"Where are all the female lawyers?" asks the "proudly female biased" DailyLIfe.com

JaydenPope · 2013-10-22T02:27:15+00:00

Why would you need female lawyers when a lot of men will gladly help the sisterhood voluntarily ?

tyciol · 2013-10-22T07:56:55+00:00

I contemplated a job offer at Allens, one of Australia’s top-tier law firms.

A friend who was already working there told me a joke

I took my tits to the academy instead.

Not sure which academy Alicia Simmons is talking about, but if a joke is what causes someone to make up their mind about whether or not they accept a job at a law firm, THAT is more likely the reason we don't see many women in them and why they fail to succeed at the same rate or climb as high.

Perhaps fewer women make partner because fewer women join, believing feminist stereotypes about women being unable to succeed and using that hypothesized discrimination as an excuse to puss out and become a housewife instead?

Why else are male law graduate starting salaries on average $4,300 higher than female law graduates?

Perhaps the men ask for higher salaries?

To say that the problem is with women’s self-confidence just blames the victim.

Pointing out that people fail due to lack of confidence and lack of applying themselves isn't blaming anybody, it's looking to a problem and a solution.

If I say "maybe you come into work late a lot because you're depressed" I'm not blaming a victim of depression... oy.

For there to be a victim there needs to be proven discrimination from a victimizer, and the author of the article doesn't appear to be very concerned about supporting that necessary preceding argument.

When mothers return from maternity leave, they often suffer a catastrophic descent down the corporate ladder, being consigned to menial knowledge management tasks.

Boo hoo, nobody forced you to procreate and take a year off work.

Author also seems to be overlooking that women are capable of forming their own law firms rather than trying to succeed in already existing ones formed by men, if they're so convinced they stand no chance in them. Being the geniuses the author credits them to be, these women-dominated new law firms will naturally win more cases and become the most reputable firm on the block.

So why isn't THAT happening?

ScottFree37 · 2013-10-22T01:00:55+00:00

It is for this reason I removed the SMH app from my phone and have effectively boycotted the source. I would encourage Australian MRAs to do the same.

2013-10-22T11:17:25+00:00

She asks why do women make up so few of the top level lawyers ... but she points out that over 61% of all law school graduates are female. I would point out that while vagina-equipped humans are a mere 50% of the species, they make up over 61% of the law school graduates, and the penis-equipped humans are under-represented, being fully half of humanity, but less than 39% of law school graduates.

Her atttempt to use proportionality to support her position of discrimination only highlights her own biases and prejudice. She see when women have it 'hard'; but glosses over when men have it 'hard'.

cashmunnymillionaire · 2013-10-22T14:02:55+00:00

In family court fucking things up for men.

5th_Law_of_Robotics · 2013-10-22T14:16:31+00:00

"Where are all the female garbage collectors or male teachers?"

-no feminist ever.

I was reminded of this joke when I read recently that although 61.4% of law graduates are women

Er, equality?

only 23% make partner in top-tier corporate law firms, 18% in mid-tier and 17% in small firms

Only a very tiny number of lawyers make partner at all.

So this really isn't surprising. Feminists always forget that some women are perfectly happy having careers that don't consume their lives and leave room for having children. To become a top whatever in a demanding field you either need to be well connected or essentially have no life outside of your job. Or more likely, both.

Now women have been graduating from law school at equal numbers to men for over twenty years.

We really need to work on basic math education if this apparently educated woman thinks 61 = 39%.

If the good lawyer is modelled on a man with a wife at home to raise children and perform domestic labour then women, as Joanne Bagust argues, are relegated to the status of fringe-dwellers in the legal community

Well part of it is that women don't want a man who stays at home and fills that role even though there are plenty who would be able and willing to do so.

Feminism really needs to fight against the Patriarchal notion that a woman is marrying down if she finds a man who doesn't want to work.

Anyway her article does two things: 1) notes discrepancies in outcome and 2) speculates wildly as to the cause (discrimination against women in various forms naturally). What it doesn't do is provide step 3) demonstrated evidence that this is actually caused by discrimination.

TracyMorganFreeman · 2013-10-22T14:37:45+00:00

Why does the gender matter?

I was reminded of this joke when I read recently that although 61.4% of law graduates are women, only 23% make partner in top-tier corporate law firms, 18% in mid-tier and 17% in small firms. The Courts are also rollicking penis pageantries with the Federal Court, for instance, having a mere 16% of women on its bench.

Probably because women who go into law are more likely to be paralegals, not lawyers, than men.

And given that this bias within the law

No bias was mentioned. Results are not bias, and there being more of one group doesn't necessarily mean bias either.

Why else are male law graduate starting salaries on average $4,300 higher than female law graduates?

Because not all law graduates go into the same kind of job.

Law professors concur that it’s not because they’re smarter. Women dominate the awards ceremonies and take a larger share of the high marks. It is, quite simply, a reflection of the fact that legal culture systematically discriminates against women.

That's just a non-sequitur.

From sexist jokes, to pay inequities, corporate law is a boy’s own adventure story where a life of capitalist plunder pays off with a corner office and promotion to partner, just like Daddy! To say that the problem is with women’s self-confidence just blames the victim.

Yeah none of those are inherently discrimination.

But none of this changes the fact that in law your value lies in your ability to be on call and able to deliver services to clients at any moment of the day or night. The good lawyer is someone who works long hours, full time and with no time off for child rearing. And by long hours I mean sometimes 48 hours without sleep and working during your holidays. Some corporate law firms have beds and most have chefs that reward you with dinner for staying past 8.00. One of my friends said that her skin turned grey and sores started to appear after she did 14 hour days on an international commercial transaction for one month straight without any days off.

And women are less likely to do those things to be successful.

Particularly women with children. When mothers return from maternity leave, they often suffer a catastrophic descent down the corporate ladder, being consigned to menial knowledge management tasks.

Probably because they volunteered to be less productive for their own benefit and set a precedent.

No matter how many hours they put in, says Bagust, they’re not seen as good workers. Legal culture doesn’t allow for shared love.

No, business culture doesn't care about what you do with your off time, unless it impacts how much you work.

The result is a classic case of private care-givers being excluded from responsibility and power in the public sphere.

It's called opportunity cost.

Of course, in an ideal world corporate law firms would not exist and we’d all resolve our disputes through collective consensus decision making, clicking or twinkle fingers.

Her ideal world is a tyranny of the majority.

But until that day arrives it’s in everybody’s interests for legal culture to be less Boy’s Own Adventure Story and more Choose Your Own Adventure: flexible and with multiple options including to put the book down for a while.

Well somebody doesn't understand economics or business. It's not based on "should" or feelings.

Ma99ie · 2013-10-22T01:07:50+00:00

Big tits are/is? an important qualification.

Title	"Where are all the female lawyers?" asks the "proudly female biased" DailyLIfe.com
Author	ThePigmanAgain
Upvotes	14
Comments	10
Date	October 22, 2013 12:29 AM UTC (12 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/1oxxta/where_are_all_the_female_lawyers_asks_the_proudly/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/where-are-all-the-female-lawyers-asks-the-proudly.1160732 https://theredarchive.com/post/1160732

Comments