Somebody I know and care about is becoming a feminist.

Chrisrus · 2014-10-24T15:45:08+00:00

pocketfullasunshine · 2014-10-24T15:29:57+00:00

Be a good example and make sure she knows you'll always be there to talk. That's all you can do.

She's free to make her own decisions, even if those decisions are ones you find distasteful. As long as she's an adult, she can join whatever cult she wants to join.

2014-10-24T16:59:30+00:00

Have her read "the architecture of anti science" by dutton.

2014-10-24T17:42:54+00:00

The problem, I see, is marketing... Marketing that depends on the fashion, cosmetic and entertainment industry. When we know that over 70% of the consumer base is women, it only stands to reason that the industry knows their demographic and hone in on women's lack of self confidence. Young women should have been given an education in physical training, sports along with the academic curriculum, like men do to help boost self confidence then they're less likely to be influenced by outside expectation.

the-tominator · 2014-10-24T23:06:10+00:00

Look into de-culting (haha made that word up but you know what I mean) techniques and strategies. Show her that they're wrong as well. And give her gww and other good, non-aggressive at first, men's rights/antifeminist videos and writing to watch/read - like people here have already mentioned.

ThePigmanAgain · 2014-10-25T00:02:39+00:00

Give her a shitload of examples of just how vile feminism really is. If, after that, she still wants to be one of the sisterhood, she is lost to sanity and decency and is best disowned.

comehitherhitler · 2014-10-24T17:52:04+00:00

"Let's assume that Feminism is right™ - that women must control at least 50% of the positive aspects of society by default or by fiat, and that men actively hinder them from achieving this goal. The best way for you to achieve this is not to choose to study subjects that have a glut of students and a dearth of financial opportunity. It is to become a lawyer, MBA, computer programmer, materials scientist, etc. Then use your wealth and position to affect change from within rather than throwing ineffectual stones from outside."

I'm going to make the safe bet that once she has some of her own money in her pocket and some technical knowledge in her head she'll drop feminism like a hot potato. People who have marketable skills they've gained through effort tend not to spend time repeating nonsensical talking points. And people who are independently wealthy don't buy into redistributive identity politics.

polysyllabist · 2014-10-24T18:48:07+00:00

Sounds like an avenue for deep discussions and understanding of different perspectives.

motivational_tweaker · 2014-10-24T20:42:36+00:00

[permanently deleted]

2014-10-24T21:08:38+00:00

"Radical" approach, let her find out for herself. I have some friends that have totally different views than I regarding politics. I never discuss politics with them because it's fruitless, we know that we don't agree on particular matters, but we have the same humour, and we like to hang out so we leave it at that.

librtee_com · 2014-10-25T03:11:45+00:00

Point out the clear and consistent pattern of provable lies, distortions, and omissions that define the 'feminist' press?

2014-10-25T20:13:19+00:00

If you don't like her beliefs, then don't care for her. You can't change her. I'm sorry for you.

_-_Dan_-_ · 2014-10-25T21:43:11+00:00

Difficult, giving that indoctrination happens long term in an environment you don't control (university) in a field that is not an empirical science (literature). She might have a reason to blame society (or rather: men/discrimination/etc.) for a ... an unfortunate career choice. It's just so damn self-serving (and might even get her good grades). It's also easy to fall into the trap of self-justification. She might come to the point where she has invested a lot of effort into her worldview and changing it might be incompatible with her view of being a smart and independent thinker (cognitive dissonance). And directly challenging her view might actually reinforce her position.

Here I think trying to make the indoctrination process transparent and showing how smart people can be fooled might help. But it's hard to think critically without knowing how to actually look at data (e.g., find out in which way studies are skewed). Instead, anecdotes still matter a lot and memory can be biased to find support for certain feminist assumptions (e.g., frequency of "harassment"). Same with trying to test assumptions. If a person thinks that, e.g., men have it easier online or do not get harassed -- it's possible to create a Twitter profile of a man and go for it. But besides the anecdotal quality, confirmation and hindsight biases are an issue -- I'd expect a post-hoc reinterpretation of the data to suite the assumptions.

On the positive side, I second the GWW videos. There are women who fight for equality (GWW, Sommers, the other Honey Badgers, etc.) which might be an inspiration. After all, is it really a worthwhile use of one's time to become a grumpy career victim -- or isn't it better to fight for actual equality? The later requires addressing the whole situation, not only the (perceived) disadvantages of one group and the (perceived) advantages of another (it's fairly easy to get the impression that you are discriminated against if you are only doing upward comparisons). Happiness comes from merit, not from complaining until things are handed to you.

One last thing -- while perceptions are frequently skewed -- you can ask the person to track claims back to their source. Someone claims harassment, have a look at what was said and by whom (and how many). Someone claims a site is a hate site, have a look at the article. Someone claims a group is a hate group, take part in a meeting. Sure, there are trolls who don't care about an issue and insult anyone to get an emotional response. Also, any movement has members not willing to have an open discussion. But overall, I've seen more bias and conversation stoppers by feminists (online) than by MRAs. Ideally she looks at both side of the issue before she takes a public stance -- as public commitment usually cements one's position. Here too, the question is: do you want to be known for an emotional voice chasing the latest outrage porn, or do you want to offer smart analyses that address the whole issue?

But that's a question for her -- and on which way through life she wants to stake her happiness.

P.S.: Ah, and humor. Worst thing that can happen in my opinion is that people lose their sense of humor and take themselves to seriously. Yes, an issue can be damn serious, but that's also the moment where some distance (genuine/non-ironic/non-sarcastic/non-cynical humor) is needed. After all, no single issue should become your whole world (in my view).

nnhjmsefewfe · 2014-10-24T20:12:16+00:00

Somebody I know and care about is becoming a feminist.

Make that

Somebody I know and used to care about is becoming a feminist.

ASAP

Brandnewbaseboards · 2014-10-25T01:35:24+00:00

"what do i do?"

well, a vasectomy is a good start

Title	Somebody I know and care about is becoming a feminist.
Author	pocketfullasunshine
Upvotes	15
Comments	20
Date	October 24, 2014 3:27 PM UTC (11 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/2k7brf/somebody_i_know_and_care_about_is_becoming_a/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/somebody-i-know-and-care-about-is-becoming-a.994307 https://theredarchive.com/post/994307

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