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the_bass_saxophone Archive

View 0 posts and 46 comments by the_bass_saxophone on TheRedPill subreddit and various other subreddits related to The Red Pill community.
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1

they desire financial Security&Safety. They're not magic bullets tho. I am well to do and nonthreatening toward women but I lack status. (I invested family money and I'm not very traditionally masculine. I also have some spectrum traits that harm my social viability.)
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates26/02/22 05:15 PM
1

Since most of them compete for few men this feels like such an unquestioned assumption to me, and one that will get you an argument if you question it. not too different from saying "most men compete for a few women."
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates26/02/22 05:11 PM
1

it'd be nice if "ugly" women would consent to fuck "ugly" men, but nothing forced, please.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates26/02/22 05:08 PM
1

well...he did "go to work," had a dog and a truck. he didn't have a freelance WFH gig, a cat and a used Kia. just saying that cultivating a weak online tie is just another way for a socially suitable man to express his suitability. it's nothing in itself that will make an average guy more attractive. (and yes, i do use man and guy intentionally, as one might do if one sees social viability as a function of gender roles. man is top rank, dude slightly below that, guy definitely second class.)
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates26/02/22 05:02 PM
1

Culture is not nature. It's mostly nurture.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates26/02/22 04:54 PM
1

What, does soeciety expect men to suffer in silence about their lack of intimacy and affection? Not just expects it, but insists upon it. The attitude - as in so many other phases of life - is "if the system doesn't work for you, it's not the system, it's you." more men speaking up against the current toxic bubble of modern dating being hypercapitalistic and very very superficial That would be constructive. But it is not often done. Realistically we will do anything to avoid critiquing capitalis…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates26/02/22 04:50 PM
1

so because you personally can overcome social conditioning and eat healthy, everyone can overcome it and do all kinda good stuff, such as think independently. man, isn't it simple.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates10/02/22 03:52 AM
0

Originally, patriarchy is simply defined as a system of society or government in which the father or eldest male is head of the family and descent is traced through the male line. Today however, it could mean anything. You could have quoted a prominent definition of the term that's used or discussed in literature. Instead you kinda fluff it off: I'll define it as oppression of women, because it seems to be the most common use of the word by feminist. See, we have to take your word on that. It al…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates10/02/22 02:45 AM
2

Masculinity and femininity are "things" like a rock. An rock is a rock. It is neither toxic or non-toxic. ah, you fell into the trap. i wasn't asking about masculinity or femininity. i hoped to get your opinion about the effect of socially conditioning people towards certain concepts of gender roles. that conditioning, and of course those concepts, change from era to era. it's my strong belief that they are anything but pure goods, even in their era.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates10/02/22 02:35 AM
1

i think men don't get to talk it out with women as often, and the support expected of them is to silently have a woman's back. you might call it the unemotional side of emotional labor - addressing her feelings without burdening her with your own, or with doubts about your "rockhood." that calls to mind the double bind of having to limit one's sensitivity to protect one's manliness to women, yet having to be stereotyped as insensitive by women.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/02/22 11:52 PM
1

the lack of men not speaking up about men's issues. you should either get rid of "the lack of" or get rid of "not."
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/02/22 11:48 PM
1

taking what you can get, you mean. inevitably, a more "beta" behavior to society than taking what you can take.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/02/22 11:46 PM
4

social competition and producing in a market, to some women, must be what men are "really for." creative or problem-solving work are fine but not...sexy, somehow. and i think this might actually apply regardless of a man's financial security, within a normal range, anyway (ie no superstars or zillionaires).
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/02/22 11:31 PM
1

let me ask you this then: are male and/or female gender role socialization also "only good"? because when we talk in terms of toxicity, we're generally speaking of hurtful social behavior or social norms. no Platonic ideals of manliness or womanliness really are relevant here.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/02/22 11:27 PM
2

I personally feel that the term is not true, and there is no such thing. I just think that there is one term. Masculinity. And all masculinity is good. All of it. if its not good, its not masculinity, right? i'm sorry, that just obligates us to accept a huge range of pernicious behaviors that might come from manly socialization, and say, "sorry, they just don't. and we're under such attack from feminists that you better not tall anyone different." there ain't nothing on god's green earth that's …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/02/22 01:54 AM
23

if you aren't fully comfortable with that language, the assumption is that you don't understand it. What's not allowed is positing any bad faith on the part of radfems, wokies and similar communities. That's why discomfort can't be acknowledged, only parsed as misunderstanding. Another thing in the mix: these communities have in common that they "owe no one an education." Explanation or debate are off the table. But it ought to be obvious that that, right there, is a position of bad faith. And p…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates06/02/22 08:05 PM
7

Why not just jail, mistreat, or kill more potential or possible criminals? That way we don't have to treat anyone any better, and those who run things can continue to run things how they run things.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates03/02/22 06:10 PM
1

"americanitis" at work. the only acceptable positions on any issue are hateful ones, because they drive the most traffic.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates30/01/22 06:26 PM
1

that's an interesting question. i don't think it can be proven, but research could pose questions to a sample group of men and track what kind of answers associate with others.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates18/01/22 09:59 PM
1

As an American man I suspect capitalism, militarism, and neoliberalism are all so deeply conditioned into the idea of what it is to be manly/American that there will always be more women than men open to meaningful change to the system.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates18/01/22 09:41 PM
1

We can analyze patterns of behavior in any population. The issue woman and man get touchy about is what about the outliers?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates18/01/22 09:36 PM
0

That's a definition I like, because it gets past the outdated and pernicious concept of common courtesy. It's fully understandable and human to want to treat people like shit if they don't deliver on your expectations in some small way. Barista hands you the wrong drink? They're just a malfunctioning machine. Bang on them (figuratively). Bus driver surly? Don't just snark at him. Call him some stereotype. Maybe more than one. (Do you see how your comment implies these things?)
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates18/01/22 09:26 PM
1

Even outside of sexuality, masculinity can be dehumanizing, including to oneself or other men. In fact that's a good definition of what's toxic about it: to the degree that it dehumanizes anyone, that's toxic. But the phrase "toxic masculinity" is so loaded it's hard to even discuss any longer.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates18/01/22 09:21 PM
3

Because idpol runs interference for a capitalist system that doesn't want public scrutiny.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates18/01/22 09:14 PM
2

They certainly don't want them studying the humanities or learning how to think critically. So being less educated is a good thing.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates18/01/22 09:10 PM
0

We cant write flawlessly all the time. Because as men, we're fundamentally nonverbal. And if we're not, we're effete cucks. (/s?)
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates18/01/22 09:08 PM
2

That's the beauty of neoliberalism. "Every man for himself" becomes "every group for themselves." The quiet part is that anything that's too good for too many, also takes away privileges and hegemonies, so it can't be tolerated.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates16/01/22 06:05 PM
2

What ought to burn people's bacon is that neoliberalism thrives on people being uneducated about neoliberalism itself. Effectively, how the country runs is nobody's damn business.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates09/01/22 10:55 PM
1

is my comment promoting the myth beyond just the term? (ed: why did i know that question wouldn't get an answer? but of course, one must never educate the ignorant when they ask to be educated. that's playing into their hands. far better to shock indoctrinate when they least expect it.)
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates08/01/22 05:01 PM
2

of course if we're too far out from society's norms we often don't pair up at all. and that's how society wants it. 2 misfits might make a fine couple, but each generates far more social, financial, and other profit from loneliness than they would together. letting such people meet each other's needs, when they haven't even paid their dues in conformity, represents a lost opportunity on both ends.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates08/01/22 02:31 AM
2

Sometimes the hardship that unites us isn't physical or financial or competitive. Sometimes it's social. Sometimes it's subtle. But it is still real. Old school guys are just reading a script if they tell you any different. Oil rigs, drill sergeants and mountain climbs aren't the only challenges worthy of a man. Yes, it is difficult to talk about or feel secure talking about. That right there is hardship enough to pose a challenge. No reason we can't rise above it if we have friends to help. A t…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/01/22 08:24 PM
2

This claim that we are all toxic stoic, mindless drones that need to hug our problems away comes from where exactly ? Its a quick and sloppy response to a system of socialization that wanted to make mindless drones out of men to build and defend the nation, and for the most part, still does it to serve the market economy. One is not good because the other's bad. And yes, fluffing men off with stereotyped feminine responses is bad. For one thing, pets make better cuddle buddies than your male fri…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/01/22 08:15 PM
-1

One of many such problems (and I don't mean to steal focus). The military is a fucked-up institution because it serves a fucked-up institution known as the USA.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/01/22 08:09 PM
-2

Men don't run shit. Having a wiener and a dollar will buy you a cup of coffee. Money and power run damn near everything.* It just so happens that money and power end up mostly in the hands of men with attitudes and prejudices that are traditionally masculine. They are the patriarchy and it is real. There are just damn few patriarchs among us. *(ed: Does anybody here have issues with my criticizing money and power? We are lefties here, are we not?)
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/01/22 08:00 PM
2

my point is that people generally pair up with someone broadly similar to them. at least if they stay paired up. a side point is that people's "standards" aren't necessarily what we think. i like to call them society's standards, as that's mostly what people go by.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/01/22 06:45 PM
1

We probably can't overestimate the hegemony of capitalism over all aspects of first-world heterosexual lives.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/01/22 11:34 AM
1

apply pressure on women to lower their standards and make them more open to pairing up with men who are just average or below. where are all the women who are "just average or below" on whatever scale you might have in mind? am i nuts or did these people used to just sort of find each other? and aren't they still? where i am, i see plenty of couples where both partners appear totally average.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/01/22 11:31 AM
1

But does that also go for the shaming of men approaching women It's worked out great for men who are all about chasing status, success and other social markers. They are forgiven gaffes that would sink the average guy. And so it is that that kind of man becomes less of an extreme and more of a role model for all.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/01/22 11:24 AM
2

Biden isn't a leftist, lol. He's as neoliberal and corporatist as they come. If you think Biden is leftist, on a subreddit explicitly meant for self selefting leftists, I don't know what to tell you. Tell him he's normal, because he is. The average voter has no idea what a neoliberal is, because neither political party wants them to know. That's because US political power operates on a broad neoliberal consensus, but if too many people start to understand what that means, politics as usual will …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/01/22 11:06 AM
1

Then there's the commenter upthread who said changing the word won't change society's attitude, and that nothing will change the attitude because it's millennia old, so even if the attitude is ultimately baseless, its never going away. The sheer abysmal depth of hopelessness among some of these guys is enough to make one wonder if there isn't something real in society's attitude after all.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/01/22 10:46 AM
1

Usually the problems don't start and stop with their relations with women I don't blame women for my loneliness. I actually resent men more than women - not healthy either, but there it is. Call me ASD, call me eccentric, I always thought conventional masculinity was about 2/3 bullshit. Not getting involved in all that aggression, competitiveness and bluff has come at a cost in my life - in relating to other men and to women. My beef with women is that I suspect they'll always just go along with…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/01/22 10:33 AM
1

You said a mouthful there. I personally feel I have aged out of sexual attractiveness - my messin' round years were long ago and for various reasons really didn't lead anywhere. (Why is it all our stories require such tiresome explaining? Is part of our plight just general nonconformity?) So I am, in a sense, a born-again virgin. I despair of the same things you mention.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/01/22 10:23 AM
1

"False consciousness" is a sweetheart of "neo-marxists" (I call them post-marxists) who like to concentrate on identity rather than class. The concept is useful in class terms - particularly so in the US. A blue collar worker who is loyal to the boss that's underpaying and overworking them, or holds reactionary political views about immigrants, education etc., is just as falsely conscious. It might be cloaked as work ethic or some other kind of cultural orientation. But it works the same way.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates06/01/22 08:18 PM
1

and the use of the word market - towards men, women or whomever - really should not be taken in stride, as people usually do. Sex and courtship are already well entangled in the web of capitalist norms, and they are all the more dehumanizing because of that.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates06/01/22 08:14 PM
1

a beautiful, high-value woman damn, i hate that phrase, even used ironically.• "value" in any intrinsic sense should not apply to human beings. what's the value of a human life? and maybe you're not being ironic here. otherwise why would you feel anything when called an incel, other than "this person is a random internet twerp not worth a millisecond of my time"?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates06/01/22 08:08 PM
1

Originally virgin applied only to young girls. That made it both infantilizing and emasculating when used in reference to men - and that was very much the intent. So historically at least, it's as stigmatizing as incel. I like the term volcel meaning voluntary celibate. A lot of so-called incels have really just given up due to cynicism, depression or social handicaps. They are volcels - the effort isn't paying off and they have abandoned it. Volcels can also be people in a serious dry spell who…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates06/01/22 08:01 PM
You can kill a man, but you can't kill an idea.

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