Shaming Men Out of Their Pursuits – Reaction to Jordan Peterson’s ‘Marriage’ Ad

somethingneet · 2022-11-13T06:15:26+00:00

He's gone full trad-con and this has been happening for years, people just refuse to be honest about these figures because they make one salient point every 10 years

OldEgalitarianMRA · 2022-11-13T06:02:13+00:00

Peterson doesn't speak to the modern man. He is stuck in trad-con tradition. Women have left the marriage market and even half that get married want a divorce eventually. Marriage is a dead end in the Western world.

RoryTate · 2022-11-13T16:10:07+00:00

The two most influential and popular figures for men at this time are probably Jordan Peterson and Joe Rogan. And it's interesting to see their different approaches to this problem of "men and marriage". They both get it wrong, but in completely opposite ways.

Rogan misses the scope of the problem when he talks about men and failed relationships, but in the end he at least offers up a simple and practical solution: "Just go the gym". It unfortunately doesn't address the real issue in any way. Still, it's something realistic that gives an individual man some benefit in matters unrelated to the problem that Rogan misses.

Peterson has the opposite problem. He sees the whole system and how it will inevitably be bad for men, and his solution is meant to address the core of it. So unlike Rogan, he is at least asking the right question. However, Peterson's failing is that his message: "Put the genie of birth control and the entire sexual revolution back in the bottle", is both impractical and impossible. Pretending may be a potential short-term strategy, but overall in the long-term it's very likely that this bubble will burst for anyone who attempts it, leaving many men facing a hard, cold reality after too many wasted years of living a pretense.

So for each of us as men, we either take action in a practical way that doesn't address the core issue (Roganism), or we live in a fantasy world that tries to wish society's modern circumstances away (Petersonism). Not really the best options when you consider what is being sold to us.

ggleblanc2 · 2022-11-13T07:42:10+00:00

It is better to be married than single.

However, and the point the article makes as well as the comments, is that divorce in Western society is too costly for the man.

Until divorce laws are more equitable, or women are more responsible, marriage is a foolish option.

Bernard245 · 2022-11-13T15:29:14+00:00

I read the first half of the article, and then I realized what the second half would be and stopped. I can empathize with the authors feelings on the subject, but, it is clear that he sees Petersons ad as an attack on himself. The way he describes the various scenarios of entrapment within Peterson's words implies that these are all the ways he could be entrapped.

I'm a gynophobe myself, I understand what it means to not trust women. But Peterson is right, marriage, and the resulting nuclear family model, are the bedrock of society.

Seeking to complete your own nuclear family model is REQUIRED for society to continue. The young work, and the old can rest. You can't have restful elders with no working young. You can't have young without procreation, and as far as history can describe to us, the most stable, hardest working young come out of some variation of family model. The nuclear family model is ideal because it only asks every household to self replace and plus one themselves if they can.

This is what pays for social security, this is what long-term economic modeling is based on. It is necessary for society to continue in such a way, where we care for our elders and don't abandon them to die. That is what the nuclear family model permits. Eventually we will run out of space to live in the future, but the earth should be able to endure at least a 1,000 years of unstifled growth. We should have rockets to take us off-world by then.

What I've learned as I've gotten older, is that, all conversations are had for your sake. Yes, you. It's always been for you. Every conversation, ever had by anyone, was to introduce you to alternative perspectives. Only by living a different life, can we see the world through different eyes.

We HAVE to marry. The system exists to endure a certain rate of failure which is always in flux. Without the marriage system, the few children we do produce become men and women of weak character. They are unable to self actuate until much later in life, and they lose precious years or decades of development. They in turn believe themselves to be unfit parents, and will choose to have fewer and fewer children.

Peterson has summarized the entirety of all possible reasons for abstaining from marriage. He frames them negatively with biblical reference to sin. Peterson has recently publicly converted from atheist to Christian theology. I've seen a lot of people do this in recent years, and they all seem to be in service of reaching a wider audience. When Peterson says greed lust and envy, he doesn't really mean or expect every unmarried man to engage in acts of depravity. He is saying that the mere act of forgoing the nuclear family model, in pursuit of anything other than that as the end goal, is an end not worth pursuing.

As I said firstly, I am a Gynophobe. My mother blamed me for things my father did. My sister was dissassociative from our family, and me as well. I was bullied by girls in school, and belittled by my inability to do anything about it by female teachers. When I was finally old enough to date. My first date, went into graphic detail about her history of sexual abuse, and that she had a handgun with the prints of her rapist on it, that she could use to "kill anyone she wanted".

Every girl after that either held me emotionally hostage, or squeezed me dry of all of my money. I had one girl proudly tell me she had emotionally cheated on me, because I was not good enough to understand the complexity of her emotions. By the time I found my first fiance in a hotel room with another man, I was ready to give up.

But, a few years later, I met my wife. And, she wasn't like all the other women. She listened and she cared, we shared interests and goals, and my life has never been so full of joy. So full of life, so full of excitement. My sleep has never been so restful. We've been together 6 years in upcoming January and we will have been married two years next October. We have a little one starting their journey now, and they will be with us, sometime next year. We didn't plan for it to happen so fast, but we are both excited.

Financially we aren't ready yet. If they were here today we'd surely be in a situation. I have to step up and do more and I am, for once in my life happy to rise to that challenge. I will give my child a good life.

That's what Peterson is getting at. Yes, the marriage contract is just a piece of paper, and it gives my wife permission to take my head if she is so willing to do so. But, the key to the problem, is that I have married a woman who will never take my head. And I knew that before I proposed. And you need to have that moment of clarity with a woman to marry them, and someti.es it takes years, and mistakes to reali,e that she won't. But once you know that she won't. Then you can marry her. And you'll be a happier, more fulfilled person for it. It feels like becoming an adult out of childhood all over again.

I wish everyone out there good luck in finding a viable life partner. Please raise healthy families if you are able.

coffeeinvenice · 2022-11-13T14:37:54+00:00

Jordan Peterson is either the reincarnation of, or is demonically possessed by, a 19th-century rural Alberta village preacher whose goal in life is to "correct everybody" and "tell it like it is", regardless of whether or not it makes sense.

There have always been a significant number of heterosexual males or females in western civilization who have chosen not to marry. In many cases, those people took up holy orders and became priests, monks or nuns in the Roman Catholic or Eastern Orthodox churches. They felt a calling in life or a duty to serve their communities some other way. Nobody suffered as a result: neither the unmarried individuals themselves or the communities they lived in. We have just as many unmarried heterosexuals today as in the past; the only difference is that organized religion and pursuing life within a religious order has become much less important. Even if the laws and court rulings regarding things like divorce, child custody, etc. were perfectly equitable, a significant number of individuals would still choose to not get married. It's all about life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness. And arguably it is far more reasonable and responsible to stay single than enter into marriage when you are not prepared for it and/or don't think you can keep the committment.

vwatchrepair · 2022-11-13T22:26:36+00:00

Peterson needs to stop with the religious BS. Abrahamic religion, while an abomination to women, is also at the same time doing the same to men. Men are expendable in the bible. And every human is reduced to a slave in some form or another. Go look for his debate with Matt Dillahunty.

While I do like some things Peterson says, when he goes and asserts god as real or an authority, I can't help but cringe now.

Temporary_Spend_3111 · 2022-11-15T00:23:37+00:00

Im a traditional man personally. But that doesnt mean divorce should be skewed. Male rape victims ignored or courts favoring women.

Men are half of all rape victims.

I want the government out of my marriage And my wallet. The greedy bitches can have my taxes but alimony needs to go. Palimony definetly needs to fucken go.

But yeah i do agree with peterson here

Title	Shaming Men Out of Their Pursuits – Reaction to Jordan Peterson’s ‘Marriage’ Ad
Author	rbrockway
Upvotes	28
Comments	18
Date	November 13, 2022 4:51 AM UTC (3 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/yts5ki/shaming_men_out_of_their_pursuits_reaction_to/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/shaming-men-out-of-their-pursuits-reaction-to.1138793 https://theredarchive.com/post/1138793

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