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My life was quite simply destroyed: MP John Hemming recalls the devastating toll on him and his family after a woman he had never met claimed he had raped her as a child

JohnKimble111

February 8, 2018
490 upvotes
/r/MensRights
http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-5364915/Former-Lib-Dem-MP-blasts-police-sex-probe.html
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Title My life was quite simply destroyed: MP John Hemming recalls the devastating toll on him and his family after a woman he had never met claimed he had raped her as a child
Author

JohnKimble111

Upvotes 490
Comments 32
Date February 8, 2018 5:30 AM UTC
(8 years ago)
Subreddit Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/7w2mz8/my_life_was_quite_simply_destroyed_mp_john/
Archive Link https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/my-life-was-quite-simply-destroyed-mp-john-hemming.1179614
https://theredarchive.com/post/1179614
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Comments

[–]EricAllonde 137 points138 points139 points 8 years ago (24 children) | Copy Link

Mr Hemming accused Labour MP Jess Phillips of using the allegations as political ammunition

Wow, a man-hating feminist exploited every opportunity to smear and demonise a man in public life with no regard for the truth? I'm shocked! Shocked I tell you, to learn that feminists behave this way! /s

[+][deleted] -28 points-27 points-26 points 8 years ago (23 children) | Copy Link

I doubt all feminists behave this way.

[–]Macismyname 17 points18 points19 points 8 years ago (21 children) | Copy Link

So do the rest of us. I'm not here to paint everyone on the other side with the same brush. The problem isn't that all of them are this terrible. The problem is that they collectively let this happen and go so far to defend the practice.

Feminists defend the idea of "Listen and believe" and always "supporting the victim". Which sounds very nice on paper but it leads to cases where facts are ignored or not required to ruin the lives of the accused.

I am no where close to deluded enough to believe all feminists are horrible people. Most would never falsely accuse someone in order to ruin their lives. But they support the culture and the ideals that let it happen to others. Most even support the idea that women would never do that sort of thing anyway.

I'm not out to hate on feminists. I'm here to point out ways in which their philosophy gets men and boys like me hurt. Ways in which we could all make the world better. That's it.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago* (1 child) | Copy Link

most of the feminists i’ve met in real life condemn this practice, but it’s a large enough amount of them that are okay with it that i will never call myself a feminist. this along with an enabling legal system calls for a movement for mens rights.

the real issue is that pretty much every feminist i’ve come across denies that it’s happening at all or thinks that it’s one or two isolated cases.

[–]Macismyname 6 points7 points8 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I've always had reasonable discussions with feminists in real life. Hell, some of my friends self identify as SJW's. We're friends because we can compartmentalize our beliefs and keep them separate from our hobby's.

Yeah, I think the fact that they tend to believe the feminist sources is the real problem. They hear only 0.01% of accusations are false and never even try to verify it. Even my friends will jump on the celebrity hate bandwagon when an anonymous accusation is brought up. Most of them are kind reasonable people and I love knowing them, but when I see them calling Aziz Ansari a rapist or believing the anonymous tabloid accusations of T.J. Miller it just breaks my heart a little.

[+][deleted] -7 points-6 points-5 points 8 years ago (18 children) | Copy Link

Why are you talking about feminists like they're an organization?

'Feminists defend the idea of'... What?

I'd consider myself a feminist, I hope you'd consider yourself one too.

[–]Macismyname 5 points6 points7 points 8 years ago (17 children) | Copy Link

I would not consider myself a feminist. I wont get into why, it has no place in this discussion.

I am referring to ideas held by many feminists, or by prominent feminists. I would not presume to know any specific individual's opinion. I'd like to think my post was relatively fair and nonvolatile.

There's no denying that lives are being destroyed by false accusations. Nor that feminists are pushing for convictions to not require evidence. I'm not here to cast blame on the entire group that identifies with the word, but I can't further this discussion without saying phrases like "I wish feminists would stop pushing guilty until proven innocent".

[+][deleted] -3 points-2 points-1 points 8 years ago (16 children) | Copy Link

You could just say nob eds instead of feminists, really fucking simple solution.

Id love to know why you dont think men and women should be treated equally though.

[–]DaeusPater 5 points6 points7 points 8 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link

Ah you're the 'feminism is just equality' type.

Consider me and my position when it comes to gender politics and tell me if I'm a feminist.

  • I think men and women should be equal in the eyes of the law. Currently in the majority of the world, men have lesser rights than women so I consider myself an MRA. In many nations, it is legal to sexually assault, rape, commit DV on men. In some countries, men don't have free male universal suffrage; they earn a right to vote by gambling on their life as a disposable soldier.

  • I think feminist theory is inherently misandric, and I refuse to use feminist jargon in my life. It is common sight in feminist literature to see women being stripped of any agency while men are accused of enacting all agency. I think feminism has a clear double standard in how it addresses male victims and female victims.

  • In general, I think physical assault is more serious than sexual assault. Exceptions exist, of course.

  • I think false accusations are far more common than mainstream media and academia tend to admit. I also think experiencing false accusations of rape/sexual assault can potentially be more traumatic than rape and sexual assault. I can't digest feminist readings that constantly downplay this or even refuse to acknowledge it.

Am I still a feminist my friend?

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

i agree with all of your points except for the physical assault is worse than sexual assault one. i think i’d rather be beaten instead of raped (as long as there’s no permanent physical damage). some people can handle the physical pain much more than the emotional and mental damage but i acknowledge that this probably differs from person to person.

[–]DaeusPater 2 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Obviously, different people process physical and sexual assault in different ways. Both physical and sexual assault are a spectrum, I can accept that some people are much more sensitive to sexual assault.

i think i’d rather be beaten instead of raped (as long as there’s no permanent physical damage)

I think I'd also rather be beaten. But you are comparing a moderate form of physical assault with an extreme case of sexual assault. I'd rather have my butt grabbed than be slapped or punched,

some people can handle the physical pain much more than the emotional and mental damage but i acknowledge that this probably differs from person to person.

This is true.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

yea that makes sense, i agree with you on all fronts then

[+][deleted] -2 points-1 points0 points 8 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

I think you're a bit of a dick.

[–]DaeusPater 3 points4 points5 points 8 years ago* (4 children) | Copy Link

Thanks for your opinion, as I thought I don't get along with feminist-minded people.

Now stop using this 'feminism is belief in equality' recruiting tactic.

I want to add something. I also think MGM is a far more relevant issue than FGM. This is especially true in the west, where FGM is incomparable to MGM; it shocks me that anyone can even mention FGM without addressing MGM in the west. In every single nation in the world more boys/men are mutilated than girls/women. I think feminists and other MGM deniers who compare MGM done in sterile conditions in the west with FGM in hostile African conditions utterly dishonest and disgusting pieces of shit. All the while totally ignoring African MGM which is more torturous and unethical than FGM, though few minority types of FGM are more horrible.

Consider this a US doctor is being charged with life for 'pricks' to clit type FGM in sterile conditions, which is nothing compared to male infant circumcision in the US. This is an example of institutional and systematic misandry. MEN, LOOK; THIS IS HOW MUCH EMPATHY SOCIETY HAS FOR YOU.

[+][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

I wasnae recruiting no one, youre a crazy cunt.

[–]Macismyname 6 points7 points8 points 8 years ago* (1 child) | Copy Link

That assumption is downright asinine. I do consider myself an egalitarian but I disagree with what a lot of feminists stand for and what a lot of mainstream feminists focus on. I'm extremely proud of my work in the middle east protecting polling locations from the Taliban when they tried to intimidate women out of voting. I've done plenty to support equal rights and I wont be insulted by the likes of you.

What I choose to call myself is neither here nor there. My actions and my beliefs are what define me. You have long since stopped making actual arguments and are instead just trying to pick fights over labels and I'm frankly done with it.

[+][deleted] -6 points-5 points-4 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

A lot of feminists have different opinions dip shit.

[–]wrekd3 points 8 years ago [recovered] (3 children) | Copy Link

Branding my friend. Branding.

One may love Germany but not want to call themselves a German Nationalist. Just as one may believe in equality and not want to call themselves a feminist. You should know this, but then again, the UK has been neutered for a good bit now. Cheers.

[–]BorneOfStorms 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Neutering is a very viable and practical option for those who don't want cancer or other defects in their pets.

[+][deleted] -2 points-1 points0 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Branding is shit, stop it.

[–]Gloid02 7 points8 points9 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Oh come on guys don't downvote him, he is correct. A lot of feminist don't know the true face of feminism but to say that all 20% of feminists (USA) are man-hating criminals is just absurd. Don't fall to their level guys, we need to show a better image of ourselfes.

[–]5th_Law_of_Robotics 37 points38 points39 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

If men were privileged, and we lived under a Patriarchy, and ours was a culture that promotes rape and defends rapists, none of this would have happened.

[–]The__Tren__Train 9 points10 points11 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

remember, feelings over facts

[–]mikesteane 64 points65 points66 points 8 years ago* (7 children) | Copy Link

Why do so few people sue their accusers? In this case, there is little doubt 1. that she made it all up and 2. that she did enormous damage. She needs to be sued into bankruptcy even if the judicial system is too yellow-bellied to prosecute.

[–]unbelievablepeople 32 points33 points34 points 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

This is in the UK, and I'm in the US but I believe the answer is similar in both countries, so let me tell you what happened to me when I had a case where I was clearly in the right and confident I'd win if I filed a lawsuit:

I consulted with a lawyer. The lawyer told me that for the case to be worth his time, he'd need to be sure we'd win at least $50,000 in damages, of which he would get one-third. He said that although what the other person had done to me was clearly against the law, juries and judges can be very unpredictable about how much they award in damages. He said he once had a client have his career destroyed by someone else's lies, costing him hundreds of thousands if not millions in future earnings, and the jury returned a verdict of $25,000. So a lot of times, the lawyer won't take the case because there isn't going to be enough of a payoff.

The second problem is even if there is enough of a payoff, the person might not have the money to pay. You could win a $10 million judgment against someone, but if that "someone" doesn't have $10 million, you're not getting that money. Most people have a pretty low net worth, and even people who have a decent amount of money, most of that money is tied up in things that can be protected in bankruptcy, like a person's home and some types of retirement accounts. If I sue you and win a lot of money and you turn around and declare bankruptcy, I'm not getting that money.

Bottom line: Suing is expensive and unlikely to yield results.

[–]GrumpyDingo 24 points25 points26 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

So a lot of times, the lawyer won't take the case because there isn't going to be enough of a payoff.

"Justice".

[–]eclectro 11 points12 points13 points 8 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

The lawyer told me that for the case to be worth his time, he'd need to be sure we'd win at least $50,000 in damages,

Aka the legal system is broken. If men want "mens" rights, they need to find ways to fix the legal system. I can think of a couple of ways - bring down the cost of law school so lawyers are not spending $500,000 to get through law school for one. Another, have it be a two year degree instead of three.

Really, I know the bitching on Reddit is completely valid, but nothing happens until we crack that monster somehow. Men/women in positions that can make decisions need to keep this goal foremost in their mind.

[–]furchfur 28 points29 points30 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

They usually have zero money. It costs a minimum of £700 to make someone bankrupt over an unpaid debt in the UK.

For a defamation of character case it is likely to be around £30,000 to £40,000 of legal costs. Most false accusers have more debt than asset so it is financially very costly. You are almost certainly going to be out of pocket.

The Labour government under (Jack Straw) made it impossible for anyone to sue the CPS, unless there was negligence.

The CPS (state) brings a claim against an individual acting on the instructions of the false accuser. Any "just" system you could sue the organisation bringing the legal claim the CPS. But this has been reinterpreted by New Labour so that the CPS cannot be sued even though they are the ones making the prosecution.

Unless the CPS, Police are negligent then you cannot sue them at all. Blame the Labour party for this,.

[–]Grand_boy 8 points9 points10 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Quiet honestly its insane that you can lie, accuses someone with no evidence of something, ruin there life and not face jail time. It should not be "getting back damages". There should be a threat of jail if you falsely accuses someone of a crime that could send them to jail on a lie.

[–]mikesteane 1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I agree. But if the crown will not prosecute, individuals should sue.

[–]nforne 18 points19 points20 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

John Hemming was told he'd been accused during the 2015 General Election campaign. He unsurprisingly lost his seat.

And who was his rival in the election campaign...?

[Jess Phillips] not only supported Esther Baker [the accuser] on Twitter, calling her ‘brave’, but encouraged others to speak out. That was a cold-blooded attack on me and my family, and she should be held accountable, for assuming my guilt and for inciting hatred.

And that, ladies and gentlemen, is the story of how Jess Phillips won her seat in government.

The case was dismissed in 2017. Fortunately Hemming kept a diary and had receipts that proved his innocence.

[–][deleted] -2 points-1 points0 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Bring back the witch burning stakes.

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