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carterworld Archive

View 5 posts and 102 comments by carterworld on TheRedPill subreddit and various other subreddits related to The Red Pill community.
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2

Not true at all...put that stat back in your ass where you found it.
/r/seduction29/05/18 03:52 PM
1

What guy says, "totes asleep?"
/r/seduction11/02/18 07:47 PM
1

Get some help man. Seriously, you need to talk to a therapist.
/r/seduction10/02/18 03:57 AM
16

I take things food industry girls do with a grain of salt. Don't get nervous staredown king. You should've kept your eye contact. If she kept eye contact even when you moved to the next girl, that's something.
/r/seduction10/02/18 03:52 AM
1

I hope not. I don't even take myself too seriously. I'm open to haters as well!
/r/seduction10/02/18 02:02 AM
2

We don't know her, so who knows what to expect. All you can do is try. Just because she just got out of a relationship doesn't mean she'll be easier. She might think you and your friends are fun to hangout with, but not sleep with. To me, it sounds like she's not interested in y'all. That's why she dates outside of your circle.
/r/seduction10/02/18 01:24 AM
6

Are you sure she's real? Sounds like spam.
/r/seduction10/02/18 01:18 AM
1

You don't deal with chicks that play games. Move on.
/r/seduction10/02/18 01:10 AM
1

Make up a reason that you'll be in her city. "I'll be in your city Saturday to get a part for my car, let's grab a drink."
/r/seduction09/02/18 03:35 PM
1

Yea man, I'm still here! Sounds like she was trying to be polite. Maybe ask her out again, but say Friday or Saturday instead of right after your class. She might want the opportunity to freshen up before going out. Ask her for drinks one more time, for a different day. If she declines, move on. If she won't get drinks with you, do not take her to a concert.
/r/seduction08/02/18 11:41 PM
1

My response is, "Every so often. I see, you're no stranger to the gym yourself."
/r/seduction08/02/18 03:51 AM
6

Let girl 1 go. She playing games. You don't have time for games. Girl 2 sounds awesome. I cast my vote for girl 2.
/r/seduction07/02/18 06:46 PM
2

It's that simple. If she's not feeling you, she'll leave. It's better to say something in context, even better to make a joke in context. But saying anything with confidence is key. I think women are generally more receptive during the day because they know guys go to the club to get laid.
/r/seduction07/02/18 06:40 PM
2

Stop coming across as needy. You did that with the third girl too. Don't ask her why she's ghosting you. Sounds like it wasn't even that long.
/r/seduction07/02/18 06:34 PM
1

I didn't say she wasn't into you. Take the shot next time so you'll know for sure. Especially if you feel the vibes from her.
/r/seduction07/02/18 06:30 PM
1

Don't blame the weed. It didnt make your jokes corny. Maybe she thinks you're immature. And she might be right.
/r/seduction07/02/18 04:14 AM
1

What could you have said to ruin her interests? Just tell her you got high. In the future, your first text shoud say, "What up? This Steve."
/r/seduction07/02/18 04:05 AM
3

"But then I got high"
/r/seduction07/02/18 03:39 AM
2

What's Bolivia like? Is it way different than here? Does she like it here? Does she speak another language? What's her hobbies?
/r/seduction07/02/18 03:31 AM
6

You have a scarcity mindset. You need to switch to an abundance mindset. You're trying to rationalize your lack of success. No way "every girl" is taken. And if you're getting out like you say, you've had more opportunities to talk to girls. As for your question, you have to try. Girls aren't going to knock on your door wanting you to smash. No pressure, it'll happen if you just try.
/r/seduction07/02/18 03:24 AM
1

Was the A/C on? I'm just saying, it's better to see a combination of several cues. When it comes to the thighs, it's more common for a woman to cross her legs towards you. Then, maybe some thigh/knee rubbing.
/r/seduction06/02/18 05:53 AM
3

I wouldn't say, strong eye-contact alone means she's horny. A combination of several nonverbal cues is more helpful. A smile, playing with her hair, flipping her hair to expose her neck, biting her lip, nail or pen, pointing her feet or knees towards you, leaning towards you, etc. You should say something to anyone you make eye contact with for an extended time. Guy or girl. Possible lost chances, possibly not. Take the shot next time so you won't wonder, "what if?" Seriously, you're already loo…
/r/seduction06/02/18 05:33 AM
7

Can you give a specific situation? A dead giveaway is her vagina being wet.
/r/seduction06/02/18 03:51 AM
1

Sounds like you're doing fine. Girls pushed you into a car to keep hanging out with them. For all you know, the girl that passed out might have wanted you. She just got too drunk. These random, crazy situations are what shape confident, interesting men. Every well-rounded guy has tons of these stories. Stop lying about where you're from. Just say the state or if you're from overseas, the country. I don't know why you think people want to hangout with you because you from China. They couldn't car…
/r/seduction06/02/18 03:47 AM
2

Check out the bars and lounges targeting older crowds.
/r/seduction06/02/18 03:24 AM
1

Download the app "calm." It has several free beginners meditations and a few advanced ones. Basically, you focus on your breath and clear your head of any thoughts. If your mind starts to wander, bring it back to your breathing. Soon you'll be able to do that when you start to feel anxiety and it'll relax you.
/r/seduction05/02/18 03:55 PM
1

Yes, jump in the game now. Make friends with your classmates and go the club. Also, go to all the graduation events and parties when they start coming up. Everyone parties hard the final semester. Usually girls are more open as well because most of will leave and never return. Flirt by having a conversation and escalating. Escalate by slowly move into her personal space. Light touching then longer touching. Take dancing classes, cooking classes, anything interesting. Doing interesting things mak…
/r/seduction05/02/18 05:33 AM
1

Clear your head when interacting with people. Focus on what they say and how they say it. Other people are so wrapped up in their own minds, they don't care about what you doing. I suggest meditation. That will help you clear those negative thoughts from your mind.
/r/seduction05/02/18 04:50 AM
1

Why do you want girls you're not supposed to make moves on? What's the punishment? Find other girls. That way you can make sexual moves. Otherwise, you're basically playing the waiting game. Always display confident body language and be witty in your interactions with them. You're basically waiting for one to overtly throw herself at you. I suppose you could try to "coincidentally" run into her outside the house. It'll be such a complex scheme. Just find other girls.
/r/seduction05/02/18 04:43 AM
1

Some kind of classes. Just depends on what kind of nerds you're looking for. Check out meet up, and search local star wars FB groups.
/r/seduction05/02/18 04:33 AM
1

You have to find where they congregate. Try meet up or local business classes. You just have to ask them out like any other woman, but be prepared to be flexible with your schedule.
/r/seduction05/02/18 03:24 AM
2

Start a conversation with her and her questions about herself. What's her favorite hobbies, career plans, favorite celebs? After some conversation, ask her to help you study. From there, it's about being clever, witty and escalating. Show confident body language when you talk to her and speak with a purpose. Don't be scared and more importantly don't sound like you're scared.
/r/seduction05/02/18 01:39 AM
1

Yes. Also, find a hobby you enjoy doing and work everyday to get better at it. Those little victories will give you more confidence over time.
/r/seduction04/02/18 08:10 PM
1

Keep escalating until she stops you. If she doesn't like it she'll tell you or she'll lean away. If you're walking side by side, gradually move closer to her. Brush the back of her hand with the back of your hand. Then, hold her hand and lead her across the street for example. The pua stuff has you inside your head too much. Women read body language. Thinking too much throws off your body language. Your body language needs to show confidence and be relaxed. Vulnerable and weak are completely dif…
/r/seduction04/02/18 07:06 PM
2

Maybe she didn't want you to know much about her and didn't want to know about you. Crazy that she would take you out of town though. There's some chicks that just want to hookup. So it's more about escalating, less about conversation. If you were kissing in the hotel room, you should've kept escalating until she stopped you. "Putting movement in hips when lying down?" You mean grinding? She wanted it.
/r/seduction04/02/18 03:45 PM
2

Park over by her car because, "you couldn't find a spot by your department. Try to catch her after work by "coincidence." Sometimes you have to make the opening to approach. But make it seem completely unintended. Be careful with work pick ups. Don't get fired.
/r/seduction04/02/18 07:41 AM
1

He said he's a goof. If he's making a joke through text, the crying laughing face conveys its a joke. Don't go overboard, but get with the times. Emojis are gaining popularity and animated emojis are upon us. Every female I know uses emojis. I just came around about a year ago and it helps.
/r/seduction04/02/18 07:26 AM
2

It's a move that takes balls. The more you do it, the better you get. During conversation, gradually move into her personal space, light touching, then longer touching. Girls want a man who knows what he wants and pursues it.
/r/seduction04/02/18 07:09 AM
2

Make sure it's confidence and not cocky. Cocky makes you sound like you're seeking validation. When you date the girl, don't act like you did at the club. That's a different environment. In general, nothing expensive for dates. You can find cool local events for cheap. Nothing wrong with coffee, and if something out of the box comes up for cheap, do it.
/r/seduction04/02/18 07:05 AM
3

As you get more experience, you'll have a better ratio of dates per approaches. Whoa, that was a lot. Read "Models" by Mark Manson. That pua shit is making you unnatural. I started reading your story and thought, "sounds like this guy is trying to hard to be a jerk." Later on a girl told you, "you're nicer than you let on." Stop trying to be a jerk, girls can see through that. Be witty funny and clever funny, not asshole funny. It takes a certain demeanor to be asshole funny. Converse, move into…
/r/seduction04/02/18 06:42 AM
2

Have a conversation with them like any other girl. Always look to escalate. They're not royalty.
/r/seduction04/02/18 05:31 AM
2

Say hello and introduce yourself. You have to show confident body language. Then, compliment something about her appearance. "You look great in that dress." Or "you have a great smile." Make a clever or funny observation about the environment. Ask her questions about herself. Escalate by moving into her personal space slowly, gradually as the conversation progresses. The whole process is a lot to explain. Check out, "the art of seduction" by Robert Greene. "Bang" by Roosh "Models" by Mark Manson
/r/seduction04/02/18 05:18 AM
2

Get new girls. These old chicks already have bad impressions of you. It's cool if you come across them, holla. But don't chase these old crushes, move forward.
/r/seduction04/02/18 04:24 AM
3

If a girl is checking you out, walk up and introduce yourself. Start a conversation like any other pick up. Just because she looking doesn't mean she's interested. You still have to spit. Being swole is good because girls will think you can protect them. Run your game as normal and escalate as usual. Lift off her feet by her waist (without hurting her). Girls like big strong guys and a display of strength is fun to them.
/r/seduction04/02/18 04:07 AM
1

Maybe be a drag queen? Hang out with gay guys, but still smash girls, if you want. You'll feel better being around people you can be comfortable with, not performing.
/r/seduction04/02/18 03:31 AM
2

Ask her to hang out again. Were you escalating hard enough by the 3rd date? That might be why she blew you off. Hang out with her again and escalate.
/r/seduction04/02/18 03:27 AM
2

Slowly move into her personal space while you're talking to her. Get close enough so you're barely brushing her when you move. Touch her arm when you say something. Relax your body so your movements look confident and natural. A good way to be creepy is looking at your hand touching her arm. Maintain eye contact when touching.
/r/seduction04/02/18 03:15 AM
2

Instagram and Facebook mainly. My HS class has a group on FB. Talk with your other HS friends and ask if they know what's up with her. Especially if you come across her friends. When you message her to talk, just catch up as old friends and plan to meet in person.
/r/seduction04/02/18 02:49 AM
2

Make an observation about the environment. Then, introduce yourself. Using canned pick up lines is lame and sounds corny. Saying something clever or funny about what's going on around you is gold.
/r/seduction04/02/18 02:38 AM
2

It starts with a conversation, then you escalate from there. Being witty, clever, and funny makes her comfortable enough for you to escalate.
/r/seduction03/02/18 10:42 PM
3

My bad dude. I'm obviously illiterate. Don't look for a wingman. It's cool to know guys to hit the bar with, but a good wingman is tough to find. You just don't know how they'll react in important situations.
/r/seduction03/02/18 10:36 PM
5

If you're suicidal, please get help. Please bro. Workout, it'll make you feel better about yourself. Don't fear women or rejection. Humans are just animals. Complex animals, but dumb animals when it comes to mating. Make small talk with cashiers til you get more comfortable talking to people. Keep up the online dating. Try to improve your profile. Better pics, creative bio.
/r/seduction03/02/18 10:30 PM
3

Screw the wig. Go bald. Studies have shown bald men look more powerful. Find smaller bars close by you and sit at the bar. Chat with the bartenders, other people at the bar, people walking by. Of those bars, go to your favorite every 1-2 weeks. You'll be a regular and have social proof. When you pickup on girls at that bar, they'll think you're the popular guy everyone knows.
/r/seduction03/02/18 10:17 PM
7

Social skills have to be developed in society. Put yourself out there. Go to meet ups, take classes, events. Just smile and say hi to random people at first. It'll get easier the more you do it. When you talk to the cashier, waitress, secretary, practice making small talk. "Isn't this weather great?" Find a nationally syndicated radio show and listen to their podcasts daily. The actual "on-air" radio shows, not home podcasts. The on-air radio shows are great with witty banter, storytelling, and …
/r/seduction03/02/18 10:07 PM
3

First date options, get coffee, ask her to help you study, any events on campus. From there you have to escalate to another location. Bonus if you get her to study with you in your room. Join clubs, activities, go to parties. Be open to meeting new people and you'll naturally have some platonic girlfriends. You should mainly want them to help widen your circle though. Sounds like she wanted it, but you didn't escalate hard enough. She chilled with you, but has a bf? Maybe she does. She was proba…
/r/seduction03/02/18 09:54 PM
2

Workout if you don't already. Dress sexy. You can dress conservatively and still look sexy. Accentuate your best features because men are visual. Show open body language, dont be closed off. The trademark woman move is to make eye contact with a guy for a few seconds, smile, then look away. The type of guys you want will approach you based on that move and try to sleep with you. You can be even more aggressive by staring at them. That being said, don't do anything you don't want to do. "No" or "…
/r/seduction03/02/18 09:29 PM
3

Ask her if she want to get coffee, or food, help you study. When you're with her, always escalate. Edit: Wait til she's better. You don't want to get sick.
/r/seduction03/02/18 09:03 PM
2

Getting into her personal space when you're talking to her, light touching, and keep escalating. Don't fear rejection because that's better than the friendzone. You escalate until she flat out rejects you. As for being desperate, workout and try new hobbies until you find one you love. Then, work at being great at that hobby. Girls want to know you have other things going on and your entire focus isn't on them. They like a man with drive in life.
/r/seduction03/02/18 08:27 PM
2

The compliment is the start. It's tough because that puts you out there for potential rejection, but you should value rejection over not knowing, or the friendzone. You have to keep escalating so she knows for sure you're interested.
/r/seduction03/02/18 08:17 PM
3

Join clubs and activities you're interested in. Go to parties, sports games, school events. It'll help to meet new people because that'll widen your social circle and give you social proof. You're in college man. Enjoy the college experience and have fun. Everyone there is trying to figure themselves out.
/r/seduction03/02/18 07:47 PM
2

Be more direct in your approach. Women like a man who knows what he wants and pursues it. Introduce yourself and compliment her clothes, eyes, hair, something that makes her look beautiful without flatout saying "you're beautiful." Let your body language show intent with increased eye contact, moving into her personal space, light touching. Never say, "I like you." Say, "I like your laugh, smile, eyes, or style."
/r/seduction03/02/18 06:49 PM
3

Workout if you don't already. Improve at your hobbies or passions everyday. Whether it's playing guitar or coding, work at it everyday. Use being in good shape, and being good at coding or whatever to validate yourself. Building up those little victories over time will give a huge boost to your confidence.
/r/seduction03/02/18 06:33 PM
5

She's interested. Don't look away. Let her eye contact draw you directly to her. Then, just confidently introduce yourself.
/r/seduction03/02/18 06:27 PM
5

It's less about what you talk about, more about your nonverbal communication. Fun conversation, move into her personal space, light touching, and so on. My favorite move to get into her personal space is trying to hear what she's saying. With your ear to her face, you can easily put your hand in the small if her back, then turn and speak into her ear.
/r/seduction03/02/18 06:23 PM
4

Tell her, "lets grab some lunch." Then, gauge her responses from there. Be careful with work because you don't want workplace trouble.
/r/seduction03/02/18 06:18 PM
2

Get out of your head. Social anxiety comes from insecurity. Be in the moment and don't concern yourself with what other random people think about you. You're a good looking dude. Show confident body language and be the hot guy!
/r/seduction03/02/18 06:14 PM
11

Escalate. Laying in the bed, turn on your side and put your arm around her. Pull her in close to you. Inviting you to lay in bed is either an invitation or a tease. Either way you need to put yourself in the category of guys who want to sleep with her, not friends who cuddle but don't sex.
/r/seduction03/02/18 06:09 PM
3

It's difficult if she's into her workout. Look for an opening when you're walking by like /u/no2k7/ said. You can also time your workout so you're finishing when she's finishing and talk to her.
/r/seduction03/02/18 06:03 PM
4

Correct. Or 1.2 M's a year. Haha. Thats on the low end.
/r/seduction03/02/18 05:58 PM
4

Your first mode is, "very girly, shy, cute?" Assuming you're a guy, girls don't want a guy that calls himself girly and cute. They want a man. Cut back on the cutesy, lovey dovey. They'll think you're gay.
/r/seduction03/02/18 05:56 PM
2

The emotion you want her to feel is happy. I always suggest talking about what makes her excited, hobbies, celebs, career plans. In turn she'll more comfortable with you and equate being with you as fun times. Nothing wrong with being poetic if you're good at it. Girls like the deep, monotone, smooth voice. Speaking a little slower is also a plus.
/r/seduction03/02/18 05:53 PM
2

Please do not high five unless you're at a sports bar with her. Initially it's about moving into her personal space. If you shift your weight, your arm should be touching hers. Turn to her to tell her something and lightly touch her arm or put your hand in the small of her back. You'll know she's not interested if she closes her body off or leans away. Edit: words
/r/seduction03/02/18 05:33 PM
5

Move into her personal space first, then gauge her response. At that point, lightly touch her arm as you tell her something. Don't look at your hand touching her. Make eye contact. If she's leaning into you, put your arm around her or hold her hand, rub her thigh. Don't be afraid to take her hand and lead her somewhere else. Get used to making these "ballsy" moves because you need plenty of them to close the deal.
/r/seduction03/02/18 05:28 PM
2

Find another girl. Not wanting to lose her is making you needy. You stand a much better chance of getting her back by showing her, you can get another girl.
/r/seduction03/02/18 05:18 PM
3

Do interesting things. Learn cool skills.
/r/seduction03/02/18 05:12 PM
9

You're inside your own head. You need to focus on her. What's her interests, hobbies, favorite celebrity? Bounce around topics until you find one she gets excited talking about. That said, your body language needs to escalate. Eye contact, moving into personal space, light touching, and so on.
/r/seduction03/02/18 05:10 PM
1

You need to find the breakdown in your game. It could be your escalation tactics since you have success picking up, but not closing.
/r/seduction03/02/18 05:05 PM
5

It's more important to be social, then have a serious social life. Like /u/no2k7 said, you can work from home and still get laid. Get in on the online dating and get your health right. Good luck dude.
/r/seduction03/02/18 05:01 PM
2

Start with talking about the environment if possible. "Do you come to this event every month?" After that, move towards questions about her. The key is finding what she gets excited to talk about.
/r/seduction03/02/18 04:36 PM
2

You might be boring them. You're doing a good job trying to incorporate things from their bio. If she is a swimmer, Google strange facts about swimming or swimmers to tell her. That'll help you stand out in her mind.
/r/seduction03/02/18 04:34 PM
2

I agree with no2k7. Also, look on YouTube, and maybe webMD for exercises you can use to improve your speech. If the girl is already interested in you, say less. Focus on talking about her plans, her interests, anything that gets her excited.
/r/seduction03/02/18 04:15 PM
5

"How are you?" Usually gets the manufactured "good" answer. Make a comment about the class. A funny observation. You can always find something unique about the scenery or the people around to make a funny comment. Edit: Follow up with questions about her. What's her plans after graduation? Whats her career aspirations? Who's her favorite celebrity? Bounce around topics until you find something she gets excited talking about.
/r/seduction03/02/18 07:26 AM
15

Talk about the environment. In the grocery store? "Which cinnamon rolls do you think taste better?" That's how you gauge interest. Bonus points if you make a joke about the environment. From there, it's a typical conversation. Relax. No pressure. Pretend you're talking with a childhood friend.
/r/seduction03/02/18 07:21 AM
26

Agreed brother. You never know unless you try. Insert Wayne Gretzky and Michael Jordan quotes.
/r/seduction03/02/18 07:14 AM
6

Make sure you always give priority to your main girlfriend. Beyond that, it's up to you. See another girl weekly, daily. You have to see her enough to make it worth her while. Open relationships heavily rely on open communication between the partners. Make sure you keep pace with the amount of sex she's having with other people. You don't want to be on the couch every night while she's out doing it.
/r/seduction03/02/18 07:11 AM
9

Try to change the scenery. Different bars/parties/friends. Look to meet new people. Don't be inside your head at a party. Stay in tune with whats going on in the moment. You have to be relaxed and loose to pick up in these environments. Also, knowing more people at the party makes it more fun and gives you social proof.
/r/seduction03/02/18 07:03 AM
5

"Models" by Mark Manson for frame and inner game. "Bang" by Roosh was good for social skills and body language. Also, "The manual," by W Anton. Edit: "What everybody is saying" Joe Navarro "The art of seduction " Robert Greene
/r/seduction03/02/18 06:55 AM
11

After asking her what she studies, ask why she's studying it. Then, lead to her to talk her future job plans. What city does she want to move to after graduation? Get to know her. If it's awkward, but she still talks to you, or even laughs, that's good. Awkward isn't always bad.
/r/seduction03/02/18 06:51 AM
5

You don't need accomplishments. Of course it helps, but confidence is the determining factor. Average looking means not superugly, which works well for online dating. He just needs a picture holding a puppy while playing guitar, and he's in the game.
/r/seduction03/02/18 06:21 AM
7

Not many moves here. You have the head nod, eyebrows raised, wink, bite your lip, blow a kiss (the manly way). You need the conversation during the break or after the class. Acknowledgment from across the room is an open invitation and a great sign.
/r/seduction03/02/18 06:15 AM
4

100% yes. I would suggest the online dating.
/r/seduction03/02/18 06:09 AM
3

Find them everywhere in public. Online is even easier. You shouldn't open with being the bf. She won't agree. "On a subway in a rush but not likely in a hurry?" Is she in a rush? Get on the subway beside her and make small talk first. Subway game is difficult because you have to make a lot happen fast. Don't build up one girl in your head. Find more girls because subway girl is advanced game.
/r/seduction03/02/18 06:02 AM
12

If you make a joke, put a crying laughing emoji, or haha, lol, lmao. Use texting abbreviations like hmu, omw, wyd. Using full sentences with no emojis makes you look like a square. Plus, "bitches love emojis," quoted from some movie. You dont have to go overboard, but be more personable through text. You're not writing a letter to your senator.
/r/seduction03/02/18 05:50 AM
48

Putting your penis in a vagina is the incentive. Get your confidence up. Work out, try new hobbies. Get in the game now. All guys take a few years to develop the flow. You're at the right age to get started dating. It only gets better.
/r/seduction03/02/18 05:42 AM
58

Remain relaxed. Display confident body language. Saying what's up to other people helps with social proof. Depending on the situation, you could act like you don't notice her, but make your way into her field of vision, then open her. Or, as soon as you see her walk directly into her vision and introduce yourself.
/r/seduction03/02/18 05:29 AM
30

Don't overthink it. The balance between being trying to be funny and flat boring is always in motion. I'm sure I crack more jokes on a Friday than a Tuesday. If the moment strikes and you have a good joke, let it fly. Be sure it's something you find genuinely funny, otherwise you'll look corny. Maybe I should mention, every single word from your mouth shouldn't be a punchline. Find local groups around your hobbies using something like meet up. Depending on where you live, they have threads here …
/r/seduction03/02/18 05:22 AM
1

I agree with this and would add meditation. It helps you get out of your head and brush away negative thoughts.
/r/seduction03/02/18 03:12 AM
9

I always wondered, "who would fall for this? "
/r/seduction18/12/17 09:26 PM
40

Going down on a one night stand? That's how you get a cold sore.
/r/seduction09/12/17 04:26 PM
5

Before i got married, I was a full-time web developer and a part time personal trainer. Guess which job title got me more azz. Girls are stupid...
/r/seduction27/11/17 08:04 PM
3

Fake being a master. Girls don't wanna teach you, they want you to take control. Don't sell yourself short. 4 is enough to be experienced.
/r/seduction20/11/17 02:04 PM
1

Stupid pickup line unless you're in the book store, if they still exist. Stop with the pickup lines, they seriously hinder your game and make you look amateur.
/r/seduction15/11/17 02:41 AM
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