The Misguided Message Of Men's Rights Groups

2009-11-06T03:57:06+00:00

in a very real way, women's rights are men's rights. Being a feminist or an advocate for domestic violence victims doesn't mean you want women to be allowed to batter men. It means you believe in egalitarian relationships in which partners resolve disputes through communication rather than violence

Now can we all go home and play nice?

Mesca · 2009-11-06T08:37:41+00:00

I loved this article.

I think it correctly characterizes some real problems in "the men's rights" movement, such as it is.

standing for men's rights - for example equity in custody arrangements - is tantamount to "belittling domestic violence against women [sic]"
This is a real issue. The fact is that women get beat up - physically, emotionally, and financially - by the very people they depend on for physical, financial and emotional support. Domestic partner abuse is real, and women suffer for it. The moral man will walk the line that neither minimizes the issue of DV, nor accepts the hyperbole that all men are violent, and all women are victims.
the article purports to analyze the issue of whether DV laws are dicriminatory against men, and then translates that, incorrectly, into the issue of the prevalence of DV against men. Those are not the same thing. To say "DV laws discriminate against men" is not to say "DV against men is underreported and under-treated." Both may be true, or neither, or one-and-one. They are completely independent statements. The discrimination I see in DV law is not about preventing men from reporting it when it happens to them; although this may exist, I don't see it. The discrimination I see is in the use of DV allegations as a tactic in a divorce to gain an advantage in custody, and hence in financials as well. It takes little to nothing to get a order of restraint against a man, and when that happens in a divorce, the case is as good as over.

But the author never addresses that. Instead the author links the two independent issues - discrimination in DV law and under-reporting of male victims of DV - and proceeds to knock down the second issue as a straw person.

The article goes on to say

The sad thing about this is that, in a very real way, women's rights are men's rights. Being a feminist or an advocate for domestic violence victims doesn't mean you want women to be allowed to batter men. It means you believe in egalitarian relationships in which partners resolve disputes through communication rather than violence — something that benefits both men and women.

I love the sentiment expressed here.

Abuse of restraining orders is violence. It is legal terrorism. The commenters to the article who commented on this issue, all supported the idea that there is bias in custody. None of them, however, had the statistics at hand.

We could do best by

recognizing the common ground. That mainstream feminists want equity, not control. That men-vs-women is a false dichotomy. That equity in custody cases is good for all involved - men, women, and children.
obtaining and presenting, as often as possible, evidence of bias in places where it exists. This means, the stats that I have quoted before, that men "win' in less than 27% of contested custody cases in the State of Washington. A stat for which I have lost the source !

Stcik to the facts and you will win skeptical people to your side. Be reasonable and you will persuade reasonable people that you are correct.

Title	The Misguided Message Of Men's Rights Groups
Author	[deleted]
Upvotes	7
Comments	2
Date	November 5, 2009 11:44 PM UTC (16 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/a1flb/the_misguided_message_of_mens_rights_groups/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/the-misguided-message-of-mens-rights-groups.1052169 https://theredarchive.com/post/1052169

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