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Trial of Toronto man accused of harassing a feminist on twitter has an interesting twist...

genuinewitty

August 7, 2015
30 upvotes
/r/MensRights
http://www.genuinewitty.com/2015/08/06/gae-twitter-trial-update-did-the-crown-change-her-story-in-mid-trial/
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Title Trial of Toronto man accused of harassing a feminist on twitter has an interesting twist...
Author

genuinewitty

Upvotes 30
Comments 13
Date August 7, 2015 3:23 AM UTC
(10 years ago)
Subreddit Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/3g36bx/trial_of_toronto_man_accused_of_harassing_a/
Archive Link https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/trial-of-toronto-man-accused-of-harassing-a.973813
https://theredarchive.com/post/973813
Red Pill terms in post
feminist
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Comments

[–][deleted] 8 points9 points10 points 10 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

I'm not an expert in this area of the law. But is it possible that the Crown is deliberately damaging their own case? That is, aiming for a dismissal on a technicality because they know they won't win and don't want the court to set an adverse precedent.

[–]girlwriteswhat 8 points9 points10 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I hope that's what it is. We'll find out on Monday, I suppose.

This entire case has been an absolute farce.

[–]dangerousopinions 8 points9 points10 points 10 years ago* (1 child) | Copy Link

I really doubt that. This is just what happens when you have a really weak case. It's not at all surprising that the crown is unsure about their reasoning when they basically had to reverse engineer justification in order to pursue charges.

Edit:

That is, aiming for a dismissal on a technicality because they know they won't win and don't want the court to set an adverse precedent.

This assumes the crown involved has a horse in the race. I don't know if it's clear that she does. Guthrie is very well connected and this could very easily have been something Goldenburg got stuck with rather than something she pursued. There is nothing that suggests either one, but it's such a thin case that it would be easy to make a screw up like this without trying to.

[–]RedditorJemi 5 points6 points7 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I disagree. I think prosecutors generally know the law extremely well, and for the prosecutor to accidentally attempt to modify the charge in the middle of a court case would be almost unheard of. This prosecution knew very well what they were doing.

[–]Cypher_Aod 2 points3 points4 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

That is, aiming for a dismissal on a technicality because they know they won't win and don't want the court to set an adverse precedent.

That's certainly what it sounds like to me. While beneficial for Elliott, it's hardly the ideal situation re. the charlie-foxtrot that this law represents.

[–]DavidByron2 0 points1 point2 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

No.

[–]DavidByron2 4 points5 points6 points 10 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

How is it that the guy is already "banned from the internet" for three years exactly, since the case is not concluded yet?

[–]mansplain 4 points5 points6 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Terms of his release on bail, interview with his son about it.

[–]RedditorJemi 3 points4 points5 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Shortly after judge Knazan was seated he reached out to Elliott’s lawyer over the speakerphone and asked if he had access to a copy of the criminal code. Knazan’s next interaction gives some insight into how our judiciary has an inadequate understanding of Internet technology:

 

Judge: “What’s your email address?”

Defense: [reads email]

Judge: “And it’s a capital C?”

 

Most people who are familiar with email will quickly see the judge’s mistake; it doesn’t matter if it’s a capital or a small C, email addresses are case insensitive. It’s a common misunderstanding that’s inconsequential to Elliott’s case, but also a good example of the challenges the judge faces ruling on this highly technical trial.

It's not a common misunderstanding. It's an uncommon example of someone who actually understands how email technically works.

Although this example of extreme pedanticness is uncommon in the general public, it must be extremely common in the legal professions, where people pore over minutiae for many hours on end. I also imagine that if you need a judge who's familiar with RFC's these days (as they did in this case), that they wouldn't be too hard to come by. It's good to know that Gregory Elliot's judge is not going to be fooled on technical issues. Making a mistake on something as small as e-mail case in a legal hearing like this could be disastrous.

[–]plasticsporks21 1 point2 points3 points 10 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Where can I read the twitter exchange??

[–]ZimbaZumba 1 point2 points3 points 10 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

It appears the defense botched the case by not being there. They should have asked for the case to be dismissed there and then.

[–]girlwriteswhat 12 points13 points14 points 10 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

I'd rather see it go to a verdict.

The question was raised, and both the defence and the prosecution have until Monday to respond.

From what I've heard from eyewitnesses in the courtroom, the judge is... not extremely convinced that Guthrie et al were afraid. At one point, Guthrie was asked about the email Elliott sent her after she opted to go with another graphic artist for the logo, but offering to still let him contribute a poster to her organization.

The email was pretty much along the lines of, "No, if I can't do both, I'd rather do neither. I'm disappointed, but if you ever need any other work done, just shoot me an email. It was great meeting you."

Guthrie testified that the email was, between the lines, "seething with anger". She essentially asserted that anyone who couldn't see the frothing rage simmering in that email, they were blind. The judge kind of rolled his eyes.

[–]dangerousopinions 7 points8 points9 points 10 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I've commented back and forth with you on this before and I feel more strongly now, after this hearing, than ever that the judge is trying to get this to a verdict in order to set a precedent. I have to imagine, given the various twists and turns in an otherwise low stakes crime trial, that he would have thrown this out if there wasn't something to be gained by making a ruling.

I certainly hope this results in a verdict otherwise all the trouble Elliot has gone through will have been for not. At least if there is a verdict in his favour, his hardship will prevent such a use of the law in the future.

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