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Ethics in journalism? UK Guardian manages to 'report' on 'Ceci N’est Pas Un Viol' without once mentioning what Sulkowicz does in the actual video.

KrisK_lvin

June 6, 2015
17 upvotes
/r/MensRights
http://www.donotlink.com/ffwl
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Title Ethics in journalism? UK Guardian manages to 'report' on 'Ceci N’est Pas Un Viol' without once mentioning what Sulkowicz does in the actual video.
Author

KrisK_lvin

Upvotes 17
Comments 19
Date June 6, 2015 10:06 AM UTC
(11 years ago)
Subreddit Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/38s5rp/ethics_in_journalism_uk_guardian_manages_to/
Archive Link https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/ethics-in-journalism-uk-guardian-manages-to-report.978333
https://theredarchive.com/post/978333
Red Pill terms in post
feminism
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Comments

[–]KrisK_lvin[S] 9 points10 points11 points 11 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link

Seriously, how is it possible to trust a news source that doesn't actually include the most notable fact about the story but instead resorts to allusions and hints only?

releases video depicting 'rape' … releases new performance art piece … released a performance art piece that depicts a sexual encounter she warns “may resemble rape” … though Sulkowicz says it is not a re-enactment, she does appear in the video

"She does appear in the video"? That's clear.

Really, unless you already knew the content of the video, you would be forgiven for not understanding that Sulkowicz performs actual sex acts during the video.

[–]walkonthebeach 8 points9 points10 points 11 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

Agreed.

/r/MensRights predicted that this is how The Guardian, HuffPost etc., would react. The porn videos she has made is just so terrible, and it so clearly demonstrates that she is off her rocker, that the only thing that these feminist news outlets can do is whistle in the wind and pretend that it's just an "art piece".

I would love to have been at the editorial meetings when it was discussed. I'm sure their angle is that they all know she is demented, but they don't want to feed the "false rape" fire, and so they agreed to try and brush it under the carpet and hope it goes away.

[–]KrisK_lvin[S] 5 points6 points7 points 11 years ago (7 children) | Copy Link

they agreed to try and brush it under the carpet and hope it goes away.

Heh.

I think it's ironic that one of Sulkowicz's aims was to make her critics uncomfortable. Instead quite the opposite has happened - it's all those that supported her that are now put in the deeply embarrassing position of having to distance themselves from this woman they previously supported loudly and enthusiastically.

She's bitten the hand that feeds her in many ways. I mean what on Earth Gilibrand and her advisors are making of all these I cannot imagine.

[–]walkonthebeach 4 points5 points6 points 11 years ago (6 children) | Copy Link

Ultimately, there will be no escape. Over the next few days and weeks the op-eds and other articles will start to be published, and this insane video will become part of the fabric of the hoax-rape truths — alongside Rolling Stone/UVA and the many, many other well documented cases.

The other killer, is that readers of the Guardian and HuffPo will be reading the articles, and then pop over to watch the "art" video. But boy-o-boy will then get a shock. Then even them will start to realise they've been conned.

[–]KrisK_lvin[S] 4 points5 points6 points 11 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

Rape Culture is the new Satanic Abuse by the sound of it.

If you have time and access to the BBC, I recommend listening to these two programmes from David Aaronovitch:

Ritual Sexual Abuse: The Anatomy of a Panic (Part 1)

Ritual Sexual Abuse: The Anatomy of a Panic (Part 2)

[–]walkonthebeach 1 point2 points3 points 11 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

Very interesting — I will take a listen. More crazy "therapists" I think eh?

The law in Scotland is very interesting. They just don't accept witness statements, as they are so unreliable:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Corroboration_in_Scots_law

I agree. Rapists can lie and you would believe them. False rape accusers can lie and you would believe them. So you need much more than that to convict.

[–]autowikibot 1 point2 points3 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Corroboration in Scots law:


The importance of corroboration is a unique feature of Scots criminal law. A cornerstone of Scots law, the requirement for corroborating evidence means at least two different and independent sources of evidence are required in support of each crucial fact before a defendant can be convicted of a crime. This means, for example, that an admission of guilt by the accused is insufficient evidence to convict in Scotland, because that evidence needs to be corroborated by another source. However, testimony from some experts, such as forensic medical examiners or doctors, is accepted by courts on the basis of the expert's report alone, therefore requiring no corroboration.


Interesting: Corroborating evidence | Colin Sutherland, Lord Carloway | Scottish criminal law | Admission (law)

Parent commenter can toggle NSFW or delete. Will also delete on comment score of -1 or less. | FAQs | Mods | Magic Words

[–]KrisK_lvin[S] 0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

You perhaps know more about this than me and as someone with no legal background I'm quite prepared to be proved wrong about this, but …

… according to the recent Angiolini report (Report of the Independent Review into The Investigation and Prosecution of Rape in London), they want the London's Met to follow the Sexual Offences (Scotland) Act 2009 and define consent as free agreement, but where free agreement is qualified to take into account a complainant who lacks "the capacity to consent at the time of expressing or indicating consent unless consent had earlier been given to engaging in the activity in that condition." In addition to that, "the prosecution must still prove that the defendant had no reasonable belief that the complainer consented."

If I've understood it correctly, it seems to be saying that, let's say, a woman can be drinking by choice, and be enthusiastic about a sexual encounter at the time, but later decide that she was raped. At the same time, he's got to prove that while he knew she was at least a bit drunk that he didn't know that the she was so drunk that when she said something or acted in a way that indicated consent she was in a state where that consent wasn't freely given. Quite apart from the fact that this seems to completely ignore that if he's also drinking he might also be more enthusiastic than he might otherwise have been and that his judgment at the time would have been impaired.

I find that a bit disturbing because it all seems to come down to what she thinks happened when she's in one state of mind when compared to another. Believing / not believing seems irrelevant - she may well come to believe that she did not consent (and was raped) but what should matter were her actions and behaviour then not her perception of the event know. I mean I can believe that she believes what happened to her is true, but that to me shouldn't be what proves or disproves whether that's what actually (or at least legally) happened.

This seems to be not much more than Feminists going back to their roots in the Temperance Societies more than anything else.

[–]walkonthebeach 0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

I don't know much about this, and I'm not a lawyer. Not that that would help, as different lawyers would have different opinions, and courts interpret things in different ways, and juries make different decisions.

But I don't see anything wrong with what they are proposing. Have sex with someone who has passed-out, or incoherent, is rape (unless they agreed that you have sex with them whilst they were unconscious).

[–]KrisK_lvin[S] 0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Neither am I (a lawyer that is), but the key point is this change in the law is not about being unconscious (which would as you clearly be rape by anybody's definition), but someone who is conscious, who may be laughing and joking etc. In other words, someone who to all intents and purposes is indistinguishable from someone who is drunk but who is capable of making consent willingly.

Anyway, it was just something I came across the other day.

[–]ZimbaZumba 4 points5 points6 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

The Guardian has become the Fox News of the Left in the UK. In fact I's say it is worse.

Sulkowicz's video is presently down. They are apparently trying hard to get it back up, yeah right.

[–][deleted] 1 point2 points3 points 11 years ago (5 children) | Copy Link

What are you talking about?

They say its depicting a sexual encounter.

[–]KrisK_lvin[S] 3 points4 points5 points 11 years ago (4 children) | Copy Link

They out right say its depicting a sexual encounter.

The key word is depict there, though isn't it?

Batman depicts a man in an armoured suit who can fly - it's not real.

[–][deleted] -2 points-1 points0 points 11 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

What do you want them to say?

Confuse it for and describe it as if its porn like people here are tending to do?

It says it depicts sex acts ... sex acts are blow jobs, sex etc.

[–]KrisK_lvin[S] 6 points7 points8 points 11 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

OK, look I'm not arguing with you - I strongly think they are avoiding the elephant in the room that is not a simulated sex act but an actual sex act - depiction to me suggests representation and this is not a representation but the actual thing.

If Bradley Cooper punches a guy in the face for real, that's not a stunt, he's actually broken the guy's jaw. If he takes a swing and you hear the SFX of a punch, that's a depiction or a representation of a punch.

You don't agree - fine.

[–][deleted] 4 points5 points6 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

You are right though, they are skirting around it.

[–][deleted] 0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

Its not going to be an elephant in the room to a lot of people.

Its being an elephant in the room is subjective.

Sex isn't inherently an elephant in the room.

[+][deleted] 11 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

[permanently deleted]

[–]KrisK_lvin[S] 2 points3 points4 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

They out right say its depicting a rape.

Oh do they? I didn't notice that in all the extracts I quoted above and set in bold

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