The average brigader. They are free to leave us alone as we leave them alone.

[–]MGTOWMediator258 points259 points260 points 8 years ago (30 children) | Copy Link

[–]I-am-the-lul111 points112 points113 points 8 years ago* (18 children) | Copy Link

[–]Fat_Akuma71 points72 points73 points 8 years ago (16 children) | Copy Link

People say stuff like this and it makes it a target. A lot of ladies are frustrating yeah but some are good arm distance away friends same with most people. The sub is mainly about empowering other men who choose to be single, debating ideals, investments, and hobbies too. I don't with hold any frustration towards women just some of their toxic behaviors but a lot of men are toxic too. If our sub as a collective starts to seem more negative towards women than it does for men empowerment then the mgtow movement has failed because that much negativity is feeding into the system we are actually going our own way from. At least that's how i assumed it was about. I don't think it's women hating at all, I think it should be about coexisting with the opposite sex, acceptance of our difference, but taking our own path towards independence.

[–]I-am-the-lul56 points57 points58 points 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

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[–]ATLpunk8637 points38 points39 points 8 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

"collective"? "empowerment"? "movement"?

MGTOW isn't some bullshit collectivist demographic movement trying to speak truth to power and all that other shit.

"People say stuff like this and makes it (MGTOW) a target."

I Suppose we should sanitize our speech and views to appease our female overlords, huh? I mean that would certainly be effective, just like all the other times that giving abusers, tyrants, and bullies exactly what they wanted worked?

How about fuck you. MGTOW in the most simple of terms is about being a man. Not being in a little circle jerking club. People are going to say shit here that's not family or women friendly. Because the places a man can do such are shrinking. So we vent and offer advice and knowledge for those who want it. Not for the acceptance and goodwill of women or even of the general public.

You remind of that douchebag from 300, Ephialtes. You know, the bitch who sold out his fellows for some tang and gold to the Persians....

[–]JasePearson9 points10 points11 points 8 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

And how about fuck you too?

Nobody is asking for you to "sanitize" your speech. Nobody is asking anyone to "appease" anyone but yourself. This should be a place we can vent, a place where we can read each others stories and help other men in need.

You're right, this isn't exactly a movement. This is more a philosophy. That's why I come here. I want to read other's interpretations of what they think MGTOW is. I want to know about other men's thoughts and experiences when dealing with shit that they get every day.

Don't be fucking family/women friendly. Keep this a male orientated space. It's not for women and it's not for fucking incels who are absolutely obsessed by pussy that they'll do messed up shit for it. We shouldn't be advocating or encouraging those morons to act like that. Correct me if I'm wrong but just the fact they'll do anything for a shag makes them the complete opposite of the men that come here and to do what you described. That's the negativity, that's the women-bashing shit. We don't need it and if we start agreeing with them, say goodbye to the sub.

Thought we were meant to be invisible or some shit, actively making ourselves unavailable to leeches and scum, instead we're just encouraging brigades and more idiots to turn up.

And you're a funny one, talking about someone selling out his "fellows". We're not a movement, we're not a collective and we're certainly not fellows. You do you, he does him, I do me. He can voice what the fuck he likes as long as it isn't rulebreaking or abhorrent imo.

tl;dr: We don't need to bash people regardless of their gender. Bash people for their actions. The whole "AWALT" idea is dumb. We've got Incels and Feminazis turning up and the rest of us seem to want to choose between which turd looks tastier. It's dumb.

[–]funinsun1012 points13 points14 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

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[–]ATLpunk861 point2 points3 points 8 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

Yeah I'm getting the distinct impression that you and I never had much reason to disagree in the first place.

That being said, while I acknowledge the position of practicing a little tact and not being foaming at the mouth with red pill rabies.... AWALT is very real and shouldn't be dismissed as mere saltiness. Does that mean that we should hate women? No. It just means we should bear in mind their biology whenever having any dealings with them and to beware.

The very act of using Reddit is going to attract undesirable elements. We're not saying anything illegal or immoral here so we shouldn't really give a fuck. And we've got some edgelords and trolls on our side too who like to fuck with the other guys as well. All this shouldn't be a distraction or hindrance to honest open expression. I mean if it gets out of hand, that's what mods are for.

Also thanks for finding me funny, I aim to please.

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[–]Fat_Akuma1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

It used to be a bunch of us that thought like that. Now you get all these guys demonizing even talking to women and trying to shame each other for even claiming to be a man going his own way becAuse he had a conversation with a woman. I don't like the aggression towards females on here either. I have no hate towards anyone, females included it's too much wasted energy/passion. I honestly have women as friends, some of them are even Ex's and they all do the same dance , party like crazy until the stress or carbs catch up with you and now it's time to settle for a guy who isn't out of their league and has money to keep them happy/comfortable. A lot of my female friends tried to do that at me, just because we have had sex doesn't mean I want to pursue anything further. Which they always think it means it's okay to put me on a shelf for later.

Yeah some shameless shit went on from both sides but not enough to shun half of the planet for having a different reproductive organ and views/motivation about life. My dreams don't include getting a decent house having a kid and working my ass off for a women who statistically will most likely leave me. I'd rather do it for myself, a modern women only offers me one thing I truly love more than sex and that's having something to hold at night. (Now I have animals and a pillowtop full sized bed)

I don't like how it goes. Ill go out for a drink and ill have a single mom try and impress me in regards to a relationship and not a one night stand. It's always suppose to be at their choosing or we can get it for sexual harassment. I ran into this girl a few months ago who lead me on before after high school, benefited from my car, money, weed, and sense of humor. Her family even loved me as a good dude, she was from poor like myself. I thought buying her flowers and taking her to do stuff romantic and fun would keep her around. She fucked a close friend of mine and I said fuck them both, some men are as bad as women. This guy chooses her over our friendship and she choose him over me, not even a week later They were dating and my other friends told me about it. Since high school I lost a lot of weight, dress nicer, have a nice house and soon to be nice car hopefully. I know I speak better and with more confidence and I have facial hair now. Suddenly this girl wants to date me, I straight up told her I maybe wanted to fuck. She wanted more, she thought now that she wants me I would want her, the disrespect. I told her she should feel lucky I even let her talk to me. I'm glad that guy cheated on her and knocked up another girl around the same time as her. She will never change. Her goals are to keep a 15 dollar an hour job and find a man to takr care of her and her kid.

You and i both joined this group to respect ourselves and gain perspective of other guys who's dreams are for themselves for the time being some might change. Everyday I'm doing more independently than I ever did in a single day when I was more red pilled. My life had more stress, responsibilities that were not my own, and money spent on a relationship where id lose more. I always found myself sacrificing more and still losing at the end of it all with every woman I've ever dated. If I weren't the one to end it on equal terms I can guarantee it didn't end well for me, either being cheated on or replaced. Every time I ended a relationship out of the blue because I could see her getting comfortable being crazy, spiteful , jealous over my lifetime friends/family or try to convince me to give up my dreams for hers they would always come back and try to ruin my life in some way or block me on all social media and play their narrative while trying to turn my friends against me. Nobody is worth giving up my tribe for. I don't understand how "I'm ready to settle" in their mind actually normally means "I'm ready to be the center of your universe" like any sane confident man is ever going to chase that or play those odds.

[–]ManGoingtoTOWn1 point2 points3 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

[–]intentionally_vague0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

I am not part of your little group, or your movement. I, like many other people here are going their own way. The human mind is complex, and everyone handles transitions at different paces and in different ways. What would lead to my satisfaction in life, would not make you happy. There's no reason to thrash against the system, you'll only work yourself raw. Human nature cannot be changed. In the history of mankind after a civilization has given its women rights, they have never been able to successfully revoke them before the empire fell. Sex and Culture by JD Unwin dives into the matter. He was an author from the 1930's, holding degrees in ethnology, and social anthropology from both Oxford and Cambridge. He examines civilizations, old and new and discusses the correlation between civil rights of women, and national instability. Look up a .pdf and it'll be there. The publication has been free for a long time now.

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[–]Mefistofeles12 points3 points4 points 8 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

Sorry I am still biologically and emotionally wired to desire the woman

I fully understand what you are saying, I've been there. But you are making a mistake, you don't have to be a slave to your instincts. You think that your suffering comes from pain or lack of pleasure, but it actually comes from the way you react to it.

The origin of suffering is in our denial of reality, in trying to run away from pain and chasing and keeping pleasure. We will always be hurt, and we will never be able to get everything we want, much less forever. Instead we have to accept reality as it is, taking both the pain and pleasure as it comes to us without, calmly accepting that we are simply not in control of the universe and that's ok.

This does not mean you do nothing with your life, it just means that you don't suffer when things don't go your way.

It is not easy nor quick, there are no magical remedies, but with patience, training, and learning you can learn how empty and counterproductive the chase for pleasure is.

Look up buddhism or stoicism for further insight. It helped me, and It might help you too.

[–]Mr_Lonesome0 points1 point2 points 8 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

I hear you. Desire brings suffering as Buddhists say. And no need to remind me of this eastern philosophy. I could tell you Jesus studied with the Buddhist monks during those his unrecorded years between ages 12-33. Sanskrit writings tell of the boy from the West. Hence why his teachings mirror Buddha's (i.e., golden rule). In fact, I even know Lao Tsu's Taoism owning his piece, Tao Te Ching. Verses 16 and 22: Empty yourself of everything...yield and overcome; bend and be straight; empty and be full; have little and gain. Even our thread opener here carries an interesting username where Buddhists say you have to transcend the ego to gain enlightenment and enter the nirvana. Heaven and nirvana are just states of mind nothing in the clouds above. And God is not a being but the light of eternal mind which we are all part of. This awesome and intangible concept is so difficult to understand that we humans personifed God as a "He", a "King", etc. separate from us.

Make no mistake, I do not chase women, or pump or dump. Thankfully these women left me alone with more time to read on Lao Tsu, Rabindranath Tagore, William Cullent Bryant, etc. Even in this young man's body I do control all urges but there are relapses when a fox crosses my path, or passes on my screen to which I settle it later alone in my room. She doesn't know about it. I'm not a thirsty orbiter, and yes at times the spirit is willing but the flesh is weak. And its not the sexual, female touch but the deeper, intimate touch I long for, sometimes no physical touch at all but look of eyes, quiet smile, silent wave that can exist between sexes. Even if made up by Hallmark, Disney, Hollywood, medieval and Renaissance love poems and songs, it is arguably a higher evolved state of being than our primitive roots back in jungle of survival of the fittest. Even with fellow brothers you can find this connection.

So this is what I want, that spiritual touch. To know I am more than flesh and bone and live more than by bread alone. This is why our current social culture is so trobling where women are dominated by things of this world, behaving soulless and heartless, and we MGTOW are pegged on survival tactics, indifferent to everything outside. I am ready to evolve to a higher form of consciousness where we absolve our animal, primitive urges for the mental touch of mind, to return to the Source, (and as Lao Tsu says) to the ten thousand things, the eternal Tao: And though the body dies, the Tao will never pass away.

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Shut the fuck up.

Lol jk. I hear you, but I think you're lacking context here. These people have been brigading this sub for a few days now.

They insult en-mass, they downvote things, the screen shot posts they don't like and then take them back to their little hide out and circle-jerk about how angry we make them.

Eventually they get angry enough that they make fake accounts, pretend to be MGTOW posters and start posting things about wanting to hurt people and wanting to rape women so it looks like the subscribers here are dangerous.

Some are militant feminists. Some are deluded white knights who think that harming their fellow man is fine if it might get them some pussy.

I've got nothing but sympathy for a lonely human. I felt plenty of that for the incels too. Hell I'd even help them out if I could and they wanted it.

But... I don't respect people who wish to harm others to get a leg up in the race. Regardless of where they are posting from.

That's pathetic behavior. It's not the desire of company that I see as weakness, it's the willingness to forgo others in the pursuit of that that I see as weakness. If they give that part up, there would have no reason to insult them.

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Title	The average brigader. They are free to leave us alone as we leave them alone.
Author	unIllidain
Upvotes	1068
Comments	85
Date	November 9, 2017 9:59 PM UTC (8 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MGTOW
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MGTOW/comments/7bwory/the_average_brigader_they_are_free_to_leave_us/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MGTOW/the-average-brigader-they-are-free-to-leave-us.537977 https://theredarchive.com/post/537977

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