Our topics include things ranging from double standards in genital mutilation, in child custody, conscription, working with children, women encourages to be engineers but men not encouraged to be nurses, etc. How much do feminists agree with or care about our topics?

redtheda · 2012-07-10T08:45:13+00:00

For what it's worth, I consider myself a feminist (I am female) and I am concerned about all those issues. I feel that if we are not all equal, than none of us are. Double standards hurt women and men.

It's especially troubling that men who want to take care of children not their own are suspect in this society. My boyfriend has said that he's scared to help out a lost child in a mall because he might be accused of something. That is really, really sad. Conscription in general I think should be either both sexes or neither. There are plenty of women who are willing to join the military. Personally, I hope the draft is never reinstated at all. And some of the best nurses I know of are male, including some personal friends of mine.

I am also very concerned with child custody issues. I know personally men who were harmed by this double standard and lost their children as a result, and I hurt for them. One case in particular, my (male) friend's son ended up with his abusive mother because of the actions of a prejudiced (male) judge who wasn't even assigned to the case initially (and even though everyone else involved in the case said the boy was better off with his father). The poor boy suffered 13 years of abuse because of this. For what it's worth, I do know women who have unfairly lost their children as well, by men who had more resources and used the children to get back at the mother. When children are used as pawns, we all lose.

You didn't mention domestic abuse and rape, but I am also concerned by the fact that men aren't treated equally in this sense. If a man calls the police because his wife is abusing him, more likely than not they'll take him to jail, or he won't be believed, or he will be treated like he's "less than a man". I have known men in emotionally abusive relationships, and it's sad. Similarly, male rape is underreported and underacknowledged. The toxic masculine ideal creates shame such that men feel they cannot confess the abuses they have suffered, and this deeply saddens me.

I think it's a mistake to blame these inequities on feminists, however. I think it's stratified gender roles in as a whole in the entire society which oppress us all, and which are imposed by women and men who are invested in the status quo. Feminism has become unfairly demonized. Some of this is because of the radical fringe, but some of it is because of anti-feminists as well.

Most of all, I am very zealously against circumcision and have been an intactivist for 18 years. My son was not circumcised and I have fought for the rights of boys to have bodily integrity ever since. It is the single most important issue for me. (My family thinks I'm crazy - my dad called me an "anti circumcicsion nazi" as a joke once - but guess what, my brother has affirmed he will not circumcise any boys he might have, so it's worth it to me.) Any slings and arrows I might suffer are nothing compared to what a baby goes through. If I can even save one child then my work is worth it.

You might be surprised to know that quite a few feminists feel the same way, because of the natural birth movement. This is how I myself became an intactivist. Mothers who have educated themselves about circumcision in preparing for the birth of their children and have come to realize what a barbaric practice it is are some of our strongest allies in this regard.

You have more feminist allies than you might think. It would be a better world if we could work together for equal human rights.

I realize this isn't likely to be well accepted by r/mensrights, but you asked how feminists feel, so there you go!

rightsbot · 2012-07-09T23:58:17+00:00

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Vaginasauroraptor · 2012-07-10T00:24:04+00:00

I'm not sure why you care what feminists think. Do your own activism, bring attention to these important causes and don't worry what they think. All those issues are very important and need to be addressed. If you do that I'm sure the women will get on board too. I do believe circumcision is wrong, that nobody should be conscripted male or female and that it is wrong that men are discouraged from pursuing the nurturing professions. You are very right.

Grapeban · 2012-07-10T00:25:20+00:00

Good news about that nurse thing! http://curt-rice.com/2012/05/14/a-sex-point-or-two-for-male-nurses/

Affirmative action for male nurses and veterinarians in Norway apparently, so that's cool.

As for how much I, as a feminist, agree and care about those topics, here's my thoughts.

1) Circumcising children should be banned.

2) Conscription should be banned, though the armed forces should be open to all genders.

3) Child custody should not be biased towards any gender, it should aim to be equal mostly, but in cases where this is not possible, the less abusive and more able to look after the child parent should get custody.

4) All genders should be encouraged to enter careers where they are seriously under-represented, and I am fine with affirmative action being used to achieve that.

thunder_mcshock · 2012-07-10T03:52:11+00:00

Feminist responses seem to generally fall in a range from "I won't stop you but it's not my problem" to "MISOGYNY". Somewhere between apathy and staunch, instant, hyperzealous opposition, depending on the issue and the feminist.

There are a precious few outliers who explicitly show their support for us on many of our issues, but I like to think that those people are only feminists in the same way that I might persistently refer to myself as an ostrich, despite objectively being a human.

Tomorrow_he_is_off · 2012-07-10T12:09:07+00:00

Feminists have no function, except to serve as an example of hypocrisy and hate. Debating feminists only has value when it shows them squirming to get out of admitting wrongdoing, or perpetuating double standards with a 'thats different' defense.

Feminists ONLY have value, in other words, if they serve as example as to why Feminism is the bane on society it is.

Feminists will NEVER 'ally' with men, or allow mens issues to take precedent...well, ever. They have not to this day, nor likely will they ever, take an 'egalitarian' stance. Feminism is a Womens Lobby Group, nothing more.

And this is why MRAs have no compulsion to welcome them.

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