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[–]chasingsnow 42 points43 points44 points 9 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
i remember when i bought my first home. i was young at age 26. the rest of the block was middle aged and older men. they took me under their wing since i didn't know how to care for my lawn and other shit. we'd end up having beers on the sidewalk out front... i remember the first time many guys were together very well.
all they did was talk shit about their wives. one guy saying "i wish she'd just shut up and suck my dick more"
I remember thinking in my blue pill mind....god these guys are so horrible and shallow, they have no romantic appreciation for their wives and seem to have not married for true love...
NOW I LOOK BACK.....and now i get it.....god i was so naive.
[–]mrp_18444 points5 points6 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Its true.
[–]Diam35 16 points17 points18 points 9 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
Keep in mind that old age does not equal virtue. There are plenty of old shitheads out there, don't automatically trust or give credit to someone just because they are old.
[–]jahozafet8 points 9 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link
My dad is old as fuck and he swallows blue pills daily from God. And he's the most condescending asshole I know. To listen to his advice would be to ruin my life.
[–]helpmeiminpainplease8 points9 points10 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
"Women answer questions by not answering the question." - Some random old due at tim hortons.
[–]hollybegin11 points12 points13 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Old men are smart
Wish it could be true. Reality is: No! Not always, far from it...
[+][deleted] 9 years ago* [recovered] (3 children) | Copy Link
Old men [never married] BACHELORS are smart
FTFY
[+][deleted] 9 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
[–]DWShimoda2 points3 points4 points 9 years ago* (1 child) | Copy Link
Or lucky.
Nah... see for the current crop of old bachelors (I'd say guys 50+, maybe even 45+ or 40+ years old) -- well back in the day (the "before time" before Tinder, before "online dating," before the intertubes) there were still enough chicks with few enough options (no "swiping") that pretty much EVERY guy had at least one or two females "latch" onto them and try to dig the claws in... didn't matter how poor, or ugly, or short or otherwise pathetically desperate you were; some land whale would decide you were a "prize."
So, back then (20 to 30+ years ago); to ENTIRELY avoid EVER getting married -- well it wasn't just "luck" -- it required a combination of multiple skills & talents: SPEED, STRENGTH, DEXTERITY & AGILITY,* along with WILLPOWER, INTELLIGENCE and WISDOM.
* Ability to leap over tall buildings in a single bound didn't hurt either -- and mind you, this was before "parkour" was a popular thing you could get "trained" in, or learn from watching YouTube, which didn't exist. (In fact who do you think invented that "parkour" shit? That's right French 'MGTOW' guys getting away from women who were trying to drag their asses to the altar, that's who!)
;=)
[–]mrp_18442 points3 points4 points 9 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Experience is the best teacher.
That's why the lessons are so expensive.
[–]johnnyblorf 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
And as an old-man-in-training, I would say that those old men are not necessarily smart, but experienced.
[–]Indominablesnowplow3 points4 points5 points 9 years ago* (32 children) | Copy Link
I'm new to MGTOW so I hope it's ok I ask a question: The thing is really like the idea behind it.
But a lot of posts seems to be about thrash talking women (like this one which prompted the question) and it seems odd to me that MGTOW - a way of living as men - spends so much time on women? And dedicating resources to being angry with them?
Who cares why they do what they do? Why be so emotionally invested in them?
Edit. Question answered by referral to a post by u/DigitalScetis. If anyone else needs to know the core of this subreddit it's a very detailed post that seems to resonate with the subs subscribers
Link to post: https://www.reddit.com/r/MGTOW/comments/5vo6si/to_those_who_say_i_came_here_to_see_exciting/
[–]MiGTOWing 14 points15 points16 points 9 years ago (12 children) | Copy Link
It seems paradoxical that we talk about women so much. However, the whole discussion of women exists in a context - that of modern society. This is a huge subject that touches upon everything from history to psychology to media to politics.
MGTOW is a new way of life, you don't embark on that without firm foundation for why you are embarking on it. A firm foundation requires years of study and discussion to build.
I honestly think it takes at least 5 years to go from Billy Blue Pill to MGTOW.
[–]Indominablesnowplow2 points3 points4 points 9 years ago (11 children) | Copy Link
Hmm I see what you mean.... But I still just see a discrepancy.
As you point out, it's important to understand the foundation. Completely agree. But not every part of the foundation gets as much scrutiny and visceral emotional attention as the subject of women - and they're only one of the many constituent parts (even though in a binary society they're naturally one the most significant parts). Most importantly there's the difference between understanding and disliking: Why obsess over women when you realize they can be shitty? Why keep posting about them being shitty when you already know it/why have focus be on their wrongdoings when it should be about the political side/men's rights issues/societal structural issues?
I'm sorry to seem so apparently critical. It just seems like womanly behavior to lash out so I'm thinking there must be something I don't get
[–]MiGTOWing 11 points12 points13 points 9 years ago (10 children) | Copy Link
Because there is a constant stream of new MGTOWs and they go through an anger phase.
[–]Indominablesnowplow4 points5 points6 points 9 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link
That of course makes sense...
[–]Matthevv2 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link
The other thing is, gossiping and trash talking others is human nature. Men still succumb to the effects of this as they are human. Generally the older men get the less gossipy they become.
However, just because men can be guilty of this, does not make us calling out women for it hypocritical. This is because despite men participating in it now and then, gossiping is core to a women's nature. Men will prefer most of their conversations be about ideas while women will prefer most of their conversations be about other people. Keyword for both of these is "most".
[–]Indominablesnowplow1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link
But wouldn't it be an ideal to strive to not gossip?
Most of the things being gossiped about could be dealt with and analyzed without resorting to "womanly behaviour"
[–]Matthevv2 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link
Of course. I feel a little dirty every time I catch myself participating in gossip. I am conscious of my actions when I gossip and I actively strive towards stopping this kind of behavior. And that is what separates me from women. Women are not conscious of how their gossiping is a problem and as a result, they are not trying to stop engaging in it.
That all being said, gossiping can be a necessary evil when it comes to spreading platforms like MGTOW. If men aren't shown examples of women's true nature then they are not going to believe in the movement. Men after all tend to base their decisions on logic and evidence based reasoning.
[–]Indominablesnowplow1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
I think I understand what you mean: Gossiping - in that sense - then becomes a form of propaganda to help enlist more men.
But in that case it still feels off since you can't claim superiority when you're doing the same thing as the ones you claim to be superior to. Which makes the propaganda message moot, undercutting the very purpose of propaganda. Even if you're aware and they're not.
Also: there's no worse way of saying "fuck women, I don't care" by dedicating so much energy to the thing (women) you're supposedly not caring about
However I was introduced to a post that explained the dedication
[–]Matthevv2 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
But in that case it still feels off since you can't claim superiority when you're doing the same thing as the ones you claim to be superior to. Even if you're aware and they're not.
Being aware of it does make us superior. Being superior is not a binary notion, there are varying degrees of superiority. A person who gets a 97 on a test was superior to both people who got a 96 or a 52. Men are not so superior that we are without flaws, but we are superior enough to recognize our flaws.
there's no worse way of saying "fuck women, I don't care" by dedicating so much energy to the thing (women) you're supposedly not caring about
Men are fighting their primal instinct to go their own way. It would be near impossible to completely ignore the existence of women and bashing them helps men keep their primal urges at bay. And I really wouldn't consider reading/posting/commenting on a subreddit to be "dedicating so much energy". I spend most of my time on reddit while on public transport, while waiting for something, or in the washroom. I wouldn't really call that a dedication.
[–]Indominablesnowplow2 points 9 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link
We disagree on the first part, but I see your point
I spend most of my time on reddit while on public transport, while waiting for something, or in the washroom
It's impossible to know how much time is spent and in which capacity by each poster and contributor, so I'm just going by the amount of posts regarding women and the emotional intensity the subject of women invokes
[–]Matthevv21 point 9 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link
so I'm just going by the amount of posts regarding women
Are you controlling for the fact that the posts are submitted by different people? Wouldn't that just speak to the size of the community? As in, the more people on this subreddit, the more content gets posted.
the emotional intensity the subject of women invokes
How are you determining emotional intensity through the medium of text?
I would be interested in hearing your reasoning on why you disagree. I hope it isn't just something along the lines of "it just feels wrong" because that is emotion based reasoning and therefore, illogical.
[–]Indominablesnowplow1 point 9 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link
Are you controlling for the fact that the posts are submitted by different people?
7 out of the first 10 posts (selection "hot") is about women. The subscribers upvote what they like and/or are ok to spend their energy on
Words chosen to describe women and experiences women. MGTOW seems to have a - predominanty - normal vernacular
I would be interested in hearing your reasoning on why you disagree
From your statement - and from what I can tell reading other posts at MGTOW - you would probably find my reasoning to be based on "emotion"
[–]TheArtOfTheKek 0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Redpills do have side effects. It fades with time. But many newcomers and redpills ragers are going through lots of adverse side effects currently.
[–]DWShimoda2 points3 points4 points 9 years ago (16 children) | Copy Link
But a lot of posts seems to be about thrash talking women
Because most posts are from people like yourself -- newbies who are shallow and have only a superficial understanding.
Read this: https://www.reddit.com/r/MGTOW/comments/5vo6si/to_those_who_say_i_came_here_to_see_exciting/
[–]Indominablesnowplow1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago* (15 children) | Copy Link
Thank you for linking to that post. It clearly lineates - as so many agree with it - what the sub/movement is about
[–]DWShimoda1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago* (14 children) | Copy Link
Ah ok. Thank you for linking to that post.
It's on the sidebar as the "--> MGTOW HOSPITAL ADVISORY"
It clearly lineates - as so many agree with it - what the sub /movement is about
PLUS...
There actually ARE a LOT of far deeper, more substantive, positive comment conversations that take place here -- which have little or nothing to do with women, but instead are discussions about hobbies, finances, life goals, houses, tools & toys, and on and on.
But the thing is -- those things are very OFTEN sort of "digressions" that take place over several days, even WEEKS and are "buried DEEP" within other (generally by definition "OLDER") threads... threads that have long since been "bumped" off of both the "new" and even the "hot" (aka "front") page of /r/MGTOW.
So the "newbie" or the "superficial" lurker will invariably only see the more recent (shallow) threads and the banal/mundane (snarky) comments.
Much of this simply has to do with the base design of Reddit itself -- as well as the level of mentality of the typical "Redditor" (who have a tendency to upvote very SHALLOW "memes" and snarky one-liner comments -- and to ignore {even downvote} anything that requires more effort; to wit: more than 140 characters? Boo Hiss, TL;DR, etc.).
Long and short of it is, you will get OUT of /r/MGTOW in line with what you put INTO it. If you lurk long enough & dive deep enough to understand (and then "friend/track") WHO the more substantive posting people are -- read THEIR threads and comments -- well you'll see far MORE value.
If by contrast you simply pop in, engage in "low effort" scanning down the "hot" (and/or "new") page thread titles -- you'll end up with the exact sort of (shallow/superficial) impression that you initially did... that the subreddit itself is shallow AND superficial (and "obsessed" with women).
It's akin to looking at the default front page of Reddit -- and concluding that the whole thing seems to be nothing but photos/videos of people's cats, and a smattering of ridiculously stupid animal "meme" pictures.
[–]Indominablesnowplow0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (13 children) | Copy Link
Thanks for going into detail and providing an entryway.
From reading that post + comments you linked to - which seemed accepted as "truth" - I can see this subreddit/way of thinking probably isn't for me. But it can never hurt to learn and broaden horizons and I will absolutely read more and try to understand it better
[–]DWShimoda2 points3 points4 points 9 years ago* (12 children) | Copy Link
Well IF you're NOT interested in learning how to live life without women at the core of it -- i.e. as a permanent, voluntary "confirmed lifelong bachelor" -- which (make no mistake) has a cost or "price to pay" in it's own fashion...
And instead your idea of a "successful life" is still that dream/desire for the "romantic-soul-mate-blue-pill" fantasy of perfect wife & 2.5 kids (plus a dog & a white picket fence McMansion in the burbs)...
At least not yet.
But -- after that "fantasy/dream" turns into a nightmare -- well then it may very well be the only thing between you and suicide. -- that is of course, assuming it's still in existence (and hasn't been censored because: "misogyny").
Again, as that post describes: this often isn't a "pretty" place -- much like a local hospital Emergency Room isn't a "pretty" place (and is no place for anyone who is "squeamish" about or who faints at the sight of "blood" and "exposed wounds" etc) -- but also understand that "banishing" it (or complaining that it SHOULDN'T exist), well try that claim about the local ER sometime. (And consider what the alternative would be to no such place ... just do what instead? Tell the wounded and bleeding to "be of good cheer"? Or maybe take the wounded out to some local ditch and cover them up so you don't HAVE to look, bury them quickly {even if still half-alive} just so that YOU won't have to bear the thought that there might be "blood" somewhere?)
[–]Indominablesnowplow0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (11 children) | Copy Link
You don't see anything inbetween (edit: or outside) the two "extremes"?
I don't subscribe to "romantic-soul-mate-blue-pill" but like women
[–]DWShimoda2 points3 points4 points 9 years ago* (4 children) | Copy Link
You don't see anything inbetween (edit: or outside) the two "extremes"? I don't subscribe to "romantic-soul-mate-blue-pill" but like women
It's not a matter of liking or not liking women... its a matter of TRUST. Whether you are willing to place your entire future (and all, or the vast majority of, the fruits of your labor over the years, both before during, and for probably many years after some "marriage" {or baby-mommyhood}) at risk of being transferred TO a woman... a woman who may very well not only NOT "love" you nor "like" you, but may in fact hate & despise you.
If you are unaware that THAT can happen, then you haven't been paying attention, are ignorant in the extreme, and beyond all hope. Go live in blissful ignorance for as long as you can. (Who knows, maybe you'll get "lucky" and find a good/unicorn woman; maybe you should buy a lottery ticket too, because these days your odds of winning the "Big Money" prize is probably HIGHER there.)
If you ARE aware but believe that somehow "LOOOOVE" will triumph, then -- whether you admit it or not -- you DO in fact subscribe to "romantic-soul-mate-blue-pill" script. (And you're probably a sucker for "love songs"; have a whole collection you dance around to... go put them on and GTFO of /r/MGTOW .)
If you ARE aware and you understand the "LOOOVE" bullshit is bullshit; but believe that your uber "AlphaAlpha-ness" (you're more "Alpha" than Brad Pitt!) and physique (Lift Bro!) and "Hodling Frame/Dread Game" will somehow PREVENT a woman from taking your crap & divorce-raping your ass -- then you are a "Red-Pilled" IDIOT (aka Stupid Is As Stupid Does.)
[–]Skaskunski-1 points0 points1 point 9 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
Wow,can't believe you don't have 100upvotes already.Spot on dude.
[–]DWShimoda1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
Most people don't read this far down in a day-old thread.
[–]Skaskunski1 point 9 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link
Too bad,your post says it all, the whole enchilada of reasons to be here.99 more up votes from me then. Thanks for the honesty given.Gooday.
[–]DWShimoda3 points 9 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link
It's just recognizing reality for what it is.
-- The vast majority of subscribers here (just like elsewhere on Reddit) have a preference for relatively shallow content that can be consumed with little effort -- "meme" pictures, snarky/jokey posts, etc -- and they also tend to only quickly "scan" through the first/front "hot" and occasionally the "new" page threads.
-- Longer posts, as well as back and forth in depth comments -- basically anything that requires any significant effort -- well the more effort required to consume it, the fewer who are likely read it.
-- Those -- like yourself -- who put in a bit more effort to read further down, or return to older threads ... well you reap the rewards.
And IMO that's not only the way it is... but basically as it should be.
Cheers!
[–]eltonl0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link
Then redpill may be better for you
[–]Indominablesnowplow0 points1 point2 points 9 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
Any reason as to why you think this?
[–]Skayruss1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
Red Pill is essentially re plugging yourself into the Matrix to manipulate it. So getting laid via game while not being a supplicant to females.
MGTOW and TRP have some differences and they trash each other for it.
I believe that both are two sides of the same coin and mastery of both is truly the best possible scenario. If you're Chad, that is.
Using game to manipulate the system, and HAVING the skills, while going your own way and not bowing for anyone.
But I'm also about 7 months into my journey, so I don't really know shit. Just my goal.
Thats very interesting. So MGTOW feels the The Red Pill guys don't really get it?
Who's Chad? A generic person?
This is a little personal, so feel free to not answer: what prompted you to start your journey?
[–]Skayruss1 point 9 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link
Chad is the stereotypical frat boy who's outrageously extroverted, attractive, and bangs sluts.
They get key issues but disagree.
As for my journey, it's a personal one.
That makes sense (sans the slut part on my behalf).
Good luck/enjoy with your journey to come
[–]toerrisbadsyntax-1 points0 points1 point 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
For being f1 drivers, they sure talk about safety alot
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[–]chasingsnow 42 points43 points44 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]mrp_18444 points5 points6 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]Diam35 16 points17 points18 points (2 children) | Copy Link
[–]jahozafet8 points [recovered] | Copy Link
[–]helpmeiminpainplease8 points9 points10 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]hollybegin11 points12 points13 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[+][deleted] [recovered] (3 children) | Copy Link
FTFY
[+][deleted] (2 children) | Copy Link
[deleted]
[–]DWShimoda2 points3 points4 points (1 child) | Copy Link
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