we should change the name to anti-pseudo feminism or anti misandry

TrilIias · 2021-08-02T03:35:36+00:00

People keep suggesting this, so I'm just going to paste a response I already wrote.

I disagree with your definition of feminism. I understand feminism as the ideology that interprets society as "women are (or have been) oppressed by men, or at least by the patriarchy (men), specifically for mens' benefit." I disagree with their interpretation of society, but I am convinced that this is the fundamental idea behind feminism. When surveys have been conducted, they've repeatedly found that while an overwhelming majority of both men and women support equality of the sexes, a small minority actually consider themselves feminists. You don't have to be a feminist to support equality, and you may even find yourself in conflict with feminists in the course of advocating for equality. On the other hand, I don't think you'll ever find a feminist who doesn't believe that women are oppressed by men.

I also think feminists will oppose equality if they must in order to maintain their oppression narrative. The issue of domestic violence is particularly relevant. Murray Straus and many other researchers have consistently found gender symmetry in domestic violence. Straus found that women were as likely as men to be perpetrators, and that they abused their male partners for the same reasons that men abused female partners, and only a small percent of partner violence by women can be explained as self-defense.

I watched an interview of Michael Paymar, one of the creators of the Duluth Model, the most commonly used model, and one that explicitly discriminates against men by casting them as the abusers and women as the victims. If focuses on helping victimized women, and helping men to stop their abuse. In this interview, Paymar states in no uncertain terms that the Duluth Model is feminist in nature. He also acknowledges that Murray Straus found gender symmetry in perpetration of domestic violence, but Paymar says that women are violent for different reasons, namely self-defense, so domestic violence is still a gendered issues.

So here we have an issue where we actually have a gender neutral problem, which is kinda surprising given that men are the perpetrators of all other non-partner violent crimes. We've had research for decades that proves it isn't a gender specific issue. Even Erin Pizzey, the founder of the first domestic violence shelter (also an opponent of feminism) said that it was a generational issue, not a gender issue, and that many of the women she helped were as violent or more violent than their male partners. Meanwhile you have feminists like Michael Paymar outright lying about this research, completely ignoring that Straus found gender symmetry in the motives of abusers, and pretending that domestic violence is a tool men use to perpetuate their own patriarchal male privilege. Katherine Spillar, executive editor of Ms. and co-founder and executive director of the Feminist Majority Foundation, said "domestic violence is just a clean up word for wife beating. It's not girls who are beating up on boys, it's boys who are beating up on girls."

These aren't radical feminists, they are mainstream feminists with actual power and influence. They spread these lies in order to maintain the current system, established largely by the Duluth Model, which creates victim shelters for women and abusers programs for men. There are 2,000 domestic violence shelters for women in the U.S., and when I last checked there was only one for men. What I see here isn't feminism advocating for equality. Equality is a casualty of their efforts to perpetuate their victim narrative.

Additionally, the National Organization for Women, has consistently opposed shared parenting in the US. The NOW chapter in Florida even managed to convince the governor to veto legislation that would have made equal parenting the default. This legislation had passed both the house and senate with bipartisan support and was popular with the general public.

When a mens' rights group made some progress recently through the courts, only to eventually loose and attempt to appeal, the NOW and some other feminist organizations signed an amicus brief in support of their efforts. The problem is that it's very obviously lip service. All they can manage to do on this issue is sign a lousy amicus brief in support of an effort that they know is doomed to fail? All they want is plausible deniability. They want to be able to say they support equal conscription, but they don't actually want to do anything that would result in equal conscription. Perhaps even worse, their amicus brief framed male only conscription as sexism against women. I was fuming as I read it, it was some serious "women have always been the primary victims of war, women loose their husbands, their fathers, their sons in combat" nonsense.

If the NOW has enough power to sink popular legislation that would have resulted in equality, they certainly have enough power to actually make some progress on equality in conscription. But they won't, because feminism isn't interested in equality.

AppropriateFun47 · 2021-08-02T04:28:51+00:00

Keep it same feminism = pseudo feminism = misandry :/

Pukku-99 · 2021-08-02T05:17:58+00:00

Anti feminist just means fight against Gender Obsession not misogyny fem girls.

TheLostTinkerer · 2021-08-02T08:44:29+00:00

Read the Karen Straughen article. It's there linked on r/MensRights

Estenar · 2021-08-02T09:17:27+00:00

There is nothing like pseudo feminism, even famous modern feminists who are fighting for something are misandrist who do not believe that woman can do any harm. Most of the times, bad people will join these movements or ideologies, because they know they can hide behind them and they believe them, sometimes they are even supported by majority!. If you follow feminists online or in real life little bit, you will hear the phrase "anyone who believe in xxx and xxx is feminist" I did not made this, they made is and what are you saying is simple No true Scotsman fouling. Try to go to the biggest feministic private (no wonder) FB group, you will open your eyes. EDIT: No, I am not saying that every single feminists is misandrist or supporter of echochamber, but those people get canceled and shut down by the other group, the "Real feminists".

Title	we should change the name to anti-pseudo feminism or anti misandry
Author	rough_crayon
Upvotes	0
Comments	8
Date	August 2, 2021 2:20 AM UTC (4 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/AntiFeminists
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/antifeminists/comments/ow5jwh/we_should_change_the_name_to_antipseudo_feminism/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/AntiFeminists/we-should-change-the-name-to-anti-pseudo-feminism.796213 https://theredarchive.com/post/796213

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