TheRedArchive

~ archived since 2018 ~

  • Subreddits

      Popular

    • /r/askTRP
    • /r/TheRedPill
    • /r/MarriedRedPill
    • /r/MensRights
    • /r/MGTOW
    • /r/PurplePillDebate
    • /r/WhereAreAllTheGoodMen
    • Other

    • /r/AllPillDebate
    • /r/AlreadyRed
    • /r/altTRP
    • /r/AntiFeminists
    • /r/askFDS
    • /r/askMRP
    • /r/askRPC
    • /r/becomeaman
    • /r/BlackPillScience
    • /r/Chadfish
    • /r/Divorce_Men
    • /r/EverydayMisandry
    • /r/ExRedPill
    • /r/FemaleDatingStrategy
    • /r/FeminismStopsWhen
    • /r/GEOTRP
    • /r/LeftWingMaleAdvocates
    • /r/MalePsychology
    • /r/Male_Studies
    • /r/MenSupportMen
    • /r/MGTOW2
    • /r/MuslimRedPill
    • /r/newTRP
    • /r/PussyPass
    • /r/PussyPassDenied
    • /r/RedPillBooks
    • /r/RedPillParenting
    • /r/RedPillWives
    • /r/RedPillWomen
    • /r/RedPillWorkplace
    • /r/RPChristians
    • /r/seduction
    • /r/ThankTRP
    • /r/TheRedPillStories
    • /r/trpGAME
    • /r/TRPOffTopic
    • /r/TrueBlackPillMGTOW
    • /r/WhereAllTheGoodMenAre
  • Blogs

      Popular

    • Dalrock
    • Heartiste
    • Illimitable Men
    • Return of Kings
    • Rian Stone
    • The Rational Male
    • Woujo
    • Other

    • Artful Prudence
    • A Voice for Men
    • Alpha Game
    • Black Label Logic
    • Caleb Jones
    • Captain Capitalism
    • Corporate Machiavelli
    • Days of Game
    • Deep Strength
    • Dicipres
    • Donal Graeme
    • Female Misogynist
    • Free Northerner
    • Gaming My Wife
    • Good Looking Loser
    • Hawaiian Libertarian
    • In Mala Fide
    • KillToParty
    • Kill Your Inner Loser
    • Krauser PUA
    • LaidNYC
    • Married Man Sex Life
    • NO MA'AM
    • Omega Virgin Revolt
    • Pook's Mill
    • Random Xpat Rantings
    • Red Pill Theory
    • Red Pill Wifery
    • RedPillDad
    • RedPillDoctor
    • Seasons of Tumult and Discord
    • Sigma Frame
    • The Feminine Woman
    • The Futurist
    • The Masculine Principle
    • The Modern Man
    • The New Modern Man
    • The Obsidian Files
    • The Power Moves
    • The Private Man
    • The Red Pill Room
    • The Red Quest
    • The Rules Revisited
    • The Spearhead
    • Troy Francis
    • Wintery Knight
    • Young Man Red Pill
  • Books
  • Dictionary
  • @TRParchive
  • Please help TheRedArchive stay alive

RedPill masculine lifestyle: what a good supplement stack looks like.

[deleted]

September 11, 2013
0 upvotes
/r/TheRedPill
Download the post

Want to save the post for offline use on your device? Choose one of the download options below:

PDF TXT EPUB
Share
Share Tweet Reddit Email
Post Information
Title RedPill masculine lifestyle: what a good supplement stack looks like.
Author

[deleted]

Upvotes 0
Comments 45
Date September 11, 2013 11:13 PM UTC
(12 years ago)
Subreddit Posted in /r/TheRedPill
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/TheRedPill/comments/1m7jp7/redpill_masculine_lifestyle_what_a_good/
Archive Link https://theredarchive.com/r/TheRedPill/redpill-masculine-lifestyle-what-a-good-supplement.233127
https://theredarchive.com/post/233127
Red Pill terms in post
the red pill

Comments

[–]TheGoodBro 15 points16 points17 points 12 years ago* (34 children) | Copy Link

No offense man but this stack is based on complete broscience and some of it is even going to make progress harder. Like that True Mass shake at 6 am for a few reasons.

a. Testosterone spikes in the morning and flooding your system with glucose is going to suppress T levels b. Fasting for length periods is beneficial through its regulation of autophagy. At first autophagy, a catabolic process, sounds detrimental to progress but it is in fact required for muscle growth. I see you said you do a variation on IF but for those who are not practicing strict fasting AMPK isn't being upregulated often enough to clean up cellular garbage and you'll be impeding progress by constantly supplying your body with calories. c. Breakfast has also shown to worsen cognitive performance in people who didn't exercise shortly(<2 hours) after. d. Being physically active while fasted is actually a better way to maintain stable glucose levels compared to actually eating. It sounds counter intuitive but for those of you who've trained fasted have probably noticed you feel better in the gym without having eaten. People with normal glycemic control can benefit from staying fasted in the morning, they'll carry more energy into their afternoon.

Not trying to be aggressive and I know you're just posting up what you do and what works for you but some of it is going to slow progress down. It doesn't mean you won't progress, just not as effectively. Supplements are still less than 10% of the whole thing. If you're not eating right, if you're not busting your ass in the weight room, and if you're not getting enough sleep then no amount right/wrong supplementation will matter. That being said I think I could improve your list a lot if you want some input. Like carnitine for example, its got a variety of version each with different benefits and some are indeed worth supplementing. Bulk L-carnitine l-tartrate could be acquired for relatively cheap and it protects the androgen receptor during intense exercise preventing the damage that normally occurs. This basically means more sites for growth factors to activate post workout. Acetyl-l-carnitine has shown to raise free test iirc, not significantly enough to warrant it as more than a bonus, but it also improves cognitive performance through donating the acetyl-COA for increased production of acetylcholine. All carnitine supplements also go well with a diet high in choline and some caffeine for fat loss. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/12514272

We conclude that the choline-induced decrease in serum and urinary carnitine is buffered by carnitine preloading, and these supplements shift tissue partitioning of carnitine that favors fat mobilization, incomplete oxidation of fatty acids and disposal of their carbons in urine as acylcarnitines in humans.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/11120451

The magnitude of increase in urinary acylcarnitines (34-45-fold) is a unique effect of this combination of supplements. Cumulative evidence indicates enhanced beta-oxidation of fatty acids without a change in the RQ because acetyl units were excreted in urine as acetylcarnitine and not oxidized to carbon dioxide. For this phenomenon, we propose the term "fatty acid dumping." We conclude that supplementation with caffeine, carnitine, and choline augments exercise performance and promotes fatty acid oxidation as well as disposal in urine.

Edit: Wanted to add it would be way better to make your own mass gainer shakes, please do not buy actual Mass Gainers. Its not hard or time consuming at all and an easy way to cram in a ton of calories. Mix it up with some eggs, occasional fruit like a banana(the liver prefers galactose and fructose over glucose for glycogen replenishment and its still a reasonable amount of sugar), whole milk, oats(another good source for carbs, its a lower GI so blood sugar levels will be more easily controlled and it contains beta-glucan which is good stuff for your intestinal health), whey protein(you wan't whey for it's high leucine content to spike mTOR/MPS which has a refractory period and needs 2-3 hours before you can bring it up again so get the most out of it) and occasionally whatever sweet shit you want if you've been fasted for a while or it's a postworkout shake and a ton of glucose will be readily sucked up by your skeletal muscle.

[+][deleted] -8 points-7 points-6 points 12 years ago (33 children) | Copy Link

jesus, every fucking time with you people... and you're being upvoted... the worst part of it all...

Chronic hyperglycemia inhibits the male gonadal axis

Yes... im sure this study copied my workout and nutrition plan to the T... which makes it so fucking relevant....

b. Fasting for length periods is beneficial through its regulation of autophagy.

Wtf does this have to do with the article...

c. Breakfast has also shown to worsen cognitive performance in people who didn't exercise shortly(<2 hours) after.

Wtf does this have to do with the article...

d. Being physically active while fasted is actually a better way to maintain stable glucose levels compared to actually eating.

And im the one bro sciencing here? Working out in a fasted state is going to catabolize the fuck out of your muscle tissue, source: ive made this mistake before. You either need to hit up BCAAs before hand and afterwards until you are able to hit a refeed OR you can just eat beforehand. No doubts that it will burn fat off more quickly, but Im not only interested in LOSING FAT, I also want to KEEP MUSCLE.

This isn't your fucking kindergarten ABCs here man, and my information is based on more than just "broscience," it has also been put to the test.

Wanted to add it would be way better to make your own mass gainer shakes, please do not buy actual Mass Gainers. Its not hard or time consuming at all and an easy way to cram in a ton of calories. Mix it up with some eggs, occasional fruit like a banana(the liver prefers galactose and fructose over glucose for glycogen replenishment and its still a reasonable amount of sugar), whole milk, oats(another good source for carbs, its a lower GI so blood sugar levels will be more easily controlled and it contains beta-glucan which is good stuff for your intestinal health), whey protein(you wan't whey for it's high leucine content to spike mTOR/MPS which has a refractory period and needs 2-3 hours before you can bring it up again so get the most out of it) and occasionally whatever sweet shit you want if you've been fasted for a while or it's a postworkout shake and a ton of glucose will be readily sucked up by your skeletal muscle.

Gosh... I didnt realize that I could do this... OMG, you must be some genius because ya know, I never thought of this... so I have to have a blender and stuff? /jesusfuckingchrist

Anyhow, congratulations on proving to the world that a fucking post on anything health related must be hit by at least one ignorant troll.

Wtf does this have to do with the article...

[–]TheGoodBro 8 points9 points10 points 12 years ago* (32 children) | Copy Link

jesus, every fucking time with you people... and you're being upvoted... the worst part of it all...

Relax hombre

Yes... im sure this study copied my workout and nutrition plan to the T... which makes it so fucking relevant....

You could be an ultramarathon athlete or a powerlifter, it doesn't matter, if you down that stupid True Mass shake at 6 am you're ingesting a shit load of sugar and the study referenced suggests that directly suppresses testosterone " The main outcome measurements were deconvolution and LH-T dose-response analyses of 10-min data. LH-T responses were regressed on glucose, insulin, leptin, adiponectin, age, BMI, and CT-estimated abdominal visceral fat. During the first 120 min after glucose ingestion, for each unit decrease in LH concentrations, T concentrations decreased by 86 (27-144) ng/dl (r = 0.853, P < 0.001). "

Wtf does this have to do with the article...x2

If you read what I said it pretty clearly indicates its about your recommendation for a True Mass shake at 6 am.

And im the one bro sciencing here? Working out in a fasted state is going to catabolize the fuck out of your muscle tissue, source: ive made this mistake before. You either need to hit up BCAAs before hand and afterwards until you are able to hit a refeed OR you can just eat beforehand. No doubts that it will burn fat off more quickly, but Im not only interested in LOSING FAT, I also want to KEEP MUSCLE.

Reference one piece of scientific information that suggest training fasted will induce proteolysis significantly enough to warrant having to consume something before hand. I'm also going from experience, I've done everything and fasted is hands down the best way to train for normal healthy people. Muscle isn't built in the gym, thats where its broken down, you're supposed to do damage so that later you can consume a shit load of protein and build new mass. Unless you're doing ultra marathons or training for 4 hours a day you'll be fine. Even Arnold would exercise 4-5 hours a day, but he was also on the juice so a bit of an exception due to more rapid recovery times.

Still studies have even shown that cortisol, one of the most significant and potent catabolic hormones in the human body, is the only hormone significantly correlated with increases in lean body mass. That means the athletes who busted their ass the most, being the most 'catabolic', built the most muscle in the end. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22105707

Acute hormonal responses were correlated with gains in lean body mass (LBM), muscle fibre cross-sectional area (CSA) and leg press strength. There were no significant correlations between the exercise-induced elevations (area under the curve-AUC) of GH, fT and IGF-1 and gains in LBM or leg press strength. Significant correlations were found for cortisol, usually assumed to be a hormone indicative of catabolic drive, AUC with change in LBM (r = 0.29, P < 0.05) and type II fibre CSA (r = 0.35, P < 0.01)

Cortisol and catabolism are misunderstood by the mainstream gurus

This isn't your fucking kindergarten ABCs here man, and my information is based on more than just "broscience," it has also been put to the test

I squat 405 for reps and train selectively fasted 5 days a week. I'm not just twiddling my thumbs here trying to make you look bad, I'm trying to help people get started right.

Anyhow, congratulations on proving to the world that a fucking post on anything health related must be hit by at least one ignorant troll.

I'm not a troll and if you'd like to discuss the article or any of my points like adults I'm ready to do so.

[–][deleted] 12 years ago (13 children) | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[–]TheGoodBro 0 points1 point2 points 12 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

For the average healthy human fasted training keeps blood glucose levels more stable than fed training. You're basically one of the statistical outliers and it may have to do with some pathological insulin resistance or any other number of factors. They're indeed some people who do better training fed but the vast majority will do better fasted.

In your case I'd aim for a meal with about 30g quality protein(high in EAAs because they stimulate skeletal muscle glucose uptake), 50-100g of carbs with mix of fructose and glucose(like a banana and 1 cup of oats) and maybe some coconut oil if you want MCTs even though they haven't shown much statistical significance on exercise performance, fats are still important. Coconut oil has also shown to reduce waist circumference and provides a myriad of other benefits. Its saturated fat content is surprisingly beneficial and even contains some compounds that are potently antimalarial and antiviral iirc.

You should have an 8 hour window if you do a 16 hour fast but you don't need to be super anal about it. If it's hard for you to eat enough maybe get your zinc checked. Zinc deficiency lowers appetite and even if a mild deficiency will have an effect. Long term/hard training athletes tend to be deficient in zinc(and magnesium) and some even regardless of having a good diet. Those two are micros worth supplementing but get your levels checked first. If you're not deficient and load up on zinc you can deplete copper levels rather quickly and cause other problems.

http://link.springer.com/article/10.2165/00007256-200131080-00002

Mild zinc deficiency is difficult to detect because of the lack of definitive indicators of zinc status. In athletes, zinc deficiency can lead to anorexia, significant loss in bodyweight, latent fatigue with decreased endurance and a risk of osteoporosis.

[–][deleted] 12 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[–]TheGoodBro 0 points1 point2 points 12 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

That's a lot of psychological and physical stress so it's not surprising you feel fatigued and have a poor appetite. In those with chronic fatigue syndrome and depression it is common to find magnesium/zinc deficiencies. To top it off 4-6 hours of sleep a night will directly cause insulin resistance and if not remedied can snowball into full blown T2DM. Even acute sleep loss causes slight increases in insulin resistance. Doing it for weeks or months plus all that stress will seriously fuck you up. Start getting at least 7(preferably 8+) hours of sleep. Definitely look into zinc/magnesium as well, you're likely deficient in both. If you're going to supplement magnesium the kind you use is important, some are much more bioavailable then others. Magnesium oxide has show bioavailability as low as 4-15% but it's the cheapest and most commonly sold. Magnesium gluconate is the most efficient at reversing deficiencies(in rodent studies of deficiency at least) and other decent more available versions would be mag malate, aspartate, lactate, taurinate, or even citrate. Less bioavailable versions tend to lead to GI issues. You could even buy some epsom salts(magnesium sulfate) and take a bath in about 400-600g for 12+ minutes. If you're deficient you'll probably find the bath borderline sedating

[–][deleted] 12 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[–]TheGoodBro 0 points1 point2 points 12 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I will try to push for more sleep, but sometimes it just doesn't happen.. already have the good magnesium, natural calm chelated or something like that. is all zinc the same?

Word, as long as its not oxide its a decent choice. Zinc is pretty decent in all forms but in order of efficacy in three that were tested, in healthy humans btw, picolinate>citrate>gluconate.

can I over do it with magnesium?

If you have renal issues than yeah but otherwise I'm not aware of significant complications with excessive mag consumption aside from GI issues. I'm fairly certain in mag loading tests they administer pretty large doses(like 7g or so) of magnesium sulfate over a span of like 8 hours so I doubt they're acute problems with large doses. Off the top of my head I don't know about any problems with loading mag, only the benefits

[–]Nutz76 1 point2 points3 points 12 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

For the average healthy human fasted training keeps blood glucose levels more stable than fed training. You're basically one of the statistical outliers and it may have to do with some pathological insulin resistance or any other number of factors. They're indeed some people who do better training fed but the vast majority will do better fasted.

Careful with this generalization. It entirely depends on the type and length of training being performed. Workouts under 40 minutes should be fine, but for workouts that last longer training subjects run out of gas if they don't have fuel in the tank (meaning a meal within 2-3 hours of exercising). Another factor is when in the day the training occurs. If first thing in the morning then fasted is fine up to a certain point, but later in the day you simply can't perform at peak condition during an extended fast (more than 12 hours IIRC).

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 12 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

This. And apologizes for going all nuts on these trolls, they pushed my big red button.

[–]TheGoodBro -1 points0 points1 point 12 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Do you have any references? They're a bunch of studies showing Ramadan style fasting(~15 hours of no food or water) does not impair athletic performance(if anything some groups improve) and leads to improvements in body composition.

http://journals.tums.ac.ir/abs.aspx?org_id=59&culture_var=en&journal_id=31&issue_id=2311&manuscript_id=19088&segment=en http://journals.tums.ac.ir/upload_files/pdf/_/19104.pdf http://www.degruyter.com/view/j/hukin.2011.29.issue--1/v10078-011-0042-9/v10078-011-0042-9.xml

I train for roughly 1-2 hours 5 days a week and days when I do get food in before my workouts I feel sluggish. Your body is not as frail as you think it is. A pre meal might be important depending on the individual or the intensity of their training but for the average person fasting is great option. Just something people should play around with and figure out for themselves.

[–]Nutz76 1 point2 points3 points 12 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

my strength workouts last about 2 hours. if I don't eat within 2 to 3 hours beforehand I'm gassed in about 45 minutes

[–][deleted] -2 points-1 points0 points 12 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

how do you selectively train fasted?

Guys that train fasted typically do refeeds and big carbohydrate rich post workout meals. I don't train fasted because I'm on a cut and simply can't fit those kind of macros in my diet. If I wasn't on a cut, I might consider giving fasted training a try again with big carb rich post workouts.

The bro-science this guy is posting has also been debunked in other studies. One in which they had fasted training and pre workout training groups aiming for competitive cycling times (cant find link...) and both groups were able to complete in the same time. The pre-workout group had spiked blood glucose levels of course, but it stabalizes through the workout and actually pumps you up for heavier output as the training goes on. Basically it makes your first 2-4 sets pretty sluggish, but once you get rolling you get that nice jacked anabolic feeling.

[–]TheGoodBro 1 point2 points3 points 12 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

The bro-science this guy is posting has also been debunked in other studies. One in which they had fasted training and pre workout training groups aiming for competitive cycling times (cant find link...) and both groups were able to complete in the same time. The pre-workout group had spiked blood glucose levels of course, but it stabalizes through the workout and actually pumps you up for heavier output as the training goes on. Basically it makes your first 2-4 sets pretty sluggish, but once you get rolling you get that nice jacked anabolic feeling.

Lol I like how a study completed as of this year has apparently some how already been debunked... http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23825228

These other two studies aren't each less than years old as well. http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21051570 http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20837645

I also like the part where you haven't referenced any scientific material at all yet claim to have all these opinions based on scientific opinion. It's kind of like feminists hamstering their way through an argument based on their feels and pseudoscience bullshit you couldn't even wrap your head around.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 12 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Pick any exercise routine, any food, any supplement, anything fitness related, and I garauntee you will find at least 3 contradictory studies.

My current method is working wonders for me. Lifts are up across the board, energy is through the roof, fat is melting off like butter. If the science you're posting here is accurate, the difference it makes it a droplet in a bucket of fucking water.

I also like the part where you haven't referenced any scientific material at all yet claim to have all these opinions based on scientific opinion. It's kind of like feminists hamstering their way through an argument based on their feels and pseudoscience bullshit you couldn't even wrap your head around.

Lol, and I love the fact that you only have one source for data, and you're blabbing off about shit you've never even tried as if this one source has all answers fitness related, and experience means nothing.

[–]TheGoodBro 1 point2 points3 points 12 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Pick any exercise routine, any food, any supplement, anything fitness related, and I garauntee you will find at least 3 contradictory studies.

I agree thats why context is important.

My current method is working wonders for me. Lifts are up across the board, energy is through the roof, fat is melting off like butter. If the science you're posting here is accurate, the difference it makes it a droplet in a bucket of fucking water.

Just because something is working doesn't mean you can't be doing it better

Lol, and I love the fact that you only have one source for data, and you're blabbing off about shit you've never even tried as if this one source has all answers fitness related, and experience means nothing.

I've posted multiple studies and have plenty of my own anecdotal experience. Experience does mean a lot per individual because factually we've all got a different homeostasis and we all respond somewhat differently to everything. That being said your experience is still N=1 and can't compete with studies for observing the effect each little thing will have on you.

[–][deleted] -2 points-1 points0 points 12 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

Muscle isn't built in the gym, thats where its broken down, you're supposed to do damage so that later you can consume a shit load of protein and build new mass.

Lol, and you know all about my training style eh? I don't do it like Lyle McDonald and Berkan, and ended up slowly sliding into this groove which is quite fucking amazing.

Previously my feeding window was from 12m-9pm, workouts at 6:30pm, and I found that even eating 3 hours beforehand left in me starving of enough energy before the gym, even with plenty of carbs in my post workout. So I figured, I'd switch to pre-workout, and just get the timing down exact, which I discovered roughly 1 hour beforehand to be the prime spot. Since my feeding window doesn't allow for a whole lot post-workout eating, and I just plain couldnt stomach that much, I finally made the push to move my workout to 7am, which is the earliest my gym opens here. Training in the AM for me personally has resulted in an extreme lack of energy pretty much my entire life. Whether this is a problem with me, or a general human problem, I'm not sure. But the only fix I know to a lack of energy, is to consume energy in a properly timed manner so it hits my body when I'm hitting the weights. Hence the True Mass shake at 6am, which yes, I realize nobody else on the fucking planet does this apparently.

The results have been staggering though. I literally have been bleeding testosterone all fucking day on wo /days. So much so that I cant wait to get back in the gym the next day. If you are interested in my eating habits, they go as follows right now:

(3 lifting days / week, and yes this is for a cut at 2400tdee)

Lifting day:

  • 6am true mass 700cals.
  • 7-8am workout, 8:30am breakfast #2 - 2 egg sandwiches (600 cals).
  • 9am breakfast #3 200g of lean chicken, 50g rice, 10g nuts, veggies (4-500cals).
  • 12pm 200g of lean chicken, 50g rice, 10g nuts, veggies (4-500cals).
  • 15pm 200g of lean chicken, 50g rice, 10g nuts, veggies (4-500cals).
  • 18pm 10 egg whites.

Rest days:

  • 12pm 200g of lean chicken, 50g rice, 10g nuts, veggies (4-500cals).
  • 15pm 200g of lean chicken, 50g rice, 10g nuts, veggies (4-500cals).
  • 18pm 200g of lean chicken, 50g rice, 10g nuts, veggies (4-500cals). 10 egg whites.

Supps are taken with first meal, and before bed. On rest days I also take L-glutamine and L-tyrosine 500mgs each when I wake up.

[–]TheGoodBro 2 points3 points4 points 12 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

Training in the AM for me personally has resulted in an extreme lack of energy pretty much my entire life. Whether this is a problem with me, or a general human problem, I'm not sure.

It's you or your diet. If you actually read what I said I actually pointed out that breakfast was only consequential towards cognitive performance if you didn't exercise shortly after(<2hours). So yes, having some calories at 6 am before a workout at 7 am will help you feel better later on. For people who are just following the time table you laid out and aren't exercising shortly after it's a problem.

And I'm sure you do feel great now, working out and eating what you do would lead to a healthier body and thus better endocrine function. That being said I did note that my post was about optimizing what you're doing. Just because something is working doesn't mean you can't be doing it better.

[–][deleted] -5 points-4 points-3 points 12 years ago* (4 children) | Copy Link

If you actually read what I said I actually pointed out that breakfast was only consequential towards cognitive performance if you didn't exercise shortly after(<2hours).

And if you had read what I wrote:

One thing to keep in mind about this stack, is that my timing is based on a morning workout routine. I wake up at 6am and hit the weights at 7am, so I take my first stack at 6am, with a 700 calorie protein / carb pre-workout True Mass shake.

Then you'd realize that what you wrote was inconsequential to the fucking article, because I wrote in plain as day English that I use this as a pre-workout meal.

And I'm sure you do feel great now, working out and eating what you do would lead to a healthier body and thus better endocrine function. That being said I did note that my post was about optimizing what you're doing. Just because something is working doesn't mean you can't be doing it better.

Yes, you are correct, there are optimizations left for sure, tbh, this article was meant to help people get started on a decent stack and nothing more. The proper timings and the big hitters are important for people to know about, because not everyone has shit tons of cash to throw around at supps. This was supposed to be more about what a minimalists stack should look like, which I guess the article didn't emphasise as it should.

[–]TheGoodBro 4 points5 points6 points 12 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

Yes, you are correct, there are optimizations left for sure, tbh, this article was meant to help people get started on a decent stack and nothing more. The proper timings and the big hitters are important for people to know about, because not everyone has shit tons of cash to throw around at supps. This was supposed to be more about what a minimalists stack should look like, which I guess the article didn't emphasise as it should.

I agree and is why I largely hit at the True Mass shake. It's a waste of money, making your own calorie dense shakes would be cheaper and healthier. Also your use of glutamine and tyrosine are relatively pointless, unless you have a damaged intestinal wall or depressingly low dopamine levels neither are doing much for you respectively. Even then neither is really doing much. To top it off multivtiamins are not doing much for you either. You're better of spending the cash for an RBC analysis and supplementing with what you actually need, it'll be smarter and cheaper in the end.

http://ajcn.nutrition.org/content/47/2/186.short

We conclude that multivitamin and mineral supplementation was without any measurable ergogenic effect and that such supplementation is unnecessary in athletes ingesting a normal diet.

You can claim it makes you feel better but its likely just placebo, which can be surprisingly powerful.

Also the daily fish oil might be beneficial for the average sedentary individual whose never exposed to rapid spikes in inflammation but for athletes it increases oxidative damage and toxic waste in the body.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/21116022

Significant interaction effects between supplementation and time on resting MDA concentrations and Rmax were found (p = .03 and p = .04, respectively), with elevated values in the n-3 LCPUFA group after supplementation and no change in the placebo group's levels. The authors observed a significantly greater NO and oxidative-stress increase with exercise (MDA, Rmax, CDmax, and NO) in the n-3 LCPUFA group than with placebo. No main or interaction effects were found for retinol and α-tocopherol. These results indicate that supplementation with n-3 LCPUFAs significantly increased oxidative stress at rest and after a judo-training session.

If you want Omega-3's you're better off eating fish one or twice a week or just taking that fish oil once or twice a week to prevent the damage excessive fish oil intake can cause. A lot of people think we need fish oil to prevent inflammation because inflammation is inherently assumed to be a bad thing. Inflammation is ironically what signals the body its time to repair the damage that was just done and is a good thing in acute sharp doses. The reason fish oil helps the general sedentary population is because they're mostly fat and chronically inflammed because of it and the shitty diet they generally follow. Chronic inflammation causes problems yes, but unless you're fat or have an incredibly shitty diet fish oil won't be doing much for you. I know this goes against the current broscience dogma but you'll see soon enough that the recommendations for fish oil will slow down and inevitably stop. Just like the CDC had to recently apologize for recommending low salt diets, turns out they had no scientific evidence to do so and yet everyone you know will tell you that you should watch sodium. My point here is that the popular opinion isn't always the correct one or based on really any solid proof

[–][deleted] -3 points-2 points-1 points 12 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

is unnecessary in athletes ingesting a normal diet.

You are like the mecca of trolls, not taking a multi vitamin on a diet that consists of only chicken, nuts, spinach, and eggs would be the most ignorant fucking thing on the planet that I could do. You guys are so hilarious, you just cant stand that there is a little guy out there putting you to shame.

[–]TheGoodBro 0 points1 point2 points 12 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

You are like the mecca of trolls, not taking a multi vitamin on a diet that consists of only chicken, nuts, spinach, and eggs would be the most ignorant fucking thing on the planet that I could do.

Makes sense, I have no idea how humans even made it this far through evolution without their daily multi and True Mass shakes. It must have been the nightly buffet style dinners equipped the perfect diet and ample servings for all members of the tribe

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 12 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Last I checked prehistoric humans didnt "make it" that long... life expectancy was what... 30 years? Just keep trollin buddy ~

[–][deleted] -3 points-2 points-1 points 12 years ago (10 children) | Copy Link

The main outcome measurements were deconvolution and LH-T dose-response analyses of 10-min data. LH-T responses were regressed on glucose, insulin, leptin, adiponectin, age, BMI, and CT-estimated abdominal visceral fat. During the first 120 min after glucose ingestion, for each unit decrease in LH concentrations, T concentrations decreased by 86 (27-144) ng/dl (r = 0.853, P < 0.001). "

Speak English.

If you read what I said it pretty clearly indicates its about your recommendation for a True Mass shake at 6 am.

If you RTFA you'd realize I don't recommend this anywhere in the article, I include this information so the people reading about supps understand that I am taking the supps with something, and not on an empty stomach, and any other relevancies.

Although if it was an article about eating timing I would 1000000% recommend that people get a proper premeal workout ingested:

You also get the benefits of a blend of carbohydrates in True Mass, not just a ton of high-glycemic maltodextrin like most weight-gainers. BSN makes a full line of sports nutrition products and understand that, even in a weight gainer, you need a lot more than carbs and protein. So they included 5 grams of healthy fiber, almost twice as much as a bowl of Cheerios. They've also included the energizing fat MCT's (medium chain triglycerides) to help sustain energy levels.

Read up before you run around thrashing everything just because it isn't a fucking whole food. Supps are great for some purposes, and True Mass is great for a pre-workout meal when you are pressed for time. Fuck, even some of the BB pros take this shit on a regular basis, I guess they wouldn't know wtf they are talking about though since they dont quote a bunch of random irrelevant goverment funded studies with everything that comes out of their mouth.

I squat 405 for reps and train selectively fasted 5 days a week. I'm not just twiddling my thumbs here trying to make you look bad, I'm trying to help people get started right.

Means shit without posting your height and weight. Something tells me I've got better pound for pound numbers than you even though you're 10 years younger than me and haven't been through 500 women's worth of booze in the last half decade.

I'm not a troll and if you'd like to discuss the article or any of my points like adults I'm ready to do so.

Yes, you are. You just got your internet training wheels and the first thing you did was walk into forum discussing supps and tell me the entire points are invalid because I'm not a fasted training humper. You're that guy today, and yes, you pissed me off.

[–][deleted] 12 years ago* (9 children) | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[–][deleted] -3 points-2 points-1 points 12 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

6'3 220lbs ~12%. I also DL 500 and I've been lifting for 3 years as of last month. Its cool if you want to have a better ratio and then honestly good for you. However, it doesn't detract that I have plenty of experience to support my own anecdotal opinions and you have yet to provide any scientific references to denounce mine.

That's not bad... although kind of shit for a 22yo... I had a 300lb bench at 65kgs when I was your age, from gymnastics training though, not powerlifting...

And dude, you are the one that started this shit. I was just trying to help people get started with a simple stack lols.

[–][deleted] 12 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[–][deleted] -3 points-2 points-1 points 12 years ago* (6 children) | Copy Link

Naaa, the lb for lb strength is because I have a small skeletal frame (6'3'' wrists) and I'm at about 90% of my natty saturation levels, the small frame keeps my weight fairly low even at high muscularity. I have lanky ass arms.

I posted what I did cause you're supplement stack is the epitome of brosicence and they're tons of people who will see and likely follow this blatantly foolish advice.

You still haven't posted anything that was "wrong" with the stack except for the true mass (which isn't bad imo). Whats wrong with: Opti-men? What's wrong with fish oil? L-glutamine? L-tyrosine? Vitamin D-3? And how is it "bro-science" to take these supplements?

You are still harping on about true mass, yet Ronnie Coleman, 7x Mr. Olympia has done bulks on it, I fail to see how a professional athlete could make such a fatal mistake of "bro-sciencing" his way to the fucking pinnacle of his chosen sport. This is of course, the only example I know off the top of my head, and I'm sure he was getting paid big money to down the stuff, but my personal experience with it has been quite pleasing. I honestly do agree with you though, balancing out a perfect pre-workout from whole foods, using oats and whatnot would be optimal. I just think you're splitting hairs over true mass being "broscience" simply because it comes in a can. I don't have time to make these shakes myself, so I'm glad there is a quick and dirty option out there.

[–]TheGoodBro 1 point2 points3 points 12 years ago* (5 children) | Copy Link

Naaa, the lb for lb strength is because I have a small skeletal frame (6'3'' wrists) and I'm at about 90% of my natty saturation levels, the small frame keeps my weight fairly low even at high muscularity. I have lanky ass arms.

That's a weak ass excuse and I've seen your picture, you don't have high muscularity at all. Is this what you call high muscularity? http://www.tokyo-pickup.com/img/fluffy-before-stats.jpg

You're nowhere near your 90% natty limit and quit making excuses about your bone structure. You're not even 9.5% BF in that pic, more like 11 especially given how little muscle you actually have.

You still haven't posted anything that was "wrong" with the stack except for the true mass (which isn't bad imo). Whats wrong with: Opti-men? What's wrong with fish oil? L-glutamine? L-tyrosine? Vitamin D-3? And how is it "bro-science" to take these supplements?

Look above ^

You are still harping on about true mass, yet Ronnie Coleman, 7x Mr. Olympia has done bulks on it, I fail to see how a professional athlete could make such a fatal mistake of "bro-sciencing" his way to the fucking pinnacle of his chosen sport. This is of course, the only example I know off the top of my head, and I'm sure he was getting paid big money to down the stuff, but my personal experience with it has been quite pleasing.

Not only his the guy roided out of his fucking mind but he gets paid and represents the company so of course he says he uses it a shit load.

I don't have time to make these shakes myself, so I'm glad there is a quick and dirty option out there.

It takes 5 minutes to make a shake, maybe less. Saying you don't have time is a weak excuse

[–][deleted] -2 points-1 points0 points 12 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

That's a weak ass excuse and I've seen your picture, you don't have high muscularity at all. Is this what you call high muscularity?

Yup, let's see your take a selfie with no lighting on your phone thats better?

It takes 5 minutes to make a shake, maybe less. Saying you don't have time is a weak excuse

Perhaps, but my time is valuable, and true mass is pretty much designed for what I'm using it for.

[–][deleted] 12 years ago (13 children) | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[+][deleted] -7 points-6 points-5 points 12 years ago* (12 children) | Copy Link

Fuck the downvotes, I'm pissed about ignorant ass muther fuckers that don't RTFA before posting shit that is completely irrelevant.

None of his points have shit to do with the article, which is about supplements if you took the time to read it.

And this 150 lb muther fucker has 2x deads, 2x squats, and a 4.5x press, at 6 feet tall nonetheless.

When you're on a cut you slosh off like 5-10 lbs of water weight, and I'm also natty unlike 90% of people giving advice on the net, which also has relevancy.

It's nice that you guys get to sit back, and expose nothing about yourselfs while tossing insults at people putting themselves on the line, but it's also cowardly as fuck. Post your stats up here big boy, put your life on display, you speak as if you have some relevancy to the matter that is greater than my own, so why don't I hear any suggestions on how a newcomer to BB can have a better supplement stack?

My guess is you have no fucking idea.

[–][deleted] 3 points4 points5 points 12 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

There are no 6' tall 70kg muscle building experts. I'm 2 inches shorter, 20lbs heavier (w <6" wrists), and just as lean as this guy, and I take no supplements. And here he is talking about fasting and amino acid timing? Why the fuck would I or anyone else here take his advice on how best to spend my resources and attention when he's clearly dicking around with shit he doesn't need and getting weak results.

[–][deleted] -2 points-1 points0 points 12 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

There are no 6' tall 70kg muscle building experts.

Didn't say I was an expert bro, I'm an expert in living a chaotic life filled with endless pussy and booze, while keeping fit at the same time. Keep in mind I've managed to pull this shit off while boning 50-100 chicks a year.

There are no 6' tall 70kg muscle building experts. I'm 2 inches shorter, 20lbs heavier (w <6" wrists), and just as lean as this guy, and I take no supplements.

Big talker but I see no pics and no stats.

[–][deleted] -1 points0 points1 point 12 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

White guys picking up Japanese chicks is sort of like having a 2x bw deadlift at 70kg: it's easy as fuck and will impress no one worth impressing.

[–][deleted] 12 years ago* (8 children) | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[–][deleted] -2 points-1 points0 points 12 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Why did you come to TheRedPill and post a thread called "RedPill masculine lifestyle" if you didn't want to be critiqued by TheRedPill? Just kidding, I don't really care.

Been here since the begining bro, why you feel the need to hate on your fellow TRPers? We could have used this as platform for discussing improvements, instead a bunch of fat power lifters are tryin to tell me how get a body like a greek god. L.M.F.A.O.

[–]TheGoodBro 0 points1 point2 points 12 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

We could have used this as platform for discussing improvements

I tried doing that in my first post and you got incredibly butt hurt and defensive

[–][deleted] -2 points-1 points0 points 12 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

You were being a complete fuckin dick, just deal with it and move on. You act like a dick to people and they will be a dick straight back to you.

[–][deleted] 12 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[–]Nutz76 0 points1 point2 points 12 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Removed due to personal attacks.

[–][deleted] 12 years ago* (2 children) | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 12 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Awe... big fat man getting outperformed by a guy 60lbs lighter than him... can't do shit other than troll about it. DL this month was maxed at 130kgs, at the end of an 80-rep pyramid, perfect form all reps (no im not advocating volume training, but I was experimenting with it for a short while). 2 months ago max was 140kgs, havent been working my deads recently, and I've gone complete focus on leg press over squats, because I've been dealing with wrist problems that i can't seem to sort out in my squat form. Try hard, or gtfo bro ~ or just resign yourself to being a fatass donny thompson wannabe the rest of your life.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 12 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Hey everyone, for those of you interested in upping your T levels and living a masculine lifestyle, this article is all about getting your supplement stack straightened out.

Not too long ago I had... sort of a life changing experience. I was at the beach and met a cute little 20yo j-girl, we made out, went inside an abandoned beach house and I banged her doggy style in the locker room. This was all good and normal, life was great, and obviously I was enjoying my day at the beach, until of course, I ejeculated blood.

Since I've never blown a bloody load all over some chicks ass, this took me by a bit of a surprise and I took it as a message from my kidneys that it's time for a change. That weekend I decided, I was going to drop booze off my menu, and get my body back in 100% working order. Since that day, two months ago, I started a custom variation of IF training that was inspired by leangains, went from 16% bodyfat to sub 10% bodyfat, squatted 150kgs (a new PR for me), my body weight went from 80kgs to 70kgs, and I feel fucking amazing every. single. day.

Browse all authors
You can kill a man, but you can't kill an idea.

© TheRedArchive 2026. All rights reserved.
created by /u/dream-hunter