sketchy theory of body autonomy and dead bedrooms; bear with me.

maya_elena · 2016-06-13T17:28:39+00:00

Edited for grammar

I don't disagree that doing it even when you "don't feel like it" but feel guilty is not rape, and insults real rape victims.

But from a historical perspective, I do think it's naïve to think men didn't get denied by their wives and didn't sleep around as a result, especially in aristocratic circles where marriages were arranged, and without contraception. (Otherwise how did they only manage to have one or two kids??) Marriage for love wothout financial advantage only really became a Thing recently.

And the stereotype of the fat, gossiping, nagging, spendthrift wife who's a burden on a man is time-honored and ancient. (Pride and Prejudice, anyone?)

phantasmagnolia · 2016-06-13T17:42:51+00:00

I don't know much about the historical aspect of this but I will say that I do agree that doing it even when you 'aren't in the mood' is not rape. I think people forget the "romantic" part of their "romantic relationships". There is a difference between that and a friendship. If you aren't willing to sleep with your man then HE IS NOT YOUR MAN! I always ask this: If you met a new guy right now, do you think he would put up with the idea of no sex just to be with you?

lady_baker · 2016-06-13T19:23:18+00:00

I've gotten The Stare Of Total Incomprehension from some IRL women on this very topic, mostly after I say "why is it so bad to just give your husband access to your body when he needs it?" You are absolutely right that they feel they can still demand he hold up his end of the bargain while dropping theirs.

Actually, I had a DB poster respond to me when I made that last comment with 'I don't see anything about sex in the wedding vows.' Bad faith, and a bad show.

One of the most poignant points I've read from a married RP man is how he describes the realization that his wife used to have sex for fun with multiple dudes for "free" but denies it to her own husband, who is there earning it every day. I had already done away with sexual No in our marriage, but if I hadn't, that would have done it. I felt the hurt in his words, and of course the subsequent anger.

Anyhow, good post.

alcockell · 2016-06-13T23:56:58+00:00

can't even fathom 'taking one for the team'

Nope, they seen that as backwards and I've even seen some rancid femnazis refer to it as "marital rape". There was an article some time ago a SJW wrote that claimed all instances of sex between husband and wife are rape. Like, wtf honestly.

While obviously legitimate cases of rape happened back in the day, both marital and non-marital, we have gone too far the other way in this day and age. I had a coworker of my husband's pick a fight with me about having sex and quoting the bible (big mistake to do in front of me unless you know what you're talking about) in which HE quoted 1 Corinthians 7:4 "The wife does not have authority over her own body but yields it to her husband" and used that as proof that the bible advocates marital rape. That's one of the favorites for SJW's and atheists to use but they unfortunately don't know the whole verse which ends with "In the same way, the husband does not have authority over his own body but yields it to his wife". Everyone loves to leave that part out.

I suppose my point is to agree with you, way too many people give women to much slack with sex as an option which is simply not true in a marriage or LTR. You're asking to be cheated on.

Ian Ironwood had written a great post on the subject of women having sex with their husbands and used the example of women who say "well that phase of my life is over" (I'm paraphrasing) and his response is perfect: it's fine if that phase of your life is over but it isn't for your husband so is it ok if he goes out and sleeps with other women who are still in that phase?" point well made!

[deleted] · 2016-06-14T17:38:53+00:00

they were expected to submit to their husbands in the bedroom. On one hand less dead bedrooms, but on the other hand, more instances of marital rape.

Well, yes, but it was "marital rape" only in the sense that the women involved didn't want sex with their husbands for whatever reason. But the women went along with it, because it was expected and they had no recourse at all, really. There was no such thing as "marital rape".

And they were "dead bedrooms" in the sense that she had no passion for sex and didn't really want to have sex with her husband, the only man who was lawfully allowed to have sex with her. So for her, it was a "dead bedroom".

The sexual revolution, and before it women's rights in general, sought to rectify all that, by saying it was a good thing for women to choose their own men, to marry only for love, and enabling them to leave marriages if they no longer felt what they had felt before.

The problem is that a long term relationship lasting a few decades isn't based, and cannot be based, on a woman's emotional state.

dead bedrooms didn't really exist before feminism collectively decided we don't owe men anything anymore, because some women were raped by their husbands.

I don't agree with this. Sure, dead bedrooms existed before feminism. Many times she didn't want to have sex with him. Much of society looked the other way while the husband got side pieces or used hookers. It was fine as long as he did his duty and supported her financially. Many times he didn't want to have sex with her for whatever reason - because she'd turned him away one too many times, because he cared about other things, he was secretly gay, etc.

It's only been recently that marriage was viewed as something you do only for self-actualization and for mutual love and affection. Marriage up until about 1850 or so was for uniting families to their mutual benefit, for consolidating money and property, for the provisioning of women, and for rearing children. To a certain extent, marriage is still about provisioning, kids, and mutual benefit. But the love and sexual attraction part of marriage is much, much more prominent now. Most women have a romanticized view of marriage. Most women want to marry a man who is perfect in every way - rich, hot, a god in bed, and kind/nice to them while kicking ass and taking names at work. (That's what most women want. Many of them settle for far less than that, but that's another post.) Most women would never intentionally marry any man because their daddies want them to marry him, much less for preserving family assets, provisioning, and for taking care of kids. And even if they do, they don't say that.

[deleted] · 2016-06-14T18:38:06+00:00

All this is premised on the idea that lots of women don't want to have sex with their husbands! And I don't know of that's actually true, or if it's just a kind of sad cliche... I think its really depressing that we have this stereotype that married women are always turning down sex, and then at the same time every magazine aimed at young women is full of stories about one night stands, hook ups, etc etc. And I don't think it has to be this way. There are plenty of old married women who still seem passionate about their husbands. I aim to be one of them someday! I don't know why our culture almost encourages women to lose interest in sex by a certain age.

Title	sketchy theory of body autonomy and dead bedrooms; bear with me.
Author	philomexa
Upvotes	16
Comments	12
Date	June 13, 2016 5:11 PM UTC (10 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/RedPillWives
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/RedPillWives/comments/4nwmvi/sketchy_theory_of_body_autonomy_and_dead_bedrooms/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/RedPillWives/sketchy-theory-of-body-autonomy-and-dead-bedrooms.209912 https://theredarchive.com/post/209912

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