Manospherians, I give you the answer to a curiosity I've had for years: Does Game work? Also, general discussion of Game and PUA's welcome.

General_Fear · 2015-06-16T02:25:11+00:00

Banks makes bank loans to people who don't need it.

Same goes for game. If you are a but ugly guy with two heads, I don't care how much game you have, you will not get anywhere. However, if you are a hot guy. A real 10 that makes a woman drool. And you can't talk to women, forget it, you will not score. However, if you are a 10 and you learn game, then you will score with women.

PUA's take the mystery out of dating. Take for example David Deangelo. He teaches cocky funny game. How many times have women said that they like a guy with a sense of humor. So a guy hears that and tries to hard being funny. Lands on his face. He has no game. He might be a 10, but does not know what he is doing. He learns the right way of telling jokes around women. Bang. He is scoring. The woman wants the 10 to approach her. But she will not go to bed with a guy who can't even make it to first base.

To sum up. All game does is help a guy who has the potential of being with women and just need a push in the right direction.

Morranaii · 2015-06-16T02:46:36+00:00

[deleted]

machine_language · 2015-06-16T02:49:59+00:00

Not sure what your point is OP (I haven't heard of "game" before), but if you're trying to start a conversation about picking up women, doesn't make sense to do so on /r/mgtow. We don't care by definition.

Xuixien_TheEpic · 2015-06-16T15:15:08+00:00

I've done PUA stuff and it worked. You can write all the blogs you want about how, theoretically, it doesn't work, but in practice it worked for me. And I'm nothing to look at and I'm poor. vOv

scrubzor · 2015-06-16T15:10:12+00:00

This blog is very misguided as to the state of the current PUA community. The writer of this article is pretty uninformed and knows little about PUA today.

I'm also confused as to why anyone would feel the need to 'debunk' game. To justify that they have no power to change their dating/sex life as it currently exists? So they can avoid taking a long hard look at themselves and admit that there could be room for self improvement? Seems to me like the author of this article wants to debunk game so he can protect his own ego and justify the quality of his own game sans PUA. If you debunk PUA, then you might as well debunk every form of self-improvement on the market. And also just accept that self improvement as a whole is largely a myth. And accept that you cannot change as a person. PUA is an extension of self-help.

David DeAngelo hasn't been relevant in 10+ years. The man certainly laid a foundation for the PUA community, but PUAs like him, Mystery, Neil Strauss, Ross Jefferies, existed in a time when PUA was in infantile stages. These PUAs discovered the tactics that worked, but they did not understand the underlying principles behind them. They were all show and no substance.

PUA these days is not focused on 'creating attraction'. It is a mix of 'inner game' (self improvement/mindsets/attitude) and 'outer game' (social skills). Essentially both increasing one's SMV while learning how to navigate highly social environments. The focus is less on SIMULATING an attractive man, and more focused on actually BEING an attractive man.

PUA does not claim to be able to attract any woman. Even master PUAs don't get every girl. PUA simply exists to increase the amount of women in one's life. And it works. Alot of the advice taught by Real Social Dynamics, is practical and actionable. The PUA community is not selling a magic pill, nor does it claim to. The PUA community exists to help men through a long arduous journey of self-improvement.

I can attest to the PUA community, because it helped me go from a sexless nerd to having a vibrant sex life. It took hard work, many nights of going out in the city, chatting on forums, reading books, meeting other guys who were into the stuff, attending a few seminars. Constant trial and error. Years and years of learning. I look back on my life of where I started 6 or 7 years ago, and where I'm at now, and the difference is night and day. From a dorky gamer with crippling social anxiety to being able to go out on a friday night, chat up lots of different women and consistently get at least a few phone numbers. Wouldn't have been possible without the lessons I learned from the PUA community.

TheQuestion78 · 2015-06-16T06:48:27+00:00

The article was right in that almost all PUA tips boil down to general comments that are repeated again and again. To me, the only reason they have a consumer base is because they manage to repacket this general knowledge in an easier to observe fashion. Cannot blame them for extracting money out of fools who don't do that kind of research (especially with the power of the internet).

The saddest part to me is that some men are so clearly slaves to their biology that they do everything in their power to go out of there way to be something they are not simply to feel the sensation of having their dick in a mouth/vagina. It reeks of low confidence and shows you really don't have authority over yourself. That is why I feel RP is good for most dudes since RP (and MGTOW) takes you back to square one and teaches you the most important lesson of all: Fucking respect YOURSELF above all and be your own man.

Rufus_Reddit · 2015-06-16T15:49:18+00:00

The article is an example of crapulence on the internet: Build a giant strawman about "seduction myth" and then tip it over. Surely, there's some woo in the PUA cabinet, but most of it is prima facie true:

More attempts lead to more successes.
Presentation matters.
Confidence matters.
Women have sex drive.
Effective social interaction is a skill that can be learned.
People are controlled by their context in subtle and powerful ways.

I recall reading the PUA stuff a few years ago expecting some dark secrets, and while there's some deception involved, it's more about confidence, sensitivity, and honesty than anything else.

oldredder · 2015-06-19T07:30:20+00:00

game 100% works. What fails is if you appear to be a faker, appear to have something really wrong with you, or if the women you're trying to game is way too high in value compared to you (and knows it) or way too low in value (and knows it).

It throws them off in those cases but you can re-adjust.

I do it just to confirm responses and interest.

You can't debunk game. I've learned it since 95, used it and it works 100%.

timoppenheimer · 2015-06-16T02:01:51+00:00

Edit: it seems to be a partial blog. The original appears to have been lost. If anyone has seen, for example, the "experimental" section from the original blog, I'd love to see it. The author claims that he challenged the PUA's to prove their methods in a clear, scientific manner by laying out an easy experiment, but I'm having a hell of a time finding the experiment.

mydark · 2015-06-16T02:55:02+00:00

I think there's validity to game but it has to be organic to who you are for it to work, plus you are always playing the odds and last man standing rules usually apply. When I studied it years ago I felt it opened my eyes to a lot of stuff I didn't know and helped me break blue pill mentality so for me I got alot out of it. I don't know if their stuff is bullshit because most guys have seen plenty of hot girls with guys who are complete garbage. Also how many women go for guys who are on death row. There's something there.

2015-06-16T04:03:21+00:00

It's like knowing tricks to get a discount on a used car; when you're buying a lemon in the first place. Why do you want to buy a lemon? Why would you want to learn game?

The answer is the same: You shouldn't. Don't talk to the Lemon Bros. Auto Mall and don't talk to women. You'll find that you don't get roped into ridiculous contracts that way.

itgscv1 · 2015-06-16T06:13:27+00:00

How does it debunk game? I see a lot of attacking various groups in the manosphere with not much substance in the posts. They are a few paragraphs of opinion without much to back them up. The post about mattress girl is a glaring example. There are quite a few legal reasons why he didn't include her in his lawsuit, but all the blog puts forth is "I think x, I suspect y". Too much speculation and not enough substance to back up any of the assertions.

I checked red pill delusions and its filled with roosh, avfm, etc. While roosh did contribute a bit to trp, there really isn't much overlap between rok and trp. Also mensrights generally dislikes trp so that's a big red flag for me. While I don't agree with avfm that much, there are legitimate issues men are facing in western societies and this blog is just alarmist and not rooted in reality. There's a lot of attacking of pua/avfm, basically nothing trying to debunk sidebar material from trp.

TRP is very different from PUA, pua and game just gives you some tools and you try out. TRP explains why things are the way they are, what you do with the knowledge is up to the you.

Can game fail? Sure, if you are only using pua techniques without understanding why you aren't going to be as successful as someone who swallows the red pill and internalizes the sidebar. People that only try pua without knowing about trp are much more likely to fail. If you are reading these blogs and agreeing then you don't really understand the red pill.

thrownaway_MGTOW · 2015-06-17T06:32:02+00:00

IMO, the only "game" being played is the one being played ON the men who think they are learning how to be "players" in the "game".

For the most part they are (at a minimum) sacrificing their TRUE selves in order to chase after pussy, to "become what women [really] WANT"...

And in many cases they are sacrificing (or being suckered out of) a lot more (in terms of time, money, etc) as well.

Keep in mind that the entire "goal" here is essentially gynocentric -- and not merely in the superficial form of centralizing women -- but in the deepest meaning of centralizing the gynecology organs: worse, it's NOT even about obtaining access or control over the reproductive aspects (i.e. to the end of having children), but rather more specifically it is about the most BANAL and PUERILE aspect: it's about a high-school (or middle school) locker room notion of "success" -- that is, achieving a high "notch count", aka just how many wet "pussies" (vaginas) have you (temporary) gained access to for a sufficiently long enough period of time so as to get your dick wet (well, actually since it's wrapped in latex, the dick itself won't be getting "wet", but getting the condom "wet" {inside AND out} apparently qualifies as success).

My neighbor's dog seems to have the same goal (and quite frankly probably a higher notch count).

Omega_Effect · 2015-06-17T14:33:16+00:00

Game? Which platform? Nintendo? Playstation or xBox? Or maybe some good old-timey arcade machines?

2015-06-16T02:07:28+00:00

At my book, whoever gets frustrated with anything related to try to manipulate others to achieve his own desires gets what deserve.

Having said that, I would concede an exception to a video titled something like "x rules to success with woman", because almost half of those "rules" are not even related to woman, but be a better person. "Take responsibility of yourself", "accept things as they are", "be honest", "don't complain", etc.

thrownaway_MGTOW · 2015-06-16T19:37:21+00:00

Game is bullshit. When I see a hot girl that I want to fuck, they're "game" and words have nothing to do with me wanting to fuck them. It's the physical factors and presence. It's probably the same shit with women. She'll see a guy and their body, height, and face will make the girl want to have sex with him. It varies individually but is generic on average.

I'm short, so this is one of the many factors that make it appear as if I have no game. Other guys say it's all about confidence. They fail to realize that my height can be related to my confidence. When you notice that you're treated differently and almost are never the preferred type, that affects your confidence and self esteem. A tall guy will be taken more seriously and will always be more likely to receive positive and wanted attention along with validation. A tall guy is more likely to have their confidence reinforced. But it's always the physical characteristics. It's fucked up, but what am I gonna do? Wear heels?

Title	Manospherians, I give you the answer to a curiosity I've had for years: Does Game work? Also, general discussion of Game and PUA's welcome.
Author	timoppenheimer
Upvotes	0
Comments	45
Date	June 16, 2015 1:14 AM UTC (11 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MGTOW
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MGTOW/comments/39zgxd/manospherians_i_give_you_the_answer_to_a/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MGTOW/manospherians-i-give-you-the-answer-to-a-curiosity.626601 https://theredarchive.com/post/626601

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