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Carkudo Archive

View 17 posts and 9,420 comments by Carkudo on TheRedPill subreddit and various other subreddits related to The Red Pill community.
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Upvotes Title Category Author Subreddit Date (UTC)
228

DiscussionCarkudo/r/PurplePillDebate01/05/21 01:27 PM
60

discussionCarkudo/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates08/11/21 11:11 PM
35

Incel Sticky Thread 12/21/20Carkudo/r/PurplePillDebate22/12/20 12:00 AM
29

DiscussionCarkudo/r/PurplePillDebate01/05/15 03:30 AM
20

CMVCarkudo/r/PurplePillDebate08/04/16 02:40 PM
16

DiscussionCarkudo/r/PurplePillDebate16/11/17 07:53 AM
12

Question for BluePillCarkudo/r/PurplePillDebate18/04/15 12:43 PM
11

AMACarkudo/r/PurplePillDebate28/10/15 08:22 AM
10

DiscussionCarkudo/r/PurplePillDebate07/09/15 01:51 PM
9

DebateCarkudo/r/PurplePillDebate05/08/15 10:54 AM
7

Question for BluePillCarkudo/r/PurplePillDebate16/12/15 10:18 AM
6

Carkudo/r/TheRedPill13/02/13 09:28 AM
6

DiscussionCarkudo/r/PurplePillDebate12/11/15 10:29 AM
4

Question for BluePillCarkudo/r/PurplePillDebate21/08/15 07:44 AM
1

DebateCarkudo/r/PurplePillDebate01/11/15 05:02 AM
1

Carkudo/r/BlackPillScience08/03/21 05:28 AM
1

Carkudo/r/PurplePillDebate28/02/16 11:37 PM
Showing the 1,000 most recent of 9,420 comments.
Upvotes Comment on Subreddit Date (UTC)
-2

WHY NOT READ THE ARTICLE? Jesus.
/r/Male_Studies23/03/22 12:06 AM
1

I follow those videos on OSINT Twitter accounts, I've seen them. Some sound sincere, some are clearly acting, for most it's impossible to tell. But the majority of Russians do support the war and I don't believe that by some miracle the POWs just happen to all be from the minority.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates08/03/22 10:58 AM
-1

It's not against their will. The war is popular and most of those soldiers are happy to be there right up until the moment when a blast turns their guts into tree ornaments.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates08/03/22 03:45 AM
1

I'm on Reddit because I had the privilege of being able to leave the shithole called Russia. One of the reasons I left is exactly because I was wary of the growing warmongering culture in the general population. And what the fuck do you know - I was right!
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/03/22 09:28 AM
-8

Most of them would be, if they had that option. You hugely underestimate how popular this war is, and was from even before it began. Those against war are a minority in Russia and there's simply no way that all those POW just randomly happen to belong to that minority. They're crying crocodile tears to drum up sympathy and cover their asses.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/03/22 03:45 AM
2

No, it's the youth. Perhaps the reality of war now will change it, but I'm not optimistic. A big part of it is that war and military service are glorified as this awesome masculine thing in education and in media, but another big reason is that for a good chunk of the male population everyday life is so bleak and boring - the idea of war provides an escape to a life where you can have purpose and relive the mythic glory of the WW2 veterans.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/03/22 03:31 AM
4

Not all of them, obviously, but I am from there and yes, the hunger for war in the general population was and is distributingly high.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/03/22 12:32 AM
-8

Most of them are probably just a bunch of scared and misinformed boys. Scared misinformed boys who were fed a ton of propaganda and are happy to go to war, mind you.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates06/03/22 10:44 PM
2

I'm not sure how what you describe leads into the idea that most men pursue such interactions though. Can you elaborate?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates22/02/22 03:50 AM
0

I suffer from attachment trauma as well. It has fucking nothing to do with having penalties inflicted on you for being single.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates22/02/22 03:48 AM
1

But only in the US it exists as de facto slavery.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates22/02/22 12:06 AM
1

Such interactions could be common for two possible reasons: 1) Most men pursue such interactions 2) Women systematically only match with men who pursue such interactions You assume the former is the case. Why?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates21/02/22 04:39 AM
1

Where I live one of the most powerful AND popular politicians in the country is a never married woman in her sixties. A man like that having anywhere near that status is unthinkable. And it's a fairly conservative country too. For bonus points try to guess the country.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates21/02/22 04:36 AM
9

Those discussions always remind me of an episode that happened on r/foreveralone. A prominent female poster sent unsolicited nudes to a prominent male poster. A poster she knew is gay. A poster who was also well known to be very physically attractive. Fucked up, right? She picked the most attractive man out of all to fish for validation, while ignoring his own well known preferences. She then made a post about it, complaining to the tune of "look what my loneliness is making me do" Again, fucked…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates21/02/22 04:32 AM
0

If a woman's peers are pressuring her to do something she doesn't want to, she can and should just find different peers. Having different priorities in life is not a penalty.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates21/02/22 02:48 AM
1

Not fitting in with people who have different interests in life is not a penalty. You're struggling to come up with examples right now exactly because there are none. Plenty of women don't sleep around because that's how they prefer to live, and there aren't any penalties levied on them for choosing such a lifestyle. And really, that's the baseline decent treatment that society denies to men who can't attract a partner.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates21/02/22 12:58 AM
1

You say "they get penalized" but provide no examples. What are the penalties women face? Like, what's the actual damage that they suffer for choosing to not fuck around? How is a promiscuous woman more advantaged over one that is not?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates20/02/22 11:10 PM
1

I'm 39 years old. I get shit for being unmarried. I get it - you're normal and have it easy, so it feels natural for you to just dismiss the things people like me go through. Let me guess - it just doesn't feel right for you to condemn the discrimination against single men. Something about it just intuitively feels inherently justified, right?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates20/02/22 11:09 PM
1

The market is shitty but almost everyone can get ahead of it. But you said yourself that the less people can, the better. So if tomorrow we end up in a market where even more people are selected out of participation, that would be better? How? Higher standards force more effort across the board. A man's efforts matter very little to his sexual market value.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates20/02/22 11:07 PM
5

World would be better if everyone had higher standards. How so? Let's say in a year we achieve a world where all men under 2 meters tall are relegated to incelhood. How would that world be better than now? Higher taxes are for unmaried, not single. I'm not sure why you feel that this distinction is relevant. A man who cannot attract a partner is perpetually single and unmarried, and so he will be taxed higher than his married peers. His unmarried attractive peers will also be taxed higher, but w…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates19/02/22 12:27 PM
3

Each time it’s the supply and demand that dictate it mate. No, it's not. There are plenty of penalties levied against single men that are not at all dependent on "supply and demand" So again - what is "much"?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates19/02/22 01:35 AM
5

Sorry mate but now you're suggesting that women should have sex against their wishes. Or we could dismantle the frankly insane system of penalties that punishes men who fail to attract a partner. I may still be lonely and sad from my inability to date, but I sure as hell would be better off if society didn't also force me to pay more taxes and didn't discriminate against me for being single. Or we (a metaphorical we) could use media to convince women to lower their standards. Media was used to p…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates19/02/22 01:33 AM
3

People who don’t bring anything to the table shouln’t expect much in a competetive market. I'm almost tempted to ask who it is you think you are to judge their expectations as "much", but let's do this another way. What is "much"? What's the cutoff line between reasonable demands and "much"?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates19/02/22 01:30 AM
2

That sounds utopian, honestly. Hippie communities are the closest we've come to that in the modern world, and those communities still sexually disenfranchised unattractive men.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates19/02/22 01:28 AM
5

peer pressured into going along with it As in, their peers penalize them somehow for... what, failing to hook up with hot chads?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates19/02/22 01:27 AM
7

Yeah there are many women and employers who treat everyone well Don't you see how you just contradicted your own top comment?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates18/02/22 01:58 PM
17

Do you even hear yourself? Well employers act like they’re acting, not because they’re evil but simply because they have lots of abundance. And it’s not the employers' fault they have that priviledege, it’s the workers who handed it to them.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates18/02/22 12:21 PM
1

The conclusions don't really support the hypothesised causal relationship. The same correlation could happen if, for example, the same set of traits affords men access to higher incomes and the ability to be disagreeable without incurring penalties. In fact, intuitively this explanation appears more plausible to me because the authors' is inherently self-contradictory - being disagreeable supposedly causes a man to have a higher income, but in the overwhelming majority of cases that income will …
/r/Male_Studies18/02/22 02:27 AM
3

keeping people safe is the main point of having law Enforcing cultural notions is the main point of law, unfortunately. If the prevailing cultural attitude is that women have a right to harass and harm men, then the law will be used to enforce that right.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates17/02/22 10:18 PM
2

No. There's nothing about feminist ideology that necessitates such hostility to men. In fact, given that the stated commitment of feminist ideology is to fairness and equality, the more consistent approach should be of fairness and equality. Western feminists are hostile to men because they choose to be, because for whatever reason they hate men, with the exception of a minority of really sexy ones. Feminists in other countries are not necessarily so hostile. I live in Japan and the feminist mov…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates15/02/22 10:24 PM
31

I don't mind being "seen" as a loser but my blood really begins to boil when I have to do my taxes and realize that I'm literally being forced to pay a punitive tax for my failure to attract a woman. Same goes for my career prospects which are capped unless I can convince a woman to marry me somehow.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates12/02/22 12:01 PM
17

That's just calling them out on their hypocrisy. It's not a very painful jab for someone who is speaking from a position of power, sadly.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates12/02/22 11:56 AM
7

Nah, if you show the "right", "masculine" emotions you'd do fine. Just as everywhere else, the stigma is against men being vulnerable.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates11/02/22 05:05 AM
6

Japan
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates10/02/22 10:47 PM
37

A lot of the shit many women, especially Feminists, claim about men is just based on projection. As a chronically lonely man, I hated that so much in mixed-gender communities for lonely people. All the women there always have ample opportunities to make sexual and romantic connections, but struggle because they deem those opportunities to be beneath them. And then they just go and assume that the men are doing the same when in fact the men are devoid of any options whatsoever.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates10/02/22 11:20 AM
12

New? This has been a thing pretty much since webcams became widely available in the late 2000s. I suppose platforms like onlyfans can contribute to a growth of this, but calling it new is a bit of an overstatement.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates10/02/22 10:12 AM
44

Because it's just a viable excuse that stuck. Why I'm sure of this is because such attitudes exist across different cultures, but the justifications for them vary. In the English speaking world it's assumed that men are just lying about this, in my own culture it's most often explained as instinct i.e. women are just hardwired to dislike vulnerable men, and in the culture where I live right now the most popular explanation is that showing emotions is reliable shorthand for a number of personalit…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates10/02/22 04:22 AM
1

39 is less that two months away. Fucking yay. There's still a small part of me that's hoping. I keep opening up dating apps occasionally. Even tried chatting up a woman in a bar a few weekends ago. But then I always go home alone to sleep and have nightmares about having a stroke or developing dementia. Fun times.
/r/MenSupportMen02/02/22 04:49 AM
3

It's not inconvenient for them. They justfeel it's wrong
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates01/02/22 11:31 PM
6

It's not that they have a problem with your being comfortable with your sexually. They have a problem with you not being traditionally masculine.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates01/02/22 03:53 AM
6

I think the people who call this out as emotional labour can it labor because it's something that is done to nurture and reinforce a relationship. A relationship without labour is one where the connection is maintained purely on desire and attraction.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates01/02/22 03:51 AM
2

The same reason the anti-LGBT majority in my country assume that LGBT people want the right to legally rape children - it provides a justification for the hatred.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates30/01/22 10:21 PM
1

Most would end up never being approached though. Doubtful. I don't know how it works, but the high status guys really seem to be all about that shotgun approach. Maybe the struggle to secure such men's commitment will become even harder, but I don't know what the metoo activists think of that.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates25/01/22 10:43 PM
10

What happens if you scare all the men away from approaching you? You will then only be approached by attractive high status men who know the rules don't apply to them. Which is exactly the result women want.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates25/01/22 10:17 PM
3

Being the devil's advocate is a nice thought exercise, but feminism is a fairly banal devil that's being advocates enough by billions of voices, so your opinion really doesn't have a leg to stand on, even if it were not intellectually dishonest.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates25/01/22 04:22 AM
1

In theory it should be. In practice everyone I've ever met who subscribes to the notion either walked away from the conversation or was in a position of power over me and used that to shut me up.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates25/01/22 01:22 AM
1

The men with the authority to call the shots lose nothing by making their subordinates sacrifice for women.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates23/01/22 12:09 PM
3

I'm a 38 year old incel working a low level job in a traditional corporate environment. I get comments about not being married at this age. I'm distrusted. I'll be the first to go should anything happen. No, I don't feel privileged at all.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates18/01/22 04:46 AM
2

It's not redpill narrative, come on. It's a complaint that could be seen coming a decade ago so everyone, including terpers, predicted it. And now here it is.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates17/01/22 04:01 AM
13

That reason is actually not obvious to me. I'm an androgynous unattractive man, an incel and the target of a lot of hostility from Western "progressives" The thing is, that's never pushed me towards any sort of right wing ideology. Rather, isn't it the "progressive" thinkers sliding right? Rejecting egalitarianism, enacting unequal policies and laws, unironically believing in racial hierarchies... I want a just and equal society and have been a victim of unfair treatment all my life, and that ha…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates17/01/22 03:58 AM
1

People who overcome the paradox and find happiness single for as long as they need, have beaten the paradox too. Do those actually exist though?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates14/01/22 06:28 PM
40

Dating apps are so hard for women that back when I was working in a female dominated professional field every drinking party involved the women opening up tinder to laugh at the average guys there and message the occasional dudebro.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates14/01/22 04:05 AM
2

Walking long distances is my exercise of choice and it's hugely gratifying for me as opposed to, say, lifting. But to each his own, I suppose.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates13/01/22 10:42 PM
13

She def doesn't represent feminism She definitely does because most feminists share her views.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates13/01/22 10:20 PM
3

I just walk. Up mountains.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates13/01/22 03:31 PM
5

Working out is only manly if you look manly. I'm a baby faced androgynous guy and had trouble putting on muscle and I assure you quite a few people not only took notice of how unmanly I looked working out, but took the time and effort to let me know it.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates13/01/22 04:51 AM
37

There's nothing "leftist" about misandry. For that matter, there's nothing "leftist" about the American "left"
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates12/01/22 10:21 PM
1

My point is, constant and consistent rejection builds up those anxieties, whereas challenging smaller rejections doesn't really resolve the anxieties as you seem to be implying above. At least, in my experience.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates10/01/22 12:29 PM
1

I actually find it to be the opposite - small rejections don't build up resilience to bigger ones, but constant serious rejection has seemingly eroded my resilience to smaller instances. At almost forty I find myself almost as anxious trying to book a hotel by phone as I would have felt at 16. I didn't used to be this anxious about trivial stuff.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates10/01/22 10:49 AM
2

What? The causation is obvious. Any long term illness that requires care will take out a single man whereas a man with a family will be cared for and his life this extends. That may not account for the entire correlation, but your claim that there's no causal relation at all there is laughably wrong.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates09/01/22 08:00 AM
7

For me, for the longest time there was no anger, just lots and lots of sadness and depression. I only started to get angry as I got older and really began to feel the sting of the material penalties inflicted on me for failing to secure a long term partner. Like, if I could just live my life alone without interference from others, I would probably still be really sad and likely planning to take my life at some later stage when frailty sets in, but I wouldn't be angry. As it stands, I'm angry bec…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates09/01/22 06:46 AM
5

I don't quite understand why it's more realistic to pursue a world that doesn't hate my allying with one group who hate me against another, than by pushing back against all hate regardless of who perpetuates it. I'll venture a guess that you believe Western 'progressive' movements can be pushed into a less antagonistic position after they've sufficiently beaten tradition, but I don't see what makes that view particularly plausible.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates08/01/22 03:05 AM
2

Correlation does not equal causation though.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates08/01/22 02:56 AM
6

I disagree. There is no benefit to picking and choosing which injustices are better or worse, and especially not if the only goal is to point to your political enemies and say "THEY're worse! Let's focus on beating THEM" There is a big downside though: by doing so you introduce two dangerous notions: 1) that some injustices are to be accepted and ignored and 2) that injustice perpetrated by "good" people is to be tolerated.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/01/22 11:14 PM
7

We can hold the tradcons responsible for things like bachelor taxes and career caps on unmarried men, but "progressive" movements are entirely to blame for declaring me a terrorist just because I'm not attractive enough to find a mate, and creating a world where no-single-men policies are increasingly common. In all honesty, I think there's a level of instinctual hatred for unattractive men working in the background - both sides are leveraging their hatred to push their political points, but it'…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/01/22 10:41 PM
2

If we assume that everyone just pairs up and there's no imbalance in standards, then there is no problem. But the problem is apparent. Women who are similar to me don't in fact pair up with men like me.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/01/22 10:22 PM
2

I see you're trying to subtly make some kind of point, but I'd like you to state it clearly before I address it.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/01/22 03:07 PM
14

To many young disgruntled young men almost always end up in trouble and very often bloodshed. This is a commonly repeated myth that has no basis.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/01/22 10:00 AM
2

I think a lot of people do need to 'shut up and listen' in the sense that they should make the effort to actually hear about others' experiences. As a struggling man, I'm tired and tbh incredibly hurt by the fact that everyone and their dog has a very detailed idea of what my life is like, and none of it is anywhere close to how my life actually is. People just take your life experience, erase it, substitute some other experience, and then often judge you for it and get angry when you tell them …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/01/22 07:42 AM
1

Okay, let's put pressure on women so that they don't see unattractive men as attractive, but will still be open to dating and marrying such men. Better? My point is that the media campaigning certainly helped create a world where a woman's attractiveness mattress little to her ability to have a family and advance her career. Why not campaign to give the same benefit to men?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/01/22 12:20 AM
1

In case of men's standards there was (and still is) just constant campaigning in mass media portraying as attractive women who used to be considered unattractive. Men being shamed for refusing to date, say, fat women has no always been a thing. I'm thinking of something similar, only targeting women this time. real, tangible solutions that lift up both sexes Wouldn't that be exactly such a solution? We've lifted up women so now women of all shapes, colors and sizes are seen as attractive. If we …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates05/01/22 10:27 PM
2

The real scary part is that as you get older landlords become reluctant to rent to you at all.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates05/01/22 09:50 AM
1

Here's one suggestion: apply pressure on women to lower their standards and make them more open to pairing up with men who are just average or below. The same pressure was successfully applied to men in the past, so why not women? Or does that also count for you as eroding women's rights?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates05/01/22 09:41 AM
3

I get the feeling. But why express it here?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates05/01/22 08:40 AM
2

I'm a 38 year old incel. I was recently turned down from renting an apartment because the landlord felt I'm a risky tenant due to my age and lack of a spouse. May I ask for a society where this kind of thing is not normalized? I know nobody can compel a woman to love me. Being unlovable but having the same rights as every other man in society is a very close second as far as solutions go. That, and some system to provide care for me when I'm old and frail.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates05/01/22 08:37 AM
2

I'm a 38 year old incel and I think there absolutely needs to be a word because it's a condition that goes well beyond just a lack of sex and well beyond even just the mental issues that result from it. At this age being unable to attract a woman, being unpaired, being unmarried results in very tangible economic penalties such as difficulties in securing housing and decreased job security.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates05/01/22 08:30 AM
5

Before the incel craze, which started in 2017, the men in r/foreveralone was similarly accused of being violent misogynists. Yes, even after 2012, when that sub was given over to a radical feminist mod team which to this day allows female members to generalise and insult men, but not vice versa. On the flip side, given how poorly women treat unattractive men it's entirely natural that such men will grow to dislike women.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates05/01/22 08:14 AM
1

if you unfairly treat lonely, disadvantaged, depressed, and disaffected men like absolute scum, I don't think you have a right to be surprised when some (and I emphasise some, because it's absolutely not a majority) start doing as that cornered dog does The really peculiar thing is that they actually don't. For all the moral panic, there hasn't actually been even one violent incident committed by anyone who could reasonably be said to be an incel. I think the misguided expectation of violence is…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates05/01/22 08:11 AM
2

"Lonely men" and "socially excluded men" will be used to talk about men from sexual minorities to the exclusion of men who are simply not up to the market standards.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates05/01/22 08:06 AM
3

That's not how you do it. Every word, any phrase that refers to sexually unappealing men in a way that is not overtly negative, mocking, hostile etc. will be hijacked and made as such. Before the current incel hysteria "forever alone" used to carry the same connotations even while places like r/foreveralone gave even less justification for it than current incel communities. We have to fight the hatred not the word use.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates05/01/22 08:05 AM
5

The sentiment behind #mencancry is well intended Evil with good intentions is still evil. Just saying.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/01/22 10:37 AM
3

Had a neighbor pass away like that some months ago. Friendly guy, looked to be in his early fifties. We weren't friends, but I guess we were sort of acquaintances. Hell of a way to go.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates01/01/22 11:20 AM
1

It's illegal here too, but still pretty common.
/r/Male_Studies01/01/22 01:08 AM
4

I was recently turned down from renting a property explicitly because I'm an "old" (38 years old) single man. The landlord felt there was too much of a risk of my dying on the property and ruining it.
/r/Male_Studies31/12/21 04:34 PM
7

Spousal abuse by women is extremely common and accepted. Abuse by men is not. Don't know what you meant about daughters, but just recently there was an article about the growing problem of single Gen X women. You see, when the bubble burst I 1990 people became much poorer, but Japanese women failed to adjust their expectations of a partner's income. Many of those who were young at that age ended up never meeting a "suitable" man and lived off their Boomer parent's incomes without accruing any sk…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates31/12/21 09:18 AM
15

I think Japanese women are disadvantaged in ways Western women are not. I've been living in Japan for almost a decade now and plan to stay for life. I don't think Japanese women are particularly disadvantaged but given the shitty quality of anglophone journalism on pretty much any Japan-related topic, I can totally see how you would have that misconception.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates31/12/21 05:20 AM
1

Do you have any evidence to suggest that they don't? Why would I? You're the one who explicitly claimed that single mothers struggle more. The likelihood of being in poverty only matters if single motherhood causes poverty, which again, I understand that you intuitively feel it should, but you don't know that. And at least in some environments the opposite is true, i.e. poverty causes single motherhood because single mothers receive more welfare.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates31/12/21 05:08 AM
1

That doesn't show that a poor single mother struggles more than a poor single person or a poor couple or a poor single father though. I get what you're saying, and don't really have a horse in this race, but you really want to explore your view on this and separate the parts of your view motivated by knowledge from the parts motivated by intuition and feeling.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates31/12/21 04:00 AM
0

I'm going to ask you to back those assumptions are. I know why that seems intuitively true to you, but it's really more complicated than that. In my country, e.g., it's not uncommon for women to become single mothers specifically because the benefits enjoyed by mothers are so vast.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates31/12/21 02:40 AM
5

But also, a huge problem with parental leave is that women will take it and then just quit at the end. It's one thing to demand that an employer should support female employees in their motherhood. But if the normal state of affairs is that an employer will help an employee in such a way, and then lose her anyway, then parental leave becomes simply a financial penalty for hiring a fertile woman. I just recently found out that abuse of parental leave is par for the course in my home country (Russ…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates30/12/21 11:30 AM
3

The rules for parental leave say that I can't take leave if my spouse is taking it That can't fucking be legal. ...can it?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates30/12/21 11:24 AM
5

Well, single mothers comparatively struggle Comparatively? Compared to who?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates30/12/21 11:22 AM
10

It pretty much fucks every worker, if you stop and think of it. You're a working father? You're going to have to work your ass off and your employer is going to hold your child's well-being hostage to force you to do more work. You're a working mother? Enjoying balancing child-rearing with work. Or, if your husband is taking care of the kid, enjoy being worked to the bone just like a working father would be. You're a single woman? No point in paying you well or training you because you're just g…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates30/12/21 11:19 AM
10

That feminism is less evil than Nazism still doesn't excuse the evil of feminism and still isn't a reason to ally with feminists though.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates29/12/21 08:23 AM
1

What does "political non-starter" even mean? I explained to you the reason why I oppose feminism. What else?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates29/12/21 04:51 AM
0

Both are political movements which are evil, widespread and have a lot of institutional power. Just as the existence of decent people among Nazis doesn't exist the existence of Nazism and doesn't constitute a reason to join a Nazi party, the existence of decent feminists doesn't excuse all the evils committed by feminism and isn't a good reason to join the feminist movement.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates29/12/21 01:48 AM
19

There were probably members of the Nazi party who did something good. That's not at all a reason to downplay the evil of Nazism, let alone become a Nazi.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/12/21 10:54 PM
3

And on your second point, all forms of approaching end in failure more often than not for unattractive men. By your reasoning all forms of approaching a woman are thus always chosen exclusively out of desperation. And that obviously doesn't make sense.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates27/12/21 02:55 AM
0

For men who successfully cat call and like to, it is the norm.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates27/12/21 02:52 AM
-5

I love how literally every comment here operates on the assumption that catcalling never results in successfully meeting the woman and engaging in some form of intimacy with her. I guess this is your brain on Reddit. In real life attractive men catcall to signal their interest to women and when that interest is mutual women respond accordingly.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates27/12/21 02:15 AM
3

But some do it to be provocative and a man who approaches such women is simply banking on that being the case.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates27/12/21 02:13 AM
4

The only men I've known who actually engaged in catcalling were men who could reasonably expect no negative consequences and occasional good consequences from it. So that's one thing your pet theory completely fails to account for.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates27/12/21 02:10 AM
10

The female version is the weird lady who keeps pining for that one super-attractive dudebro from her past. And she's not lonely.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates26/12/21 10:12 AM
4

Oh! 750 million dollars is small change to an Arab prince. That fact certainly inspires in me great confidence in the institution of marriage and the fairness of family courts. What's your fucking point?
/r/Divorce_Men23/12/21 10:37 PM
8

I don't resent the idea. I resent the fact that acting feminine doesn't help and that the same feminists who preach femininity will punish a man for acting feminine, unless he's good looking.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates19/12/21 10:23 PM
0

That literally doesn't support what you said lol. But that's okay, it was an easy mistake to make. In any case, a man's physical attractiveness determines his income as well, so even if you hadn't misread the article (and you never even read the study itself lmao) the causative relationship would be the opposite of what you assume it is.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates18/12/21 06:00 AM
0

See, no, we don't "have studies". The moment you resort to making shit up is the moment you've lost the argument.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates18/12/21 05:33 AM
8

What? No, it's not similar at all. A woman can marry a man for his money without being attracted to him, and if offered would gladly trade such a marriage for a set up where she can have the money without the man. There's no equivalent of that for attraction to looks.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates18/12/21 03:48 AM
3

That's a problem with feminists though.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates17/12/21 04:36 AM
1

Look at photos of billionaires in their youth and most were extremely attractive. For the ones that aren't, you'll find that all achieved their success by relying on inheritance or by sheer luck.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates15/12/21 10:06 AM
1

It's knowledge and experience. You assume I'm making it up based on some ethical notions that I espouse. No, I'm simply relaying to you the things I've experienced and seen in my four decades of life on this planet.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates15/12/21 05:41 AM
-1

Power, social status and money are capped and cannot reliably be earned unless a certain threshold of physical attractiveness is met. An unattractive man can either inherit power and status or achieve them through methods that are not replicable and rely on luck. In addition, a man who is not attractive enough to get married will face even harsher restrictions. I know that you instinctively, intuitively feel opposition to this idea. I also know the best counterargument you'll have is anecdotal e…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates15/12/21 05:39 AM
-1

No. Attractive deadbeats are attractive. Successful ugly men are not attractive and past a certain point economic success is capped for men who aren't physically attractive.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates15/12/21 03:41 AM
-2

Becoming attractive takes effort. Creating attraction then is as easy as simply being present. An unattractive man is unattractive regardless of what he does.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates15/12/21 02:39 AM
0

Men have to earn sex Bullshit. Attraction is instant and instinctual, it cannot be earned or otherwise negotiated.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates14/12/21 10:11 PM
10

What boggles my mind in those scenarios is the lack of empathy. Can't those people put themselves in the child's shoes? Can't they realize that if they were getting molested the attractiveness of the abuser wouldn't matter at all to them? Part of me thinks this'lucky boy' excuse is less about failure to realize the harm and more about a reluctance to condemn a woman.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates14/12/21 04:41 AM
7

I wouldn't get worried until they start to suppress the original, honestly. IIRC 451 Fahrenheit or some other similarly iconic anti-authoritarian work is actually banned in my country. That's something to worry about. People writing fan fiction of popular books is good, if anything. Even if the fan fiction is shitty.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates13/12/21 11:16 PM
15

Yeah, I've lost a number of female friends recently because of things like this. It's bizzarre. I still can't quite understand how someone can just throw away two decades of friendship because of a minor political disagreement but that's exactly what happened several times now. And it wasn't even something extreme like me saying we need to take away women's rights or something. The last female friend who decided to pick a fight with me and storm off got triggered when I said it's tough being a l…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates13/12/21 10:20 PM
9

Aside from the obvious - distant relatives lost in the horrible wars of the past - there's conscription. I'm Russian. All Russian men between 18 and 27 years old are targeted - you have to spend a year (used to be three years) in the military. It's fairly straightforward to bribe one's way out of conscription, but it's expensive and not many families can afford that. Men who haven't served are very often shamed and sometimes outright discriminated upon (a significant number of civilian governmen…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates12/12/21 10:46 PM
2

You do you and keep taking responsibility with others use institutional power to harm you. I'll fight for my rights.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates11/12/21 05:49 AM
1

The last point is big, I feel. The internet makes all communication incredibly easy to monitor and censor - feminists never had to face a resistance so powerful. Hell, I've read my share of books on Soviet dissidents and even they had much more freedom to discuss and spread their ideas than mess MRAs do now online.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates11/12/21 05:45 AM
5

Pretty much all remixers feminist spaces are guilty of the same though. That can't be the reason.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates11/12/21 05:42 AM
4

We REALLY need to separate feminism from men's mental health. And that's an incredibly difficult thing to do. Good luck finding any space where you can engage in any sort of conversation or treatment of mental health that is not also overtly feminist. No, seriously, there are extremely few of them around, and the few that exist are also constantly besieged.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates11/12/21 02:56 AM
6

Know your place, really. An attractive, high status man obviously isn't getting punished for looking at a woman, but someone like me absolutely would. Authoritarianism aside, this is just another step in codifying the male pecking order into law. Just as with taxes, it's your job to figure out where you fall on the hierarchy and you will be punished if you figure it out wrong.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/12/21 01:51 AM
7

The "woke agenda" is right by the traditional political compass. You don't get any more right than pushing for hierarchies based on race and gender.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/12/21 01:48 AM
1

Not having forced labor camps also hurts the government.
/r/Divorce_Men05/12/21 02:04 AM
1

Honestly, marriage tax breaks are such bullshit anyway.
/r/Divorce_Men04/12/21 11:38 AM
2

No, no, they were being showcased as victims and brave survivors of a vicious attack. Except they were going around talking about how he deserved to be bullied.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates03/12/21 08:42 AM
3

No. Unless you really start stretching definitions, there really haven't
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates03/12/21 02:48 AM
6

You're actually wrong - most violent attackers don't fit that definition at all. Only a select few do. But the line of thinking you're presenting here is very telling. You acknowledge that being an unattractive, low status man leads to such bad treatment from society, that it intuitively seems understandable to you that such a person would violently lash out. It doesn't matter that in reality they do not - you're so aware of the mistreatment that you feel they should. I think the whole stereotyp…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/12/21 10:52 PM
9

The guy with the nice car who made a manifesto and shot a bunch of people Elliot Rodger. He was never part of any incel community, had never approached a woman in his life and had never been rejected. Hardly fair to call someone like that an incel, unless you just go and slap that label on literally anyone who has yet to have sex. But if you do that, you'll have trouble making the argument that incels are violent - most violent attackers still won't fit it. I think a guy with a van Alek Minassia…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/12/21 10:40 PM
8

I believe Elliot Rodger self identified as incel He did not. He also wasn't an incel in any pragmatic sense either. He attributed his violence to girls not paying attention to him, but he had also literally never even approached a woman in his life before deciding that none will like him. Since he never identified as an incel, never was part of any incel community and was never rejected by a woman, what basis do you have for assigning him the incel label? His looks? If so, that leads us to the u…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/12/21 10:33 PM
5

That's quite obviously not true, at least if you use the definition of "involuntarily celibate", not some nebulous group identity mostly used to denigrate people. But the "incel attackers" trope is used to justify witch hunts against that "nebulous identity", not all involuntarily celibate men. But not getting laid when they desire to is absolutely one of the top reasons for extreme violence. No, it's not.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/12/21 10:30 PM
5

What's an "incel-type person"?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/12/21 10:28 PM
-6

I mean groups like "incels" There has never been a violent attacker that was an incel.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/12/21 03:22 PM
2

Combat conscription with biblical necromancy? Count me in!
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/12/21 04:33 AM
1

No, I don't think they were being underhanded. If they were, they certainly didn't do a very good job. It's just bad research.
/r/Male_Studies01/12/21 10:36 PM
1

Can't read because paywall. The "weight status" variable is suspect to me because the positive effect it has on sexual activity in men is really counterintuitive. I bet they're using "dumb" BMI to assign weight status which will conflate data from overweight men with data from extremely fit muscular men.
/r/Male_Studies01/12/21 04:15 AM
5

No. Metrosexual was never about just being androgynous - a metrosexual man had to be fit and have a masculine appearance under the non-masculine outfit.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates30/11/21 04:15 AM
2

Lol, no dude, when women complain that they don't get any attention or that it's only bottom of the barrel men, that's absolutely me. I'm not disfigured, but I am ugly and androgynous and that seals the deal. They're not offended because the elephant man is hitting on them - it's guys like me and lower. What you're saying about personality, I disagree. Women judge men on appearance first and only if an initial threshold is passed does personality begin to matter. This isn't limited to sexual stu…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates30/11/21 03:30 AM
1

See, I don't understand it in that I can't really empathize with feeling genuine distress and sadness because you're not getting courted by people attractive enough. I get that those feelings are genuine, but feeling that way just seems alien to me. I can't relate. And being in the same space as women who feel that way is toxic to me because I am one of those unattractive men whose attention is making those women so distressed.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates30/11/21 02:23 AM
3

It was the top comment at some point anyway. There's a comment here that links to the source on her being married. And yeah, pretty much all women in lonely people's communities are like that. Not all of them are necessarily in a relationship when they post there but it's literally always the same scenario - they enjoy plenty of attention but it's not the right attention and the people they reduce receive it from are not good enough. It's why despite suffering from severe loneliness I've sworn o…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates30/11/21 01:03 AM
4

Bachelor tax.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates29/11/21 11:24 PM
6

its really strange that she says this then It isn't. Visit any community for lonely people and pretty much 100% of the female users will be like her. The source for her being married is given in the top comment here.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates29/11/21 10:14 PM
20

the people that are against "feminine men" are also the ones that enforces strong gender roles for women I'm an androgynous man and people who claim to be progressive are far more guilty of shaming and discriminating against me and others like me. You usually have different types of men that get the girl in movies for example, like the fun guy or the nerd. You usually have different character types who, however, all look the same - tall, masculine, fit. Unlike women, who are represented in all s…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates29/11/21 02:42 PM
1

Are mixed gender spaces dedicated to that also toxic to men?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates29/11/21 10:46 AM
8

its better to be a virgin than someone that only gets used for a ONS but isn't deemed worthy to actually date The author is married and had several boyfriends. She's not complaining that men won't romance her. She's complaining that attractive men don't romance her often enough.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates29/11/21 08:11 AM
2

It doesn't, actually, unless you're specifically excluding men like me from the "we"
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates29/11/21 01:48 AM
6

No. The discussion of loneliness specifically constantly gets poisoned by the notion that loneliness in men and women is identical, and that it's all the kind of loneliness that the author of the article experiences: that is, the "loneliness" of someone who has plenty of positive interactions with people, but wants to have that with more attractive people. This completely erases low status men who are objectively isolated, rejected everywhere and have no choice but to be alone. It's not helpful …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates29/11/21 01:46 AM
2

Recall that you started this conversation trying to convince me of something.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates29/11/21 01:37 AM
2

You want body cam footage of my daily life? You can file a request at the Carkudo section of your city hall. I'm sure they'll have it.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates29/11/21 01:17 AM
4

Hatred is too strong of a word here. That's, like, your opinion, man. If members of a group are consistently offended by the mere presence of members of another group, I think it's not at all "too strong" to say that the former hate the latter. We'll just have to agree to disagree on what's "too strong"
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/11/21 11:17 PM
5

Oh, I see. I disagree, actually. I think that sort of nuance is irrelevant actually, and it's entirely fair to say that women in general hate unattractive men. But that's kind off taking this offtopic, don't you think?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/11/21 11:06 PM
5

Um, that's nice about your friend, but I'm not sure what this has to do with my comment?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/11/21 10:57 PM
7

Most of the important topics have already been covered by others here, so I'll add my own personal angle. For me this article also resonates with another problem I have being one of those invisible men - a lack of online spaces where I can talk about my experiences and feelings. Women like the author, who receive plenty of attention and lament that it comes from men who are beneath her, are plenty. As one of those 'beneath' men I can't really go to communities like r/foreveralone or pretty much …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/11/21 10:56 PM
7

I somehow doubt that women abhor guys who are genuinely nice. It's possible when a man is unattractive. Niceness can be or can be misconstrued as courtship, and women do indeed abhor being courted by an unattractive man. I'm very physically unattractive and a good chunk of my life is a balancing act between showing people common courtesy (as in handing someone a wallet they dropped etc.) and avoiding creeping women out doing that. Of course, that's more like women abhoring unattractive men than …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/11/21 10:29 PM
2

women moving around or even leaving the country to find husbands wut Russian women become mail order brides not to "find husbands" but to get a better lifestyle. I assure you, when Russian women complain that "there are no men" they mean attractive, eligible men, and the standard for that is as high as it is elsewhere. I mean, come on, I'm Russian and was an incel until well into my thirties. And my story is not unique - there are plenty of men like me in Russia. It didn't take much to disqualif…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/11/21 10:21 PM
2

Don't these men have the option of not having a family?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/11/21 06:11 AM
3

You're making the point that discrimination that keeps a worker from jobs she might be qualified for, but not from ALL jobs, means "keeping her at home" As an older single man I face the same kind of discrimination. Shall we say that modern society is "keeping older bachelors home"?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/11/21 06:07 AM
1

As a single 38 year old I'm way more active and outgoing than most of my peers and I am active in my local community too, thank you. I don't think it's up to me to judge whether what I have to offer is "of value" It certainly was to my ex wife, until someone offered her something different and/or better. But aside from her women tend to avoid even just casual one on one conversation with me, unless they can't see what I look like. DOn't know who Big Ed is, but experience says that yeah, looks ar…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates27/11/21 09:24 AM
1

When I said only one woman has ever given me a chance, I meant that literally. I'm very unattractive. Covid also destroyed my finances so now I'm poor. I don't need perfect and I'm willing to take even a completely loveless relationship at this point, but there just aren't any takers.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates27/11/21 08:49 AM
1

"Somatic illness" What a sophisticated name for the monster that lives under my bed. If my health ever fails me, I damn hope I have enough mental and physical capacity left to become part of that statistic. There worse fates than suicide.
/r/Male_Studies27/11/21 07:25 AM
2

It's not even misandry. I bet she has way more empathy for attractive men.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates27/11/21 07:17 AM
5

This is such a great message. Thank you.
/r/MenSupportMen25/11/21 03:58 AM
5

It's also not like finding one such person solves everything. I met one woman who gave me a chance, jumped at the opportunity and it worked out. Until it didn't and she left. Now I'm back do square one, only older.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates25/11/21 03:54 AM
1

The youth bulge is a hypothesis, not an "observation". And it predicts that a large number of disenfranchised young men in the context of an otherwise unstable society will exacerbate the instability. That's a pretty far cry from the idea that a large number of lonely men will turn violent just because they're lonely - that idea is a meme and doesn't stand up to even cursory scrutiny, because there's just too many counterexamples.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/11/21 01:03 AM
1

You make a fair point, but I have to out that incentives existed since long before capitalism or even feudalism. Through most of civilized history it's probably been weird and unacceptable for men to be single past a certain age.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/11/21 12:55 AM
2

Once I read that the biggest chance of war was in countries with a high percentage of young, unmarried men. Once? I've read that thousands of times. It's a meme. At best, it's a talking point.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates23/11/21 12:29 PM
1

That's an adjective that I don't actually know how to apply in this context. "Conservative" in the context of statistic means cautious, reluctant to support any plasuible interpretation unless there is overwhelming analytic evidence in favor of it. To reiterate, to attribute the evident difference between the endpoints of the men's graph purely to statistical error is the opposite of that.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates23/11/21 12:28 PM
1

An ambulance.
/r/MenSupportMen23/11/21 05:14 AM
1

Where did I even mention feminism, wtf?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates23/11/21 01:31 AM
10

Source it please.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates23/11/21 01:08 AM
3

The reason I can't get a date is toxic soup. Ooookay.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates23/11/21 12:58 AM
1

Statistical error like that would mess with any sort of analysis involving regression, but you really don't need it here. The important parts of the graph are the endpoints really - the graph for men ends at a very different place whereas the graph for women doesn't. You can advocate being conservative in interpreting this, but to attribute the entire difference to error is the opposite of that.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates23/11/21 12:57 AM
5

The association between sexless men and violence is false. It intuitively feels "right" that a sexless man should be violent, but that's a purely cultural view that is not born out by any data and is not based on any objective facts, even cherry picked ones.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates23/11/21 12:52 AM
6

Por que no los dos? Where I live income is very important in determining a man's chances of getting married. The common sense cutoff line below which men are considered unmarriagable is about 25% higher than the national average. The cutoff line reflects a higher average income from a few decades ago. So it's really both economic factors (incomes are objectively lower) AND unrealistic standards.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates23/11/21 12:49 AM
2

Your view feels simultaneously correct and bizarre to me. Current because it does represent how I feel about dating personally, but at the same time bizarre because... isn't there plenty of incentive for men to seek out sex and relationships? Modern society is heavily biased against single men - giving up on having a family means giving up social interaction and career progression later in life. It means always being the outsider, making less money, having higher expenses. Is the dating market f…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates23/11/21 12:41 AM
6

That doesn't sound like it's misrepresented, but rather that it's poorly explained. While the criticisms there are valid, none rule out the straightforward interpretation from the OP.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates23/11/21 12:37 AM
6

Going to be the pessimistic voice here. I think there has been an increase in recognition and support, but it's not due to increased empathy but due to increased institutional oppression against men. In the past few years we've come to have a world where a man who can't have sex is deemed a Twitter terrorist in the making, where nonviolent crimes are only crimes when committed by men, where bachelor taxes are making a comeback. Proportional to how much more severe the oppression has become, sinc…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates21/11/21 03:39 AM
1

Could you advise me on which units to use to measure my straightness?
/r/MenSupportMen19/11/21 10:22 AM
5

Lol honestly I want to be able to have sex and be in a relationship - growing old alone sucks. But I'll take not being shamed as the next best thing.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates16/11/21 02:02 AM
2

Backing down on your own words already, huh? The larger point of shaming those who fail to play ball is absolutely valid Nothing about that is valid. It just makes you feel good to punch down on those who have it harder than you in life.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates15/11/21 11:16 PM
2

Dude. What is it about male sexlessness g trust gets you that riled up?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates15/11/21 10:44 AM
8

There quite literally aren't. And that's the fundamental difference that makes your comparison wildly invalid. Promiscuity is a choice always. Sexlessness often is not.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates15/11/21 09:41 AM
4

Hi. I can't have sex because I'm just that unattractive and couldn't find a willing partner if my life depended on it. Come on, tell me now what the fuck is "valid" about shaming and penalising me for being the way I am?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates15/11/21 04:26 AM
19

Not to defend slut shaming, but promiscuity is a choice. A promiscuous woman can choose to not have sex. I can't choose to have sex.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates15/11/21 04:24 AM
2

Second and third. I got friends who understand me well enough but we're middle aged and they all have families now so I'm lucky to see them maybe a couple times a year. And that's just those who live in the same country. The only romantic partner I've had left me a year ago and realistically I probably won't meet another. Miss her like hell too.
/r/MenSupportMen14/11/21 04:42 AM
3

I'm used to dealing with feelings of loneliness but it's been almost two decades since I've felt this horny. And yet I couldn't find a sexual partner if my life depended on it. Just. Fuck this life.
/r/MenSupportMen13/11/21 06:17 AM
11

It gives a 404 error. Check the link please.
/r/BlackPillScience13/11/21 03:35 AM
3

I did. You replied with an appeal to semantics at which point the debate was over. Feel free to ignore me.
/r/BlackPillScience12/11/21 02:23 AM
5

Hint: take a look at how the variable in question is actually defined. You probably don't understand why it's distinct from attraction, but it is and your appeal to dictionary definitions doesn't change that. Also, the hint isn't actually for you ;)
/r/BlackPillScience12/11/21 02:17 AM
12

The moment you're arguing semantics in a scientific debate, you've lost the debate.
/r/BlackPillScience12/11/21 02:12 AM
17

Those studies showing that blind women are still only attracted conventionally attractive chads would like to have a word. Of course, that's only if we go with your baseless assumption that preference equals attraction. If we don't then the post itself is off topic and not relevant to the black pill.
/r/BlackPillScience12/11/21 02:07 AM
1

Jesus fucking Christ. This is why I have no respect for career military men. Useless assholes preening in their uniforms and practicing dat steely gaze for photos while sending children to get mutilated and die.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates12/11/21 02:02 AM
4

No, I'm not reading the whole thing just to find your argument for you. My point is that the study doesn't control for participants' attractiveness and is thus useless. That's written in the methodology section. You want to refute something - make your case. But I'm sure that as usual, you cannot.
/r/BlackPillScience11/11/21 01:46 AM
7

As someone who went from shy socially anxious boy to a confident man capable of running his own business in a field that relies on networking and maintaining good relationships over all else, I have a very good perspective on how such a personality change did not affect my attractiveness to women. But that's just my personal anecdote. The problem remains - two predictors known to affect the target variable, you're saying they "probably" don't interact. What makes that probable?
/r/BlackPillScience10/11/21 10:35 PM
3

I have absolutely no idea what that sentence is supposed to mean, and I'm sure neither do you.
/r/BlackPillScience10/11/21 10:33 PM
4

Why? I read the methodology section and saw it doesn't control for phyiscal attractiveness. This renders the rest of the paper entirely uninteresting.
/r/BlackPillScience10/11/21 10:32 PM
7

What makes that probable? From a statistical point of view, you're arguing that two predictors that are known to significantly affect the dependent variable "probably" have no interaction. That seems like a pretty unlikely scenario, but feel free to provide your sources that show it's actually more common than the opposite.
/r/BlackPillScience10/11/21 11:35 AM
2

Could be. The point is that the OP study is useless for arguing either of those points.
/r/BlackPillScience10/11/21 11:32 AM
3

You guessed it - I feel goddamn lonely.
/r/MenSupportMen10/11/21 04:04 AM
62

Does not control for physical attractiveness, thus useless.
/r/BlackPillScience10/11/21 03:38 AM
1

It's a rationalisation because it's a reason appended to an existing attitude of discrimination. It would be an actual reason only if all single men performed worse and all family men performed better, but that is obviously not true.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates10/11/21 03:12 AM
2

That's one of several common rationalizations for that. Ask around for reasons why single men are discriminated and you'll get about half a dozen common justifications - unmarried men don't work as hard, they don't perform as well, they're unreliable, they reflect badly on a company's reputation etc. The fact that those rationalizations are all over the place is evidence that they're just that - rationalizations, and not actual reasons.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates09/11/21 10:50 PM
19

I believe we need feminism. What for? Feminism today is a bigoted movement that perpetrates way too much injustice to justify the little good that it does. We need a force for gender equality, but why should it necessarily have to grow out of a movement that was for gender equality and then became opposed to it?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates09/11/21 12:49 PM
4

It's a thing in Japan and in my home country of Russia and I've heard the same about workplaces in Europe and North America as well.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates09/11/21 10:55 AM
5

If you work in a traditional corporate environment, which realistically most men will be, being single will put a cap on your income and compromise your job security, meaning you will make much less than your married peers and thus will be able to save less. Then when you're old you'll need more money, because you won't have a spouse or adult children to fall back on, but you will have less. It's self-evident that people with families still save money, so you can't make the argument that having …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates09/11/21 05:43 AM
1

But a better one than staying single. Only a good dedicated retirement plan is a good retirement plan, but someone without a family is much less likely to be able to afford one.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates09/11/21 01:50 AM
3

Accumulated wealth gets eaten up by funeral expenses and inheritance taxes, and income guys away because the elders are no longer there to collect their pension and dividends. The problem arises because whatever is left is obviously not enough for one or more adult daughters to survive on indefinitely. And having a family absolutely is cheaper than being single. Even without a double income the earning potential of a man with a family is much higher - most corporate environments have a glass cei…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates09/11/21 01:48 AM
11

I don't know the numbers, actually. Obviously most Gen X people have relationships and marriages. Specifically, the 'lost generation' women mentioned in the article are in their situation by choice - they opted to wait for a sufficiently wealthy suitor expecting to become a housewife, as was common for the several generations that came before. The catch was that wealthy men became MUCH less common from exactly that generation meaning a bunch of those women ended up waiting for someone that never…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates09/11/21 01:08 AM
4

You make the decision to have kids when you can afford them though, whereas growing old is something that happens to you regardless of your wishes. If you grow old without having a family you end up shouldering all the costs of old age without the benefits that having a family affords and with all the penalties that come with being an older single. Sure, one can perhaps invest and with some luck multiply his wealth just enough to offset the economic penalities of being "leftover" but IMO a solut…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates09/11/21 01:00 AM
15

It doesn't have to be, but it is in practice. I mean, I'm not saying we should actively censor the voices of women who end up as "leftover" through no choice of their own, but I'm convinced that there are no such women to begin with whereas men in that situation are increasingly common.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates09/11/21 12:08 AM
4

Why do they need to have knowledge though? You accused them (us, really - I'm one such men) of meaning "no women I like" but that's simply false. There are plenty of women out there that I wouldn't want to date, and none of them are any more open to dating me that the women I do want. And this is true for just other unattractive men I've met in the past. Erasing potential partners that you deem too unattractive is something lonely women commonly do. Lonely men don't. And you know, it's telling h…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/11/21 10:02 AM
5

No, your point doesn't stand. A man can't ask our every woman he meets and in fact doesn't need to ask women out at all to gauge their interest. I get that you might have met someone who acted the way you describe - aware that some women could be open to dating him, but pretending that none are. But again - my claim is that most men who say "no women" do indeed mean no women. My view comes from almost two decades of hanging out in such men's communities across three different cultures. Your view…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/11/21 09:11 AM
2

After the Greek alphabet is done they'll move on to animals. Who wants to be a wolf man?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/11/21 09:04 AM
3

I'm going to challenge you on this one. Obviously you mean the incels and foreveralones and other such types. I've spent most of my adult life (I'm 38) in such communities and the overwhelming majority of those men indeed mean "no women" and not "no women I like" The men you're condemning here are very much a minority.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/11/21 08:43 AM
4

I'm Russian and I disagree. You make a solid theoretical point, but in practice we can observe that all historical Communist regimes are very similar politically.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/11/21 08:30 AM
5

Historically socialist societies have tended to lean traditionalist as well. The Soviet Union had a male-only bachelor tax AND a childlessnes tax. It's hypocritical but sadly very common.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates05/11/21 03:58 AM
3

Nothing wrong with old data jfc
/r/Male_Studies03/11/21 04:10 AM
8

I wouldn't call them controlled opposition - it's not like they allow any opposition to Feminism or any other misandrist forces in society. It's really more like a reeducation camp.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates03/11/21 04:08 AM
4

I'm probably going to die alone and I'm terrified of it. Every day. Every second that I can't cover it up with work, hobbies or substance abuse. They say learning to love yourself is salvation, but it really isn't. So what if I know I don't deserve to suffer? I still suffer and can't do anything about it. So what if I know I'm worthy of love when there's no love to be had? My wound is loneliness and rejection. It's not particularly unique. It's just particularly deep now that I've almost made it…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/11/21 04:10 AM
1

It's okay to cut back on gym time if it's eating up all of your free time.
/r/MenSupportMen01/11/21 09:29 AM
0

Metaphors don't really have to be consistent with other metaphors
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates01/11/21 04:26 AM
1

In the US only.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates31/10/21 10:58 AM
8

with minimal bodily impact Huh? From what I've read about US family courts, men in the US get thrown in prison not just for failing to pay child support, but also for literally earning less than a judge believes they could be earning. That sounds like pretty serious "bodily impact"
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates31/10/21 10:57 AM
1

Tax credits, handouts and any form of discrimination by private entities that favors married people.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates31/10/21 10:49 AM
1

Can't watch the video so just tell me - does your reform include taking away all the incentives and privileges that married people currently enjoy?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates31/10/21 08:47 AM
0

French movies. Not even once.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/10/21 06:44 AM
14

Why do even have subscription? I've never had one and the last time I considered getting one was in 2017. The platform sucks. Their content sucks. Their policies sucks. And it's run by plain bad people who should be out on the street panhandling, not raking in millions. Stop giving them your money. Pirate the content if you absolutely need to watch it.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates27/10/21 01:09 PM
3

I have the ugleh. Also the oldeh and the pooreh.
/r/MenSupportMen26/10/21 11:15 PM
7

As usual, I'm lonely. I've also been extremely horny these days. Like I'm sixteen again. I feel I might develop some kind of porn addiction over this. Great fucking place to be in life. I want companionship and sex very badly, yet there's not much I can do to get either.
/r/MenSupportMen26/10/21 10:20 AM
1

As evidenced by the fact that there are selfish lonely men and altruistic men who date, it's more that women are attracted to men who can afford to be either without incurring punishment from their environment.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates25/10/21 04:11 AM
1

Here's my feedback: don't negotiate with bigots. Definitely don't suck up to them.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates25/10/21 03:50 AM
1

Five paragraphs of guidance on how to suck up to aggressive feminists. In a left wing male sub. Amazing.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/10/21 11:01 AM
1

One can feel self-worth and still find life not worth living. Self-worth is not to be-all end-all of the human condition and it's a bit fucked up IMO to think that it is.
/r/MenSupportMen23/10/21 07:56 AM
2

Thanks bro.
/r/MenSupportMen22/10/21 06:37 AM
7

Not at all. Pretty much all men's issues fit into the framework of class issues. For example, as a man who can't get married I am unfairly forced to pay a higher income tax. If I were wealthier that wouldn't matter and I could avoid personal taxation altogether, but as I'm not born into the elite and can't married due to unattractiveness, my career progression and wealth are capped at a level where that extra bit of tax does matter. In a similar way pretty much all men's issues feed into class i…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates22/10/21 04:15 AM
4

I am the once and future incel
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates21/10/21 10:23 AM
1

The fact that it's gendered is self-evident. It would be reasonable to be cautious about the why, but avoiding stating what's evident is not cautious, it's just being politically correct.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates21/10/21 04:07 AM
9

You make a fair theoretical point, but in practice it's obviously going to be gendered because women have easy access to better options.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates20/10/21 10:22 PM
13

I agree with everything you say. But even before we get into complicated stuff like what you describe, there's a very simple venue for exploitation - any sex worker who has any sort of protection can simply take a client's money and refuse service. The one time I went to a sex worker that basically happened - she has me pay up front, as is standard with sex work, then did everything to let me know how unwelcome I am at her place, short of directly saying it. Obviously the experience wasn't very …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates20/10/21 10:18 PM
1

So you finally gave your hunch a rationalisation and it's just wrong. This is by far not the first article that treats women's high standards as something that the world and men are inflicting upon them. Come on, seriously, you think this is the first ever such take in the history of humanity? Really?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates20/10/21 02:35 AM
12

although flawed, the commenter does believe in the logic Yeah, I figured as much, but that's the second half of his problem - it's not logic, it's literally a hunch.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates19/10/21 11:09 AM
11

The other commenter is saying that's it's acceptable to erase incel men by equating their problems to the "problems" of women who forgo sex and relationships because they dislike their options. The commenter's reasoning is that it's acceptable because he has a vague hunch that something in the article is potentially beneficial to incels in the future and because involuntary celibacy is not a big deal. Except, it is a big fucking deal and any beneficial rhetoric cannot excuse the absolutely evil …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates19/10/21 10:33 AM
18

Literally people who choose not to have sex and relationships vs. people with no choice. Of course the people with the freedom to choose are privileged. I understand that you have some sort of hunch that this is beneficial to incel men, but a hunch is not very convincing.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates19/10/21 08:16 AM
13

The reason there are few older incels isn't because men just age their way into relationships and sex lmao
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates19/10/21 07:44 AM
13

I like that they equate the issues of a group of disadvantaged men to the issues of a group of privileged women because I feel that will eventually make things better for the former. I don't know how it will, but I still think this is good. I mean... Need I even say anything?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates19/10/21 07:42 AM
3

I'm lonely :(
/r/MenSupportMen19/10/21 04:42 AM
31

You're okay with them equating the situation incels face to that of women who got old and stopped having sex because they don't like their options?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates19/10/21 04:38 AM
4

Chinese shills courting blackpillers is something new. What's your deal OP?
/r/BlackPillScience19/10/21 03:50 AM
0

Actually, there is a solid probability (around 93.8%) that you are making up numbers to sound smart.
/r/BlackPillScience18/10/21 11:15 PM
4

A housewife is a slave? Really? Let's take the example of my friend. She's a housewife in her thirties. Her husband is the sole breadwinner and she makes small change selling arts and crafts sometimes. Mostly she's busy raising her kid and taking care of the house. She has full control of the family budget and gives the husband a small monthly allowance. She doesn't like him much and could easily divorce him whenever she wants - she would recieve default full custody and he would be obligated to…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates16/10/21 04:35 AM
2

50 Shades of Grey that u/carkudo mentioned Hey, just a heads up. I think you've got the wrong guy here.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates16/10/21 01:11 AM
2

Why indeed? Have you ever tried asking that question non-rhetorically, or does that make you feel threatened?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates15/10/21 04:31 AM
4

We'd need to find some to figure that out.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates15/10/21 04:29 AM
14

There is protocol - Rule 1 and Rule 2. They're just sort of taboo to talk about.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates14/10/21 04:35 AM
-2

Boo hoo
/r/PussyPassDenied13/10/21 11:10 AM
4

Having self-worth is not an alternative to incel communities - having self-worth and a community of like-minded people who empathize with you is better and healthier than having self-worth and no such community. Same goes for "hobbies, health, work"
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates13/10/21 06:45 AM
7

Other than you feeling one reason is good and the other not, what is the difference?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates13/10/21 06:42 AM
1

Пиши по-английски, цыка блджад.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates13/10/21 05:11 AM
9

And do you know healthier ways to deal with being unattractive and undesirable? Not even a rhetorical question. I'm more or less a forty year old incel and while I recognize the flaws of incel communities, they're still the healthiest option for dealing with my situation.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates13/10/21 05:06 AM
8

It's not normal to form one's identity around an illness either, but I don't see you berating cancer patients
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates13/10/21 04:43 AM
6

No incels have actually committed violence. You take all the "incel" attacks since, say, 2008, and you will find that no single attacker was both and incel and identified as one.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates13/10/21 04:41 AM
2

This isn't a criminal trial. This is the institutional equivalent of a high school bully beating the crap out of you because you were there and he felt like it. This is society taking the life of a low status guy simply because he caught their eye.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates13/10/21 02:12 AM
5

The same shit does routinely get posted on r/datingoverthirty
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates12/10/21 09:26 AM
5

Look who's all butthurt.
/r/BlackPillScience12/10/21 03:52 AM
7

It being a peer reviewed study doesn't mean the intuitive insights it gives you are true.
/r/BlackPillScience12/10/21 03:52 AM
5

It doesn't as long as she doesn't make Chad wait.
/r/BlackPillScience12/10/21 03:51 AM
7

Feminist take. How did you grow up to be this shitty?
/r/PussyPassDenied11/10/21 10:13 PM
6

Yes it is. Sure, I know that you have a ton of academic 'thought' written down to explain why your racism and sexism are okay. So did the nazis. So does pretty much every right wing group that does that.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates10/10/21 10:59 PM
11

I mean, it promotes racial and gender essentialism within a framework of "natural" hierarchies. You don't get more right wing than that.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates10/10/21 01:16 AM
25

Was it ever empathetic? As a low status man, I don't think Western intersectionality was ever not hostile to me.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates09/10/21 11:13 PM
-1

Then why do you feel the need to make excuses?
/r/ExRedPill09/10/21 07:44 AM
0

Good. Thank you for showing that women are indeed the choosers.
/r/ExRedPill09/10/21 05:40 AM
1

Look who's getting all huffy because someone see through his lies. You've been around for two decades and still have to rely on staged videos to sell your bullshit. It's pretty safe to assume your bullshit doesn't work, except for attractive men who can't fail anyway.
/r/ExRedPill09/10/21 05:38 AM
-2

None of that is an excuse for having unrealistic standards. If you feel the need to excuse having those, that's not going to do it
/r/ExRedPill09/10/21 05:36 AM
0

What are those women like? The least attractive woman I've known literally had to skip university classes because she couldn't fit through the auditorium doors. She was also epilptic, balding in her early twenties and had a very abrasive personality, constantly starting fights with people around her. She certainly never suffered from a shortage of suitors, all of them normal, fit men. So if someone like her has plenty of options, what kinds of women do fall through the cracks?
/r/ExRedPill09/10/21 02:38 AM
0

Because you have an easy way out and you choose to take the easy way out.
/r/ExRedPill09/10/21 02:36 AM
10

we're missing the part that performing artist do not give away their copyrights Correct me if I'm wrong, but don't most performing artists have no copyrights to give awway in the first place because they've already given those away to producers?
/r/PussyPassDenied09/10/21 02:11 AM
2

But I know many unattractive PUA dudes that managed to fuck 30+ women Bullshit.
/r/ExRedPill08/10/21 06:22 PM
1

Why do you think so?
/r/ExRedPill08/10/21 01:07 PM
1

That's an easy thing to say for someone who has a normal social life. And no, don't give me "you don't know my life". I do enough to make that judgement.
/r/ExRedPill08/10/21 12:54 PM
5

I'm gonna be level with you, I don't think you were a good husband and there are at least three separate points in your story where I want to slap you in the face for being such a dumbass. But she was a downright fucking horrible wife and mother too, so there's that. You both made your mistakes and now have to live with it. I sincerely hope for the best for you son.
/r/Divorce_Men08/10/21 12:02 PM
0

people treat you how you allow yourself to be treated Some of the less fortunate men have to choose between being treated badly and being completely alone.
/r/ExRedPill08/10/21 11:47 AM
-10

Yep. Ultimately, you shouldn't become red pill because redpill techniques don't work unless you're already attractive anyway. Try using them like that guy did and all you get is harsh rejections and damaged mental health.
/r/ExRedPill08/10/21 11:43 AM
6

Pro tip: your relationship didn't fail because you initiated. It failed because you pursued someone who didn't like you.
/r/ExRedPill08/10/21 06:39 AM
4

Women can just as easily be the proactive party.
/r/ExRedPill08/10/21 04:32 AM
1

Most men have standards, but the intersection of those different standards leaves no women completely disqualified, whereas a sizeable chunk of men do fall through the cracks and end up without options.
/r/ExRedPill08/10/21 01:56 AM
1

The mainstream view is that they're not because men who aren't attractive inherently cannot be chosen, so it's really not a choice at all. To admit that women are the choosers would be to admit that men who aren't sexy are still human, and that's a line that modern Western progressive thought refuses to cross.
/r/ExRedPill08/10/21 01:54 AM
2

That doesn't answer my questions though, does it? The last one is rhetorical, but please answer the other ones.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/10/21 03:28 AM
1

I don't know. According to OP, I'm not "a man", so I asked them to teach me how to "be a man" in the context of my being so unattractive that women actively avoid me.
/r/ExRedPill06/10/21 10:56 PM
3

maybe in a diff country Oh? So you live in a country that doesn't give married people tax benefits simply for being married? You live in a country where bachelors are commonly found in positions of power? Tell me where that paradise on earth is so I can move there.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates06/10/21 10:55 PM
1

Why didnt it work out? We got trapped on the opposite sides of a border by the pandemic, and then she met someone.
/r/ExRedPill06/10/21 10:52 PM
-2

Why would you ask your wife about what other women think of you? Because she was, and to this day remains the only woman to ever be attracted to me, so of course I felt like asking her how she felt about other women treating me like a leper. I hope you don't fall into any incel mentalities because right now they would consider you ripe for conversion. Bro, I was a mod on r/incels before my marriage.
/r/ExRedPill06/10/21 03:18 PM
1

there’s dating apps I literally don't get any matches on any apps. groups you can always try out I do participate in group activities, but as mentioned, women downright avoid and stonewall me. You may not even consider the fact you treat women in a disrespectful manner I've been married, actually, and asked my wife to help me figure out the reason why so many, pretty much all, women are so uncomfortable around me. She eventually came to the conclusion that it must be my appearance, the same conc…
/r/ExRedPill06/10/21 12:37 PM
-1

Late thirties. Yes, younger women are still attractive.
/r/ExRedPill06/10/21 11:48 AM
-3

Oh hey, OP, o wise one. Teach me to be a man so I can overcome the fact that women won't even speak to me outside of work, and now I'm almost 40 and scared of growing old alone.
/r/ExRedPill06/10/21 11:46 AM
5

Then so should virgin shaming, but feminists would be appalled by that.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates06/10/21 11:04 AM
5

I kinda used to admire that way of thinking, but now I'm a 40 year old single guy and it's kinda hard not to care that I'm taxed higher for that, landlords refuse to rent to me and my career and income are capped.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates06/10/21 04:09 AM
-5

Oh, by the way, good work abusing the "concerned redditor" function to shame me. I'll save your report and this conversation into my growing folder of examples of feminists being abusive. It's a small thing but hopefully it'll bring closer the day when bigots like you are finally put in your place.
/r/ExRedPill05/10/21 11:12 PM
-3

Someone sure is lost for words when getting called out. Hey, wanna know one more thing that makes you morally inferior to even the redpillers?
/r/ExRedPill05/10/21 10:46 PM
-12

OP, you don't really want an answer, do you. You just want to shame former redpillers beacause you think they're weak and that it's shameful for a man to be weak. You digsusting fucking sexist. You're no better than them. Worse even, I would say, because they are indeed weak, whereas you are applying your sexism from a position of power.
/r/ExRedPill05/10/21 10:43 PM
1

Could you give some examples of women's romance/erotic literature in which the male characters are neither dehumanized caricatures nor the terribly unrealistic ideals that OP calls out? I don't specifically seek out women's romance lit, but it does fall into my hands often enough that I know the genre. Provided, it's almost never English-language works - I mostly consume media in Russian and Japanese these days, and for women's media in those two languages the OP's criticism applies 100%.
/r/ExRedPill05/10/21 10:26 PM
-16

Absolutely. Women don't care about that - they care about what you look like and what you have.
/r/ExRedPill05/10/21 10:38 AM
-1

They looked normal. More attractive than me, for example. Definitely more attractive than her by virtue of not being obese and balding, if anything. What I'm calling dating is whatever it was she was doing seeing those men regularly. Whatever it was, it was something she evidently found worth doing. I get what you're trying to say - those relationships were not quite as good as a relationship with an attractive man would have been. But so what? She had those options and she took them. It shows t…
/r/ExRedPill05/10/21 04:23 AM
1

Jesus. The way women like you just completely exclude men you don't find attractive from even being human is a huge factor in pushing them towards redpill and blackpill thought.
/r/ExRedPill05/10/21 03:38 AM
-2

I mean, those men were normal looking, fit, without any visible disfigurations or anything like that. So my question remains - if it's that easy for her, what kind of woman actually struggles?
/r/ExRedPill05/10/21 01:07 AM
-6

Most people do. But it's also important to acknowledge that some men lack options completely, whereas women don't have to face that. So yeah, that's the answer to your question - women really do have that many options.
/r/ExRedPill04/10/21 10:59 PM
-9

Gonna repeat my comment I posted elsewhere. Not true. The least attractive woman I've ever met was obese to the point of getting stuck in doorways, epileptic, balding at ~20 and extremely socially awkward. She still had no trouble finding attractive men to date. Do you suppose that she's one of the '10% most beautiful women'?
/r/ExRedPill04/10/21 10:49 PM
-6

But average women, not so much. Not true. The least attractive woman I've ever met was obese to the point of getting stuck in doorways, epileptic, balding at ~20 and extremely socially awkward. She still had no trouble finding attractive men to date. If it was that easy for her, by your logic she's above average. What is an average woman then?
/r/ExRedPill04/10/21 10:47 PM
-4

attractive women don't want "most" guys So? Having tons of options and still wanting better is having tons of options nonetheless.
/r/ExRedPill04/10/21 10:46 PM
-7

but whats the point The point is to acknowledge that women have options, which is the opposite of what many men face.
/r/ExRedPill04/10/21 10:45 PM
1

seeing women as human is the bare minimum. No, it's not. Plenty of men don't view women as human and still get to enjoy loving relationships, start families and live happy lives.
/r/ExRedPill04/10/21 10:42 PM
1

You should be a good person because that's the right thing to do. I agree with that, but it's also true that there's no practical incentive. It can also be pretty difficult to put kindness into action when you're an unappealing person - often the kindest thing that you can do for someone who is in trouble is... nothing. Which is very counterintuitive and can be highly discouraging.
/r/ExRedPill04/10/21 10:41 PM
20

There's a lot of feminism-bashing outrage-porn here That's because western feminism is outrageously morally corrupt.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates04/10/21 10:02 PM
34

because i'm anti-circumcision i must really be anti-choice And here I thought western feminists could not get more fucked up.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates04/10/21 09:58 PM
8

they were actually a moderator You gave mod privileges to a feminist?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates04/10/21 09:54 PM
-1

I'm sorry, what power exactly do you think I have?
/r/ExRedPill04/10/21 06:10 AM
4

They too, yeah. When you're not attractive women tend to avoid you, so it's difficult to build up the relevant social skills and easy to start viewing then as those ethereal beings that defy understanding. I nearly fell into that trap myself.
/r/ExRedPill04/10/21 04:00 AM
-3

All you have to do... for what? I see women as humans but I don't feel like that affects anything in my life at all. It hasn't made me any more appealing to women, and if anything it makes dealing with women's constant hostility to me more difficult. I've had candid conversations with male friends who went down the route of seeing women as something less, as big children. Those are successful men, with marriages, careers, children to raise. I don't really approve of their views and don't share t…
/r/ExRedPill04/10/21 03:51 AM
1

Ever since high school ended, which for my was over two decades ago, the bulk of the shaming comes from women.
/r/ExRedPill04/10/21 12:05 AM
1

I studied and worked most of my life in a female dominated professional field, so I kinda see those things. Yes, most women absolutely do have those kinds of men, are aware of them and take advantage of them to various degrees.
/r/ExRedPill03/10/21 02:48 AM
5

Just so goddamn lonely. I keep grabbing my phone, opening up the play market and almost installing one of those dating apps. But then I stop because it's not actually what I want to do. I don't want to try meeting strangers, and I don't match with anyone on those apps anyway. I want to meet with someone close to me. Just have a good time like I used to when I was younger. God, I miss my friends and I miss my wife.
/r/MenSupportMen02/10/21 08:09 AM
-9

So you lied, and those things are not the bare minimum. Figures.
/r/ExRedPill02/10/21 07:53 AM
4

I'm an older man so my social circle is limited these days, and even still I know four women who get income from simps, two of them even have that as their primary source of livelihood. So no, simping is not nearly as rare as you're trying to paint it. As for how I feel about it... I don't, mostly. I think it's sad an unhealthy, and the women are clearly taking advantage of vulnerable lonely men, but at the end of the day it's the simps' choice to do it. I wish they wouldn't but I can't dictate …
/r/ExRedPill02/10/21 03:22 AM
-1

The bare minimum is thoughtfulness and respect? So you would accept an invitation to a first date from literally any man at all?
/r/ExRedPill02/10/21 03:18 AM
5

That makes no sense. "They can do whatever they want, therefore you must not criticize them for what they do" No, fuck that. I'm absolutely going to criticize them. What they're doing is evil.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates01/10/21 11:11 AM
1

Not more so than regular interactions with women, honestly.
/r/ExRedPill30/09/21 11:11 AM
1

...no. Not every internet crazy from Russia is Aleksandr Dugin. He's only famous on the anglophone internet because you guys picked him up for some reason and dressed him up as some sinister mastermind. The guy with the tradcon movement is named Vladislav Pozdnyakov, and I had to google that just now.
/r/ExRedPill30/09/21 11:06 AM
0

The kind of men that are attractive enough to actually be able to act on those urges? I assure you such men's partners very much are afraid of hypergamy. But you're simply falling into the apex fallacy. Very few men are so attractive that they can cheat and change partners easily.
/r/ExRedPill30/09/21 02:43 AM
2

I'm not "bashing" you - I'm fully within my rights to choose how to engage you based on what groups you belong to. In my experience you feminists tend to not participate in debates honestly, so if I'm going to speak to you, I'm going to leave you as few avenues for dishonesty as possible.
/r/ExRedPill30/09/21 01:23 AM
1

Lol, neither of those are American. Antivaxers in Russia are mostly motivated my religion. Antivaxers in Japan look back towards a number of domestic incidents related to sped out rollouts of untested vaccines. No idea about flat earthers but I guess you can have that if you want lol
/r/ExRedPill30/09/21 01:19 AM
2

I'm being evasive because, as a feminist, I don't think you can be trusted to participate in this conversation in good faith. So I'm taking precautions. If you ever feel like continuing the conversation, feel free to answer my question first and then I'll answer yours. Until then I guess we have nothing else to say to each other.
/r/ExRedPill30/09/21 12:06 AM
0

I could, but like I said, I don't want to play this like that. Give me examples of "art and literature about love, written by women" that you had in mind when you suggested that. Then I'll tell you about my own experiences with such art and literature and how they reinforced my conviction that women's love is purely visual.
/r/ExRedPill29/09/21 11:12 PM
5

My mother married my father for his career and money prospects. He gave her that, but throughout all her life she felt she deserved a better man, so she abused him badly. It made me really averse to provider marriages. I used to swear that I would rather die alone than get into one. Now that I'm older I've mellowed out to the idea, but honestly still shudder at the thought of ending up like my dad. The sadness in his eyes as he died slowly from that stroke haunts me.
/r/ExRedPill29/09/21 10:46 PM
0

You really overestimate America's culture influence these days. I'm a Russian expat living in Japan and pretty much no one's heard of that stuff in either country.
/r/ExRedPill29/09/21 10:42 PM
1

I'm from Russia. Our manosphere is basically limited to a state-run tradcon group who mostly spend their days talking about tradcon stuff and only occasionally advocate for family court reform. It has a leader who is known to regularly meet with police and intelligence and actual users have been thrown in prison for speaking out of line. There also is/was an independent incel movement. Or rather a joke of an incel movement because it's run by pretty boy Chad Alex Podnebesny (aka Alex Undersky) w…
/r/ExRedPill29/09/21 10:31 PM
1

No, let's not do it like that. First you tell me what literature I should have read and then I'll give you examples of what I read.
/r/ExRedPill29/09/21 10:21 PM
1

But weren't you saying that loving someone's money and loving someone's face is not different?
/r/ExRedPill29/09/21 10:16 PM
1

Okay, I won't. But what about a woman who values me for my appearance and character?
/r/ExRedPill29/09/21 04:04 PM
1

Women don’t aspire to date these men And yet those men don't find themselves at a loss for partners, whereas I can't even get a woman to chat with me in a casual setting. See how that might be a bit discouraging? A normal looking rapist is more lovable than an ugly guy like me.
/r/ExRedPill29/09/21 11:45 AM
2

And I don’t see a lot of women living with these men But there are enough women attracted to those men that such men don't end up lonely for life. Ugly men like me do, though, regularly. It really comes down to the fact that outside of professional interactions, women avoid me. I can't "work around" someone else's choice to simply not engage me in any sort of interaction at all - and that's what women do. I’m sure there is someone out there But that someone is rare enough that a man like me migh…
/r/ExRedPill29/09/21 11:08 AM
1

It's really saddening how being a rapist, a murderer, a war criminal are all just "flaws one can live with' to when, while my ugliness is apparently something no woman is ever willing to even try dealing with.
/r/ExRedPill29/09/21 10:21 AM
1

What doesn't add up?
/r/ExRedPill29/09/21 10:18 AM
3

They're attractive. Unattractive bad been don't get into relationships. It's that simple.
/r/ExRedPill29/09/21 08:49 AM
-2

It doesn't need to be invalidated. It's just wrong.
/r/ExRedPill29/09/21 08:49 AM
2

Recall that you started this thread by claiming that women have low standards for men grooming and now you've conceded that women only do that for attractive men, while the less attractive ones are supposed to "temper their expectations" Good job.
/r/ExRedPill29/09/21 08:27 AM
1

You said that it's not about looks though. Going back on your own words now, eh?
/r/ExRedPill29/09/21 08:04 AM
1

Attractive men get by just fine without even basic grooming. If it's not about looks, what do I need to do to get the same privilege?
/r/ExRedPill29/09/21 07:49 AM
1

Okay, is it about something that an individual can change about himself? What should I do so that I too can get away with not grooming myself?
/r/ExRedPill29/09/21 04:19 AM
4

I wonder which is more challenging for a journalist - to interview an FDSer and avoid showing what horrible people they are, or to interview an incel and avoid humanising them.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates29/09/21 04:14 AM
2

How would you deal with clubs just outright not letting you in? In my country it's common for nightlife establishments to have "face control" - bouncers are instructed to turn away anyone who looks to ugly, unkempt or poor. How would you deal with just not passing "face control" constantly?
/r/ExRedPill29/09/21 03:58 AM
1

That makes no sense, sorry. The attractive men who are loved for who they are are held to lower standards exactly because they are attractive and loved. I have to groom myself meticulously and still get called unkempt while other, more attractive men appear much cleaner even while showering once a month and wearing the same shirt for weeks on end.
/r/ExRedPill29/09/21 03:46 AM
0

I've consumed such literature and feel that it has only reinforced my conviction that the primary basis of love is physical attraction.
/r/ExRedPill29/09/21 03:39 AM
0

If a woman values me only for the money I bring, would she not prefer a hypothetical situation where she gets the same amount of money and doesn't need to put up with me? If a woman values me for money, what if I take a pay cut? What happens when I retire?
/r/ExRedPill29/09/21 03:36 AM
-2

When a woman "loves" you for money, she would prefer to just have the money without having you, if she had that option. When a woman loves you for your looks or personality, she loves something that is immanent to you - it's not conceivable to "have" your personality without having you. Though I guess there are also women out there dating hit guys who they wish had better personalities, so even when a woman loves you for your looks she doesn't really "love you"
/r/ExRedPill29/09/21 02:06 AM
1

I didn't read it.
/r/ExRedPill29/09/21 12:06 AM
1

No. I pointed out that it's wrong to assume that women remain with abusers out a sense of loyalty and not for some other reason, such as attraction. In response she wrote ten paragraphs of her biography which I have absolutely no interest in, and I told her as much.
/r/ExRedPill28/09/21 10:46 PM
1

My point is that "women only like Chad" can't be true if women like a self-described incel. But the fact that he rejected her doesn't mean that she liked him. Also, standards being higher than they can afford is part of the reason why none of the women they like like them back. Are you actually sure of that? I have standards myself but I've never had the chance to reject anyone - the women who fall below my standards date men who are more attractive than I am. I've spent over a decade in various…
/r/ExRedPill28/09/21 10:41 PM
1

plenty of people DO get satisfaction and happiness from touching people other than their romantic interests Like who? I really hate this "plenty of people" formula, it's used to dismiss all forms of men's issues. "Oh, you have a need for something? Plenty of men get along just fine without it, suck it up and shut your mouth" And if you dig just a little deeper it turns out that those "plenty of people" are imaginary.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/09/21 12:23 PM
2

Yep, so very much this. The only time in my life that I was with a woman, I found out that the way I most enjoy my sexuality is through cuddling, tenderness etc. So did she it and it was great. But I also work in a professional field that leans heavily female and god, the way some of my colleagues have mocked their partners for this... Mind you, those are attractive, successful men who those women already deemed good enough to date!
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/09/21 12:20 PM
7

like everyone else Name some other groups and causes that kept creating their own pages and eventually convinced the wiki admins to keep them. You can't, so stop making shit up.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/09/21 12:09 PM
11

Because an encyclopedia shouldn't be used for fucking advocacy.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/09/21 04:12 AM
1

Look at the science regarding males being more visual in attraction. There is none. There's plenty of "science" that reveals women have much less reasonable standards for appearance, make harsher judgements and infer much more about a person based on their appearance. And my own personal experience fits with that. You might want to make sure "the science" is actually on your side before telling someone to "look at the science"
/r/ExRedPill27/09/21 10:25 PM
1

You appraise it accurately and take it as what it is. Enjoy the good (if there's any) and remember that anything bad that happens to you because of your appearance is not your fault. If someone dislikes you for how you look - it's them being shallow. If someone stereotypes you for how you look - they're the bad person. A word of caution: the normies tend to equate confidence with feeling good all the time. That's not true. If you're not good looking, you won't feel good all the time - you can't …
/r/ExRedPill27/09/21 10:23 PM
0

With all due respect, if you need someone to tell your marriage story to, find a therapist or a friend.
/r/ExRedPill27/09/21 03:58 AM
-1

I'm pretty sure you're lying, but whatever. If you remained with him out of some misguided notion of loyalty, that's sad but doesn't really invalidate what I said.
/r/ExRedPill27/09/21 02:57 AM
3

I mean, is there any stronger rebuttal than the fact that redpill just doesn't fucking work? Because it absolutely doesn't and redpillers will have a collective conniption and ban you if you say it.
/r/ExRedPill27/09/21 01:56 AM
0

Uh, "bad men" doesn't refer to men who aren't good looking and don't make a lot of money. Also, thanks for calling me a bad man. Right back atcha.
/r/ExRedPill27/09/21 01:53 AM
1

I don't subscribe to the idea that "no women are faithful" but the redpill argument you're addressing is not hypocritical. Women who stay with "bad men" stay with them because those men are just that attractive, not because of some high concept of "faithfulness"
/r/ExRedPill26/09/21 11:10 PM
1

Probably have a small dick . Body shaming. Classy.
/r/ExRedPill26/09/21 11:07 PM
0

???
/r/ExRedPill26/09/21 09:38 AM
-2

Women are absolutely more concerned with looks than men are. The people inferring my personality from my unfortunate physical appearance are overwhelmingly women.
/r/ExRedPill26/09/21 02:42 AM
1

To be honest, I used to rely on meditation to deal with feelings of rejection, loneliness and fear of growing old and dying alone. It helped for years until those feelings became so strong that they overwhelm whatever concentration I can muster. Meditation is not a panacea, bro.
/r/ExRedPill26/09/21 02:40 AM
-2

Is your point that incels shouldn't have standards? That the woman he didn't make a move on would have been open to dating him if he had just made a move?
/r/ExRedPill25/09/21 02:52 AM
1

My redpill phase predates both Reddit and the red pill movement. If you count only the period when I took all that alpha asshole dating advice seriously, then my phase was barely a couple months long at 20 years old. If you count all the period of masculine self-improvement as that, then I guess it would have been the period between 20, when I started, and 24 when I mostly stopped because I became convinced that I cannot self improve myself into being attractive.
/r/ExRedPill25/09/21 02:47 AM
1

Gibbons aren't even apes...
/r/ExRedPill25/09/21 02:43 AM
1

No, it's not projection, it's an observation. At worst, an exaggerated one. Sure, all women don't want some mythical "Chad" but it is true that all women want and can get together with attractive men, leaving unattractive men with provider relationships as their only option at best and lifelong loneliness at worst. My standards are realistic, but I in turn don't fit into any woman's standards - they can and do all find men more attractive than I am. The women I would reject are dating men who ar…
/r/ExRedPill25/09/21 02:17 AM
22

The whole purpose of menslib is to find excuses for bigoted double standards in feminist ideology.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates25/09/21 02:10 AM
1

Whether an unattractive man resents the fact is his unattractiveness has no bearing on the fact itself and honestly, don't you recognize how ridiculous it is to even suggest that it is?
/r/ExRedPill24/09/21 05:36 AM
1

Recognizing that people don't find you attractive is an observation, not a self-fulfilling prophecy. You assume that the other guy actually is attractive but rejects his options because of his insecurity. You have absolutely no reason to assume that other than wanting it to be true.
/r/ExRedPill24/09/21 05:16 AM
1

Nonsense. When I met the only woman to ever be interested in me she indicated her interest and we hit it off and eventually got married. Her linking me however doesn't change the fact that before and after her no women have found me attractive.
/r/ExRedPill24/09/21 04:03 AM
1

I'm not OP but I'm in a similar situation to him. You need to understand that the older you get, the more difficult it is to "decentre" Past a certain age, if you're single and obviously not by choice, people notice. It affects your career. It affects your income. It affects you friendships. It even affects where you'll be allowed to live since many landlords don't rent to older single men. I'm in my late thirties in this situation, and by now I wish other people would stop focusing so much on h…
/r/ExRedPill24/09/21 04:01 AM
5

I asked you for evidence, not rhetoric. By the way, I went to a sex worker once and was rejected.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/09/21 02:28 AM
3

What's your evidence that most incels have options and that they forgo those options? I know why you want that to be true, so don't give my your thoughts and your rhetoric. Show evidence, if you have any. Which of course you don't.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/09/21 02:01 AM
4

If incel and otherwise lonely men need therapy, why are such men's experiences with therapy (including mine) so negative? I've spent over a decade scouring the intent for positive accounts of such men going to therapy, tapping both patients AND providers. I still have yet to find even one. How so?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/09/21 01:59 AM
3

Society does treat sexual and romantic success as an obligation that I have. At middle age now, I face constant penalties for being unattractive and unmarried. If I owe it to society to be paired up, does the rest of society not owe my equal opportunity to pair up?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/09/21 01:57 AM
4

Those are women who are alone by choice - the options they have are deemed not good enough so the prefer to stay single. Even if we accept it as an actual problem, it's still fundamentally different from what incels face. Women don't face complete disqualification from the dating market.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/09/21 01:54 AM
4

Because victimhood is a commodity, and the average person believes that women are entitled to more of that commodity than men. Who suffers and how much doesn't even come into play. I've struggled with loneliness most of my adult life and noticed this pattern in the various communities for lonely people that I've been in. In mixed gender communities the men are mostly lonely because they're unattractive, unpopular and can't get anyone to like them, whereas the women are lonely because they don't …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates23/09/21 11:00 PM
6

And the KKK are openly racist. Will you now defend the KKK against accusations of racism?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates23/09/21 04:15 AM
10

We can't compel someone to fall in love with someone else, but we could work to abolish all the myriad ways in which society (including the government) punishes men for failing to be sexy. And we also could introduce measures to mitigate the natural negative consequences that men suffer for being unattractive and single.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates23/09/21 01:07 AM
10

The only people who expect to be able to use women are those whose experience tells them they can - i.e. those that women allow to use them. I'm an unattractive man and outside of work women pretty much refuse to interact with me at all. It's a simple choice to avoid and/or stonewall someone. Women make that choice when they see me and they could just as easily make that choice with those who supposedly "use" them. But they don't - they choose to interact with those men. Incels don't get any cho…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates23/09/21 01:03 AM
12

So why doesn't society punish serial monogamists, manipulative people and abusers the same way it punishes me for being an incel?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates23/09/21 12:55 AM
7

I don't know what the upper comment said since it's deleted, but I think you're overestimating the male "need" for sex. I'm fairly confident that I wouldn't feel nearly as bad about being sexless if all the negative consequences of that went away. After all, as far sexual pleasure goes, it's possible to get really good at getting it all by yourself.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates23/09/21 12:50 AM
1

Amen to that. Getting drunk alone can be fun, but I miss drinking socially.
/r/MenSupportMen22/09/21 03:16 PM
1

More death anxiety. More insomnia. More loneliness. And no exit in sight except drinking every night. They're saying they'll lift the lockdown in another week. Maybe then I can get my ass outside again and at least drink while socializing with strangers in strange bars.
/r/MenSupportMen22/09/21 08:05 AM
3

I'm a former incel and I still get death threats over having participated in r/incels years ago. I'm glad that you just reaffirmed my conviction that those threats shouldn't be seen as a reason for me to reconsider my views or actions.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates22/09/21 04:15 AM
4

Neither are incels, yet the media and the public have desperately clung to this idea that incels are violent for years. The uncomfortable truth is that there hasn't been even one incel attacker to this day. Every single attacker who gets put in that category either was sexually active or didn't identify as an incel and had no connection with any incel communities online.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates22/09/21 04:12 AM
3

Except, no one bullied or humiliated Elliott Rodger.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates22/09/21 04:08 AM
1

IMO this isn't even a "we" thing. It's a women thing. Far too many women treat politeness, friendliness and good manners as a reward for sexiness - i.e. they only offer basic human decency to men they are attracted to and treat less attractive men with contempt.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates21/09/21 09:49 PM
27

ive always not liked MRAs. i thought MRAs were right wing What I'd like to ask you is why you were so eager to believe that without ever questioning the notion and doing your own research. Was it because being a menslibber/feminist benefits you personally somehow? Or was it because you were taught that notion by someone who you believe should never be questioned? Or was there some other reason?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates20/09/21 09:56 PM
10

I don’t know why anything should be expected of women We both know you wouldn't agree with policies that harm women with the same type of justifications. So you have no leg to stand - you're against equality because you want benefits for your preferred group.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates19/09/21 12:34 AM
1

Man, the loneliness has been just overwhelming. I want a relationship but in order to even have a chance at all, I need to start dating. But the task is so daunting I just can't work up the motivation, especially knowing that my chances are low enough that I might spend all my trying and still not succeed. Hell, just my income alone is a huge obstacle - even a normal man in my age bracket making this much is more likely than not to remain single for life, and I'm not even a normal man - I'm unat…
/r/MenSupportMen17/09/21 04:05 AM
4

It's just a bit weird It really isn't. She liked you and then she found someone she liked even more, so she discarded you. The connection you had, if any, was only as valuable as you are to her, and the moment you ceased to be valuable to her, so did the connection.
/r/MenSupportMen16/09/21 02:52 PM
7

Ironically, it's somewhat similar to what women themselves experience. You know how men sometimes interpret a smile, a compliment, a random act of kindness as an expression of romantic interest when it comes from a woman? It's sort of the same for me - I genuinely want to be a nice person, but it's so frustrating when a random act of kindness gets treated as a come on.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates16/09/21 02:28 PM
7

I suppose different people would have different reasons for that. For some women it's narcissism, as the other poster explained. For others it's a 'better err on the side of caution' mentality. For others it's something else.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates16/09/21 02:23 PM
20

I'll second that. It's absolutely a US thing. I'm from Russia and probably like a fourth of the country's population is Asian and the men are not seen as unmasculine or anything.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates16/09/21 04:09 AM
40

As an ugly guy, I generally have the opposite problem - women treating something I do as a sexual advance when it is not. It may intuitively seem fundamentally different at first but it really isn't - and it gets really damn tiring getting sexualized like that and the getting creepshamed for it.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates15/09/21 09:43 PM
1

She's worth it - why? Why is someone who treats you like that worth it?
/r/MenSupportMen15/09/21 04:11 AM
8

Does what I said contradict your view somehow? If so - how?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates14/09/21 10:54 AM
8

How did you draw that conclusion from what I wrote? Simple - I looked for a completely morally bankrupt and unjustifiable policy that a) exists and b) is consistent with the view you espoused. It wasn't very difficult to find one, really.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates14/09/21 10:42 AM
14

If you accept that premise, then what is wrong about women focusing on issues that disproportionately impact them? That's a horrible fucking take my dude. So what, if some research comes out proving that, say, crime perpetrated by black people disproportionately affects other races, that would, in your mind, justify your country's judiciary being biased against black people? You really didn't think your position through very well.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates14/09/21 10:34 AM
1

I dunno, I kinda rushed into dating after my divorce and found it no different from how it was before I met the ex - women just kinda avoid me and I've yet to score a first date. It's like I'm young again!
/r/Divorce_Men14/09/21 07:01 AM
1

I couldn't tell you about Chinese media (since you mention Genshin) but in Japan I would go so far as to say that harem stuff has actually become a women's genre. I don't really follow the latest anime anymore so maybe there's still harem series being made for guys, but going by advertisement alone there seem to be a constant stream of new harem stuff made for women. Though admittedly I have no idea whether or not this trend is true for gacha games specifically.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates13/09/21 09:45 PM
1

This is indeed a very long reply, but forgive me, I don't think there's much depth in it. This is just a typically American condemnation of "goddamn fencesitters" and I simply don't subscribe to your idea of absolutely having to take a side. My ethics are a product of my experiences in life - I refuse to reshape them to fit a 'side', any 'side' really, even ones I feel more sympathy and empathy for.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates13/09/21 01:33 PM
3

Yes, I get what you're talking about - as in, I understand the patterns of thinking that underlie such views, I just don't understand how such thoughts actually come to influence ethics. Put simply, I support equality of the genders not because someone asked me to, but because I believe, in principle, that equality is right and good and a world with it will be a better world than one without. Western feminists clearly don't stand for gender equality even while verbally demanding it, so I condemn…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates13/09/21 12:15 PM
1

Is that allowed? I thought surrogacy was banned in most of the world?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates13/09/21 06:12 AM
1

Not to be an ass, but it sounds like your wife just isn't very attracted to you and uses the fact that your attraction to her is stronger to gain some sort of advantage. I'm not your therapist but perhaps look into the possibility of it not being a libido issue.
/r/MenSupportMen13/09/21 05:52 AM
3

Not really. There are women's issues I don't care about but those are ones that I can't empathize with, simply cannot relate to - stuff like women feeling genuine distress at being courted by an unattractive guy, or abusive relationships, etc. I honestly find it a little strange, alien even, that someone could care not care about issues based on how other people treat some other issue. Like, yeah, nobody seems to care about the problems I face and those problems are real, but other people's othe…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates13/09/21 05:40 AM
1

How does a man become a single parent?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates13/09/21 05:33 AM
11

I couldn't tell you the market breakdown of course, but there absolutely is a glut of gacha games aimed at women. The biggest gacha addict I've ever met is a thirty-something housewife lol I think the pattern I described applies to fanservicey stuff all across the board - venues, media, games etc. The anime/manga fandoms are another example - full of guys who have nothing, and women who have nothing they deem good enough.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates13/09/21 03:41 AM
28

It exists because there are too many men that feel the women around them don’t respect them or care about their feelings I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that there are actually plenty of men who would respect, care and listen, but they don't "count" because the women deem them not attractive enough. I'm sure that's the case because that's the case for women who use those of venues in Japan. The 5ch anonymous board is huge and you can find accounts both from the users and workers the…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates13/09/21 01:36 AM
1

Congrats man! I'm sure you'll get it!
/r/MenSupportMen12/09/21 10:23 AM
10

I'm not a warlock but I'm am a wizard! Can I join?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates12/09/21 08:59 AM
3

You've got to be kidding. Obese women can and do use sex appeal to gain favors. At the very greatest you could claim that their likelihood of success in such endeavours is lower but even if true the fact remains that they have that privilege.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates12/09/21 07:33 AM
2

Any group of low status men and really most low status men individually work it out eventually because it's pretty apparent. Doesn't have to be incels. There's a reason talking about the apex fallacy is prohibited in r/foreveralone
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates12/09/21 07:27 AM
1

Holy crap man, that's some job. Though for you I suppose it was a positive since it gave such a valuable perspective on just how dangerous suicide is.
/r/MenSupportMen11/09/21 04:26 PM
1

No, I mean this part. I've seen too many examples of people half assing it and blowing off their face while surviving or horribly maimed Are you some kind of first responder or something?
/r/MenSupportMen11/09/21 12:20 PM
1

What kind of life so you lead that you see so many failed suicides??
/r/MenSupportMen11/09/21 08:38 AM
2

Yeah, of course you can't erase all the downsides of loneliness by ending discrimination, but IMO it's still a worthwhile goal.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates11/09/21 07:49 AM
4

I wasn't talking about it being fair or unfair. I was talking about you being wrong. Beauty and wealth are attractive in and of themselves, not because they "show" anything.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates10/09/21 12:48 PM
9

Is the correlation being made by OP that gay people aren't going to therapy because they don't like hearing about the importance of traditional family values? Seriously asking here: doesn't a gay person who gets pissy about hearing a truth they don't like need to get into therapy even more than the average person? And this isn't even a strawman - this is real rhetoric applied to LGBT people in my country. How does that make you feel?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates10/09/21 03:56 AM
1

Really?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates09/09/21 03:46 PM
7

People can be attractive and rich without any effort, and people who invested huge amounts of effort can still come out bad looking and poor. It's not about what men do. It's about what men are.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates09/09/21 12:25 PM
1

Next step: advice for those to whom women never came and who is not facing old age alone
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates09/09/21 09:44 AM
1

With all due respect, dude, this is a thread for discussing advice, not for giving out advice.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates09/09/21 04:25 AM
4

Become more attractive. Barring that, wait for a miracle. I have the same problem as you - women avoid and ignore me. Ultimately, there's a threshold of attractiveness that we're required to meet, and we don't meet it. It's not fair, but there doesn't seem to be anything we can do about it. It's why I eventually moved from wanting a relationship to wanting social change so that being single would be less miserable.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates09/09/21 04:14 AM
86

Yeah, over the years I've become pretty sensitive to such portrayals in the media. There was a TV series I watched that had an episode in which one of the characters, a woman, was driven to suicide after having a particularly bad day while dealing with mental illness. The bad day included a cancelled date, being late for the train, getting yelled at by her boss and, glaringly, receiving words of reassurance from a creepy ugly coworker. It was a tiny scene that lasted all of two seconds, but some…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates08/09/21 11:11 PM
8

If I have to be a completely fake person to get a girlfriend then how am I ever going to enjoy it knowing that the relationship is based on false pretenses and there is no actual compatibility since I've faked my personality? By avoiding the consequences of being single later in life. As a single guy in his late thirties, I can tell you that loneliness can get pretty debilitating. Then again, the real solution to this is not a guide on how to get a fake relationship. The real solution would be t…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates08/09/21 10:28 PM
7

This hasn’t been my experience but I almost exclusively date left leaning artistic freelancers, like myself. Almost all of them offer to go dutch or trade picking up meals. lol In my country the myriad reasons why the man always has to pay is a major part of the local feminist rhetoric.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates08/09/21 10:19 PM
1

Thanks.
/r/MenSupportMen07/09/21 10:20 PM
3

Ouch! Good luck man, I hope you will succeed!
/r/MenSupportMen07/09/21 10:20 PM
6

Been having it rougher than usual lately, feeling lonely and sad even during my favourite activities. Tried organising a get together with a few friends but no one was available, they never are. In a moment of weakness went and tried for online dating again - been seeing people recommend Hinge so I went to install that but it's not available in my country. Lol. Guess it's for the best anyway, it would ultimately just make me even more depressed.
/r/MenSupportMen07/09/21 04:25 AM
2

At this point I'm skeptical it was ever anything but that.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates06/09/21 04:30 AM
1

I have done more than a bit of research. It's how I know. You on the other hand are content just buying into the media hysterics. Glad that you agree with my key point though.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates06/09/21 01:38 AM
2

The exclusion of men from Body Positivity is for all intents and purposes the promotion of body shaming against men. Your stance is that apparently harming someone intentionally through inaction is a lesser evil that can be "cancelled out" by helping someone else. That's a pretty arbitrary line to draw - it honestly makes my think you drew it just now specifically to give some ethical backing to your support of the Body Positivity movement. My principled stance is that any form of organized/inst…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates06/09/21 01:36 AM
3

I feel safe in assuming that the Body Positivity movement did not come up with the idea that people shouldn't be shamed and made fun of for their physical characteristics. Either that or I'm an incredible visionary myself for having come up with this idea in, uh, elementary school? The Body Positivity movement has always been a bigoted movement promoting the body shaming of men. There is nothing good about them.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates06/09/21 01:29 AM
0

I'm just going to go all Godwin on you now. Hitler helped lots and lots of Nazis at the expense of, well, most of the rest of the world. I help... uh, my boss, I guess? I am literally worse than Hitler.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates05/09/21 02:11 PM
7

I think the body and sex positivity movements are great. For what, the name? It's a movement that has coopted the idea of body positivity and turned it into an ideology that promotes body shaming against men and gives undeserved privileges to women. Do you think the Boko Haram movement is also great because it has the word 'love' in its name?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates05/09/21 11:43 AM
1

No, not a single one fulfills both conditions and only one fulfills one of them. Do a bit of research. And again, if you consider society's constant scrutiny of incels warranted, then you have to accept that their own attention to their problems is also warranteed. Otherwise you would be unfairly holding incels to a higher standard, essentially demanding saintliness of them.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates05/09/21 03:53 AM
6

Incels have also committed ideologically inspired terrorist attacks No, they have not. Until 2021 there hadn't been a single attacker who was also a member of any incel community. And even right now there still hasn't been a single attacker who identified as an incel. Whereas the allegations started in 2017 and the first government designation came in 2019. No matter how you spin it, the amount of attention, pressure and scrutiny regular people put on incels is huge and largely unwarranted. If y…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates04/09/21 05:23 PM
0

I don't know what's worse - a mother who kills her own child for the sake of her own laziness, or a group of regular people just up and deciding that it's okay for her to do that because she's a woman. Fuck.
/r/PussyPassDenied04/09/21 03:56 PM
1

Casey Anthony Holy fucking shit. Just what kind of collection of human garbage was on the defense team and on the jury? I'm used to stories of women getting away with crimes, but this is on a whole new level.
/r/PussyPassDenied04/09/21 03:20 PM
2

As a kid, my parents would do that too, the caveat being that it was with other families. I'm sure my friends don't spend all their time just working, they socialize with other people too, and I'm just not too high on their list of priorities. As for it affecting low status men more, I think it's not mentioned for two reasons: first, discussion of male loneliness is sort of taboo in Western media, and second, the loneliness epidemic only began to gain steam about a decade ago and perhaps not eno…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates04/09/21 07:48 AM
2

Romantic loneliness causes platonic loneliness later in life even if one didn't struggle with it initially. I never had trouble making friends and still have lots of social connections on paper, but in reality I never meet my buddies any more. Sometimes (often even) their spouses disapprove of them hanging out with the weirdo who's single in his late thirties. And between careers, kids, emergencies and aging parents, ultimately nobody just has the time or energy to just hang out. And on the off …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates04/09/21 05:07 AM
1

for shitting all over the Warfighter for almost 60 years Anyone whose identity is "I was in da war" for 60 years deserves to be shat all over.
/r/PussyPassDenied04/09/21 02:03 AM
11

Dude, if you feel uncomfortable discussing the argument you made, you could just refrain from replying to me. As it stands you berated incels for focusing on their issues, and now you're trying to say you didn't. I obviously can't compel you to defend your argument, so your refusal now means that this whole conversation has been a waste of time, at least to me. Was it a waste of your time as well, or do you feel you've gained something from it?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/09/21 12:22 PM
8

I decline to answer your quotes. Please don't take that as an offense. I'll reply to this quote though. Ok, but you could also worry about any other existential crisis and have devastation, so its why this one over others thats need to be looked at. This is clearly you demanding that incels stop treating their particular problem as something serious.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/09/21 11:50 AM
8

Well all your mentionning is intraclass division. So? Recall my original question - if incels shouldn't treat their situation as a big deal (as you demand of them), then why is it right for others to treat their situation as a big deal and punish them for it. You're demanding that incels don't focus on their issue, but don't demand that others do the same with the same issue. Why?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/09/21 11:36 AM
19

there is a difference between your relationship status and actively being part of a political group There isn't at this point. You're treated as part of a "political group" if you participate in incel communities. At the same time, incel communities are currently the only spaces where such men can talk about their problems and empathize with each other in an environment safe from harassment and abuse. I mean the rich are avoiding paying their taxes, but sure thats the biggest unfairness. And the…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/09/21 11:12 AM
19

I never said incels should be treated with scrutiny. But, they are. You demand that they stop worrying about their loneliness because it's not a big deal, but conspicuously you don't say that to the ones perpetuating the whole public outcry about incels. What is the government doing towards them? They're labeled as terrorists in what, three first world nations now? They also pay a higher tax rate simply for being unable to marry, which is complete bullshit.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/09/21 10:59 AM
6

I mean, it is those same leftists trying to convince incels that looks don't matter and you just need to hang out and have similar interests to get a girlfriend.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/09/21 07:44 AM
7

The thing is she didn't even coin the phrase. It's just that the irony that results from pretending she did is so attractive and useful that people just went with that.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/09/21 05:55 AM
7

It's a common myth that is used as a rhetorical device to dismiss the problems of incels. The words "involuntary celibacy" appear in publications as early as the fifties. In the late nineties a woman named Alana used the words for a small community she made which consisted of herself and her psych research subjects. When the incel witch hunts started five years ago the haters dug Alana's work out and began to parade her as "the woman who founded the incel movement" It's especially ironic since B…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/09/21 05:34 AM
5

Being able to just ignore what society thinks would be a huge improvement actually. But it didn't just think, does it? It goes out of its way to punish those guys.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/09/21 05:29 AM
17

why this one over others thats need to be looked at I'm going to go and throw that question right back at you. Why do incels need to so much scrutiny and punishments from society? Loneliness aside, incels' lives would be much better if the witch hunts, the harassment, the government oppression just stopped. So why is it important to keep punishing them?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/09/21 05:27 AM
0

No, incels absolutely don't struggle to strike a balance between decency and desirability. They're undesirable in all contexts. You're confusing incels with redpillers. I'm telling you that as someone who's been on incel forums since the mid oughts.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/09/21 05:22 AM
4

Murdering innocent people is war?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/09/21 02:22 AM
13

When something bad is done to me by men and women, men and women are guilty of it.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/09/21 02:19 AM
23

All my life I've struggled with a lack of masculinity, being unattractive and the resulting loneliness. For most of my life I was also an incel. I would say my participation in the Incel Support forum in the late 2000s is what started my separation from Feminism. It may surprise many people here, but the Incel Support forum, the biggest Incel community at the time, was run by feminists - IIRC there weren't even any male and/or non-feminist moderators there at the time. That resulted in rampant a…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates30/08/21 10:34 PM
1

Good point.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates30/08/21 02:47 AM
1

Not quite. Obviously there are different kinds is stories in which a character might be lonely. My beef is specifically with the kinds of characters that are supposedly lonely because they're awkward and unlikable, but then perform like total social butterflies when the story calls for any such interactions. There's a manga called Ressentiment by Kengo Hanazawa. I'm pretty sure there's an English version out there somewhere. It's a silly story but it's also a good example of a depiction of an aw…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates30/08/21 12:43 AM
2

But you also complain that he's too perfect Yes. Now that I think of it, while I do greatly appreciate Japanese media for its depictions of lonely struggling men, I'm also very often left feeling that such depictions are far too positive and end up treating a character's social awkwardness, outcast status, unattractiveness, loneliness etc. as informed attributes. I mean, I know it's hard to write a story with a protagonist that is genuinely unlikable, unpopular and lonely, but it can be done. Th…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates29/08/21 11:26 AM
2

While some of the talking points resonate with me, I honestly don't understand how it's possible for lonely men to relate to that character when he's... extremely popular, socially savvy and constantly successful in everything he does. His loneliness and doomership is an informed attribute. As an actually lonely man, Hachiman at times felt like a caricature of me - perhaps made with no evil intent, but still a caricature.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates29/08/21 03:41 AM
5

For those of us not from America - who is this scumbag?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates29/08/21 02:18 AM
1

Married or soon to be married men probably chase after promotions more. But the ones who don't still get all the same benefits.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/08/21 04:03 PM
3

You are a good man. Good luck!
/r/MenSupportMen28/08/21 08:11 AM
1

I'd like to point out that married men are not paid more because they work more. If anything, they work less - unplanned overtime, emergencies etc. always go to the single employees first because the married guy has a family to take care of. Married men are paid more because paying them more is considered the right thing with justifications varying by culture and by individual employer.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/08/21 06:21 AM
4

It's a problem in itself that we bristle merely at the idea of something that might benefit a troll-like dirty mac type. I am one for all intents and purposes and I'm not dangerous. It's insane that in a capitalist society capitalists will forgo making money from something just because it might benefit low status people.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/08/21 06:06 AM
1

this is a sensible interpretation with a level of caution A level of caution would mentioning that the results suggest such a conclusion but further research is necessary before any concrete claims can be made. But the authors chose not to say that. They chose to deny that such a conclusion could even potentially be correct, even though there is no rational basis for such a categorical denial.
/r/BlackPillScience28/08/21 03:09 AM
6

Note, the person in your link is very clearly an American (or European) person pretending to be Japanese. My guess would be American given that they bring up typically American talking points such as being stopped by the police and the court system. Honestly, having myself lived in Japan for almost a decade now, I don't buy it that women have to deal with that much in terms of gender roles. The workplace is really the one place where traditional gender roles for women still prevail, but even the…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/08/21 03:06 AM
4

It wouldn't get accepted by reviewers if the authors claimed as such It also wouldn't get accepted if they had said nothing at all. They couldn't have stated the intuitive conclusions and they couldn't have stated no conclusion at all. The only option is to explicilty deny the intuitive conclusion, even if there is no rational basis for doing so. It's why this is ultimately politically motivated - either by the political leanings of the bureaucracts in charge of 'peer' review (which is not, in f…
/r/BlackPillScience27/08/21 06:56 PM
-4

Those are venues for further research - they're not reasons to dismiss the conclusions that the results of this study point at.
/r/BlackPillScience27/08/21 06:51 PM
4

There are all kinds of reasons why you can't conclude from this that, in natural settings, a smaller penis means less sexual satisfaction or vice-versa. Yes, you absolutely can conclude that. There's no obvious reason why the results would be different in a different setting, and if you wish to convince yourself or someone else that they are, you need to run an experiment and demonstrate as much.
/r/BlackPillScience27/08/21 04:14 PM
34

"Our results should not be misinterpreted as meaning that increasing penile length will increase sexual pleasure in women, because if we don't tell you that the publisher and/or the ethics committee will block this paper" There is no reason why those results cannot be interpreted in exactly that way and that sentence is at best a disclaimer for institutional reviewers and at worst an author clumsily inserting his or her political views into research.
/r/BlackPillScience27/08/21 04:12 PM
9

It's still nobody's business to police just how neatly a community's content fits its name. And there is one simply reason why what you're saying is wrong: there are plenty of other communities online that don't fit their names, but none are policed like that - only MGOTW and similar male spaces were.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates27/08/21 04:08 PM
11

I read a bit of Japanese feminist rhetoric. It's a group that is very much left wing and thus their political activism is intertwined with left wing policy goals. One such goal is their demand to dismantle the toxic traditional Japanese work culture, and with regards to that a huge talking point for them is that many of them are housewives and want quality time with their husbands and/or sons.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates27/08/21 04:06 PM
1

That's just a no true scotsman argument. Even if we assume that it's true, the original point was that the number of true scotsmen is small and not increasing.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates27/08/21 04:01 PM
30

What do you mean where? Where isn't it? I'm in my late thirties and single, not by choice. I encounter various forms of shaming for this pretty much everywhere - during my commute, at work, in public places, in government services, in medicine. It's ubiquitous.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates27/08/21 03:58 PM
1

Neither do I, ironically. I do feel that such a law, if passed in the US today, would only invite some minor grumbling and would otherwise be accepted and even welcomed by some.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates27/08/21 11:47 AM
35

Why stop at choice? Stop stigmatizing single men, period, whether they're single by choice or not.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates27/08/21 11:13 AM
0

Are you really, like REALLY sure the American public would not welcome that?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates27/08/21 11:10 AM
1

No violent incels in Russia though.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates27/08/21 11:09 AM
1

Yet.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates27/08/21 08:56 AM
5

It would honestly be a moment for history books if it happened that way. But it could also happen much more gradually. Something like this: they introduce a "temporary" tax benefit for women as some sort of reparation or encouragement, then keep extending it and adding new gendered benefits and bonuses, slowly branching them out into various forms. There won't be a huge watershed moment, but rather just a series of small changes making taxation slightly more gendered with every step. It's how th…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates26/08/21 10:48 PM
12

I wonder what will happen when women are paying much more taxes than men Gendered taxes. I don't know about your country but in mine a male-only bachelor tax and childlesness tax have been a slow ongoing discussion for years already. It's not even some shocking new thing - taxes have been gendered throughout most of history. Given this premise, I can easily see western nations introducing higher taxation for men, be it in the form of gendered tax rates or gendered tax deductions.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates26/08/21 10:33 PM
9

American "leftists" promote traditional gender roles and puritan morals. However you soon that, that's conservative.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates26/08/21 08:29 AM
5

It honestly boggles my mind how you guys can have any respect for your military at all.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates26/08/21 05:51 AM
1

I was going to say that it serves one well to be able to get in touch with his feelings even if only in the privacy of this home, but then I realized most men have families. Jesus.
/r/MenSupportMen25/08/21 04:28 AM
7

The sad part is that tons of men are willing to date those piece of shit women. They're bitter only because they can't quite get the top of the crop men to submit to them.
/r/PussyPassDenied24/08/21 11:11 PM
2

You've clearly never written a discussion section in a paper. That sentence is a personal opinion and/or a disclaimer. Your personal opinion might be the same, but as much as it may upset you, others' will be different. And there's not much value in you saying "Well I remain unconvinced" because you have an agenda and will never be convinced.
/r/BlackPillScience24/08/21 05:25 AM
11

Damn man, I've tried everything to secure clients for my business since covid hit. Ended up closing up shop but maybe I should've petitioned the government to force some prisoners to pay my instead.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/08/21 04:02 AM
2

Which correlations in this paper are spurious? Do you even know what a spurious correlation is?
/r/BlackPillScience24/08/21 03:34 AM
4

Not only do many countries require men to work until an older age, but men die younger; as a result, many men have only half the years to enjoy retirement. And in some places only about half the men have any years at all to enjoy retirement. AFAIK in my country (Russia) the recently increased retirement age for men is now greater than the average male lifespan.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates23/08/21 10:20 AM
1

Now that I think of it, perhaps you haven't encountered it in your field because IT has a more general ageism problem? As in, people in their late thirties and older are going to struggle, regardless of family status? If that's the case, the penalty against being an older single man could be sort of baked into that.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates23/08/21 08:25 AM
1

Either you're not quite that far along in your career or your specific sector in your specific country is an outlier. The stereotype of single older men being supposedly "unreliable" is so old and widespread that I don't think I even need to provide evidence for this, and so don't have any. And if you need it, it should come up easily enough on any search engine.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates23/08/21 07:52 AM
4

Employers pay more not to men, but to married men. To the benefit of the women married to those men. The glass ceiling for unmarried male professionals can just as easily be reframed as a monetary bonus for married women.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates22/08/21 09:22 AM
61

Because any account of the male experience needs to be written carefully, so as not to cross the line of extending sympathy to struggling men.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates22/08/21 09:05 AM
1

I know what life is like as a senior - I was the full time caretaker of several, as mentioned above. I don't know, I feel like having that perspective is in large what drives my fear in the first place - knowing just how miserable old age and frailty can be and how much old people are forced to rely on the kindness of others to mitigate the misery. Having to face that alone is terrifying.
/r/MenSupportMen21/08/21 04:11 AM
1

Do you need this even more broken down? I need you to answer my question without using rhetoric devices or playing victim. Though after just two comments by you I'm sure you don't have the moral integrity for even that. And by the way, the superiority is not veiled. You are, after all, a bigot - it doesn't take much to be superior to a bigot.
/r/PussyPassDenied21/08/21 02:25 AM
1

I'm sure you're not genuinely curious, but that's beside the point. I asked you a question. Do you mind answering it?
/r/PussyPassDenied20/08/21 06:20 PM
3

Who do you think? And I'm asking you this genuinely - who do you think that poster was referring to?
/r/PussyPassDenied20/08/21 10:36 AM
1

I've been a carer for elderly relatives in the past and have a good idea how much it takes to arrange care for an elderly person. Even if I had kept my successful career I probably wouldn't be able to afford something like that. Now though the pandemic has destroyed my career and I'm basically working an entry level position in a new field. Being this old, I'm grateful that I was given the opportunity for a new career, but realistically I'm probably going to remain behind my peers income-wise fo…
/r/MenSupportMen19/08/21 06:20 AM
3

Had another of what I call crisis moments. Been having them a bunch recently. Saw an elderly lady being helped into a car by a younger woman, probably family or a care worker or something. How many years before I need help like that? And there won't be anyone there for me. I'm scared folks. I feel like I'm still in my prime - late thirties, no health problems, comfortable lifestyle. Even though I'm alone, life isn't hard - I like what I do and have the energy to do that. But how much longer will…
/r/MenSupportMen19/08/21 01:55 AM
30

Yeah, no, that's not true.
/r/BlackPillScience15/08/21 02:59 AM
13

Not quite. Middle management doesn't necessarily come with that much money and Mike doesn't necessarily have to be equally skilled. Really the whole "unreliable" canard is, IMO, just a rationalisation for something much simpler - hatred. Unattractive men are hated and giving one a higher position in the corporate hierarchy just feels wrong to people.
/r/BlackPillScience15/08/21 01:37 AM
16

Ah, yes, as a woman, please educate me on my experience as an older man in a corporate environment.
/r/BlackPillScience14/08/21 02:29 PM
53

Unattractive men who can't marry are paid less. Highly paid women disqualify more men and thus have a harder time finding a man they will seem eligible.
/r/BlackPillScience14/08/21 02:22 AM
38

Yeah, that's absolutely true. A guy without a family is seen as unreliable so unless you're the owner of the company, there's a hard glass ceiling to your advancement. The correlation is at least in part due to the fact that a man's inability or unwillingness to marry causes his income to be lower.
/r/BlackPillScience14/08/21 02:21 AM
3

Bad habits and coping mechanisms. Therapy I'm sort of done with.
/r/MenSupportMen11/08/21 04:11 AM
1

Still thinking about how I want to have a family and probably will never have one. It sucks. I'm scared of dying alone.
/r/MenSupportMen08/08/21 05:46 AM
3

It's entirely possible that women intentionally seek out friends in such a way that results in groups with unequal attractiveness. In fact, I'm going to assert that that's the more plausible explanation because it's evidently not true that women completely ignore the attractiveness of their female friends.
/r/BlackPillScience06/08/21 03:30 AM
2

Neither do I, that's why I wasn't going to see the movie anyway. But I'm sure that the number of people who refuse to see the movie because of Amber Heard and who wanted to see it beforehand, is negligible.
/r/PussyPassDenied04/08/21 12:24 PM
-1

What liability? Nobody's going to boycott the movie over this.
/r/PussyPassDenied04/08/21 07:22 AM
3

Actually, disregard my comment, it's dumb. I got the r confused with the p.
/r/BlackPillScience01/08/21 05:26 AM
3

Isn't it a bad idea to try to interpret the value of the r beyond its relation to the alpha?
/r/BlackPillScience01/08/21 02:58 AM
6

So how do such societies deal with leftover men?
/r/Male_Studies22/07/21 11:02 AM
4

Lol,. Russia. I'm Russian and used to work as an interpreter with Russian and a certain first world language that's not English. Mail order brides' divorces were a source of good money.
/r/Divorce_Men22/07/21 03:48 AM
2

Bingo
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates22/07/21 03:27 AM
4

Black Panther was a great movie for that I admittedly only watched it half-asleep during a 10 hour plane journey, but to me it didn't feel progressive at all. I mean, the protagonists is... an absolutist ruler of an isolationist nationalistic ethnostate, and that characteristic seems to be the key point of his heroism. This kind of superhero would be right at home in Nazi fucking Germany. That's not progressive. And then the culture of that nation state, which is supposed to be a glorifying repr…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates21/07/21 11:11 PM
24

Not hard at all. If anything, it's hard for me to understand how people let the political compass get turned into what it is. Left wing political views are not SJW identity politics, and by the traditional political compass the SJWs are ultra-right. The regressive feminists, the transtrenders, all that toxic bigoted horde - those are not leftists, they hold few if any views that are actually left-wing.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates21/07/21 11:06 PM
6

Before I tell you - I'm sure you have an idea what the justification was. Can you make a guess?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates21/07/21 03:38 PM
13

Not only did they not, the point of the rule was specifically to prevent men from discussing those topics, not to prevent discussion of those topics altogether.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates21/07/21 02:22 PM
17

I'm convinced this whole "awkward men" thing is blown way out of proportion. Honestly, lately I'm convinced that the proportion is exactly right, we're just looking at it from the wrong angle. Sure, objectively a man who is socially awkward and physically unappealing is hardly any kind of threat. But subjectively, people just tend to hate such men, and hate them much more intensely than they do actually harmful, actually threatening people like criminals.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates21/07/21 11:01 AM
16

Some years ago, wrongplanet.com, a huge online resource for people on the spectrum, quite literally and explicitly banned male members from discussing any topics pertaining to romantic and sexual relationships.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates21/07/21 10:58 AM
8

Do you know what obstacles men face that deter them from organising the same way feminists have in the past. Show me how that the stakes for them were ever as high as they are for us.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates20/07/21 04:40 AM
7

The world? Circumcision is not the norm in most of the world. The US is pretty much the only secular country that does that.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates20/07/21 04:38 AM
12

It's fair to generalise feminists as not doing anything for men, because they don't. Go ahead, prove me wrong.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates20/07/21 01:24 AM
2

I admit my impression comes from what I see on the internet and from the Chinese diaspora in Japan. However, the input I get online includes accounts from western and Russian expats living in China, and views such as yours are only a tiny minority. You'll have to excuse me for assuming your account is wrong. If it's any consolation, I actually want to be wrong on this.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates18/07/21 03:31 PM
2

Hopefully you're right, but it's scary how quickly their fascism is growing. A good chunk of the Chinese public have really bought into this idea that they're the chosen people destined to rule the world, and are clamoring for war.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates18/07/21 11:31 AM
1

But every individual woman could be, and enough women are that most men have stories to tell about that. It doesn't necessarily warrant swearing off helping all women, but you can't really fault a man who does.
/r/MGTOW218/07/21 05:28 AM
6

Yeah, but the US can keep waging war without setting fire to the whole world. If China decided to invade Taiwan or some other neighbouring country like Japan, or if Russia did the same, things would get very ugly very quick on a. global scale.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates18/07/21 05:25 AM
10

As a Russian, I've always felt that it's hella unfair how women get several thousand dollars from the state, no questions asked, just for popping out a baby. But what you describe is a whole different level of injustice, jfc
/r/MGTOW218/07/21 03:29 AM
5

There's a good chance China or Russia will start something that will lead to a real war, and then all of us excess men are just going to die.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates18/07/21 01:57 AM
7

We were cavemen a lot longer I'm sure if I used this argument to justify, say, the use of violence to acquire mates, you wouldn't stand for it.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates17/07/21 02:38 AM
15

They can. They choose not to.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates15/07/21 06:03 AM
2

Jesus Christ. When you mentioned it I was sure it would be a story from some place like India. And that photo at the end of the article...
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates13/07/21 06:32 AM
4

And what peer reviewed academic pieces, replete with sources, have you seen? A good number of them, though you'll have to forgive me for saving none in my Zotero library. After all, empirical evidence has data and statistics behind it. Which makes it all the more telling that the overwhelming majority of CRT 'research' is qualitative.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates11/07/21 10:47 PM
8

outside her misandrist comments occasionally, shes always supportive So, she never abuses you except for the times that she does. That's a roundabout, but still correct way of describing an abuser. She isn't your friend.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates11/07/21 11:59 AM
5

I personally do so because from what I've seen, the "framework" is indeed just the strawman dressed up in prose that tries to stylistically imitate research papers.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates11/07/21 11:57 AM
5

More and more men are being pushed to look for ways to cope with a lack of sexual and romantic success. MGTOW is one such venue, so obviously it sees an increase in popularity.
/r/MGTOW211/07/21 11:48 AM
19

No, she's treating you as a violent criminal. Because of how unattractive sexually she finds me.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates09/07/21 06:43 PM
35

Just like women the conventionally attractive are. I would say that even the unattractive often are, just not in a positive sense. The woman next to me on the train acting all creeped out while I'm just sitting next to her trying to read a fucking book - isn't she sexualizing me? The co-worker who assumes I'm trying to court her because I helped her out with work a few times and who opts to preemptively reject me - isn't she sexualizing me? The colleague who sees me hire a young female professio…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates09/07/21 02:07 PM
3

Take away the marrieds' tax benefits.
/r/Divorce_Men09/07/21 04:07 AM
2

Can't exactly lose virginity with a date when nobody is willing to go on a date with you. It's all about probabilities, really. I'm a very unattractive man and so far I've had exactly ONE opportunity in life to make something with a woman. I manage to seize that opportunity and got to experience sex and romance and marriage and divorce. And I'm not even that unattractive - plenty of men have issues worse than mine, they likelihood of them meeting someone who likes them is even lower. Out there t…
/r/MGTOW207/07/21 11:22 AM
1

If they say no, and it’s worth it to you, offer more. Um, dude, that's not how it works. They decline after you pay. It's a scam, but what are you going to do - go to the police?
/r/MGTOW206/07/21 10:12 PM
2

It ain't that easy to buy sex actually. I'm a former incel myself and when I went to a sex worker all those years back she declined to service me. Sex workers aren't really suffering from a shortage of clients, at least in my country, so they get to pick and choose.
/r/MGTOW206/07/21 07:25 AM
2

Most incels have long and varied experiences with self-improvement. I've been around incel communities since the early 2000s and honestly a good rule of thumb is that stood-improvement should bring tangible results within a year. If it doesn't, that person is most likely fucked and won't see consistent, if any, results no matter how long and what they try.
/r/MGTOW206/07/21 07:23 AM
2

Sent. I grew out of tying my self worth to women's evaluation years ago but I still care insofar as I don't want to die alone. I've been the caretaker of elderly family members and I know just how badly an illness can fuck you up.
/r/MGTOW206/07/21 07:19 AM
1

Then why are you crying?
/r/MGTOW204/07/21 01:02 PM
8

Late thirties, not the West, but still can relate. All my peers at this point are paired up and raising families while also working full time jobs. Often times their wives disapprove of them spending time with anyone else, or with single male friends specifically. Nobody ever meets up anymore.
/r/MGTOW204/07/21 08:03 AM
1

Maybe. So?
/r/MGTOW204/07/21 07:36 AM
2

Don't your courts routinely turn those matters criminal by ordering the guy to pay, then holding him in contempt when he doesn't?
/r/Divorce_Men04/07/21 03:36 AM
-21

You would argue that most men aren't afraid but are taught to pretend they are?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates03/07/21 11:39 AM
1

By asking separate questions about ability and willingness. That's... not really a solid approach.
/r/BlackPillScience30/06/21 10:58 PM
7

If she used sperm bank data, instead, she would have more adequate picture Nitpick, but would she, actually? Sperm banks have pretty ridiculously narrow requirements that only a minority of men probably meet, so just as with hospitals you would only get data for a very specific subset of people.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates30/06/21 10:34 AM
1

Yeah, but what's the measure, exactly? How does it separate ability to have casual sex from willingness to have casual sex?
/r/BlackPillScience30/06/21 10:27 AM
2

I'm too lazy to read the article, so just tell me - how do they piece willingness apart from ability?
/r/BlackPillScience29/06/21 11:36 PM
4

They confirmed that it's detected.
/r/BlackPillScience29/06/21 12:51 AM
-1

Really, OP, the only saving grace of people like you is that you're dumb and thus unable to spread your evil efficiently.
/r/MGTOW227/06/21 08:35 AM
16

It's more important to avoid convicting innocent defendants than to avoid letting guilty ones go free.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates27/06/21 06:25 AM
6

Going by the spirit of the law, shouldn't the existence of such restrictions introduce more "reasonable doubt" into any trial, thus pushing judges to convict less? And if it doesn't, does that fact not undermine the whole notion of reasonable doubt as a factor in making judgements?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates27/06/21 06:24 AM
1

Like they literally approach you and chat you up?
/r/MGTOW227/06/21 03:00 AM
2

How?
/r/MGTOW226/06/21 09:22 AM
3

Not necessarily. Capitalists regularly sacrifice profits for personal "ethics"
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates23/06/21 04:24 AM
4

I'm Russian and live in Japan these days. Female homeless are pretty much unheard of in both countries. It's especially egregious with Russia because we had a homelesness epidemic in the nineties and some parts of the country still struggle with that, but it's pretty much exclusively men.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates19/06/21 04:41 PM
14

I'm sure others can come up with more and better examples so I'll kinda just toot my own horn here. Marriage tax benefits. They used to be an incentive but now they're basically a punitive tax on unattractive men. Any woman can find a partner to marry, but some men are disqualified from that market and can't find anyone at all. Those men end up paying more taxes simply because they couldn't attract someone.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates18/06/21 08:16 AM
9

the mainstream narrative has genuinely convinced society that women are getting the short end of the stick in all areas I disagree. If it were just conviction, it would possible, if maybe not easy, to convince people otherwise. But if you try, overwhelmingly people will either get angry and storm off, or they will get angry and admit that they just don't care about men and/or feel that treating men unfairly is the morally right thing to do. So, IMO, most people don't genuinely believe that women…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates16/06/21 11:07 PM
9

they at least honor men for their toughness No they don't. They honor masculine men for the apparent masculinity. If you don't fulfill that condition, nobody will care what other qualities you have - traditionalists will hate you just as much as regressive SJWs.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates16/06/21 10:59 PM
17

In general, I’ve found that men expressing general lack of confidence at the wrong time really does throw people off their game Ah, yes, "throw people off their game" You know, the same way seeing a free black person used to throw people off their game in 19th century America. The same way an LGBT couple kissing in public tends to throw people off their game in Russia. The same way a woman without a burka tends to throw people off their game in Saudi Arabia.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates16/06/21 01:35 PM
1

I mean, the Soviet Union had a bachelor tax AND alimony with child support rolled into it. If the state wants to fuck men over, it can fuck them really hard.
/r/MGTOW215/06/21 03:57 AM
4

Until one day, you are. I don't think FDS types are crazies and not representative of anything. I think they're exaggerated versions of mainstream thought and their positions are growing less and less marginalized by the day. Already several countries are looking into bringing back bachelor taxes for men while also maintaining tax breaks for marrieds. That's turning providership into an institution and honestly is there any reason to think it will stop there?
/r/MGTOW215/06/21 03:48 AM
2

I've heard that many people in Japan don't even want to date I've lived most of my adult life in Russia. My success rates in both countries are equally low. Or have you considered just lowering your standards for physical attractiveness? To what, exactly? When I was in college I knew a woman who was so obese she literally couldn't take some classes because she couldn't fit through the auditorium doors. She was also balding, epileptic and diabetic. I can confidently say she's the least physically…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates14/06/21 10:31 PM
2

Because they were starving to death and going days without food; wouldn't a better system have been to give everybody food? How were those men supposed to eat? It seems to be little more than a poorly thought out excuse to deny aid to men, i.e. someone in charge believed that help should only be given to women and felt the need to justify that - and that's what they came up with.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates14/06/21 01:40 PM
2

"Men were left to eat grass to try and survive" requires proof. Why? If food relief efforts were necessary, that implies food shortages. If food relief is denied a certain group of people during food shortages, it stands to reason that at least some members of that group would face starvation. Sure, proof would be welcome, but why would it be required? What exactly is made impossible and/or unacceptable by a lack of proof?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates14/06/21 11:12 AM
19

What would that accomplish exactly? It would not prevent the "unruly" men from taking those things from women by using violence. What it did accomplish was condemn to death men who would not or could not feed themselves through violence and who didn't have a woman to acquire food for them. If I were there, I would have been one of those men. Can you explain to me why in a disaster like that I should die?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates14/06/21 04:10 AM
-7

What kind of source could one cite to prove that something didn't happen?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates14/06/21 04:08 AM
29

So it’s basically business as usual. I think it's something scarier. "Business as usual" is mostly conventional. What NOW is doing is trying to encode that in law.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates13/06/21 07:40 AM
10

Serious talk, you're just bringing the end of your life closer. Our time on this earth is finite and you're wasting yours here doing something completely futile.
/r/BlackPillScience13/06/21 07:37 AM
13

Also, dude, you should really reexamine what you're doing here. What's your goal exactly? Convince blackpilled people that the world is actually fair, the blue pill is the way and there's someone out there for anyone? Well, look at it like this: 1) You won't convince those blackpillers who don't go deep into the academic aspect - they're going to prioritize their experience over your arguments, and their experience is that the black pill is correct. 2) You won't convince those blackpillers who d…
/r/BlackPillScience13/06/21 04:02 AM
15

I have to admit you've levelled up. Instead of straight up bullshitting statistics you're now shuffling theoretical frameworks, picking those that lend themselves better to the results you want to achieve. Here's the kicker though - that's still not science. That's just you trying to rationalize your wishful thinking. You've lost the debate the moment you made the decision to work towards a predetermined conclusion.
/r/BlackPillScience13/06/21 03:53 AM
5

I think you can mention these things if you frame it correctly. Isn't that the definition of controversial? I always like to compare men's issues in the west with LGBT rights issues in my own country, Russia. This analogy works here as well. In Russia, I can speak for LGBT rights, but only if I frame it correctly, otherwise I will face expensive fines and violence. Framing it correctly involves always making the disclaimer that I condemn LGBT people and recognize them as lesser and also as harmf…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates12/06/21 04:56 PM
35

Attractive nice guys finish first.
/r/BlackPillScience12/06/21 02:08 PM
27

That's not how the r statistic works. Jesus man, in all this time you could've sat your ass down and read a simple statistics textbook.
/r/BlackPillScience12/06/21 02:05 PM
5

I don't wish I were more masculine. I want people to stop hating me and discriminating against me for my lack of masculinity.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates11/06/21 05:16 AM
34

Yes. Wanna know how I know? Over the past two decades I've been a member of a number of communities for men who can't date and have sex. Not all of them called themselves incels. Most of them didn't have anything close to black pill views. They still faced all the same false accusations and all the same persecution. The biggest issue people have with incels is that they're unattractive low status men, and people are taught to irrationally hate unattractive low status men.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates11/06/21 03:13 AM
4

And ugly men too.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates11/06/21 03:11 AM
12

The reason I personally hate those norms is because those are norms for attractive men. I'm not even asking women to date me, mind, but goddamn as an unattractive man do I hate having to temper my courtesy to avoid offending a woman. Holding a door open is creepy. Telling a woman she dropped something is creepy. Any little act of kindness can and will be interpreted as an attempt at courtship exactly because of those shitty norms.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates11/06/21 03:09 AM
6

Russia.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates08/06/21 05:49 PM
-3

Pepe being bad was a smear campaign of 'guilty by association' The Pepe association was specifically because Pepe was used by incels a lot.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates08/06/21 02:16 PM
8

"Boys will be boys" has always meant rambunctious behavior Was it really? In my country the equivalent does absolutely get used to excuse the sexual and other violence of high status and/or handsome 'alpha' men.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates08/06/21 02:15 PM
10

I've always wondered how that negative effect on boys compares to the negative effect of having two parents, but living in a very turbulent household. My parents' marriage was a very extreme example of "beta bucks" - mom married dad for his career prospects and money but absolutely hated him as a person and worked hard to make me and my siblings hate him as well. Unsurprisingly there was lots of abuse and substance use in our home which affected us all heavily. On the other hand, they both made …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates08/06/21 05:45 AM
11

This is not possible unless the pressure on men to marry is lowered, and there's no indication it will - if anything, the traditional male gender role has only been reinforced through the past two decades. As long as the stigma against older bachelors persists there will be enough simps and all women who want to marry will be able to marry easily.
/r/PurplePillDebate07/06/21 12:52 PM
1

Great! I'm in a professional field which is very female-dominated and at times I've struggled with employment for this reason. I have, however, made a good career of it, and eventually found myself in a management position, a position that allows me to make employment decisions. Since then I've made the conscious effort to fix the gender imbalance problem by prioritizing male professionals over female ones when hiring. Do you feel I'm doing the right thing?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/06/21 03:43 AM
12

They're trolls and they don't define the sub. I feel you're downplaying what is a serious problem. There's a fairly new post there right now with a guy in the field of psychology complaining about feminist bullying. The fifth most upvoted comment (with 40+ upvotes as of right now) is a comment berating him for generalizing feminists.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates07/06/21 03:30 AM
–

Tell me lifting weights doesnt' work. It doesn't. If it did, saying it doesn't wouldn't send you gym fanatics into fits of rage.
/r/PurplePillDebate07/06/21 02:22 AM
–

It's not ignorance, it's malice. They deny it because they hate unsuccessful (unattractive) men and find sympathy towards them abhorrent.
/r/PurplePillDebate07/06/21 02:16 AM
1

Whoa, old thread but okay. You could find a tailor and get some nice clothes really well fitted to you. Already done - I own two tailored suits. I still look bad in them. You could hire a personal trainer to make your body more attractive. Also done - I went through five different personal trainers in my youth when I found myself struggling to gain muscle after losing a lot of weight (I was obese through my teens). You could experiment with growing a beard and see if that makes things better or …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates06/06/21 11:46 AM
6

To be fair, the American left/right debate is not a left or right issue because by the traditional political compass both the American 'left' and the American 'right' are extreme right wing. However, if you take 'left or right' to mean the modern American political compass, then men's rights are indeed a left vs. right issue because the two sides have opposing views about what rights men should be granted.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates06/06/21 09:24 AM
1

I would say until recently it wasn't exactly wrong to say that. Both men and women perpetuate men's issues and are especially hostile to lower status men, but until recently most power was concentrated in the hands of men, so it was mostly men who were promoting harmful sexist policies. Nowadays though plenty of women hold institutional power and they've shown themselves to be just as willing to harm men and just reluctant to offer any help.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates06/06/21 04:42 AM
3

Okay, by my definition Vladimir Putin is an incel. Let's now have a discussion on how Russia came to be the world's first incel state.
/r/PurplePillDebate05/06/21 12:49 PM
2

That's not how it works lol
/r/PurplePillDebate05/06/21 11:44 AM
3

So? Many people claim they're incel while sleeping around, especially women. It's called lying.
/r/PurplePillDebate05/06/21 10:18 AM
1

The guy she's taIking about also suffers from schizophrenia which really explains it.
/r/PurplePillDebate05/06/21 09:16 AM
2

Podnebesny isn't an incel. He sleeps around with his followers when he's not busy sharing his turds of wisdom with the internet.
/r/PurplePillDebate05/06/21 09:15 AM
1

As a Russian who emigrated to Japan I can assure it's a global problem.
/r/PurplePillDebate05/06/21 09:09 AM
2

I get what you're talking about, I struggle with loneliness a lot too, but dude. Travel alone. I always travel alone and it's great. What, do you also never go to the movies by yourself?
/r/MGTOW203/06/21 03:43 AM
18

I don't get it, do women not have agency in choosing who they date? I too would hate to inflict myself upon a woman who doesn't enjoy my company, but in my experience women are pretty darn good at keeping distance from me when they don't want me around.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates03/06/21 12:11 AM
6

It really depends on what feminist group we talk about. Russian mainstream feminism is hellishly homophobic.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/06/21 11:58 PM
1

Yeah, sadly.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/06/21 03:29 AM
10

Going by the real political compass, the two factions of American politics are both ultra-right factions that disagree on the class and racial hierarchies they want to enforce.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/06/21 03:26 AM
2

the ONLY reason a hooker would refuse someone is if they thought they werent willing to pay If it matters, she declined after taking my money. And no, the reason a sex worker might decline a client is because she doesn't particularly need his business. I've only gone to a sex worker myself once, but I've arranged encounters for my foreign clients and partners on numerous occasions and I know full well that sex workers get plenty of business from clients with perfectly normal bodies - they can ea…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/06/21 03:19 AM
7

If that matters, I'm Russian. When I was younger, I did go to a sex worker to at least try sex to find out what it feels like. She declined to provide her service to me. Didn't say why but I have strong reasons to suspect it was because of my less than stellar physical appearance. And sex workers are not a solution to the problems of incelhood anyway. Going to a hooker isn't going to help a man find companionship in life, nor will it help him avoid the stigma against single men, especially singl…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/06/21 02:01 AM
3

I don't know if any others in here have had the experience of going to therapy out of desperation to seek some help, and the therapist' cold uncaring detached (often subtly victim-blaming) attitude made you feel like you literally ran all out of hope. I went to therapy because I was lonely. Not to mince words, because I was an incel - a virgin in my thirties with no sexual and romantic experience and no prospects. It weighed extremely heavily on me. I won't go into detail because that's not quit…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/06/21 01:26 AM
6

I'm lucky to have never been in contact with the penal system of any country. If a man on parole expresses suicidal feelings to his parole officer, would that officer be likely to re-imprison him?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates02/06/21 01:17 AM
1

it's virtually impossible to find a man to marry you I'm sorry, but given the abundance of similar claims about women elsewhere which are outright false, I'm going to assume this is also false unless presented with compelling evidence.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates01/06/21 12:27 PM
2

Goddamn, ain't that the truth. I thought I was ready for the eventual day when her affection for me ends. Didn't expect it to happen when it, in the middle of the pandemic, which killed beloved job as well.
/r/MGTOW201/06/21 06:39 AM
1

It benefits attractive men as well.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates01/06/21 06:03 AM
3

Women are push to get married more than men are. Society uses both shaming and material punishment against men who fail to pair up. Women face no material troubles for the same.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates01/06/21 04:34 AM
3

I deleted my previous reply to you because it went off-topic. It was very recent when being an 'old maid' was highly stigmatized and people would look down disapprovingly at any woman who wasn't married off and popping out kids at least by her mid 20's. The penalty for being single for women begins and ends with disapproving looks whereas men are punished materially in a number of ways. Reducing the consequences of being single just to disapproving looks would be a huge improvement for men. My p…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates01/06/21 03:29 AM
1

Then they get called "leftover women" And in Japan they used to get called "christmas cakes". So? A nickname is not much of a penalty, is it.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates01/06/21 03:28 AM
4

Okay, here are a few especially egregious ones that I think need fixing most urgently: 1) Single men face a glass ceiling in most corporate and public career fields. Women notably don't face this problem as evidenced by the fact that never-married and divorced female executives are common, whereas male ones are not. An example I like to bring up is the fact that even in fairly conservative Japan, the second most-powerful, if not the most powerful politician in the country is a never-married woma…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates01/06/21 03:16 AM
1

a very strong claim I don't think "all feminists are not automatically man hating bigots" is that outrageous a claim.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates01/06/21 03:00 AM
1

Men face a fairly large number of penalties for being single. Just for the sake of convenience, can you give a quick list of the ones you know about so I describe only the ones you're overlooking, if any?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates31/05/21 05:25 PM
13

I disagree. You're basically arguing that men won't choose a shitty option that is harmful to them because they'll realize being single is better, but men already have such an option - provider marriages - and the pressure on men to have a partner is so high that most men who cannot find a relationship based on love (and even many who can!) still choose providership over being single. Additionally, normalizing polygamy doesn't even challenge the existing structure of inequality at all because it…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates31/05/21 02:15 PM
11

Also women are much more wiling to stay single I don't think women are inherently more willing to stay single - older desperate women are after all a thing. The real difference is that women are not nearly as penalized for being single as men. I personally believe that if we equalized the penalties (either by removing them altogether or by easing men's burden), then men would also be far, far more okay with staying single for long stretches of time.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates31/05/21 02:11 PM
1

What I'm trying to say is "if you don't want crazy feminists like here, maybe you should be particularly watchful over those feminists you have. Their craziness might be hidden a slight bit deeper. That's a noble sentiment but I don't really have the mental, physical and time resourcs to conduct a campaign of investigation and surveillance of Japanese feminst activists. So far what I see them doing is all good and consistent. If one day I find out something that will change my view, then I'll ch…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates31/05/21 02:04 PM
1

Those feminists aren't misandristic, so I won't examine them. I won't examine them, so I can't really show they aren't misandristic. Well, yeah, that's about it. I don't care about Japanese feminism enough to examine it in-depth to make 100% sure not part of it is misandric. I'm simply working on the assumption that if it were misandric, it'd be readily apparent the same way it's apparent with feminism in the west and in my own country (Russia). If your point is that my knowledge is not enough t…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates31/05/21 11:14 AM
3

Um, what?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates30/05/21 02:37 PM
1

It isn't. There's actually quite a lot you can change in that regard. That's a disagreement on something that is essentially a subjective evaluation - men can do some things to improve their sex appeal. I think the extent of that is very limited, you think it's "quite a lot" Don't you think it's a bit over the top to call my evaluation 'dangerous delusion'? I would also like to address the topic further because your reply made me feel I didn't argue my point well enough. We can certainly start t…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates30/05/21 12:48 PM
21

It would be far better if every comment did need to be a scholarly article. As it stands now they're simply censoring since groups while letting others speak freely.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates30/05/21 05:59 AM
-1

I mean, since they do use the word "feminism" the movement's ideology is obviously informed to some extent by western feminism, at least at some point in its history. But what the movement is doing and promoting in the present is not bigoted, and frankly that's the extent of the scrutiny I'm willing to put it under.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates30/05/21 03:00 AM
5

You cannot appease the people who label you a hate group by adjusting your rhetoric. They hate you for what you are, not for what you do.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates30/05/21 02:01 AM
1

No idea actually. What feminist discourse I've read in Japan didn't really discuss things in terms of western academic feminism.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates29/05/21 05:27 PM
2

Everybody has heard of the toxic work culture that is in Japan. Since men are the ones generally expected to be salarymen and spend most of their time at work. How does this affect notions of equality? Work culture is something not just feminists, but the left in general are trying to change. The toxic work culture affects both women who pursue careers and men and I was very pleasantly surprised to find the feminist rhetoric here tackling both the problems women themselves face in the workplace …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates29/05/21 05:26 PM
2

I myself ascended but did not become hostile to incels, so that change which most former incels seem to go through is puzzling to me. It's understandable in those cases where the former incel tries to give advice (which is never useful to other incels), but that doesn't happen nearly as often as you think. Oftentimes they simply do a 180 and begin to denounce incels without any intermediate period.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates29/05/21 01:33 PM
3

I don’t think that actually really helped me overcome my situation The methods for overcoming inceldom are pretty well-known and obvious - it comes down to becoming more attractive. Changing one's mindset will not compel women to be attracted to him - only changing one's attractiveness will. The goal of evading distress from incelhood is not "overcoming" incelhood - the goal is to feel less distress. Elsewhere again in the thread someone else posted about viewing subs that hate on incels, which …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates29/05/21 01:28 PM
2

Im disappointed that you would anticipate harmful stereotypes on a left wing sub! Hahaha, well, to be frank it's because this is a majority American sub. The American public specifically seems to have so many stereotypes about Japan which are just plain wrong that it's ridiculous at times. As far as Japanese feminism goes, I'm by far not an expert since I'm not an activist and not Japanese. My involvement begins and ends with reading some books and following a few twitter accounts. I'm also not …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates29/05/21 01:21 PM
3

Honestly, I didn't want to name the place because I was afraid I'd spark conversations based on so many stupid and false stereotypes, since that happens very often. But I guess that's dumb because anyone can look it up in my posting history anyway. I was talking about Japan.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates29/05/21 12:39 PM
12

Honestly, I don't think it will stop if men protest. Protests work when there's room for public debate on the topic and I feel that currently in most of the world institutional power is not open to such public debate. A man protesting in any form will be very harshly punished and will more likely than not lose his reputation, job, livelihood, status or perhaps even life. A 'men's march' won't be allowed and if it still takes places it will most likely be put down very harshly. I don't know what …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates29/05/21 11:43 AM
12

No, that's just wrong. Feminism is a label that's slapped onto so many different movements that declaring them all guilty of some sort of sin is just wrong. For example, in the country where I currently reside mainstream feminism is firmly rooted in left wing politics, has a fairly powerful voice (though admittedly not anywhere as powerful as in the US) and doesn't endorse any sort of bigotry or hatred. Blanket declaring all feminists to be evil is throwing out the baby with the bathwater and do…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates29/05/21 11:36 AM
2

you can choose what content to expose yourself to online Which is a fairly meaningless strategy because online content is a very minor factor among all the things that make an incel's life miserable. It's also risky because seeking to remove "negative" content from one's feed can easily end up with the incel man cutting himself off from any communities where he can talk about his experiences. The absolutely darkest period of my life as an incel was when I took the normie advice and forced myself…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates29/05/21 11:24 AM
2

Oh, sorry, you're right, I should have addressed that to him.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates29/05/21 11:04 AM
1

The issue is that you're offering up them both as if they are both valid. I'm not, merely mentioning the other option does not mean endorsing it. Complaining that feminists see both as equally abhorrent implies that destigmatizing is abhorrent to some extent Also no. It simply refers to the fact that feminists treat it as abhorrent. I'm sorry, but I really don't like your tone here. It feels like you've made a bunch of assumptions about me and are demanding that I prove to you that I'm not this …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates29/05/21 04:05 AM
4

avoiding the kind of outrage bait type of discussion As I'm sure other incels (I'm a former one) will attest, the extent of things that trigger distress over the incel situation go far, far beyond just discussions on the internet. I get sad seeing families together at the park. I get angry when I do my taxes and see the marriage tax deduction section. I get sad again when my local restaurant does a couples only event. I get angry again when a night club turns me away because they have a no singl…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates29/05/21 03:45 AM
7

It's up to you to fill your void. There's a conspicuous lack of people who manage to do that while completely isolated.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates29/05/21 03:36 AM
3

"Go to dance class" is a bit cliched advice for this stuff, but I do still recommend it and second what you're saying here. If you know it's cliched advice, why didn't you take the time to look up how that usually goes for incels. If you did that, you'd find that incels' experiences with dance classes are almost universally negative because those places are almost always extremely hostile to unattractive men. That's been my experience as well. The controlled part of the environment does necessar…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates29/05/21 03:32 AM
6

they are minority of population This is often stated, but there's never any proof of that. And besides, even if it is true, that still leaves that supposed minority of ugly incels. What do you propose to do with them?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates29/05/21 03:28 AM
1

I do obviously lean towards qualizing society rather than women's sexuality and I find it really disturbing how feminists seem to treat both options as equally abhorrent and equally unrealistic.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates29/05/21 03:24 AM
3

There's very little quantitative research on incels because many factors conspire against it: the stigma makes data collection extremely difficult with actual incels being reluctant to reveal themselves and haters seeking to poison the data. And after that there's the barrier of political views - both the authors' and institutional. Many people aren't comfortable with publishing research that casts incels in an insufficiently bad light and many institutions (universities, publishers etc.) reject…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates29/05/21 03:09 AM
2

Ironically, in my heavily patriarchal country the same arguments are often used towards feminists, i e. "we shouldn't remove workplace discrimination because men didn't owe that to women" Do you agree with such rhetoric also? As for the last part of your comment I don't have a recipe for changing women's sexuality or much interest in one. I personally prefer the second option and have some ideas how it could be realized, but this seems to be more a debate whether it should be realized, correct?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates29/05/21 03:02 AM
1

By "delusion" do you mean that something in my comment is factually wrong? If so, can you point out what, exactly?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates29/05/21 02:55 AM
6

You are making the same mistakes as incels Mate, I am an incel. And a wizard at that. Vex me no further or I shall turn thee into a toad. Which brings me back to my point, generalizing everyone of the same group tends to gets you rejected by other humans. That's a moot point. Most women avoid interacting with unattractive men at all, so there's not really a chance for them to find out how those men feel about women and whether or not they generalize them. And even when they do find out, it reall…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/05/21 03:04 PM
6

"Wasting energy" on haters is usually not a choice, but let's stop for a moment. You were saying that we need to teach incels that women are "decent human beings" Let's say you magically taught that to an ugly incel. He now knows that women are 'decent human beings' and women still hate him. What changes?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/05/21 02:09 PM
1

First you say dO yOuR rESeArCh. Then when I say I know what the pain is like firsthand, you discount that. I mean, going back to the comment that started this conversation - your experience does not in any way demonstrate that incels have some special investment in 'incel ideology'. They don't, and they abandon it easily when they ascend. You're trying to pontificate about incels and the premise you're using for it is simply not true. Your past experiences with depression or whatever don't give …
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/05/21 01:29 PM
3

It's a far more common occurrence than you think.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/05/21 01:25 PM
2

It sounds dystopian, but honestly, would such a society really be horrible if we just had a reliable way of predicting a man's (un)desirability? Let's say we really can identify incels early on. The current state of affairs is that such boys, later men, will most likely lead miserable lives where they suffer from sexual frustration, loneliness and later complete isolation, while also being discriminated against - single men are taxed at a higher rate and face glass ceilings in pretty much any ex…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/05/21 10:19 AM
1

Was your friend born bitter?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/05/21 10:13 AM
0

Maybe I've felt the hopelessness and depression If you think the experience of incels boils down to "feel hopelessness and depression" that just once again shows that you don't know the topic you're trying to discuss. For that matter, the same applies to your thinking that your personal experience, whatever it is, is in any way representative of any large number of incels. You don't even know how diverse incels and their life stories are, do you.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/05/21 07:08 AM
0

It's strange how you just said you want to know what he is trying to be informed about, yet the question you posed to him is: Why do you need to be informed about this, though?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/05/21 06:41 AM
6

I've pretty much never had any success either in Japan or in Russia - women just aren't attracted to me and in fact outside of professional environments mostly refuse to interact with me at all. I actually have been in one relationships, that even developed into a marriage. I found that it's actually very easy to interact, be intimate and have a deep emotional relationship with a woman who is interested in me. However, eventually that relationship ended I've yet to meet another woman who would b…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/05/21 06:38 AM
0

Yes it does. It does actually flip off like a switch, which you would know if you actually did some research on the topic you're trying to discuss.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/05/21 06:32 AM
6

There are feminists who want to start a sexual assistance programm with female sexworkers Uhhh... you do know that being rejected or mistreated by sex workers is not exactly a rare occurence for unattractive men, right? Nah, who am I kidding, of course you didn't know that.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/05/21 06:29 AM
3

Why does he need to justify his browsing habits to you?
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/05/21 06:28 AM
2

Unless you also teach women not to hate men for simply not being sexually appealing, what you'll end up teaching incels is that women are decent humans beings with ambitions, dreams and morals who hate them irrationally.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/05/21 06:26 AM
5

Because that kind of progress never happens to guys like us, right? No, because there are guys for whom it doesn't happen. You got your lucky break - that's not a reason to dismiss the problems of those who don't, or excuse the discrimination they face.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/05/21 06:24 AM
4

The thing is it's increasingly normal for relationships to be delayed. In California California isn't the world. The US isn't the world. I'm an incel. I was born and grew up in Russia and I have been living in Japan for the better part of a decade now. Relationships are definitely not delayed in either culture, and both have large numbers of incel men whose experiences and grievances aren't very much different from those of American and European incels. I see what line of thinking might have led…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/05/21 06:22 AM
1

women’s sexuality isn’t supposed to be egalitarian Whether or not women sexually accept a man heavily shapes his life. Companionship, family, health, taxes, career opportunities - all of those things are impacted by whether a man is sexually appealing to a woman. Since sex appeal is to a large extent immutable, the current system is extremely unjust. Unless you want to just accept that injustice, egalitarianism is indeed required to resolve it - either women's sexuality should become more egalit…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/05/21 06:19 AM
1

I’m not saying we should be banning people, I'm saying we should structure the community in such a way that people will self-censor. That's not nuanced at all. And it's also an approach that doesn't work with reddit.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/05/21 06:15 AM
6

they're making their misery worse Are they though? Being an incel is miserable, sure, but the worst, darkest period of my incel life was when I took the normie advice and just cut myself off from all incel and incel-adjacent forums and content.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/05/21 06:14 AM
6

The problem isn't that the comedians are allowed to say it. The problem is that they say it and it pays off, or rather the problem is the social attitude that makes it so.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/05/21 06:12 AM
4

Okay, hard mode now bro. I'm in my late thirties. Gimme what you've got.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/05/21 06:03 AM
0

Not true at all and showcases your lack of research. All incels who ascend readily leave incel communities and it's extremely rare for an ascended incel to not become hostile towards incels.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/05/21 06:01 AM
5

I'm an incel and I accept myself. I've met plenty of other incels who accept themselves, whereas you clearly have not met many, if any at all incels. Lack of self-acceptance is not nearly as rampant in incel communities as your intuition mistakenly suggests.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/05/21 05:54 AM
3

Is it really OP's job to live up to some random internet dude's standard of perfection?
/r/MGTOW228/05/21 05:06 AM
5

The very first thought that comes into my mind is that probably there's a huge number of 'poor' women enjoying comfortable, perhaps even luxurious lives with the money of their lovers.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates28/05/21 03:37 AM
6

Oh, you're saying that it's okay to treat a group of people unjustly because they're a minority.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates26/05/21 06:16 AM
7

It is exactly an excuse, i.e. a false reason given to hide the true reason. The true reason is that they don't want to punish a woman because they feel women should not be punished. Since they don't want to explicitly express that reason, they instead give an excuse - that she supposedly is mentally ill.
/r/MGTOW226/05/21 02:31 AM
2

There was some progress made in the oughts, but it rolled back heavily in the following decade. Vigilantes targeting LGBT men are not common exactly, but incidents involving them do pop up regularly enough. In Russia it's common for people to think that all gay men are automatically pedophiles and this is both the motivation and the excuse for targeting them. If you want to learn more about such groups.... actually, I couldn't really give you much in terms of concrete information because I don't…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates25/05/21 04:58 PM
4

Not quite third world, but it does get pretty shitty in Russia. Conscription and brutal hazing in the army, extremely strict gender roles in pretty much every aspect of life with some pretty severe punishments for failing to be masculine enough. In recent years there's been lively debate in favor of bringing back the (male only) bachelor tax. LGBT men on top of that have to deal with vigilantes targeting them and law enforcement turning a blind eye if not outright helping them.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates25/05/21 12:07 PM
7

AHS has become a lot less effective, especially since they were exposed for doing exactly that, including spamming CP How so? I was under the impression that they were exposed... and the reddit essentially turned a blind eye to that.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/05/21 03:43 PM
12

I feel a big part is that only men who already have a lot to lose are able to even do anything. Who suffers the most from misandry? The weak men. The unattractive men. The ostracized men. Often, 'feeble' reactions are the only reactions they can even have - how can a friendless incel, for example, fight against misandry other than by arguing on the internet? And the men who can do something know that they stand to lose everything in their lives for it. They know it's an extreme risk and they are…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates24/05/21 04:44 AM
6

We shouldn't excuse their behaviors because their behavior doesn't need an excuse. If Chad can do and say the same things without repercussions, the nerd should be able to as well.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates23/05/21 11:38 PM
7

If you're 'foreveralone' because you're unattractive, then it probably won't. I went from being a typical poor student kid to owning my own reasonably successful business - not rich, but quite comfortably middle class. Despite that and active attempts to find a partner, I still entered my thirties a virgin. Ultimately I met one woman who gave me a chance, and it wasn't because of my success or money - she was wealthier than me. Unless you really make it big, money isn't your ticket out of foreve…
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates23/05/21 11:36 PM
4

Is it though? It certainly did little to change my nonexistent romantic life.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates23/05/21 11:32 PM
1

Every time I've had to do something that involves taking off my clothes I've received derisive comments from female doctors and nurses. To be fair, it's sort of par for the course for doctors to be assholes in my country, but only women have made comments about my body.
/r/MGTOW223/05/21 07:30 AM
1

Those tax breaks used to be an incentive for marriage in the past, but in the modern world they're more like a punitive tax levied against men who won't or can't get married. Sure, they're usually small, but the very notion is fucking outrageous.
/r/MGTOW222/05/21 02:55 PM
3

What fucking tax breaks? It's great if your jurisdiction is sensible about it, but in most of the world people really do get tax breaks just for being married, which is its own whole can of bullshit.
/r/MGTOW222/05/21 02:40 PM
2

It's also probably a double effect. Some of it might be researchers themselves fibbing the data to get the results that confirm their ideological views, and some of it may be researchers fibbing the data to get past an ethics committee.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates21/05/21 04:47 AM
2

I'm a Russian expat living in Japan so I could give you some perspective of men's issues in Russia and Japan as well as perhaps specific issues of expat men in Japan. I, however, suck at writing such things out in free form, so this might work out better if you give me some questions to work with.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates21/05/21 04:42 AM
2

I was going to say that the law only provides for a fine so they'd be alright, but given that Russia is essentially ruled by decree the risk is indeed there so you've got a point.
/r/MGTOW221/05/21 01:59 AM
3

The really damning part is that the fines for 'gay propaganda' are not even that high in Russia - definitely affordable for a huge corporation like Bethesda.
/r/MGTOW220/05/21 01:05 PM
1

Uh, yeah, and?
/r/MGTOW220/05/21 02:56 AM
7

It's not an obstacle, it's an enemy. An obstacle it's something that stands in your way. An enemy, on the other hand, chooses to stand in your way.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates18/05/21 07:47 PM
1

Never try to insult someone to whom you are morally inferior - it's bound to fail simply by definition. I was going to say I wish someone you love would some day become the victim of the same thing you're perpetrating here, but let's face it - you are probably a broken narcissist incapable of love.
/r/MGTOW218/05/21 05:10 PM
1

So you don't even notice. Yeah, you're an even worse piece of shit than I initially thought.
/r/MGTOW218/05/21 02:44 PM
1

Notice how you make a number of assumptions and all of them are generous towards the woman and not the man. That's how I know you're an awful person.
/r/MGTOW218/05/21 05:14 AM
1

However, there is a flip side to this, single men are more likely to jump jobs and retire early. No, that's just an excuse. I'm from a country where early retirement is unheard of and pretty much impossible, and the glass ceiling for unmarried men still exists.
/r/MGTOW217/05/21 02:02 AM
1

there's a ceiling for single unmarried men in corporate america True for Russia and Japan as well. In Russia it's not uncommon for companies to have explicit policies that bar unmarried men (including divorcees) from holding certain positions.
/r/MGTOW217/05/21 02:01 AM
2

Thanks. I'm doing fine, probably lightyears better than most late 30's guys who find themselves forced to change careers. I've always prioritized financial safety, and now it's paying off.
/r/MGTOW216/05/21 04:27 PM
3

It's really fucking hard to succeed in business and in office work as an older single man. Source: me, older bachelor and former business owner. Corona is what did me in but I'd seen my share of discrimination before that.
/r/MGTOW216/05/21 09:09 AM
1

Wonder if they were actually white knights or just thugs looking for a fight. "Ima gunna defend this woman/child from you" is a very popular 'excuse' for mugging someone in my country.
/r/MGTOW215/05/21 03:59 AM
1

But that seems to be true both here and there, yet you only have debts here. Not that I'm trying to convince you to leave. Just trying to figure out what you want to do and how I can help you, if I can.
/r/MGTOW214/05/21 11:46 AM
5

it's much better to be underestimated than the other way around That's fair, but IMO it doesn't address the issues with self-acceptance that OP has. Let's say he does beat the odds and work his way up into a position of power as unattractive guy without working on accepting himself. Then he'll just be one of those paranoid/insecure types that are constantly insecure and miserable and make others miserable. Yes, like Stalin. And realistically, OP is probably not going to even work his way up to a…
/r/MGTOW214/05/21 02:46 AM
5

Can't speak for OP but in my case professional success did little to alleviate the pain of being unattractive and unmasculine, or rather the pain of being looked down on for it. If anything, before I found a way to deal with those feelings, they were a huge obstacle in the way of enjoying my professional success. There's also the fact that in most careers men with issues like those OP has face more obstacles and get less opportunities to advance than normal men.
/r/MGTOW214/05/21 02:23 AM
1

Nurturing self-love helped a lot when I was young. Somehow I just had an epiphany and realized that while people tend to hate me because of my unfortunate appearance and lack of masculinity doesn't mean I deserve any of that or that there's something wrong with me being alive in this world. I think it also pushed me to become more manipulative to get around some of my disadvantages, which helped alleviate them somewhat. Fair warning though, you will face different issues at a later age as an una…
/r/MGTOW214/05/21 02:19 AM
1

Why not?
/r/MGTOW213/05/21 06:04 AM
2

If your debts are incurred in Japan, you can, in the worst case scenario, ditch them by going home. It's not a cool thing to do, but if it's affecting you that much, self-care takes priority and I wouldn't judge you if you did. Is that an option for you?
/r/MGTOW213/05/21 05:37 AM
-1

But isn't that exsctly the kicker - that we don't know. Your assumption is reasonable, but it's not self-evident and at this point in time it's also not even intuitive.
/r/MGTOW212/05/21 07:18 PM
3

Well, you can sure pick nice places to live. I used to live near Juso myself but moved to Kawachi last year, mostly pursuing cheap rent. How was Tenmabashi in that regard? That area looks like it should have sky high rents. So, assuming you don't off yourself, what would you like to do? What's troubling you the most right now?
/r/MGTOW212/05/21 03:16 PM
5

Hi from Osaka, son. I'm sorry you're having to go through that. What do you currently want to do? Continue your education? Go back home? What's your nationality? I'm down on my luck myself so I can't offer any material help, but maybe I can help you navigate the bureaucratic bullshit and cheer you up a bit.
/r/MGTOW212/05/21 10:49 AM
5

I don't think you can call something a noble thing when it's done under duress.
/r/MGTOW211/05/21 06:44 AM
1

dude everyone knows that advocation of any kinda is prohibited on tiktok Seriously? Because while I don't use tiktok regularly, what gets reposted from it elsewhere makes me feel like my country's (Russia) segment of tiktok is a huge source of trad-feminist propaganda.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates10/05/21 12:02 PM
2

How do they work?
/r/BlackPillScience08/05/21 05:58 PM
1

I was that kid once. Yes, our mother brainwashed but damn, I will always have that weighing in my conscience
/r/PussyPassDenied08/05/21 07:34 AM
0

So, to you a man going his own way is a man who is careful not to say or do something that will make others think he's an unmasculine pussy.
/r/MGTOW208/05/21 05:37 AM
2

Not necessarily. I cried just the other day. It was out of grief. I did it in private to avoid being shamed for it, and I obviously did not receive any support for it, but I still felt better after. Crying has an introspective function like that as well.
/r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates08/05/21 04:42 AM
7

The estrogen craze seems like such bollocks to me. So we actually know that putting it in one's stomach causes it to feminise one's body?
/r/BlackPillScience08/05/21 04:19 AM
4

They're not nazis. We'll just have to agree to disagree here. The average Chinese person certainly fulfills my criteria for calling someone a nazi and I'm not one of those people who use the term lightly.
/r/MGTOW206/05/21 11:12 AM
3

Thanks. I'll keep your words in mind.
/r/MGTOW206/05/21 11:05 AM
12

You've never dealt with the chinese, obviously I fucking wish man. I live in a major city in Japan with a large Chinese diaspora and they've gotten increasingly racist and aggressive over the past few years. But yeah, I have it easy compared to the horror stories I've heard from peers who live in China. I'm sorry if you're Chinese and this is rustling your Han jimmies, but if so, then it's up to you to get your people to start acting like people and not fucking nazis.
/r/MGTOW206/05/21 10:58 AM
10

The Chinese don't need to "fall" for propaganda that tells them they're the master race destined to rule the world. Your average Chinese citizen these days is quite the raging nazi already, and circumventing import restrictions to get a Gucci bag doesn't really contradict that
/r/MGTOW206/05/21 09:43 AM
11

Hey, how's... uh, life at that age? I'm only in my late thirties but don't really have any plans to get married, let alone have kids, and old age kinda terrifies me. Both the health part, like things that you described and more severe things like strokes, and the social part. Being unmarried at my age is hugely isolating - all my friends are busy with their families and we don't communicate nearly as much. Does it get better at a later age?
/r/MGTOW206/05/21 06:49 AM
24

There's rumor that Zuckerberg's wife is a Chinese asset. If that's true she'll stay with him as long as the CCP needs her to.
/r/MGTOW206/05/21 06:38 AM
3

Texas’ family code, chapter 161, states that even if one is not the biological father, they still owe support payments that accrued before the paternity test proved otherwise. Jesus christ. There's unfair and there's just plain evil.
/r/MGTOW205/05/21 10:34 AM
3

You just know you're not facing any real disadvantages lol
/r/PurplePillDebate02/05/21 07:22 PM
2

I am lol
/r/PurplePillDebate02/05/21 07:21 PM
1

I mean this part. To take into account potential effects of father's attractiveness (which we do not know) on subject's attractiveness, we divided father's age at subject's birth into two fractions, namely age at birth of the subject's eldest sibling (if there is any), and time span between birth of the subject's eldest sibling and birth of the subject (“time to subject's birth”). The reason is that, firstly, it may take longer for less attractive fathers to find a mate, so that they would start r…
/r/PurplePillDebate02/05/21 04:56 PM
2

What's the problem with that exactly? They got a subjective variable and made sure to have high inter-rater agreement - that's pretty solid methodology. It's possible that raters of different age might rate differently, but that's not exactly a flaw - rather it's an issue to explore in further research. There's a limit to how many variables you can stick into a model before the results become impossible to interpret.
/r/PurplePillDebate02/05/21 04:52 PM
1

My biggest question is does this mean older siblings tend to be more attractive than younger ones? They do control for that and it appears that the answer is yes. Check out page 299, last paragraph on the left. I feel like that is something that would be noticed throughout history. That's not really obvious to me. Plenty of things about nature have been observed only with the advent of the scientific method and statistics - this could be easily one of them. Alternatively - this might be the reas…
/r/PurplePillDebate02/05/21 04:45 PM
1

Attraction is a powerful thing. I thankfully never went through the kind of brutal shit that you had to endure, but I did have that kind of woman in my life, and we were married too. Beware though - attraction is also a fickle thing. One day something in your appearance changes and/or she meets someone who tickles her fancy even better, and that's it. Happened to me last year. We parted ways amicably and she didn't take me to the cleaners even though she could have, but it was still a gut punch …
/r/MGTOW202/05/21 04:39 PM
0

Isn't it like a social faux pas to go to a restaurant alone in the US?
/r/PurplePillDebate02/05/21 04:32 PM
3

Oh? Do tell me of some disadvantages that obese women face. Hard mode: tell me of some disadvantages that only obese women face.
/r/PurplePillDebate02/05/21 04:31 PM
11

That was my first thought too, but they actually thought of that and controlled for it - page 299, last paragraph on the left.
/r/PurplePillDebate02/05/21 04:29 PM
4

Did you read it? What are the problems with it?
/r/PurplePillDebate02/05/21 04:27 PM
3

What power were you expecting them to have exactly?
/r/PurplePillDebate02/05/21 02:08 PM
8

Probably because it's women talking to other women and to themselves a lot of the time. Also because those same women cheerfully engage in body shaming targeting men. There's no complex reasons there - they simply hate fat men but want privileges for themselves. But there are no women i have ever met in eating disorder rehab/the wide world of internet eating disorder/body acceptance communities that has said they want men to be fat or unhealthy or unwelcome. That's a pretty low bar you've set fo…
/r/PurplePillDebate02/05/21 02:06 PM
5

But only obese men are disadvantaged.
/r/PurplePillDebate02/05/21 02:04 PM
1

Why do you think the rise in never-marrieds is driven by men opting not to marry?
/r/PurplePillDebate02/05/21 01:59 PM
3

There's going to be horrible irony if you guys end up with a society where A LOT of old folks are never married, yet still staunchly insist on catering to couples over everything else. I can absolutely see American moving in that direction and the repercussions of that would both tragic and hilarious.
/r/PurplePillDebate02/05/21 01:59 PM
2

Have you ever seen those subs? Those are all women who get plenty of options. Literally every 'lonely women' sub has a rule against asking members out because that's not what they want - they get asked out plenty. I could never forget that time when a woman on r/FA30plus made a post to the tune of 'Men are thrash, I bet none of you would date me', then rejected a guy who offered to date her because he lived a 30 minute drive away from her Even the least attractive, heavily disfigured and/or disa…
/r/PurplePillDebate02/05/21 03:22 AM
2

(not ugly either just average) I mean, women say that about AAA movie stars like Chris Hemsworth and Chris Pratt too so it's a bit of a meaningless evaluation.
/r/PurplePillDebate02/05/21 03:15 AM
5

Dating is easier for men in their 30s. lol I fucking wish
/r/PurplePillDebate01/05/21 05:05 PM
3

Oh, that makes sense. Thanks.
/r/PurplePillDebate01/05/21 02:47 PM
2

This is what facilitates my cougar behavior. I'm confused. "This" is what exactly?
/r/PurplePillDebate01/05/21 02:36 PM
76

Male dating issues are relatively consistent across the age groups so there is less need for men to look beyond the "default" dating sub. Wow, I never thought of it this way.
/r/PurplePillDebate01/05/21 02:02 PM
2

Out of curiosity, what foreign country?
/r/PurplePillDebate01/05/21 01:07 PM
2

I think pretty much everyone eventually got married although I'm obviously not keeping track.
/r/PurplePillDebate01/05/21 11:20 AM
8

You do realize that not everyone in the world is a middle class white American, right?
/r/PurplePillDebate01/05/21 11:07 AM
9

I have some friends who went that way. They believed they couldn't find any better - be it because they thought they weren't attractive enough or that women are just all like that. And the reasons they chose that over being alone are also understandable - it's two more or less equally shitty options anyway, so no surprise that some individuals would pick one over the other.
/r/PurplePillDebate01/05/21 11:06 AM
3

...no, I'm not. I just pointed out that the research is dishonest.
/r/PurplePillDebate01/05/21 10:58 AM
5

For the majority of the time, yeah.
/r/PurplePillDebate01/05/21 10:43 AM
7

When we were in our twenties it was common for the really attractive people to have several lovers simultaneously, usually in the form of one boyfriend\girlfriend and a number of FWBs, lovers, mistresses and the like. Hell, me and my peers are now in our late thirties and even now I know at least one woman who is married to a betabux but still sleeps with her long-term megachad lover. I can't imagine the current generation of twenty-somethings is that much more chaste.
/r/PurplePillDebate01/05/21 09:40 AM
4

How so what?
/r/PurplePillDebate01/05/21 09:11 AM
1

What exactly are you trying to argue?
/r/PurplePillDebate01/05/21 08:13 AM
1

Most incels are functional too. So let's say vets and incels are on about the same level. We good?
/r/PurplePillDebate01/05/21 06:36 AM
2

Men are better off for that brief moment between recieving their income and sending part of it to the ex as alimony and child support. It's extremely telling that all "research" focusing on well being after divorce chooses not to take alimony and child support into account.
/r/PurplePillDebate01/05/21 05:36 AM
10

Your heart is in the right place, but IMO you're being a bit too optimistic. Take the legal framework out of marriage and what you get is harems, harems everywhere. They're already common, but why accelerate a bad thing?
/r/PurplePillDebate01/05/21 05:33 AM
1

You're also clearly biased to see vets in a positive light, so I say that's just your wishful thinking talking.
/r/PurplePillDebate01/05/21 04:20 AM
2

No dude, that's just a coput. I've met American vets and they're absolutely the same as Soviet/Russian vets. Besides, if you have to be a highly trained professional warrior to not become a quivering piece of shit after experiencing war, then the OP's argument goes out the window either way.
/r/PurplePillDebate01/05/21 03:13 AM
1

Say what? Based on what? I'm Russian. Half the men in Russia are WW2/Afghan/Chechnya vets and almost all of them are a drain on society for exactly the reasons I describe - they can't/won't carry their own weight, can't handle basic adult shit, break down at the slightest stress and constantly demand privileges everywhere they go. Been to war, not the place, the actual conflict? You sound exactly like those same vets when I call them out for their shit. I get that war is hard and I sympathize wi…
/r/PurplePillDebate01/05/21 02:01 AM
1

Counterpoint: few men are as weak and fragile as those who have gone to war. Oh boy, you're skipping work today and I have to pick up your shit because a car without a muffler gave you PTSD flashbacks? Such strong, much hard times. That you think war makes men stoic shows that you're getting your information from comic books, which is fairly typical for an AMerican. War doesn't make men stoic. War makes them fragile entitled crybabies.
/r/PurplePillDebate01/05/21 01:40 AM
1

LVMs aren't overestimating themselves by being outraged at unfair treatment.
/r/PurplePillDebate01/05/21 01:22 AM
7

Which explains why most women treat being male as some sort of original sin.
/r/PurplePillDebate01/05/21 01:20 AM
4

And what will change then?
/r/PurplePillDebate30/04/21 05:28 PM
34

Worst sin a man can commit is being unattractive.
/r/PurplePillDebate30/04/21 05:27 PM
1

OP's question isn't "Do women get random $3000 offers from strangers" Case closed.
/r/PurplePillDebate30/04/21 02:24 PM
2

She never replied to any of them to my knowledge so it never went as far as discussing actual sums.
/r/PurplePillDebate30/04/21 02:06 PM
3

The women who get those kinds of offers have IG as a career. Not true. Any decently attractive woman gets those offers occasionally. My ex would show me the cringy shit guys would sometimes send her on instagram and other social media.
/r/PurplePillDebate30/04/21 07:54 AM
1

Policy changes are preceded by something else first.
/r/PurplePillDebate30/04/21 02:08 AM
1

I don't need you to believe me lol. You know you lied.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/04/21 04:01 PM
1

Dude, I dont understand your problem. My problem with you in this thread is that you are a hypocrite who misrepresented her point of view and outright lied. I get that you think I'm being too harsh or that you're somehow special and need to be given more leeway, but tough shit honey.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/04/21 01:46 PM
2

Uh-huh. And average men are also a minority.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/04/21 10:11 AM
3

I promise I'm not like the other girls, but I won't guarantee I don't act like then. You're like the other girls.
/r/PurplePillDebate28/04/21 08:15 AM
1

which makes me think you are using that word as a proxy for something else No, it's your insecurity that makes you think that way. Anything to save face in the eyes of some random internet person. I did meet you halfway, because I do think married men can get more work lol
/r/PurplePillDebate28/04/21 04:01 AM
1

It sucks that you don't want to have a genuine conversation with me though I understand. I've spoken with enough people like you to know that it genuinely frustrates you to have your hypocrisy called out. But don't make it my responsibility - you chose to act that way instead of meeting me halfway like an actual genuine conversation would require. The only one to blame for your frustration is you yourself.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/04/21 03:50 PM
1

That's it, myth busted. Since middle eastern employers hiring foreign workers (claim to) favor unmarried candidates, we can safely conclude that there's no stigma against older unmarried men in the workplace.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/04/21 03:47 PM
1

what do you mean I initially lied That you lied. I'm not going to point out to you where you fucked up because that might help you learn to lie better in the future.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/04/21 02:36 PM
1

I don't think this happens in the workplace And that's exactly why you give off the impression. You don't know either way, but when someone talks about it, your reaction is to deny. By the way, the fact that you initially lied about your point of view only goes further to reinforce that you're coming from a place of negativity and hatred.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/04/21 02:20 PM
1

Lmao I have seen a fair amount of incel content on reddit Oh, on a platform that hasn't allowed any incel content since... lemme check... 2018 was it? Sure, you've seen incel content honey. it is absolutely down to straight women to decide whether or not they think these guys would make good partners No, it's not lol. If an incel ever gets a partner, that partner would have the exclusive right and ability to say whether or not he's a good partner. You seem confused lol Now can you explain what p…
/r/PurplePillDebate27/04/21 10:45 AM
1

Of course you can. You just demonstrated that you have an unrealistic view of what average attractiveness is.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/04/21 10:43 AM
1

I had looked at some of their content in the past Such as? Where? By whom? No, you haven't looked at any incel content. You've looked at content about incels and have never talked with one, unless we count me. Sorry honey, having spent over a decade in various incel communities and interacted with numerous members from all over the world, I'll reseve the authority to judge their character for myself rather than surrender it to someone who is ignorant and hateful like you.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/04/21 09:57 AM
1

All of them are average/below average looking imo for the ages that they are. And there goes what little credibility you had.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/04/21 09:55 AM
1

That's far too vague. Every incel community I've been a member of has been very diverse. If I had to generalize like that, I'd say yeah, most of those guys would probably make fine partners. Though it's also true that this is usually said about most abusers too. The reality is that no matter how well you know a person, it's hard to gauge how they'll behave in a relationship.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/04/21 09:42 AM
1

I'll put my money on your standards mellowing out in time. There's a reason why all older single men are those who couldn't get any partner and not those who held out for a perfect one.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/04/21 08:23 AM
2

For all the brutal standards of Japanese women, Japan is also betabuxland. Turning into that would arguably be an improvement for modern day USA
/r/PurplePillDebate27/04/21 08:20 AM
1

Young women have left the internet, but also half of all the couples meet online. Lol
/r/PurplePillDebate27/04/21 08:15 AM
1

Hot take: the mods should ban "I don't care" responses too discussion threads.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/04/21 08:13 AM
1

You give off the impression that denying the disadvantages faced by single men is an ideological thing to you.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/04/21 05:41 AM
1

Anything past 30, really. Before getting married I got a taste of being the only single guy in my 30+ social circle and the isolation that came with was very sobering. Now I'm closer to 40 and single again, looking at living out the rest of my life single, and it's scary in a different manner - like sometimes I worry about having a stroke and waking up paralyzed or something. I know it's too early for that, but I've seen strokes claim so many of my relatives that it's hard not to think about it.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/04/21 05:40 AM
1

Being single at an older age can be a pretty scary experience.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/04/21 02:56 AM
3

Why do women and their allies so vehemently demand that people stop caring and talking about hypergamy? The answer to my question is the answer to your question as well. On a separate topic: Some guys will be virgins forever. You might as well accept it Do you even know any of the ways that society punishes men for failing to be attractive? Do you even know what you're telling men to accept? No, you don't.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/04/21 02:52 AM
1

I'm gonna say you're lying.
/r/PurplePillDebate27/04/21 02:23 AM
1

He's 48 years old lol Obviously not unattractive and might not be an abuser either He's 47 years old He's 52 years old He's 52 years old He's 55 years old and not unattractive even at that age I get the point you're trying to make. Your point is badly hurt by the fact that you had to really dig for data, and even with that digging all you were able to come up with is that. Also, just to add insult to your injury: I had a coworker who was (and AFAIK still is) abused by her Megachad boyfriend - he…
/r/PurplePillDebate26/04/21 04:46 PM
1

Which guys?
/r/PurplePillDebate26/04/21 04:36 PM
1

I just told you what my source is.
/r/PurplePillDebate26/04/21 04:35 PM
1

married men tend to work more hours This is also a factor in the discrimination I described - in workplaces where overtime pay exists, tasks that require it tend to get assigned to those with families over those without.
/r/PurplePillDebate26/04/21 03:10 PM
1

No, I don't have a source for it. I am (was) an employer myself so it was something pretty obviously present in the professional field. Never felt the need to look up research about it, but feel free to do so if you need sources, that's understandable. I couldn't find anything where people are getting paid less JUST because they aren't married? What do you mean "JUST"? Sure, there are 'reasons' - unmarried older men are stereotyped as unreliable and less skilled or as poor team players. They're …
/r/PurplePillDebate26/04/21 02:16 PM
3

100% can relate. It often feels like my experiences with doing something inappropriate are much, much more negative than other people's. The average person can do or say something inappropriate and it will promptly be forgotten, but if it's me, people either drag it out, remind me of it constantly and repeatedly punish me for it, or they just reject me and cut me off. When I talked this out with my therapist, it really felt bizarre just how different our experiences are with making someone angry…
/r/PurplePillDebate26/04/21 12:38 PM
1

I'm not an incel, dumbass. So, what beliefs?
/r/PurplePillDebate26/04/21 12:23 AM
1

Citation needed
/r/PurplePillDebate26/04/21 12:21 AM
2

An incel by definition can't abuse a partner lol. What are you smoking?
/r/PurplePillDebate26/04/21 12:21 AM
1

I literally said outside of work and you're trying to counter with examples from your workplace. Though even in that context, I've had socially r-worded women even at work go out of their way to avoid me and/or let me know they find my presence offensive, to the point of affecting the job process. It was thankfully infrequent, but it did happen. I'm sure there are men who you think are too ugly to date, who are still dating and marrying, but the ability of a man to do so it's not dependent on wh…
/r/PurplePillDebate25/04/21 06:05 AM
2

The problem is that you're explaining YOUR reasons for going mgtow, while she's demanding a reason that she will judge as good enough.
/r/PurplePillDebate25/04/21 05:15 AM
4

That would be like joining a support group for leg amputees because you don't like walking very much.
/r/PurplePillDebate25/04/21 05:00 AM
1

Probably yes. Women tend to act shitty towards men they don't find attractive, so friendly behaviour is indeed a somewhat reliable sign of attraction. It would be much less of a problem if women stopped thinking of friendliness and politeness as a reward for sexiness.
/r/PurplePillDebate25/04/21 03:22 AM
1

What beliefs?
/r/PurplePillDebate25/04/21 01:18 AM
1

That's because almost every female member of this sub considers her relationship somehow special, when they're just typical. I'm an exception because I was an incel until meeting my ex, and I'm for all intents and purposes still an incel after dating, marrying and divorcing her - other women still treat me like a leper.
/r/PurplePillDebate24/04/21 05:14 PM
2

How many? And what even constitutes an exception to you? Mind, I'm almost 40 and have been in exactly one relationship, and not for lack of trying. Except for that one woman, no other women have ever been attracted to me or have given me a chance.
/r/PurplePillDebate24/04/21 03:06 PM
1

she probably does desire him at least at first What makes that probable? It's a hugely important premise that needs to be proven before we accept it. Men usually leave their sick/dying wives Men leave their sick spouses more often than women, not usually. It's telling that this particular bit of research transformed inside your head exactly the way it did - shows that you have an agenda. Married women are usually less happy and have worse quality of life/shorter lifespans, whereas for men it's t…
/r/PurplePillDebate24/04/21 12:40 PM
12

I don't tell them but I do silently judge them.
/r/PurplePillDebate24/04/21 11:43 AM
2

And do those benefits outweigh the negatives? Sex Betabux men get sex only a limited number of times, and it's forced. I doubt most betabuxers enter those arrangements aware of that. On a purely pragmatic level it's much cheaper to pay sex workers for about the same amount of sex. longer life Debatable. Married men live longer, but do betabuxers live longer? There's the benefit of having an ambulance called for you if you have a stroke or something, but there are also the stresses of having a fa…
/r/PurplePillDebate24/04/21 11:42 AM
3

There is one paper and the author itself later published a follow up showing his previous analysis had been wrong.
/r/PurplePillDebate24/04/21 09:48 AM
3

Aside from avoiding the punishments that society metes out to older unmarried men, what benefits does the beta bux man enjoy? Because if there are none, then it seems a bit like a racket, doesn't it.
/r/PurplePillDebate24/04/21 07:38 AM
2

Because the man in the picture is visibly dangerous and not just fat and ugly. You live in dreamworld if you think sex workers don't screen for attractiveness.
/r/PurplePillDebate24/04/21 05:16 AM
10

Wolves don't have an alpha\beta hierarchy.
/r/PurplePillDebate24/04/21 03:10 AM
1

Yeah you do. All the fucking time.
/r/PurplePillDebate24/04/21 02:59 AM
4

The alphas are respected by betas because they look after the pack. Not just by protecting them, but by caring for the weakest of the pack. In what species?
/r/PurplePillDebate24/04/21 02:58 AM
4

tl;dr It's an approximation that works and is therefore useful and helpful.
/r/PurplePillDebate24/04/21 02:10 AM
2

I too, am an exception, my friend. We are exceptions exactly because there is a rule.
/r/PurplePillDebate23/04/21 03:49 PM
0

Your opinion is very important to us.
/r/PurplePillDebate23/04/21 03:46 PM
3

Sex workers already decline to serve unattractive clients though. This is literally the top post on the biggest sex worker sub right now. The OF model is about as far as this can go.
/r/PurplePillDebate23/04/21 05:47 AM
-1

The allegory falls apart because the fox in the story doesn't know that the grapes are sour, but the low quality of women and how dangerous relationships can be today are widely known things.
/r/PurplePillDebate23/04/21 05:44 AM
3

I'm pretty sure the only reason for this is the fact that married men work harder Even if it's true, it doesn't make it fair to value a man's work less just because he's unmarried. And knowledge that your work will be valued less is a pretty big deterrent to becoming a MGTOW. Who gives a fuck, I thought the point of going mgtow, was leaving society behind I think you're getting them confused with mythical hermits. Check out their sub - MGTOWs are generally pretty big on enjoying life outside of …
/r/PurplePillDebate23/04/21 03:39 AM
1

It's not normal for someone to be confused by your relationship with them It's not anybody's responsibility to make sure you're not confused. I'm sure you think it is, but that's just your entitlement talking.
/r/PurplePillDebate23/04/21 03:24 AM
4

What negative consequences will I face for being single? The list is pretty damn huge. Here's a couple off the top of my head: you'll hit a glass ceiling in your career; you'll pay higher taxes; you'll be seen as creepy; you'll find yourself increasingly unwelcome in more and more venues and situations.
/r/PurplePillDebate23/04/21 03:23 AM
4

Because becoming MGTOW is a pretty hard decision in modern society. First, it's lonely. On top of that there is huge stigma against being a single man, and that stigma grow as you get older. Plenty of men do choose that path, but it's a scary and difficult path, so it's unreasonable to expect more men to choose it.
/r/PurplePillDebate23/04/21 03:02 AM
1

If you lead someone on, that's immoral. Nobody's leading you on. You just want them to tell you what they plan to do with you in the future - they aren't obligated to tell you and it's unreasonable to expect them to. If you want to know - ask them. But you won't. I know why you won't. Do you know why you won't?
/r/PurplePillDebate23/04/21 02:55 AM
1

I was talking specifically about abuse What do you mean? You were saying that the bar is set low for men in Russia... but only for those men who abuse their partners? That makes no sense. I'm kind of curious how unattractive you are. I honestly don't know a guy who have never had a girlfriend Well see, I'm unattractive enough that most women don't want to interact with me outside of work. You don't know guys like me because you look at a guy like me and don't want to get to know him. Or what, ar…
/r/PurplePillDebate23/04/21 02:54 AM
2

the thing I see is that the threshold for when personality does tart to matter is at least reasonable Given how vehemently women deny the existence of that threshold, they themselves don't seem to think so.
/r/PurplePillDebate23/04/21 02:48 AM
5

No. Rather, women tend to only willingly interact with men they find attractive and a weaker initial attraction can still grow.
/r/PurplePillDebate23/04/21 02:47 AM
6

Attraction is subjective and flowy and can be attained through intimacy which itself requires attraction to happen.
/r/PurplePillDebate23/04/21 02:44 AM
3

You didn't class them as unattractive. You classed them as "not ideal, but hot enough to care about his ideas and personality"
/r/PurplePillDebate23/04/21 02:44 AM
1

Where the hell did I say that women are victims? You called my stance victim blaming, which implies that you see the women in question as victims. Now you're saying they're not? So am I or am I not engaging in victim blaming when I say that Russian women can't complain about bad men in their dating pool? People who settle down for shitty partners just settle down for whatever reasons including a generally low bar for one gender in their society There is only a low bar for attractive men though. …
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 03:33 PM
0

And you're here doing a classical victim blaming. Are you seriously saying that women are victims because there are too many bad men in their dating pool? As in, Russian women are entitled to a dating pool of men who are perfect gentlemen and because such a dating pool is not provided to them, they are victims? Are they victims because there's a need to vet partners instead of just jumping in bed with the first hot hunk? On second thought, you are a Russian woman and generally speaking this craz…
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 03:03 PM
2

Good point, but I think I'll stick with mine still. A woman who is financially dependent on an abusive partner and has children with him is a woman who chose to be with such a partner long enough to have children and become financially dependent.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 02:57 PM
2

Do I get it correctly that you think bad partners == attractive men? Of course not. I think that women choose men based on attractiveness which allows attractive men to be bad partners should they so choose. I'm unattractive and it doesn't matter whether I'm a good or bad partner since no woman would consider partnering up with me. Conversely, an attractive man will have an endless supply of women willing to pair up with him and bear with lazy or abusive behavior, so it also doesn't matter wheth…
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 02:54 PM
1

Let's put it like this then: Hot men are present in 100% of abusive heterosexual relationships in which the woman chooses to stay and bear with the abuse That would indeed represent my point of view fairly.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 02:25 PM
1

No, the problem is entirely in women's choice. Women are free to not date men with problematic attitudes, but instead of doing that they opt to go for attractive men who can afford to act any way they like, and then they complain that those men aren't good to them. If you want to make it about attitude, then the problematic attitude is women's belief that they are entitled to their dream relationship with their dream man.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 02:03 PM
1

That's good thinking.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 01:52 PM
1

Yeah, I do. I've only ever seen it applied to hot guys and have met several women who don't rationalize it and openly admit that they are fine being abused and/or being a mistress because the man is just that hot. This makes me seriously doubt that counter-examples exist at all, let alone that they're prevalent.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 01:41 PM
1

What do you mean?
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 01:39 PM
0

Yeah, I did. What exactly does it change?
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 01:38 PM
1

Men got spoiled Who would have spoiled the Russian men who are in their twenties and thirties now, including myself? Yet, Russian women still whine endlessly about how hard it is to find someone who isn't an abuser or an alcoholic. WW2 ended four generations ago so you can't blame that supposed shortage of decent men on that. In fact, there is no shortage of men, but there are plenty of men who struggle badly in the dating market in Russia - I am one. Just as is the case in any other country, th…
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 12:39 PM
1

Depending on where you are, that might preclude you from having a family, which many people do see as failure in life. For example, in Japan somwhere around 32 is the age beyond which an unmarried man is more likely to stay lifelong single than marry.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 12:23 PM
3

It’s illogical It's not. It's inductive reasoning. It could be wrong certainly, but it's impossible to tell.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 12:19 PM
3

It does seem that way if you treat it as a grudge held against you, but you have to understand that you are not, in fact, the center point of people's worldviews.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 12:17 PM
1

I didn't derail it. You just don't want to answer my question, I think. Because the truth is that you actually do not know, but it makes you uncomfortable to admit it. Yeah, you're free to not continue this conversation if it makes you uncomfortable.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 12:14 PM
1

No, let's go back to the topic of the thread. Do you know that most women who stay with abusive men aren't just rationalizing staying with them because they're hot?
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 11:59 AM
1

So you’re assuming i’m putting Aziz on that list because i have a bias against indian men? No, I think you're putting him on that list because you have unrealistic standards for male beauty AND because you have a bias against Indian men. The fact that you think your skin color somehow matters in this only shows that I was right in guessing you're an American lol Look, I'm not interested in discussing your friends' exes here. Do you still remember why you even brought them up? Let's go back to th…
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 11:29 AM
2

Uh, no. I knew her in college and she had several boyfriends during that time. How the hell would I know her one night stands\FWBs?
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 11:11 AM
1

do you genuinely think a man like Aziz would be considered “hot” irl ? Yes. Note - you're from the US, a country which has a huge cultural hatred of Indian men. Not every place on earth is like that. That's in addition to your clear bias in judging hot men as average. Are you trying to have an honest conversation or just say im wrong to validate your preconceived ideas? I'm still doing what I said I'm doing in a previous comment.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 11:09 AM
3

I don't think there are any average looking celebrities these days, especially male ones. My point stands - you are judging (yes, judging) men who are well above average, as merely average. Your assessment of your friends' boyfriends is probably similarly wrong.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 10:14 AM
3

No, you actually can't. Nobody has any obligation to plan out a future relationship and discuss it with you before you first have sex. Since there's no such obligation, you cannot expect that. On the other hand, it's absolutely normal for you to want to make future prospects clear before doing the deed, which is why it makes sense for you to bring that up. But we both know you'll never bring it up first. I also know why you won't. Do you know why you won't?
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 10:08 AM
1

African or European?
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 10:04 AM
3

You feel personally attacked.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 10:02 AM
4

but they're still not seen as attractive just because men are attracted to them Need I even say anything?
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 10:00 AM
3

You just wrote four paragraphs of text on a topic that you never even bothered to research beforehand. I'm not sure if that's impressive or disgusting. I have an avoidant attachment style. I've worked on it in therapy and by myself, and I know how to live with it in such a way that it will not adversely affect my life. I'm also unattractive and was an incel until well into my thirties, and even now most women find my appearance offputting and avoid me - something I'm certainly not to blame for.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 09:54 AM
2

Yeah, it can't have anything to do with the fact that catfishes and other similar scum target unattractive men all the time. Gotta be insecure attachment.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 09:50 AM
1

But I almost never see is stories about Avoidants, which I think is pretty common Where are you looking? Pretty much any online community dedicated to discussing attachment theory is 95% women talking about their "avoidant" boyfriends, crushes and FWBs. Avoidant pretty much just means a Chad who isn't into her at that point.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 09:48 AM
1

You know OP, I think this is literally the weirdest example of anglocentrism I've ever seen in my life. Good job.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 09:46 AM
1

Which again brings us to the question I asked you in the other thread - how would I determine my league? Pretty much no women are ever interested in anything I have to say, and most actively avoid or ignore me. Conversely, women with more severe physical and mental flaws are able to interest men who are way more attractive than I am. Based on that, what kinds of women are in my league exactly?
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 09:38 AM
3

In my experience the men who these women stay with aren’t “hot” Says the woman to whom a bunch of celebrity male models are 'average men' Thanks for reinforcing my point, I guess.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 09:35 AM
1

It's a cultural thing. In Russia older women are arguably far more vindictive than young ones.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 09:33 AM
1

That's an intuitive definition, but it's also pretty useless. The obese chronically ill girl I mentioned previously would, by that definition, be in my league. But she could consistently date fit, good looking, succesful men with whom I have no way to compete. So you just pretty much demolished the premise of your own OP - men who stay in their league are overlooked by women in their league, because the women can just go and date more attractive men.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 07:57 AM
4

Do you have many female friends and witnessed this? I went to a liberal arts college and have worked all my life in a female dominated field. So yes, I do have many female friends and yes, I have witnessed this. I have also met a number of women who did it and weren't ashamed of admitting it. In all cases, whether you’ve experienced something else, does not change my statement Yeah. I'm simply challenging the truthfulness of your statement - do you know that all those women aren't just rationali…
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 07:50 AM
2

I didn't ask about your dating history. I asked you what my league is.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 07:48 AM
4

What you know is that some of your friends dated men who you deemed to be unattractive. But that's not what I asked. And yeah, in my experience women do absolutely only get sad about hot guys.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 07:09 AM
10

So many girls out there stay in unhealthy relationships and genuinely think their boyfriends are good because “at least he doesn’t cheat” How many of those women genuinely think that instead of it just being a rationalization for a stupid desire to stay with a guy who's hot? You don't know, do you.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 06:51 AM
-2

That doesn't make sense though. You set the bar low for a minority of men, but prefer being alone to being with a man who is not quite as attractive. It honestly looks more like you can't let a hot chad get away.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 06:49 AM
7

But... why would terpers defend simping?
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 06:47 AM
2

Ugly self-made men pretty much don't exist because they are extremely rare and their success is a product of lucky breaks.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 06:45 AM
1

So you were compelled to date them simply because they asked you out? Wow, where do I find women like you?
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 06:44 AM
0

So it seems I don't talk to guys out of my league. It's funny how you're totally oblivious to the real importance of this fact.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 06:43 AM
6

Okay bro. I'm a very ugly man who struggles with weight, has a very androgynous appearance, and suffers from a mild skin condition. The least attractive woman I've met was morbidly obese to the point of having to skip class because she couldn't fit through the auditorium doors. She was also balding and suffered from epilepsy. AND she had an abrasive personality with a habit of starting fights over petty stuff. That woman dated men who were much more attractive than I am, and made it clear on sev…
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 06:41 AM
1

I'd figure out what I did wrong And what would that achieve?
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 06:35 AM
6

Holy shit. Is asktrp a bluepill sub?
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 06:34 AM
6

Ugly women are not any more likely to give ugly men a chance, so aiming for more attractive women is indeed the rational choice.
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 06:33 AM
1

Which is why ugly people of both genders have the same struggles, right? ...right?
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 06:32 AM
1

Hint: it's because of the shaming
/r/PurplePillDebate22/04/21 01:42 AM
2

Really? You don't see why?
/r/PurplePillDebate21/04/21 07:16 PM
2

Looks get you in the door, personality and looks keep you inside. FTFY. Better looking people are more likely to be given a chance AND more likely to be forgiven for any transgression, big or small.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/04/21 12:22 PM
2

Its so beyond clear that any female peer that says that is just attempting to stay moral So, lying. You just changed your own view midway through the post. Good job dude, quality content right there.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/04/21 12:20 PM
3

Weird place to start mental gymnastics but you do you bro.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/04/21 10:12 AM
7

No, the mindset "men have it easy" is global. The US is only unique in that the women choose to pretend they're not talking about only the top men.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/04/21 10:05 AM
3

That's wild. I extra'd in a few movies and if the staff told me to do something crazy like that I'd tell them to lick my balls. Unless I guess she was trying to break into fame from that or something.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/04/21 03:30 AM
-2

Pushes? These guys are choosing to do it.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/04/21 03:27 AM
12

No they’re talking men as a whole They are absolutely not. Outside the US this rhetoric explicitly excludes unattractive men.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/04/21 03:02 AM
21

It's 100% apex fallacy. Your question is only possible because American and European women are vehemnt in denying that they're only thinking and talking about the alphas. In Russia for example you will hear plenty of similar talk from women, but if you point out that less attractive men can struggle badly, you'll get replies to the tune of 'who cares' and 'those aren't men' The same is true for Japanese women.
/r/PurplePillDebate21/04/21 02:59 AM
2

Implying bananas are not resources.
/r/PurplePillDebate20/04/21 07:01 AM
1

Huh. How does any of that debunk hepergamy?
/r/PurplePillDebate20/04/21 06:58 AM
1

By all reasonable predictions, I should have been a lifelong incel. Instead I managed to bump into that one unicorn, marry her and then divorce. So yeah, as far realising my potential goes, I think I did very good.
/r/PurplePillDebate20/04/21 06:39 AM
10

9 out of 10 awkward situations I get in, it's the woman making it awkward. And she's doing it because of my appearance
/r/PurplePillDebate20/04/21 05:33 AM
1

This man uglys
/r/PurplePillDebate19/04/21 11:00 AM
0

Agree. I'm very unattractive and while the lack of attractiveness has always prevented me from getting into social circles, the ones I did get into were mixed. Not that being in mixed social circles helps you find a partner when you're an unattractive guy.
/r/PurplePillDebate19/04/21 10:59 AM
1

Russia, though I've been living in Japan for some years now.
/r/PurplePillDebate19/04/21 10:55 AM
2

Yes.
/r/PurplePillDebate19/04/21 01:51 AM
10

Complaining won't do anything Then why are you complaining about people complaining?
/r/PurplePillDebate18/04/21 03:51 PM
5

I've never ever had a meal as a first date, not once. You find a pub and you drink and talk. I've never had a woman agree to go out for drinks with me as a first date. Have some perspective lol
/r/PurplePillDebate18/04/21 03:43 PM
1

Yes it can. You're full of shit lol
/r/PurplePillDebate18/04/21 02:16 AM
6

Let's say nothing. And?
/r/PurplePillDebate18/04/21 02:13 AM
8

Neither do women
/r/PurplePillDebate17/04/21 08:44 AM
28

Because you're not unable to get laid. You're unable to get laid with attractive high status men. When you pretend that you can't find a guy, you're dehumanising all the men you're rejecting. Others not playing along is normal - if you were make they still wouldn't.
/r/PurplePillDebate17/04/21 08:43 AM
29

Which is why there are swathes of ugly women condemned to be single all their lives, while ugly men easily find partners, right?
/r/PurplePillDebate17/04/21 08:40 AM
18

Expected? How? Are people surprised when you're older than 21 and look it? No. Do they punish you for that? No. So where's the expectation? Where's the pressure?
/r/PurplePillDebate17/04/21 08:39 AM
0

It's actually 26.36646. Did you not do the math?
/r/PurplePillDebate17/04/21 12:36 AM
1

educated upper middle class Which is a small minority, no?
/r/PurplePillDebate16/04/21 11:19 AM
2

The only woman I've ever been with certainly saw me as providing a lot of value in our relationship. Well, until she met that other woman lol Based on just that, I like to think that I'm not a terrible partner and can function pretty well in a relationship when given the chance to. The problem is that nobody else wants to give me that chance because I have the ugleh.
/r/PurplePillDebate16/04/21 08:27 AM
6

Men have realistic standards and then are forced to drop them further because the stigma against being single makes them deathly scared of, well, being single.
/r/PurplePillDebate16/04/21 04:10 AM
2

I said most things are done out of self-preservation No, that's not what you originally said. At this point you've taken to misrepresenting your opinion that I initially replied to, which means you recognize just how harebrained wrong it is. Good job.
/r/PurplePillDebate13/04/21 04:57 AM
2

I think you've lost your original point somewhere along the way. Care to take a few steps back and pick it up again?
/r/PurplePillDebate13/04/21 04:30 AM
3

you’re not disadvantaged by not being anyone’s catch Yeah, you are. If you're not anyone's catch you might end up not being in a relationship at all, and single men are heavily disadvantaged.
/r/PurplePillDebate13/04/21 04:08 AM
2

So much wisdom in this comment. It's incredible how you normies get endless opportunities to try and make your relationships work and then just... don't do that.
/r/PurplePillDebate13/04/21 04:07 AM
3

there's still an underlying reason for it How so? The desire to live better generally doesn't require an "underlying reason", especially when one's daily life is not very enjoyable.
/r/PurplePillDebate13/04/21 04:05 AM
3

Son, you're probably young enough to be my actual son, so I'm not even going to address your silly advice. It's wrong. If you're lucky, you'll never find out why. The point is, casual interactions with women in my life are overwhelmingly negative - women don't like me, refuse to give me the time of day and just completely stonewall me. But I also know what it's like to be loved - there's a happy, if short-lived, marriage in my past. I'd absolutely communicate with an AI to reproduce even a fract…
/r/PurplePillDebate13/04/21 03:22 AM
5

I'd talk to something like that simply because 95% of women refuse to talk to me at all. Between constantly getting ignored and brushed off, it's simply the more attractive option. And I'm by far not the only man in this situation - plenty others have no options except 'siri' Then I suppose there are also people who can intract with others ok but who would simply prefer the experience of talking with an AI for whatever reason.
/r/PurplePillDebate13/04/21 02:50 AM
1

I just want to find a way to make sure privacy will be protected/ not for sale. No way other than strict regulation. But that would be communism, eh.
/r/PurplePillDebate13/04/21 02:46 AM
3

Plenty of reasons other than being afraid bruh
/r/PurplePillDebate13/04/21 02:45 AM
1

Ads are already tailored to us Hilariously badly. I mean, would the robot wife go "Honey, you just bought a chair - why don't we buy a few dozen more? This home is so chairless"? I guess that could kinda work as a 'ditzy girl' sort of appeal, but not everyone goes for that.
/r/PurplePillDebate13/04/21 02:43 AM
4

There's no threat. Kind of like how prostitution is no threat. So, lots of women feeling threatened, screeching and working tirelessly to get it banned? Sure sounds like a threat.
/r/PurplePillDebate13/04/21 02:41 AM
11

Comes down to how it's marketed. Anime waifu culture successfully won women over in Japan to the point that the female market for escapist anime stuff is bigger than the male one. There's nothing stopping western corporations winning over western women the same way. Though given the fuck-the-client trends in western marketing I'm not holding my breath lol
/r/PurplePillDebate13/04/21 02:35 AM
2

What you describe is the experience of an attractive man. A horny guy in your position would do just as well. Don't break your back with all the patting.
/r/PurplePillDebate12/04/21 01:41 AM
8

They don't care who you're trying or not trying to date. You're a newcomer and unwelcome, that's it.
/r/PurplePillDebate11/04/21 03:45 AM
3

You know full well what an asinine argument that is.
/r/PurplePillDebate10/04/21 07:22 AM
3

What do? Have realistic standards?
/r/PurplePillDebate10/04/21 07:18 AM
6

The research specifically looks at income prior to paying child and spousal support. It's dishonest.
/r/PurplePillDebate10/04/21 06:18 AM
1

Was BB ever as dangerous for the man as it is nowadays?
/r/PurplePillDebate10/04/21 06:17 AM
2

Marriage is out of reach for unattractive men and presents little advantage to the attractive men, so it makes sense that men in relationships are less inclined to marry.
/r/PurplePillDebate10/04/21 06:16 AM
6

My mother abused my father horribly because she settled for him and hated him for not being her dream man. Is that supposed too be normal?
/r/PurplePillDebate10/04/21 06:11 AM
8

Because we're vilified and punished for failing to attract women. If it's our obligation to be attractive to women, then women are obligated to have realistic standards that give all men a fighting chance. As it stands women disqualify huge chunks of men for things they can't fix and those then have to bear all the penalties.
/r/PurplePillDebate10/04/21 05:57 AM
1

The only woman I know who reads that stuff AND writes fan fiction of it is definitely not a 'beta girl'
/r/PurplePillDebate10/04/21 05:53 AM
2

Women get this stigma too Lol, what do you 'get'? You don't get passed over for promotion. You don't get treated as second class in business. You don't get banned from venues. You aren't discriminated against by landlords. You don't 'get' anything but some imaginary expectation that is never expressed neither explicitly nor implicitly.
/r/PurplePillDebate10/04/21 02:17 AM
7

those who don’t are suspect in many ways How so?
/r/PurplePillDebate10/04/21 02:15 AM
4

Given the fact that women almost never message first, the data says the the opposite of what you think it says.
/r/PurplePillDebate09/04/21 06:17 AM
3

I bet you anything that 99% of the people answering 'hell no' here are living the life script.
/r/PurplePillDebate08/04/21 09:12 AM
1

My point is that thirst is by far not the only reason men desperately pursue women.
/r/PurplePillDebate06/04/21 09:58 AM
1

Incels are deplatformed everywhere they go.
/r/PurplePillDebate06/04/21 07:01 AM
0

Now you want it you can find hundreds or thousands who agree. Incels beg to disagree lol
/r/PurplePillDebate06/04/21 06:42 AM
2

Making men's sexuality like women's would not remove the pressure on men to be paired up. Plenty of men are not sex-crazed monsters who cannot bear being single - they're still desperate to find a partner because there are tangible penalties for not having one.
/r/PurplePillDebate06/04/21 06:41 AM
1

I dislike them because I'm bitter, I fully admit it. I've struggled with weight all my life and have been penalised for it when I was overweight. Fat girls experience none of that.
/r/PurplePillDebate06/04/21 04:15 AM
21

That's a huge conclusion to make based on observing one interaction between two people you don't even know.
/r/PurplePillDebate05/04/21 03:03 PM
2

I'd argue that was PUAs - they're the ones that actually took money from unsuccessful men. Terpers are more of a circlejerk than a scam.
/r/PurplePillDebate05/04/21 01:47 AM
2

Can't exactly hire a maid to overtime for you at work though.
/r/PurplePillDebate05/04/21 12:14 AM
-1

You're not calling out any hypocrisy, you're just making excuses for women. Note, the fact that you feel excuses are even warranted means you believe women's behavior is worthy of condemnation.
/r/PurplePillDebate04/04/21 11:58 PM
3

So... it seems like you agree with me... in disagreeing with your previous comment?
/r/PurplePillDebate04/04/21 02:23 PM
29

you can't be surprised You can, actually. Most such men reasonably expect that when family responsibilities take over, the wife will not expect him to balance that with running off to conquer karate gym or some other 'ambitious' stuff like that. But the wife does, actually. She wants him to magically have the time AND energy to both be a husband and father and go on exciting adventures as the superhero that she was attracted to in the first place.
/r/PurplePillDebate04/04/21 01:45 PM
7

lol he read you like a book and you're salty about it
/r/PurplePillDebate04/04/21 12:50 PM
1

feminine fashionable men They're masculine though.
/r/PurplePillDebate04/04/21 11:54 AM
14

things that actually matter Like doing more work for your boss?
/r/PurplePillDebate04/04/21 11:47 AM
0

What do you mean 'allowed'? HVMs are already allowed to do that, it's no like infidelity is illegal.
/r/PurplePillDebate04/04/21 08:17 AM
1

There's no reason to marry a woman and/or have kids then cheat on her. Tax breaks and social status. Being single past a certain age is a social faux pas regardless of a man's 'value' and marrying someone lets an HVM avoid that.
/r/PurplePillDebate04/04/21 08:15 AM
1

Perfect analogy really! There's also the fact that male fashion only ever functions to complement an already attractive appearance, which is just like the red pill - it works only for guys who are already attractive!
/r/PurplePillDebate04/04/21 08:13 AM
1

How would you keep yourself fed? Keep the lights on?
/r/PurplePillDebate04/04/21 08:08 AM
11

The only choice that could possibly make a difference for my life would be becoming gay. Perhaps if I were gay I'd have a better chance of not having to live out the rest of my days alone. But on the other hand, I've heard that looks competition is pretty brutal among gay men, so maybe not. Also: LOL at all the emotional "I'd change nothing replies" You guys berate incels for making an identity out of a lack of sex, but now you go and show that your sexual preferences are such a huge part of you…
/r/PurplePillDebate04/04/21 08:05 AM
3

Most men don’t have anything in their bios [citation needed] There also services other than Tinder.
/r/PurplePillDebate04/04/21 05:46 AM
2

Because it’s based entirely on looks It literally isn't.
/r/PurplePillDebate04/04/21 05:40 AM
2

The proof is in the fact that you only believe what you believe No, that's not proof at all. You don't know anything. You're just repeating shit you believe to be true because it makes you feel better to believe that.
/r/PurplePillDebate04/04/21 05:32 AM
2

Got any proof?
/r/PurplePillDebate04/04/21 03:55 AM
3

It’s not wishful thinking, it’s the truth. You wish, but you have nothing to back it up except your own strong desire for it to be true.
/r/PurplePillDebate04/04/21 03:13 AM
2

most insecure people vastly overestimate how ugly they are while drowning in their misery of it, and walk into situations already lacking any self confidence or feelings of self worth, and they drip with self doubt Got a source to back that up or is that just some good old wishful thinking? In any case, even if you were right (which you aren't) this assumes I'm insecure. I'm not. I'm just that proverbial '1-3 on the ugly scale' and all it took to get me there is an ugly face and some minor skin …
/r/PurplePillDebate04/04/21 02:52 AM
3

“your face looking like you just got stung by 1000 bees and you’re deathly allergic” It takes much less than that to be completely disqualified though. I have no disfigurations but I'm still ugly enough that most women refuse to even talk to me in a casual setting. You're underestimating just how harsh women judge men's appearance.
/r/PurplePillDebate04/04/21 02:33 AM
10

All of those women would be abstaining from sex by choice. Very few of the men would.
/r/PurplePillDebate04/04/21 02:27 AM
1

Cooking classes, book clubs, hiking clubs, horse riding And of course you've done research on how those events work around the world and how welcoming they are of single older men, right? No, of course you haven't. Otherwise you'd know that more often than not those venues are explicitly for families or young people only, and even when they aren't they still don't welcome older men, especially not single ones. Like I said, do your research before replying. It's easy enough to guess what you thin…
/r/PurplePillDebate03/04/21 01:57 AM
1

Go out and meet people to make friends How? Where? What are some ways that an older single man could reliable utilize to make friends and make lasting connections? I get that you think it should be easy to just 'go out' and 'make friends' but it betrays your lack of perspective. Next time instead of replying how you think things should be, take the time instead to research how they really are before replying.
/r/PurplePillDebate03/04/21 01:31 AM
2

the study was not looking at how a person's actions are evaluated That would mean that 'MI' is something that directly compels people to mate with the person exhibiting it, which is simply ridiculous. Or... do you seriously believe that? No, physical attractiveness is not even part of the study so I don't know why you keep bringing it up. You do know - I already explained that to you. Your refusal to acknowledge or adress that explanation shows that you are arguing in bad faith. I knew that was …
/r/BlackPillScience02/04/21 05:14 PM
6

Actually, the theoretical basis seems pretty solid to me, although I admit psychology is not my field. The sample being college students is pretty common too - it's not exactly unfair to assume they're more or less representative of the general population as long as the sample is large enough, which it seems to be. You could level all kinds of criticism on the papers, but frankly my only beef is that it doesn't control for appearance. I think it's the only truly major flaw, but also a fatal one.
/r/BlackPillScience02/04/21 04:59 PM
7

Yes, that is generally the case for new theories. ...this is your brain on doing social sciences in America. Sorry, but no, real scientists are not driven by a desire to prove a political talking point true.
/r/BlackPillScience02/04/21 04:55 PM
2

You don't have to include every variable in every study. This isn't 'every variable' - this is a factor that is widely known to have a very strong effect on the dependent variable being explored here. The idea is that, across a sample with large enough statistical power, variables that you are not measuring (roughly) average out across participants. So? Even if we assume that the attractiveness of the subjects matches a normal distribution, that does not justify leaving it out of the analysis wh…
/r/BlackPillScience02/04/21 04:54 PM
3

Why would a journal, run by a collection of academics, not have a review process? Because they want publications. Every academic field has a small number of top journals with a very severe and involved review process, and a bunch of others where the review if more of a formality. It might blow your mind, but journals may even have no formal review process at all. is it necessary for you to shoehorn physical attractiveness into every conversation about mating success? Yes, because it's a factor t…
/r/BlackPillScience02/04/21 02:51 PM
1

Things like maintaining friend and/or family relationships Okay. What knowledge does it take to maintain family and friend relationships when one's family dies and one's friends are unavailable because they are busy with family life? Finding happiness outside of a relationship requires there to be venues for that. I'd argue that in modern society there aren't such venues - there's no reliable strategy for older singles to remain socially active, it's purely luck based.
/r/PurplePillDebate02/04/21 12:45 PM
1

Too mild smh
/r/PurplePillDebate02/04/21 06:50 AM
3

There's no incel women is there.
/r/PurplePillDebate02/04/21 05:17 AM
1

...I just told you the exact opposite. In professional settings people who know what I look like tend to just brush me off or dismiss my input regardless of what role I occupy. Being in a leadership role just makes that marginally easier to avoid because I have some power to put my input into the mouth of someone who isn't as bad looking.
/r/PurplePillDebate02/04/21 03:57 AM
4

Low effort.
/r/PurplePillDebate02/04/21 03:34 AM
2

I appreciate your gesture, but you're probably being a bit too generous towards me here lol
/r/PurplePillDebate02/04/21 03:32 AM
1

Lol, getting salty because you can't answer a simple question.
/r/PurplePillDebate02/04/21 03:31 AM
1

Could you rewrite that in intelligible English?
/r/PurplePillDebate02/04/21 03:27 AM
1

It's a chronic problem in my life from way, waaay before I was old or competent enough to be in any sort of leadership role. If anything, being in a leadership role mitigates it because it allows me to delegate things to others, thus removing my appearance from the equation.
/r/PurplePillDebate02/04/21 03:26 AM
1

What's the point of having a high salary if it just gets eaten up by rent and groceries?
/r/PurplePillDebate02/04/21 02:32 AM
16

The really surprising part is that this passed review at all, although the journal might not have a review process in place at all for all we know. It's obvious that if appearance were controlled for there'd be covariance issues precluding the kind of interpretation that the author and OP are making. Given the plentiful literature on that, it's also likely that the author opted to exclude appearance intentionally, because the goal of the "research" was to promote a viewpoint.
/r/BlackPillScience02/04/21 02:15 AM
3

What the hell is 'statistical nature' If there's data, you can easily demonstrate the validit of your claim. If there's no data, then your claim lacks substance and I can easily dismiss it as either: 1) You choosing to associate with rude people and/or 2) You having a bias against ugly men and judging them more harshly
/r/PurplePillDebate01/04/21 02:53 PM
1

And if you would go ahead and just pop the following into google “assertive women called bitches at work” I'll get numerous accounts from women who have been called bitches. Why do you assume they're not bitches? I don't believe for a second that this specific type of misogyny is somehow widespread specifically in your field, but even if it is, it just means that your professional field is toxic.
/r/PurplePillDebate01/04/21 02:51 PM
1

People who act dominant will always try to challenge Note how I said nothing about challenges. Re-read the comment you're replying to please.
/r/PurplePillDebate01/04/21 02:50 PM
0

Honey, I don't give a fuck about your lived experience. You said that assertive women are called bitches. That's not true. Even if I extend maximum generosity to you and believe that you had a bad experience with being called a bitch without being one, that still doesn't make your statement true.
/r/PurplePillDebate01/04/21 01:14 PM
1

But non assertive men still get further in the business and corporate world than assertive women, it's called the old boys club. I'm a boy and I've been feeling pretty old lately. Would love some help getting further with my business. Where do I join?
/r/PurplePillDebate01/04/21 01:02 PM
-1

Assertive women are called bitches No, bitches are called bitches. You can be assertive without being a bitch. Source: my ex-wife is involved in my business, is assertive and no one considers her a bitch.
/r/PurplePillDebate01/04/21 01:01 PM
5

More like because they don't appear confident in themselves. Why exactly is this likely? I suffer from this problem a lot - people often (but ONLY when they've met me in person) refuse to take me seriously and accept that I'm competent - to the point that I've often had to put opininons and offers in the mouth of my better looking partners to get my way. I've never had someone mention that I appear unconfident, but I have received comments about my unpleasant appearance and my androgynity, so th…
/r/PurplePillDebate01/04/21 12:59 PM
2

[citation needed]
/r/PurplePillDebate01/04/21 12:55 PM
0

So you’re saying a woman who is born ugly should appreciate life because men with weird fetishes still find them attractive? Why not?
/r/PurplePillDebate01/04/21 12:55 PM
1

Am I missing something or is this whole thread discussing correlation and effect size as if they were the same statistic? I was never a stats buff but IIRC that's not correct.
/r/BlackPillScience01/04/21 12:52 PM
You can kill a man, but you can't kill an idea.

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