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View 1 post and 48 comments by throwawayoney on TheRedPill subreddit and various other subreddits related to The Red Pill community.
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4

The idea here is that a woman will quickly give up sex to high-SMV "alphas," while forcing low-SMV "betas" to wait and/or exchange resources or commitment for access to sex. Stop right there. The reasons women have sex are complex, and partner choice is just as complex. First off, I wonder how much data corroborates this claim, or if it's just despondent paranoia. Secondly, "Alpha Fucks Beta Bucks" sounds pretty much like "Be attractive. Don't be unattractive." To me. That's true for both men an…
/r/PurplePillDebate29/05/15 02:34 AM
0

Ah, see, this is what my last relationship has taught me: the level of success in a relationship is heavily connected to how much each partner's definitions of happiness overlap. If you're compromising too much, then it's probably time to find somebody else, no? Else you're basically living some degree of the movie Vertigo.
/r/PurplePillDebate29/05/15 02:33 AM
0

I don't think it's the same "be yourself" crap because knowing what you want involves going out there and actually failing at relationships. That's an important step.
/r/PurplePillDebate29/05/15 02:22 AM
1

Granted, this framework doesn't have the specific instructions to unlock a woman's heart, but it does allow for multiple kinds of desires, relationships, gender identities, etc. Cooperative relationships are better than adversarial ones for sure, but the argument I'm making is that the techniques employed by TRP are based in limiting philosophies about gender roles and dating, and that by opening one's mind a bit one's options increase dramatically. What this means about how to get chicks: evolu…
/r/PurplePillDebate29/05/15 02:14 AM
0

No, absolutely not, and I would never say that the science has no basis and can't be used to achieve the kind of relationship wanted. I don't have a problem with telling guys that amassing wealth, strength/beauty, and confidence will help them move closer to their relationship goals. That is absolutely true. Where I think followers of TRP shoot themselves in the foot is the assumption of conflict and scarcity of resources. I think successful relationships are based on mutual trust and respect, w…
/r/PurplePillDebate29/05/15 02:08 AM
0

Idunno, I find it very relieving when new information helps me realize that the problems in my life lack substance so I can get past them, but to each their own.
/r/PurplePillDebate29/05/15 01:54 AM
0

As I said elsewhere in this thread, gender is not a bad place to start, but it's far more effective to become familiar with local attitudes towards relationships, an individual's ideologies and culture, and their own gender identity. They're all far better predictors of behavior than notions based solely in evolutionary psychology. Trying to plan for "traits women are attracted to" is like planning to wear clothes outside without knowing what the weather is like. I think you're right in that thi…
/r/PurplePillDebate29/05/15 01:50 AM
0

It's a lot easier for me to believe that these genders will (for most people) facilitate certain traits and behaviours than it is to believe that every person on earth is a perfect individuum with little to no overlap I think that's not a bad place to start, but it's far more effective to become familiar with local attitudes towards relationships, an individual's ideologies and culture, and their own gender identity. They're all far better predictors of behavior than notions based solely in evol…
/r/PurplePillDebate29/05/15 01:45 AM
-1

That's why it's a skeleton. You're missing the important fundamental differences. TRP is based around manipulation and leverage to achieve one's relationship goals. My framework is based around self-awareness and cooperation. That means, if you know what you want, and you're dating towards what you want, then you're getting into relationships with people who already want what you want. The idea that you need a "strong negotiation position" posits a conflict between what you want and what they wa…
/r/PurplePillDebate29/05/15 01:37 AM
0

go hang out with some queers. They exist, there's proof, I don't know what else you want.
/r/PurplePillDebate29/05/15 01:33 AM
0

No doubt. I don't understand what you're getting at though. Don't bother practicing self awareness? Even if you're young, self-awareness is valuable. Of course you're going to deal with a huge dating population full of people who are stupid and/or unaware. But another way of putting that would just be "knowing what you want reduces your dating pool to a specific set of people, and disregards everybody else." Which is helpful, no?
/r/PurplePillDebate29/05/15 01:30 AM
0

Sex and gender are synonymous: Each sex has a range of expectations (set by culture). Each gender has a range of expectations (set by culture). Funny how that works. No... you're so wrong. Yes, each sex has a range of expectations - and the name for that set of expectations is called gender. We don't have expectations of gender, gender encapsulates our expectations of sex. Don't ever get into programming, you'd be terrible at pointers.
/r/PurplePillDebate29/05/15 01:26 AM
2

If everyone comes to the conclusion that Jim isn't a good partner, I'm guessing it would be too obvious to say that he should look at why and see if he can change as a person? So sexually frustrated Jim over here should just wait until he finds a person who is self aware enough to understand that they can have a good relationship with him instead of using tactics that he regularly observes as effective? I'm having trouble parsing this
/r/PurplePillDebate29/05/15 01:24 AM
-1

Oh. A large body of sociological research and theory. Probably starting with this
/r/PurplePillDebate29/05/15 01:22 AM
-1

Well, the fact is that you can't expect people to be respectful, honest, and know what they want in life. Especially young people. But somebody who wants to incorporate dating into their lives in a healthy way will start with self-awareness. It's not about giving credit, it's about what's intelligent to do. That's what makes it a strategy.
/r/PurplePillDebate29/05/15 12:26 AM
3

Mmmm no... because sex is the word we use for the physical trait. Gender is the word we use for the range of common behaviors that we associate with sex, and our associations are usually as informed by culture as they are sex traits. Either way there's a word for the physical differences between men and women and there's a separate word for the range of expectations (set by culture) that we have for them. Gender is studied in cultural studies, and sex is studied in biological studies. They're di…
/r/PurplePillDebate29/05/15 12:24 AM
0

I believe gender is by definition rooted in physical biology, but like human personality, is incredibly influenced by (cultural and economic) environment, not to mention gene variance, and therefore has fluid characteristics. [Edit] Essentially, I believe that gender is a mere factor in one's personality, one among many with comparable influence. [Edit] And sex is biological while gender is psycho-social.
/r/PurplePillDebate29/05/15 12:09 AM
-2

Oh. My why is that I think some people can't handle cultural changes and so biologically deterministic models are a lot easier to grasp.
/r/PurplePillDebate29/05/15 12:04 AM
0

The why is up to the individual, and the how is covered in #s 1, 2, 4, 5, 7. This is a skeleton framework, so of course explicit game advice and stuff is more fine-grained. This is absolutely a strategy for incorporating romantic relationships into your life in a healthy way. Edit: for example, my whys include love, sex, companionship, stability, and possibly children later on. Why do you need somebody to tell you why you're dating?
/r/PurplePillDebate28/05/15 11:58 PM
0

how so?
/r/PurplePillDebate28/05/15 11:44 PM
0

Because the first step is self-awareness and the meta-game accounts for experience over time. But yeah! essentially!
/r/PurplePillDebate28/05/15 11:26 PM
1

thanks!
/r/PurplePillDebate28/05/15 11:25 PM
1

Well, I flat out disagree with you about a lot of these things, but let's see what you think.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/05/15 10:52 PM
0

Oookay, benefit of the doubt: http://www.medicaldaily.com/nature-vs-nurture-debate-50-year-twin-study-proves-it-takes-two-determine-human-334686 http://www.nytimes.com/2014/12/02/upshot/the-divorce-surge-is-over-but-the-myth-lives-on.html?abt=0002&abg=0
/r/PurplePillDebate28/05/15 10:45 PM
2

Okay here goes. Introduction The primary difference between the following sexual strategy and that of TRP is that it is not based on sexual economics, but establishing romantic relationships. Romantic relationships are characterized by Romantic Love, also known as Limerance in early forms and New Relationship Energy among people who practice non-monogamy. The idea is that sexual needs can be fulfilled through romantic relationships, and that love is fun. The whole thing is based on mutual respec…
/r/PurplePillDebate28/05/15 10:36 PM
1

good for them?
/r/PurplePillDebate28/05/15 10:08 PM
0

It's good that those men can be selective
/r/PurplePillDebate28/05/15 09:51 PM
1

What changes does TRP claim agriculture has caused?
/r/PurplePillDebate28/05/15 09:49 PM
-1

I believe this is a false dichotomy
/r/PurplePillDebate28/05/15 09:46 PM
0

Thank you for the most informative response so far. So, my response to: sexual strategy of men is to fuck lots of women, and the sexual strategy of women is to fuck the most genetically fit male, but if he doesn't support you financially, find another male who will. is that this is part of the fundamental flaw of TRP thinking. It's based on a pre-agricultural mode of human reproduction, which includes less paternal certainty. But since the introduction of agriculture, men have largely controlled…
/r/PurplePillDebate28/05/15 09:43 PM
1

The point about nature vs nurture. Gender is a cultural concept that is informed by common biological sexual differences, but just as personality is as informed by genetics as it is environment, so are gender roles. Gender definitions are often reinforced by the followers of these institutions, sometimes violently. In what eon are you from? One in which female genital mutilation is still a thing. Either party can break off a relationship at any time for any reason. Which is the crux of the probl…
/r/PurplePillDebate28/05/15 09:20 PM
0

Okay, you're either blind or dismissing the two sources presented in there, but that's all on you.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/05/15 09:15 PM
1

When you're saying that the root cause of a problem is that men are naturally inclined to rule, then you're using a gender role as a base for a social theory. But I won't say that he's not advocating for the role as well.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/05/15 09:14 PM
1

I only had to look at the front page of TRP to find evidence to the contrary: I've found many women, not certainly all, but probably a bit over half, believe these are the heads of their social circle, household, or friends. Where this creates a problem is naturally, the male should be the head of the tribe. When it comes to dating and relationships, this mentality of the woman carries over. Instead of a relationship where the man is leading, the woman finds it her job not to follow, but to try …
/r/PurplePillDebate28/05/15 09:05 PM
0

Sure. But some people want to be promiscuous and others want to establish romantic relationships.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/05/15 09:05 PM
0

Don't get too excited, I'm just an asshole on the internet.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/05/15 08:56 PM
0

The meat of it is: Male physiology and female physiology have widely associated psychological characteristics But when we say this, it's descriptive and not prescriptive.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/05/15 08:54 PM
-4

So far the responses have been pretty good so I may do that. I want more challenges though, so I can be more confident before I share.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/05/15 08:47 PM
-1

My theory would be that modern people respond to modern needs and conditions, and are attracted to those traits that are seen useful in whichever conditions one lives in. I would extend my theory to say that class and cultural distinctions play a significant role in what women find attractive in potential mates.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/05/15 08:45 PM
1

https://www.reddit.com/r/PurplePillDebate/comments/37mrpy/cmv_the_underlying_assumptions_of_trp_are_false/cro1hmy
/r/PurplePillDebate28/05/15 08:27 PM
-1

I've been reading TRP, and now I'm watching the documentary. For the record I think the concept of the feminine imperative is fairly paranoid and not very helpful in dating, because it immediately undermines mutual respect, trust, and benefit of the doubt.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/05/15 08:26 PM
1

look elsewhere in thread
/r/PurplePillDebate28/05/15 08:25 PM
2

I'm not gonna disagree with any of that.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/05/15 08:24 PM
-1

Sexual strategy is only based solely on lust if you're choosing to be promiscuous.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/05/15 08:24 PM
-2

Point 1: http://www.medicaldaily.com/nature-vs-nurture-debate-50-year-twin-study-proves-it-takes-two-determine-human-334686 I don't understand your gender question. I think a common TRP view is that women have sex in order to gain commitment, when really most women have sex because they like sex. The institution of marriage started changing in WW2 with women entering the workforce, stalled for a bit in the 50s with the rise of the nuclear family, and changed dramatically with the rise of feminis…
/r/PurplePillDebate28/05/15 08:22 PM
-1

you just copped out
/r/PurplePillDebate28/05/15 08:12 PM
0

The point is that the competitive sexual dynamic that TRP posits, based on traditional gender roles, is fundamentally flawed. Because the focus of dating has shifted from marriage and childrearing towards romantic love, relationships can be based on cooperation instead of manipulation and competition.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/05/15 08:07 PM
-2

on average, men are more likely better at learning and performing a single task at hand, like cycling or navigating directions, whereas women have superior memory and social cognition skills, making them more equipped for multitasking and creating solutions that work for a group. And that goes to support this point: Male physiology and female physiology have widely associated psychological characteristics that may or may not manifest in an individual to varying degrees. However, women can choose…
/r/PurplePillDebate28/05/15 07:58 PM
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