How do I deal with the emotional and mental costs of being more successful with women.

CapnJibid · 2013-06-04T18:26:23+00:00

Your post was long, and I understand the feels. I'm going to focus on two big things you can work on.

1) self esteem. I have low self esteem issues as well, and it comes down to what you believe about yourself. Fixing this takes a lot if self reflection. Therapy helps a ton. Everybody has different reasons for why they feel low about themselves, but addressing these reasons and changing how you see yourself is critical.

2) Outcome independence. We can't control anything, only how it all affects us. If something makes you feel crappy, ask yourself why? Don't blame her/universe etc, bc you can't control that. Focus on you. What is it inside you that feels shitty about what's happening? Where does it come from? Address this stuff and you can begin to accept whatever happens, good or bad, and get past shitty times much faster.

Its not easy, but things worth doing rarely are. You'll learn more about yourself than you knew, and you'll be more in the moment. Which is the BEST place to be. Women will be drawn to that. I'm sure you've had those nights where you were ON, unstoppable. Think about where you were inside yourself. That's where you're going to be, all the time.

2013-06-04T19:33:06+00:00

I feel your pain dude. Honestly I'd go with therapy or some kind of counseling, it's what I'm planning on doing. I can relate to your pain very deeply and as hard as it is, even though I'm experiencing the same shit at the moment, there are some obvious pickup principles we both need to be applying.

Outcome Independence.
Find happiness from within and avoid external validation.
Live in the now. Everything is a temporary, transitory experience. Let go.

These points leading to the biggest point...

Don't seek happiness in woman.

Good luck man I know it's hard. I'm feeling like it's just a phase just like you were explaining. We'll eventually move past it and find peace. I'd also consider hitting up counseling/therapy, it helped me so much in getting onto my feet a short 6 months ago.

recyclablebantha · 2013-06-05T07:44:53+00:00

First thing I'm going to say is that I would disagree with your title, though this is mostly semantics. The issue is not about you "becoming more successful with women" at ALL. The issue is that you have a mindset which would be unsustainable and unhealthy for even ONE relationship, and you're going out and getting involved with several women in a short span of time (often at once?). So you're multiplying your issues and creating one hell of a roller-coaster ride for yourself.

The thing is, when I connect with someone it's REAL. I can't fake it, and when I get vulnerable it's real. I'm not sure how I'm supposed to date women yet stay unattached.

I'm not sure how I'm supposed to like someone, or pretend to like someone but not like them?

That's not what the more emotionally intelligent PUAs like myself are doing. The trick is not to open yourself up to an experience and yet magically have no stake in it. Well, not really. (I'll get to that.) It's not about pretending not to like someone. (Which, by the way, would only make matters WORSE.)

I go through highs and lows sometimes. Women liking you can be validating but them disliking you can be crushing. I know I need to be more outcome dependent and do other things with my life and not assign my self esteem to this stuff. But how does one actually become outcome independent?

It involves some work. What I'm about to describe is not magic. It's mind-numbing work, that involves 24/7 commitment to monitoring your own thoughts in a way that you may never have done. But if you can manage it, it's a backdoor method to be able to enjoy an experience without having a stake in whether it continues or not. There are a few key thoughts/ideas I like to keep in mind in my pursuit of peace as I go out and be social in the world. You can try to keep these things in mind but to be honest, you may have to suffer a little in order for some of these thing to truly sink in. There is no magic pill. I know it's not the sexy answer, but all you can do is start putting the work in NOW.

Let it go: when your time with someone ends for the day or whatever, let it go. Even better, be prepared for it to be over. Assume it will end; because even in the best case scenario, it will at some point. And under such assumptions, LET go of the need for it to continue.
Enjoy the moment: it's really all you have. Years of being rejected and of awesome interactions with women going sour have taught me that few things, if any, last in this world so trying to hold onto things is pointless. Best to enjoy what you have, when you have it. If you spend time trying to hold onto something, it WILL slip from your grasp and you'll even fail to enjoy it while it's there.
Love thyself. Sounds cheesy but seriously. Think about this: who knows better than YOU, what you like and how you like it. Everything from your favorite food to sex..... This alone makes you special because no one else is so finely suited to make you happy, as you are. Also, sit down and really think about what makes you unique: Your unique combination of strengths and even weaknesses, make you different from everyone else.
Spend time alone with yourself. This is just a fact of life that you need to be able to stand alone in life. Strength on your own is fucking necessary. This requires CONSTANT maintenance and vigilance. The moment you allow thought patterns to creep in that relate to finding "the One" or needing a certain kind of "happily ever after" or some magical relationship, you're fucking done. And one of the best ways to maintain strength of self / hold onto it is to spend time alone. Even travelling alone. (In fact, I highly recommend travelling alone to a country where you know no one and can't speak the language. It's an excellent way to learn what you're capable of than something like that.)

EDIT: If you can accept and live the truth of the previous four points, it will matter not if you enjoy an interaction with a girl you're dating or the girl your with. It won't matter if you allow yourself to like her or not. You'll be able to do so

frogma · 2013-06-05T13:42:28+00:00

Sorry about the late response.

The way I see it, your attachment issues are coming from an overall lack of experience. You're getting experience now, sure, but it's new to you. Essentially, you end up wanting what you can't have, and even if a girl was an ugly crazy bitch, you still develop attachment even after they leave. That's normal for people who have less experience (the first girlfriend is usually the hardest to get over, etc. -- even if it was a shitty 3rd grade "relationship"), and it's still fairly normal for people who have more experience. I suffer from the same shit, just not as often. It usually happens pretty randomly.

Like others have said, it's a lack of self-dependence and self-validation. You're not self-validated so you have to get the validation from others, which isn't good, because you're the only person who's with you 100% of the time. You're the only one who can deal with you, especially when you're alone. I don't want to say you're afraid of that, necessarily, but I think you're trying to avoid it.

When you're alone/single, you lack that emotional intimacy that can be shared with someone else -- except, you really don't. You can be "emotionally intimate" with yourself just by developing better feelings about yourself.

You basically have the same problems that Casanova had: he would get attached to basically every semi-decent girl he saw, and wouldn't stop until he got the girl. Even after getting a shitload of experience, he still always had the same feelings about it. And I think it really just boils down to a lack of self-validation. If someone were to have true self-validation (nobody has it, it's really just a concept), they'd never need anyone else in their lives, ever. That'd be a lonely existence. So be happy that you don't.

You're already on the right track if rejections don't faze you very much. You just need to apply a similar approach to your various relationships. It's fine to get pretty "attached" in a relationship (that's basically what they're all about), and it's fine to be sad when they end or when something "bad" happens -- if you become more self-validated just by appreciating yourself more, those things will bother you less, just like how rejections don't bother you.

As far as how you can become more self-validated: IMO, it's more about just changing your mindset, not really about any actions you can take. You just start thinking better thoughts about yourself, develop a more positive outlook in general, and try to get rid of some of those negative thoughts/emotions (and to do that, just try to view them from a different perspective -- if a girl flakes, she might just be busy, and that's cool, because you're doing other shit too. If she dumps you, that's cool, because you're fine on your own and it just opens up more options for you, etc.).

Kappio · 2013-06-04T16:21:29+00:00

I think you should seek help elsewhere, maybe therapy.

Title	How do I deal with the emotional and mental costs of being more successful with women.
Author	RRthrowawaye
Upvotes	1
Comments	17
Date	June 4, 2013 12:58 PM UTC (13 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/seduction
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/seduction/comments/1fnd3c/how_do_i_deal_with_the_emotional_and_mental_costs/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/seduction/how-do-i-deal-with-the-emotional-and-mental-costs.1353360 https://theredarchive.com/post/1353360

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