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mia6ix Archive

View 1 post and 76 comments by mia6ix on TheRedPill subreddit and various other subreddits related to The Red Pill community.
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16

Questionsmia6ix/r/MensRights06/07/16 05:48 AM
Upvotes Comment on Subreddit Date (UTC)
2

You're correct, my experiences are limited and anecdotal. At the same time, can't all of our individual experiences be described that way? I've watched modern social justice activism (outside the classroom) from both the inside and the outside, and some of it has been ridiculous, and some has been hugely meaningful and positive. As you said before "All my feminist friends would be on board with the MRM's legislative goals". This is NOT the case with a majority of active feminists This has been s…
/r/MensRights07/07/16 12:58 AM
1

Unfortunately, when Feminists say that encouraging women to take safety precautions is victim-blaming, or when a man and a woman both commit a crime say the man must have made her do it, or blame male gender roles on "toxic masculinity," or assuming women in porn or sex work are coerced and objectified instead of doing it by choice, they perpetuate these beliefs. Actually, this same debate takes place in feminist circles, and almost fractured the movement in half in the 80s, during what we somet…
/r/MensRights07/07/16 12:49 AM
2

I wanted to reply to everyone and say how much I appreciate your time, effort and graciousness in talking with me about this. This is the most productive, informative discussion I've ever had on men's rights issues, outside of academia. Because there's only one of me, and many more of you, I have to admit that I'm experiencing some reply-burnout. If I haven't responded to your post directly, please know that I've read it, and I'm thinking about all of this in earnest. I will try to devote more t…
/r/MensRights07/07/16 12:43 AM
2

Being anti feminist "seems" like being anti-female to you Actually, I made this statement in direct reference to things I read while researching the MRM, before I posted. At A Voice For Men and a few other places, I came across threads of comments of MRAs saying things like, "all women are leaches that just want to bleed men dry," or "women are inherently manipulative," things like that. I don't equate anti-feminist with anti-female. Those comments seemed directed at women in general, and not ju…
/r/MensRights07/07/16 12:27 AM
3

Yes, thank you, that's a very complete response. I appreciate that.
/r/MensRights07/07/16 12:22 AM
3

Okay... your Feminist friends might say this, but do they really believe it? Have you asked them whether they actually support Legal Paternal Surrender, or a ban in infant male circumcision, or gender-neutral conscription laws and/or complete abolition of conscription, or how they truly feel about due process for men accused of rape? The results may surprise you. I haven't asked specifically about all those things, so I will, and I'll report back. All I have to go on are conversations with my fr…
/r/MensRights07/07/16 12:20 AM
2

Thanks for sharing that, those responses were very helpful. but no, of course you're different from all those other feminists who cry misogyny at the slightest hint of disagreement. Perhaps if you had the time to read through all the posts, you would feel differently about me. Additionally, if this happens so often and is irritating, perhaps it would be helpful to highlight a past thread that feminists could read where these questions that we all seem to have would be answered without further ir…
/r/MensRights07/07/16 12:02 AM
1

I don't contest your point, that women will also attempt to bully men into adhering to gender expectations. I have never seen it happen, personally, but I will take your word that it happens. You haven't been paying attention if you don't know what happens when a man refuses to do all the heavy lifting, dangerous/dirty work and demands that women with the same pay and job title share in that work. I think it's a little condescending to say I haven't seen this because I don't pay attention. I hav…
/r/MensRights06/07/16 11:58 PM
2

In the MRM, this idea is referred to as "male hyperagency and female hypoagency," I have never heard those terms, that is extremely helpful. Thank you.
/r/MensRights06/07/16 10:03 PM
2

Your issue with my claim that rape culture exists seemed to me to be an issue with the fact that I would generalize on the basis of my own experience. Some of the links I quoted are generalizations, that are unsupported, which I did not ask the OPs to support. Others legitimately are the sharing of personal experiences, for which I also did not demand "proof" or "elaboration." Perhaps you didn't click on every link. There's no need to insult me or my background.
/r/MensRights06/07/16 09:33 PM
2

https://www.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/4rh247/a_big_question_from_a_former_feminist/d51muyr https://www.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/4rh247/a_big_question_from_a_former_feminist/d5160j6 “Most men don't care about one another by virtue of their sex. We just don't. We're not like women like that, we don't have an in-group preference or at least ours is socially ground out of us early on.” “Nobody likes it when guys share their pain, because frankly the easiest way is anger and that scare…
/r/MensRights06/07/16 09:14 PM
0

And you are lost on why I don't see how she's oppressed and can't actually do anything... Not at all. Obviously, the Queen was not oppressed. Just like we can both agree that men in power today are not oppressed. But just like you argue that men without power really do experience discrimination and oppression, I believe I can argue that women without power in the time-period also experienced oppression and discrimination.
/r/MensRights06/07/16 09:12 PM
0

I'm just... lost on this one. How do you ignore the entire structure of the rest of society, common law, religious doctrine, everything, which placed men always in positions of authority over women during that time-period, just because birthright of kings occasionally passed to women? How do you not see how this argument totally invalidates your ability to argue with my OP assertion that men have all the power now, because they occupy more seats of government? Even I see the fallacy in that argu…
/r/MensRights06/07/16 09:08 PM
-1

I can tell you why feminists don't see this as a fallacy. One female queen, so appointed because of birthright and not election, among an entire court of male advisors, male religious leaders and male military leaders, is clearly an anomaly. An entire male Congress, a male president, and a wholly male judiciary, as the United States had until the mid-20th century, clearly points to a male-dominated, male-controlled government as tradition, not anomalous.
/r/MensRights06/07/16 08:56 PM
1

I took my information from the same Wikipedia article that you did, which clearly states: "Abolition of property qualifications for white men, from 1792 (Kentucky) to 1856 (North Carolina)" Meaning, according to the law, no white man is prohibited from voting at this point. Poll taxes, grandfather clauses, etc. affected men as well as women, so using those to say that men did not have legal suffrage way before women did seems disingenuous to me. Additionally, using the ratification date of the 1…
/r/MensRights06/07/16 08:29 PM
2

Goes to show, never trust a feminist, always question everything they say and ask for evidence to back it up. Actually, the Amazon description of the book literally uses the pronouns "he" and "him" to describe the author. It wasn't just the ambiguous initials, it's an actual misrepresentation on the part of Amazon. My mistake for not catching it, though.
/r/MensRights06/07/16 08:09 PM
2

I'm really grateful that you guys are willing to talk to me about it. I'm aware that I'm intruding on your space. It makes me angry and sad to think that you've had women or feminists come in here before just to mess with you. That's incredibly insensitive of them. If I had to describe myself, I'd say I'm an egalitarian as well. The feminist leaders and the education I received made it seem like egalitarianism was totally compatible with feminism, and I'm realizing through this discussion that c…
/r/MensRights06/07/16 08:02 PM
1

That is not accurate. I think you should read through the comments again. I feel awkward calling out specific users, so I won't, but there have been several threads where guys have said, essentially, these kinds of things happened to me, therefore, I feel women/feminists/the feminist movement is/are like this.
/r/MensRights06/07/16 07:29 PM
1

I don't think I'm having trouble with that. I posed those questions in my OP, and then I've simply listened to the responses. I have not attempted to counter them, with regard to the overall content (only specific, limited instances of incorrect facts).
/r/MensRights06/07/16 07:27 PM
2

By the way, I wrote you a much longer top-level response. I'd be interested to hear your reply, if you want. I'm about to have to log off for the day, but I wanted to say that I saw your response, and it was excellent. I will respond as soon as I am able. Thanks for the conversation.
/r/MensRights06/07/16 07:25 PM
1

I haven't asked any other person in this discussion to elaborate on their experience in order to "prove" to me that their experience is valid. And, for the record, I didn't attempt to use my personal experience to "prove" the existence of rape culture. My statement was that I experience that rape culture exists, not "you are all ignorant if you think rape culture doesn't exist." In speaking from my own experience, I'm not demanding that you believe me, or trying to prove anything to you, I'm jus…
/r/MensRights06/07/16 07:24 PM
1

With a female monarch, a female ruler of the entire empire, are you really claiming that women were oppressed, and subjugated? I don't think you can use this argument, if you intend to continue using the argument that others have used here, that just because men currently occupy most of the positions of governmental authority in society, doesn't mean that the majority of other men have access to that same power and preferential treatment. I could present the same argument that another poster pre…
/r/MensRights06/07/16 07:19 PM
2

Then we can agree that with both our experiences combined we can safely say that it is both men and women who contribute to maintain male gender roles and masculinity. Very good point, I do agree. I have seen women denigrate men before, for not living up to their expectations of masculinity, and the abuse you describe seems very hurtful. I have just seen men do it to other men more often. But I agree - our experiences put together mean that both are responsible.
/r/MensRights06/07/16 07:14 PM
1

Ok, I'd like to move on. I'm not saying you should believe me. My very first response to you about this was to explicitly say that I knew I would damage my credibility by not wanting to share. My following comment was that your assertion that you don't believe me was unnecessary and inhibitive to the discussion. That's all.
/r/MensRights06/07/16 07:11 PM
2

I appreciate your responses, and I do understand what you're saying. Also, I don't experience that I'm feeling hostile toward the words you've countered with - she-paying, womansit, etc. I see how those are valid issues with how some women interact with men.
/r/MensRights06/07/16 07:08 PM
1

Women more often raise children and (as you have brought up your experiences) my experiences show me that women are the ones who mock/do not pay any attention to men who do not fit their idea of what a man should be. I accept that has been your experience. I won't argue with that. I can only say that the three boys I knew in high school who later came out as gay, were physically abused by their fathers for being "wusses," not by their mothers. They were beaten up by the boys at school, not by th…
/r/MensRights06/07/16 07:02 PM
0

I appreciate the article, your suggestion to search Google was all I needed. I didn't know if you had a specific book or something.
/r/MensRights06/07/16 07:00 PM
1

Do I have a source for this? Yes, any early American history textbook. Men occupied nearly every leadership role in society, period. Religious, political, social. They owned the vast majority of all the business, performed the vast majority of business transations, and owned the vast majority of all the wealth. I don't know how to answer that, because the question is so obvious that a Google search doesn't even yield a sensible result. But here's something that might help: https://en.wikipedia.o…
/r/MensRights06/07/16 06:57 PM
1

How sexist of you to just assume I haven't been. I'm certainly not assuming you haven't been. I'm asking you imagine a very specific scenario, in order to put yourself in my exact shoes in this moment. The word "imagine" does not negate your ability to fully relate to the exact experience I'm describing. I'm not silencing you. I did not accuse you of silencing me. I don't know where that came from, other than from my description of what a men's rights activist might say to a group of feminists.
/r/MensRights06/07/16 06:48 PM
1

In other words, feminists use these words as sexist epithets to attack my character on a regular basis. They attack me because I am male. People who are insensitive jerks, be they male or female, do things like this. I don't agree that this is characteristic of all, or even most, feminists. Can you tell me why you experience the term mansplaining, for instance, as I described it, as inherently hostile? (Apart from having jerks use it to unfairly attack or silence you, which would irritate anyone…
/r/MensRights06/07/16 06:45 PM
3

But it's a choice that has consequences. You're going to have to accept that I don't believe you've seen anything of rape culture. I think that was unnecessary of you to assert. Clearly, I understand that, and now I am even less likely to want to discuss this here. Imagine you were the victim of sexual assault by a woman, and you have just told a group of feminists that rape paradigms systematically silence and harm men, and one of them responded to a vulnerable comment you made the way you have…
/r/MensRights06/07/16 06:31 PM
1

I'm sorry too, if what you say is true. Can you cite the source of this information?
/r/MensRights06/07/16 06:27 PM
2

Thank you, I'm grateful for your sensitivity about that.
/r/MensRights06/07/16 06:26 PM
1

You didn't, you claimed societal pressure. Ok. My premise was that men dominated the public sphere, which includes politics and society - public life. It is within the public sphere that women experienced pressure to marry. Does that clarify my point?
/r/MensRights06/07/16 06:25 PM
1

And how have you experienced rape culture? That's a very personal question, and, while I accept this may hurt my credibility here, I'm just not willing to get into it in this forum yet. There are some experiences that would be very painful to have to defend to a hostile audience, as I'm sure many men here can understand, from their own unwillingness to speak about their experiences. If I am to speak about those things, I want to know that the men listening are willing to try to see the world thr…
/r/MensRights06/07/16 06:23 PM
0

I've attempted to provide evidence of men's studies within feminist theory at the university level elsewhere in this thread. Here's one of the best resources: http://mensstudies.org/ I don't experience men's studies in gender studies to be "trickle-down," but instead of be a robust part of the gender conversation, on college campuses at least, which is my arena of experience. I can't speak to your experience.
/r/MensRights06/07/16 06:18 PM
2

Also, it's quite inconsiderate of you that when I talked about male rape your first reaction was try to lower and discredit the high number as much as possible, and yet when I then talked about female rape you did the exact opposite, claiming the number was very possible and in your experience a safe estimate would actually yield a higher number despite everything pointing towards the opposite. It's funny, isn't it? I can see why you would have interpreted my comments this way, and I apologize. …
/r/MensRights06/07/16 06:15 PM
1

Why do feminists use these terms? Are they unable to see how divisive they are? Do they not see men as human? I obviously can't speak for all feminists everywhere, but I'm pretty positive that the vast majority are fully aware of men's humanity, yes. I think they do not realize how divisive those terms feel to men, no. For feminists, those terms give voice to lifetimes of shared female experiences, of being talked over, interrupted, assumed to be less competent/informed/intelligent than we are, …
/r/MensRights06/07/16 06:06 PM
1

You are using pop culture examples to counter my argument that modern academic feminism is different from mob feminism. I don't think that's an effective argument.
/r/MensRights06/07/16 06:00 PM
1

Could you please define male privilege to me? "Male privilege is a concept for examining social, economic, and political advantages or rights that are made available to men solely on the basis of their sex. A man's access to these benefits may also depend on other characteristics such as race, sexual orientation and social class." That's wikipedia, but I'd say it's a good summation. Another poster mentioned that he wanted me to give a list of laws that privilege men, and he's right - there aren'…
/r/MensRights06/07/16 05:54 PM
2

I'll check it out, thanks!
/r/MensRights06/07/16 05:41 PM
1

You are begging the question. Prove this to be the case. Ok. Here's the syllabus from the course I took in undergrad (different year, same course & instructor), demonstrating an example of how modern feminist theory includes a robust discussion of men's gendered experiences and the lived experiences of men. http://users.clas.ufl.edu/marsig/MEN%20AND%20MASCULINITIES%20syllabus%202012%20spring.pdf
/r/MensRights06/07/16 05:40 PM
3

I completely agree, WR groups should stop advocating against men. That is completely counter-productive, and, to be honest, I didn't realize the extent to which NOW and other major feminist organizations do this.
/r/MensRights06/07/16 05:35 PM
2

Why are feminists so loathe to denounce radfems? That's a good question. I think it's an issue of exposure to the various branches of feminism. For instance, there was massive critique of the anti-male aspects of 2nd Wave feminism that took place in my college classes, which included many men (not a majority, but enough to provide some male perspective, I'd say 60/40). Among the feminists you know and have read, I can't tell you why they won't denounce radfems. Perhaps they see radfems as existi…
/r/MensRights06/07/16 05:29 PM
1

I honestly cannot fathom why i would "hate" that I'm sorry, I didn't mean to project an assumption on to you. There have been other voices in this conversation that seem to have serious differences of opinion regarding basic premises of feminism, so I assumed that many MRA-supporters would just be anti-feminist, in general, even if those feminists were male-positive.
/r/MensRights06/07/16 05:23 PM
1

No the 4th wave is comprised of a younger generation that tend to view things like gender to be optional and migratory. Most of this "data" has been suppressed by these very "academic circles" which you ask feminists and MRAs to unite over Can you support this claim? I'm 33, and I'm in grad school, and I don't experience that undergraduates in my feminist circles view gender to be optional or migratory. There is a general understanding of gender as a social construct, but that started in 3rd Wav…
/r/MensRights06/07/16 05:21 PM
1

I think understanding this issue requires both men and women to see how their lived experiences diverge. For instance, some feminists claim 1. there is a thing called rape culture that predisposes men to rape, and endangers women, and shows up in society in all kinds of ways, and 2. rape culture is all-pervading, and is shared by all men. I disagree with this characterization of "rape culture." I do not think it is all-pervading. I think it exists, yes, because I have experienced its existence -…
/r/MensRights06/07/16 05:17 PM
2

In one post, you mention that women wanted marriage because of social pressure, and that it was a bad deal for them. Then you mention that they have no political power, so therefore they couldn't oppress men? That's a bit of doublethink... right? How is it double-think to suggest that women, having no political power, were pressured into roles and sublimation of identity that they did not want?
/r/MensRights06/07/16 04:58 PM
1

Conscription in various forms has been around since for thousands of years, and since Colonial times in the USA. Yes, I do understand that has been the case. But our discussion was focused on voting rights, and prior to 1940, conscription was not tied to voting rights.
/r/MensRights06/07/16 04:55 PM
1

You said a lot here, and I won't address it all. In general, I think you made some very good points. I think the lack of resources and the general treatment of male victims of rape is appalling. I also think the CDC's policy here is incredibly biased, so I absolutely agree with you. Additionally, the double-standard of consent is also really messed up. Those are major injustices. So at least 25% of all reported rape victims were actually men. This math doesn't make sense to me. You can't add tho…
/r/MensRights06/07/16 04:52 PM
0

Excellent point.
/r/MensRights06/07/16 04:37 PM
5

This is a beautiful statement, and I am very appreciative. I think you're right, that women, and society in general, do not see the traumas endemic in little boys, when they look at adult men. Men deserve much more compassion than they are given by society currently.
/r/MensRights06/07/16 04:35 PM
0

Ok, I get that my statement irritated you. Let's back up. I understand what you're saying, that men have incentives and inculturation to do things that protect and benefit women and children. That makes sense to me. It does seem to me, though, in society, that men do much of the reinforcing and policing of the masculinity and behavior of other men. A masculinity that, according to many comments here, is damaging to men. I mean, it's not women who beat up effeminate gay men for violating gender n…
/r/MensRights06/07/16 04:30 PM
1

One more thing... I have no idea if this will resonate with you at all, and you might just hate it, because it's not anti-feminist, but it's a good example of the breadth of the focus on men's experience and masculinity that is currently happening in academia, within women's studies and gender studies. Just the sheer amount of resources available for men which were not available before, from the American Assembly for Men in Nursing, to father advocacy groups and men's health organizations, I tho…
/r/MensRights06/07/16 11:00 AM
2

Ok, I understand what you're saying. Do you believe, then, that traditional gender roles are better for society than total egalitarianism?
/r/MensRights06/07/16 10:45 AM
1

I will get in touch with Karen Straughn. I've been watching her panel discussions on YouTube. This is what's called the 4th Wave. I would disagree with that. So-called 4th Wave is still hotly contested in academic feminist circles, and while there is a general consensus that it involves technology somehow, it definitely does not mean that 2nd Wave radical feminists on Facebook are somehow 4th Wave just because they're online. male feminist huh... ? Do you think perhaps You may be misinformed now…
/r/MensRights06/07/16 10:43 AM
2

I understand what you're saying, and how those terms would feel insulting or aggravating. I think there's just a big breakdown in communication. I think men don't share their genuine, difficult experiences often, for many reasons, and when they do, they aren't heard as clearly as women are. This might also be partly to blame: I do not know what third wave feminism is Another user posted something similar below. If there's any branch of feminism you might want to understand, as a MR supporter, it…
/r/MensRights06/07/16 10:24 AM
1

Wow, ok. I think I'm seeing a trend here, with your comment and a comment by another user, higher up in the thread. Based on our conversation, I think there might be a basic ignorance of 3rd wave academic feminist theory in the MRM? And I can understand why that might be. Because the feminism of rabid SJWs online is the feminism the everyday person is most likely to see. However, those of us who actually studied feminist theory in an academic setting have been exposed to areas of feminist though…
/r/MensRights06/07/16 10:13 AM
3

Ok, but see, this is what is weird to me. At this point in American history, there was a small, very limited feminist movement. 19th c. feminists wanted the right to vote. They weren't challenging gender roles for the most part, as you seem to suggest they should have. So if the gender roles at the time were so oppressive to men, as you seem to suggest, why didn't men use their near-total dominance of the public sphere to change them? I feel like your argument in your last few replies is that me…
/r/MensRights06/07/16 10:01 AM
2

Ok, I understand what you're saying. And thanks for the article link, that's a good one. So, do you feel that it's simply not true that there is a thing called male privilege that exists? And if so, do you think male privilege has never existed, or do you think that, maybe earlier in the 20th c. it did, but now it doesn't?
/r/MensRights06/07/16 09:47 AM
2

I really appreciate your perspective, and your thoughtful responses to my questions, thank you. Then you know how inevitable it is that all this has to come into the open and be discussed, publicized, scrutinized, and analyzed to the highest degree imaginable before ultimately being passed as law. Do you know what it's going to take to make circumcision illegal, the social hurdles for that alone? I imagine it's going to take a lot. I guess that's why I'm here. I think the MRM needs help from wom…
/r/MensRights06/07/16 09:41 AM
1

Ok.. can you provide me with solid counter-evidence? And tell me why you think the other sources are not valid?
/r/MensRights06/07/16 09:20 AM
2

I won't argue the point about modern times - the scenario you describe is obviously deplorable. With regard to why women would get married, I think the answer is simply, social pressure. You're correct that men (first father, then husband) were burdened with the responsibility for providing for women. At the same time, women were deprived of the freedom to provide for themselves. This is not a good deal for anyone, but there's no evidence to suggest that women truly had other options besides mar…
/r/MensRights06/07/16 09:14 AM
2

One more question, and thank you so much for your responses. You said the crazy laws started coming in after the feminist movement gained some ground. Do you think feminism had (at the time) a legitimate critique of a male-dominated society, and they just over-compensated into female-superiority (basically, went about equal rights in the wrong way), or do you think feminism was always just anti-male, maybe a power-grab, etc.?
/r/MensRights06/07/16 09:03 AM
2

I read your post, and I still disagree that I am guilty of a just-world fallacy. The idea that powerful men aren't ever taken to court for child support, etc., by their equally powerful ex-wives doesn't hold water.
/r/MensRights06/07/16 08:59 AM
2

Thank you, I appreciate your comments as well :) I see what you're saying, about chivalry. The practice of chivalry is confining for women and unjust to men. I disagree that college-aged men reject it because of their "irritation with third-wave feminism" though. I would wager that 90% of college-aged men have no idea what third-wave feminism even is. Also, 3rd wave is by far the most male-positive branch of feminism, with lots of gender theory and focus on lived male experience and the construc…
/r/MensRights06/07/16 08:56 AM
0

Wives were not property they were a responsibility with the husband held legally liable for her upkeep. Can you find an single example of a wife being sold to another husband, which would be possible if she were, as you put it, his property. I would argue that there are different kinds of property, not all of them transactional. A man's hand is his property, but he's not going to sell it under any normal circumstances. That's actually the best analogy for the status of married women through the …
/r/MensRights06/07/16 08:43 AM
2

Because men in power are not the common man, laws do not apply in the same way, as woman are the majority of voters it makes more sense to pander to them than to mra groups that are often seen as crazy sexists. Women were not the majority of voters until 1980. Is it generally felt in MRM circles that laws and society were more just and fair toward men prior to 1980? In other words, are the problems that men are experiencing now problems that have always existed, or are they a modern result of wo…
/r/MensRights06/07/16 08:29 AM
2

I'm asking why men wouldn't behave selfishly, which is kind of the opposite of a just-world fallacy, actually.
/r/MensRights06/07/16 08:26 AM
4

One more comment... you mentioned that you don't believe there is irrefutable evidence of institutionalized male privilege. Understand that I'm not saying women don't also have privilege over men in other areas. But I did provide links in my original post to a selection of solid evidence to suggest that institutionalized male privilege exists. I am open to reading whatever evidence to the contrary you can provide.
/r/MensRights06/07/16 08:22 AM
4

I think we probably do disagree on certain things, which are very difficult to prove beyond a shadow of a doubt, without a major investment in research. I appreciate your comments, however, and I have a few more questions/comments. They didn't get equal suffrage with men until 1928, ten years after universal adult male suffrage, but they voted as women voting as early as 1843. They did not, however, get the the obligation to do national service, which was obligatory for all men at the time. Univ…
/r/MensRights06/07/16 08:18 AM
1

Yes, I can affirm that I have heard the point you're making in other places, too. Men largely still haven't recovered from the Recession, while women have. It's true that men outnumber women in the highest echelons of power. However, those powerful men often cater to the wishes of women and feminists. Why do you think that is? It doesn't make sense to me that men with power would do anything contrary to their own interest. They have children and get divorced and perhaps find themselves in the sa…
/r/MensRights06/07/16 07:53 AM
2

Recommended watching if you have 2 hours to spare and I'll def watch the video, thanks.
/r/MensRights06/07/16 07:36 AM
3

That is an excellent response, thank you so much. Really, I think my last question is just this: Given that modern feminist theory addresses and is concerned with men, masculinity and the ways in which the patriarchy harms men, too, what are the barriers to feminists and MRAs acknowledging all the data on both sides, and working together? Obviously, misogynists and misandrists will not be able to work together, so my question assumes those contingents are not the mainstream of either movement.
/r/MensRights06/07/16 07:35 AM
3

Thank you! Here is my biggest question: Wouldn’t it be more effective for MRAs to address their advocacy and activism directly toward other men, since it’s other men who have the power to change the things they want to change? Why even bother arguing with feminists or countering feminism in any way, if many of the aims of the MRM could be accomplished with only the assistance of other men, because those other men occupy the positions of legislative and judicial power necessary to create the chan…
/r/MensRights06/07/16 07:16 AM
0

Neither did men, men were only even given the vote due to the draft. I appreciate the rest of your comments, thank you. This one, though, is not correct. After the Revolutionary War, land-owning white men all had the right to vote. During the early 1800s, the property requirement was lifted progressively, state by state, until all white males had the right to vote. Universal male suffrage was granted after the Civil War with the 15th Amendment (all men, not just white), but Jim Crow prevented bl…
/r/MensRights06/07/16 06:38 AM
You can kill a man, but you can't kill an idea.

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