what do psychologists think about pick up artists?

2013-11-05T05:23:42+00:00

[permanently deleted]

recyclablebantha · 2013-11-05T12:35:48+00:00

You might check out Mark Manson's book, Models or listen to some of his talks on YouTube. He actually has studied up on a lot of related fields like evolutionary psychology and the like, and found a lot of basis for the practicality of certain "seduction" concepts.

EDIT: Keep in mind that anything that you read on Wikipedia should be tracked back to whatever source that content was pulled from. The criticism section of the "Pick up artist" article on Wikipedia that you're referring to, was actually NOT based on research, but is traceable to an article at the UK Telegraph. Mainstream media sources tend to do a shit job of science reporting, and this article is no different.

1 It's riddled with bias, as evidenced with comments like, "You can't get far in the world of pick-up artistry without a silly name," or "This is a look at some of the aspects of this weird world. A lot of it is harmless, plenty of it is funny, but a large amount is genuinely unsettling."

2 The article has lumped ALL of the PUA philosophies into one incorrectly categorized basket, when they state things like: "If you didn't think deliberately targeting women with low self-esteem was bad enough, a lot of PUAs base their techniques on something called “neuro-linguistic programming” or NLP......if this actually worked, PUAs would be hypnotising women into sex......Luckily for everyone, research into NLP suggests that it is nonsense anyway."

Obviously, it's nonsense to be implying that PUAs try to "hypnotize women into sex" or that they "deliberately target women with low self-esteem".

What's more, if you look closely, whoever edited that content into the Wikipedia article saw fit to incorrectly apply the claims that NLP was, in his opinion, "Cargo cult psychology," to ALL PUA techniques, which is clearly a misquote. (This portion of that article has since been corrected.)

3 It's also unclear how closely they've truly examined a lot of PUA theory when one reads a quote like, " Dr Petra Boynton, the sex educator and blogger, says that there is “no evidence of effectiveness” for any of the PUA claims."

They're not specific as to which claims have no evidence behind them. And it seems like a rather ridiculous thing to state, given that the basis for current PUA theory is basic human psychology: the best PUAs can clearly ground their advice in things you can go out and test right away. So it's sloppy for the author of that Telegraph article to write it off in such a vague manner. Really, the author comes off like the kind of guy who made up his mind that PUAs were opportunistic, amoral, quacks and then confirmation bias led him to find "evidence" of that.

EDIT2: Next time, do people a favor and LINK to something you're referring to instead of making people hunt for what you're talking about. Presumably you were just recently looking at that Wikipedia article, maybe even while you were posting here. So take a few seconds and add a hyperlink.

ThrowawayPUA · 2013-11-05T05:28:04+00:00

I have read a psychology/sociology research paper that confirmed most of the precepts of PUA. But damn if I can find it in my hard drive. I'll poke around some more.

ThrowawayPUA · 2013-11-05T23:44:10+00:00

OK, I found the psychological research paper I mentioned.

From the International Journal of Evolutionary Approaches to Psychology and Behavior.

The Dating Mind: Evolutionary Psychology and the Emerging Science of Human Courtship.

Abstract
In the New York Times bestselling book The Game: Penetrating the Secret Society of Pickup Artists (2006), the world was granted its first exclusive introduction to the steadily growing dating coach and pick-up artist community. Many of its most prominent authorities claim to use insights and information gleaned both through first-hand experience as well as empirical research in evolutionary psychology. One of the industry's most well-respected authorities, the illusionist Erik von Markovik, promotes a three-phase model of human courtship: Attraction, building mutual Comfort and Trust, and Seduction. The following review argues that many of these claims are in fact grounded in solid empirical findings from social, physiological and evolutionary psychology. Two texts which represent much of this literature are critiqued and their implications discussed.

Title	what do psychologists think about pick up artists?
Author	imstayinalive
Upvotes	0
Comments	5
Date	November 5, 2013 5:16 AM UTC (12 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/seduction
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/seduction/comments/1pxjya/what_do_psychologists_think_about_pick_up_artists/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/seduction/what-do-psychologists-think-about-pick-up-artists.1361089 https://theredarchive.com/post/1361089

Comments

1 It's riddled with bias, as evidenced with comments like, "You can't get far in the world of pick-up artistry without a silly name," or "This is a look at some of the aspects of this weird world. A lot of it is harmless, plenty of it is funny, but a large amount is genuinely unsettling."

3 It's also unclear how closely they've truly examined a lot of PUA theory when one reads a quote like, " Dr Petra Boynton, the sex educator and blogger, says that there is “no evidence of effectiveness” for any of the PUA claims."