Aren't all the problems men have caused by patriarchy?

EmirikolWoker · 2022-07-13T08:46:50+00:00

The foundational principles of all flavours of feminism (class warfare between men and women with men winning, shorthanded as "Patriarchy") are inherrently anti-male when you examine what needs to be true for it to accurately describe reality. Feminists can claim that it's "just about equality", but it's equality based on bigotted assumptions, presuming psychopathy on the part of men as a class.

Mens rights advocacy, and Egalitarian values in general, are innately anti-feminist.

Monster3gamez · 2022-07-13T08:57:15+00:00

So ur whole point in 1 and 2 is . Everything wrong with men mostly is due to toxic masculinity? Get the fuck out with that.

Punder_man · 2022-07-13T09:15:30+00:00

Question, do you REALLY think the "Man up" or "Shut up about your feelings" is something ONLY perpetuated by men?Because I'm pretty sure there are MANY women out there guilty of telling men to 'Man up' or 'Suck it up and deal with it' etc.

So why then do you put all the focus on men and try to paint it as only men doing this?

When I came forward about the abuse I suffered at the hands of women do you know who told me to 'Man up'?Women, not only that but I was scolded and told "No matter how bad it was, women have it worse so SUCK IT UP!"

Do you know who didn't tell me to man up? Other men..So yeah.. no I disagree with your premise and especially with the idea of 'Toxic Masculinity' as Toxic Masculinity has been overused tot he point that it no longer means what you want it to mean and is instead used as a feminist dog whistle to further shame men into silence.

If you want to discuss this then come at it from a neutral point and call it "Toxic Gender Norms / Roles" as that doesn't paint us into a corner of it being only something which applies to men.

Secondly:

Alright so this is caused by men dominating roles with dangerous conditions. But isn't this also reinforced by toxic masculinity? We don't need to be the ones choosing these positions and excluding the other gender. Yes there is conditioning in women that leads them to believe they don't belong in these positions. But that conditioning also leads men to believe women aren't valuable as for example service members in the military, or construction workers, or so on so forth.

And all of this social conditioning was created by men throughout the ages, because they were the ones in the positions of power that allowed them to condition the masses. We can't just ignore history here and expect people to act in ways that haven't been hammered into them since birth.

FUCK RIGHT OFF!
What do you suppose would happen if men simply 'refused' to do the dangerous jobs?
Our society would grind to a halt and MEN would be blamed for it for being selfish.
Also note how Teaching, especially Early Childhood teaching is dominated by women.. this is because of successful fear campaigns to tar any man who wants to be a teacher as a pedophile.

As such many men simply are not willing to take the risk given that ONE accusation even if false is enough to end their teaching career for good.
This then has a direct co-relation to your first 'point' Boys in school are often taught by women and lack male role models they can look up to / ask questions of. It also doesn't help that boys are often treated as 'broken girls' and are medicated in an attempt to 'fix' them.

90% of CEO's are men, however, that does not equate to 90% of men being CEO's (Despite how loudly feminists want this to be true)
Men dominate the highest tier of jobs, true however they also dominate the highest tier of dangerous, physically taxing and dirty jobs too.. but I never see any movement from feminists about "Breaking the glass ceiling in construction or mining or forestry" etc because shock horror.. women don't WANT to do those jobs but seem perfectly fine with expecting men to do them.

Also it's rich you saying "We can't ignore history here" when that's EXACTLY what feminists have been doing for years.
The true history doesn't play into their narratives so they hand wave it away and replace it with a history which is much worse and makes it seem as if women have since the dawn of time been oppressed.

Take your feminist concern trolling and go elsewhere..

Viesegel · 2022-07-13T09:15:57+00:00

Let's start by defining the terms.

What exactly do you mean by "patriarchy", and in what form does it currently exist in Western countries?

mensmod · 2022-07-13T09:29:54+00:00

Victim blaming is not welcome here.

Your post has been removed.

odysseytree · 2022-07-13T09:36:01+00:00

It's a time tested advice from men that showing emotions to your partner leads to break up, getting cheated on and taken advantage of. Only show emotions to your closest male friend. Only he can understand you from his male lens.

Also, men naturally can't manifest emotions like women. Men and women are biologically different. Why are you setting a female standard on male biological characteristic?

Men do seek help before committing suicide but most services priorities women.

https://www.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/np7d9a/study_of_1500_men_who_committed_suicide_91_had/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=mweb

https://www.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/nnz6t4/mens_higher_suicide_rates_not_linked_to_their/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=mweb

You cannot harras women on Tinder. She has to swipe right in order for you to send a message to her. You are lying about harrasment of women on dating apps.

Men aren't excluding women to opt for dangerous jobs. Women themselves don't apply in it. Women can open their own women only mining group but they don't. Women aren't interested in these jobs.

Stop treating women like children.

dukesaces · 2022-07-13T09:05:37+00:00

Not all male problems but a significant number of them are caused by patriarchy, I'll give you that, that's not the crux of our problem.

The crux of our problem is that patriarchy gave men certain hardships and responsibilities but in return it also gave us certain rewards, the control of society, of the government, family units in which our wives would obey us and would bear our children and keep the family together and laws that catered to male needs while protecting women.

Our problem, is that all the benefits of patriarchy have been stripped away. We no longer control society, the government, women or anything really. That's not necessarily a bad thing but It goes even further. Our voices are shut down when we try to complain about our legitimate grievances and were treated as second class citizens.

If we can't have the benefits of patriarchy you'd think we'd naturally be allowed to buck the responsibilities of patriarchy as well right ? However, neither the government not feminists want to allow this of men. We're forced to serve in the military, were guilted and shamed into marriage even when marriage has all but lost its purpose and only benefits women now, were shamed when we don't protect women, masculinity is constantly attacked and feminine men are ridiculed, domestic violence by women against men has risen to the point where it's a 50-50 gender split but there are absolutely no resources for men. You talk about male suicides but when men share their feelings no one gives a shit. Where are the government resources for us ? The women in our lives ridicule us for being vulnerable, even mainstream media mocks male problems. Prison rape is still a joke on tv.

When it comes to dating and relationships yes men are desperate and flood women but who pushed hookup culture ? Who made it common for men to only be valued for sex and for marriage and traditional relationships to break down? That's right, feminism and the sexual revolution. They push sex and porn on us so damn much with the whole women empowerment and onlyfans and sex worker support movements, movements that prey on lonely vulnerable men and then they wonder why men have become so sex crazed. Women are as much a contributor to this problem as are men. I don't believe the 80-20 rule is exact but women are giving it up, quite easily and with little to no relationship and emotional investment to the top % of men while lower calibres of men get increasingly desperate. Some check out because why should they do any more than the top men do for inferior relationships by women that will never value them as much, despite being inferior women themselves. Others get addicted to porn or simping.

So it's bullshit, isn't it ? They want us to bear the responsibilities of the patriarchy, to serve society, to protect it, to work those dangerous jobs, to serve against our choice (look at Ukraine), to marry these broken women when they hit 30 and have a sudden desire to settle down, to use our tax money to fund welfare for single mothers (men fund the lion's share of welfare, women recieve it). To surrender our autonomy with male genital mutilation and mandatory child support while supporting the autonomy of women (I'm pro choice btw but not when men are forced to pay child support for children they don't want).

However, they won't give us any of the traditional benefits of the patriarchy that we used to have. Fuck the patriarchy, we don't want it but the people keeping it alive aren't men, it's women and the government, forcing it onto us.

Title	Aren't all the problems men have caused by patriarchy?
Author	Anonduck0001
Upvotes	0
Comments	16
Date	July 13, 2022 8:44 AM UTC (4 years ago)
Subreddit	Posted in /r/MensRights
Original Link	https://old.reddit.com/r/MensRights/comments/vxydep/arent_all_the_problems_men_have_caused_by/
Archive Link	https://theredarchive.com/r/MensRights/arent-all-the-problems-men-have-caused-by.1123314 https://theredarchive.com/post/1123314

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