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[–]trouble_with_trilbys33 points34 points35 points (5 children) | Copy Link
[–]ZealousMathematician16 points17 points18 points (4 children) | Copy Link
[–]trouble_with_trilbys11 points12 points13 points (3 children) | Copy Link
[–]WikiTextBot1 point2 points3 points (2 children) | Copy Link
[–]trouble_with_trilbys1 point2 points3 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]ZealousMathematician1 point2 points3 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[+]IllusionWLBD [recovered] (21 children) | Copy Link
Why would you think about it? Have you ever had your own company? Running a company isn't about playing buddies. From what I see here many MGTOWs here are laid back and don't seem to want to hassle themselves too much. That is understandable, but a mangina, from an owner perspective, would be a better worker. His nagging wife will make his work his sanctuary, he will be more obedient, flexible and hard working. If you find yourself such a MGTOW, fine, but too many problems for a doubtful result.
[–]ColdStoryBro5 points6 points7 points (4 children) | Copy Link
[+]IllusionWLBD [recovered] (2 children) | Copy Link
It depends on the size of the company we are talking about. The smaller the company, the harder they should look at the qualifications. If it is some kind of corporation, then I agree with you. However, it is NOT always the case. I have experience of being hired as a worker despite my quite arrogant character and my looks, which was originally good, but partly destroyed by illness.
Yet I agree with you, a company is not your friend or family, it is like a government. It will use you as long as you have value to offer, after that it is rational to dispose of the "body". A rational man should have the same attitude towards his work and take whatever he can from it(knowledge, skills, money and connections). I just don't understand what is so bad about it. It is the human nature.
[–]ColdStoryBro0 points1 point2 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]IllusionWLBD2 points [recovered] | Copy Link
[–]JosephBancor -1 points0 points1 point (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]trouble_with_trilbys2 points3 points4 points (4 children) | Copy Link
[+]IllusionWLBD [recovered] (3 children) | Copy Link
I am not saying not to hire MGTOWs. I am saying to hire productive and useful people. Whether they are MGTOWs or not is irrelevant. If I could hire a woman, donkey or alpha centaurians to significantly boost my company's efficiency, then I would be glad to put up with their shit.
[–]trouble_with_trilbys1 point2 points3 points (2 children) | Copy Link
[+]IllusionWLBD [recovered] (1 child) | Copy Link
:D Life is such a mess that taking it seriously is really bad for your health.
The more difficult situation or shittier character you have, the more you need to be qualified. Like I said, it is all about profit and efficiency, so your qualification always matters(unless you are a smooth talker or downright good manipulator).
Anyway, wish you luck with your job hunting.
[–]trouble_with_trilbys0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[+][deleted] [recovered] (9 children) | Copy Link
I agree with your skepticism, but...
Not necessarily.
Yup, he'll say late and surf the web, etc.
Nope on all counts.
-- The problem here is that your base assumptions -- while far more common -- are in fact JUST as faulty as OP's. You assume that because a guy is "indebt/indentured" and therefore desperate to keep the paycheck coming, possibly uses the workplace as a "refuge/hideaway" that he will somehow be "productive."
But the threat of losing a job will only make someone work just hard enough to NOT be fired.
-- Now of course OP's assumptions -- not the least of which being his delusions regarding the ease with which he expects to identify (real, true) MGTOW guys -- & conclusions are at least as fallacious; they're just not as common.
[+]IllusionWLBD [recovered] (6 children) | Copy Link
DWShimoda, what I made is a rough generalization. Lets take two guys. The first one is "live for yourself", the second one is "you have obligations for ...". Although it is, of course, rational to study case by case, but if I had to choose blindly, I would bet the second one will be more beneficial to me. He has more reasons, after all.
As for hard enough to NOT, I worked with Japanese companies and some of them had interesting tactic. Their managers would set extremely high goals and make their workers do the work. The result? To complete everything you would have to stay overtime everyday. Still they seemed to struggle with it and the managers were happy to point that out and threat them. Although I doubt it is a good tactic(in the long run for productivity), yet there are ways to handle "bare minimum" workers. Pretty sure you know if you are a Japanese.
Agree with you on the last paragraph.
[+][deleted] [recovered] (5 children) | Copy Link
LOL. Of course you would -- but choosing "blindly" means ignoring facts, abandoning "reason" and instead going with the "default" of your "gut" (aka "truthiness") -- problem is of course that isn't your "gut"... it's the preprogrammed response that you've been indoctrinated into believing, because it's the unexamined "water" you've been swimming in your entire life.
Basically what you'll be doing is cutting off your nose to spite your face -- you may see a short term gain (just as the generation that sells off some "family farm" can reap a windfall), but it's not going to work long term.
--
Zere zertainly are... ve haff vays tu mak u "verk"* Ja, did ist tru.
--
Again, LOL... no, he really doesn't have "reasons" -- and the "beneficial to you" is dubious (at best). He won't be a better worker, he will simply be a bitter worker (or actually non-worker "warm body" who appears to be performing some minimal "tasks").
-- To be blunt about it: SLAVES -- regardless of the mechanism used to enslave them -- are never really productive. (And actually ALL of human history attests to that.)
* But as the Russian (Soviet Communist era) proverb-joke goes: "They pretend to pay us, we pretend to work."
[+]IllusionWLBD [recovered] (4 children) | Copy Link
Then maybe a seasoned swimmer like you will point out to something more... explanatory than LOLing and that mystic dance with short/long term? Perhaps I have something to learn from you?
I see. So you are not a Japanese and have no idea how they speak. And I have a strong feeling that you are trying to put into my words the meaning they never had. Oh well...
Let's take not a small company, where it is easy to control, but a big corporation. Do you really think that big corporations however faulty they are, don't have methods to deal with laziness?
[–]DWShimoda0 points1 point2 points (3 children) | Copy Link
[+]IllusionWLBD [recovered] (2 children) | Copy Link
Oh, I have a feeling you are so smart. Who could think that there are things like different strategies with different goals and levels of weariness of the equipment and employees and etc... Well, I kindly thank you for your explanation.
Oh, I see. Then I guess every corporation out there is on the brink of collapse due their inefficiency. Or... not?
But still I am interested in your thoughts. What is your suggestion? What would you implement to boost efficiency? Clearly such a bright man should have some kind of a crafty idea, no?
[–]DWShimoda0 points1 point2 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]IllusionWLBD1 point [recovered] | Copy Link
[+]rahl_r [recovered] (1 child) | Copy Link
Depends who you are working for, the workplace conditions, and the contracts (written & unwritten ones).
Personally, I have some awful experiences with office-type environments. You dig into it with supercharged work ethics, then you are setting yourself for a disappointment, as the sociopaths up there toss even more work<sup>1</sup> at you, for their entertainment. All for the same measly salary...
Not to mention that in those office careers, working hard gets you pigeonholed into a position of a mule (those Ferrari bonuses have to come from somewhere).
My conclusion: work as a (co)owner of your own company, as an independent contractor, or at least in a high-skilled job with high level of autonomy and/or where the results matter. Control your environment.
<sup>1</sup> "Work", heh. More like, shifting papers, filling in M$ Excel spreadsheets, and other mediocre ways to kill yourself slowly. The worst part of it? Such workplaces are designed as a meat grinder on purpose - that, or those low-level managers are not that smart (their workflows are cumbersomely ineffective).
There was even a story of a guy who was expected to be calculating some Excel nonsense all day. He was smart, though - so he programmed in some functions that did most of the calculations for him. When he made the mistake of telling others, his coworkers started resenting him (ooh, he is going to eliminate our jobs) and his dimwit boss tried to undermine him.
[–]WhistlingAlong 2 points3 points4 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]CorpulentLeprechaun2 points3 points4 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]MGTOWorSLAVE 2 points3 points4 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]SuspectedLumber2 points3 points4 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]OutWithTheNew1 point2 points3 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]DWShimoda1 point2 points3 points (0 children) | Copy Link