited experiences.
/r/PurplePillDebate02/04/24 12:39 AM
2

I don't think old people have the same hormones and sex drives they did in their 20s, 30s and even their 40s.
/r/PurplePillDebate02/04/24 12:36 AM
0

Well at that age I don't think it's reasonable that anyone is "lusting" for people like they did in their 20's, much less pursuing relationships on that basis.
/r/PurplePillDebate01/04/24 06:41 PM
3

Do you believe that even in most couples, men have issues with dead bedrooms and not being able to arouse their partners? I ask this because on the surface, I see couples everywhere and I make the assumption that most are happy with each other. Statistically, most men find somebody, so it's not like we are looking at a massive incel generation which gets over represented online.
/r/PurplePillDebate01/04/24 06:27 PM
1

I'm pretty sure the data about it says women tend to stick with someone a few years older than them. How much this can be swayed by his attractiveness is hard to say, but I'd hazard a guess that most normal people are looking for other normal/average people in a certain age range, and statistically that's who they'll find. Not the shredded 40 year old porn star, or any other outlier.
/r/PurplePillDebate01/04/24 06:15 PM
12

The idea is generally that men don't have their shit together until their late 20s or early 30s. It's an aggregate of qualities like maturity, confidence, wisdom, financial security and sustained physical fitness that make guys desired. It's obviously possible to do this in their 20s, but for some reason some guys can't or don't cultivate these things until later in life. That said, a lot of people in general let themselves go with age. Weight gain is one of those things that ensnare a lot of fo…
/r/PurplePillDebate01/04/24 06:06 PM
3

Nobody's entitled to relationships. You don't earn them by doing the right things. You form them with people through mutual consent and desire. The only solid advice here is to work on yourself in a way that makes you more attractive, but there is no guarantee doing that will work either.
/r/PurplePillDebate31/03/24 11:34 PM
4

Well sure, but this would easily apply to men too. You might be thinking it's different for guys, that guys have it so much harder and they're alone because they're not Chad. But in order for that to be true, it would need to be an observable reality that only "Chads" can attract and date women. This is demonstrably false. A lot of dudes are not truly horrible people, but struggle with dating because they don't empathize with women. They see women as a means to an end, a way to cure their loneli…
/r/PurplePillDebate30/03/24 08:15 PM
6

Most stable couples I know, the women put in effort, are considerate of the man and respect his feelings and desires, and they mostly work as a "team". They care about their boyfriends and husbands and their happiness. This idea that women are all entitled and only want Chad to take care of them while they do nothing in return simply isn't true of all women. The ones who go on TikTok and Insta to berate men are an outlier, because it's largely self-absorbed people who gravitate to social media t…
/r/PurplePillDebate30/03/24 07:45 PM
1

The fact that Tinder is up to 75% men kind of speaks to the fact that women have grown tired of it. But, no telling what the future holds for the dating "market" or any specific individuals, which is why I'm just taking it day by day and not getting my hopes up at this point.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/03/24 11:46 PM
1

Honestly man, there was a period of time I did okay on dating apps too and I'm not great looking either. I believe there was a window of time before like 2018-19 that Tinder and its owners felt somewhat more equitable and usable, before the bots, OF models and subscription crap completely took it over.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/03/24 10:51 PM
1

Not gonna dox the guy but I promise if you saw him, you wouldn't think he is some hyper Chad.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/03/24 10:50 PM
1

He was really goofy, not muscular and did not have the Chad jawline or predator eyes or whatever else people who know the "science" of good looks would claim. But he was super confident, personable and smiled a lot. And actually pretty fun to hang with, which I'm sure made him even more magnetic to women.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/03/24 09:59 PM
0

I've had women approach me before. Either because they knew me through some social circle or as a classmate or coworker, or even as a first message on dating apps. Maybe this is outside the norm for most people, but it does happen. I'm not the world's most attractive person, and depending on who you ask I could be pretty unattractive because of my height. I think what attracted those women (outside of how I looked, which was good enough for them), was seeming approachable, easy going, funny or d…
/r/PurplePillDebate21/03/24 05:33 PM
10

The one guy I knew that cleaned up on Tinder, was average height and average looks. But he had a lot of "game" and was a total party animal. He basically oozed confidence and sex appeal, which was all that was necessary. I wish I could be more specific, but I can't. When a guy just "has it" and carries himself a certain way that works for him, women are drawn to it. Obviously, better looking guys will also do well, but they can struggle if they don't have the confidence and game, and have shitty…
/r/PurplePillDebate21/03/24 05:12 PM
1

You stated that men feeling lonely and being unable to have sex are closely related. But then if that was true, men would just go see prostitutes and that would basically be the end of it. Men aren't having sex because they can't get close to people; they technically could, but then it would really just be sex, not intimacy or desire.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/03/24 05:06 PM
3

Being able to pay for sex, and someone desiring sex with you, aren't the same thing. Yes, you can technically have sex if you pay for it, but that's shameful to so many for a variety of reasons. And like I said, it doesn't fix the problem.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/03/24 04:48 PM
13

Men don't get prostitutes because it doesn't fix the problem. The male loneliness/sexlessness issue is a consequence of a broader social problem, which is that men are not able to form connections with other human beings. Guys who writhe in despair because they can't get laid are oftentimes, struggling to get to a point in their life where the requisite conditions which need to be met in order for that to happen, simply aren't there. Or, they have tried and failed to meet the expectations of the…
/r/PurplePillDebate21/03/24 03:56 PM
3

Because even if I say that I'm about accountability, being responsible for my life and taking action to deal with the problems and challenges I have, it still gets frustrating when the reaction I get is still a dismissive "man up and deal with it". This is why the "manosphere" talks about things like the burden of performance, and says truisms such as "women don't care about your struggles, they wait at the finish line and pick the winners". The fact that it's difficult to be a man, for reasons …
/r/PurplePillDebate18/03/24 06:14 PM
7

Yep, you get it. People trivialize and make light of what causes people to be this way. I wasn't always isolated and hesitant to reach out to others. Bad experiences have made it increasingly difficult to want to do so. The practical considerations of "just socialize more bro" completely ignore the human, physiological aspect of why people end up this way. If your car gets a check engine light on, you hopefully would not just ignore it and keep driving, hoping the problem goes away on its own. S…
/r/PurplePillDebate18/03/24 03:23 PM
7

Yeah, which is why I said other creepy behavior. Guys either get aggressive with women who aren't interested at all, or take it too far as soon as they match someone. Men notoriously overestimate a woman's sexual interest, even if she is willing to go on a date or two with him. Or they get really pushy and needy and that all drives them away too.
/r/PurplePillDebate17/03/24 01:47 PM
14

Take a look at the Tinder subreddit then, if you want proof that women hate dick pics, and also guys that are extremely pushy, ask for sex too early and get nasty when they get shut down.
/r/PurplePillDebate17/03/24 01:40 PM
4

I sort of see what you're trying to say, I think. If it's something along the lines of men "simping", to put it crudely, and putting women on a pedestal out of desperation, which makes women come to expect that then I sort of agree. But I don't think I'm capable of ever controlling what a woman wants or how she goes about her life. I can watch and control myself, but I can't do it for others, not other men and especially not women.
/r/PurplePillDebate17/03/24 08:25 AM
13

It doesn't actually matter how they feel. If men actually want women to behave a certain way, they can make that happen. Well, count me out. The last thing I want is to have to force a woman to be with me, especially by restricting her own rights. If she isn't desiring me without being coerced into it, then I don't want it.
/r/PurplePillDebate17/03/24 08:20 AM
63

I don't know if I agree that women want random men to put them on a pedestal. Especially when the attention they get is not often very welcome. See: dick pics and other creepy behavior. Yeah sure, women still have a lot of options overall, but to most of them it doesn't matter much unless one of them is a guy she's into. From what I've seen, many women are content to ignore the majority of their options for the handful of strong suitors. Men assume women want all that attention the same way that…
/r/PurplePillDebate17/03/24 08:16 AM
10

I don't know if I agree. Countries where women have their rights restricted that much don't really represent how women feel or how they act when left to their own devices. If the government is forcing it, that's not really social programming, that's straight up making them behave a certain way so they aren't imprisoned or killed. In western countries where women have far more rights, we can see what they choose to do, and who they choose to date, marry and sleep with.
/r/PurplePillDebate17/03/24 08:09 AM
2

I agree. I was stuck in the "I can fix her" trap. Or really, it was more like I put up with it thinking I couldn't do any better, or shouldn't try to. Nowadays I'm less likely to go "yeah she's depressed, but she has a reason to be" or "she might not respond right away but she has a lot going on, and we are still getting to know one another". Even if any of that's true, it doesn't make much sense for me to do such emotional heavy lifting when the opposite party doesn't appreciate it, and isn't g…
/r/PurplePillDebate17/03/24 07:33 AM
2

To your point though, yes, there's a difference between "not being happy with what you have" and "being unhappy because what you have now isn't meeting your needs in a way that it should".
/r/PurplePillDebate17/03/24 02:55 AM
9

I'm super jaded when it comes to relationships, but even I can see that a quality partnership with the right person is probably pretty amazing and makes life so much better. Unfortunately, not everyone gets to experience it without dealing with prior bad experiences and some people will never feel it at all. All things considered, a large amount of good partnerships and families are a product of an emotionally healthy society, in which people have stable upbringings and solid relationship skills…
/r/PurplePillDebate17/03/24 02:45 AM
2

While that's possible, I also wonder if those kinds of things don't actually signal deeper issues in a broader context. People won't always be able to articulate that something feels off, but they do sense something is wrong. Like, maybe they didn't want to go see your family over the holidays, but they've also been acting cold and distant lately. Maybe they changed up their routine, and that person changing what they eat is just an example of that. Someone might describe the situation to you an…
/r/PurplePillDebate17/03/24 02:36 AM
3

I've always tried so much to compromise in relationships. On almost every metric I've made some "allowances" in order to try and preserve something or give it a chance. In the end, I almost always left feeling as if I'd been trying too hard to give the benefit of the doubt to someone who was not even remotely willing to do the same thing for me. Obviously, some standards can still be negotiated. I don't have a specific requirement for height, hair color, bust size or anything like that. But ther…
/r/PurplePillDebate17/03/24 02:10 AM
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Women have "approached" me before. Sometimes they are just being nice, sometimes they are making conversation with plausible deniability if we don't connect, sometimes I've straight up been hit on. Some women like to sit around and wait for the guys to make moves but from experience, many of them are at least trying to get your attention if they like you at all.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/11/23 05:17 PM
6

From your last source: As hypothesized, women who placed a lesser emphasis on the importance of sex, who had fewer sexual partners, and who were less accepting of men who had many sexual partners were more likely to choose the nice guy as a dating partner. The findings indicate that nice guys are likely to have fewer sexual partners but are more desired for committed relationships. So like always, water finds its own level. I don't know why so many people here get caught up in thinking one entir…
/r/PurplePillDebate28/11/23 10:08 AM
5

Broken clock and all that jazz.
/r/PurplePillDebate26/11/23 02:42 AM
13

Some people aren't good relationship partners, enough that they don't deserve someone. They don't have good relationship skills, they don't put as much effort into themselves or the things they need to bring to a relationship to make one stand the test of time. They blame everyone else for their problems and expect the "right person" to change their mind. They enter a cycle of destructive habits and self-fulfilling prophecies, and have no business getting that intimate with other human beings un…
/r/PurplePillDebate25/11/23 07:19 PM
2

Seeing this at age 31 with no current prospects makes me lol a bit. Guess I'm not completely delusional for thinking my window is closing/has closed.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/11/23 01:12 AM
3

Almost half? Source?
/r/PurplePillDebate21/11/23 12:40 AM
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Aside from some superficial things, femininity is an extremely unattractive character profile from the perspective ofsz romantic relationships. It is self-centered, entitled, and passive. It seeks to extract more value than it gives. Even women themselves are repulsed by femininity. I'll play devil's advocate and say that the way "feminine women" gets described feels a little odd sometimes. It sounds infantilizing and childish when someone says "women want a man who can lead" but then goes on to…
/r/PurplePillDebate19/11/23 12:56 PM
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Yeah, that's all "logical" ways to meet people and form communities. It's very different from the reality a lot of people are experiencing though. For starters, access to therapy is not something everyone has. Some may not have the financial means to pay for classes, workshops, hobbies etc. Or they just get so tired and burned out from working multiple jobs that it's hard to find the time and energy. Ergo, people turn to low effort avenues like dating apps where you just upload photos of yoursel…
/r/PurplePillDebate18/11/23 04:08 PM
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Sure, but with that in mind, no community makes it harder to meet people and connect with them at all, which means relationships don't form as easily either.
/r/PurplePillDebate18/11/23 03:12 PM
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If women can't find men they want to date I think that's an issue too. I don't think it's unreasonable to say that most hetero women want relationships with men, and if men aren't finding women to date, then women aren't finding men to date either. I don't subscribe to the "women just pass around Chad" theory, I honestly believe that loneliness is becoming an issue for people in general. The male loneliness crisis is a topical issue now, but it's a symptom of a larger problem, and the rise of po…
/r/PurplePillDebate18/11/23 02:29 PM
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I mean, "potential" can be relative. Some partners get together and stay together through tough financial times and other hardships. Many people stay with someone even as they struggle after hitting a rough patch, or are still working on their future. Personally, I'd argue that everyone is a "work in progress", we are always changing and growing. I expect every person I meet to have flaws and bad days, just like I do. But I don't feel entitled to or expect everyone to put up with my shit or not …
/r/PurplePillDebate18/11/23 02:16 PM
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Disagree, some women will complain about being lonely. Arguably not as much or as often because they have more perceived options, but even that gets lonely if you're unable to find someone you actually desire.
/r/PurplePillDebate18/11/23 02:12 PM
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