Hello guys. I'm not sure where else to post this so I'll post here.
I (19M) am 5'5. I think I am relatively good looking besides that and disciplined, with a lot going on for me career wise at 19 (good school, upcoming internship, extracurriculars etc.). Because of my height though, I never ask out any girls even if I like them. I never even talk to them, but I don't talk to most people unprompted anyway. For romantic purposes though, I never ask women out / "put myself out there" because of my height.
I know all the typical arguments or whatever, I get it. I have a hard time trusting women who say they would date a hypothetical short guy since they never seem to do so actually when an opportunity presents itself, which I why I put this tag as venting. I understand its a self-fulfilling prophecy, but I am so utterly convinced I will be rejected regardless of whatever "method" I use, that the prophecy would be fulfilled regardless. Apps (>90% of women filter me out by height), cold approaches (almost 100% rejection rate anyway), friends ("you know her very well" + a bit dishonest to enter a friendship with the goal of romance). I've only really "asked out" one person when I was 15 online but never again. Also, I understand I am young. That doesn't change anything. I will most likely be 5'5 for the rest of my life, and height preferences remain pretty strong in women regardless of age. I would also like to be chosen for myself and not "settled" for, which seems to be my fate at my height.
Anyways, this has gotten really strong recently, maybe because springtime for me brings more thoughts of romance or whatever. But the loop remains the same, and it's a loop that protects me. I see a cute girl I might want to know better before reality checks in that I am way too short for her. And I get it, women are not a universal being with entirely aligned preferences, but statistically my claim is correct. I am most likely too short for her preferences. Couple this with the "male loneliness epidemic" (hate that phrase) where much taller men then me are struggling in dating. A fortiori, how much more will I struggle?
I want to make expressly clear I do not hate or dislike women because of this. I kind of just treat it as a math problem deduced from statistics, apps, anecdotes, what women say online and irl, etc. I guess I'm not really asking for anything, just venting and wondering if anyone else feels the same.
This honestly gets so strong that in a lot of cases I'm not even attracted to women I would've found beautiful anymore. Marriage and children are becoming less and less of a priority, and they are not being replaced by anything. The certainty of rejection if I were to try anything is strong that it overwhelms my system. Not anxiously, just protectively. And honestly, I want that because I think it is true. I genuinely believe with every bone in my body if I were to ask that person, friend, stranger, whoever, out on a date respectfully and cordially, that I would be rejected for my height. From time to time I'll freak out about it in my mind, which is kinda rough, but honestly not as rough as it would be to deal with so much rejection that would happen anyway. Also, how will I know the girl won't just be completely mean in rejecting me, or worse and film the interaction or something? I know its anxiety speaking here, but even when I'm not actively anxious I feel this way.
Is there anyone else that feels like this?
[–]PutsWomenOnPedestal 11 points12 points13 points (1 child) | Copy Link
Since you seem determined to stick to your preconceived notions, what sort of responses are you looking for?
I’m not from a culture where dating was a thing, so I honestly have no idea what the reality is for you. But I personally know of short white men at my work who are smart, in high status management positions and are married with kids.
Gimme a break. This isn’t a Netflix series.
[–]Ok_Chicken_1586[S] -3 points-2 points-1 points (0 children) | Copy Link
I just wanted to know what you guys thought. Thanks for responding
[–]ConsultJimMoriarty 10 points11 points12 points (7 children) | Copy Link
No one cares as much about height as straight men.
[–]Altruistic_Emu4917 -4 points-3 points-2 points (6 children) | Copy Link
Yes, because height affects straight men the most in dating.
[–]ConsultJimMoriarty 8 points9 points10 points (5 children) | Copy Link
They THINK it does. The majority of others - including women - really do not care.
[–]Altruistic_Emu4917 -2 points-1 points0 points (4 children) | Copy Link
Quite untrue, height is a major physical preference in straight women.
[–]meleyys 4 points5 points6 points (2 children) | Copy Link
Source for this claim? But even if that's so, that's not say that being short is some kind of hopeless prospect as a straight dude. Like, the data says short dudes aren't fucking that much less than tall dudes.
[–]Altruistic_Emu4917 -2 points-1 points0 points (1 child) | Copy Link
So it does affect very short men, which are men who are mostly shorter than avg women. So it doesn't differ much from the hypothesis that most women want a taller men than themselves, so those who are shorter than most women are at a disadvantage.
Also, it also showed height being important in women's preferences, which is what I directly claimed in the comment above.
Although the study is kinda old (since it's from 2015) and I would like to see whether it could be replicated after the rise of ML-based social media and dating apps. Because the height preferences do seem to be a bit more exaggerated, if not skewed, in the present gen.
[–]meleyys 6 points7 points8 points (0 children) | Copy Link
You are missing the point. The study also shows that even very short men have only a couple fewer partners than very tall men.
[–]ConsultJimMoriarty 1 point2 points3 points (0 children) | Copy Link
It’s really not.
[–]octave120 3 points4 points5 points (0 children) | Copy Link
As a short guy myself, here are some thoughts that have helped me:
The average height for women in the U.S. is 5’4”. In many countries, it’s even shorter. Anecdotally, a significant proportion of women are between 5’0” and 5’3”. This is relevant, as many if not most women with a height preference just need the man to be taller than her. This puts any man 5’5” and up at an advantage.
Many women of all heights don’t mind a short man, for a variety of reasons. For short women, it’s because most of them are taller than her anyway. For average height women, it’s because men within an inch or two of her’s are most compatible to her for intimacy. For tall women, it’s because they like a man who is not intimidated by her height and are comfortable in their own skin. It’s usually more about making height insecurity their problem that turns them off than anything else.
Not every tall man is Brad Pitt. Many tall men have their own uncontrollable traits that make them less attractive. While some people are more lucky than others, it’s a comforting reminder that everyone is human who have their own issues to handle.
Attraction is multi-faceted. Yes, for some women, height is a deal breaker…but for a great number of women, it’s just a “soft preference,” as someone in your crossposted thread put it. If you are attractive in other ways, such as a good body shape or sense of humor, height is far less of a factor for them.
“You miss 100% of the shots you don’t take.” -Wayne Gretzky. This is arguably even more true for dating than it is for hockey. A missed goal attempt can give an opponent possession, but a rejection gives you a chance to move on to the next person. “Who cares if I get rejected by 99 women when I will find 1 who likes me?” That’s the attitude I embraced before finding my now wife.
[–]Aschkat 5 points6 points7 points (0 children) | Copy Link
My fiance is 5’5”. Height means nothing to most of us. We get repelled by men that harp on or are insecure about their OWN height. Tough guy syndrome is so unattractive! Be confident, but not cocky. Be calm, be kind, be secure in who you are as a person, looks are superficial and fade away anyway
[–]meleyys 6 points7 points8 points (2 children) | Copy Link
Anecdotally, I can tell you that as a 5'5" woman, my first boyfriend was 5'4". It's not just that I didn't care he was shorter than me; I actively thought it was cute. That's not to say I have a specific preference for shorter people--I don't really care either way--but there's something to like about every height. Taller than me? Can envelop me with a hug. Same height as me? Cuddling is easier because there's no need for awkward maneuvering to make sure everyone is sufficiently snuggled. Shorter than me? Can be enveloped in a hug. All good and enjoyable.
You're also just wrong about the statistics. I'll link you to a comment I wrote here, but the tl;dr is that short men do not statistically have that much trouble finding partners.
Lastly, you aren't looking to date some abstract average woman. You're looking to date a woman who would be into you specifically. So who cares whether the average woman would want to date you or not? The average person wouldn't want to date me. I'm chubby, queer, mentally ill, childfree, exclusively dominant in bed, a vegetarian, and an unironic left-wing extremist. All of those are dealbreakers for huge swathes of people. Yet I still found my match. You can too.
[–]Ok_Chicken_1586[S] 0 points1 point2 points (1 child) | Copy Link
Thanks for the response! I should’ve probably clarified. What my claim was (and maybe I’m wrong) was that I believe I have a lot of qualities that (without knowing my height) may make many women interested in giving me a chance by getting to know me better, but those same women would not if they knew of my height / saw me irl.
I will definitely check out those stats! Thanks again
[–]meleyys 4 points5 points6 points (0 children) | Copy Link
My link to my comment doesn't seem to be working, so I'll just copy and paste what I wrote:
There's a fair amount of research on height and sex/relationships. For example, here's one article: https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC10480972/
It doesn't answer your exact question about whether height is more important than personality, but it does count mean and median numbers of sex partners by height for men (and women). Want to know what the difference between median sex partners for very short (5'2" to 5'4") men and very tall (6'0" to 6'2") men was?
Two. Two sex partners. The median number of sex partners for extremely tall men was 7 and for very short men was 5. Oh, and every single height category except very short had the same median number of 7. Of course, if you want to judge by mean sex partners instead of median sex partners, that 2-partner difference skyrockets to... a 3-partner difference. That's it.
Seriously, look at the data. Are taller guys having more sex? Yeah, maybe a little. But the mean age of male participants in this study was 40, and guys under 5'4" reported having a mean of 9.4 partners and a median of 5 partners in those 40 years. Which means that being a short guy is by no means a hopeless prospect.
[–]Lumpy-Lion-2949 2 points3 points4 points (0 children) | Copy Link
sweetheart don’t worry abt it.
[–]Responsible_File_529 0 points1 point2 points (0 children) | Copy Link
I've never felt insecure about my height until watching RedPill content