~ archived since 2018 ~

/MGTOW is about popularity?

BigBadMike9999 · 2018-09-19T01:00:33+00:00

It's pretty lame on there I just unsubscribed. I have a disagreement and so called MGTOW personally attacks me telling me I'm angry when it's...

BigBadMike9999

September 19, 2018

2 upvotes

/r/MGTOW2

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Post Information

Title	/MGTOW is about popularity?
Author	BigBadMike9999
Upvotes	2
Comments	10
Date	September 19, 2018 1:00 AM UTC (7 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MGTOW2
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MGTOW2/comments/9h0mrl/mgtow_is_about_popularity/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MGTOW2/mgtow-is-about-popularity.815017 https://theredarchive.com/post/815017

Comments

[–]tiredofshit 1 points 7 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Lol you got into it with zagnut? Pretty bold telling him he's not mgtow tbh.

I saw what you were getting at but the truth is you're both right to a certain degree. It depends on a lot of factors one of which being location. Canada is not the USA.

I can go on and on about all the fake charges and investigations I've beaten that my ex wife threw at me. People in the other sub love to circle jerk victim mentality and going against that is what got me banned.

They think as a man you can never win and should just bend over and open up your asshole for inevitable penetration in any situation that involves a woman. I disagree.

I'm living proof that is not always the case. I've gone toe to toe so many times and won that if I told you you probably wouldn't believe it.

When you are accused of something in the USA the burden of proof is on them. If you have covered your ass and did no wrong it simply won't stick.

[–]BigBadMike9999 1 points 7 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]tiredofshit 1 points 7 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]BlueAscetic 1 points 7 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]tiredofshit 1 points 7 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]BlueAscetic 1 points 7 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

To preface, I can totally understand why you and other MGTOW individuals "hate" women. I wish you'd take the time to view your own thoughts and question them. I also get that as a woman, I'm responding in a way that doesn't match up, if I were a man, because I don't have a man's life experience, and therefore can only respond the way a woman would.

Do you think you have some level of the traits you've seen in women? Can you go more into detail about those specific traits, or elaborate on them? I ask the second question out of curiosity. I might agree with you. I'll give you an example of what I mean.

I'll go first to show what I mean. Negative traits I attach to men from experience are that they're selfish, war-hungry, cold, inconsiderate, angry, and cocky. But then I think that's men I've seen in movies or in real life, and the ones I've seen in real life behave that way are usually unwilling to take responsibility for themselves and their past emotional wounds that still need healing. I'm starting to believe I need to change my view of them first, and usually I do, after the initial anger-avoidance phase. This is from a person who doesn't have a father figure, except for a step-dad who exhibited most of those negative traits. But I also know in my heart of hearts that he tried his best, I did my part to push him away, and he's full of anger and self-hatred that he pushes onto other people to avoid facing it. At least, that's my assumption, but I also know I don't know. I'm not comparing my example to your experience, as yours sounds vastly different from mine.

As for me, I know I exhibit some of those traits as well, some more than others. I can be angry, selfish, cold, inconsiderate, and perhaps "cocky" although I don't know that for sure because I'm not observing myself. I wouldn't say I'm war-hungry, but for some reason I like a good argument and don't avoid confrontation. Something in me likes to win. So, maybe that's the same thing.

I'm not saying you should think the same as me, and you'd like to stick to your view and way of thinking. I also understand I don't understand you, and I'm not going to say I'm trying to, because it seems a lot of MGTOW seem to hate that.

[–]tiredofshit 1 points 7 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Do you think you have some level of the traits you've seen in women?

Yes and no. I learned these traits from women and can force them if absolutely necessary. They are effective but immoral. Not my natural state by any means. I can mimic them at a price. The price is guilt. For a man guilt is cumulative so circumstances must absolutely warrant it. I'm speaking in majorities because it's logical and that's how I base my judgements. I've known men who were not forcing it. None of these traits are gender specific in the general sense.

The flip side to that coin is that the natural state of man must also be suppressed. All the good things. Only exhibited very selectively and at great risk. For if he were to exhibit his natural good nature, his compassion or generosity, and everything in between, he would be set upon and torn to shreds. We have to either mimic what we despise, remain in a neutral state, or suppress. If I had to guess I would say that we are only our true selves openly 10% of our entire lives, not including childhood. None of that 10% will be reciprocated, quite the opposite. It's exhausting, and this exhaustion can manifest itself in an infinite number of ways.

When you add all this up and a man finally figures things all out after all the suffering. It compounds it even further. He figures out that everything he has ever been taught is a lie. He was set up. It finally clicks that from the day he was born he was a sacrifice and everyone was in on it, and at the end of the day nobody cares.

[–]BlueAscetic1 point 7 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

Huh. That's how I feel as a woman. Like I've woken up to a new world where I'm expected to be and act a certain way, and suppress other "masculine" things, such as rage, hatred, coldness. I'm questioned if I don't want to have a family or have children, because I'm a woman. Or when I say I don't want to get married. I know the struggle for men is different than the struggle for women, or maybe you don't think women struggle. Everyone struggles; everyone has bad traits. I don't know your experience with the women in your life, so I don't really know what you mean. The point is, I'm unique, but not different from. If I want to feel restricted by my sex and gender, I will be, and my thoughts will follow in that pattern to tell me how I should behave, or what I shouldn't say or act like or look like. Or I can ignore what everyone else thinks and says about reality, because we're creating it as we go.

"The flip side to that coin is that the natural state of man must also be suppressed. All the good things. Only exhibited very selectively and at great risk. For if he were to exhibit his natural good nature, his compassion or generosity, and everything in between, he would be set upon and torn to shreds. We have to either mimic what we despise, remain in a neutral state, or suppress." - This is beautifully said, and I can imagine it's been this way for men for a long time. I know men who don't act this way though, and they aren't being taken advantage of. You mention that, but choose not to be that?

You say for men, guilt is cumulative, which means it increases with each unfolding event that creates guilt, or did you mean something different? Can't you say women also experience increasing guilt? I don't know what you mean by "speaking in majorities" either. I'm just trying to understand what you mean.

Are you saying you repress certain expressions that you have and feel? Are you happier that way - knowing you're less likely to be "torn to shreds" versus just expressing yourself and facing whatever society throws at you?

I guess I don't really understand your viewpoint. It's almost caveman-like, to be blunt - alpha versus beta, whoever is the strongest or the best fighter will win. I know men who express themselves. Either way you're going to get hurt; either way there are people out there who will take advantage of you, men and women alike.

The purpose of the question is an idea I had that without a restrictive female partner, MGTOW males (or individuals) would have an opportunity to be their most authentic selves, whether that be a blend of masculine/feminine traits or energy, or whatever else you'd like to call it. Would you say you are being authentic, or is authenticity (being yourself) not a high value for you?

[–]tiredofshit1 point 7 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

I guess I don't really understand your viewpoint. It's almost caveman-like, to be blunt - alpha versus beta, whoever is the strongest or the best fighter will win.

I'm talking about survivalism. Men are not wired with pack mentality like women. There is no safety net. Take any solo animal in nature for example. If it sprains ankle it will starve. If it breaks a leg it will be eaten. If it breaks a tooth it will die of infection. It has to be just as cautious as it is agile. It simply cannot afford anything less or it will die. I'm fending for myself and my children in a hostile environment. Emotionless logical decisions are not an option they are a necessity. I can't afford to take "chances" like some motivational facebook meme written in cursive.

Majorities

It's exactly that. In any context you please. The overwhelming majority is deemed representative. Outliers do not represent the majority and are thus irrelevant. Remove emotion.

Example: People win the lottery all the time. Lottery winners do not represent the majority of people. Even though lottery winners exist I can conclude with accuracy that you are not going to win the lottery.

Cumulative guilt

Yes it gets heavier with each infraction. Women have a mental recycle bin that they fill up and empty. Timing varies. Some empty instantly, some wait a little while, but the outcome is the same. That's if they even felt any guilt in the first place.

I know men who don't act this way though, and they aren't being taken advantage of.

They're giving more than they're getting. That's being taken advantage of. They're also taking catastrophic risks. They will pay the price. In lump sum or in increments. That I can guarantee you.

I'm expected to be and act a certain way, and suppress other "masculine" things, such as rage, hatred, coldness.

Motivations.

Once again speaking in majorities, if you get this from a man you've done something very wrong. Internet shit talk not included because that's not real. I'm talking about people you've known. You can get this from a woman for nothing at all. Even your own mother. I'm sure other females have targeted you at some point. Most likely for something petty. I've seen more aggression and outright cruelty from females than males by an astronomical margin. It's practically cannibalism.

[–]BlueAscetic1 point 7 years ago [recovered] | Copy Link

Well this shows me that people have different experiences.

I've known two women who were "outright cruel" manipulative, lying, whiny, victim-mentality, etc. but they both have mental disorders and histories of severe trauma (parents dying when young, sexual abuse, incest) and enabling family members. The mental disorder aspect is the most important part here.

If you're referring to your family members, maybe they have a common thread of mental disorder.

I don't think anything I say will change your idea of women - not feeling guilty. Holy shit. As a woman, I know women feel guilty, a lot. We're all human and all experience the same range of emotions. If you don't believe that then I don't know what to tell ya. But I do wish you the best, and hope your beliefs change for a more peaceful view.

Humans for our given written history have had a "pack" mentality, or else we'd have societies of women and men roaming around on their own. Right? I could be wrong about that. In our Western society we are inherently more "individualistic" and supposedly feel more alone than ever. I think it depends on your relative view, if you feel alone and you need to fend for yourself, or if you feel a part of the community as a whole.

It's alright that I see your paragraphs as irrational and mainly non-factual; if they make sense to you, then so be it, as long as you don't harm women in the process.