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A graph of the introduction of Technologies into the household -- I thought it would be interesting how this relates with women's rights movement in regards to Gender Roles vs. the misguided belief in Patriarchy

DejaBoo

June 3, 2012
4 upvotes
/r/MensRights
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Title A graph of the introduction of Technologies into the household -- I thought it would be interesting how this relates with women's rights movement in regards to Gender Roles vs. the misguided belief in Patriarchy
Author

DejaBoo

Upvotes 4
Comments 18
Date June 3, 2012 10:40 AM UTC
(14 years ago)
Subreddit Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/uigxm/a_graph_of_the_introduction_of_technologies_into/
Archive Link https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/a-graph-of-the-introduction-of-technologies-into.1020568
https://theredarchive.com/post/1020568
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Comments

[–]Profix 1 point2 points3 points 14 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Because technology adoption has increased over the years, you are saying this perpetuates gender stereotypes? What?

[–][deleted] 2 points3 points4 points 14 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

No, its that gender roles have been influenced to change because of technology. It's one of the ironies of technology and the patriarchal view because women were in charge of some of the most technological advanced machines than men (e.g., the sewing machine).

But also, the technological advancements made the need of labor in the household greatly decrease (oven, washing machine, etc.) and later the advancement of technology outside of the home lead to possible employment in service industries and less physical demanding jobs for women.

So it has greatly influenced the tide of Gender Roles shifting and consequently why today we have MRA and Feminism.

Cheers.

[+][deleted] 14 years ago* (3 children) | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points3 points 14 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I don't understand why this is the second comment on this. I'm confused why this would be brought up since one, I never said causation and two, correlation is the norm when working in a humanities subject, especially in a historical perspective.

[–]Dranosh 1 point2 points3 points 14 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Correction: Correlation does not always equal causation...

[–]Ted8367 1 point2 points3 points 14 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Correlation may not mean causation; but so what? If a correlation exists, then it is a fact that it exists; to find that out has value all by itself.

You can think up mechanisms for generating the correlations you observe. This is a separate process.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 14 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link

Hey all,

I would love any resources or information where we could plot the women's rights movement along this graph.

My basic premise is women's rights movement is about change in Gender Roles as technology entered the household it "Freed" women to focus on roles outside of the household. Not saying they didn't have any discrimination or hurdles to overcome, just that it was a natural process given the idustrial revolution and how much the need for labor to maintain the home significantly decreased.

Any thoughts or opinions? Anyone care to photoshop this graph with points of interest for the femininst movement (e.g., percentage of labor market? Right to vote? I dunno).

Also I recognize this isn't exactly Mens Rights material, but does place a context for the history regarding many issues men have faced. As men have to adapt to the changes in our society.

Cheers

[–]ignatiusloyola 2 points3 points4 points 14 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

How does one quantify the women's rights movement?

Also, how does one protect against simply showing correlation, which would be a meaningless result? (ie: alternative explanations include - as society progressed, it became more enlightened, which served both to improve the lives of women and to produce new technologies)

You aren't going to find anything but correlations here, which doesn't serve to make any real point because there is no test to show causation.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points3 points 14 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

There is hardly ever causation in humanities studies (correlations are the norm). And when it comes to historical perspectives you can't have causation, so I don't get what your point is?

This is normal in any given historical topic...

edit: in regards to quantify that is a real concern. Not like feminism had registered users that I'm aware of, though maybe there is data on that? What I was thinking were historical movement points, like the right to vote was 1913 (iirc) and that has near a 30% with phone technology.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points3 points 14 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

In the aftermath of World War II, the lives of women in developed countries changed dramatically. Household technology eased the burdens of homemaking; life expectancies increased dramatically; and the growth of the service sector opened up thousands of jobs not dependent on physical strength. Despite these socioeconomic transformations, cultural attitudes (especially concerning women's work) and legal precedents still reinforced sexual inequalities.

Technology definitely played a huge role for change in gender roles of men and women. I thought it would be interesting to see a correlation but I fear there are not enough historical significant points to be able to plot on this graph.

If that's what you were pointing out, I'm with you. Either way I think it's an interesting graph of data that demonstrates how gender roles are the key differences we face and not an oppressive patriarchal society that second wave feminists like to portray.

Just thought I would share...

cheers.

[–]girlwriteswhat 1 point2 points3 points 14 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

I think an interesting addition to this graph would be to plot women's participation levels in post-secondary education and the paid workforce (at least, working outside the home, as opposed to cottage industry type work).

Also interesting would be to compare those two items against the percentages of jobs in differing sectors/areas of the economy--resource/manufacturing, tertiary, quaternary--or the percentages of jobs overall that are physical/indoor vs non-physical/outdoor.

I'd guess that there'd be enough correlation wrt all of it to assume some degree of causation (lots, IMO), for sure.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 14 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Thanks for the feedback. Those misogynistic bastards invented all this technology to oppress women didn't they ;)

Cheers and I'll ponder your post. I'm pretty tired now, lol.

[–]Ted8367 0 points1 point2 points 14 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Another big factor would be number of births per woman. In my grandparents' time, family sizes of eight or so children were common. This would have a major effect on what other employment a woman could even have time for (with eight kids: not a lot).

[–]Ted8367 1 point2 points3 points 14 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

If you go to Gapminder World (www.gapminder.org) you can get various graphs by time for women's participation in the workforce, for various countries.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 14 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

A billion thanks!!! That is perfect!

Sadly, I'm thinking this much more work than I'm currently interested in doing. But later on maybe and with your link you definitely made it more likely =D

[–]mantrasong[🍰] 1 point2 points3 points 14 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I'm at work, and don't have an easy way to plot it against the given graph, but here and here are some timelines of major feminist/feminism related events. The biggest accomplishments - suffrage and the beginnings of the birth control/abortion battle, all started by 1920, before the major growth of consumption. If anything, it looks like the movement has done less in the past 20-30 years than that it has increased.

Now, this doesn't approach the size of the movement, or the grown of women-are-better-than-men feminism (I honestly don't pay enough attention to it to remember which wave that counts as). But the accomplishments do not seem to correlate strongly to consumption based on that graph.

As a completely random aside, this is the source for this graph, gotten originally from here, which is a condensed version of this.

[–]Demonspawn -1 points0 points1 point 14 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Advancement of society causes a surplus of survival resources. Women of wealthy husband are the first to have "little to do" and as that starts to hit middle-class wives it starts to become the social problem known as feminism.

The men, who's stupid subset has not been removed from the earth (again, the surplus of survival resources) then strive for something known as "equality" when ends up ensuring the doom of the society, because it allows women more direct input to society. Women then take over the concerns of society and then the self-destructive spiral begins.

How do I know all this? Because this is not the first time feminism has existed. Read a book called "Sex and Culture" by J. D. Unwin and you can read about what is rarely talked about: some of the historical cases of Feminism.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 14 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Whoa, I'm honestly a bit taken back by your post, but you do cite and that adds to convo. My reading list is long, but is book marked.

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