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OGBoglord Archive

View 9 posts and 509 comments by OGBoglord on TheRedPill subreddit and various other subreddits related to The Red Pill community.
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3

Men aren't going to commit some mass exodus, in no small part because most actually care deeply about the women in their lives, as most women care for their men. This is a big reason why MGTOW and 4B are only limited to relatively tiny corners of the internet and fail to gain serious traction with the general populace - at the end of the day, most men and women want to commune with each other. Also, misandry isn't limited to women - its baked into the normative frameworks of gender that both men…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/07/26 11:58 PM
3

No, they're the side that supports policies that actually do kill men.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates18/07/26 08:27 PM
18

The Right/Republicans only pretend to be friends with ingroup men. Immigrant men, Muslim men, gay men, Black men, queer men, etc. are all viewed as existential threats and are obsessively demonized.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates18/07/26 12:48 AM
13

Men in war are also raped (e.g. Palestinian men) and forcefully displaced, all while being regarded as enemy combatants before they even reach their teens. That said, I'm not actually interested in the question of 'which gender is most impacted by wars' as it is entirely subjective.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates17/07/26 01:55 PM
-4

You misunderstand, I have no issue with those who wish to preserve the association of the term 'Red Pill' with Cassie Jaye's documentary - what I'm saying is that most of the people online who identify as Red Pill are following an ideology that is antithetical to Cassie's values. You don't have to call them Red Pill if you don't want to, but let's be honest about what they represent, and how numerous & widespread they are.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates23/06/26 06:34 PM
-5

But feminists WANT us believe that Manosphere, Red Pill, incel, these things all equal “racism, right wing ideology, and misogyny.” There is a touch of those things mixed in. While I agree that the nuances within and between these communities are usually blurred, to say that there is only a "touch" of bigotry within them is disingenuous. The Red Pill for example has expanded far beyond its origins and is now primarily a gender-essentialist ideology with countless evangelists online. Its one thin…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates23/06/26 06:14 PM
14

Murder, as horrible as it is, is a relatively rare form of violence. The most common forms of violence (such as IPV, sexual violence and child abuse) are largely bi-directional (i.e. committed by men and women at similar rates). So if you're actually interested in mitigating violence, which includes murder, then your policy measures should mostly be gender-neutral. P.S. Its worth noting that in some communities, intimate partner homicide is also largely bi-directional.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates11/05/26 05:57 PM
1

Whether or not someone is against mass deportation in spirit, by voting for Trump they effectively have supported mass deportation, as well as MAGA. Besides, the pushback against ICE from the non-MAGA right is negligible at best.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates11/05/26 03:27 PM
3

I think we're referring two different, albeit correlated, things: MAGA's rise as a political movement that has subsumed the identity of the American right, and Trump's presidential victory. I don't think its fair to say that the reason Trump was able to inspire cult-like devotion, despite failing to deliver on most of his promises and being a member of the pedophile elite that the right claims to oppose, is because the left alienated men. I do think its fair to lay a lot of the blame on Feminist…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates09/05/26 09:16 PM
16

I think this minimizes the agency of MAGA/the "manosphere," and the divisiveness inherent to their ideologies. If feminist misandry leads you to support ICE raids and restrictions on trans rights, that says something about your own biases. And if you listen to MAGA republicans, a lot of their rhetoric actually echoes that of radical feminists (or vice versa). "Men need to protect women," "porn is ruining young men," "Muslim men are brutes and rapists."
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates09/05/26 10:23 AM
3

The majority of sexual assault cases don't involve physical force.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/05/26 07:40 PM
17

The NSVRC uses CDC data. Quoted from your link: "Made to penetrate (completed or attempted): 7.1% (1 in 14 men). The majority of this group (almost 80%)%3A7.1%25%20(1%20in%2014%20men).The%20majority%20of%20this%20group%20(almost%2080%25)%20reported%20the%20perpetrator%20as%20being%20female) reported the perpetrator as being female."
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates01/05/26 08:41 PM
3

then we are better off focusing on our own problems and leaving the rest of the world to mind its own affairs A man is not only a man - he also has a race, nationality, sexual orientation, etc. The world is experiencing a rampant surge of anti-minority sentiment right now. If misandry justifies me limiting my concerns to those of men, why shouldn't racism justify me limiting my concerns further to those of Black men? Its politics by division and modern idpol has already demonstrated it's destruc…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/04/26 09:14 PM
5

while feminists freely commit horrible, manipulative and sexist acts is ludicrous and self destructive. This is precisely why its so important to remain principled - society needs a truly egalitarian movement, not more hypocrites to add to the pile. One needn't be inflexible in order to be principled.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/04/26 06:10 PM
3

I could go on, but I think that I've made my point. Outside of optics and the normal need to ensure we don't slip into misogyny, we have zero need to be better than them, because we have surpassed feminists in morality long ago. Being 'better' in this context just means being principled. If we undermine or abandon our egalitarian principles, then we lose our ethical foundation, which is what separates us from the reactionaries. Its not about being 'better' than Feminists - its about not allowing…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/04/26 01:07 AM
1

A mainstay of Feminist discourse, both in pop culture and academia, is that men employ sexual aggression as a tool to dominate women. This idea has become so prevalent and exaggerated within Feminist spaces to the point where they had no trouble believing that over 60 million men joined a "How to Rape" academy online - even major new outlets reported this easily disprovable lie. Considering that the vast majority of Feminists are women, its little surprise that so many would be inclined to perce…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates26/04/26 02:52 PM
2

Again, that doesn't explain the disparity. It didn't just shift on both ends, it shifted in opposite directions - "toxic masculinity" doesn't explain that. I agree that this is a complex issue, which is why I don't believe Feminism is the sole cause for the disparity; I have plenty of reason to suspect that its a significant contributing factor, however.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates26/04/26 01:32 PM
2

You're not engaging with the text. Even if your assertion were correct, that "toxic masculinity" has risen since 1984, that wouldn't explain why women subscribe to it more than men, or why men subscribe to it less than they did in 1984.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates26/04/26 12:42 PM
2

That doesn't at all explain why the 2019 female participants would be more likely to attribute encouragement and pleasure to the male victims than both the 2019 male participants as well as the 1984 female participants. Do you think women subscribe to "toxic masculinity" more than men? More than women did in 1984?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates26/04/26 02:36 AM
7

Misandry has lead to the death of countless outgroup men via institutional and social persecution. We only just witnessed pro-Israel supporters generalize Palestinian men as violent rapists in order to justify their decimation. Regardless, death shouldn't be the bar for determining whether misandry is tolerable.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/04/26 04:02 AM
7

Feminism, at its core, is founded on axioms that don't necessarily comport with reality, and often sharply contrast it. For example, all iterations of Feminism assert that patriarchy will marginalize all demographics of women to a higher degree than their male counterparts; this assertion is based on the false premise that all men - even dehumanized men - inherit patriarchal privileges which grant them systemic power over their female peers. So when evidence comes to light that contradicts this …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates23/04/26 06:38 PM
3

Unfortunately, he hasn't authored any books that I'm aware of, yet. If you're interested in getting into Black Male Studies though, I can link you to some research articles written by BMS scholars: https://journals.sagepub.com/doi/10.1177/01914537261425917 https://substack.com/@mironjclaygilmore/p-191666675?utm_source=profile&utm_medium=reader2 https://www.tandfonline.com/doi/full/10.1080/13642987.2024.2382779
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates30/03/26 03:42 PM
3

No disrespect intended, but can we try to condense our responses? This is quite long and I don't have time to meaningful address most of the arguments. I appreciate the thoughtful reply, nevertheless. So the “institutional power” is not necessarily linked to men as a gender, it’s linked to “male gender role”. And men exhibiting more female gender role traits often face ridicule and mockery. So the real axis in a patriarchy is not “men oppressing women”, but the male gender role being valued over…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates29/03/26 08:15 PM
36

In this essay, Black Male Studies scholar Reny Taylor argues that dominant Feminist frameworks (or 'feminist metaphysics', as he refers to them) are guilty of consistently misrepresenting black boys'/men's experiences of sexual abuse. Prominent Feminist thinkers, such as bell hooks, frame black male sexuality primarily through the lens of hypermasculinity and dominance, which means that even when black boys are victims of sexual coercion, their victimization tends to be explained away as an expr…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates29/03/26 05:35 PM
5

These issues matter to me and I find it disappointing that parts of the feminist movement can be dismissive of them or even openly hostile toward men. It isn't simply "parts" of feminism that are dismissive though - the problem is fundamental. To quote myself: "The potentially irresolvable conflict between male advocacy and Feminism is that Intersectional Feminist theory positions men as ontological oppressors, with women as their ontological victims. Within this framework, men can only ever suf…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates29/03/26 11:45 AM
1

But that doesn't make the contemporary use of "black fatigue" racist or stupid. It's a tad different to have a .0001% of white men be serial killers and assassins and then point a finger at all white men. Or when the vast majority of men aren't violent but feminists insist on calling all men violent and "toxic." But when you have large-scale repeated behaviors among blacks that are showing up incontrovertibly on countless videos and yet being swept under the lumpy carpet of anti-racism as if it …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates25/09/25 05:55 PM
1

I take it you didn't even listen to any of those black people who "hate black people" for applying self-criticism of their own community... which makes my point: no criticism is to be tolerated. None of them hate themselves. They're making a genuine effort to curtail tendencies they'd rather not see be as widespread among black people specifically. None of them said that "all black people" yada yada. None of them said "most black people." All of them issued the criticism while living as, with, a…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates25/09/25 05:55 PM
1

Well, that took a wrong turn fast. Are you asserting that any of those I quoted are black white supremacists? XD None of them are. At least one is on the Right (which is not equivalent to white supremacist even if it's fairly deluded to support Trump), but the rest are likely liberals. I didn't say they were. My point is that even black people can harbor anti-black sentiment, so pointing to some black people who agree with your position on 'black fatigue' does nothing to contradict my argument t…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/09/25 06:35 PM
1

You understand that black people can be white supremacists, yes? That even a black person can believe that black culture is inferior to white culture? As comparatively rare as black Nazis are, they do exist (e.g. Kanye). The misappropriated usage of 'black fatigue' is racist because it directs negative sentiment toward an entire race or racial culture based on the actions of a minority; the fact that some black people also express 'fatigue' with the black race doesn't make it any less racist. Sh…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates23/09/25 12:45 AM
1

'Black fatigue' was originally used to describe the chronic exhaustion black communities endure from systemic racism - what you're referring to is its misappropriated usage which blames general anti-black sentiment on degenerate black culture/people. “Black fatigue” is not hate against blacks but inevitable disappointment/resentment w far-too-common misbehavior- like an overstayed welcome or social capital that gets spent poorly- which can’t genuinely be attributed to anti-black racism and has e…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates21/09/25 06:37 AM
4

Its important for people, men and women, to understand that they don't need romantic relationships to achieve self-actualization, but MGTOW isn't about self-actualization and never has been - separation from women has always been the focus. I empathize with men who resort to MGTOW, but I think its a maladaptive response. Its a lifestyle that one usually adopts out of despair, cynicism, spite, or some combination of the three. If you've found a MGTOW group that doesn't forsake all relationships w…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates19/09/25 03:08 AM
0

It’s not about being “against” anyone, but about encouraging men to go their own way instead of feeling boxed into roles they never chose. This reminds me of the "Feminism is just about equality" refrain - it isn't at all true in practice. MGTOW communities are, by and large, bitterly obsessed with women, and should be the last place a man goes to if they want to be happily single. Learning to love and value yourself beyond your relation to romance and/or sex is a noble goal, but you don't have …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates18/09/25 11:09 PM
12

No, negative prejudices about men are not inherently misogynistic, though they are usually coupled with misogyny - they are, however, inherently misandrist. For example, one can believe that young men are extremely violent without having any particular opinions regarding women's capacity for violence.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates16/09/25 08:59 PM
5

The OP isn't denying the phenomena, they're criticizing how its used to generalize male behavior and explain away gender disparities: "Even masculine-coded reasons for wanting to suppress your emotions, like not wanting to be seen as weak, are not necessarily because of masculinity." One particularly egregious example I've noticed is that Feminists will often claim that the gender disparity in academic attainment is because 'toxic masculinity' keeps boys and men from wanting to enter into predom…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates10/09/25 09:50 PM
3

Bell Hooks *is* terribly misandrist - much of her work on black men is rooted in provably false and bigoted racial stereotypes. She pushed the idea that black men brutalize black women as a means to compensate for their lack of patriarchal power, an idea that pervades feminist theory to this day.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/08/25 10:38 PM
8

I criticize Feminists all the time for exactly this sort of thing - my comment history will attest to that. Its unacceptable in both cases.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates16/06/25 11:15 PM
9

They are all one-sided because they're coming from one-side of the gender spectrum, and only include perceived advantages; if a woman made a list of all the advantages that men have, yet ignored all the disadvantages, we would rightly call them out for their sexism and dishonest framing.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates16/06/25 09:29 PM
4

Can we please not do this? You're not only conflating women with Feminists (much as Feminists conflate men with Patriarchy) you're presenting a one-sided, biased account of women's gendered experiences (much as Feminists do when highlighting male privilege). You're letting Feminism shape your political engagement by adopting their hypocrisy as your own.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates16/06/25 09:06 PM
0

You're missing the point - inquiring on what someone is doing to help with 'x' isn't a problem, its doing so in an accusatory, bad faith manner. For example: Since you supposedly have an interest in male advocacy, what have YOU done for men's mental health this month? What programs are you apart of? What charities have you joined? How much did you donate this week? Do you see? I'm not asking out of curiosity - I'm attempting to bait you. Again, make all the assumptions you want. I’ve been nothin…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates12/06/25 11:33 PM
0

It was obviously accusatory, which I suspect you realize. If I ask you "what have you done for Palestine lately?" I'm obviously presupposing that you aren't doing anything - it isn't a genuine inquiry. I doubt you were ever looking for a male advocacy sub with sincere interest, but I'll humor you and pretend that you were: if this sub is 'misogynistic' to you then you likely won't find any subreddit suitable so long as it challenges Feminist theory.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates12/06/25 11:01 PM
0

It isn't a question that was presented in good faith - challenging the sexist preconceptions that pervade our society is the primary focus of the sub, which would be obvious to anyone who took just two minutes to browse, and is an incredibly important aspect of male advocacy. Is challenging the sexist nature of male conscription just a disguise for misogyny? Is highlighting the systemic ignoring of black men in politics just a disguise for misogyny? The fact that you think this sub not only hate…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates12/06/25 10:35 PM
20

I am also aware that men are the most at risk from (male) violence They are also the most at risk from female violence, particularly as children. The data allowed the researchers to determine the most common filicide scenarios. A father killing a son was the most likely (29.5 percent of cases), a mother killing a son (22.1 percent) follows. A mother was slightly more likely to kill a daughter (19.7 percent of cases) than a father was (18.1 percent). The rarest instances were stepmothers killing …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates06/06/25 07:33 PM
6

Men are just people who are less oppressed by the patriarchy (non-white men and gay men are more oppressed than the average white guy but still less oppressed than children and women). Do you believe that non-white men being the primary targets of institutional violence constitutes "male privilege"? Do you believe that gay men being the primary targets of homophobic violence constitutes "male privilege"? I posted this the other day: The Systematic Ignoring of Black Men by Elected Officials. This…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates05/06/25 11:14 PM
32

Black men are not only among the most politically marginalized across all race/gender groups, but also... The gap in economic mobility between White and Black people is driven almost entirely by Black men Black boys consistently have the lowest high school graduation rates among all race and gender groups Black men have the highest unemployment rates of any race/gender group, and the lowest labor force participation and employment rates among men Civic engagement, economic mobility, educational …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates01/06/25 01:33 AM
2

"Removing" an ideological movement is a losing battle - the best way to undermine bad ideas is to challenge them with good ideas. The bad ideas that allow those feminists to legislate gender roles are not unique to feminism.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates20/05/25 06:57 PM
1

Gender roles are able to be legislated because constituents largely subscribe to them - you can try to fight legislation, but if public opinion is against you then you can only progress so far. Conservatives are arguably in a far more entrenched position of political power and they push gender norms with religious fervor, so "getting rid" of Feminists will only do so much to secure the legal front.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates20/05/25 06:42 PM
2

When gender roles are legislated its because a significant portion of society already subscribes to them. The male gender norms that many Feminists push are also being pushed by non-Feminists, so "getting rid" of Feminists doesn't tackle the core issue: sexist ideals that pervade all corners of society.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates20/05/25 06:25 PM
6

So capitalism, imperialism, xenophobia, traditional gender norms (all of which negatively impact men in particular ways) would end without Feminism? Of course not - these oppressive forces long predate Feminism. While Feminism tends to harness these forces as political tools (e.g. reinforcing male gender norms insofar as they advantage women, reinforcing xenophobic stereotypes about marginalized males), it isn't where they originate, and they don't need it to propagate.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates20/05/25 04:43 PM
1

"Relatively" is the key word there. Many on the right gladly embrace racial & sexual minorities who evangelize right wing politics, so long as they don't make a habit of discussing their experiences as minorities. The caveat to being a right wing minority is that your political "allies" will ensure that your out-group, by and large, remains in the margins - your divergent traits may be tolerated, but they're what keep you from being fully accepted into their society. If a show or movie displays …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates20/05/25 03:35 AM
2

You have to include the whole tweet homie. Yeah, I agree you can make that assumption if you take that quote out of context. Here's the full tweet for analysis. The full tweet does nothing to invalidate this interpretation, quite the opposite. That's not what the whole tweet implies. Also I don't know how often you speak to black people but "owning women" is used often in a particular way. Sure, misogynistic and objectifiable, but it doesn't usually mean absolute control. Sorry to explain that i…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates22/04/25 04:14 PM
4

But framing does matter, especially in this instance - its vital for understanding how she, and other Feminists, conceptualize male victimization: as a byproduct of women's victimization. "No one sees boys as victims because men are taught that owning women (no matter their age) makes them a man." This implies that when boys are raped by adult women, its a consequence of the boys' misogynistic conditioning; if only women weren't objectified, then we'd finally be able to see boys as victims of ra…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates22/04/25 01:49 PM
2

What if the "Marxist" thing to do is to join the managerial class in order to gain necessary capital? What if the "libertarian" thing to do is to suppress anti-American speech? I'm sure we can agree that a movement can act in contradiction to their supposed principles.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates14/04/25 11:21 PM
3

The progressives have made positive forward progress though - what liberation initiative hasn't had overwhelming progressive support? From pro-Palestine, to pro women's rights, to pro gay marriage. Even some of the most popular male-advocacy campaigns are championed by Feminist-critical progressives. Can progressives make an arbitrary claim about who is oppressed? Sure, but so can anyone. Or they could make unsubstantiated claims about who isn't oppressed, as the right so often does. That said, …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates14/04/25 11:05 PM
-2

Liberals have historically only pushed egalitarian policies after consistent and heavy pressure from progressives, and even then their "support" for marginalized groups only goes so far. Liberalism has served as a gateway for racialized groups to be exploited by the forces of capitalism. But if you interpret Progressivism as authoritarian then that's your prerogative, but I disagree - that doesn't at all reflect in its underlying principles, as I've understood them. Now Intersectional idpol is a…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates14/04/25 09:22 PM
1

That's incredibly ironic when you are criticizing an ideology that you claim is saying "every man is oppressive". And no, it does not minimize the systemic nature of the problem. What it does is it protects you from falling into fallacies when you critique these issue. It would be ironic if I was saying that every Feminist is x, or Feminists are generally y - I've made it abundantly clear that I'm talking about the ideology, not its adherents. I have no issue with Feminists saying that "patriarc…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates14/04/25 09:09 PM
-1

I agree, but that hasn't always been a facet of Progressive politics. Progressive politics has historically opposed people being judged based on characteristics, which is in large part why I have the liberties that I enjoy today despite being a racial minority.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates14/04/25 09:00 PM
0

Identarian in what sense? If you mean by actively opposing racism, homophobia, and other forms of bigotry then yeah I'd agree, and that's a good thing. Intersectional idpol isn't core to Progressive ideology, but egalitarianism is.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates14/04/25 08:37 PM
15

Are you on twitter/x? Its pretty common. Here's a tweet from a Feminist responding to a man who was raped by a 22 year old when he was 14: https://x.com/xm_muva/status/1728395126005702739 She freely acknowledges that the man was raped, but frames it as consequence of men's misogyny. While this isn't precisely the argument I'm referring to, it speaks to a new angle of approach: instead of outright denying that women rape men, acknowledge it (but only when it becomes a viral topic) and place the b…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates14/04/25 08:32 PM
1

The point is that you cannot use an individuals ideology as something that applies to the rest of a broader movement, ideology, or group. I'm not referring to individuals, you are. The forces I'm addressing aren't single institutions or ideological factions, I'm talking about the broader ideology. Patriarchy theory is core to the main political body of Feminism, and even though there are a variety of different conclusions that this body produces, the theory itself situates men as an oppressive c…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates14/04/25 08:17 PM
12

I'm basing this on general sentiments I see when I engage in Feminist spaces, but I'm sure there are youtube videos and articles that are pushing this narrative too. Next time you see a story go viral about a woman sexually violating a man, pay close attention to how they respond, particularly where they lay the blame.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates14/04/25 07:41 PM
3

All of the above as it encompasses a broad range of core principals and values, including egalitarianism Praxis and theory are distinct concepts, what you're referring to is praxis.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates14/04/25 07:24 PM
0

My comment length was too long lol sorry. Ultimately, I would like to just focus on this point because my initial argument does imply that we shouldn't overgeneralize the red-pill and manosphere movements either. It seems then that any criticism about a movement, organization, ideology, etc. would qualify as an overgeneralization so long as any exceptions to the criticism exist, no matter how tiny in comparison. I'm sure that there are some Feminist factions who don't subscribe to patriarchy the…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates14/04/25 07:11 PM
5

They aren't equally left wing because they don't align with leftist ideology - they're contradicting it. Expecting men to self-sacrifice for women, to disregard their own vulnerabilities, is in line with right wing ideology and its core principles. If the majority of Marxists came to believe that the poor should uplift themselves by trying to become millionaires, that wouldn't be a reflection of Marxist ideology - that group would be in stark opposition to the fundamental principles of Marxism.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates14/04/25 06:01 PM
1

Many academics within men's studies focus on these issues. I'd recommend getting into men's studies to actually be more informed about how feminist theory is evolving. Misandry and Emptiness is a great read. It doesn't seem that these authors are even Feminists, but let's assume that they are for the sake of argument: the ideas expressed in this paper do not at all reflect general Feminist thought, which the paper itself seems to recognize. (It does seem like an interesting read though, so I tha…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates14/04/25 05:44 PM
1

These critiques are laid out better in the paper and give you an analysis of literature that are opponents of patriarchy theory. Not a huge fan of the paper's argument but it at least refutes your idea that patriarchy is "hard-coded" The few Feminists who opposed patriarchy theory in 1999 (the date your cited paper was published) does not reflect the main political body of Feminism as it exists today. Outside of feminism, what schools of thought don't regard gender as a class? "Protected classes…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates14/04/25 05:44 PM
51

The narrative is shifting from "its other men who rape men" to "yes women rape men too, but its relatively rare and only happens because other men condone it." Of course this ignores that the vast majority of women (and men) don't even consider being made-to-penetrate as a form of rape, and even in the US its an emerging concept.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates14/04/25 04:20 PM
1

Second, certain schools of feminism are conservative in nature. Not every feminist subscribes to the same philosophy and so certain understandings of our reality may be more traditional/reductive than others. Again, you cannot generalize this group as a whole. Which schools of feminism don't subscribe to patriarchy theory? Which schools don't regard gender as a class, and men of all classes as inheritors of patriarchal privilege? Which schools recognize the particular patterns of violence endure…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates14/04/25 02:59 PM
9

While I disagree with the OP, Bell Hooks is a pretty bad example of a Feminist who isn't misandrist. She's notorious for reinforcing false and bigoted stereotypes about black men.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates14/04/25 12:21 PM
7

If you agree with the second statement, then its hard to argue against the second - they're mostly expressing the same sentiments. If Feminism shares right-wing values, then it is, in some respect, right wing. Unlike Feminism, progressive politics aren't inherently sexist - you can be progressive without viewing all men as members of an oppressive class.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates14/04/25 12:14 PM
1

It's a society in which the model authority is a man and the majority of men are expected to be social authorities, whereas women are expected to be ultimately subservient, however subconsciously. There are expectations for how society should be, and then there is the reality of how society is - the expectation for patriarchal authority is not the same as actually possessing that authority. My point is that arguing for traditional gender roles is absolutely patriarchal and I have no idea how tha…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates14/04/25 02:58 AM
5

I've never looked at it that way before but I think you've hit the bullseye.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates01/04/25 12:11 AM
5

Yes, the claim that there were mass rapes as a systemic and premeditated strategy of attack by Hamas, but also the caricature of Palestinian men as rapists that persisted in the following months.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates31/03/25 03:15 AM
11

I think the claims of mass rape by Palestinian men is a particularly egregious example, especially considering that it was used to justify their extermination. These very same men would later be raped, sodomized, and paraded about naked by the IDF. False rape allegations of racialized men have long been used to justify violence and genocide.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates31/03/25 02:55 AM
10

Please cite these studies that supposedly prove that men are losing interest in female-dominated fields because they perceive them as feminine. I hear this narrative pushed so often (by Feminists, naturally) yet never do I see actual surveys to support it. Who is actually asking these men why they don't want to be teachers, authors, etc.? This is yet another instance of men's issues being framed as simply a manifestation of misogyny.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates26/03/25 12:20 AM
47

Let me begin by saying that I'm so sorry that you were assaulted, and for the harassment you've received. Its admirable that you're looking to bridge the gender divide in order to build communal support for other victims of assault, especially in today's political climate, but after reading this post I think I might understand why your efforts thus far have been met with such pushback. In this post, you've posed a question to the subreddit: what causes the discomfort that prevents you from aidin…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates03/02/25 09:19 PM
0

Are you sure about that ? Because those measures do not have an inbuilt way to check whether the country is discriminating against them. As has been mentioned in this thread, there are plenty of studies demonstrating that black-sounding names are significantly more likely to be passed over than European names. This isn't some localized issue - its a cultural bias that pervades society. Do you also think we have no way of knowing whether racial profiling in policing truly exists? And you see, tha…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/02/25 02:19 AM
0

I might be able to point to more, but what would be the point ? The whole point I was making was that it was context dependent, and a single country is sufficient to make that point. No one is suggesting that black people should receive targeted support in countries where they aren't discriminated against - in most countries, they are discriminated against. Like I said, keep focusing on wages if it helps you ignore literal racial massacres. Racial massacres of whom? White South Africans?? Surely…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates01/02/25 08:54 PM
1

So the only countries you can point to where black applicants aren't discriminated against are countries with a black majority... And therein lies the problem. Yeah. It wasn't exactly wages I was talking about, but if that helps you avoid thinking of massacres... Wages are relevant because they help illustrate the racial power dynamics in the country. Its a bit rich to argue that South Africa "isn't welcoming" to white people when they have economic superiority in a majority black country.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates01/02/25 02:36 PM
3

No one here is making the argument that classed-based issues should be ignored in order to focus exclusively on identity. My point isn't that you should just "live" with racism That's essentially the point you made though: "it's something people just need to learn to live with while we solve more pressing problems that affect 99% of people." If "black names" are automatically associated with unprofessionalism, that's an example of racial prejudice, i.e. racism. By suggesting that black people sh…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates01/02/25 01:11 AM
1

One could also point out for example that there are plenty of countries where this is absolutely not the case. From what I've heard, South Africa has gone through a few phases where they were not that welcoming towards white people, for example. Why is it relevant ? Because it reveals how contextual this whole issue is. And why does the fact that it is contextual matter ? What are these other countries that don't discriminate against black job applicants? South Africa is an strange example to us…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates01/02/25 12:42 AM
5

You could say the same about Feminists. The problem with working with either is that, being associated with larger and more established political ideologies, they tend to subsume smaller movements like ours into their own. Not to say that it shouldn't happen necessarily, but I think strong boundaries would need to be set.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates25/01/25 03:07 AM
1

No, the OP just didn't add it; the figure for Asian men is 88.1%
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates13/01/25 03:43 AM
2

I don't imagine that people who engage in political discussions necessarily believe that doing so will directly address the related political issues - that doesn't mean there's no inherent value in it. It seems pretty callous to regard working class men discussing the problems that effect them as "whining." In the digital information age, spreading awareness and challenging preconceptions about gender and gender dynamics online is extremely important - I only wish we could focus on building a co…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates12/01/25 01:23 AM
3

I know, I was answering that question. Since the sub doesn't present itself as being dedicated to activism, and since its a public forum that anyone can participate in, its seems unreasonable to expect its members to be inclined toward activism. Most other political subreddits don't engage in activism either, so why would anyone expect this sub to be an exception when there's nothing to indicate that it would be? Especially considering that a significant portion of members migrated from r/MensRi…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates12/01/25 12:28 AM
3

Because its a public, freely accessible subreddit that literally presents itself as "a place for discussion of male advocacy from a left-wing perspective."
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates12/01/25 12:07 AM
2

I'm aware - I joined shortly after the sub was created too, and I haven't left since. I'm also aware that you've only recently rejoined and that u/gratis_eekhoorn has been managing the sub almost single-handedly for the past year or so. I never said the sub was solely for discourse, just that it has always been its primary focus. Only a tiny percentage of total posts are ever related to irl activism.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates11/01/25 11:50 PM
4

As far as I'm aware, this subreddit wasn't created for the purpose of political organizing, and that has never been its focus; this has always been "a place for discussion of male advocacy from a left-wing perspective." If most are here to learn about and discuss men's issues, its unreasonable to expect them to suddenly rally behind your attempts at irl activism. Its sort of like blaming your therapist because you haven't achieved happiness yet - that's not what therapy is for. Also, this accusa…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates11/01/25 10:11 PM
18

A father of one of the victims, Dominic Hackey, who was in contact with the other parents, claims that all of the confirmed victims were in fact non-white males; the white baby and girl baby referenced in the Daily Mail testimony above aren't among these victims, and were (allegedly) only targeted after her initial hospital suspension in order throw off the scent of her usual target profile, black male infants. So while we have conflicting testimonies, it seems clear that, at the very least, the…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates09/01/25 03:19 AM
66

According to one testimony: "The majority of the babies were black babies, when she came back when they noticed the pattern, she tried to throw them off by targeting a white baby and a girl baby." https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-14255261/virginia-nurse-erin-strotman-targeting-black-babies-henrico-doctors.html If true, her intended targets were indeed Black boys.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates08/01/25 11:14 PM
19

It seems likely that it was motivated by racism and sexism, but we'll have to stay tuned.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates08/01/25 08:01 PM
56

All of the victims were boys (which the articles does state) and, from what I've gathered so far, Black boys were the primary targets.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates08/01/25 07:24 PM
10

Imposing rules banning an entire political wing, people who believe biology has profound impacts on our drives and behavior, or people who are feeling depressed and hopeless (which describes a lot of men who need a movement the most right now) is going to further limit the number of people you can rally together. "We're excited to introduce the Progressive Male Advocacy Discord server, a growing community dedicated to discussing men's issues from a left-wing, egalitarian perspective." If this is…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates30/12/24 03:08 AM
2

Women vote more than men do, and the majority of white women supported Trump, who champions anti-LGBT legislation. Also, more Asian women supported Trump than their male counterparts. Some of the most dedicated and influential anti-trans advocates are women. There is massive hatred for gay men and trans women within radfem communities (mostly populated by women). Radfem influencers (most of whom are women) give rhetorical structure to this hatred and spread it to their many followers online; thi…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates27/12/24 11:06 PM
1

I don't think MGTOW's only complaint about women is "dating them feels like a job interview." A general distrust of women seems to pervade MGTOW communities online.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates23/12/24 03:54 PM
2

Gay men evoke far more revulsion, ridicule, and violent aggression than lesbians do. The face of the gay pedophile caricature is that of gay men, not lesbians, which motivates targeted discrimination of gay men.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates20/12/24 08:16 PM
1

Oh 4B is definitely way worse than MGTOW in that regard, but I haven't seen evidence of that actually happening yet. But even before the poisoning "jokes," the 4B movement was still a problem, just as MGTOW and WGTOW are a problem.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates20/12/24 04:12 PM
5

Yeah which is unfair - don't expect me to defend Feminism.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates19/12/24 01:58 PM
9

If a woman avoided men because they experienced abuse and trauma because of the actions of men would that make her misandrist? If she generalizes the majority men as abusive, then yes it absolutely does make her a misandrist.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates19/12/24 01:43 PM
3

I think sexism is a problem in itself, don't you? Is the 4B movement not a problem so long as it isn't directly hurting men?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates19/12/24 01:39 PM
4

I don't trust people by default in general, regardless of gender. I don't initially trust people trying to sell me things (e.g. used car salesmen, realtors, and politicians). I don't trust emails from Nigerian princes offering me millions of dollars or anyone else with something that appears too good to be true (yet many people still fall victim to these scams). I don't continue to trust brands that have proved their trustworthiness in the past, especially if the packaging has "New and Improved …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates19/12/24 01:38 PM
1

It is when those individual experiences are extrapolated to a broader population. If a woman's negative experiences with men lead her to generalize the majority of men as untrustworthy, she's a sexist - the same is true when the genders are reversed.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates19/12/24 01:49 AM
8

The idea of men forgoing romantic relationships isn't misogynistic in itself, but when that choice is motivated by negative preconceptions of women rather than, for example, a desire to focus on personal goals, its misogynistic. Sadly, most MGTOW communities online seem to be motivated by the former. Its like the male equivalent of the 4B movement - swearing off the opposite sex only to complain about them constantly.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates19/12/24 12:06 AM
3

The thing is feminists just hate all men she probably forgot to mention white men because she sees black men also turning to Trump. No, radfems actually do have a particular hatred for black and Muslim men.
/r/MensRights17/12/24 01:07 AM
10

The potentially irresolvable conflict between male advocacy and Feminism is that Intersectional Feminist theory positions men as ontological oppressors, with women as their ontological victims. Within this framework, men can only ever suffer oppression from other men, and never on the basis of their gender - any social discrimination of males, or AMABs, can only be a product of male power and privilege. Such a framework has proven incapable of capturing and analyzing the gendered experiences of …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates12/12/24 05:23 PM
2

I don't think that is the argument in patriarchy. I think that it is more about what society is geared towards. Who represents the default status that is always considered? Again, patri = male, archy = rule. Patriarchy relates to male rule, or domination, not necessarily "default status." But even if your personal definition was correct, the Western world could still not be accurately classified as a patriarchy; in conservative communities, it is white men who represent the "default status," but…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/11/24 03:41 PM
1

False. Women have worked for well, since work existed as a concept. Mostly as farmhands, arts and craft makers, and business owners (inns and such). Long long before industrialization. That doesn't contradict my statement. I'm not simply referring to work, I'm referring to the capacity to spend one's own wage independently. Systemic limitations (e.g. restricted access to education, wage disparity, limited financial independence, less industrial and trade job access) meant that while women worked…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates22/11/24 07:56 PM
1

But they weren't a voting block. It's like saying if redheads could have made anti blonde laws. You're the one who said it though... that men could have made anti-women laws. If political and economic power were withheld from blondes but not redheads, then blondes would have barely any legal means to prevent an anti-blonde law from passing. Unless he decides to go serial killer and really disturb the world he inhabits, no, he was merely a cog. A tiny blip with no power, even locally. A woman cou…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates21/11/24 07:25 PM
1

If men could have made anti-women laws, that implies that they had power over women - power that isn't exercised to its fullest extent is still power. Historically, the average man has had significantly more power than women to steer the society in which both genders inhabit. This isn't to say that women had absolutely no power, or that the average man had significant societal influence on his own, but there was a severe economic, political and social imbalance between genders. Of course, this i…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates20/11/24 07:11 PM
5

...You haven't tried to convince me - you haven't even made an argument. Men do have certain gendered advantages, as I've said, but the question isn't "do men have more advantages?" its "do men dominate women?" "do men have power to shape and steer society that women don't?" The earnings gap between genders is shrinking while the educational gap is widening. Women vote more than men and even have more legal protections. Black and brown men have the lowest social mobility of all race/gender demog…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates20/11/24 01:04 AM
2

If patriarchy was determined by the gender of those with the most power in society, female monarchs would have signaled a hiatus of patriarchy; when people refer to 'patriarchy' they're usually speaking to the general power dynamics between sexes/genders, not the ratio of men to women among society's elite. The average man doesn't hold power over the average woman. Do men retain certain contextual privileges? Absolutely, but so do women. I believe that this has lessened a great degree, but I wou…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates19/11/24 07:46 PM
3

Patriarchy is a system of relationships, beliefs, and values embedded in political, social, and economic systems that structure gender inequality between men and women. Gender inequality doesn't necessarily equate to male dominance, which is what patriarchy denotes (patri = male, archy = rule). Although sexist gender norms still reinforce gender inequality in Western society, the average Western man no longer has the political, social, or economic power to dominate the average Western woman - in…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates19/11/24 06:09 PM
9

Trust me, the attention given to black men as a demographic, by both liberals and conservatives, is overwhelmingly negative - certainly not the sort of spotlight you'd want on you. Have you ever heard the phrase "black men are the white people of black people"?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates16/10/24 12:58 AM
10

Most of these aren't exclusive to black men - the only one that may be is the mentorship program. "Provide 1 million loans for Black entrepreneurs and others to start a business." Kamala has publicly stated that she wouldn't support policies that only help black people.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates15/10/24 08:50 PM
26

Most of these promised policies won't have a significant impact on the vast majority of black men - most black men don't own a business, don't sell weed, and don't engage in crypto. This isn't meant to help, its a token gesture meant to secure the black vote, which has always been reliably democrat. They're likely focusing on black men this time because their support has started to wane in recent years. And if Kamala loses, it will be black men who get the blame; Obama already helped prime black…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates15/10/24 08:44 PM
1

https://www.reddit.com/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates/comments/1fhip74/comment/lniekwq/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web3x&utm_name=web3xcss&utm_term=1&utm_content=share_button
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates17/09/24 02:25 AM
1

(Source: https://dpic-cdn.org/production/legacy/Williams_HabeasPetition_MOSCT.pdf) The Reliability of the Witnesses In November 1999, officers went to Ms. Asaro’s mother’s house to speak with her. Ms. Asaro believed that the officers were there to arrest her on outstanding warrants. The police offered to help Asaro with her warrants if she would provide information about the murder. In contrast to [Henry] Cole’s account (and in direct conflict with the crime scene evidence), Asaro claimed [Willi…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates17/09/24 02:22 AM
2

The Reliability of the Forensics ...numerous hairs were discovered on the victim’s shirt and on the rug where her body was found. The rug had been vacuumed eleven days before the crime. While some of the hairs matched Gayle or Picus, others did not match either of them or [Williams]. Similarly, two pubic hairs found on the rug did not match Gayle, Picus, or [Williams]. Head hairs also found on the rug also did not match any of these three individuals. None of these unmatched hairs, nor the knife…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates17/09/24 02:14 AM
0

Neither do they support his guilt beyond a reasonable doubt. The footprints and hair samples of the perpetrator also do not match those of Mr. Williams.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates16/09/24 06:37 PM
3

"No one and nothing connected Marcellus Williams to this crime until months later, when a jailhouse informant looking to collect reward money and cut a deal on his own pending charges claimed Williams had confessed to him. That informant led police to a second, equally incentivized witness [Laura Asaro], who only came forward after she was arrested on her own charges and who told police that Williams had sold the victim’s stolen laptop. What the jury never learned, however, was that the person w…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates16/09/24 06:29 PM
5

This is a useless definition of toxic masculinity because it means all masculinity is toxic masculinity. All conceptions of masculinity are artificially constructed and sexist and preconceptions about men This is false - masculinity is the qualities or attributes regarded as characteristic of men or boys. Obviously there are such qualities that are indeed characteristic of men of boys (on average), such as relatively high testosterone levels, but many are merely based on sexist preconceptions wi…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates16/08/24 04:10 PM
4

I downvoted you because you condescendingly implied that the entire sub dislikes a term merely on the basis that Feminists use it, without actually engaging with any of our direct criticisms of the term, of which there are many. Throwing insults because you're being downvoted is childish.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates16/08/24 03:43 PM
4

"Toxic masculinity" generally refers to masculinity that is artificially constructed according to sexist preconceptions of men. Misandry is hatred of, contempt for, or prejudice against men and boys. "Toxic masculinity" is constructed according to sexist prejudice (preconceived opinion that is not based on reason or actual experience) regarding men and boys. The term itself implies the denotation of a toxic form of masculinity when, in fact, it denotes a false, pseudo masculinity.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates16/08/24 03:37 PM
4

Our contention with the term is that it regards the stereotype of men that sexists mistake for masculinity as itself a form of masculinity. In the same vein, I would have a problem if someone regarded promiscuity as a form of "toxic femininity"; we should be trying to dismantle sexist associations such as these, not reinforce them with our language.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates16/08/24 03:23 PM
2

I'm not referring to misogyny, I'm referring to its male equivalent, misandry. The sexist construct commonly referred to as "toxic masculinity" is itself predicated on misandry.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates16/08/24 03:00 PM
5

Likely because he's referring to the male equivalent of misogyny as "toxic masculinity." We can look at statements such as "women are bad at math" or "women should be slim" and have no problem identifying them as misogynistic, but when it comes to ideas like "men lack emotional intelligence" or "men should be muscular" no one seems to want to use the word misandry.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates16/08/24 11:57 AM
9

I think its a serious mistake to regard conservative gender ideology as merely benevolent sexism toward women. For example, the willingness to sacrifice the life of a young man rather than that of a young woman is indicative of more than just an underestimation of women's capabilities - it represents an estimation of males as objects of warfare. Even within matrilineal, non-patriarchal societies such as the Mosuo of China, the role of protector tends to be reserved exclusively for men.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates16/08/24 11:45 AM
6

Femininity that is artificially constructed according to sexist preconceptions of women (e.g. women are frivolous, weak, childish) is misogynistic. Likewise, masculinity that is artificially constructed according to sexist preconceptions of men (e.g. men are brutish, hypersexual, single-minded) is misandrist. What OP is identifying is the misandry that underpins conservative ideology.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates16/08/24 11:07 AM
1

Demoralizing the police doesn't affect the bad actors much, but it does chase out police officers who care about doing right. The left doesn't simply "demoralize" police - they actually support institutional reform, which the right always aggressively opposes. Body cameras - the left supported, the right opposed Ending qualified immunity - the left supported, the right opposed Revising use-of-force policies - the left supported, the right opposed The police aren't bad in principle, its the unche…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates06/08/24 12:56 AM
0

These "identity politics issues" have material impact on millions of lives. It's fine if you don't care enough do anything about it, but many of the victims of such institutional and social discrimination do, including myself. Anti-capitalism and anti-bigotry aren't mutually exclusive - just because neo-liberals only focus on the latter doesn't mean you can't attend to both without one being compromised. This is all besides the point though; if we're comparing the negative impact of "intersectio…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates05/08/24 10:10 PM
0

No, it isn't close. "Feminist-blessed discrimination," as harmful as it is, merely reacts to, and piggybacks on, the pre-established discrimination that has long been endemic to the right wing, and culminates in right wing ideology and policy. The majority of homeless people are male, and it is the right that advocates for budget cuts to affordable housing programs. They also support tax cuts that favor the rich, which exacerbates economic inequality and can contribute to homelessness. The major…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates05/08/24 08:07 PM
5

Link: Number of male slaves per 100 female slaves on select voyages during the transatlantic slave trade, by carrier and destination, 1636-1867 "In Africa, where domestic slavery was the predominant form of slavery, female slaves were usually favored as they were perceived as being more easily-controlled and less likely to rebel. In the Americas, however, where productive slavery was more prevalent, male slaves were preferred due to the physical intensity of the labor and the perception that the…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates04/08/24 06:15 PM
23

The vast majority of Black slaves were male. The vast majority of lynched Black slaves were male. Black male slaves were raped by both white men and women.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates03/08/24 08:10 PM
1

Dude... this is literally the only time I've heard this criticism of the sub - I've been here a long time and most consider it to be an oasis, one of the few leftist spaces that approaches men's issues with compassion. I respect your opinion but I simply don't share it; if anything I would like this place to be even less like r/MensRights . You seem to be expecting the sub to accommodate your preferences even though many, if not most, have the opposite preference. If a Feminist guest told me tha…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates01/08/24 02:42 AM
0

I have no idea how this place could be seen as a popularity contest. The only metric for popularity is likes and dislikes, but that's just a feature of reddit - r/MensRights has that too. Try criticizing the MGTOW movement on MensRights and see just how unpopular you become. I'm sorry that you feel boxed in here but not everyone feels that way. In fact, this is one of the few male advocacy communities where I don't feel boxed in. We often criticize Feminism, but we also welcome criticism of cons…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates01/08/24 01:38 AM
2

This is a subreddit dedicated to discussing male issues from a left-wing perspective. There is no organizational leadership, no party platform - anyone is free to raise discussion on any issue they wish so long as it relates to men and doesn't promote values that are antithetical to our own. If you're looking for a "point," this subreddit usually serves as a space for people to learn about male experiences they likely won't hear discussed on mainstream outlets, and analyze them with those of sha…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates01/08/24 12:44 AM
2

There are many issues to discuss, and everyone has their own priorities. If you wanted to create such a post yourself I guarantee you'll be met with a positive reception. This is criticism that left-wing spaces often receive: "What about x?" "You aren't discussing x enough." A way to keep the discourse around a particular topic consistent is for those who are most passionate about it to keep the ball rolling. I myself intend to start drafting a post about the sexual torture of Palestinian men, w…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates31/07/24 11:44 PM
3

The stuff that I want to fix is the fact that we have only one DV shelter for men in the country. We have some laws badly written in favor of women when it comes to sexual assault. Protection of boys from abuse and exploitation. Am I crazy that these topics do not come up in this subreddit? I'm guessing you're quite new here because posts that highlight the gendered double standards for victims of DV have been commonplace for a while now - I wouldn't be surprised if the topic comes up at least o…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates31/07/24 11:13 PM
9

I’m not sure I agree, people who have looked out for men’s issues have often been from the right or centre Which men, and which issues? The right are usually, if not always, the primary instigators of issues that outgroup males suffer from, such as targeted harassment/violence. They also tend to be vehemently opposed to political actions that aim to help those in the outgroup (including outgroup males) integrate into civil society. Some day the left may stop and care instead of trying to force m…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates31/07/24 09:24 PM
16

That isn't the concept of patriarchy that dominates Feminist theory. Feminism doesn't simply view the ruling class of men as the "patriarchs" - men as a class are viewed as inheritors of patriarchal power, which is used to dominate women.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates22/07/24 12:03 AM
1

The two scenarios aren't analogous due to the vast disparity in personal cost, as well as personal and external benefit. The pilot would have an ethical responsibility to land the plane safely because there are several conscious human lives at stake, including his own; both he and the passengers could gain far more than he himself would risk losing. Therefore, compelling the pilot to perform this duty could be justified, depending on the method used. It's important to add that consent isn't what…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates08/07/24 01:52 AM
1

I never implied that one couldn't speak on ethical rights. But if I don't agree with your premise on what constitutes an ethical right, then I'm not going to attempt to argue the logic that derived from that premise. With regard to solely ethics, a contract proves at least a prior expression of consent. Even if consent can be revoked, it doesn’t change whether there was an expression of consent, which may have different ethical implications in different contexts. Ethically, consent that doesn't …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/07/24 09:36 PM
2

Remember, we're now concentrating solely on moral rights, not legal rights, so specific performance isn't relevant at this point. That said, if we did want circle back to legality, specific performance isn't applied to force a surrogate to continue a pregnancy against her will.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/07/24 07:38 PM
1

I pointed to legal rights because the moral "rights" are subjective - this wasn't to imply that legality equates to morality. If a gestational surrogate agrees to a contact, there’s nothing to force, except as enforcement of her past will. If we aren't pointing to laws, then why would it matter if there was a contract? Violating someone's present will to not carry a fetus to term, in order to enforce their past will, is still a transgression of bodily autonomy. If I sign a contract that allows s…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/07/24 03:08 PM
5

If we truly hold the former to be more important, then we must be consistent about this when gestational surrogates threaten to electively abort the offspring of couples, including of mothers. Would you be consistent? If so, I can respect the moral consistency. A gestational surrogate does indeed have the same right to bodily autonomy as a mother, which supersedes the desire for the fetus to be carried to term. I say "desire" because there are no widely recognized legal frameworks that grant fat…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/07/24 08:07 AM
27

Men and AMAB (assigned male at birth) people who fall within the out-group of society, and who pose an existential threat to the status-quo, are consistently portrayed as extremely violent, hypersexual, and predatory, which justifies the institutional and interpersonal persecution of said men/AMABs by the in-group. The stereotype of the brutish thug is that of Black and Hispanic men, and they serve as objects of terror for white supremacists. The stereotype of the LGBT pedophile is that of gay/q…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates06/07/24 08:12 PM
1

I've been on this subreddit for about 5 years now - I guarantee you that over 90 percent of users, even the new ones, are already well aware of misandry online. Its not as though they're new to the Internet. The only ones here who don't believe this happens are invariably radfems, and showing them examples will usually just be answered with "those aren't real feminists."
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates05/07/24 11:01 PM
1

But we are already aware of how rampant this hateful rhetoric is, so posting this here doesn't spread awareness - its merely preaching to the choir.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates05/07/24 10:29 PM
1

That is already an extremely well-enforced idea here. As I commented in another post similar to this one: Obsessing over individual instances of online misandry is a fruitless exercise that will only embitter you. If the majority of posts on a male advocacy subreddit are just highlights of Feminist hypocrisy, that does indeed hurt our political movement.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates05/07/24 09:29 PM
22

Yes, hypocrisy abounds in Feminist spaces - we all know that already. Let's focus on what we as male advocates can do to advance gender equality rather than focus on how Feminists fail to do so.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates05/07/24 08:28 PM
13

From what I've seen, he is very much of the "toxic masculinity hurts men too" variety of breadtuber. If you aren't subscribed to the idea that misogyny is the root of male disparity, you'll probably find his gender "analysis" to be rather one-dimensional.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates05/07/24 04:52 PM
10

As gross as this is, we are all already aware that misandry is trivialized and widespread. Obsessing over individual instances of online misandry is a fruitless exercise that will only embitter you.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates04/07/24 10:44 PM
14

There are several direct criticisms about her and her work in this comment thread, including this link: The troubling racist analysis of black masculinity by Bell Hooks, and how her patriarchal model of society is inferior to Marxism in basically every way Do you really think they only amount to "muh feminist bad"?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates03/07/24 11:45 PM
78

They've long since started actually, and they employ many of the same stereotypes that white supremacists have weaponized against Black men for over a century. Apparently, it's progressive to regard Black men as deadbeat, hyper-aggressive predators, as long as you add the caveat, "...because of patriarchy."
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates03/07/24 08:20 PM
60

We need only observe how Palestinian men are currently being hypersexualized by Zionist liberals as savage rapists, and how some of these very same men have been sodomized by Israeli soldiers themselves, to realize how insufficient the Intersectional framework is for capturing and contextualizing the experiences of racialized men. When a Palestinian man is forced to dance naked for the entertainment of a female Israeli soldier, is that simply racism? Is there truly no gender dimension at play? A…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates03/07/24 07:01 PM
35

Kimberly Crenshaw helped fight against the 'My Brother's Keeper' initiative, which aimed to address persistent opportunity gaps faced by boys and young men of color, on the basis that it excluded Black girls, even though Black boys consistently have the lowest high school graduation rates among all race and gender groups. https://www.nytimes.com/2014/07/30/opinion/Kimberl-Williams-Crenshaw-My-Brothers-Keeper-Ignores-Young-Black-Women.html This exemplifies the root problem of intersectionality pe…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates03/07/24 02:38 AM
11

Tbh I think both notions are ludicrous.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates03/07/24 01:55 AM
61

The intersectional Feminist framework can't conceive of men being oppressed, vulnerable, or otherwise disadvantaged on the basis of their gender/sex, so any instance of men experiencing worse outcomes than women has to be a consequence of misogyny, which is upheld primarily by men. Any explanation for male disadvantage that isn't reducible to misogyny will be dismissed. MensLib is inclined to blame "male ego" for boys underperforming in school because it aligns perfectly with the pre-conceived n…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates03/07/24 12:49 AM
1

Few men cheat, abuse their partner, etc. And the ones who do are usually the unreliable, hot, bad boy types, whom are pretty obviously not reliable, stable men. First, just because a partner doesn't cheat or abuse doesn't mean they're compatible with you, it doesn't mean they will love and/or respect you, and it doesn't mean that they're prepared for the struggle of a maintaining a long-term relationship with you. Frankly, the implication that a person can, or should, be satisfied with a partner…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates22/06/24 07:47 PM
-1

Let's not minimize women's struggles here; attracting a "good reliable man" is by no means guaranteed for most women, let alone maintaining a healthy, long-term relationship with one. Often I see people conflate the relative ease with which women can secure a sexual partner, and the difficulty of finding someone who will love and respect them as individuals. Yes, women can generally attract sexual interest without much difficulty (at least compared to men), but that doesn't necessarily translate…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates20/06/24 01:33 AM
3

I'm pretty sure the mod team is entirely male, and the sub's demographics are overwhelmingly male. You may be thinking of MensLib.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates09/06/24 07:20 PM
2

I'm sorry but this is patently untrue. For example: Jim Crow Laws, Stop-and-Frisk, the War on Drugs - all disproportionately targeted black men by a massive degree, and resulted in far more unjust murder and false imprisonment of black men than black women. "Young black and Latino men were the targets of a hugely disproportionate number of stops. Though they account for only 4.7 percent of the city’s population, black and Latino males between the ages of 14 and 24 accounted for 41.6 percent of s…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates30/05/24 06:53 PM
10

Yes, some of the most passionate male advocates are women, and some of the most misandrist people are men. Try not to generalize an entire demographic based on your singular experiences, especially if you expect the same courtesy from others.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates30/05/24 05:36 PM
2

See, this is one of the fundamental errors of the intersectional Feminist framework: all other things are never equal. There is no pure, undiluted male category - a "black man" is not black at once and then man in another instance - he is always both. While ingroup males, who most closely reflect the quintessential human, have historically been granted more institutional privilege than their female counterparts, outgroup males and AMAB people face an extreme level of targeted, gendered violence …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates30/05/24 04:20 PM
2

So again I want to make the suggestion that to properly make and defend the position that men suffer too under these systems of inequality, you really look the places in the eye where these systems of inequality hurt groups with more intersectional vulnerabilities more, and acknowledge that. Although you're acknowledging that men suffer under our current social structures (which is appreciated), you seem to also be implying that being female is a social vulnerability in contrast to being male. I…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates30/05/24 02:32 AM
1

Men are more likely to be made-to-penetrate than they are to be raped, and 70% of male MTP victims report only female perpetrators. https://www.cdc.gov/nisvs/documentation/nisvsReportonSexualViolence.pdf So, no, the problem isn't simply "another men."
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates30/05/24 01:21 AM
1

If you don't think anything will change then why are you even here? This is a place for advocates, not doomsayers.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates25/05/24 07:45 PM
15

I'm pretty sure they're being sarcastic.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates20/05/24 05:44 PM
7

Tbh, men themselves do. Nothing is better at that than the redpill, manosphere, and what men themselves say in their own spaces. If hatred towards the opposite gender expressed online is proportional to real life violence then men, and boys especially, should be terrified.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates03/05/24 08:13 PM
2

That's not what I'm saying... If 70% of men eat salmon, the percentage of men who eat fish (regardless of type) would have to be at least 70%, because salmon is a type of fish. If 70% of men who were made to penetrate had a female perpetrator, the percentage of male CSV victims who had female perpetrators would have to be at least 70% because made to penetrate is a type of CSV.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates03/05/24 03:16 PM
14

"What would be wild to me, is if because of some preconceived notion of wokeness, that we should expect people to put aside all of their personal experiences to drop their guard and be like, "Oh, obviously a man, because there's nothing wrong with men. They're just like everyone else!" I think in any situation where it's possible that your safety could be at risk, that you should exercise caution, regardless of whether leftists would consider you a racist or sexist. I balk at the idea that this …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates03/05/24 02:48 PM
2

Being made-to-penetrate is a form of contact sexual violence, so among the men who experienced contact sexual violence, the percentage who had female perpetrators would have to be at least 70%.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates03/05/24 02:13 PM
2

Firstly, that is the literal definition of 'sexual violation.' Second, I'm fairly sure most reasonable people would categorize sexual harassment as a sexual violation.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates03/05/24 01:54 PM
14

Maybe you guys should ask yourselves why women say they would trust a bear more than a man in the wild, and ask yourselves if, um, maybe men are actually standing in the way of the kinds of progress that you're trying to achieve? Men are holding back egalitarian progress, but so are women - the vast majority of humans still hold to traditional gender norms, particularly with regard to men. What many of us take issue with is the persistent metanarrative that men are the ones holding themselves (a…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates03/05/24 01:41 PM
6

On page 11 we see that for about 60% of men who have been sexually assaulted in their lives, at least one of the perpetrators was female This is incorrect. 70% (69.6 to be precise) of men who have been made-to-penetrate report ONLY female perpetrators.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates03/05/24 06:29 AM
8

I said violated, not violence. Sexual violations are "the sexual advances by one party against another, which cross personal boundaries of the second party." I'm not merely referring to sexually assault. You're right though that the 57% refers specifically to the IPV abuse of black men, not just sexual abuse against black men in general - I'll edit my comment to reflect that. If we hone in on sexual violations though, especially against black men, the picture is still fairly alarming. About 1 in…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates03/05/24 05:15 AM
14

Link to a pdf of the survey: https://www.cdc.gov/violenceprevention/pdf/nisvs/nisvsreportonipv_2022.pdf Link to the specific stats on black men: https://pbs.twimg.com/media/GHx_DsmWMAAO0H7?format=png&name=small Link to a summary of the survey: https://www.cdc.gov/violenceprevention/intimatepartnerviolence/men-ipvsvandstalking.html
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates03/05/24 02:52 AM
26

If I were to tell you that a national CDC survey suggests that over half of black men have been victims of contact sexual violence, physical violence and/or stalking by a woman within their lifetimes, would you conclude that it would be reasonable for them to hold misogynistic generalizations about women, given their experiences? this should be a learning moment to know about the kind of world women live in, which we will never understand as men, but the least we can do is empathize with their i…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates03/05/24 02:40 AM
6

According to the most recent National Intimate Partner and Sexual Violence Survey, about 1 in 3 men experienced contact sexual violence, physical violence, and/or stalking by an intimate partner during their lifetime, 97% of which had only female perpetrators. What are you doing to make it better?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/05/24 11:24 PM
1

"There may be certain cases that go on today where that happens..." Such as? Honestly, is there a single aspect of society that privileges black men over white women?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/05/24 11:01 PM
7

How is that relevant?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates20/04/24 05:44 PM
1

I agree with you, but I said 'people,' not specifically 'women.' For example, many in the LGBT community will dismiss the concerns of (cis-het) men on the basis that they already have, and have had, so much support and privilege compared to themselves.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates12/04/24 09:49 PM
0

"So we are already where you are describing, we arrived a long time ago. What I'm doing is simply playing by the "rules" that these people created and benefit from. And it isn't even about spite or "revenge" as much as it is common sense. It is simply objective fact that women's problems gain far more attention worldwide and have hordes of people willing to move mountains to ensure that they are safe and taken care of." By "playing by the rules" you are effectively helping to maintain the status…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates11/04/24 06:45 PM
2

"I'm sorry, but did you completely unironically go "women most affected" while openly acknowledging that there has been a huge degree of social detriment done to men at feminism's behest?" That's... not what I said at all. I'm saying that women still have issues that need advocating for. "While I agree with your other points about the conservative side being a false hope for men (it actually echoes certain points I've also made here) I have to say that your stance on women's issues and men's rel…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates10/04/24 11:14 PM
12

"I don't support women anymore. They get plenty of support from elsewhere. I support men now." This is exactly the sort of rationalization that people have used to dismiss men's issues; "men don't need institutional support, the institution of patriarchy is already supporting them." One of the primary issues with the Feminist movement is that it isn't concerned with being balanced - instead, its focus is on being a counter-balance. It sees the the world as a patriarchy so it dedicates itself ful…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates10/04/24 06:02 PM
7

He isn't saying that there should be extremely limited welfare and social programs in general.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/04/24 04:12 AM
9

TERFs are some of the most extreme misandrist radFems I've ever encountered, if not the most. All of the criticisms that this sub has rightly levied at modern Feminism can be applied to TERFs ten-fold. RadFem "analysis" has been debunked countless times on this sub, and the fact that TERFs extend the bigotry inherent to that analysis to trans women doesn't make it any more compelling, quite the contrary.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates05/03/24 11:25 PM
2

The most upvoted comments are supportive of trans people
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates05/03/24 11:04 PM
-3

No, he is saying that in our current conditions, women's issues don't need our support because they are now the privileged gender. "You, if you really consider yourselves 'pro-men advocates', don't need to concede nor show any sympathy to Feminism or 'Women's Issues' in general nor consider them as valid. It's unnecessary, since they have the whole society supporting them. Women are the privileged, while men the disadvantaged."
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates08/02/24 05:32 PM
-11

OP is literally denying that women even have valid issues.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/02/24 11:52 PM
1

"It's unnecessary, since they have the whole society supporting them. Women are the privileged, while men the disadvantaged." This is (supposed to be) an egalitarian subreddit. If your focus on men's issues is predicated on the belief that women are now the privileged class then this isn't the place for you - you're just the inverse of Feminists. Feminism is your Patriarchy. Female Privilege is your Male Privilege.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/02/24 10:55 PM
38

I know how difficult it can be to be single, especially at a time when tension between genders seems incredibly high, but just as we expect people not to demonize men based on negative experiences they've had, we need to be sure not to generalize women based on our own experiences. Also, its worth considering that dropping out of most of society might limit your opportunities for growth and connection more than it'll protect you from harm.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates04/02/24 09:53 PM
1

If you remove the political structure, the social structures remain. These social structures still push society towards the political structure, even though that political structure is no longer legally enforced. Here - this is where things get troublesome, in my view. Your basis for classifying these social structures as 'patriarchy' is that they reinforce the control of political structures by men, classified as 'political patriarchy.' The definition of the noun 'patriarchy' has yet to be arti…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates27/01/24 08:31 AM
1

You provided a definition: "So the definition of patriarchy, as it exists today, is the social elements that descended from the political patriarchy from which our society was built on. This system of social elements does all of the things you listed above." You provided examples of these social elements: "Things like the concept that men must be strong, logical, and emotionless." I alluded to these social elements persisting and emerging outside of a 'western political patriarchy' while still r…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates26/01/24 01:13 AM
2

A political patriarchy would be one in which a government is, basically by law, run exclusively by men. This has represented the vast majority of societies. Men created the laws, voted, were the leaders, etc. That was the legal state of things. See, this definition already contradicts many Feminist understandings of political patriarchy. You're providing me with one of a myriad definitions but my point isn't that coherent definitions of 'patriarchy' don't exist in isolation, its that the term is…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates25/01/24 05:35 PM
1

Although establishing a technical definition for 'religion' is difficult, the colloquial understanding is coherent enough to service communication. On the other hand, neither the formal nor the colloquial meaning of 'patriarchy' reaches this threshold of coherence outside of closed Feminist circles, and even among these there are such vast inconsistencies that some definitions, even within the same circle, outright contradict each other. I'm not just talking about quibbles over what societal ori…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/01/24 09:42 PM
10

The reason white women were excluded from service was very different from why slaves were excluded. Also, its important to note that many of these slave owners were in fact white women themselves.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/01/24 01:43 PM
5

I don't think the problem OP has is that the definition of patriarchy isn't rigidly concise - its that its incoherent. As difficult as it may be to pin down all things that classify as religion under one term, if I tell people I'm religious most will know generally what I mean. However, when someone refers to a thing as being 'patriarchal' its anyone's guess what they actually mean. If a movie is patriarchal does that mean it serves to dominate women? Does it merely promote the domination of wom…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/01/24 07:46 AM
12

Can we please not promote the inverse of patriarchy theory? Men do not rule the world. Women do not rule the world.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates17/01/24 09:23 PM
25

Women's liberation and advocacy for their rights is needed everywhere, Feminism is needed nowhere.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates14/01/24 07:11 PM
4

Usually, the instances of "asking men to embrace emotions and get help" just consist of telling men what their problems are (despite doing little to no research) and tossing them half-baked, one-dimensional solutions (ex.: "go to therapy, open up more, unlearn toxic masculinity).
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates04/01/24 10:39 PM
4

Misandry is bi-partisan, but this particular form of misandry is far more present among the right/conservatives.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates04/01/24 08:26 PM
1

Ah yes, the highly speculative "mismatch" hypothesis. Are Minority Students Harmed by Affirmative Action?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/01/24 10:03 PM
2

Here's an excerpt from the same linked research briefing: "Black students are more likely to drop out from higher education than other ethnic groups and least likely to achieve a first or upper second-class degree. In contrast, White students are least likely to drop out and most likely to achieve a first or upper second-class degree. White graduates have the highest employment rates of any ethnic group. Chinese, Black and graduates from ‘Other’ ethnic groups have the lowest. Pakistani, Banglade…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates22/12/23 09:03 PM
6

Belle Hooks works backwards from her conclusions while failing to corroborate her claims with hard data. "She focuses so much on how patriarchal society hurts most men and how often men are demonized in media. " This is the core of her problem. Every issue that disproportionately impacts men is framed as ultimately a byproduct of the domination of women by men (working backwards from a conclusion). Homophobic violence against gay males? Oh well that's because straight men hate femininity. Racial…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates18/12/23 02:57 AM
6

I don't think its so much about the phrase as it is the general trend to regard gay men as just "one of the girls."
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates30/11/23 02:00 AM
1

I'll be honest I haven seen a lot of her content but based on what you have described I can't say I am impressed I've barely said anything about her. Focusing on dating aspect of gender issues is already oversaturated and frankly it also trivializes actual issues (like systematic and institutional ones you know) by taking away attention from them. I agree that its an oversaturated topic but if there's a demand for that content (which there definitely is) and if that's her area of interest (which…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/11/23 09:39 PM
1

If someone believes that all White people live overall privileged lives, then yes they're being racist, but that's a pretty fringe belief. 'White privilege' generally refers to advantages that are often unconsciously enjoyed by White people compared to racial minorities. Yes, White and Black people both experience advantages and disadvantages, but the social advantages that racial out-groups (i.e. minorities) experience aren't going to be comparable to those of the racial in-group. Again, this d…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/11/23 03:30 AM
25

Although I disagree with classifying it as a "black supremacist" group, you can certainly be critical of BLM while standing against anti-Black racism, especially considering its tendency to minimize the impact that gender plays on the police brutality of Black males. (an in-depth critique of BLM from a professor of Black male studies https://youtu.be/0vhMIMRro0I?si=IJEdCftJu4JlUXHb)
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates27/11/23 07:26 PM
45

I highly recommend NotSoErudite. She demonstrates a genuine concern for men (particularly with regard to dating) while being unafraid of telling men what they may not want to hear. She's also a data nerd with a background in psychometrics so her analysis of men's issues tend to go beyond simply recycling/repackaging common talking points.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates27/11/23 04:15 PM
5

That... isn't why men desire women. I'm sure this narrative framing feels intuitively true to someone inundated with 3rd wave Feminist theory, but it has no statistical, biological, or sociological basis. This is an incredibly nuanced topic that is oversimplified and obfuscated by catchall buzzwords like "toxic masculinity." If we want to examine disparities between men and women objectively, we have to ensure that our gendered preconceptions and theoretical frameworks are always subordinate to …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates27/11/23 03:55 PM
1

"Were" bullied? And gay men were most definitely told to just pretend to be straight (see, "gay conversion therapy.")
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates26/11/23 01:30 AM
1

I'm not sure that patriarchy explains much at all. I've seen no evidence that a matriarchal ruling class, or even one that is gender-balanced, wouldn't also exploit males in ways that differ from women, and vice versa. Let's examine the treatment of Black slaves. It was many years before Black males were considered to be actual men, yet they were still expected to perform manual labor that differed from that of Black females, including sacrificing their lives in the American Revolutionary and Ci…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates26/08/23 11:41 PM
1

The history of Feminism has very much been lock-step with conservatives with regard to men in many respects, particularly men of color. If you want to learn how I suggest watching/reading the works of Tommy J Curry: https://youtu.be/KtNhsGgEk54?si=Psvp-Pk_eNB5O5we. The only way to fix mens problems is to get rid of the patriarchy and do away with traditional gender norms. Most of us here reject the notion that all, or even most, of men's problems can be boiled down to the result of a historicall…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates26/08/23 11:08 PM
0

You've inferred from context, not from what was necessarily implied. One could make the distinction of "modern" because that's the form they've experienced first-hand.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates27/07/23 11:10 PM
0

That's not necessarily implied, that's simply what you've inferred. You could have an opinion about modern Feminism without knowing anything about past forms of Feminism.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates27/07/23 11:01 PM
0

Er... no, those statements don't contradict each other.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates27/07/23 10:49 PM
2

Okay...? Not sure how that contradicts anything that I or the OP said.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates26/07/23 05:52 PM
-1

Its incredible how many comments here are straw-manning your position, rushing to defend the sub's criticism of Feminism despite the fact that you acknowledge, almost immediately, that Feminism does indeed deserve criticism. Unfortunately, I haven't found a single male advocacy space online that isn't either aligned with Feminism or almost entirely focused on anti-Feminism, and this sub is no exception. The most common justification you'll see is that Feminism is the greatest barrier to men's pr…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates25/07/23 08:52 PM
5

Huh? He never claimed it was about hating women. He says in the second sentence of the post, "modern feminism is full of flaws and deserves fair dose of criticism."
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates25/07/23 08:02 PM
1

They've apparently opted for letting it rot; this sub is now merely a landing page for their kbin thing. No new mods, no new posts (unless they direct to kbin).
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates08/07/23 06:06 PM
-1

She does not call herself an MRA besides what advocacy has she done for men anyway, That's... most of what she does. If you want evidence just look at her Youtube shorts or her TikTok. Even Warren Ferrell, perhaps the most prominent figure associated with the MRM, hasn't explicitly identified himself as an MRA, at least from what I can find online. Prominent figures do matter because people who have been trusted and respected by a movement say more about it than random people identifying with it…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates04/06/23 07:49 PM
-1

I don't know if majority of them support these things or not haven't talked to all of them, but I can say they *are* mainstream positions as some of the biggest and most influental feminist organizations and figures are pushing them I'm talking about what the majority of Feminists support/advocate for. Being anti something does not automatically unite people under same umbrella, some traditionalists and redpillers are anti feminists, for wrong reasons though, does Pearly and her fellow redpill '…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates04/06/23 06:49 PM
-1

Claiming MRAs are just like feminists is not well informed at best and bad faith at worst. Is that what I said? Pretty sure that's not what I said. How are feminists wanting men to have same legal rights as women while creating the duluth model, advocating for no jail time for female criminals, working against changing the definition of rape so male victims are not included, and making countless hateful statements about men. Pretty sure these aren't mainstream Feminist positions. If you believe …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates04/06/23 06:07 PM
1

I cited an extremely well known book, the findings of which are not and have never been in dispute, because it is universally agreed upon by researchers that this is indeed true. I highly doubt that it actually supports what you think it does, or that most researchers of repute believe this to be true. EDIT: I just looked it up and "Queen Bees and Wannabees" is a self-help book lmao! Written by an author with no professional research background whatsoever. Apparently her "findings" were compiled…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates04/06/23 05:51 PM
1

On that we can agree. This was never meant as a condemnation of the MRM as a whole, just a criticism.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates03/06/23 12:52 AM
0

On average, that certainly may true, and if he said that its more common for women to lie to resolve conflicts than it is for men (providing strong evidence to corroborate himself) I wouldn't be accusing him of misogyny.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates03/06/23 12:51 AM
-1

I don't think you've shown that to be true. Oh I certainly can if you'd like, although I'm not sure how many highly upvoted comments showing distrust and disdain of women would be enough to prove my point. Sure. But those are what it is about. And in that it is very different from feminism. I see many similarities, as I've noted a few months ago: https://www.reddit.com/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates/comments/10h42zf/comment/j58rxpd/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3 True. Are there misogynist…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates03/06/23 12:31 AM
1

Have you read Queen Bees And Wannabees? This comment is not misogynistic, it is an accurate reflection of the different strategies the different sexes use to address social conflicts. Ah yes... "its not sexist if its true." If you believe that women resolve conflict by lying and spreading rumors to hurt another people's social connections then feel free to substantiate that. Comparing two things and finding that one is minimal in relation to the other is not minimising one, it is an accurate ref…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates03/06/23 12:02 AM
0

Considering that r/MensRights is the largest MRA community online, the fact that misogyny is pervasive there does say something about the movement, at least partially. A movement is more than its texts, its policies, or its leading figures; a movement is also the culture that permeates it, the behavior of its members, and the focus of its advocacy. When I look at that, I do see genuine support for men, but I also see intense distrust for and resentment toward women. What I don't see, however, is…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/06/23 11:34 PM
1

The two aren't mutually exclusive. Since the commenter doesn't know most of the women in the world, and is apparently not basing his assertion on any peer reviewed studies or other objective measurements, he is making a judgement based on preconceived opinion, which is prejudicial.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/06/23 11:11 PM
1

I mean, prejudice against women is a form of misogyny, just as prejudice against men is a form of misandry and prejudice against racial minorities is a form of racism.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/06/23 09:07 PM
3

.... what? If women lie in order to resolve a conflict, what does that logically make women in that situation? Liars. A liar is someone who consistently lies. If you abuse your partner whenever you get into an argument, you are an abuser. An abuser is someone who consistently abuses. How in the world is this a stretch?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/06/23 07:39 PM
-1

Acknowledging that a cultural climate exists in which women aren't punished for false rape allegations is a far cry from claiming that women are liars and rumor spreaders when faced with interpersonal conflict. In the same vein, I can acknowledge that men commit relatively more violent crime without claiming that men resort to violence when faced with interpersonal conflict.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/06/23 07:12 PM
0

Do you think the statement "men resort to social destruction to resolve interpersonal conflicts" wouldn't be a sexist generalization? I certainly would.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/06/23 06:12 PM
-3

This subreddit isn't the only MRA group online. Every single time I visit r/MensRights I see at least one blatantly misogynistic comment receive a relatively high upvote count. Just recently I saw this comment with 120 upvotes stating "Women resort to social destruction to resolve interpersonal conflicts, this manifests as spreading rumors or lies to hurt the other person's social connections." Distrust of women and the minimization of their struggles are prevailing themes within that sub. There…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/06/23 05:29 PM
13

My mistake, you said that making a female equivalent to this list would be toxic -- I just assumed that you viewed this male version in the same light. There are varying uses of the phrase "toxic masculinity", some of which I would argue are implicitly sexist. Would you care to elaborate on your meaning? I agree that opening jars isn't a regular task and is hardly taxing, resetting clocks is marginally more so but I'd hardly consider it intensive labor. Christmas decorations I would guess is oft…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates21/05/23 10:05 PM
25

Do you believe that in "traditional" marital homes its more common for the wife or the husband to perform the tasks above? Note that this is hardly a comprehensive list.https://ifstudies.org/blog/the-myth-of-the-lazy-father You posted this list on r/TwoXChromosomes and disparaged it as being "toxic." The list is a response to the popular framing of heterosexual marriages as being one-sided with regards to housework -- that it is wives, not husbands, who must perform both paid and unpaid labor. W…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates21/05/23 07:35 PM
1

What you linked isn't a study, its a webpage (titled female delusion calculator...) that references two surveys that don't actually support the underlying premise it makes. According to this calculator, there's only a 1.1% chance that a man is, simultaneously, at least 6' feet tall, not obese, and earns at least %100,000 per year. The problem is that the page doesn't give evidence that the majority of women are actually choosing their partners according to these qualities. And even if there were…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates12/05/23 03:19 AM
1

Unless he amends his statement it can't be objectively proven, any more than "most black people have poor values."
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates12/05/23 01:51 AM
0

So, to be clear, "men are misogynists" is a hateful generalization but "most men are misogynists" isn't? "We recommend using "some" or "many" to avoid unfair generalizations. If you state "most women" then you need to provide evidence when challenged on that statement." I, for one, challenge the statement. These "high expectations" that most women are alleged to have is a subjective metric, so the OP would first have to clarify what he means exactly -- high relative to whose expectations? Men's?…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates11/05/23 11:46 PM
1

"Most" is still a generalization. For example, if one were to claim that most men only value women for sex, as many misandrists do, they'd be making an unfair generalization. Even white supremacists make room for exceptions, conceding that "some" black people are intelligent and have "good" values. The definition of "general" in this context is as follows: affecting or concerning all or most people, places, or things; widespread
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates11/05/23 08:48 PM
2

Well yeah, comments insinuating that the trans movement is a hotbed for pedophilia are liable to get deleted, as will other such paranoid generalizations. Outgroup males (ex.: gay men, black men) are often lambasted as dangerous predators by the conservatives of the day, and so it is now with MtF people. I doubt the mods are willing to facilitate that rhetoric on this sub, and not because they're afraid of getting banned.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates01/05/23 07:12 PM
1

He refers to trans-people by their dead name even when they legally change it... there is no objective evidence that it improves outcomes Wrong: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC6546862/, https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/36149983/, https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/29463477/, https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/31581798/ Its not a one-size-fits-all solution, but to claim that it hasn't improved a lot of trans-people's emotional well-being is absurd. Jordan Peterson has even compared gender …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates01/05/23 06:27 PM
1

Discussion of trans issues, particularly that of trans men, have always been welcome on this sub.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates01/05/23 05:38 PM
1

He also refers to trans-people by their deadname and thinks that an adult undergoing gender reassignment surgery is "criminal".
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates01/05/23 05:34 PM
4

Agreed. Here's an excerpt from one of the studies that the OP's Wikipedia article cites: "Across 37 cultures, Buss (1989) found that women favor men who are more capable of acquiring resources (e.g., larger amounts of money, higher social status) presumably because such men can better provide for offspring, increasing the likelihood that offspring will survive to reproductive age. These effects, however, also depend on the roles of women in relation to men within a given culture. Eagly and Wood …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates06/04/23 08:42 PM
1

There's a huge difference between wanting a man who earns at least as much as you do and valuing a man only for his resources, just as there's a difference between wanting a woman who is sexually attractive and viewing a women as a sex object. Many women do prefer to date men who are at the same income level as they are, and some even prefer men who are relatively wealthy, but I have seen no study to corroborate the idea that this is the sole determining factor for women's attraction to, or sele…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates06/04/23 04:31 PM
-3

Really? Because the billboard i drive by calls out the 25% of homeless that are female, and directs the funding to only them Obviously there are organizations that dedicate funding only to women, but that doesn't account for the majority of homeless charities. Also, u/Manoj_Malhotra referred specifically to public housing projects, not charity orgs, which aren't at all exclusive to women. The healthcare policies written by the left seem far more focused on making sure women get days off for mens…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates04/04/23 05:48 PM
2

Fixating on your disadvantages, constantly comparing your lot in life to others', is an extremely unhealthy habit to cultivate; the gulf between your current self and your idealized self will continue to expand in your mind until you lose all motivation to grow and develop. Of course conventionally attractive people will have an easier time finding partners, and I can't imagine how daunting that search is when all your advances are met with rejection, but if you allow yourself to fall into a spi…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates01/04/23 10:05 PM
5

You're conflating what people believe to be masculine traits with masculinity itself. There are people who still believe that in order to be considered a proper man one must be emotionally closed-off, but they are wrong in that belief; bottling your feelings isn't inherently gendered, its only their sexist ideas about men that make it so. People also believe that wearing eyeliner or having long hair is feminine, so when they see a man doing those things, they'll say he's being effeminate. Its th…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates29/03/23 11:25 PM
6

They certainly seem to be more empathetic toward men -- that is, so long as your primary concern in life is having sex with as many women as you can; this excludes a lot of men, even heterosexual men. And how do they show their empathy for this select subsection of men? By exploiting their sexual frustration for profit, glorifying and selling a lifestyle that so often contributes to unwanted pregnancy, fatherless homes, distrust of straight men, and many other terrible outcomes. These are salesm…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates26/03/23 01:01 AM
2

What if Feminism never backs off? Will we be doomed to forever sit in its shadow, waiting hopelessly for the day when we can fully dedicate ourselves to political advocacy? To quote Socrates, "the secret of change is to focus all of your energy, not on fighting the old, but on building the new..." I'm not saying that criticism of Feminism isn't warranted or necessary, but I think its far more important for the MRM to be a proactive political force that counters institutional and cultural misandr…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates25/03/23 12:06 AM
12

I would say our movement is primarily needed because of sexist conceptions of what men are and who they're supposed to be, which long precede Feminism and are hardly exclusive to it. If Feminism were to end tomorrow would we see a sudden swell of compassion for male victims of trauma? Would straight men's value cease to be measured by how attractive they are to women? Would gay men no longer be violently persecuted for being openly intimate with each other? Would men of all kinds finally be trea…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/03/23 09:20 PM
17

Its different because their perception of male power is misinformed. Men vote less than women, have as many legal rights as women (at most), are less likely to be hired when applying for jobs and are even less likely to earn a college degree. On the other hand, racial minority communities (particularly those of Black and Hispanic people) still exist in relative poverty compared to white communities, broadly speaking, and possess far less political and cultural influence. If in 2023 someone still…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/02/23 02:53 AM
40

If "men's group" implies to you 'anti-women' then you clearly already hold a bias against male advocacy. The fact that men have to prove that they aren't dangerous in order to address the issues that impact them is a men's issue in itself.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates23/02/23 09:47 PM
5

Not to you, but clearly it has utility to some. It serves as a shorthand for a particular kind of celibacy. 'TERF' and 'Incel' is a bad comparison because 'TERF' was originally tied to a specific political ideology, one which was innately transphobic (its literally in the name). 'Incel' on the other hand was coined by a woman in the 90s who used it to mean "anybody of any gender who was lonely, had never had sex or who hadn't had a relationship in a long time." The literal translation of the ter…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/01/23 04:50 PM
8

I'll use the term 'woke' as an analogy. 'Woke' was originally AAVE (African American Vernacular English) and meant 'to be alert to racial prejudice and discrimination'. Sometime after the term was eventually co-opted by the mainstream progressive movement, it came to be associated with any SJW who aggressively pushed for progressive identity politics of any sort. Today, the SJW connotation has supplanted the original definition in the public consciousness. Nevertheless, there are still those amo…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/01/23 04:33 AM
8

Why do you keep using words like 'bastard' and 'broken person'? I'm specifically referring to the connotation (and generalization) of incels being resentful of women, not just being a bastard in general. I'm fully aware that plenty of self-identified incels are misogynists, but misogyny is not inherent to the definition. I've known incels myself and most don't use the term as a proper noun to refer to some political movement, online community or ideological framework -- they usually just mean th…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/01/23 02:58 AM
17

I'm pretty sure incels identify themselves according to the original, literal definition of the word. They don't see themselves as women-haters, even the ones who actually are. Incel is a slur depending on how its used. For example, if I call a random person online an incel because they said something misogynistic, what I'm insinuating is that their misogyny is a result of their frustration for being unattractive to women. Its like when you call someone with poor social skills 'autistic'; you do…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/01/23 12:43 AM
21

One could be a virgin by choice. Being an incel, at least originally, implied that you were sexless despite wanting sex. Technically, you don't even have to be a virgin to be an incel. This is an instance of the connotation of a word replacing its denotation. Following the mass shootings that were committed by self-identified incels, and the subsequent media exposure of prominent incel communities, the public associated the term with men who resent women for not being attracted to them. Eventual…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates23/01/23 11:14 PM
2

In some cultures sure, but the details and extent of this are widely exaggerated. You cut out the word 'often' in your quotation -- I never claimed that it was ubiquitous. That being said, women's legal rights throughout Europe were dependent on male guardianship (their fathers, husbands, or uncles in the case of widows) even in nations governed by Roman-based laws. So yes, European women had little choice but to rely on men to survive. In the Early Republic of Rome, a woman was legal property o…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates11/01/23 12:35 AM
1

The theory is that agricultural society brought with it food shortages which then created competition from men to acquire food to trade with women for sex. Which is ultimately responsible for the class stratification that we see throughout all of history with the start of the agricultural revolution. We all need food, but often it was only men who were permitted to own land to farm on, or to own property at all, so women obviously had to rely on men's resources to survive -- either their father'…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates08/01/23 06:08 PM
2

There are plenty of reasons why men would want to acquire wealth and status that don't relate to attracting women. The accumulation of wealth translates to power in our capitalistic society, power to satisfy one's needs and desires. Do you honestly believe that the only thing that drives a man is his libido? Or the desire to start a family? On the contrary, capitalism came from the fact that women prefer to marry up, so men had to strive for wealth and status to be able to marry. For much of hum…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/01/23 10:58 PM
2

It think its fair to say that if a male made that same joke to Tate there would still be plenty of people cheering.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates30/12/22 09:59 PM
3

She's stated in an interview that she believes women shouldn't have the right to vote until they can be drafted into war (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oye3f04KPVg&ab_channel=AbaNPreach). I'm sure most of us here are in support of a gender-neutral draft (if a draft must exist at all) but certainly not at the expense of women's fundamental rights as free citizens. Obviously you're free to go if you'd like, but please be cognizant of what the perception will inevitably be of a male advocate goin…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates16/12/22 11:41 PM
4

The term only implies that one is celibate despite having a desire for sex; all you have to do is read some of the comments here to see examples of self-identifying incels acknowledging that women don't owe them sex. Even the woman who coined the term for herself had no illusions that she was entitled. Many incels online do overdramatize being a virgin, but considering how much value society places on sex and relationships, its shouldn't surprising that they do.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates13/12/22 07:31 PM
8

I don't see anyone here attempting to excuse misogyny, or suggesting that incels are entitled to sex
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates13/12/22 07:07 PM
3

The placement of sex on Maslow's Hierarchy has been heavily contested, as have many other aspects of the theory. There are countless examples of people living happy, healthy lives without sex, which doesn't hold true for nearly any of the other hierarchical values. I doubt many would argue that a pre-pubescent child or a voluntarily celibate monk is unable to achieve happiness. Its also important to note that 'sex' is ranked separately from 'intimacy' or 'love', and neither are necessarily roman…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates29/10/22 09:38 PM
2

Here are some quotes from the article you posted: "Humans love intercourse. We like it in pairs, in groups, in the house and in the woods. We seek it out during the day and at night, in person and online. To be human is to want to do it—to need to do it. But this “it” is probably not what you think." "Intercourse is a connection or interaction between people—an exchange, especially of thoughts and feelings." "Human social information exchange moves beyond topics like food, safety, friendship, or…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates29/10/22 08:36 PM
17

Considering how many people, parents included, get outraged at the very sight of a boy wearing a dress, I'd be shocked if there wasn't a strong correlation between boys not playing with dolls and the stigma associated with them doing so. I, myself, am a fairly masculine guy who never had any interest in cars, LEGOs, or other traditionally "boys' toys" -- instead, I gravitated toward toys with faces. I would gather up my action figures and stuffed animals and use them as actors for the stories in…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates23/10/22 10:13 PM
1

Sexism itself is a problem if your aim is to be egalitarian. And the claim was that there was a tendency for misogyny specifically; u/nam24 didn't use the term 'sexism' once.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates15/10/22 06:50 AM
-3

Where did they say, or even imply, that sexism is an issue exclusive to r/mensrights?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates15/10/22 06:35 AM
-6

"If you think that sub is bad and hostile towards women, it doesnt contain the fraction of hostility towards men in pretty much any subreddit in this website" How is this not a whataboutism? It doesn't address any of the criticisms u/nam24 made
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates15/10/22 06:13 AM
-4

Feminist subs being worse doesn't in any way absolve the issues with r/MensRights. I'm not sure why the comparison is even being made -- the comment made no mention of Feminism whatsoever. This just seems like a deflection from criticism. While I agree that the reported misogyny in that sub is highly exaggerated, its definitely present. Just today I saw this comment posted with around 20 upvotes: "All the more reason to be very wily and crafty in the way we avoid women" And this comment with 65 …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates15/10/22 12:53 AM
14

Its a principle with regard to women's bodies, not men's. Remember, the body positivity movement was a response to the standards of beauty that pressured women specifically; it was never truly gender-neutral. There is no social stigma against mocking bald men, for example.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates13/10/22 11:25 PM
1

Before 'Incel' it was 'neckbeard', before that it was 'basement dweller', before that it was simply 'virgin'. This current iteration may stem from a self-imposed label, but the association between sexless men and antisocial behavior remains.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates13/10/22 10:44 PM
1

I guess you missed it the first time but my point is this: if she's not trying to avoid rape, what is she trying to avoid? Awkwardness? Question for you: is excoriating an innocent man's feelings and making him feel like a monster justifiable merely to avoid "awkwardness"? My contention is that it is childish and extremely selfish to do this over so trivial a matter. It represents a serious lack of regard for men and emotional intelligence in understanding how they might feel. I guess you missed…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates09/09/22 05:05 PM
1

And regardless, part of being a mature adult is having unpleasant conversations and facing things in a direct manner instead of trying to avoid them. Avoiding your problems instead of facing them head on is just childish. And once again, my point is not that this is the best response, my point is that it doesn't necessarily suggest that she's trying to avoid rape; this the second time I'm repeating this. Also, rejecting men in a direct manner can sometimes lead to pretty bad outcomes depending o…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates09/09/22 01:19 AM
1

I have no problem invalidating someone's experiences if they're based on prejudice or outright falsehoods. And you'll note at the end of my comment I did acknowledge that there are indeed women who treat men this way. If a woman made a post asserting that men don't respect women's bodily autonomy, I wouldn't keep myself from refuting her simply because she's "speaking her truth."
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates08/09/22 09:36 PM
0

How is it awkward to simply tell someone you are not interested? I would think that using deceitful methods to dance around the issue, rather than clear communication, is what would be awkward. You don't understand how rejecting someone could be awkward? Some people tend to feel bad when the person they have romantic or sexual interest in makes it clear that the feeling is not mutual -- some people don't enjoy making others feel that way. Again, lying like this may not be the best response, but …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates08/09/22 09:17 PM
2

It is rationalized as defense against all men because all men are potential rapists. They have to pretend as if its applied evenly to all men so that if she accepts the 6'3 asshole but rejects the 5'8 nice guy, she can say "well the 5'8 guy was being creepy" and no one will question it. The implication here is that women are either deceitful or lack the self-awareness to understand their own motivations. Supposedly, women don't actually believe that all men are potential rapists, they just tell …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates08/09/22 07:19 PM
3

So you acknowledge that this supposed "force field" isn't applied to men as a whole. I don't know what kind of women you associate with, but from what I've observed, most rational women aren't rejecting a polite 5'8 guy on the basis that he might rape her; if she rejects him its usually because she simply isn't interested. And this aggressive 6'3 jock (or "chad") who makes disgusting sexual remarks towards women is exactly the type of guy that many women avoid like the plague. This may come as a…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates08/09/22 04:48 PM
8

Let's be clear: the vast majority of women do not treat all men like potential rapists. If they did, modern heterosexual women would never marry, never date, and would be voluntarily celibate. There are countless women who use dating apps to meet up with men they've never previously met. There are women who travel abroad by themselves, women who walk home alone after dark, women who go to nightclubs filled with drunk men; these are not the behaviors of a person who believes that any man could be…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates08/09/22 03:35 PM
74

"women simply need variety and novelty of sexual experience more than men do." "Men who have regular sex with their partners are more satisfied sexually and with their relationship, but it’s not the same for the women." These are standard Red Pill talking points, only gender-swapped.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates25/08/22 02:53 PM
1

It is then logically consistent to see feminists as misandrists. Even if it the definition you gave was the formal, and only, definition of Feminism (it isn't; although many do nowadays, you don't actually have to subscribe to patriarchy theory to qualify as a Feminist Feminism: the advocacy of women's rights on the basis of the equality of the sexes) it still wouldn't logically follow that all feminists are misandrists. There were former Black slaves who were treated brutally by their masters, …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/08/22 11:28 PM
1

Feminism is the belief that men have oppressed women for thousands of years. I'm not sure what point you're attempting to make here. Firstly, that is simply one definition of Feminism, and not even the formal one. Second, the generalizations made in the post do not logically follow from the definition of Feminism, unlike racism and white supremacy. Depending on what is being argued in the post, yes. Large swathes of the Left do hate men, so it's an acceptable generalization. "Large swathes" is d…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/08/22 10:49 PM
1

White supremacy is the belief that white people constitute a superior race and communism advocates for the abolishment of private ownership, which is antithetical to capitalism, so those example statements aren't generalizations, they're logical consistencies; a white supremacist who isn't racist is definitionally not a white supremacist, a communist who champions capitalism is definitionally not a capitalist. While it may be less offensive, a false generalization about an ideological group is j…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/08/22 02:48 PM
-2

Generalizations don't allow for exceptions and you just acknowledged that the OP generalized in his post, which is what I'm referring to.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/08/22 01:28 AM
3

I'm well aware of the lore. My issue isn't with any of the criticisms you levied in your post, indeed I think that highlighting the blatant hypocrisy of r/Feminism, and by extension r/MensLib, is important for debunking the tired argument that the problems with feminism are within its margins, not the center. All I'm saying is that, for the sake of optics and integrity, its important to be precise with where that criticism is levied. A simple change from "feminists" to "many feminists" or "the t…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/08/22 01:23 AM
1

So you're choosing to only be as intellectually honest as they are to us? I thought we were striving to be better than they are. And this comes at the cost of potentially alienating MensLib users who'd otherwise be open to engagement.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/08/22 01:04 AM
-2

Just because the OP doesn't literally say "all feminists" doesn't mean he isn't generalizing them. If I say "Republicans hate immigrants" the implication is that all of them do. Also, a generalization doesn't necessarily have to refer to every single member of a group to qualify as such; to say that even most Republicans hate immigrants would still be generalizing. Regardless of whether the group is innate or not, for the sake of optics and intellectual honesty, it would behoove us to be more pr…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/08/22 12:36 AM
3

You are conflating so many different concepts; capitalism, gender roles, homophobia; so long as a man is the one reinforcing it, its patriarchy, apparently. Have you ever heard a masculine girl called a "dyke" for having short hair and wearing men's clothes? That's literally sexism (and homophobia), which is distinct from patriarchy. Have you noticed that rich women also decide what the poor, women, and men must do? That's literally capitalism, which is distinct from patriarchy. Have you ever be…
/r/MensRights22/08/22 01:35 AM
1

I would hope not. Clearly then, traditional gender roles such as this are still inflicting extreme harm on the men of today, not because of biological differences but because of cultural norms perpetuated by society. Biology determines that men be, generally speaking, physically stronger than women, but it is the Ukrainian government that determined for women, even women without children, to have no civic duty to defend their own country, leaving male civilians to shoulder that burden themselves…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates19/08/22 08:47 AM
1

Ukrainian Men, and only the men, being barred from leaving their country so they can fight in the war is a gendered role imposed by a societal institution (the Ukrainian government).
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates18/08/22 09:17 PM
12

And it ignores that the last half century, men have been harmed more by feminist laws and propaganda than by traditional roles. Traditional gender roles are why a generation of young Ukrainian men were barred from leaving their country while the women weren't, why men are expected to initiate romance and be the breadwinner, why men are shamed for not leaving the house after they graduate, why men are expected to protect women even at the cost of their own safety. So much of what male advocates f…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates14/08/22 10:55 PM
19

Andrew Tate and Fresh&Fit promote ideologies that are founded on biological essentialism. They believe that men should pursue as much sex, wealth, and "clout" as they can, and that attaining these things is what makes a man valuable. On the other hand, they (ironically) view women as shallow materialists who don't actually know what they want. They believe that its a woman's place to serve her man, and that as long as that man provides for her material needs, she will (due to evolutionary "hardw…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates14/08/22 06:19 PM
2

But you weren't advocating for men's rights in this instance, were you? I get what you're saying, that in many feminist spaces, those advocating for men are silenced in a similar way, but that isn't what's happening here. If we're going to make arguments, it makes sense to use evidence that supports those specific arguments.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates14/08/22 02:29 AM
7

While I wouldn't go so far as to call this fascism (authoritarian might be more apt) its still very discouraging that such an innocuous response would be met with an outright permaban. How does this relate to men's issues though?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates13/08/22 09:25 PM
1

"The secret of change is to focus all of your energy, not on fighting the old, but on building the new..." -- Socrates
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates03/08/22 12:19 AM
1

"Would you say that I'm privileged for having access to 'loving partners'?" I didn't ask if I'd be privileged to have sex, we aren't talking about just having access to sex. Also, we aren't talking about what you want, we're talking about what women want, particularly women who are looking for a loving, long-term relationship.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates30/07/22 02:05 PM
1

Having a bunch of people who'd want to have sex with you ≠ having a bunch of people who would love and/or respect you. Indeed, having to filter through partners who are only interested in you for your sex traits makes finding meaningful relationships that much more difficult, not to mention emotionally draining. As a black male, if most of the women I dated were only interested in me because they thought I'd have a large penis, or wanted the experience of sleeping with a black guy, would you say…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates29/07/22 02:00 PM
1

Not all women have to do that though. Lets not forget there are plenty of women who are content to get one night stands. We're not talking about those women though, we're talking about women who are looking for love, for long-term relationships based on meaningful human connections. What you're essentially saying is that having more options actually sucks because its hard to decide. I'll say this as plainly as I can "That is a problem I would wish to have." No, its not a matter of choosing betwe…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates25/07/22 03:41 PM
6

Women don't have access to a buffet of options when it comes to love; they have a buffet of options of guys to sleep with, and they have to sort though all of those to find one who will actually care for them beyond what sexual gratification they can provide. This isn't some minor inconvenience we're talking about here, this speaks to a fundamental struggle that women have with earning respect and acknowledgement for something other than their appearance. Of course it can be nice to receive posi…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates25/07/22 12:20 AM
7

So you think women are privileged to have access to sex even if it isn't emotionally fulfilling for them? Simply because men's access is more restrictive? The problem here is that you're framing sex as an inherently valuable act, no matter who you do it with; most women don't feel that way.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/07/22 09:19 PM
-7

Women can generally attain sexual partners more easily than men, but unless they meet strict beauty standards its likely that most of the partners they match with will only be interested in sex and will have zero regard for them beyond that; as I said in another comment in this thread, overweight women will often sleep with men who are ashamed to even be seen in public with them. Many (not most) men will treat conventionally unattractive women as an easy lay, or they'll date them for a while but…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates23/07/22 09:55 PM
-12

A common problem that overweight women face is that most of the men they sleep with are only interested in a purely sexual relationship, with many being ashamed to even be seen in public with them. Perhaps you wouldn't mind being used and discarded so long as you were afforded sex, but for most women this is an extremely daunting prospect. So although even conventionally unattractive women can still manage to find a sexual partner, that sex will often be more traumatic than it is fulfilling. If …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates23/07/22 05:52 PM
-5

If he wants to get a girlfriend, he has to be gregarious and outgoing, show gumption, show enthusiasm, approach people, be friendly, be disarming, be warm, etc. because you can bet no one is going to through all that effort for him. In this context, women aren't being "icy" for the sake of attracting men, its to repel them. When they actually do want to attract a man, women will not only have to be warm, congenial, and often submissive, they will usually have to meet standards of physical beauty…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates23/07/22 04:05 PM
8

So, because traditional gender roles were established within the context of a patriarchal society, our modern society is patriarchal so long as even vestiges of those roles still exist? If you define patriarchy as 'a society with patriarchal gender roles', you've created a circular definition. "Patrilineal inheritance and segregation of labor between men and women" is, more or less, what I would consider to be a necessary condition for sustained patriarchy; the gender roles that were derived fro…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates22/07/22 10:13 PM
13

Most of what you describe just seems like a capitalistic society that enforces sexist gender roles, not necessarily a patriarchal one. Couldn't we have an equal ratio of men and women at the top and still have social expectations for how each gender is supposed to behave? Couldn't there be a matriarchy that was homophobic and disapproving of sexual openness? In what way do you think men have ownership over women's reproductive capacity, specifically in developed countries? It seems to me that th…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates22/07/22 04:41 PM
1

OK, I just don't seem to be getting through, and I don't want to keep reiterating the same points. Please, please try to understand: respect women does not imply that every single woman should be regarded with high esteem simply because they're women. When someone says "respect women" they aren't saying that even female murderers deserve to admired. "Respect women" is a call for society to address the ways that women have historically been disrespected, to give consideration to their issues.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates15/05/22 04:14 PM
1

I don't mean to be rude, truly, but I still think there's a miscommunication between us. Its true that respect in the sense of high-esteem is generally earned (you can earn this kind of respect by possessing admirable qualities, such as loyalty or honesty), but that's not the kind of respect that "respect women" is referring to; in this context, 'respect' is synonymous with 'consideration for'. Respect for someone's personal boundaries, for example, isn't something that has to be earned, that re…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates15/05/22 05:51 AM
3

No, I meant include. BLM isn't obligated to include Latinos, male advocacy isn't obligated to include females. When a pro-choice, abortion advocate says "respect women" what they mean is that society needs to fully respect the bodily autonomy of women. That person isn't obligated to amend their slogan to "respect both women and men" because they're advocating specifically for women. I agree with you that its important for us to respect and support both men and women, but I also think its importa…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates15/05/22 04:15 AM
1

Again, you're misinterpreting what 'respect' means in this context. Its not meant to imply that women should be respected just for being women, the idea is that consideration needs to be given to women, in relation to the issues they're facing. Yes, sexual harassment of men needs to be addressed more, just as police brutality within Latino communities needs to be addressed more. What I'm saying is that a community can advocate for themselves and the issues they face without including other group…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates15/05/22 03:14 AM
1

Absolutely there are ways that both men and women aren't generally respected. That said, this slogan was probably created in relation to specific problems women were facing that society wasn't sufficiently addressing, such as sexual harassment. Black Americans aren't the only ones who get racially profiled by police officers, but criticizing the BlackLivesMatter slogan for not being inclusive of Latino Americans would sort of be missing the point. Similarly, as a subreddit dedicated to advocatin…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates15/05/22 02:16 AM
1

I knew this post seemed familiar: https://www.reddit.com/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates/comments/mxpe7j/respecting_women/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x&context=3 I think you may be misinterpreting the slogan; you're using 'respect' in the sense of high-esteem or admiration for someone, but in this context its generally meant in the sense of due consideration (its the difference between having respect for a person's character and having respect for a person's privacy). Even the most die hard feminis…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates15/05/22 01:18 AM
1

Not surprising, you've failed to comprehend me from the beginning and have made zero effort to do so.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates05/05/22 10:59 PM
1

You clearly don't understand what theory means in this context, just as you didn't understand what gender roles meant. The idea behind a unified theoretical framework is to have one body of knowledge, founded on some underlying principle, that builds over time, and that anyone can contribute to; its not some set law that irrefutably explains all of sexism. That the MRM has no theoretical basis is simply untrue There are prominent figures of the MRM who have "theories" related to gender politics …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates05/05/22 08:18 PM
1

The MRM doesn't have a unified theory for systemic sexism/gender roles to replace patriarchy theory. Nothing wrong with "making stinky faces", the problem is that's what the vast majority of men's rights advocacy consists of; we call out society's double standards against men, and we criticize Feminists for supporting, or ignoring, those double standards. In its current form, the MRM is more reactive than it is proactive. You downvoted me, but your response to my comment showed that you didn't e…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates05/05/22 07:22 PM
2

Liberating men from their gender roles isn't about coercing them against being masculine, its about dissolving the societal pressure to conform to a set standard of behavior on the basis of their gender identity. Where did I imply that male advocacy should only be focused on ending gender roles? Of course there are a myriad of other issues impacting men, which I've discussed at great length on this sub.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates30/04/22 08:49 PM
-5

I strongly agree, I'm tired of male advocacy being stuck in the endless mire that is anti-Feminism. As it stands, the MRM has a tendency of attracting reactionaries who are far more concerned with criticizing Feminists than they are with liberating men from their gender role, sort of like how MensLib attracts Feminists who are more concerned with keeping men from becoming radicalized misogynists than with their overall well-being. One would hope that the common thread that unites male advocates …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates30/04/22 08:37 AM
1

No, its because we separated the church from the State so it has no power to enforce its doctrine on us. Many Muslim Majority Nations don't separate religion from the law, thus homosexuality remains illegal in many Muslim majority Nations. Christian churches still have institutional power in America, even with the separation of Church and state; Christian lobbying groups exert pressure on Republicans, just as Feminist lobbying groups exert pressure on Democrats. Even with this power, social osmo…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates29/03/22 09:58 PM
1

I think it makes sense to be critical of it, of course, and to work with Feminists who want to correct for that bias while advocating for men on our own terms. To echo the rules of the sub, I think we need to challenge Feminist ideology wherever its fails to be egalitarian or truthful. I don't think we need to tear down the symbol of Feminism or try to convince Feminists to distance themselves from it. People's attachment to a symbol is generally based more on emotion and personal background tha…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/03/22 12:48 AM
1

… I'm saying the exact opposite. Men have an out group bias, and women have an in group bias. Both men and women are more concerned with protecting women.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates27/03/22 10:06 PM
1

When legislators are aware of men's issues they still don't work toward resolving them, and neither does society at large. After women were granted the same basic human rights as men, they, with men's assistance, leveraged their newfound political capital to further liberate themselves from their gender role. When men had more political capital, there was no concerted effort to liberate men from their gender role. Feminists don't need to erase men's issues; we've seen them and have already deter…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates27/03/22 06:20 PM
1

That isn't the point. The point is that indifference to men has remained constant, yet it hasn't for women, even though men had more political representation and power. In nations where women were eventually granted equal rights and protections under the law, society continued to address other ways in which women were unfairly treated due to their gender. Today, in those nations, most men and women are well aware of the misogyny women face, the struggles they endure, and care about protecting th…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates27/03/22 04:55 AM
1

Obviously. The point is that even before the advent of mainstream Feminism, the politically powerful were indifferent to the way men suffered under their assigned gender role, despite the fact that they were men themselves.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates27/03/22 03:37 AM
38

I'll just repost this comment: Its funny, we can look at statements such as "women are bad at math" or "women should be slim" and have no problem identifying them as misogynistic, but when it comes to ideas like "men lack emotional intelligence" or "men should be muscular" no one seems to want to use the word misandry.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates27/03/22 01:46 AM
8

Most women aren't psychopathically malicious, just as most men aren't rapists, so I would say no.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates26/03/22 11:38 PM
1

Women didn't have political capital, many men did. Even so, society still treated female rape victims with more compassion than male ones, and regarded female war casualties as being more tragic.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates26/03/22 11:36 PM
1

I was simply using the US an example, the same is true elsewhere. Through Academia and cultural osmosis, Feminism has reached deep into the bedrock of modern liberal thought; Feminism is essentially the branch of liberalism that relates to gender politics. Google 'Mainstream Feminism' and you'll soon discover that its just another term for liberal Feminism, which was the foundation of Feminism as an ideology. Even if you don't identify as either a Feminist or a liberal, there's a good chance tha…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates26/03/22 07:02 AM
1

because Feminism is the de facto ideology of the left and the sole authority on gender politics I've already alluded to the fact that its Feminist influence on liberal ideology that helps to convince liberals that men don't need support. That said, the nature of the male gender role is one of self-reliance, so society has never been especially eager to give men and women equal support. The point is that this is the default liberal position, as well as the default conservative position. Feminist …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates26/03/22 03:38 AM
1

Justice System is not an ideology and hence its fixable no matter how corrupt it may be. You're missing the point of the analogy. Feminism is a political ideology, one that has a rather large political movement behind it. Movements can be changed, or 'fixed', and when political movements change, their ideologies tend to evolve. Look at Christianity or Islam: these religions have a deep ideological basis for homophobia, supported by interpretations of their scriptures, yet many Christians and Mus…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates26/03/22 02:31 AM
1

Of course, but they already don't have the support of those who don't believe that, and in this hypothetical everyone's beliefs are unchanged. The question is would policy makers have less power to act against men's interest. You seem to be under the impression that the reason Feminist groups are able to influence legislation is because politicians are looking at some poll, seeing that Feminism is popular, and deciding to go along with it on that basis; that isn't how it works. Within liberal so…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates26/03/22 01:26 AM
1

Yes, and TERFs are being condemned by mainstream Feminists. My point was that there have been improvements, not that cis women weren't always the primary focus.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates25/03/22 08:03 PM
1

Please answer the question.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates25/03/22 05:46 PM
1

Adopting the label does not, by itself, support misandrist Feminists. Once again I ask you this: If everyone decided to abandon the Feminist label, but still held to the belief that men have class privilege over women, or that men don't need as much social protection as women do, would policy makers have any less power to act against men's interest?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates25/03/22 02:45 PM
1

That's like saying working tirelessly to fix the American justice system, which is inherently racist, is a waste of time. Feminist ideology has changed over the years. The most prominent second-wave Feminists were often anti-porn, white-centric, and trans exclusive. The current wave of Feminism is porn-friendly, Intersectional, and trans inclusive. Do you honestly believe that those changes have had zero positive impact? I imagine most Trans women wouldn't think so.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates25/03/22 02:39 PM
2

The only way to unequivocally dissociate yourself and your beliefs from them and their beliefs (and the harm they do) is by calling yourself something different. Unless that is you wish to use your platform as a feminist to raise awareness of these issues and voice your condemnations. Though I warn you if you choose that path you will be quickly demonized and silenced by any feminist community you choose to speak in. One moment you're telling Feminists that, unless they're actively combating it,…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates25/03/22 04:10 AM
1

Feminism is the de facto ideology of liberal institutions, therefore it has massive influence over most of our lives, men and women alike. Since Feminism doesn't seem to be going away anytime soon, I want to try to make it better, even if its only by a little. And it has gotten better. About a month ago, someone in the sub posted pictures of male suicide-prevention posters that were tagging the walls of her university, providing detailed advice for how best to support men who may be suicidal. Lo…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates25/03/22 02:37 AM
1

Again, I'm pretty much in agreement (although the homophobia within Christianity is as informed by scripture as it is by the church, so it might be more complicated than simply a change of policy). As I said to Forgetaboutthelonely: "On the other hand, if enough of a voter base starts taking men's issues seriously as well, especially the Feminists of the LibLeft, Liberal politicians will be pressured to address those issues, whether or not they care themselves. A Feminist who isn't willing to ab…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates25/03/22 12:28 AM
2

I don't disagree with much of you said here, but I don't see that my point was contradicted. To many, maybe even most Feminists, Feminism equates to the empowerment of women for the sake of gender equality. Is there a culture of misandry? Absolutely. Is Feminist theory deeply problematic? Hell yes. But in their minds, Feminism ultimately stands for something noble and good, and even if you can get them to see the misandry, they would sooner start a new wave of Feminism than leave the pool foreve…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/03/22 09:03 AM
1

If everyone on Reddit decided to abandon the Feminist label, but still held to the belief that men have class privilege over women, or that men don't need as much social protection as women do, would those policy makers have any less power to act against men's interest? Liberal politicians don't need to publicly identify as Feminists to gain support among their consituents; although that label can certainly help, what matters more is simply endorsing policies that would, ostensibly, empower wome…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/03/22 07:50 AM
-1

So simply labelling yourself as a Feminist, even if all it means to you is supporting women's rights (which is what it essentially means to many Feminists) is implicitly supporting the misandrists within the movement? Do American patriots implicitly support the military industrial complex, or neoliberalism, or systemic racism?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/03/22 05:21 AM
-3

There have been quite a few Feminists who've engaged in good faith conversations here. Telling them that their entire movement is unsalvagable will likely keep even the more open-minded Feminists at bay.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/03/22 04:36 AM
12

The author of the article is a Feminist and she herself regards male-only conscription as benevolent sexism towards women. Of course, not all Feminists share her view (many are actually against gender-neutral conscription, https://www.womenalliance.org/no-to-female-conscription/) nonetheless, the position that a male-only draft is sexist isn't exactly novel among progressive Feminists, and I don't mean sexist against men. I can cite more sources if you'd like but this isn't really difficult to c…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates21/03/22 09:44 PM
24

https://www.forbes.com/sites/kimelsesser/2021/11/18/senate-discusses-women-registering-for-the-draft-benevolent-sexism-abounds/?sh=65e4c24653af
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates21/03/22 04:20 PM
1

This video analyzes and critiques the cultural glamorization of male sacrifice, particularly within Hollywood films. In our society, the noblest hero is the one who chooses to sacrifice his life in the defense of others', or for the 'greater good'. The noble hero charges head on into danger with little regard for his own safety, for what is his body but a weapon to be wielded, or a shield to be raised? He sees beauty not in himself, but in that which he must protect, and through his sacrifice he…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates18/03/22 07:27 PM
1

This video analyzes and critiques the cultural glamorization of male sacrifice, particularly within Hollywood films. In our society, the noblest hero is the one who chooses to sacrifice his life in the defense of others', or for the 'greater good'. The noble hero charges head on into danger with little regard for his own safety, for what is his body but a weapon to be wielded, or a shield to be raised? He sees beauty not in himself, but in that which he must protect, and through his sacrifice he…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates18/03/22 07:14 PM
1

Could you give a direct quote from these Feminists acknowledging the role that misandry plays in the suffering of black men? I don't mean simply highlighting black men's unique experiences with racism.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates20/02/22 10:49 PM
6

If a pregnant woman has the means of aborting the fetus, and the "father" wants the fetus aborted, how is he still responsible when the woman decides not only to give birth to the child, but to raise it as a mother? If she didn't have the means of providing for a child without the father's financial support, she had the opportunity to opt out of motherhood and its responsibilities.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates15/02/22 10:38 PM
1

I really don't think you can disentangle the egalitarian concerns from the misandry within the movement, especially because the radfems have taken over, and for all intents and purposes feminism is equivalent to patriarchy theory with its men as oppressors and women as oppressed power dynamic. I'm not suggesting we try to preserve Feminism here, the idea is that we cultivate an environment where we critique Feminism without making potential advocates feel like we're giving them an ultimatum; mos…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates26/01/22 07:00 AM
-1

I think there's a middle ground here where we can critique the aspects of Feminism that we find harmful to men without decrying the movement as a whole. Even if many of us have compelling reasons to believe that the problems with Feminism are baked into the ideology and that there is little chance for men to have a equal place within the movement, I think we have to come to terms with the fact that any political success we can hope to have will heavily depend on our ability to get Feminists to s…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates25/01/22 04:01 AM
5

You've side-stepped my question; where did he imply that women don't bad mouth men?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/01/22 10:15 PM
3

The key difference is that, historically, when elements of black culture were appropriated into white culture, it was without acknowledgment of their true origin. Because black communities were segregated from white ones, and because they had relatively little representation within popular media, white artists could lay claim to the works of black artists and no one, except a small fraction of those black communities, would be the wiser. This "whitewashing" effectively reinforced the widely-held…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/01/22 08:53 AM
0

"you’re making it out to seem like this is a one sided thing that men only do to women." Where in his comment did he do this? This seems like a projection.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates23/01/22 09:48 PM
21

If we're going to prioritize violent offenders by their gender majority, why not also prioritize victims by their gender majority? In 2020, 80% of all reported murder victims in the U.S. were men.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates21/01/22 05:40 AM
1

I haven't redefined anything. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gender_role - "A gender role, also known as a sex role, is a social role encompassing a range of behaviors and attitudes that are generally considered acceptable, appropriate, or desirable for a person based on that person's biological or perceived sex." What you seem to be referring to are social trends within gendered groups. I don't know the precise term for that, if there is one, but toxic social trends seems fine since trends aren'…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates11/11/21 10:38 AM
1

Did you read passed that part? I explained in the last paragraph. "Gender roles, or other social roles, aren't simply common modes of behavior; 99% of men wearing pants isn't in itself a gender role. Gender roles are standards that prescribe how men and women ought to behave according to their assigned gender, they determine what is acceptable. So, if no one in this society is batting an eye at men in skirts, if no one finds that unacceptable, then wearing pants wouldn't be a gender role imposed…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates11/11/21 10:04 AM
3

Ok, so ALL gender roles, or rather, gender roles as a concept, are toxic then? There aren't any that are completely neutral? It can and will be toxic to those who don't fit into that role, or struggle remaining within it. The idea is that gender doesn't inform a persons character, ideals, attitudes, etc., so fitting them into a role on that basis will often lead to disharmony. And even if a man does fit perfectly into his gender role and derives satisfaction from it, since its a role which socie…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates11/11/21 09:32 AM
2

I'm not sure "toxic", or any other such qualifier, is even necessary. The expectation imposed on men and women to behave in particular ways on the basis of their sex/gender will inevitably be toxic for whomever feels restricted by those expectations. The problem isn't just that society expects men to be invulnerable, its that we even have qualifications for manhood in the first place. Personally, when referring to patterns of behavior which men/males are expected to perform, I use the term 'male…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates11/11/21 06:23 AM
1

Not always, but that's a pretty subjective/nebulous quality anyway. So you're saying that generalizing ideological groups is fine so long as you determine that it isn't too "egregious"? What is your criteria for egregious assertions?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates10/11/21 05:57 PM
1

Really? I've lingered on this sub for over a year now and I've seen quite a few comments be deleted for making sweeping generalizations about conservatives. To be fair, I've also seen you delete comments for generalizing feminists (albeit not as consistently), which is why this PSA caught me by surprise.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates10/11/21 05:31 AM
3

Would a comment asserting that 'most conservatives support strict gender roles' be acceptable to make here then? How about 'conservatives support men's rights only in reaction to feminism'? After all, conservatism isn't an immutable characteristic. I thought the idea behind removing comments that generalized groups of people on any basis, whether it be ideological or biological, was to avoid alienating members of such groups from this community, which would not only keep us from becoming an echo…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates09/11/21 03:07 PM
6

I understand, still we probably shouldn't throw percentages like that around unless we can back them up with actual statistics.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/11/21 01:57 AM
9

Its obviously not just a single, or other insignificant quantity, of feminists who support gender quotas, but 40%? How did you come up with that?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/11/21 12:56 AM
17

I'm genuinely confused and surprised by how vitriolic some of the users here are against a sub that's so moderate and careful not to offend. There are several commenters here describing the issues they have with menslib in detail, and that's precisely what the OP has done in this post. Clearly their experiences contrast with your own, but please don't dismiss their criticisms out of hand because of that; their negative experiences with menslib don't invalidate your positive ones. Does finding th…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates03/11/21 07:49 AM
2

Is this instance of discrimination entangled with misandry? That isn't made clear at all in the post.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates17/10/21 03:22 AM
1

He isn't, so far as I can tell; he's only commenting on the half that he saw.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates17/10/21 03:09 AM
6

Except his comment takes a few seconds to read while Chappelle's special is over an hour long. If they didn't find the first half funny, why should they continue watching? Even if the second half turned out to be hilarious, its highly unlikely that it would retroactively render the first half funny as well.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates15/10/21 04:40 PM
1

Considering the identity of the accused, coupled with the fact that this is coming from an anonymous online source, I hope you can understand my extreme skepticism. I do generally take sexual assault claims seriously, even in the absence of evidence, but the context of this claim leaves way too much room for doubt. His credibility isn't helped by him repeatedly commenting the phrase "I was sexually assaulted by [name of high profile US politician]", by itself, without any explanation. Its as tho…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates09/10/21 09:42 PM
4

I don't take this seriously either, and not because he's (presumably) male. I suspect that making an extraordinary claim on an anonymous reddit account, without any evidence, on a subreddit which you've never posted on before, doesn't take very much effort.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/10/21 03:36 PM
3

Are we actually entertaining this? Without any corroborating evidence?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/10/21 02:54 PM
5

But that doesn't mean the expectation that the one making the offer shouldn't be the one with first expectation to pay for it. What is the benefit in perpetuating this arbitrary social norm? It seems to be based on this weird idea that the person who initiates a date is meant to play host to other party, that acceptance of a date presupposes one's position as the "guest" to be treated to. When I initiate a dinner date, it isn't with the implication that I'll be "treating the person to a meal", I…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates04/10/21 04:46 PM
3

Reasonable suspicion is one thing, but is that justification enough to delete the comment? Couldn't you have simply asked them for clarification of what they meant? As someone who upvoted the comment, it seemed pretty clear to me that they weren't disparaging male advocacy as a political action; other people who upvoted it might've had the same perception.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates20/09/21 04:52 AM
6

It looks like vote manipulation. That's why we pulled the plug on it. Isn't that rather presumptive? They said they hated the MRM, not that they hated men or advocating for men's rights; we should know better than anyone that a political movement is distinct from its ideals.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates20/09/21 02:49 AM
4

Misandry: dislike of, contempt for, or ingrained prejudice against men (i.e. the male sex) While hatred of men would certainly qualify as misandry, its only one aspect. Examples of prejudice against men are that men are inherently prone to violence, that men are simple-minded compared to women, or that men aren't naturally paternal. So if I, as a man, believed that I lacked emotional complexity simply because of my gender, that belief could be accurately interpreted as internalized misandry. Its…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates14/09/21 09:01 PM
11

This video highlights patterns of male disadvantage throughout the world by referencing statistical data from a variety of sources, particularly those cited in Warren Farrell's book, "The Boy Crisis." Here are a few of the stats he presents, all of which are extremely disturbing: "Black males make up 43% of murder victims throughout the overall population, and more American black boys between 10-20 are killed by homicide than by the next nine leading causes of death combined." "Boys who perform …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates08/09/21 02:09 AM
1

How do you know that his maleness played a role in protecting him? I brought up the point about men being more likely to be imprisoned to highlight that, in our society, not only does being male not protect one from prosecution, a male is likely to face a more severe sentence than they would if they were female. Weinstein was a person of wealth and, more importantly, influence. Weinstein's behavior was an open secret in Hollywood for so long because people, both men and women, knew that he had t…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates01/09/21 04:38 PM
5

Who mentioned validity? We were discussing why MGTOW is stigmatized.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates31/08/21 01:56 AM
2

No, not really. Are you implying that female judges would be more balanced in their sentencing of criminals than male ones are? If so, I can link research showing that women's in-group bias is around 4 times higher than men, generally speaking.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates31/08/21 01:47 AM
2

Men are more likely than women to be imprisoned for the same crime, so that's a pretty weak argument.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates30/08/21 11:36 PM
3

I guess what the article and the #MeToo ideology points out for me is that women are incapable of seeing the faults of all humans in themselves. Rule #6: Don't demonize women.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates30/08/21 05:10 AM
4

It entirely depends on what they perceive to be a hate sub. Obviously, we don't see ourselves as that, but they're probably not operating by our standards. If focusing on men's issues while rejecting Feminist ideology is enough to make us a hate group in the eyes of againsthatesubreddits, then that's what we already are and will likely continue to be.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/08/21 10:57 PM
5

That may be true on a personal level, but MGTOW communities go well beyond simply spreading awareness.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/08/21 06:35 AM
6

While I agree that there's a stigma associated with single men, the stigma of MGTOW mostly comes from the bitterness within its online communities. Its one thing to realize that the deck is stacked against you, its another to perpetually brood over your predicament, and to obsess over the one thing you've committed to avoiding.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates27/08/21 06:36 PM
3

Wow. If you don't think we can be successful, why are you even here?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/08/21 07:45 PM
10

How can you expect male advocacy to have political success with this attitude? If a feminist wants to support men but isn't willing to abandon their ideology, are we supposed to just turn them away? There are countless people on the right who endorse traditional gender roles, who support policies and ideals which actively harm men, but if any of them were willing to work with us to bring attention to male issues, it would be foolish to antagonize them by saying something like "you cannot be cons…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/08/21 07:33 PM
1

That's an excellent idea. Teachers could still structure their lessons in the more traditional, lecture-based way, but a videogame could be used as a supplement to reinforce key concepts. I think a lot of boys would retain much more information that way.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates29/06/21 03:41 AM
2

I'm not saying there isn't a difference in how some male groups perceive school, I simply haven't seen evidence that these groups find school achievement to be "girly" (again, I'm speaking as a masculine dude who attended public school and was nearly held back from graduating due to my low GPA). There definitely is some perception that high grades equates to "nerdiness", and historically there's been a stigma associated with that (although that stigma seems to be rapidly dissolving), but the ste…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/06/21 07:30 PM
2

along with a perception among boys that being good at school is feminine (aka negative). So if we started addressing some of the attitudes that society has about school performance being feminine, not only would that probably improve school performance among guys, but it would reduce the culture around feminine qualities being less desirable and therefore benefit women too. I've seen this argument tossed around Feminist spaces quite often and I have to say it seems almost entirely speculative. A…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/06/21 05:37 PM
5

Personally, I'd prefer that the draft was abolished entirely, and that neither men or women had to be wage-slaves. I think most here would welcome political strategies that would benefit people of all genders, but not every solution to a male issue would necessarily benefit women, and vice versa for women's issues. For example, there is evidence to suggest that the disparity between boys and girls in academic performance is, at least in part, due to negative biases against boys and favoritism to…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/06/21 03:04 AM
5

Men do not hold more economic power than women, those who hold the very most economic power are mostly men; there's a big difference. And of those wealthy men, the vast majority are white, college educated, and come from an upper-middle class background. Black men do not hold any more economic or political power than black women. I'll also note that in the U.S., 70% of homeless individuals are men. https://endhomelessness.org/demographic-data-project-gender-and-individual-homelessness/
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/06/21 02:01 AM
60

And of course he attributes the hostility that effeminate men face to misogyny.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/06/21 04:18 AM
5

I'm not sure if that's true actually. From tv shows to movies to commercials, the incompetent dad trope is rampant. There are many exceptions, yes, but even among those the father is often portrayed as only being competent in stereotypically masculine activities. And the incompetent parent is almost exclusively the father. I can't even think of an example of a tv family in which the mother is the baffoon while the father is the responsible, intelligent one. I guess maybe I Love Lucy.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates15/06/21 02:38 AM
1

You're missing the point: I'm not comparing rape to false accusations, I'm saying that treating an entire gender, or other demographic, with suspicion because of the actions of a few (whether that be rape, robbery, false accusations, etc.) is irrational and will place undue strain on your relationships with members that demographic. But you are clearly convinced that a paranoid distrust of women is an appropriate measure for protecting yourself so I won't waste time trying to convince you otherw…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates09/06/21 06:07 AM
2

Most here understand that a false accusation can have life-shattering ramifications, myself included, but do not think to downplay the impact of rape. The pyschological trauma of sexual assault can take a lifetime to recover from, and many never fully do. There's also the risk of STDs, unwanted pregnancy, and lasting physical damage. The point here is not let the potential for either of these happening to sour your interactions with the opposite gender. That level of paranoia may keep you safer,…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates09/06/21 03:41 AM
3

And I know women who have been raped by men, but they're still able to sustain healthy relationships with men without worrying that they'll be taken advantage of one day.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates09/06/21 03:12 AM
5

This is being more than a little paranoid; to be so distrustful of women that you think any altercation might lead to a false accusation. Most women would never even consider doing something so heinous, just as most men wouldn't consider committing an act of sexual violence. Expecting the worst from one another will only increase the tension that exists between us.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates09/06/21 02:58 AM
1

This sub is dedicated to political engagement.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/06/21 05:04 AM
10

Patriarchy theory relates to men as a distinct class unto itself, not just upper class men. But yes, the upper class have obviously held the most political power within any given society, and upper class men most of all, generally speaking. Though to say that men had a more active role in decision making when most men had no role at all is misleading; it would be more accurate to say that the people who held those roles were mostly male, but certainly not exclusively. But let's be clear: the sta…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates05/06/21 02:46 AM
14

What influence did the vast majority of men have?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates05/06/21 12:06 AM
4

What evidence? You haven't provided evidence of a glass ceiling for white women, only for there being an extreme disparity of representation between white women and white men among the 1%. And you have completely ignored that white women have more representation than all men except for the specific demographic of white, college educated, heterosexual, cis-gendered men who are upper-middle class or above. And it isn't as though men of color have much, if any, more representation than women of col…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates04/06/21 02:53 PM
10

That's not about society not liking men, it's about society not liking men who "act like women" Oh no, it definitely is about society not liking men. Men are generally liked so long as they conform rigidly to their gender role; even the slightest deviation from it often results in censure, mockery, and even violence. Society's contempt extends not only to men who appear traditionally feminine, but also men who don't provide for their families, men who don't attract women, autistic men, short men…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates04/06/21 02:31 PM
2

So while white women aren't as commonly represented among politicians and corpos as white men are-- This is what I typed. I acknowledged the disparity between white men and women within positions of power; just because this disparity still exists doesn't mean that women are actively being excluded. When it comes to government and corporate positions, the glass ceiling for white women has pretty much been shattered.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates04/06/21 01:59 PM
5

Rule #11: "Images, memes and crossposts are fine. SO LONG as they're accompanied by a few sentences (preferably paragraphs) of your own words. in either a top level comment or in the post itself. And if your post can be summarized as saying "look at what X did/is doing" it's subject to be removed as being low effort." Mods, how is this not in violation?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates04/06/21 01:43 AM
16

"Intersectional" Feminists' main issue with TERFS is that they invalidate the identities of trans people. The reason why TERFS are so much more antagonistic toward trans women than they are toward trans men, though, is largely based on their perception of men as an oppressive class, and the misandry they're able to justify because of this. Though "Int" Feminists and TERFS differ in their acceptance of trans identities, they both subscribe to Patriarchy theory, which posits that men have dominion…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates04/06/21 01:31 AM
3

But women aren't excluded from positions of power now, yet its still true that women make up the larger percentage of college graduates, and are outperforming men at nearly every education level. So while white women aren't as commonly represented among politicians and corpos as white men are (they're still more represented than men of color, working class men, trans men, etc.) they outweigh all men within the primary avenues to institutional power, college and university.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates04/06/21 01:19 AM
3

Politicians and corporate execs aren't representative of most men. People without college degrees are even more underrepresented within places of power, and taking Associate's, Bachelor's, Master's, and Doctorate's together, women have earned 13 million more degrees than men since 1982.https://www.aei.org/carpe-diem/chart-of-the-day-the-incredible-13m-gender-college-degree-gap-since-1982-favoring-women/
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates03/06/21 08:08 PM
2

Yes there are many different Feminist ideologies. What I'm saying is that it would be reductive to limit the definition of Feminism to the tenet of gender equality. Yes, Intersectionality is a paradigm! That's exactly my point. Obviously, anyone can recognize that a black man has a different lived experience than a black woman, who themselves has a different lived experience than a gay black woman. This is not Intersectionality. Intersectionality uses established theories of political power stru…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/05/21 09:35 PM
2

The idea that various systems should be viewed as wholes, not merely as a collection of parts is Holism, which is distinct from Intersectionality. It's like saying Feminism is just about gender equality while ignoring its fundamental theories.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/05/21 08:39 PM
3

You do make a compelling argument. So you're suggesting that we keep the existing Intersectional framework but try to get the broader left to reevaluate men's position within it?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/05/21 08:20 PM
3

Intersectionality was introduced by Kimberlé Williams Crenshaw in her paper, "Demarginalizing the Intersection of Race and Sex: A Black Feminist Critique of Antidiscrimination Doctrine, Feminist Theory and Antiracist Politics". It was invented by a Feminist, popularized within Feminist academia, and is largely based on Patriarchy theory. What you're essentially advocating for is a Holistic approach to sociopolitical analysis, and of course that would be most appropriate if we want to understand …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/05/21 08:04 PM
6

Intersectionality is a political framework that is rooted in Feminism. Its meant to establish a unified, standardized assessment of how systems of power oppress marginalized groups; if it were to allow for conflicting political theories, it would lose its utility. Put another way, if we don't agree on whether or not male oppression exists, my intersectional analysis is going to look quite different from yours. If you separate Intersectionality from its political underpinnings, all it really is i…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/05/21 07:20 PM
6

https://www.awis.org/wp-content/uploads/intersectionality-sources-cited.jpg Yes, Intersectionality is used to analyze how different social and political identities interact to create a unique experience of oppression/privilege. The problem is, the experiences of each individual identity is assessed according to pre-established narratives of who is oppressed by systems of power, and who is advantaged by them. The standard Intersectional framework doesn't provide an accurate representation of male…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/05/21 06:35 PM
33

According to Intersectionality, the male identity is only oppressed when it intersects with a historically marginalized identity. A gay man faces oppression due to his sexuality, but not his gender. A black man faces oppression due to his race, but not his gender. Conversely, the female identity is privileged only when it intersects with an identity that is recognized as privileged (white, heterosexual, cis-gendered, etc.)
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/05/21 09:46 AM
50

The Intersectional framework holds males as a privileged identity, which is a hinderance to male advocacy.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/05/21 09:07 AM
6

I don't disagree, I'm just suggesting that we articulate how exactly they go hand-in-hand so as to not get side-tracked.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates23/05/21 08:37 AM
8

If we're going to criticize the left, it would be more productive to our goal of male advocacy to keep the focus centered on male discrimination. Although you did mention that left wing academia frequently demonizes men, the majority of the post does not relate to or support that statement. I, too, have problems with the mainstream approach to anti-racism, particularly Critical Race Theory, as it effectively reinforces race as a concept. But if we're going to discuss it, let's make sure there's …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates23/05/21 05:49 AM
4

This article tells a story of how a teenage girl grew to appreciate sexual innuendo and flirtation from adult men. There are also boys who feel lucky for "having sex" with a female teacher, and men who are envious of them. Now when it comes to interactions between adults, I think most reasonable people would agree that sexual innuendo is fine so long as its mutually consensual; those who believe otherwise should be given the same level of consideration as the people who believe heterosexual sex …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/05/21 01:13 AM
2

I would certainly hope so, but the post itself makes no effort to condemn this behavior, and the linked article doesn't condemn the twenty-something men who were making sexually suggestive jokes to a 15 year old.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates01/05/21 09:47 PM
8

To say that this post is even tangentially related to men's issues would be quite generous. Whether it is or not though, the appearance of defending sexual innuendo toward women could not possibly benefit the optics of this sub. I do understand the point of the article: that society underestimates female agency and feminine power to such a degree that jokes made at women's expense, even good-natured ones, are seen as inherently offensive. I don't disagree with that assessment, but does such an a…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates01/05/21 07:35 PM
12

Feminist are scum. Treat 'em like it. Attack ideas, not people.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates29/04/21 08:00 PM
1

I don't see most conservatives holding that view. Personal responsibility and self-control are lauded virtues among conservatives, and many have an almost fanatic commitment to criminal justice. While I wouldn't count on conservative communities to be strong advocates for victims of sexual assault, they certainly do hold rapists and other sexual predators fully accountable for their behavior, and probably advocate for more severe punishments than many liberals do.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/04/21 08:38 PM
18

Its good that you are comfortable defending yourself from a violent woman, but there are many men who aren't. Reddit is full of stories of men who were physically assaulted by their female partner, sometimes to the point of serious injury, yet were too reluctant to adequately defend themselves. And there are stories of men who have fought back only to find themselves framed as the aggressor, by their family, friends, and even authorities. You say that this post is "primarily a vehicle to express…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/04/21 11:38 PM
31

What message does this send to boys, too? If you see a woman or girl behaving or conducting herself in an absolutely terrible way it's okay for her to do it because she's female and you've got no right to call her out for it? Worse yet, what if the woman is being physically threatening or violent, you just let her get away with it just because she's female and there's this notion ingrained in society that it's wrong for a man to strike a woman? Doesn't seem like men are superfluous to his argume…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/04/21 10:09 PM
44

Where is the women bashing in this post? Or in any of the posts here? Please use direct quotes.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/04/21 09:24 PM
8

I think you raise some fair criticisms, and I, too, would like to see more critique being directed toward the right with regard to anti-male agendas. I partially disagree with your conclusion, however: Because of this, we should certainly spend more time pointing out laws, cases, statistics, biases in research that negatively affect men (we do this quite a bit already) instead of dissecting down and understanding feminism. Its important for us to do both, to raise awareness of legislation that w…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates08/04/21 11:32 PM
10

I don't agree with the stereotype than men are less emotionally literate than women, or that the main emotion they feel comfortable expressing is anger. Indeed, I see young men expressing their sadness, fears and vulnerabilities to each other all the time. I think part of the problem is that we have a rigid conception of what healthy emotional expression and conflict resolution is supposed to look like, one which invalidates the ways masculine men often process their emotions.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates06/04/21 06:49 AM
0

Perhaps reread my comments, compare them to your interpretation of them, and hopefully you can see just how misrepresentative they are. Unless, of course, you are arguing in bad faith. I also suggest reflecting on why you have such a strong attachment to 'toxic masculinity' despite the complaints of so many men.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates06/04/21 06:10 AM
0

How frustrating, everyone is wrong except you huh? You can see how destroying the language used to discuss an issue inhibits discussing the issue though, can't you? So you are arguing that ethics are objective???????? Ok but if you ban a bad word, do you really think it will stop people being mean? You are seriously trying to argue that masculinity has nothing to do with men. Seriously? Ok, I've contended with enough strawmen for one night. Either you're arguing in bad faith or you simply aren't…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates06/04/21 06:02 AM
1

You sure sound like a gambling man. So what, the argument here is basically "you're wrong"? Ok dude. So your argument is that wiki offhand says something you disagree with? That's your argument against the term? You know that's kind of weak, right? You don't understand how wikipedia works, do you? Do your own research into 'toxic masculinity' then if the referenced links don't satisfy you. You've entered into a discussion on 'toxic masculinity' without actually knowing its conventional meaning. …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates06/04/21 05:27 AM
1

Is not knowing what society you are talking about truly a problem you have faced with this term? Its not so much of a problem so long as you know that its only referring to a subset of western masculinity; not everyone who uses the term realizes this, in fact I'm willing to bet that most don't. Where in that link do you suppose there is a specific list? You are being silly mate. Read the article, mate. It clearly specifies aspects of masculinity which are and are not considered toxic. What, were…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates06/04/21 04:35 AM
1

Sure, it would do if anyone was doing that. I'm certainly not. When discussing western masculinity clearly you are discussing that within the confines of western culture right? They are referring to a subset of western masculinity, as manifested in men; The term does not to convey this meaning. Where? Where are you seeing that? When someone usually says "toxic masculinity" they are referencing that something is (in their opinion) stemming from male gender role in that society. I don't think I've…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates06/04/21 03:34 AM
2

Treating westernized masculinity as though its the ubiquitous standard serves to downplay the influence western culture has had in shaping our masculine ideal. And note, I also said its a subset of western masculinity, and only that which manifests in men. I'm assuming you mean "good" in terms of taste, but even still this is a faulty analogy. When people say that certain food is good or bad, its generally understood to be a subjective opinion. 'Toxic masculinity', on the other hand, is classify…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates06/04/21 02:16 AM
6

The ones telling men that they have a responsibility to support women and call out bad men are not giving an equivalent mandate to women; indeed, no one is telling women that they have any obligation to men whatsoever. Boys, on the other hand, are raised to respect women and girls, told that even if a girl hits you first that you should never hit back, told that its wrong to underestimate girls, told that we should protect girls from harm. Over the last decade, boys and men have been inundated w…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates04/04/21 09:22 PM
13

To quote myself from another post "The idea that men are a privileged class has contributed to the cultural devaluation of men's issues and, consequently, makes it difficult to convince legislatures of their legitimacy. This is an idea (now widely seen as an irrefutable truth) almost exclusively pushed forth by Feminists and Feminist institutions". It isn't just the misandrist Feminists to blame, the problem runs deeper and can be traced back to Feminism's principle conception of male power. Fur…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates04/04/21 07:32 PM
23

"Of course, not all men are rapists, murderers or misogynists. But all men have a part to play in making sure those that do exhibit poor behaviour are called out." Is it possible to be more condescending than this? Crazy thing is, he probably considers this perspective generous. Edit: One moment we're promised that Feminism will free men from their patriarchal duties, the next we're told its our duty as men to keep other men in check. Starting to seem like liberation from the male gender role ha…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates04/04/21 04:41 AM
3

Exactly. You don't have directly engage with men's issues because, as a Feminist, you're fighting to end the Patriarchy, which will resolve gender inequality across the board. Its activism by proxy, except its not really activism.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates03/04/21 08:55 PM
5

Absolutely agree with you here. Honestly, what's the rationale for men's issues being resolved by the dissolution of "patriarchy"? How will empowering women, or disempowering men, make society more sympathetic toward men's suffering?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates03/04/21 08:37 PM
57

I'm all for open discussion, especially with those I disagree with, but... "a civil space to educate the knowledge on the basis of feminism"? That is a huge red flag for me. Seems like yet another forum meant to reaffirm the righteousness of Feminism without actually challenging its theories.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/04/21 09:32 PM
2

The belief that men should be self-reliant and emotionally guarded is a sexist one; misandrist, to be specific. Our patriarchal society was based on and perpetuated by sexist ideals such as this, but society needn't be patriarchal to be sexist. If all the authority, power and privilege men are alleged to posses were suddenly seized from them, if all government and corporate bodies were replaced to be comprised entirely of women, do you believe that society would necessarily become more compassio…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/04/21 09:02 PM
3

I already did explain in my last comment, but I'll expand a bit further here. Masculinity is "a set of attributes, behaviors, and roles associated with men and boys". This covers a vast, yet nebulous quantity of elements that spans cultures, generations, and even genders (masculinity is only associated with men and boys, not inherent or unique to them). Masculinity in China is different than masculinity in America, masculinity among men a century ago is different than masculinity among girls tod…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates01/04/21 09:45 AM
4

I think if the term was better constructed it would be useful. Exactly my point with "toxic masculinity". I constructed it to draw a comparison. If you believe it causes offense, which is totally understandable, then I hope you can understand why a lot of men take offense to "toxic masculinity". Although race is a social construct, it is one that people strongly identify with. Many women get offended when they see the term "toxic femininity" applied to women's behavior because they identify as b…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates01/04/21 09:17 AM
4

Race is a social construct, just as gender is. If black Americans took issue with the term 'toxic blackness', would you also find that silly? Let's say it meant 'the harmful ways by which black Americans internalize their racial identities'. As an example, a black man refusing to date women with a darker complexion than himself might be classified as 'toxic blackness'. Can you image how that might create confusion? How some black people might find that term offensive, even while fully understand…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates01/04/21 08:42 AM
4

I think you're missing the point. The term itself is problematic, not just the fact that its used as a pejorative.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates01/04/21 08:07 AM
8

Most of us here reject the notion that all, or even most, of men's problems can be boiled down to the result of a historically patriarchal system. If you acknowledge that there are fundamental differences between the sexes, then it stands to reason that institutions of power will affect each sex differently. Capitalism, for example, will exploit male consumers in ways that differ from female consumers. A pre-industrial government at war will make demands of its male citizens that differ from tha…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates31/03/21 09:37 PM
6

The term is inherently vague, which makes it easy to use as a pejorative. The key difference between how the MMM used the term and how Feminists use it now is that with MMM, men were centered as the victims. Yes, chauvinism and misogyny were incorporated within their concept of toxic masculinity, but those were viewed as being the result of societal oppression of men; this afforded men compassion and empathy while acknowledging the harm that misandry can cause for women. Feminists, generally spe…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates31/03/21 10:27 AM
11

'Toxic masculinity' is a vague term that has been grossly misappropriated in recent years. Going by the original usage of the term, which was coined by Shepard Bliss of the mythopoetic men's movement, I could use toxic masculinity to denote society's propensity to manipulate men into sacrificing their lives and human needs for the sake of protecting the interests of others. Feminists, by contrast, usually use this term to refer to men who are chauvinistic, misogynistic, homophobic, or emotionall…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates31/03/21 08:31 AM
3

Fair point.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates31/03/21 12:29 AM
12

What I meant was that I sympathize with finding beauty standards oppressive, not with restricting sexual expression. Sorry, I should've worded that better.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates31/03/21 12:20 AM
26

I think the idea is that men's sexual desire for women often reinforces beauty standards that many women find oppressive. While I can sympathize with this sentiment, shaming men for their feelings is reprehensible, and is antithetical to liberal ideals.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates31/03/21 12:04 AM
32

That black men are at higher risk of police brutality than any other demographic? No, that is not false. https://www.pnas.org/content/116/34/16793
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates30/03/21 11:16 PM
10

I believe he's referring to gender roles. We often see mainstream media convey to its audience that women can be and do anything they want to, but we don't see equivalent messaging for men. There isnt a sitcom I'm aware of with an episode teaching boys that it isn't their duty to sacrifice themselves or their happiness for the sake of protecting others, that they don't have to be providers if they don't want to be. We see so many movies make an effort to prove that women don't need men to be hap…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates30/03/21 05:26 PM
6

Acknowledging that men do indeed have issues is the barest minimum of support one can offer, and many Feminists don't even manage that. And those who do usually just attribute these issues to either the Patriarchy or "toxic masculinity" (forces which Feminists were already fighting against in the name of woman's rights). An ally (which holds far more power and influence than we do) that vilifies us unless we operate under their ideological framework is not the kind of ally we need.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates30/03/21 07:58 AM
0

Like if people can talk about the negative side effects of the whole "male privilege" issue without blaming feminism then I don't think the sub will have an issue with it. Feminism is the political hegemony of the day. If we want to enact political reform for men, our success will be largely dependent on Feminists approval. With this in mind, not pointing out the faults and challenging the rhetoric of such a powerful movement is, I believe, irresponsible. That said, if MensLib challenged Feminis…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/03/21 04:35 AM
2

Could you give an example on what you mean here? I don't understand. Let's take the discourse surrounding 'male privilege'. The idea that men are a privileged class has contributed to the cultural devaluation of men's issues and, consequently, makes it difficult to convince legislatures of their legitimacy. This is an idea (now widely seen as an irrefutable truth) almost exclusively pushed forth by Feminists and Feminist institutions, which is a fact that I've never seen MensLib address. The way…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/03/21 02:26 AM
6

I don't agree that they don't address the whole institution that are responsible for it. I believe they do. I'm not as concerned with addressing corrupt institutions as much as challenging them. As Feminists, MensLib generally blames men's issues on the Patriarchy, so if they're condemning an institution, more than likely it'll be one they view as being patriarchal, or as being in service to Patriarchy. However, if a Feminist institution, or one acting in service to Feminists, is responsible for…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates23/03/21 11:58 PM
79

I appreciate the warning and for bringing this to everyone's attention. As unfair as it is, I think its important for us to be aware of the stigma surrounding male advocacy and to react accordingly. Optics is paramount in politics, and disregarding ours will make activism that much more difficult.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates23/03/21 09:47 PM
9

I agree, the sub is never about taking people to task, and that's a part of the problem. If you're only focused on helping men cope with misandry without challenging the people, and more importantly, the institutions, responsible for it, then how much are you really helping? EDIT: Also the range of issues that MenLib addresses is extremely limited and usually revolve around their concept of 'toxic masculinity'. As comforting as it is to be told "its ok to cry" and "its ok for men to wear [insert…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates23/03/21 07:56 PM
23

I mean challenging misandrists in a broad, cultural sense, not banning posters on your subreddit. Perhaps there are people that are calling out the problem, and I'll applaud them once it manifests in significant improvements. I did read some of the comments. Most of the criticisms I saw were toward the article's author for being too overzealous and assigning blame to the Internet for male misogyny. Kudos for that, I guess, but if you actually read the article it echoes the same kind of misandris…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates23/03/21 02:34 AM
52

Most may recognize that misandry exists and that its bad (congratulations?) but don't expect them to hold misandrists to task, particularly if it comes from women or other Feminists. From what I've seen, Menslib is more concerned with misandry turning men into incels, alt-right, etc. than how it affects men's self-esteem. They approach men's advocacy like a prison counselor rehabilitating a violent offender. Hilariously, the top post right now is titled "How the Internet is Teaching Men to Hate …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates23/03/21 01:50 AM
1

I just offered you my opinion, sorry if it wasn't what you hoped for.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates21/03/21 04:00 AM
7

That's certainly true among many Feminists, but I think most people realize that sexism is a gender-neutral term. But if you're right and that is the common consensus, the goal should be to change that consensus, not create more division.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates21/03/21 03:51 AM
2

There is, its called sexists.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates21/03/21 03:38 AM
0

Toxic femininity and masculinity are such vague terms that they could be used to refer to a wide range of attitudes and behaviors. Feminists use 'toxic masculinity' to refer to the emotional repression influenced by masculine socialization, but this is an arbitrary classification. I could just as easily say that toxic masculinity is when men sacrifice themselves for others due to masculine socialization. In the same vein, the term 'toxic femininity' is vague enough to include the type of infanti…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates21/03/21 03:32 AM
2

First of all, you're stereotyping an entire gender. Second, this kind of gendered classification is more divisive than it is constructive.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates21/03/21 02:08 AM
12

I don't think we should follow Feminists' example by adopting such condescending terms. We need to be better.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates21/03/21 01:51 AM
1

I'd say daily jogs, keeping a journal, and mindful meditation are the key activities that keep me from becoming a power-hungry, women-murdering maniac.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates18/03/21 08:19 AM
2

Conversations around respect and consent are almost always couched that way, this is not an special case in that regard. Boys are told to respect and protect girls, and girls are encouraged to do the same for themselves. It would be great if society would be willing to balance the scales and teach girls to respect the particular sensibilities of boys (and even protect them from aggressive girls!) but I can think of a certain political hegemony that might take issue with that. I'm not sure how mu…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates18/03/21 07:54 AM
3

And idk where you're getting your info, but Feminists aren't responsible for the concept of gender lol.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates17/03/21 10:44 PM
3

You've clearly missed the point.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates17/03/21 10:40 PM
2

Yet disparities existed between the biological sexes, and were far more pronounced than they are now. So gender abolition isn't enough.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates17/03/21 10:27 PM
2

Gender isn't a new concept, its an ancient one. While gender abolition is an admirable goal, its isn't realistically achievable in the short term, and there's no guarantee that a society without a concept of gender wouldn't retain disparities along lines of sex i.e. male and female bodies. So, because we do still live in a gendered society and likely will for the foreseeable future, its important that people aren't oppressed because of that social identity. Gender expectations are still a source…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates17/03/21 09:25 PM
5

People aren't killed for believing that the Earth is flat. Many men are killed for being gay.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates17/03/21 08:45 PM
3

There is still a large percentage of people who believe that its a man's duty to protect women, who assume men who wear makeup are gay, who expect men to endure suffering in silence, etc., etc. Gender expectations lead to the depression, self-isolation, ridicule, suicide, and even murder of countless men, so there is still much work to be done.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates17/03/21 07:54 PM
5

There are entire countries where being openly gay is punishable by death.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates17/03/21 06:38 PM
5

Just because the Feminists movement is deeply flawed, perhaps even inherently misandrist, doesn't mean that every single idea derived from it should be rejected outright. Freeing men from the social demands that inhibit them is a net positive for us all. Besides, this isn't exactly a patented Feminist idea; there are many men and women throughout history who rejected their gender roles long before Feminism was even conceived. What's changed is that doing so is more widely accepted, and even enco…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates17/03/21 06:26 PM
2

You're conflating initial romantic attraction between strangers (specifically via dating apps) with strong emotional attachment. The question of which holds more truth, his statement or my hypothetical one is moot; they are both false, as sweeping generalizations often are.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates14/02/21 01:23 AM
4

Are you? Do you honestly not know of a single woman who genuinely cares for a man despite him earning a low wage? If so then I implore you to widen your social circle.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates13/02/21 03:57 AM
0

It isn't any more true than saying "if you aren't physically attractive, men won't care about you."
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates13/02/21 03:18 AM
10

Well that's sexist and goes against the ideals of this sub.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates13/02/21 03:13 AM
5

So you think that every woman married to a "low value" man is just faking it? That they don't actually care about their husbands? I'm not sure you understand the concept of proof. I'm not a feminist lol.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates13/02/21 03:05 AM
4

You've made the assertion, the burden of proof is on you. But any number of conventionally unattractive husbands with low-incomes would be enough to prove you wrong.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates13/02/21 02:38 AM
12

Generalizations like these hurt male advocacy movements.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates13/02/21 02:06 AM
5

Oh wow. That is some extreme paranoia.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates11/02/21 07:08 AM
11

What behaviors do you think he advised? All I see are validations for men feeling the way they feel.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates11/02/21 06:43 AM
14

You seem to have created a caricature of what r/MensRights, and this sub, are really like. The vast majority of posts and comments do not blame women as a whole for any of men's issues, and the few that do usually get heavily downvoted. The main difference between r/MensLib and this sub is that MensLib refuses to take a critical look at Feminism, even it's misandrist elements. Their advocacy for men is predicated on the belief that Patriarchy theory is correct; that while men utilize their class…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/02/21 08:54 PM
9

Though the forms they take generally differ, bullying and shaming men who don't fit the norm is something both men and women engage in, and both can be equally harmful.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/02/21 05:28 AM
14

This is patently false. There are countless women who feel burdened and uncomfortable whenever a man exposes his emotional trauma to them, who will assume that a man is gay simply because they're effeminate or have a close friendship with another man, who consider men childish if they aren't willing to put aside they're passions and focus on earning enough money to provide for others. The idea that its mostly men who uphold the gender norms that we have all been socialized with is absurd.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/02/21 05:00 AM
1

As much as I loathe the term 'toxic masculinity', I don't see 'toxic social expectations' catching on; its quite the mouthful. And honestly, I think both terms are too vague.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates29/12/20 12:30 AM
1

You're very welcome.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates15/12/20 02:50 AM
4

Those terms you used seem fine to me, they convey their underlying meaning fairly well. The term 'toxic masculinity', on the other hand, is something of a misnomer as it doesn't mean what it appears to. But if you're asking for a general term for the demands that society makes of men, here are some options: male repression, constrained masculinity, internalized misandry.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates13/12/20 09:00 PM
8

According to the article, the fake accounts were set up on chat apps for gay men for the purpose of exposing their sexuality. If that's true then this is indeed a gendered issue, especially considering how susceptible gay men are to violent assault.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates25/11/20 03:34 AM
7

Only if they can frame the issues as being symptomatic of patriarchy, or "toxic masculinity."
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates23/11/20 03:45 PM
1

Do you believe that only men can be masculine?
/r/MensRights22/11/20 09:04 PM
1

Ok buddy
/r/MensRights16/11/20 12:22 PM
1

That is not at all what I meant, in fact its the exact opposite. No one should feel obligated to conform to a role that is imposed on them, especially if it makes them unhappy.
/r/MensRights15/11/20 09:57 PM
2

If you're specifically referencing masculinity and not the social expectations of men, then it would make sense to apply the term 'toxic masculinity' to both men and women. The problem is that this term is only ever applied to men. "Toxic gender expectations for men" makes more sense (although its definitely a mouthful).
/r/MensRights14/11/20 11:43 PM
2

Masculinity is not the same as men's gender role; both men and women can be masculine.
/r/MensRights14/11/20 11:33 PM
1

I agree, and I think its important to do so considering how much institutional and social power feminists have. But how we criticize them is equally important.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates20/10/20 06:39 AM
5

I've been desperately searching for a space where male advocates can discuss real solutions without deferring to feminist theory or devolving into a reactionary circlejerk. This sub has the potential to be just that, but the mods have to learn from the mistakes of r/MensRights and r/Egalitarian. A few suggestions: posts that highlight specific instances of gender disparity should be followed by an explanation of how it relates to the social status of men in general, as well as a proposed solutio…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates20/10/20 03:17 AM
1

There is a serious danger of this sub becoming more anti-Feminist than pro-Men. I agree that referencing, and even critiquing, feminism should be permitted, but if a line isn't drawn soon there will be little to distinguish this sub from r/MensRights. Speaking of distinguishing yourself, if you want to maintain a reputation of being a left-wing sub, I think posts that advocate for right-wing/conservative politics, or employ common right-wing rhetoric, should be deleted outright. I understand wan…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates03/10/20 07:05 AM
8

"shit is gay" "no cuck" "panties in a twist" If you're trying to bruise our egos by attacking our masculinity, I suggest using some fresher material.
/r/MensRights01/10/20 10:07 PM
11

Feminists: "We don't hate men." Also Feminists: "We have a right to hate the oppressive male class."
/r/MensRights01/10/20 08:59 PM
3

But police can profile based on race and gender, and they do.
/r/MensRights28/09/20 01:07 AM
4

For men, its toxic masculinity. For women, its internalized misogyny. I've started to use the term "internalized misandry" in lieu of toxic masculinity. It's much more compassionate and actually frames men as the victim.
/r/MensRights26/09/20 02:28 AM
1

I'm sorry, I misspoke; I know there are people, many of whom happen to be feminists, who are tackling issues that disproportionately impact men, such as homelessness. However, as you've addressed, the gendered dimension of these issues is usually ignored or downplayed by feminists. Take police brutality as another example: I think its safe to say that most western feminists support BLM and the fight for racial justice in American policing. But the demographic that is most frequently targeted by …
/r/MensRights19/09/20 08:15 PM
1

I'm pretty sure he didn't hit her because he knew it would likely result in HIM being arrested. This a black man we are talking about here: the odds are not in his favor. Blaming this on "toxic masculinity" is so short-sighted.
/r/MensRights19/09/20 02:10 AM
1

MensLib looks at men's issues through the lens of feminism which, as with all feminist spaces, creates a bias toward women. They're quick to condemn "toxic masculinity" and they love to tell men that "It's ok to cry! Men have feelings too!", but you'd be hard-pressed to find posts that hold women to any standard, as though women don't hurt men, or reinforce the traditional male gender role. And, true to feminist form, the men's issues that MensLib really "fight" against are all tied into issues …
/r/MensRights19/09/20 12:04 AM
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