I feel like the concept of outcome independence/non-neediness is being misunderstood and might confuse people. Let’s say you see a really cute girl and you’re attracted to her. You have a desire to meet her, you want her. That’s why we’re all here. Then you might think, no wait, I shouldn’t have these needy desires, I need to be outcome independent and not give a fuck. This could give you the idea that you should try to avoid developing strong desires and become less emotional. But this is the wrong idea. We need to distinguish between two views on outcome independence:

Delusional Outcome Independence: ”I don’t care whether or not I get this girl, I’m outcome independent, I don’t give a fuck.”

I don’t think this type of outcome independence exists. It’s a paradox. You’re approaching this girl because you want her (I hope), and if you want something, you’re not outcome independent.

Now the standard objection is: Yes, but I don’t care if she rejects me, because other girls are right around the corner. Okay. Let’s say you meet Jessica Alba, make her laugh, everything’s going well, you get her number, goodbye kiss, and after that she flakes on you. Do you really “not give a fuck”, because you still have this other number from this drunk party chick?

I don’t know about you, but for me, there are sometimes whole weeks during which I don’t see a single girl that I find attractive enough. And when I do meet a girl that I find really beautiful, only about 20% of them are actually compatible with me personality-wise (interesting/funny/not stupid enough for me to notice). The higher your standards, the more time it’ll take you to find another match, and the less outcome independent you can be. Yes, if I get rejected, I know that I will eventually find another quality girl, but I would very much prefer to have my desire for the current girl fulfilled than having to wait for an indeterminate amount of time. Even if you have very low standards, and there is an abundance of options for you everywhere all the time - if you want a girl and she denies it, you still don’t like that. You might be able to experience something similar soon, but an unfulfilled desire is still an unfulfilled desire.

My point is that we shouldn’t pretend that this type of outcome independence is realistic. How is this even supposed to work, does it ever change during the interaction or do you also have outcome independent sex? If you want something, you necessarily care about the outcome, sometimes more, sometimes less. Complete outcome independence is only achievable if you’re delusional or if you trained yourself to be emotionally flat (let’s call that subversion Pathetic Outcome Independence), which will not only make your life boring and sad, it will also be incredibly counterproductive for seduction in the long run (since having strong desires is a major turn-on for women when they’re attracted to you).

So here’s the other approach to non-neediness:

Realistic Outcome Independence: ”I care about the outcome, but if she rejects me, I know that I can handle it. I won’t like it, but it won’t have long-lasting effects on my life, my life will still be in order, and I will definitely get another girl in the future.”

This is the mindset that I think we should actually have. Yes, if girls notice that you care a lot about the outcome, and if it’s still early in the interaction, she won’t be attracted to you. And if she is particularly hot, you do care (don’t make me bring up another Jessica Alba scenario). But the solution to this problem is not killing your desires and becoming an unemotional PUA robot, it’s reasonable emotion regulation. Just don’t freak out if it’s early in the interaction and try to downregulate your desires temporarily. It’s not easy, but emotion regulation is a skill that can be trained (and is actually a better predictor of happiness and life success than the IQ is, so it’s worth to practice). This way, you don’t have to change who you are, and you can still unleash your desires when the time is right.

TL; DR: The idea of complete outcome independence and not giving a fuck is a paradox. It’s good to have strong desires, just don’t show too much of them early in the interaction.