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Toxic to the XTREME! Discussing the toxic masculinity myth.

derram_2

April 25, 2015
14 upvotes
/r/MensRights
http://honeybadgerbrigade.com/2015/04/06/toxic-to-the-xtreme/
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Post Information
Title Toxic to the XTREME! Discussing the toxic masculinity myth.
Author

derram_2

Upvotes 14
Comments 13
Date April 25, 2015 9:49 AM UTC
(11 years ago)
Subreddit Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/33t1gm/toxic_to_the_xtreme_discussing_the_toxic/
Archive Link https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/toxic-to-the-xtreme-discussing-the-toxic.981880
https://theredarchive.com/post/981880
Red Pill terms in post
toxic masculinity
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Comments

[–]_pluto_ 4 points5 points6 points 11 years ago* (0 children) | Copy Link

Excellent piece.

There's a website that charts female mass murderers and serial killers throughout history -- I seem to have forgotten the name (I think the word 'misandry' is in the title). Anyone have a link?

Another important point: women are much more likely to engage in proxy violence (the eternal cry of the highschool girl: "my boyfriend is gonna kick your ass!"). Today, the "boyfriend" has become the state. And there is nothing more violent than governments.

[–]chocoboat 3 points4 points5 points 11 years ago* (11 children) | Copy Link

"Toxic masculinity" does not mean that masculinity is harmful and must be held in check. The author of this article doesn't seem to understand that.

The phrase "toxic masculinity" refers to a specific kind of behavior. It's when a man harms himself or others in an effort to live to up to male gender roles.

Examples include treating his girlfriend like crap when his friends are around, because he feels the need to show them he's in charge. Or refusing to seek medical care (especially psychological help) when it's needed, because he wants to prove he's tough and can just "man up" and walk it off.

The phrase "toxic masculinity" does not refer to anything else. Are there morons out there who believe all masculinity is bad? Sadly yes there are... but that has nothing to do with this particular phrase.

I've mentioned this in this sub before and people have had a problem with it... but I think it's important to use phrases like that with their intended meaning. Otherwise you're no better than a feminist who tells her friends that Legal Parental Surrender and Male Reproductive Rights mean that men want the right to walk out on their already-existing children that they chose to have, and not have to pay to raise them anymore.

[–]GoldenWulwa 1 point2 points3 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

It's the same idea of men being afraid to report sexual violence or abuse against them. They're supposed to be tough and suck up their emotions. Humans have emotions and feelings. Humans experience trauma and pain and heartache. Men have as much of a right to speak of their experiences and seek help. Bottling it up is not good and leads to more mental and emotional health issues. But as it's a word used by feminists, many are afraid to see the term for what it is meant to be. Like misogyny and patriarchy. They may be feminist buzz words, but their meanings are valid and hold a place in creating hardships for both genders.

[–]_pluto_ 1 point2 points3 points 11 years ago (9 children) | Copy Link

There is simply no need to affix "masculinity" to this problem. End of/

[–]chocoboat 0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (8 children) | Copy Link

The problem should probably have a better, less easily misunderstood name. But it is describing when people are toxic in an effort to prove their masculinity, so it's not the most terrible name I've ever heard.

[–]_pluto_ 1 point2 points3 points 11 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

Why do males want to "prove" their masculinity? Just curious about your viewpoint.

[–]chocoboat -2 points-1 points0 points 11 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

They've been taught to believe that being a strong alpha male type is what every man should be like, and they want to gain acceptance from their friends by showing off how masculine they are.

There's also some insecurity going on for some guys... maybe they fear that they'll be seen as weak if they refuse to join in on catcalling women on the street, or fear they'll be mocked for being pussywhipped or whatever if they don't boss their girlfriend around.

But the goal is always the same, they're trying to win "cool points" and gain social acceptance by acting like how they think a real man should act.

[–]_pluto_ 1 point2 points3 points 11 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Also, men are masculine by nature. So that's a big "problem."

Another "problem" is that women continually favour masculine males over feminine males. We all know it. We all went to highschool and College.

[–]chocoboat 0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Uh, those sound like facts, not problems. Not sure what you're saying.

[–]_pluto_ 1 point2 points3 points 11 years ago (3 children) | Copy Link

This is the "courtship" section of BBC Life story:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=o7LGHf3ooIo

Here's a hint: if females desired feminine men, men would be feminine.

[–]chocoboat 0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (2 children) | Copy Link

You can be masculine without going out of your way to be a dick and hurt other people. Some guys apparently don't understand that, and will just do anything they think is supposed to be masculine, without regards for whether it's harming someone else or even themselves. Toxic masculinity can also include the guy who does crazy stunts to try to prove to others how tough he is, and who takes it too far and gets injured because of it.

[–]_pluto_ 4 points5 points6 points 11 years ago (1 child) | Copy Link

Are you a man or a woman? Just curious.

Honestly, males are quite capable of being sensitive etc...it's just that that's not attractive to the opposite sex, and men receive not positive but negative results from emoting. So males stop emoting. We're not stupid. We're human beings. The entire idea of "toxic masculinity" is utterly absurd imo.

[–]chocoboat 0 points1 point2 points 11 years ago (0 children) | Copy Link

Honestly, males are quite capable of being sensitive etc...it's just that that's not attractive to the opposite sex, and men receive not positive but negative results from emoting. So males stop emoting. We're not stupid.

I know this. But I'm not sure what this has to do with the topic...

The entire idea of "toxic masculinity" is utterly absurd imo.

How so? It's clearly a thing that happens. There's nothing wrong with giving it a name. It's just that a better name would be preferable here.

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