AMA: I'm the guy that inadvertently inspired the 'Downvoted into oblivion post' on the front page.

scarletlagomorph · 2018-05-23T15:35:15+00:00

We're not Mormon missionaries and we aren't here to audition for you, simp. If you don't have enough self-preservation and maths skills to understand the near-certainty that you'll be divorced-raped then there's not a goddamn thing we can do or say to save you from yourself. Have fun in cuckland.

2018-05-23T15:37:03+00:00

We aren't the US Army, we don't recruit anyone. Don't like our philosophy, then dont.

801735 · 2018-05-23T15:39:33+00:00

and currently I see no way of being happy with an MGTOW mindset

We offer that? Guys? I thought the pill tasted bitter.

I'm listening.

That's imo your problem. You should be reading instead.

2018-05-23T15:40:36+00:00

a more equality-leaning one

I am unaware of a more "equality-leaning" psychology. I'm going to stop chasing you around, you go do your thing and be happy, I'll go do mine and be happy. How does this psychology lack equity?

Because it notes, factually, the odds of a successful fulfilling marriage in the current dating environment is remote? And that pursuing it is costly? And several times more so if you fail? Those are the facts.

MGTOWards · 2018-05-23T15:59:34+00:00

As others have said, we're not here to entertain or audition for you. And, as /u/Ex_Swm_Lfw said, MGTOW is very equality driven. Leave us alone, we'll leave you alone.

However, I would mention this:

Equality is a two-way street. Men, in many ways, are treated as disposable and worthless. In the US, at least, men must register for the draft; men make up the majority of murder victims, of suicides, of industrial deaths, and the majority of the homeless population; domestic violence against men is, at best, accepted, and, at worst, treated as a source of comedy; rape laws are often written in such a way as makes it impossible for a women to commit rape - not to mention the fact that with movements such as MeToo, many men have their reputations ruined whether they are guilty or not. Men rarely gain custody of their children. In fact, they are forced to pay child support for children they rarely are allowed to see - even in 'no fault' divorces. My own father gained custody of two children, and still had to pay support for my mother for two years - despite the fact she had no children to support.

I'm not going to pretend that life is perfect for women. There are problems. However, women have feminism fighting for them, feminism is routinely pushed as "the right thing", and governments around the world, and especially in the West (where, let's face it, most of Redditors live) are doubling down on it. So, womens' issues will be well catered to.

But where is the movement to help men? I don't see feminists calling for the abolition of the draft (or extending it to women). I see feminist adverts in papers talking about how "one in four women are homeless, we must help them" - what about the three in four who are men? What feminist organizations are advocating for fairer divorce law?

Feminism doesn't talk for men. It's more interested in making sure the girls can get into the ~~Boy~~ Scouts movement, not in trying to make sure that boys stay in education (women are getting more degrees than men now; that was a problem when it was men getting more degrees than women, but I notice a conspicuous silence now it's flipped...). Feminists are interested in making sure that women are well-represented in board-rooms and corner offices, not in coal-mines and factories. I wonder why?

As I said. Equality is two way. Feminism doesn't seem interested in addressing any male issues, only female ones. There is no male movement, and every attempt to build one is ridiculed, attacked, and stopped. So, what can men do?

In essence, I see two options. The first is to blithely stagger on with the current system, fixing the problems women face, ignoring the male ones, until men are oppressed. My part in that would be to marry, be unhappy, be limited in what I can do on a daily basis, and then (statistically, most likely) lose much of my income and possessions. That's if my marriage goes as my father's did - and that's actually a better case scenario.

The other option is, frankly, to check out. I say, "Thanks, but no thanks". I don't wish to oppress women. Frankly, I do want equality. But equality is two way, and no-one is willing to give up anything on the female side. So, fuck it. I will not interfere with the new order. I will earn money, pay my taxes, stay quiet, and go home to my own private apartment. I will play my games, alone. Write, alone. Sleep, alone. Enjoy myself, alone. Be, alone.

Notice that in no part of that existence I described did I advocate oppressing anyone. The closest I get to oppressing women is to come here, and vent a little about unfair things. If I am to hold my tongue in life, I must vent somewhere. This is a harmless space for that.

So, if no-one (except MGTOW) came here... my entire existence would be entirely non-oppressive. For you to come here and suggest that your philosophy is "more equality-leaning" smacks of either ignorance, or a deliberate attempt to be offensive.

Either way. I am not interested in oppressing anyone. I also don't want to be oppressed.

I just want to be left alone.

ilikerelish · 2018-05-23T16:20:25+00:00

If you've read any amount of the content posted within this sub alone you have your answer as to what this mindset can do for you. It's very hard to encapsulate the whole in any great granularity in a singular post. The most obvious that come to my mind are:

Legal: do you enjoy not being in jail, not being in court fighting for your freedom or your life? If so, avoidance of women is a good way to avoid those things. PoundMeToo, false rape accusations, false sexual assault accusations, false abuse accusations are the front end to that, on the back end failure to pay child support, failure to pay alimony, protection orders, stalking allegations. True or not, any of these will land you in jail, and/or court. It doesn't even require proof if a woman makes the claim. A couple of guys just got out of jail after 20+ years because a woman lied about being assaulted. If you are MGTOW, you have little or no contact making it exceedingly hard to make any of these claims.

Property: once you cohabitate or marry, or even give a woman a foothold in your life, your property is not your own. I am sure you have heard the story of jilted lovers burning cars, or seen the ones on youtube where they destroy a lover's car, burn his clothes or possessions, donate his possessions, leave them out on the street in boxes, or just plain steal them. That's the front end. On the back end during a divorce you get taken for all that you are worth. You can be expected to be kicked out of your own home, lose at least 60% (generally more) of your assets, be expected to pay unreasonably high child support (you live out of a car, ridiculous child support), on top of that alimony that sometimes lasts forever. All at government gunpoint, cause if you step out of line with what they order, you are a criminal. If you are MGTOW, it is exceedingly hard to take your things from you, or divorce rape you because you are limiting access to the risk.

Finance: You have probably been a dater, maybe been in LTRs. You know that they cost money, lots of money. Dinner, drinks, trinkets, vacations, etc. In a relationship or marriage, some of these are replaced by even greater expenses such as useless extravagances that you really don't need. By being MGTOW, these extra costs are eliminated because you are limiting women's access to your money. In doing so, you are reducing the amount of work you have to do, or increasing the total amount of money you can sock away for retirement.

Time: Your most precious possession. As and MGTOW, you are focused entirely on what is best for you, how best to improve your own life, and doing things that make you happy. In a relationship you give up a portion of your time for the other person. some of that might be good times, but a good portion is going to be doing things you prefer not to do, because you are asked or it will make the other person happy. There is no give and take to solitude.

Sex: This is where detractors begin to smile and think GOTCHA! Not so. Frankly, it's not all that great anyway. A dirty, sweaty, moist exchange that leads to a few seconds of euphoric dopamine rush. Celebacy is an option, it protects you from disease. If that is not your path, sex dolls and bots are becoming more available, and better. They will run you the price of a used car, but on the other hand they cannot cheat, they don't get headaches, they don't berate you, they don't get jealous, etc. If that is not your bag, there is still the pump and dump route. A lot more risky, but with the number of carousel riders it is easy to become a notch in their belt. There are other options, but these make my point.

Emotional: As an MGTOW, you are not being manipulated. Drama has been minimized in your life. You don't have to worry about getting involved in the thing that they find exciting (fights, strife, cattiness, etc).

Fidelity/deception: These tie into some of the above. Without attachment to a woman you never have to worry about her cheating on you, bringing diseases home, cuckolding you, or any of the fidelity issues common to relationships. Perhaps more importantly you don't have to worry about birth control deceptions, or sperm jacking for monitary or other gain when the baby is born. If you don't deposit in the bank, they can't charge you fees.

To me, these are the most obvious reasons for a man to consider MGTOW. I really hope that others chime in with more time, and ability to articulate than I have.

Title	AMA: I'm the guy that inadvertently inspired the 'Downvoted into oblivion post' on the front page.
Author	Achiii
Upvotes	2
Comments	6
Date	May 23, 2018 3:23 PM UTC (8 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MGTOW
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MGTOW/comments/8lk7p9/ama_im_the_guy_that_inadvertently_inspired_the/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MGTOW/ama-im-the-guy-that-inadvertently-inspired-the.553274 https://theredarchive.com/post/553274

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