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[–]spaldingnoooo8 points9 points10 points 11 years ago* (3 children) | Copy Link
If anything, I've always found that most men I know are better at standardized tests than women. The girls I knew in high school all sucked in math, were decent in language, and usually ended up killing the writing section because they were so good at spewing bullshit out of their mouths. I just know they added that writing section to the SAT's to help people who weren't actually smart but could string together paragraphs of crap in a style that some woman/beta male grading the subjective section would like.
The article I linked to in the edit pretty much confirms everything I've ever seen in regards to female students in schools. Most of the time, the girls getting the best grades (not counting my fellow females who were good at math or science), got the best grades by following directions the best and always prepared the most for a test to get a good grade after which they would promptly forget everything they just learned and most of them simply didn't have the ability to adapt to awkward wording of questions or think outside the box in a stressful timed environment. Funny how it "must be" discrimination because it makes no sense that girls getting good grades don't test well all the time. I also forgot that girls are the best suck-ups for grade increases, especially in high school.
Edit: Just had to do a quick search and my cynical suspicions were confirmed.
"The SAT essay might not be a good test of writing skills, but its original purpose was to allow more young women to win National Merit Scholarships. Before 1999, 60% of these prestigious scholarships were awarded to young men despite the fact that more than half the students who took the qualifying exam (Preliminary SAT/ National Merit Scholarship Qualifying Test) were women. But in 1994, FairTest filed a complaint with the US Department of Education's Office for Civil Rights (OCR) charging the Educational Testing Service and College Board with illegally discriminating against females for designing and administering the PSAT/NMSQT in a manner that violates the Title IX gender equity requirements. To settle the case, the test-makers agreed to add a multiple-choice "Writing Skills" section beginning with the high school class of 1999. After that change, the gender gap narrowed and in 1999 more than 45% of the awards were given to women." http://www.fairtest.org/gender-bias-victory-wins-millions-females-national
[–]Atavisionary[S] 1 point2 points3 points 11 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Feminists are all about the money. Whatever they can do to ensure more money is funneled to women however unjustly. The fact that the tax bill is heavily biased against men never enters their thoughts.
[–]Rougepellet0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Men are the expendable gender. If anyone has to be stomped on in order to pull up another group or gender, it has to be men.
[–]IDefyAxioms0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
Fuck all those college acceptance hoops. I'm currently dealing with all of this right now (HS Senior), and between College Board's ridiculous prices for tests that most high-level colleges demand and lack of solid financial aid for white males, it's frustrating as all hell. It's prime example of how having a pussy gets you free shit - all you have to do is show up and spew out some bullshit essays like it's a Miss America Pageant.
[–]rcglinsk8 points9 points10 points 11 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link
Intelligence is to the egalitarian religion as evolution is to fundamentalist Christianity. Each is completely sound scientifically but the true believers have to deny it. So it goes.
[–]melaffu0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link
Did you read the article? I mean, it's an interesting idea, and I've bet you've stated it before in different settings, but it doesn't really have much to do with the article at all.
[–]rcglinsk0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
It's my hypothesis for why standardized tests would be adjusted until men and women get the same scores. Hear no evil, see no evil.
[–]Atavisionary[S] 0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
In neoreaction, the idea that progressivism (of which egalitarianism is a subset) is a type of religion is well accepted. In fact, a bit of historical work can easily trace it back to mainline protestantism.
[–]rcglinsk1 point2 points3 points 11 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
Curtis Yarvin may well go down in history as the most influential philosopher of our time.
It's pretty weird, I think. Some guy made a decent bundle in the tech bubble, and then decides to write a mass of philosophy on a blog. Said writings then spawn or influence hundreds of websites and hundreds of thousands or more opinions.
If not obvious, I'm a purist, neoreaction/dark enlightenment equals Moldbug. Start to finish.
[–]Atavisionary[S] 1 point2 points3 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
That's the great thing about rejecting egalitarianism. You can actually admit when an individual has an out-sized impact.
[–]Atavisionary[S] 0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
It actually has a lot to do with the article. I just don't focus on the religious qualities of egalitarianism which leads people to have the kind of beliefs which lead to artificially demonstrated equality.
[–]wheyapartment0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
I loved standardized testing in school
The only kids who would complain were the stupid ones who needed weeks to learn how to solve basic fractions. To think that the education system actually CATERS to them is absurd. We should be catering to the best students cause they're our best shot for the future. Most people will end up working shitty jobs where they don't need to know how to do trigonometry or physics anyway, so why bother keeping them up to par? They just hold the smart kids back and make school boring for them.
I don't think you understand the thrust of the article. Spatial reasoning has been empirically shown to be an important form of intelligence with especial relevance to science and technology. Beyond under-servicing talented people (who don't know and thus aren't complaining) it also means that society is mis-allocating human capital to its own detriment.
[–]sir_wankalot_here-3 points-2 points-1 points 11 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link
Good article except for the whining part. There is a correlation between IQ and wages. But since modern schooling is often determined by IQ tests, this could explain the correlation.
Feydman only had an average IQ, Mensa offered him a position, but he turned it down since he was not qualified :-) Besides being a great mathematician and physicist he also had many other hobbies such as lock picking and bongo drum playing.
Most inventions/discoveries where made by people who did not finish university.
[–]TheDefinition7 points8 points9 points 11 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
That is a ridiculous thing to say. Certainly, people who finished university have more discoveries per capita than people who haven't.
IQ is a perfectly reasonable and well-founded metric as a predictor of success. Read The Bell Curve.
[–]sir_wankalot_here0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
See OP's comment on Spatial Intelligence. Correlation vs causation. Mr Teleb in his book Antifragile explains why this is so. Most important discoveries where made by people who did not have degrees in that field, or in some cases did not have a degree. Boolean algerbra and Baysian filters where discovered by guys who did not have degrees in that field. They are the building blocks of computers.
Take everyday life changing items and look up who originally invented them. In most causes it was invented by a person who did not have a degree.
Buddy of mine who is getting paid to ~~ tour and study the high end brothels of SE Asia~~ improve a large companies operations is a US High School dropout. He has under him guy's with PhDs whose technical knowledge is far greater then his. But they can't see cause and effect. So you can just pick these smart guy's brains for a day and then come up with a solution that is obvious.
Switzerland has the best economy in the westernized world when you factor in the lack of natural resources. Switzerland has the least amount of degrees per capita.
I have read "The Bell curve" the author brings up many valid points.
en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Antifragile
[–]Atavisionary[S] 4 points5 points6 points 11 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link
The problem with that is few people ever had their spatial reasoning properly evaluated. Two of the studies I linked to evaluate the relation between spatial reasoning and patent ownership.
The longitudinal study of mathematically precocious youth pretty clearly demonstrates that more IQ is always better and even distinguishes between high ability people with similar degrees. You should be able to get the following paper at libgen.org
http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/19000201
[–]sir_wankalot_here0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
TIL what Spatial Intelligence is. I wonder if it can be increased ?
Brian Bethune defines spatial intelligence as the ability to grasp a changing whole and anticipate its next stage; the ability to make quick decisions; to size up all the relationships in a fast-changing array and understand them.
The majority of people regardless of educational level seem to have a problem understanding cause and effect. They also have problems differentiating between causation and correlation. And they can't filter out information which isn't important.
You seem to know more about this area then me, but there was a study that showed if you where given 6 pieces of information or 30 pieces of information it didn't effect your ability to predict a future event. In a lot of cases having 30 pieces of information actually decreased your ability to predict an event.
en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spatialintelligence(psychology)
[–]Atavisionary[S] 0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link
I don't go over it here, but unfortunately IQ is overwhelmingly determined by genetics and thus isn't very susceptible to cultural interventions. The male advantage in spatial reasoning is also determined by biology. Administering testosterone to women might improve their spatial ability, but the side effects would be more than a little undesirable.
I haven't gone to the wikipedia page because frankly I don't trust them. My experience with wikipedia on controversial subjects such as this is that it is overwhelmingly influenced by cultural marxists. It is often misleading by design or by omission when it touches their sacred principles (egalitarianism in this case).
[–]sir_wankalot_here0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
I just cited wikipeda to get the defintion of what Spatial Intelligence is.
thus isn't very susceptible to cultural interventions
I disagree. One thing people ignore is language. Language is how you internalize ideas in your head, it is like the software of the brain.
The closest analogy is computer programming languages. There are "families" of computer languages. Certain computer languages can solve certain types of problems far more eloquently. This is the area of guy's like Chomsky.
Where I am there is a large amount of human languages and dialects. For human languages, there are some which are better organized then others. And some concepts can not be translated properly.
So in my case, I have to give instructions to a person. I give them to a translator who understands english internally he translates them in his had to his own native dialect which he then will translate to another dialect. I then will question and answer through the translator. From this you can catch glimpses of the third language.
[–][deleted] 1 points1 points1 points 11 years ago | Copy Link
[permanently deleted]
This has never been officially researched because it would cause an uproar. I suspect marketing companies have done that type of research.
Certain countries despite having low amounts of university graduates have high IQs. And the reverse holds true.
Find people that have been adopted at birth from places of a low IQ into a place of high IQ and observe their IQs.
This is just from observation. Children of missionaries and military who where raised from birth in an Asian culture start to think like Asians. Asians and westerners process ideas differently, this has been proven.
So the genetics might be a correlation not a causation. Humans compared to other animals have very little genetic variance.
[–]Donutmuncher-1 points0 points1 point 11 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link
the American Psychological Association (emphasis mine): “Most standard tests of intelligence have been constructed so that there are no overall score differences between females and males”
That's very revealing indeed. So they're not necessarily tracking intelligence as it related to practical areas, but a PC measure which might not have as much usefulness.
Here is good quote from a test expert. Arthur Jensen stated in his book bias in mental testing,
“The most widely used standardized tests of general intelligence have explicitly tried to minimize sex differences in total score by discarding those items that show the largest sex differences in the normative sample and by counterbalancing the number of remaining items that favor either sex. This is true, for example, of the Stanford-Binet and Wechsler scales of intelligence.“
[–]Atavisionary[S] -1 points0 points1 point 11 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link
What they do is balance items favoring one sex with items favoring the other sex. Not all such items are equally g loaded (IE, more loaded means more accurately corresponds to IQ). For example, the writing portion of the test is hardly g loaded at all. It is a shitty measure for predicting ability and achievement. But girls do better at it so its popular.
The whole reason that spatial reasoning tests are ignored on the SAT and GRE is because of the huge advantage favoring males which is very difficult to balance. The tests are already so lopsided to favor women that there isn't much more that can be done to believably add female friendly items.
[–]Donutmuncher0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link
I wonder how many men lost STEM university places to less competent women (or men with poor spatial reasoning abilities but good verbal ones) due to this bias.
[–]Atavisionary[S] -1 points0 points1 point 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link
One of the studies I linked to claims that among the exceptionally able, it is probably something like 50% of well suited individuals were missed this way. That of course is only considering the upper limits of ability.
One of the other studies I linked to shows that even at the mean there is a standard deviation advantage for men.
In short, a whole hell of a lot.
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[–]spaldingnoooo8 points9 points10 points (3 children) | Copy Link
[–]Atavisionary[S] 1 point2 points3 points (1 child) | Copy Link
[–]Rougepellet0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]IDefyAxioms0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
[–]rcglinsk8 points9 points10 points (7 children) | Copy Link
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