My question

aussietoads · 2019-12-29T23:15:14+00:00

Penile mutilation is not a Christian requirement, so being Catholic is no reason for your parents to have you mutilated, nor a good reason for you to mutilate any of your sons, now, or in the future.

dv_4 · 2019-12-30T01:32:07+00:00

Catholicism doesn't require it. In fact, you could argue that they're against circumcision, because they prohibit any sort of unnecessary body modifications:

The new (1994) Catechism of the Catholic Church at paragraph 2297 states in part: "Except when performed for strictly therapeutic medical reasons, directly intended amputations, mutilations, and sterilizations performed on innocent persons are against the moral law."

http://www.cirp.org/library/cultural/catholic/

Now, whether circumcision is "mutilation" is a different argument.

DarthEquus · 2019-12-29T23:13:54+00:00

If I may, I would recommend watching these presentations:

This presentation from Dr. Guest goes over the medical aspects very well: He covers the anatomy of the foreskin, the sensations, the medical aspects and statistics, the evolutionary aspects, cultural bias, medical ethics, and more: https://youtu.be/XwZiQyFaAs0?t=28m20

This presentation, Circumcision The Elephant in the Hospital, from Research Assistant Professor Ryan McAllister, challenges the normality of circumcision from both a social and medical perspective: https://youtu.be/Ceht-3xu84I

This is the documentary American Circumcision that was released on Netflix: https://archive.org/details/CircMovie

This video goes into the details regarding the supposed health benefits of circumcision: https://youtu.be/s9A6gPT55zQ

This presentation from Ethicist Brian Earp excellently covers all the ethical, social, and religious aspects: https://youtu.be/SB-2aQoTQeA

Another presentation by Brian Earp on how male circumcision proponents are making it possible to legalize FGM: https://youtu.be/GBH0g_Cl7Rk

This presentation, Sex and Circumcision: an American Love Story, by Eric Clopper should at least provide you with some laughs: https://youtu.be/FCuy163srRc

Here are some actual circumcision videos. If watching something like this makes you feel uncomfortable, imagine how he must feel: https://www.yourwholebaby.org/circumcision-videos

This rabbit hole gets even crazier when you take a look at the other male genital modifications done in different cultures throughout the world. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:Male_genital_modification. I'm guessing you wouldn't be too thrilled if some of these things were done to you as a baby.

2019-12-30T15:42:23+00:00

If you're Catholic, then you're already against circumcision.

Except when performed for strictly therapeutic medical reasons, directly intended amputations, mutilations, and sterilizations performed on innocent persons are against the moral law.

Catechism of the Catholic Church, 2297

2 Mark my words! I, Paul, tell you that if you let yourselves be circumcised, Christ will be of no value to you at all.

3 Again I declare to every man who lets himself be circumcised that he is obligated to obey the whole law.

4 You who are trying to be justified by the law have been alienated from Christ; you have fallen away from grace.

Galatians 5:2-4

It [The Holy Roman Church] firmly believes, professes and teaches that the legal prescriptions of the old Testament or the Mosaic law, which are divided into ceremonies, holy sacrifices and sacraments, because they were instituted to signify something in the future, although they were adequate for the divine cult of that age, once our lord Jesus Christ who was signified by them had come, came to an end and the sacraments of the new Testament had their beginning.

(...)

Therefore it strictly orders all who glory in the name of Christian, not to practise circumcision either before or after baptism, since whether or not they place their hope in it, it cannot possibly be observed without loss of eternal salvation.

-Pope Eugenius IV, Bull of Union with the Copts

Drago1214 · 2019-12-30T00:12:54+00:00

Circumcision is not a requirement of that religion. Has not been for a long time. I myself was raised secular, but all my Roman Catholic friends are not circumcised. Maybe that’s more of a being born in Canada thing. Ones dad is also a medical doctor. If that holds any weight.

That being said the idea of removing something from someone based on a idea is kinda cruel. You have no clue that, even if you try your son will remain a Roman Catholic when he gets older. So I would let him make that choice for himself.

The only religions that deem it a must are judaism and Muslims. On that note even some jews are not doing it anymore. Kind of an outdate idea left over of a bygone era.

Samantha_Cruz · 2019-12-30T01:31:39+00:00

any adult that chooses to have a circumcision should be free to make that decision but no one should ever force that on a child that does not have the ability to consent to this totally unnecessary procedure. it is almost never medically necessary and none of the so called benefits need to be done on an infant, they can wait until the subject is old enough to make an informed decision for themself.

no religious "right" gives you the authority to force that on a child but as an adult you can feel free to have a doctor snip off as much of your own genitals as you like.

mgtowolf · 2019-12-30T01:42:01+00:00

If it's not attached to your adult body, it isn't your penis to alter. Medical necessity is one thing, circumcision is a purely cosmetic surgery, that is only allowed to be done to boys. Girl's vaginas are protected by law, boy's penises should be protected by law as well.

hewillslayu · 2019-12-30T14:19:18+00:00

Genital mutilation

jimmi-jones · 2019-12-30T00:17:54+00:00

Do you feel religious membership should be by choice?

The reality is religious membership is reversible however religious circumcision is not.

From a human rights perspective concerning specifically children all is detailed in the United Nations Convention on the Rights of the Child (UNCRC) which is the most ratified convention in history.

“Article 14 of the UNCRC says that children and young people are free to be of any or no religion. Their parents can help them make decisions around religion, but: a parent can't force a child or young person to adopt a religion.”

https://www.ohchr.org/documents/professionalinterest/crc.pdf

goodmod · 2019-12-29T23:29:02+00:00

In future, please summarise your question in the title.

Although this is a good post, the title does not say enough about its subject. This forces people to click and read before they can decide whether they are interested. It also makes searching impossible.

If everyone did this, the subreddit would become unusable. Moreover, it means that your post will fail to reach some readers because they won't know what it's about.

So please don't do it in future. Take the time to describe your link, and save the time of hundreds of other people.

When making a title, it's best to assume the reader doesn't know what you're talking about - but don't go overboard with every detail. Then check if there are any words you can cut out without losing any important information.

Jackson2615 · 2019-12-30T04:41:58+00:00

Being CAtholic isn't a reason to be pro circumcision.

If an adult male wants to surgically alter his penis then that's his body , his right I guess. I don't see any reason why baby boys should have a surgical procedure to remove a perfectly normal and healthy part of their penis. I don't see any health risks in being uncircumcised as there are millions of such men living perfectly healthy lives.

The issue of hygiene is a simple matter of teaching boys how's to retract their foreskin , clean and replace the foreskins on their penis. A habit they will then take into adulthood. The foreskin provides a protective function and its removal only exposes a baby/person to unnecessary risks and complication , unless there is a medical emergency or imperative that it needs to be removed.

iainmf · 2019-12-30T07:33:19+00:00

Cutting body parts of babies for anything other than medical necessity is bad, immoral, unethical and dangerous.

It's up to you to justify the practice.

theskullcrusher8776 · 2019-12-30T09:44:07+00:00

Done without consent and irreversible it affects the brain its a painful proceedure even with anesthesia you lose most of the sensitivity and all of that would be fine if you gave consent and chose it but obviously kids cannot so ban infant circumcision but if you wanna get it done as an adult that's fine. Also no it does not decrease the chances of hiv and std look at Europe only 5%is cut yet they have way less std rates than America

Uzrathixius · 2019-12-30T07:37:30+00:00

Catholics pretend to be Christian, not Jewish, circumcision is not a Christian belief.

Title	My question
Author	ValterriBottas77
Upvotes	11
Comments	14
Date	December 29, 2019 10:29 PM UTC (6 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/ehcn3v/my_question/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/my-question.862056 https://theredarchive.com/post/862056

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