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Some thoughts on the differences between radical and third wave feminism

thetrollking

June 6, 2011

12 upvotes

/r/MensRights

http://www.ethecofem.com/2011/06/some-thoughts-on-differences-between.html

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Post Information

Title	Some thoughts on the differences between radical and third wave feminism
Author	thetrollking
Upvotes	12
Comments	10
Date	June 6, 2011 4:04 PM UTC (15 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/hsxfj/some_thoughts_on_the_differences_between_radical/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/some-thoughts-on-the-differences-between-radical.1039022 https://theredarchive.com/post/1039022

Comments

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points3 points 15 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]ManThoughts 1 point2 points3 points 15 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

[–]milkmiruku 0 points1 point2 points 15 years ago* (7 children) | Copy Link

[–]ManThoughts 0 points1 point2 points 15 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

[–]milkmiruku 0 points1 point2 points 15 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

[–]ManThoughts 0 points1 point2 points 15 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

[–]milkmiruku 0 points1 point2 points 15 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

[–]ManThoughts 0 points1 point2 points 15 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

That's what we are constantly told. Yet, where are these equality-minded feminists, and where is it demonstrated that they are opposing the "bad" feminists? Dr. Hoff-Sommers is one, and she is much appreciated, but she has been completely expelled from the mainstream feminist movement. I keep hearing not all feminists are like that, but I see little evidence. (And I've been looking.) At the very least equality-minded feminists should be calling out the bigoted and man-hating feminists, such as Jessica Valenti and Amanda Marcotte. But both of these vile women enjoy broad support among feminists. I have seen several Third-Wave feminist blogs laud Valenti and Marcotte, the latter being praised for her supposedly equitable perspective.

Valenti wrote an op-ed that men should be prosecuted as guilty until proven innocent when accused of rape. Marcotte praises false accusers, claims that women never commit domestic violence, and claims men are only nice to women because they want sex.

Valenti and Marcotte should be prime targets for feminist such as yourself to show "not all feminists are like that." Yet the only women I ever see criticizing Valenti and Marcotte are anti-feminist women. Indeed, Marcotte and Valenti are embraced by Third-Wave Feminism as a shining example of the movement. I'm on my iPhone right now or I would send you links.

If "not all feminists are like that" please explain this disparity to me.

[–]milkmiruku 0 points1 point2 points 15 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Sorry for the reply delay, life an' all :)

Feminism has various sometimes conflicting threads of thought, and I guess there are some folks who would say I was anti-feminist, but I think that if you agree with Hoff-Sommers then welcome to the club, you are a variety of feminist. For similar folk and views, check links on their Wikipedia article or on the more general equity and gender feminism article.

Saying that, I don't get their conception of 'equity feminism' vs. 'gender feminism'. I think contemporary gender roles can be harmful cultural stereotypes that people fall into, so that puts me in the latter camp, but I also don't agree that any sex should have a priority in any area of law, which is the former camp. Wikipedia says they are an "individual feminist" and that "Individualist feminism encourages women to take full responsibility for their own lives". I would have thought an individualist stance then be very close to an existential stance, i.e., that we can have the understanding and will to overcome cultural forces such as gender roles to allow, say, men to be able to be 'sensitive' without being laughed at by some?

[–]ManThoughts 0 points1 point2 points 15 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I don't agree with Hoff-Sommers all the time. I don't think she does enough to bring light to some important issues. Also, I can be a fan of someone without being ideologically compatible. For instance, I love Islamic art and Sufi poetry, but that doesn't make me a Muslim or a Sufi.

Individualist feminism would be something I could give the "thumbs-up" to as long as they eschewed the wealth redistribution and other special privileges that women get in society.

I would suggest you ponder the fact that Feminism is only possible BECAUSE it has allowed women to choose gender roles at will, but forces men into traditional ones. I've talked to so many Feminists who want to choose any gender role that sends their heart aflutter, but expect men to "man up" and "be a man." Feminism would not be anywhere nearly as oppressive as it is today if it did not force men to continue to sacrifice for women physically and financially.