Why does speaking out about the issues men face always trigger a furious reaction? Journalist, Dan Bell, is still shocked by the hostility faced by those who speak up about men's issues.

DougDante · 2015-09-08T10:04:00+00:00

My comment:

But the moment men do try to explore the many issues they face, unless they do so within a framework sanctioned by feminism, they are often immediately ridiculed or shot down as sexists and reactionaries.

Why? Because feminist aligned institutions support this bullying in order to control the narrative.

/u/NeuroticIntrovert talks about his experiences of a feminist protest during a men's rights event at the University of Toronto:

But, as we're seeing at the University of Toronto, when the Canadian Association for Equality tries to have that conversation, feminist protestors come in and render the space unsafe. I was at their event in April - it was like being under siege, then ~15 minutes in, the fire alarm goes off. Warren Farrell, in November, got similar treatment, and he's the most empathetic, feminist-friendly person you'll find who's talking about men's issues. .. You might say these people don't represent mainstream feminism, but mainstream feminist sites like Jezebel and Manboobz are attacking the speakers, attacking the attendees, and - sometimes blatantly, sometimes tacitly - endorsing the protestors. .. So our man from before rejects the patriarchy, then he leaves feminism because he was told to, then he tries to build his own space, and powerful feminists attack it and try to shut it down, and we all sit here and wonder why he might become anti-feminist.

Read more at the reddit mensrights FAQ.

2015-09-08T16:16:56+00:00

https://www.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/1rca13/the_differences_between_being_a_male_feminist_and/cdluj35

Men who complain as men, rather than as proxies for some other group (like a male feminist, or a male anti-racism activist), are seen as whiners, weak, angry, bitter, selfish, etc.

Complain about other people's problems and demand change or redress? That very much fits traditional ideals of masculinity--standing up for those weaker than oneself.

Complaining about your own problems, and demanding change or redress--especially when those problems are man vs woman problems (even if the vs is only a comparison, and not adversarial)? This violates a TON of traditional masculine ideals. You're supposed to protect and provide for women, not demand that privileges and protections be taken away from them so YOU can have more, you selfish bastard. You're supposed to endure suffering, dust yourself off and overcome--if you can't, you're weak and useless. If you're angry on someone else's behalf, that's righteous. If you're angry on your own behalf? You are now dangerous and threatening. And if you're an angry man who wants to strip protections from a weaker class of people (women), who knows how dangerous you really are?

Now look at feminism, and how it didn't really challenge traditional feminine ideals. Women want more? They've always wanted more, and it's always been an entitlement of women to be provided for. Women want protection? They've always wanted and needed protection. Women want a greater say? Henpeck'd husbands have been "yes, dear"ing their women since the dawn of time. Women yelling and being angry? An annoyance, but not a threat. Give her what she wants and she'll calm down and everyone can have some peace. Seeing men as dominant and women as weak and deserving of help (even when it's not the case)? Check, check and check. Women being entitled to chivalry on the part of men? Hah!

davesfriendchip · 2015-09-08T12:59:32+00:00

An old Schopenhauer quote explains it,

All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident.

Tmomp · 2015-09-08T12:42:10+00:00

Great post looking at the lack of empathy people give men.

This community would do well to answer that question. Tackling it will point us how to advance. Leaving it unanswered will result in our spinning our wheels getting nowhere.

Women's rights figured out how to answer their question. Now women can work, wear pants, etc. If we want equality, we have to understand the source of all this resistance.

MittenMagick · 2015-09-08T18:00:42+00:00

Because feminists believe that if you are focusing on one group's issues, you are discriminating against the other group. However, if questioned about the discrimination of focusing only on women's issues instead of men's, they will tell you the exact opposite. It's part of what makes feminism so laughable.

dewarsmaduro · 2015-09-08T12:06:02+00:00

It has been my experience that these routine responses are not limited to feminist issues. Most Liberals and Progressives are neither liberal nor progressive when entertaining any conversation beyond their own.

mwobuddy · 2015-09-08T15:51:01+00:00

Because it sounds to people who believe they are the only victims, as if the privileged are saying how bad they have it. Imagine a millionaire complaining about taxes to poor people.

Its the same way women claim they live in a rape culture in the west where rape is considered abhorrent by nearly all the population and treated as such, while you have in Afghanistan a real rape culture where women have no choice but to put out sexually.

"First world problems". "privileged people problems".

They turn that same kind of feeling towards people talking about "men's issues" because of the widely believed myth that men inherently have it good.

Electroverted · 2015-09-08T18:24:23+00:00

This comment struck me:

I find it quite remarkable and ironic that some of the best champions for men's rights now are not just women, but former radical feminists like Prof. Janice Fiamengo (who now says she hates feminism) and classical feminists like Prof Cristina Hoff Sommers (who spends far more time arguing for men's rights than she does for women's rights).

I wonder if it has anything to do with women having a strong immunity to character assassination than men do.

Clockw0rk · 2015-09-08T19:05:59+00:00

^{^Since} ^{^this} ^{^has} ^{^more} ^{^traction} ^{^than} ^{^the} ^{^other} ^{^copy} ^{^of} ^{^this} ^{^I} ^{^already} ^{^commented} ^{^on...}

It's a nice little article that speaks honestly about a problem, but I'm left discouraged by the lack of any... Call to action, or 'we have top men working on this'.

To some extent, it feels a bit like an oil spill in a remote region.

Oh no, here's a horrible thing that's going to ruin the environment for decades to come! And there's a top team of specialists.. wait, no. There's a group of volunteers.. uh, sorry, that's not allowed either. Ummm... Well, alright. People that avoid detection as they volunteer to clean up will not be shot on sight by the guards posted to cover this whole thing up. Cheers!

You'll forgive me if my enthusiasm for raging against the machine is little more to set up a lawn chair and watch the world burn.

dman5300 · 2015-09-08T19:42:51+00:00

The thing that pisses me off the most is that I guarantee a feminist would not stand in a mans shoes. WE ARE ALL PEOPLE. Some of us are strong or weak, big or small no matter what we have had this whole talk with others and we all know it. There are men in this world who cannot protect themselves just as many women as can not protect themselves. There is no weaker race only HUMAN BEINGS. If a woman is willing to go through the same things a man goes through, then she is equal. If women sit by saying you should do it because you are the man how is that equality? How would the situation go if it were reversed. People get to up in their anger about the actions of a few angry folk and forget there are actually sensible people we should be working together with to create equality.

thebard2000 · 2015-09-08T23:13:02+00:00

Because we can't have our disposable tools objecting to their role.

Basically it.

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