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Women-owned firms to benefit - This is gov. based feminism at the expense of men.

thetrollking

October 17, 2010

15 upvotes

/r/MensRights

http://www.bizjournals.com/pacific/stories/2010/10/18/story1.html?b=1287374400%5E4101471

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Title	Women-owned firms to benefit - This is gov. based feminism at the expense of men.
Author	thetrollking
Upvotes	15
Comments	21
Date	October 17, 2010 9:34 PM UTC (15 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/dsifc/womenowned_firms_to_benefit_this_is_gov_based/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/women-owned-firms-to-benefit-this-is-gov-based.1046773 https://theredarchive.com/post/1046773

Comments

[–][deleted] 9 points10 points11 points 15 years ago (22 children) | Copy Link

[–]thetrollking[S] 10 points11 points12 points 15 years ago (21 children) | Copy Link

[–]Hamakua 5 points6 points7 points 15 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points5 points 15 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]IDidItMyself 0 points1 point2 points 15 years ago (18 children) | Copy Link

[–]Hamakua 1 point2 points3 points 15 years ago (17 children) | Copy Link

[–]IDidItMyself 1 point2 points3 points 15 years ago (16 children) | Copy Link

You said "endured war" That doesn't mean casualties. So far 116 women and 4783 men have been killed in Iraq. The ratio of wounded solders is similar.

You must take into consideration that women are not allowed to participate in the same way men are. They are not put in the same situations as men, not by their own choice but by government rules. Instead of chastising women because they don't die as much as men you should be petitioning the government to allow women the same opportunities and rights as men in the military. This right is what many feminist fight for, see you have more in common than you thought...

While on the topic of "enduring" here are somethings women endure in war:

Spc. Mickiela Montoya, 21, who was in Iraq with the National Guard in 2005, took to carrying a knife with her at all times. "The knife wasn't for the Iraqis," she told me. "It was for the guys on my own side."

"I have talked to more than 20 female veterans of the Iraq war in the past few months, interviewing them for up to 10 hours each for a book I am writing on the topic, and every one of them said the danger of rape by other soldiers is so widely recognized in Iraq that their officers routinely told them not to go to the latrines or showers without another woman for protection."

"Comprehensive statistics on the sexual assault of female soldiers in Iraq have not been collected, but early numbers revealed a problem so bad that former Defense Secretary Donald H. Rumsfeld ordered a task force in 2004 to investigate."

"Pickett herself was sexually attacked when she was training in Nicaragua before being deployed to Iraq. "I was sexually assaulted by a superior officer when I was 19, but I didn't know where to turn, so I never reported it,"

"military climate is so severe on whistle-blowers that even they regarded the women who reported rape as incapable traitors."

[–]thetrollking[S] -1 points0 points1 point 15 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

Well, I should have used a better word. From the article:

The new rule puts some teeth in the regulations, putting women-owned businesses on similar footing as service-disabled veteran-owned businesses and businesses that participate in the SBA’s 8(a) business-development program, which enjoy the benefits of bidding for contracts that are set aside for their specific programs.

So yeah, some wounded female veterans might apply and good for them. That is not my point. Why should women businesses be on the same footing as war disable veterans. Women don't get drafted and most of the women I have known who went into the military didn't do so for the same economic reasons as men. Hell, here in the south in some circles women and guys will question your masculinity if you haven't served. Most of the women I know that went into the armed forces were tomboys who delighted in competing and trying to best men in every regard, they didn't have social pressure or economic pressure to go into the military, even the one or two who have kids can still get things like WIC and scholarships and grants for college.

I have read those reports and I don't believe most of it. It may be bad in some areas but even if it is true that rape is that common in the military then it's just one more reason why men and women shouldnt serve together. From the military people I know and have talked to they go through more sexual assault training than any business and more than even police officers. You say feminists argue for women to be put in harms way, I doubt that. Show me one feminist that has signed up for the draft in protest. Most say they are against it but do nothing to overturn it. hell, in 2001 and 2003 what were feminists acvocating for? Drafting all men, especially the white boys of rich men.

[–]lolbanned4opposing -1 points0 points1 point 15 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Women don't get drafted and most of the women I have known who went into the military didn't do so for the same economic reasons as men.

No one has been drafted since Vietnam. And what are you even trying to say when you say "didn't do so for the same economic reasons as men." are you saying that a mans economic reasons are greater than a woman's? I really don't know what you mean. Im sure that women have economic reasons to join the military, get your head out of your ass.

even the one or two who have kids can still get things like WIC and scholarships and grants for college.

Ever heard of ROTC? Men get free college if they join the military....

Its said when rape victims are ignored :-( Like that girl who was locked in a the shipping container and raped and couldnt sue... That bitch was obviously just making it up.

if it is true that rape is that common in the military then it's just one more reason why men and women shouldnt serve together.

It is now evident that I am talking to some retarded southern hick. (Not calling southerns hicks, Im just discribing this guy) MAYBE MEN SHOULD JUST NOT RAPE WOMEN YOU DUMBASS. Secondly don't chastise women in the military who die by saying

they are compared to male veterans who have endured war

And then say they shouldn't be allowed to fight. Please see the cognitive dissonance there.

You say feminists argue for women to be put in harms way, I doubt that

You're just plain wrong

Show me one feminist that has signed up for the draft in protest.

There is no draft. If you are refering to the NAM draft I am sure there are some out there.

hell, in 2001 and 2003 what were feminists acvocating for? Drafting all men, especially the white boys of rich men.

Dude stop watching Fox News

[–]thetrollking[S] -1 points0 points1 point 15 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Ever heard of ROTC? Men get free college if they join the military....

Its said when rape victims are ignored :-( Like that girl who was locked in a the shipping container and raped and couldnt sue... That bitch was obviously just making it up.

WTF, you say what economic reasons? I listed that the poor women I know can get college degrees through other means....where are the college hand outs for single fathers, non custodial fathers? Of the men I know who went into the military they did so for two reasons, either family obligation or economic, meaning they could make 6 bucks an hour and not have enough money to pay for their children or themselves or their wife or they could go into the military. I live in the south and around here women have many more options than military service. Hell, they can become strippers. Plus they don't have the family obligations.

The woman locked in a shipping container worked for private contracters, not the armed forces....comprehension fail. I don't think she was making it up, but it honestly wouldn't surprise me if she was. There are many problems with the use of contracters in war zones, one being that they are outside of the military field of justice. They are private citizens making money in a war zone. They aren't held to american laws, because the crime didn't happen in America. Shit, how dense are you...maybe you need to get your head out of your ass....

Now they could have been brought up on other charges, maybe as combatants against American military personnel...that would be crazy huh, our own contractors sent to GITMO. But anyways, I think what allegedly happened to her is horrible. There are many problems with private mercenaries in war zones and states/countries employing them.

As far as your claims that sexual assault in the military is rampant, I simply don't believe you. I have read some feminist propaganda on the subject and it doesn't match up with what I have been told.

No one has been drafted since Vietnam.' So what? My dad was drafted. My mom is a 2nd wave feminist who sat on the board of NOW. YOu claimed that feminists are trying to get all male responsibilities to be put on women. I want to see the name of one feminist that has gone down to the post office and signed away her rights to her BODY and life as protest.

Ok, your link is interesting but I fail to see how feminists played much role in most of it. I do think women should be in combat positions, but according to your article it appears that the critics were correct in some analysis. How many women have gotten pregnant in the military, how many have had affairs and how has that jeopardized unit cohesion? IDK, but I think it's interesting.

It is now evident that I am talking to some retarded southern hick. (Not calling southerns hicks, Im just discribing this guy) MAYBE MEN SHOULD JUST NOT RAPE WOMEN YOU DUMBASS. Secondly don't chastise women in the military who die by saying

they are compared to male veterans who have endured war

And then say they shouldn't be allowed to fight. Please see the cognitive dissonance there

Fuck you! Is that hick enough bitch. I didn't say they shouldn't be allowed to fight, I said this:

but even if it is true that rape is that common in the military then it's just one more reason why men and women shouldnt** serve together**

And I said so in reference rape or sexual assault. If you put men and women in the same room or environment you will get everything from adultery, pregnancy, false rape claims and actual rapes. This could be fixed by segregating units by sex. You can have one combat unit male and the other female...the armed forces already does this with a lot of training and we even do it with Iraqis and Afgans.

You say there isn't a draft but I would have faced jail time and loss of the few rights I have if I didn't sign away rights over my body at 18.

I don't watch fox new religiously and I don't believe much I see on fox or cnn or msnbc or any other news show. FUCK OFF FEMINIST BITCH!

[–]lolbanned4opposing 1 point2 points3 points 15 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

These scholar ships for women you speak of are most likely from woman's groups. Why don't you set up a scholarship fund for fathers? And like I said the military will pay for men to go to college, including single father. Oh wait I can use google Women join the military for a lot of reasons. Maybe they didn't want to make 6 bucks an hour at some job or maybe they wanted to do something more respectable then selling their bodies... Did you honestly just suggest that women become strippers instead of joining the army? and FYI men can be strippers too...

You don't think women have family obligations? What about being the female only child of a military household? You don't think there is any pressure? I've heard numerous stories of women joining because of family traditions, I guess it just hasn't happened where you live or you haven't heard any news reports on it.

I gave you the example of the shipping crate containing because it was a very recent example and I figured you would have heard of it. While it wasn't military I was using it to show the behavior that occurs and the military is no different. see this article

I have read some feminist propaganda on the subject and it doesn't match up with what I have been told.

What have you been told? What about listening to some women stationed in Iraq here

Ok, your link is interesting but I fail to see how feminists played much role in most of it.

By being proponents "Proponents of opening all positions in the military to women argue"

have gotten pregnant in the military, how many have had affairs and how has that jeopardized unit cohesion?

How many men have gone to whore-houses or cheated on their wives with females in the military?

Fuck you! Is that hick enough bitch. I didn't say they shouldn't be allowed to fight, I said this:

Yes it is hick enough, thank you for confirming my suspicion. So the military should adopt all female units and build separate bases because military men are incapable of not raping people?

You say there isn't a draft but I would have faced jail time and loss of the few rights I have if I didn't sign away rights over my body at 18.

Ok so open the draft to women. And on a side note you say "loss of the few rights I have" What right as a white male in America don't you have?

I don't watch fox new religiously

So you do watch it. LOL so predictable. But what feminist wanted a draft of rich white when in 2001 and 2003? Please supply evidence.

FUCK OFF FEMINIST BITCH!

Spoken like an intelligent member of /r/mensright. You can say demeaning things towards women but have a problem with the phrase "man up" You're hypocrisy is palpable.

BTW, Im a guy.

[–]nlakes 1 point2 points3 points 15 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link

[–]IDidItMyself 1 point2 points3 points 15 years ago* (8 children) | Copy Link

Wrong. Women can't participate [in the army] in the same was as men.

I think you misread what I said. Read it again, as of right now you are agreeing with me.

Nearly all women aren't good enough to serve in combat situations.

Many women serve in combat situations actually. The Marine Corps awarded twenty-three women the Combat Action Ribbon for service in the Persian Gulf War because they were engaged by Iraqi troops. This picture looks like a women who was in combat

It's not sexism to say that. They're weaker, have slower reaction times, less endurance and relatively less power:weight.

It is sexism to say that. I'd like to see your ass run a triathlon-endurance or have most men lift this much-weaker Many many women have the capability to be physically fit to fight. The military has fitness tests for a reason. If a women passes the physical tests that says they are combat fit then she can fight. Im sure the military knows a lot more about female and male physical capabilities than you do. Sure not all women are fit for military service just like all men aren't fit for military service Thats why they have tests.

[–]nlakes 1 point2 points3 points 15 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

Women don't have the same requirements as men. You're intentionally ignoring this fact to assert equal but not equal.

This is talking on average, but women aren't as strong as men period. Physically men are superior to women and men have better reaction times. If there was only one set of entry criteria for the army, men would clearly decimate women in all assessment criteria. The whole reason women have their own set of criteria in the army is because they cannot measure up against men.

The same applies to F1. You will always be able to find 20 fitter, faster and better coordinated male racing drivers than women. It's in male physiology that makes them better at these things than women.

It is sexism to say that.

No, it's a fact. There's no value judgement in it. It's a scientifically proven reality.

[–]IDidItMyself 0 points1 point2 points 15 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Im not intentionally ignoring facts. I know they have different sets of requirements. These requirements were set up by THE U.S. MILITARY. I think they know weather or not they are good measures of fitness and if these measures correlate to fighting ability.

This is talking on average, but women aren't as strong as men period. Physically men are superior to women and men have better reaction times.

What is your point? Just because men are stronger than women doesn't mean they are not strong enough to fight.

The whole reason women have their own set of criteria in the army is because they cannot measure up against men.

Yes they can't compete when assessed against men, this doesn't mean they cant fight and wouldnt make good fighters. The military uses firearms not battle axes. If the military did have one set of requirements and women could pass those then would they not be capable of fighting?

No, it's a fact. There's no value judgement in it. It's a scientifically proven reality.

You said

They're weaker, have slower reaction times, less endurance and relatively less power:weight.

You are saying every woman is weaker physically than every man. This is not true. Go fight a female mix martial artist or boxer. See how well you do.

The same applies to F1. You will always be able to find 20 fitter, faster and better coordinated male racing drivers than women. It's in male physiology that makes them better at these things than women.

What is F1 and what does it have to do with anything? The reason you find more male racers is because its a "male sport" fathers aren't exactly their daughters to be racers. Use your head a little and think outside the box. Girls are given Barbies from birth, not race cars. Girls arent born with the desire to play with dolls. that are RAISE that way. If more girls were RAISE to be race car drivers than we could actually put your theory to the test.

[–]nlakes 1 point2 points3 points 15 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]Le_Chimp -1 points0 points1 point 15 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

[–]IDidItMyself 1 point2 points3 points 15 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

I never said women are stronger than men. I said women are capable or being strong. Strong enough to fight in the military as nlakes said they couldnt. Women are capable of having the endurance and strength to fight. These pictures were a simple way of showing that. Id like to see you go toe to toe with a woman MMA and see how well you do.

The business would is not an equal playing field. Look up the number of CEO of fortune 500 companies. Look at the number of black men. The buisness world is full of men like you, thats why it is hard for women and minorities to move up. If a man and a women have the exact same sets of skills and experience who are you going to hire? The man because you believe >women are weaker

How old are you 13? Read a book and take some classes, get some world experience and see how lucky you are to be a white male. If a women is strong and assertive in the work place she is labeled a bitch. If a male is strong an assertive they are thought of as a good leader. If a male politician is fat and bald no one thinks twice. If a woman politician is fat bald and old they will not even be considered for office. Look at Hilary Clinton, everyone calls her a "cunt" or "bitch" and for what? acting like a male politician?

[–]Le_Chimp 0 points1 point2 points 15 years ago* (1 child) | Copy Link

I'm a a Half black Half English man with 10 years experience in accountancy.

Id like to see you go toe to toe with a woman MMA and see how well you do.

Again you didn't even try to understand what i was implying see you think because a woman with training and in peak physical fitness could beat me up a man with no training and out of shape proves your point? Tell me why are all the male athletic world record better then the female athletic records? example the fastest man is 9.58s for 100meters the fastest woman is 10.49s now I admit I be lucky to do 100m in 20s.

now because a woman can run 100m faster them me that means women are faster? no it means that and athlete at the peak of thier physical fitness is faster then an overweight accountant. same above a MMA will kick the ass of a CPA.

if a women is strong and assertive in the work place she is labeled a bitch. If a male is strong an assertive they are thought of as a good leader. If a male politician is fat and bald no one thinks twice. If a woman politician is fat bald and old they will not even be considered for office. Look at Hilary Clinton, everyone calls her a "cunt" or "bitch" and for what? acting like a male politician?

This is a problem with the system. by giving women an advantage you are effectively saying that either they are weaker and they need it or it is ok to discriminate against them as this is to cover the gap. This is just like a Handicap horse race. and as long as there are government handouts and advantages given to people based on gender race or sexual preference there will be no equity.

back to my previous example if i have a 10s handicap against Florence Griffith-Joyner(100m woman WR holder) and win have i achieved anything? no. if these women who use this government hand out to make a good business, will the male dominated industry thing wow these woman are just as good as men? no they will think dam that government hand out we missed out on really boosted them. Even the woman owned companies that are currently operating fine with out the had out and the companies who could of succeeded with out the hand out will all have these success attributed to the hand out and not there own aptitude.

If women want to be taken seriously in theses industries they will need to do it fairly and with out any handouts.

[–]Hamakua 0 points1 point2 points 15 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[–]lolbanned4opposing 0 points1 point2 points 15 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link