There's only one solution gentlemen

where did i deny they occurred? i said they were due to starvation and typhus and that the gas chambers were a myth. so i believe this is due to allies cutting supply lines. so really, if you wanted them to live, you should say, like i do, that the americans never should've gotten involved.

also, the jdl has admitted to fabricating the 5 million number of non jews, and an orthodox rabbi has said fewer than 1 mil of them would've been jewish enough to get into a jewish cemetery or get a passport for israel.

and i'm not a fan of this context denial where you want to focus in on the jews who died, not look at the jews who were complicit in causing the war, or all the non jews who died.

there, your argument has been completely destroyed. go peddle bullshit somewhere else.

[–]The_Columbian-1 points 9 years ago [recovered] (9 children) | Copy Link

this implies an objective standard or amorality, not subjective morality

If you make clear that you think something is moral or not, then it's clearly subjective. It's when you actually refer to something as moral or immoral that you consider this opinion to be objective.

where did i deny they occurred?

You specifically said, "the holocaust wasn't real." Then when I stated that the Germans had many accounts of mass executions, you childishly ignored it. Take the massacre at Riga in 1941, for example. In 1945, Major General Walther Bruns was secretly recorded describing the massacre. You think he made it up?

also, the jdl has admitted to fabricating the 5 million number of non jews, and an orthodox rabbi has said fewer than 1 mil of them would've been jewish enough to get into a jewish cemetery or get a passport for israel

Now you're equating denial of the six million figure with denial of Jewish death. You're performing the latter by saying that the Holocaust didn't occur, when it is clear that several million Jews died, many of them due to mass executions.

there, your argument has been completely destroyed

If you believe that enough, maybe it'll come true. Or perhaps you should explain why the deliberate mass execution of Jews doesn't constitute a Holocaust?

[–]like_a_tree 2 points3 points4 points 9 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

If you make clear that you think something is moral or not, then it's clearly subjective.

bitch, do you go around saying things u don't think? nigga please that's fucking autistic. that's not how people act. and you haven't used those qualifiers in your own argument. you don't say "my subjective idea is:" you just say "it is"

You specifically said, "the holocaust wasn't real." Then when I stated that the Germans had many accounts of mass executions, you childishly ignored it. Take the massacre at Riga in 1941, for example. In 1945, Major General Walther Bruns was secretly recorded describing the massacre. You think he made it up?

the holocaust was the creation of gas chambers and death machines specifically designed to kill all the jewish people, and extermination camps meant only for death. i'm going to have to look into those things you mentioned, but they sound like normal horrors of war, and in no way part of the official holocaust story everyone here was taught since childhood.

Now you're equating denial of the six million figure with denial of Jewish death.

no, that's literally what you're doing though.

You're performing the latter by saying that the Holocaust didn't occur, when it is clear that several million Jews died, many of them due to mass executions.

how is that clear?

If you believe that enough, maybe it'll come true. Or perhaps you should explain why the deliberate mass execution of Jews doesn't constitute a Holocaust?

sorry, my bad. obviously, since hitler tried to get the jews expelled and taken in by other countries, then tired to ship them off to madagascar or palestine, then sent them off to various work camps with different amenities, frankly nicer than the ones americans sent their german and japanese citizens to, or that the brits invented to stick my people in during the anglo boer war. then, after the allies cut supply lines, they found people starving and dying of disease. clearly the ultimate goal was always a mass extermination through a deadly gas usually used to delouse clothing. and their hair was shaved as if to prevent lice. and they were emaciated as if they were starved. and there were no bones because they were all turned to ash at impossibly high rates by those ovens. this completely fits in with the narrative that they were death camps made for extermination with deadly gas you fucking retard.

[–]The_Columbian1 point 9 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

you don't say "my subjective idea is:" you just say "it is"

You're missing the point that there is no objective morality through which one could say that something is moral or not. If there is nothing objective about an opinion on morality, then it should not be stated as fact.

the holocaust was the creation of gas chambers and death machines specifically designed to kill all the jewish people, and extermination camps meant only for death

The Holocaust is taken at a variety of definitions, all of which you've denied as existing. If you intended to mean that it happened, but that there was no state-directed extermination program, you should've stated so. Instead, you waved off all instances of the Holocaust by saying it didn't happen. That's why most people wouldn't take you seriously.

i'm going to have to look into those things you mentioned, but they sound like normal horrors of war, and in no way part of the official holocaust story everyone here was taught since childhood

It wasn't. In Riga, as in many other instances, Jews were targeted and executed. In part of 1942 and at least through 1943, concentration camps and the SS stepped up the killings and expanded transportive efforts to move Jews into concentration camps. Tens of thousands were killed on the spot at a time, because there simply wasn't room to accomodate them. The only ways in which reality deviates from contemporary historical accounts are that the extermination wasn't directed by the National-Socialist government and wasn't conducted on Hitler's orders. How much he actually knew about it is ambiguous.

no, that's literally what you're doing though

You cannot take the most stringent definition of the Holocaust to be its only definition. It is extremely off-putting to most people to simply say "the Holocaust didn't happen," with no further clarification.

how is that clear?

The records held by the National-Socialist government indicate several million deaths, and there were other unreported incidents further East.

sorry, my bad...

Jesus, are you going to act this stupid every time? You keep diverting the argument and attacking strawmen. Stop trying to turn the Holocaust into one extreme or another; it occurred, but it wasn't organized by the government or Hitler. Many Jews died from disease, and many were killed in recorded acts of mass execution.

[–]like_a_tree1 point 9 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

You're missing the point that there is no objective morality through which one could say that something is moral or not.

then you cannot tell me something isn't moral or immoral. you keep wanting to push OBJECTIVE AMORALITY. under SUBJECTIVE MORALITY YOU CANNOT TELL ME SOMETHING IS MORAL/IMMORAL, IT'S SUBJECTIVE.

The Holocaust is taken at a variety of definitions, all of which you've denied as existing.

no the holocaust is, to quote the first hit on google "The Holocaust was the systematic, bureaucratic, state-sponsored persecution and murder of six million Jews by the Nazi regime and its collaborators."

that never happened. they tried to get rid of them and put them in concentration camps and allies cut supply lines. the end goal was never death, and only contradictory soviet lies say otherwise. cry more.

i looked up riga- apparently they were communists? they were enemies of the state? weren't they? i'm sorry, but this is just ridiculous. if they were communists i'm glad they were killed. killing communists is an act of self defence.

You cannot take the most stringent definition of the Holocaust to be its only definition. It is extremely off-putting to most people to simply say "the Holocaust didn't happen," with no further clarification.

i'm not here to hold your hand and lead you down the garden path. i'm here to bash you over the head with my ideas and shock and horrify you and force you to wake you the fuck up. we've tried being nice and reasonable, but this is the zero hour. liberals don't do that shit. they close down your pizza shop for not loving faggot marriage.

The records held by the National-Socialist government indicate several million deaths, and there were other unreported incidents further East.

i am unaware of any national socialist documents detailing mass executions of jews (mass executions of communists are not what we're talking about, they were part of the war effort against bolshevism) that were not later shown to be frauds made by the soviets. please specify what you mean.

Jesus, are you going to act this stupid every time? You keep diverting the argument and attacking strawmen. Stop trying to turn the Holocaust into one extreme or another; it occurred, but it wasn't organized by the government or Hitler. Many Jews died from disease, and many were killed in recorded acts of mass execution.

Okay, you literally are a fellow "denier" at this point.

[–]The_Columbian1 point 9 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

then you cannot tell me something isn't moral or immoral

That is exactly what I've been saying. You were the one who originally described the Germans as being "good."

no the holocaust is, to quote the first hit on google...

That is not everyone's understanding of the Holocaust, it is only the contemporary "official" definition. When one wants to describe how the Jews were killed during World War II, he has no other term for it but the Holocaust.

i looked up riga- apparently they were communists?...

This is a message from Bremen to Riga's police chief, Dr. Lange (source is Hitler's War by David Irving):

Regarding Jewish evacuation: Transport train DO 56 left 971 Jews from Bremen to Minsk on Nov. 18, 1941. Bremen police; Transport Leader... is in possession of two lists of names and 48,700 are set with provisions and ready to be accounted for

This is part of the same movement of Jews to Riga, and we know from at least Walther Brun's account that they were shot on arrival. Another example is of Kiev, in September 1941. This is a report to Admiral Canaris by one of his aide's:

Orders are that the Jews are to be 'resettled.' This takes place as follows: the Jews are ordered at short notice to report to speciﬁc collecting points with their best clothes and their jewellery on the following night. No distinctions are made as to class, sex, or age. They are then taken to a preselected and prepared site outside the town concerned, where they have to deposit their jewellery and clothes under the pretext of having to complete certain formalities. They are led away from the road and liquidated

This is in keeping with other examples of Jews being stopped on railways and killed.

i'm not here to hold your hand and lead you down the garden path...

And how do you think that lack of subtlety works for most people if they don't already agree with you in some way (and most people don't)? Being as blunt as possible, rather than arguing with someone using their own values against them, is a quick method of turning people away.

i am unaware of any national socialist documents detailing mass executions of jews...

See my sources above. Also included in such estimates are records of population in the Third Reich and occupied territories. Most historians tend to overestimate them, but the number is up there.

mass executions of communists are not what we're talking about, they were part of the war effort against bolshevism

I am aware of the anti-partisan purpose of the Einsatzgruppen. That does not mean that everyone they killed was a communist; more often, they targeted Jewish populations who were at higher risk of partisan activity.

Okay, you literally are a fellow "denier" at this point

That's what most people would label me as, but that's not the same as actually denying that the Holocaust occurred.

[–]like_a_tree1 point 9 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]The_Columbian1 point 9 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

Because morality is subjective, one cannot definitively say that the Germans were good or bad. Morality only works in the context of who benefits from an action and whom is hurt.

the holocaust happened even if the holocaust didn't happen because you need a special word for the tiny minority of people who died in ww2 who were jewish

I never said I needed a term for it. Jewish death is what most people focus on, and their interpretations on it can vary quite widely, therefore it would be a mistake to openly dismiss the Holocaust. The Holocaust, in its more general sense, was Jewish death as a result of German rule, and this was accurate because many Jews were executed by Germans.

and transporting people on trains = killing them

The Jews I mentioned were shot in transit or upon arrival of their destination. Do you dismiss that as well?

and also some tone policing and concern trolling

You seem to ignore whatever evidence I bring, and repeatedly view the Holocaust in a biased manner. I have not argued whether or not the Holocaust was justified, I have argued that it happened and how it happened. Attempting to establish fact is not concern trolling.

[–]like_a_tree1 point 9 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]The_Columbian1 point 9 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

since morality is subjective you cannot say i'm wrong when i call something moral/immoral

Again, you missed my point. You are neither correct nor incorrect in saying that something is moral, given that there is some standard for that morality. What is incorrect is saying that morality is objective, like this:

the side that fought for its people and nation rather than globalist bankers, and that tried to prevent the war through diplomacy and compromise are objectively the good guys

the holocaust is the deliberate planning and extermination of 6 mil jews by the german government

It's also the killing of Poles and Gypsies. It's also the killing of Jews by Germany's allies. The Holocaust is taken to mean a number of things, and you alone cannot define the term if there is no universal agreement on its meaning.

you didn't provide proof they were shot

I've already given you two German sources, one for the execution of Jews at Riga (Walther Brun's testimony) and one for their execution at Kiev (the Abwehr report). Both describe liquidation of the Jews.

why were they transported just to be shot?

Because the Jewish evacuation was a massive and confusing process. The Jews were supposed to be transferred Eastward, but concentrations camps no longer had the space for them. As in Kiev, these instances were usually impromptu.

you have brought 0 evidence

If you actually are ignoring the executions of Jews that I've mentioned, we have nothing further to discuss.

your own definition would have you labelled a holocaust denier in germany

Are you seriously basing the definition of the Holocaust on Germany? That would be a very poor example.

the holocaust never happened. the end. f--k off

Like I said, you're only interested in biased results. Clearly you have no desire for a more realistic understanding of the Holocaust.

[–]like_a_tree1 point 9 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

you get that i believe in objective morality, right? and since you believe in subjective morality, you cannot tell me i'm wrong; according to you, it's subjective.

It's also the killing of Poles and Gypsies. It's also the killing of Jews by Germany's allies. The Holocaust is taken to mean a number of things, and you alone cannot define the term if there is no universal agreement on its meaning.

the holocaust is the planned execution of 6 mil jews, mostly through gas. if you take issue with this, talk to the jdl.

i'm sorry- was this testimony etracted during the farce nuremberg trials? and you gave documents that showed transportation; not planned mass execution.

If you actually are ignoring the executions of Jews that I've mentioned, we have nothing further to discuss.

once again, those jews were communists and they were killed in self defence (which is what it always is when you kill communists)

Are you seriously basing the definition of the Holocaust on Germany? That would be a very poor example.

you're fucking retarded. who says this? what the fuck is wrong with you?

Like I said, you're only interested in biased results. Clearly you have no desire for a more realistic understanding of the Holocaust.

like i said, the holocaust never happened. please refer to it as the holohoax from here on out, thank you for understanding.

[–]savebyvarlamov 7 points8 points9 points 9 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

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[–]The_Scrotum_Tickler3 points 9 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

[–]BroncoSwift 1 point2 points3 points 9 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

[–]savebyvarlamov 3 points4 points5 points 9 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]BroncoSwift 3 points4 points5 points 9 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Title	There's only one solution gentlemen
Author	Curveball14
Upvotes	75
Comments	49
Date	March 22, 2017 8:24 PM UTC (9 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/PussyPass
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/PussyPass/comments/60x64o/theres_only_one_solution_gentlemen/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/PussyPass/theres-only-one-solution-gentlemen.928258 https://theredarchive.com/post/928258

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